Join us on Facebook: / stacjakontrolitrakcji Follow us on Instagram: / 4x4.tests.on.rollers Subaru Outback 2.5i CVT S-AWD (2015) vs Volvo V60 CC D4 AWD (2018) #duszaniespokojna #subaruforester #volvo
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16 окт 2024
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Комментарии : 273
5 лет назад
This actually shows how good haldex system is, I was quiet surprised because I wasn't sure about buying an S3 just because of this system. Now I changed my mind, nothing is wrong with the Haldex.
I was a little confused what s-awd meant, but once I googled - I then understood >.< (symmetrical awd) Thanks! Also, I love how you do these tests. You actually hold the gas for 5+ seconds compared to 1-2 seconds on most others. It takes time for the AWD to kick in, so thank you for doing proper tests.
Thanks. Yes, we hold the gas, some systems need even up to ten seconds to react or to take effect. We are also looking for the most effective rev/speed during the tests. And when it comes to S-AWD - many people confuse "symmetrical" with equal torque split while that is just for mechanical structure of awd system.
Haldex is surprisingly good, I’ve driven Mercedes GL and Volvo XC70 for a while now, and I must say Volvo takes the victory in daily drive. On ice, I hate it that Mercedes might lose the rear end suddenly on corner, or either start to understeer. Volvo on the other hand goes like a train.
Volvos awd system seams to be a bit more smooth and no jitterbug actions on the wheels.. Both will perform well in real weather conditions with good tires
@@TJNightTrain Actually as a 2004 with 173K miles on it, aside from normal maintenance, it's been rock solid. Never had an issue with it. Sure it's starting to look a little old now, but run wonderfully.
These test are really helpful for those of us who will actually take these vehicles off-road where possibly 2 wheels could be temporarily off the ground (!).I'm glad to see the Haldex (now Borg-Warner) of the Volvo can get enough torque even to one wheel if you rev it enough.
In fact, now with Subaru's mounting low torque NA engines and CVT that limit rpm at every model you'll find real life videos where the Subaru gets stuck at places where other cars do not. Subaru is now like a car religion, criticizing is blasphemy. I remember one video against a RAV4 where the Subaru failed so spectacularly due to the CVT, the publisher got accused of framing up the car and they got to repeat it with Subaru staff present (they failed again).
@@jaumeprimerelhipster I wouldn't be so sure. Recently I watched this video, new Subaru did very well, no CVT issues: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-SsEFOH7KP-Q.html
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers I really appreciate your video and I've reviewed it carefully. However, I would like to give some insight. Your video presents two tests. The first one is a fairly flat test, something that's basically testing the effectiveness of traction control (X-MODE) at stopping spinning wheels. CVT won't play any significant role here because not much torque is needed for this test. Second test is odd. The problem is that's a "synthetic test". It's made on a man made structure which is artificial both in shape and materials, not something you're gonna find on the wild. It's difficult to understand what's exactly measuring and if it's exploiting some flaw on car design. The video I'm refering to is this one: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-OdbS-1eltDc.html It's in Spanish but please, don't make this fact prevent your from watching it, it's one of the best tests you'll finde. DiarioMotor is one of the most professional Spanish language test groups for AWD. They have a real life off road track and they test all kind of SUV's and vehicles designed specifically for offroad. In this video, there are two tests. The first one is general offroad broken road test. Both cars pass the test, the Subaru slightly better due to high ground clearance. The second test (you can skip to minute 15:00 if you want to) is where the real business begins. This test is called "The Wall". It's a slope exceding 70% with so called "cross of bridges", meaning some wheels will be up in the air while climbing. It's a very difficult test that puts the AWD system to its limits. The RAV4, thanks to the torque by its electric engines, manages to climb the hill. The Subaru, despite multiple attempts and different configurations, gets stuck in the middle, with the CVT unable to engage, due lack of torque, no matter how much the floor it. The rules of engagement for DiarioMotor are simple and clear: "minimal inertia" -> they want to test the AWD system and its capability by itself. "minimal driver intervention" -> the driver is not allowed to turn or affect the test. They are testing the car, not the driver.
@@jaumeprimerelhipster I know the channel, I am subscribing it for a long time 🙂 That's weird thing about Subaru. In the video I linked, second test - there's a huge stress on CVT and awd system - uphill, wooden curbs. Driving Sports TV also have a lot of tests where there were no issues with CVT. On the other hand there are tests like the one that you linked (or Diyas Valikhan channels) where CVT fails. So the question is if these are the same CVTs, same configurations etc. I remember testing the Outback petrol and Outback diesel - their performance was extremely different, probably due to high torque (chain) CVT in diesel version. All in all - there's no doubt that CVT's ain't the best, especially in comparison with classic AT's but they ain't that bad as many people think.
