Snipers surrounded by Conscripts - Same Cost - Red Alert 2 

Make that 2023 now.

Hate it when I write the year wrong every after the new years

@@joshsmyth130 dang it

Still waiting for that remaster/remake, RA2 is increasingly unplayable on current system.

@@Damar158 would be nice

You can see that a Conscript takes 2 hits to die, in that match, its like there are double the number to them.

Only because they outnumber the snipers by a factor of more than 5-1 and have them surrounded - the field was *heavily* tilted in their favor and yet they still lost the engagement…

Only because they outnumber the snipers by a factor of more than 5-1 and have them surrounded - the field was *heavily* tilted in their favor and yet they still lost the engagement…

@@wilberwhateley7569 Sniper cost 600 iirc, Conscript cost 100, which 1 v 6. Green & Elite, Snipers one shot one kill, which both of these match Snipers win. Veteran though, Conscript takes 2 shots to die, take twice the time to kill, which mean its something like 1 v 12. Explain Conscripts win that match.

That's partly because the snipers cannot level up any farther. In the other two they could and got better because of that

Conscript is kind of weird; they get a huge boost at veteran, where most units don't really see one until elite. They're the worst basic infantry unit despite the argument above (because Initiates exist and *deployed* GIs are basically gamebreaking, though they are close to even 1 on 1 without the GI deploying) - but with one promotion they'll kick either's ass in the field, even if the other one also has that promotion.

Makes sense actually if you look at the TTK (Time to Kill) and ROF (Rate of Fire) values at play. The Snipers TTK doesn't change for all 3 levels. Its 1 shot 1 kill. For veteran what happens is that the Conscripts TTK goes down due to a higher damage output, meaning they can chip away at the snipers much faster before the snipers have time to kill them off, which tips the scales. Now Elite is when ROF comes into play. Elite units have a higher ROF so the snipers can pick off two targets in a shorter span of time than their normal/vet counterparts. This gives less Conscripts less time firing at Snipers and more time dying before getting 1 or more shots off. This tips the scales back in favor of the Snipers, albeit with a tighter balance due to the fact the Conscripts TTK went up a second time from Vet to Elite.

@@havoc1482 Also don't forget about range, elite snipers have a huge boost to range which is honestly what saved their bacon in the last round as they were able to get an earlier lead

I think it's called the Eight-pointed Star fortress strat

@@oykel4089 Tis a true Square formation. Used only against cavalry though.

It was also big in world war z book

@@Fyrebrand18 seems works against mass infantry attacks too

I wonder if the result would be different if the pathfinding is better so more conscripts can attack simultaneously at the end.

@@andyhaochizhang Absolutely. The pathfinding is the lynchpin for the entire thing. It's why every student of war understands the value of bottlenecks and defensive funneling. It's how Leonidas got anything done at all at Thermopylae.

It's really not GIs are really powerful but conscript rushes make them seem stronger than they really are. Veterancy is the only way to make em viable and even then having them in any significant number is impossible once the mid game begins

No - they aren’t very powerful: they are just very cheap and thus can be used to easily bury an opponent in bodies on a relatively even playing field. If the playing field is tilted in favor of the opponent, all the conscripts in the world won’t win the battle for you…

Their armor is pretty strong but their firepower is crap

@@wilberwhateley7569 Someone who's name shall not be spoken needs to be told this today 😆

-CoH2 players whenever they realise conscripts in that game are actually good

If you look at the video again then you'll see that the snipers didn't rank up during first battle...

And it's so easy to mod too.

So RA3's Natasha?

You can probably mod that one in as Tiberian Sun who shares same engine as RA2, does have such mechanics in Ghostalker unit.

I love to camp

That would be very interesting

I'd say conscripts are pretty efficient. They're the cheapest soldiers, build fast and are more resilient than others, making them perfect meat shields in an army. Otherwise, idk, any unit that can kill stuff without getting hit back, like snipers or prism tanks who pay for themselves in seconds

@@Thiccoman hmm maybe kirov is the ultimate weapon..

Took 2 hits instead of 1 to kill from what I saw. This allowed them to get close to attack. The slow fire rate became the snipers downfall as it no longer became one hit kill.

well if a conscript isn't instakilled with one shot then I'd say most likely, though units in this game do SEEM to have ever so slight variations in fire rate to stop this exact problem from happening, as well as the minute amount of time it takes for them to rotate to a new target. I could be wrong but that's just how it feels at a glance.

I'd personally guess breakpoints in hits to kill make the main difference. 1 hit to 2 hits then back.

For real dude, it'd hardly take a half dozen Rhino tanks to mow over all them snipers

It took two hits to kill each one and the snipers didn't get enough damage or rate of fire increase to compensate.

We don't use conscripts in our wars, unlike the waves of Ukrainians NATO is chucking into Bakhmut and other places and getting wasted en masse

Then you probably have not played as Great Britain before.

snipers are the special units of great britain much like how the grand cannon is for france

Great Britain has Sniper, Libya has Demolition Truck, France has Grand Cannon, USA has Airborne (not to be confused with Paradrop from captured building), Republic of Korea has Black Eagle, Soviet Union (the nation, not the faction) has Psi-Corp/Yuri, Cuba has Terrorist, Iraq has Desolator.

Ohhh I'm stupid. I'm thinking of Red alert one I've never seen Red alert 2 so this was confusing to me.

Everyone gangsta until the mountains start speaking Finnish

Or Nazi Finland vs Soviet Union lol.

But Finland lost that war, Finland had left with basically 0 manpower/recruits and the road to Helsinki was at the grasp of Soviets (with incoming total capitulation of Finland). Allies said that their troops was on foot march in Sweden, just wait another month or so. Soviets didn't want more territory than they get after the peace treaty. Finland lost much more % of it's army vs soviet army, after the breaking of Mannerheim line nobody from Finland side count loses (you could at easily at least 10-20 k casualties to Fin side).

@@Ddarth_sidious yeah I know that Soviet Union won that war, but what I am saying is that Finland used quite a lot of snipers during the war because they couldn't confront face to face the opponent who surpassed them in everything. Also regarding the losses, thanks to Finish strategy and uncompetent leadership of Soviet commanders (veterans, officers who had experience were killed in camps because Stalin deemed them as traitors and threat to Communistic design), Soviet side suffered a lot of casualties

@@Ddarth_sidious Soviet Union got a pyrrhic victory...their losses were stupid high compared against the fins. It lost more in % because it had less to begin with. If you have only 50 soldiers...and lost 40 while your enemy had 500 and lost 300...you still lost less in unit to unit, but you still lost more in %. Thats all. % means nothing, you need to look man to man,