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Smelting and Gold Refining Part 3: Recovering the Gold From Anode Slimes! 

mbmmllc
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In this last video we smelt the dried anode slimes and recover a button of precious metals.
This is the third and final installment of our smelting and gold refining series.
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MORE IMPORTANT INFORMATION
** Gold recovery clarification. I wanted to mention the copper button with the ~8 grams of gold from the first video in this series was not used in part 2 and 3. I sent the first copper button to a refiner as a test piece to see if it was something they could refine and to find out what percent they would pay on the gold recovered. This is why there is not at least 8 grams of gold recovered in this final video. The material I smelted to recover the ~2 grams of gold in part 2 and 3 was from some other sulfides from a different source. Thanks to CoinSilver800 for pointing this out.***
***I wanted to post this response here in the description too as it brings up some good points about this process and why I am using this method to recover the gold. This is in response to a comment by Greg Burnside, thanks for the comment Greg!:
Thanks for the comment and question. I guess I should clarify a few things about this process and this is the perfect post to do it.
My goal is to find an scale-able process for direct smelting hardrock gold ore concentrates from gravity separation (off our shaker table specifically, but could work with any concentrate) without any roasting or pre-treatment and end up with a salable product.
By this process the roasting step can be eliminated which is very environmentally hazardous, is expensive to do in larger batches, and takes a lot of expensive equipment. Secondly, by direct smelting the handling is greatly reduced, ie take your shaker table cons, mix them with some flux and collector metal and smelt, pour your product. Now I should also mention here that the copper button I ended up with in the very first video is a perfectly salable product. AAA precious metals in Portland, OR paid me 80% of the gold value in that copper button (for nuggets, placer, etc. gold they pay 95% of the assayed value on batches under 100 oz for comparison). The second two videos (electroplating and slimes smelting) were mostly just an experiment to see if they would work and to try and end up with a gold product. Didn't quite work out like I planned, but I think with some more experimenting it could be done. Even if it does work its not easily scale-able, takes a long time, produces some by-product (sulfuric acid with heavy metal ions that needs to be disposed of) and only increases the value by 15%. Each operator will have to decide if the cost of further refining from a copper button is worth it, for me personally I think sell copper with 1-10% gold content for 80% value and be happy.
I think in your original post you were hinting at the a wet chemical separation of the gold/values from the concentrates, correct me if I am wrong. So to answer the root of your question: gold concentrates are very tricky for wet chemistry methods. Unlike with electronics, gold plated jewelry, etc. in hardrock cons the gold values are not always available to the leach because they are encapsulated by the sulfide crystals. The free/liberated gold in the concentrates can easily be leached, but I have seen concentrates with only a 10% recovery rate by leaching due to this encapsulation problem. Some ores will be easily leached due to their high percentage of free gold, others will need to be treated in other ways.
The fire assay is the universal way ores are tested for gold values. By melting everything to a liquid and collecting the precious metals in a button a very very high percentage of the precious metals can be recovered in the assay process and that is why it is still used today on all types of ores and by all companies. I am trying to essentially re-create the assay process on a large scale so no matter what type of ore concentrate you have (free gold, sulfide matrix, or a combo of both) you can recover a high percentage of the gold with minimal cost and have a easily salable, non toxic, product with minimal work and equipment.
I plan to do another smelting video in the near future with a measured amount of gold and then assay the slag, matte, and copper button so we can see exactly where the precious metals ended up and what percent recovery can be accomplished by this method.
Thanks again for the questions, we all learn from each other and by asking questions/clarifying and it is a great peer review process. Thanks again!*****

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7 авг 2024

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Комментарии : 51   
@markschenher4559
@markschenher4559 7 лет назад
Nothing to apologize for, this was a great video series. Love your work!
@Catari777
@Catari777 8 лет назад
Thank you for very interesting video. Yiu are very good at doing this. Keep on posting your highly inspiring and interesting work. Take care. Im glad that there are people like you who do this on video for us other people to watch and get inspired.
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+Zomzibom Thank you very much for the comment and the nice words. Thanks
@GeoONE
@GeoONE 8 лет назад
You can remove most of the contamination before the final smelting by roasting the anode slimes and doing some pre-wash techniques. HCl boil to remove higher reactive metals like tin,iron,lead. Rinse with water and roast again. Boil in nitric acid to remove lower reactive metal like copper. After that, there's no real need to smelt. Move straight to AR leach.
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+Geo Hi Geo, thanks for the tips. I haven't had much experience with wet chemistry, but may play around with it in the future. If I do I will be sure to get it on video. Thanks
@NOBOX7
@NOBOX7 3 года назад
Workinf with acids on large scale is a toxic mess then you have gallons of watse to deal with , we are trying to work around and smelt instead . to much acid to many toxic fumes and to much toxic waste left over that you have to pay to dump
@poosmate
@poosmate 8 лет назад
Aw sorry it didn't work out as well as you thought it might. Thank you for carrying on experimenting so that we can all learn what works and what doesn't. All the best, Poo
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+poosmate Thanks for watching Poo!