To be fair I see a lot of cars going up icey, snowy hills with only one or two tires spinning uselessly, these rollers are a really repeatable way to simulate that situation
The 2016 Subaru Outback passed the 3-roller tests (front-front-rear and rear-rear-front) much better than this video shows, the videos are in this same channel: *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IXRnjI4WoI.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IXRnjI4WoI.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html*
@@normt5463 Of course that's not a "fail". Pushing back the rollers is not a failure of the test. On the contrary, it is due to the large amount of torque provided by the gripping wheel... which proves the good torque distribution provided by a good AWD system. In addition, that happens after the car has left the rollers themselves (and precisely because it has left the rollers). Your opinion denotes you are not impartial, since pushing the rollers backwards is usual in this tests.
@@conradonarvaez7141 when the AWD system launches the vehicle sideways it is not something you want in a tight situation with tress or a or on ice. When vehicle goes sideways in the test it is not on the rollers but on the frame and latches it backwards. The system failed to maintain forward position.
@@normt5463 Passing the three-roller test requires the car to advance with the torque provided from a single wheel, which logically implies leaning on one side and therefore heel over, especially since the rollers prevent the steering from operating correctly. Neither shooting back a roller (as you said before) nor "going sideways" as it leaves the rollers (as you invent now) are a "fail" in the test since the car actually DOES LEAVE the rollers. You look for anti-Subaru arguments where there are none, and you find what only you see.
Realistically, the 1-wheel with traction situation is very rare. Most of the time, you either have all 4 wheels with traction, or 0 wheel with traction (vehicle in deep snow).
I agree with 1-wheel with traction situation, very rare. But 2 wheels with no traction is not unusual, that is why imho test on two rollers is more important.
Just turn the wheel and punch the gas peddle to see weight transfer off of the inside front wheel. The quicker the transfer the better. Even better with no modes to enter.
@4x4 tests on rollers - duszaniespokojna channel What is your impression about this test? Volvo is little better than my famous Outback. Those both cars are awsome :) Is there more different awd systems on volvo?
Both cars have very similar awd systems (shifting power from front to back via multiplate clutch-pack). Volvo doesn't have long 4x4 history like Subaru but it comes from the land of snow so they know there how to set such system for good traction 🙂 Volvo is using two systems - haldex and separate electric motor for rear wheels (in hybrid vehicles).
These comments. Both vehicles did very well. It comes down to what you can afford. The Volvo is a premium vehicle and the Subaru is not. Just like Volvo isn't the run away safety company it use to be, Subaru isn't the AWD king it use to be either. Everyone is catching and only silly fanboys refuse to see that. They pretty much performed the same in these test.
kordax mint Premium yes luxury no. There’s a difference in the automotive word! Acura is a premium brand not a luxury brand. Infiniti is a premium brand no a luxury brand. You get it!!!
@@v60polestar88 Is BMW a premium or luxury brand? I'm sure it depends on the model. BMW is also Premium but is miles ahead of Volvo in terms of technology.
kordax mint BMW is a luxury brand and Volvo is a premium brand. Why is that so hard to understand. Model means nothing. BMW and Mercedes are luxury brands. BMW should be ahead they have way more money!! So I don’t understand your argument??
Volvo seems to be very good or possibly best in class for awd traction, but not by a big margin. Wonder how stable it is on the moose test, should be better than the old xc70 cross country was.
ej7 speed a lot better... I have a older XC70 I can tell you without having to look it up that it’s completely pointless trying to swerve out of the way... the words “vague and numb, and disconnected” were invented for the old XC70’s handling capabilities.
@@TheChikchirik Nah Outback actually looks way better than this generation of V60. The Volvo just looks fat and old. The new V60 CrossCountry with "thor hammer" headlights looks much better.
The Buick Regal TourX 2.0T with torque vectoring AWD can beat them all. Plus it looks much better. m.facebook.com/groups/316013335874394?view=permalink&id=367827414026319&_rdr
GeekStar This V60 design was like 6 years old when the test was done, obviously it has become outdated compared to the competition (I think it still looks gorgeous especially in the Polestar version) :) But the new V60 is just utterly superb, I just hope they offer in the future PHEV powertrains for the XC ! Have a nice day !
It's the CVT on the Outback that makes it this challenging.. :( watch TFL here on youtube, they've proven it many times ;) also.. the engine weight.. u know...
@@FakuedGuela The "TFL Car" dudes are Subaru haters, and I'm not the only who says so. Every time I watch a video where a Subaru is not able to overcome any obstacle, then I realize that the video is from "TLF Car".
Pomiędzy przednią a tylną osią za pomocą sprzęgła wielotarczowego. Pomiędzy lewą a prawą stroną przy pomocy hamulców (czyli tak naprawdę zwiększenie momentu na obydwu kołach).
