One thing the older generations in particular forget about in terms of UK creative industries is the gaming industry, which has a turnover of £11.4bn and is growing at nearly 12% per year, it's one of the largest game industries in the world.
Both Alistair and Rory overlooked videogame development in the discussion of the creative arts. Despite recent studio closures we are still the home of many successful developers, including Rockstar Games - GTA V has made over six BILLION dollars in revenue, making it the single piece of media that has made the most money EVER. Yet we will see more studio closures, production moved overseas, and a drain of talent unless the industry continues to get more investment. Neither of the 2 main parties have addressed this in their campaigning yet.
Well, that's a shame. I work in the industry, and was rather looking forward to hearing them discuss it. It has the potential to be a major sector for UK growth if new and independent studios are given the support they need.
"Rockstar Games, Inc. is an American video game publisher based in New York City. The company was established in December 1998 as a subsidiary of Take-Two Interactive, using the assets Take-Two had previously acquired from BMG Interactive." "Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc. is an American video game holding company based in New York City founded by Ryan Brant in September 1993." Rockstar Games is not British, and hardly any of that $6bn is finding its way into the UK economy.
@@WS12658 Rockstar absorbed the original British developer behind GTA. They are an American company, as you say, but they have a lot of studios based around the UK, which brings with it jobs and taxable income. A quick check shows they have studios in Dundee, Leeds, Lincoln, London and Edinburgh. I would argue that, even though the IP is now US-owned, its British roots are still paying dividends for the UK Games Industry. Not to mention the whole discussion around "soft power".
@@colinstewart1432 Yeah, on this and on the topic of national service / involuntary and mandatory voluntary service recently, that generational bias is coming through more strongly. It would be good for them to bring in more diversity from that perspective in their guests and discussions rather than the old participants in the vestiges of power that are not really disruptive or diverse in their thinking, though they have provided interesting episodes in the round.
People see 81% of our economy in services and think of the City, but they forget our creative industries. Film, music, television, computing. We have a huge natural advantage in the arts afforded by our native language and culture, and should wake up to this - even a hard-headed miseryguts with a tin ear should acknowledge how much money it makes us.
Financial services is only 17%. I told a civil servant this once. They refused to believe me. So I pulled up independent analysis. They still refused it. You can’t get them to see past the City. And if you look up who chairs / co chairs all their business advisory boards you’ll probably see where the problem lies….
It's not just films Rory, ..it's theatre, art, fashion, design, music and literature. Well said Kiera. we are world renowned for our creativity, it is our soft power and God forbid Sunak thinks any art and design or cultural courses are mickey mouse courses with no value!
FYI for Rory, the Cannes film festival is not the French state giving Lucas a lifetime achievement prize, rather it's a prize from the festival, its jury and organisers for his work. Given how important the UK industry is for World cinema, it should be an objective of the government and the UK industry to develop a very high profile Cinema festival in the UK.
Lets go ahead and get some actual change done like stopping the privatisation of every aspect of government before we worry about the superficial stuff
@@DJWESG1In the 60s and 70s the idea thart if you worked hard irrespective of background you could make progress largely held true! Now anyone putting in extra effort is mocked for naivety! I honestly can't blame the cynical either ....... but a combination of that and the self serving leaders our politics spawned is leading us down a very deep dark hole as a country! The return of the arts to Upper middle class kids is simply a case in point!
I think Gove was consistently wrong about everything, including education. He said once that he wanted every school to be above average. The teaching unions asked if he was better at numeracy or literacy when he was at school.
The Tories don’t care about the creative industries. They cared more about fishing than the music industry during the Brexit negotiations, despite the music industry employing more people and bringing more income in than fishing. During the pandemic there were big holes in support, with buildings and flagship organisations like the Royal Ballet being supported while thousands of self employed actors, musicians and technical workers received no help.
Either we free state schools from the centralised prescriptions of the National Curriculum (just as academy schools, free schools and private schools are free from these), or else we radically reform it to create a curriculum that focuses much, much more on teaching a wide variety of age-appropriate, interpersonal and intrapersonal understandings and skills … including, for instance, those connected to emotional/psychological understanding (e.g. empathy and the capacity for self-reflection), social skills, relational skills, future parenting skills, and communication/listening skills (including the much-neglected arts of rhetoric). It also needs to focus much more on expanding the powers of imagination via various types of art classes, especially drama.