@CuongNguyen-rz9tu
@CuongNguyen-rz9tu 8 лет назад
Thank you for very interesting video
@joeshanethatsmyname
@joeshanethatsmyname 8 лет назад
Thanks for sharing..Very interesting
@Donnaya137
@Donnaya137 5 лет назад
Very good, you have helped me solve a problem i had that wet chem couldn't fix.
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 4 года назад
Thank you! I'm glad we could help!
@lee-eb2cn
@lee-eb2cn 8 лет назад
a carbon rod. used during melting it picks up the junk and you tap off the end of the rod and keep using it each time and it refines the junk out of your gold or silver.
@CoinSilver800
@CoinSilver800 8 лет назад
Great video, been waiting patiently for this one as curiosity was really getting to me wondering how it would finally turn out! 1 quick question, roughly how long did you leave the crucible in your furnace before the pour? Keep up the great work, can't wait for future refining/ smelting/ gold recovery videos!
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+CoinSilver800 Thanks for the comment and question. I put the crucibles in the kiln when the kiln is cold so it takes about ~6 hours to heat up to the required 2000+ degrees F. Once at temp I let is sit for about 1/2-1 hr and then do my pour. More videos coming soon. Thanks again.
@unavailableusername9694
@unavailableusername9694 7 лет назад
Couldn't you use Nitric Acid on the slimes, then filter and process the remaining metals in Aqua Regia?
@nuhungemisi51
@nuhungemisi51 2 года назад
Hello, I am watching your publications with interest and admiration. What is the metal layer formed between the slag and the button and does it have any value? Thanks!
@G-V-M
@G-V-M 3 года назад
hello exciting video, question if you don't mind, what is the name and model number of the XFR gun
@gelmgren
@gelmgren 8 лет назад
If it were me I would have worked the cell slimes using wet chemistry, it would have been easier to selectively precipitate your gold from the foreign metals that carried over to the finished button. Next time incinerate your cell slimes, then add them to a dilute solution of HCL heated to remove base metals left behind from the sulphuric electrolyte. What is left in the filter after this process use any of several methods to take your gold into solution then use a precipitate of your choice to bring the gold out of solution, I also noticed that you did not use distilled water to rinse the residue copper sulphate from the cell slimes or the filter paper itself.
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+gelmgren Thanks for the tips.
@terminatorfire1736
@terminatorfire1736 5 лет назад
What would happen it you paned the slimes? Could the gold separate out by weight? When they refine copper down to needing to electro plate how do they refine the slimes?
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 4 года назад
They re smelt the slimes to recover the PM's
@terminatorfire1736
@terminatorfire1736 6 лет назад
Hey I have been looking for info like this. What about catalitic converters and some of these types of methods?
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 6 лет назад
Hi and thanks for the comment. I don't have any experience with Cats, but I think I remember that platinum has a very high melting temp and I am not sure that the temperatures necessary can be achieved in a furnace like this. If you find a solution please let me know. Thanks
@frankbellend3273
@frankbellend3273 5 лет назад
This is probably a dead thread, but would switching the anode to gold or silver cause the cold and silver to transfer over and plate, leaving a bar of copper, etc.?
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 4 года назад
Nope, only the copper plates. The gold and sliver go into the slimes
@therrienmichael08
@therrienmichael08 8 лет назад
This is my next quest to be able to smelt.
@offtrailhiker
@offtrailhiker 4 года назад
Sorry is pyrite a sulfate that you can extract gold from .?
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 4 года назад
If the pyrite has gold in it then yest it can be recovered by smelting or leaching
@khosrosadi5196
@khosrosadi5196 3 года назад
Hope you have better luck next time
@nickyaero
@nickyaero 4 года назад
Wish you can cupel this one and recover gold 👍
@BillMulholland1
@BillMulholland1 2 года назад
👍
@terminatorfire1736
@terminatorfire1736 5 лет назад
Does anyone here have the process for getting individual metals out of slimes?
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 4 года назад
smelt them
@offtrailhiker
@offtrailhiker 4 года назад
So can you turn pyrite to gold .?
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 4 года назад
No
@lee-eb2cn
@lee-eb2cn 8 лет назад
you didn't use the rod to pull out the junk. to do that you need to hit the crucible with a torch. I use borax and baking soda for flux. also try it a couple times to pull out the junk. if you try this would you consider RU-vid so we can see the results.
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+Lee Lowe I'm not sure what you mean by "the rod" can you elaborate a little bit on this? And what do you mean about hitting the crucible with a torch? Thanks
@lee-eb2cn
@lee-eb2cn 8 лет назад
hitting the crucible with the torch is putting the torch to the meltable product in the crucible. sorry it is just a way of speech.