@@tomaszmarek6031 Komputer wykrywa, które koła się ślizgają i hamuje je poprzez układ hamulcowy. Zwiększając opór ślizgających się kół wzrasta moment obrotowy na kołach z przyczepnością.
@@tomaszmarek6031 Hamowanie kół to "walka" z wadą mechanizmu różnicowego, czyli z kręceniem tym kołem, które ma mniejszy opór. Jeśli ogarniasz angielski, to ten film może być pomocny: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-mryGnENTsoI.html
*Reliability* also makes a big difference among this two makes: Subaru's is far higher than Audi's: www.whatcar.com/news/2018-what-car-reliability-survey/n17826 Subaru 4º vs Audi 20º The same about *safety* : Subaru Nº 1: www.businessinsider.es/safest-cars-for-model-year-2019-2018-12?r=US&IR=T touchrate.com/safest-cars-for-2019-announced-subaru-tops-list-domestic-brands-nearly-absent/ www.forbes.com/sites/tanyamohn/2018/12/26/safest-cars-for-2019-announced-subaru-tops-list-domestic-brands-nearly-absent
@markeldamgaard - The 2016 Subaru Outback passed the 3-roller tests (front-front-rear and rear-rear-front) much better and in much less time than this video shows, the videos are in this same channel: *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IXRnjI4WoI.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IXRnjI4WoI.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html* I think the Outback driver in this video did not do too well.
Audi A4 Allroad Quattro vs Subaru Outback S-AWD: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-elFM6qg9rM8.html Volvo V60 Cross Country AWD vs Audi A4 Allroad Quattro: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-eS07RZbsxbY.html
@@teabag3854 To be honest I am more surprised that both cars struggled with only rear left wheel on the ground, but not front left. I guess it just confirms that pretty much all regular cars with AWD are front biased. Old Subaru AWD that was on manual models could transfer the power 80/20 or 20/80 depending on the slip. Here it looks like it is always more biased towards the front. It's kinda sad...
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers I guess the only thing that could solve this would be an LSD or locking diffs. But I would never say that an AWD we get in most cars nowdays, is off road capable, it just helps in difficult driving conditions so It will never be perfect, which is what the test proved.
Vela van laack BHP wont make a difference on this test. Thats not what its about. Power is subjective. Ive never had a problem on any roads, in any conditions even with low power cars. I know how to drive. Problem is, bad drivers need powerful cars because they either have no ability behind the wheel, or simply dont give a shit about the highway code.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers 2.0xe na petrol cvt -18, I wanted a diesel with more power again so I bought the volvo. I hunt and fish alot and living in a snowy country. The v60cc is good enough. But the Forester was a beast in hard conditions.
@dimekoza Hard to say... I couldn't find any volunteer with any CR-V (I think I know why...), so I have no idea if anybody with 2019 will be interested in a test...
Subaru was aggresive but strugles with back tires. Volvo was more responsive and fluent. And do well in the last test. Overall Volvo was slightly better for me on rollers. So
@@carholic-sz3qv Subaru Asymetrical AWD systems are getting passed up today by others. Once the steering wheel is turned on the Suabru it is game over an their AWD systems a failure.
@kabardinkus - Furthermore, the 2016 Subaru Outback passed the 3-roller tests (front-front-rear and rear-rear-front) much better and in much less time than this video shows, the videos are in this same channel: *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IXRnjI4WoI.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IXRnjI4WoI.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html* *ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html*
@@conradonarvaez7141 that video you the XC70 cross country was stuck in FWD (likes a broken haldex) the rear wheels didnt ever slip. so this test was FWD vs AWD so obviously AWD is going to have better time at that.. also i dont even know what tires are used on each car, tires play a huge role. sidenote: i have a Volvo XC70 T6 AWD and i know for a fact that the rear wheels would be spinning if it was actually stuck on that hill.
@@Honeypot-x9s Nope. Volvo in ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-3_pAbXfXWig.html is AWD. Otherwise the comparison would be a nonsense. "Tires play a huge role", as you say, but only when they spin to give grip.
Need to test the 3.6R with high torque cvt, or last gen 3.6r with 5pd and limited slip rear, just look at your own video testing subaru xt with more power! X-Mode not even required! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-7f1Uz8SqnzI.html
subaru got worse! amazing. the old symetrical awd system had 3 torsen style differentials, it use to be able to move the car on an incline with just one wheel tractoning.
@@TheChikchirik See how the 2016 Subaru Outback passes the 3-roller tests much better than this video shows (and much better than any Volvo), the videos are from this same channel: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IXRnjI4WoI.html ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--IXRnjI4WoI.html ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-hbqio0l0ins.html
These two vehicles performed almost exactly the same with this test, but the true test was the driving at 35 mph on a wet course and having to make an emergency swerve and maintain control. The Subaru mastered the test brilliantly while the Volvos failed miserably! There goes the 'Safe' Volvo vehicle for me. RU-vid the video test.