Agreed. Curriculum currently a millstone. It's too target-driven, too ofsted-focused. Creating a climate of anxiety. We need to return it to the enjoyment of learning and that means lowering the pressure on kids, parents & teachers. The expectations are too high thus creating miserable conditions for all involved.
@@colinstewart1432 currently the curriculum's primary driver is standardisation with tweaks attempted to improve some Ofsted-led outcomes. Really the education system, including the curriculum, should be scrapped and rebuilt from the ground up to truly remove that millstone
@@colinstewart1432 When was this golden era? Yes, the curriculum has turned schools into exam factories that are bothered about results above all else. Expectations are higher in many other countries and have been for decades. There is an anti learning culture in Britain that goes back decades too and has worsened considerably in the last twenty years. There is a generational problem with an increasing number of parents who will not support the work of schools and are now passing on their bad attitude to school to their offspring, which is manifesting itself in atrocious behaviour in many schools and high levels of persistent absence. Schools have pandered to parents for too long now that the horse has bolted. Teachers are often not supported by management that blames them for issues that are occurring with the same students in various lessons but somehow it is the fault of the individual teacher. Lower the expectations by all means but Britain will continue to have a workforce that is not fit for purpose compared to other countries. Schools have lost control and many people in an atomised, individualistic, entitled society, are just fine with that. Schools out and not just for summer to borrow a phrase from Alice Cooper.
Most academies follow the national curriculum. There is zero prospect of the curriculum you espouse being created. Many of the adults in schools lack the skills you argue need to be taught, hardly a good basis for doing so. Moreover, those skills are not needed in the neoliberal Thatcherite society in the UK since 1979. It is mostly everyone for themselves in a system designed for the rich where the qualities you advocate are irrelevant to the requirements of a workforce expected to settle for low paid, low skilled work, except for the privileged few who are able to do the higher paid jobs.
I love it when Rory refers to himself in the third person. It reminds me of the Seinfeld episode 'The Jimmy', which has a character who constantly does the same: 'Jimmy makes the sale!' 'Jimmy's going into shock!' 'Jimmy played well today'
Alastair can’t think of any other issue that was so consequential and had such a huge impact? None at all? Maybe in ten years Gove and Johnson will have their own podcast in which they bemoan the very issues they helped create.
True - Personally it drives me bonkers that Campbell blames Cameron for offering the Brexit vote, which ultimately won the majority in 2015. God forbid that Campbell accept that LABOUR were in power when the excessive EU expansion eastwards happened, with zero planning which set the scenes for Brexit! Population growth after 2003 QUADRUPPLED - with no increase in service provision, which partly explains why there's no nhs dentist spaces & why it's weeks to get a gp appointment. Blair, Brown & Cameron arrogantly ignored the increasing ukip vote, with the media pretending there was no public concern, with everything EU related golden - Personally, I voted remain, but didn't like the change of focus from a trade body, towards a de facto United States model featuring flag, anthem, currency, foreign policy ambassadors etc; nothing to do with a red bus
Rory: You stated "Nearly half the country voted Remain." What you perhaps meant was, "nearly half of those that voted" (not the same thing). The actual figures in the 2016 Referendum were 16 million Remain (48.9%), 17 million Leave (51.2%) out of a then UK population of 67 million. That means only 37% of the electorate actually voted Leave, or 27% of the population overall. It would therefore be more truthful to say "only just over one quarter of the country voted for Brexit" - a very definite minority! - Phil Copleston
Any slogan with the word "Change" in it, is losing weight. Too often used with too little result makes it carry ever less value. Britain might have come to terms with the fact that Brexit was a failure but what they didn't come to terms with is the end of the British Empire and a new role as a "normal" member in another bloc called the EU. This is why politicians avoid this subject. The country is simply not ready for it and it will take 2 generations to root this out. Once I hear UK "expats" not calling themselves as such anymore but calling themselves immigrants like the rest of the world does, I believe the UK will have changed finally for the good.
I am so glad to see the creative industry finally get a motion, not only am I a young author but I started a podcast to chat with other independant creators regardless of whatever medium and their perspectives on all of these things are really interesting to hear and i've got a bit of a backlog of guests now which I am really happy about. I am also a big believer in the potential of the gaming industry whilst my own focus remains my books, I have been thinking slightly about making a Mod - another great showing of the creative potential of people.