@dekonfrost7
@dekonfrost7 2 года назад
Listen you seem like a nice guy. Listen an xrf gun only tells you what that one spot is. And its not accurate unless you have alloyed it deliberately.
@heinousnesslesssweetness5857
@heinousnesslesssweetness5857 8 лет назад
sub
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+Hein Swe Thanks! More vids to come
@Newfive
@Newfive 8 лет назад
Not sure what you are trying to accomplish, unless you are attempting a new way to refine gold, silver and copper from hard rock or even circuit boards....much easier and cheaper ways with 99.89% purity...
@CoinSilver800
@CoinSilver800 8 лет назад
+Greg Burnside If you were to watch his previous 2 video's you will see exactly what he is trying to do. Would you watch the third movie in a series of three first? of course not because you wouldn't know whats going on... same idea here.
@Newfive
@Newfive 8 лет назад
+CoinSilver800 I have.... still dont know what he is trying to accomplish unless he is trying to refine to gold with only smelting....
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+Greg Burnside Hi Greg. Thanks for the comment and question. I guess I should clarify a few things about this process and this is the perfect post to do it. My goal is to find an scale-able process for direct smelting hardrock gold ore concentrates from gravity separation (off our shaker table specifically, but could work with any concentrate) without any roasting or pre-treatment and end up with a salable product. By this process the roasting step can be eliminated which is very environmentally hazardous, is expensive to do in larger batches, and takes a lot of expensive equipment. Secondly, by direct smelting the handling is greatly reduced, ie take your shaker table cons, mix them with some flux and collector metal and smelt, pour your product. Now I should also mention here that the copper button I ended up with in the very first video is a perfectly salable product. AAA precious metals in Portland, OR paid me 80% of the gold value in that copper button (for nuggets, placer, etc. gold they pay 95% of the assayed value on batches under 100 oz for comparison). The second two videos (electroplating and slimes smelting) were mostly just an experiment to see if they would work and to try and end up with a gold product. Didn't quite work out like I planned, but I think with some more experimenting it could be done. Even if it does work its not easily scale-able, takes a long time, produces some by-product (sulfuric acid with heavy metal ions that needs to be disposed of) and only increases the value by 15%. Each operator will have to decide if the cost of further refining from a copper button is worth it, for me personally I think sell copper with 1-10% gold content for 80% value and be happy. I think in your original post you were hinting at the a wet chemical separation of the gold/values from the concentrates, correct me if I am wrong. So to answer the root of your question: gold concentrates are very tricky for wet chemistry methods. Unlike with electronics, gold plated jewelry, etc. in hardrock cons the gold values are not always available to the leach because they are encapsulated by the sulfide crystals. The free/liberated gold in the concentrates can easily be leached, but I have seen concentrates with only a 10% recovery rate by leaching due to this encapsulation problem. Some ores will be easily leached due to their high percentage of free gold, others will need to be treated in other ways. The fire assay is the universal way ores are tested for gold values. By melting everything to a liquid and collecting the precious metals in a button a very very high percentage of the precious metals can be recovered in the assay process and that is why it is still used today on all types of ores and by all companies. I am trying to essentially re-create the assay process on a large scale so no matter what type of ore concentrate you have (free gold, sulfide matrix, or a combo of both) you can recover a high percentage of the gold with minimal cost and have a easily salable, non toxic, product with minimal work and equipment. I plan to do another smelting video in the near future with a measured amount of gold and then assay the slag, matte, and copper button so we can see exactly where the precious metals ended up and what percent recovery can be accomplished by this method. Thanks again for the questions, we all learn from each other and by asking questions/clarifying and it is a great peer review process. Thanks again!
@CoinSilver800
@CoinSilver800 8 лет назад
+mbmmllc Very interesting to hear the first pyramid of metal wasn't used in the other videos. Actually a little relieved to tell you the truth because the percentage of gold you got off the first button was so different from the final video's button after what I had thought was you processing that first button. I will possibly be experimenting with what you did in these videos by the middle of next year with black sands that contain decent trace amounts of gold after all free gold has been removed. I am thinking that with my set up I may try using a nitric treatment after what you did in the first video but possibly re-use the collector metal a few times before treating with nitric to increase the gold content. To re-use the metal I was thinking of remelting the pyramid and then pouring into agitated cold water to create shot and smelting over again with new material (original black sands).
@mbmmllc
@mbmmllc 8 лет назад
+CoinSilver800 Thanks for bringing that to my attention. I think I will post a annotation in the video clarifying that I didn't use the first pyramid in the electroplating experiment. I can see how that would be very confusing! Please let me know how your experiments go with the smelting this next summer. I will be curious to hear your outcome. Let me know if you have any questions and I will answer the best I can. Thanks again.
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