When I took O level history (1967) Oxford Exam Board offered different curricula, our history teacher chose 'Constitutional History ' which was British constitutional fron 1688 to 1890, very heavy.
That must have been a laugh! We did British History 1865 onwards in 4th form and European History 1870 - 1939 in 5th form. Enjoyed the former but hated the latter (mainly due to an appallingly bad teacher in the 5th form).
Why does Alastair Campbell feel so strongly that everyone should vote? As a current member of the labour party and ex-treasure and ex-vice chair of what was then my CLP and all that goes with those positions, I have to tell you that I haven't voted since 1997. I see not voting as a positive none vote because of the lack of choice. Since Thatcher, British politics has moved so far to the right that what is now referred to as the centre of politics would been seen as not too far from Mosley's Black Shirts. in the 1930s. Can you imagine the reaction of the media today if there was a need to establish the Kinda Transport in order to save the lives of children from evil dictators. What if Labour lost the 1946 election and the NHS was never formed. Can you imagine the reaction by the likes of Johnson and Rees-Mogg if Corbin had suggested something similar to the NHS as part of the 2019 manifesto. If they didn't think he was from the "Loony Left" they would now. Until there is an all inclusive caring choice, I will continue to positively not vote.
25:10 If anyone is interested in learning more about the predicability of social systems, how good (or bad) experts are at doing it, and how to get better, you should read Philip E. Tetlock's work. He would also be an extremely interesting guest, and I'd be interested to know if either Rory or Alister have read his work. Groundbreaking stuff.
Except that half of the film industry is currently out of work because of strikes. My wife hasn’t worked properly in the sector for a year now. It’s been worse for her than Covid. Also, gaming outshines tv, music and film combined by market cap I believe.
Over the past ten years communication skills have been crow-barred into science subjects in a really offputting way. The national 5 physics exam included questions about poetry. People who love poetry hated it because it was such bad poetry and people who can't see the point of poetry hated it because physics and poetry don't mix.
the problems in this country are systemic. Rory, you spoke on how you often get treated as though because you didn't become prime minister, Liz Truss is considered a better politician. It's the same with money. Simply being rich, earned or not, makes for 'better people'. This is the UK. For those of us who didn't set out to make as much money as possible, didn't have the benefits of Winchester or eton, or wealthy parents and positive role models -- are we worse people, have we failed in 'the game'? I don't believe you think this way, but in my experience that is the attitude I've faced for most of my life. I did my A-levels, got 3, but didn't go to university, am I a massive waste of space that the country would be better off without? That's how the government makes us feel. -- you see this with Angela. She fumbled a word, easily done, everyone has done it -- and the reaction was "haha, she's so stupid she doesn't know what words mean". The snobbery, not just from other politicians, but the media too -- it's not only unreasonable; it's unearned.
Thank you for saying what you did for creative arts...as someone who works in film production in accounting its crazy how much money the industry brings to the UK, seeing the general population thinking its a waste all of the skills required is ridiculous. We need more studios being built outside of London and home counties more, one thing that does need solving is young people being supported with entry level jobs more, runner jobs are poorly paid, ive had to turn down runner work in central london in a editing house purely because traveling from watford is too expensive...and its not even that far!
Rory, for the film industry look into the extension of Cleveland College of Art & Design in Hartlepool where Ridley Scott studied. Let's hope it does well.
I’ve worked in the creative industry (VFX) for 25 years. The last few years have been incredibly hard due to Government indifference. During the strikes last year we got no help at all. It had a huge effect across all sectors of the industry. Unless something changes very quickly lots of people will be leaving the industry in the UK.
I fully agree. If it were my decision (which it isn't), I would make the study of Music part of the School Core Curriculum, up to the age of 16. Music has so much to offer in the development of cognitive skills, coordination, team work, self-confidence, knowledge of technology (sound and light engineering), creativity, self-expression.
I wonder if there is a collective psychology here - regardless of who is in power, whether good or bad - people will just vote for change in the end. Especially if we are saying what has changed.
Love the reference to sathnam sanghera in this interview. Would love a conversation between rory and sathnam on a podcast. Both are hero's of mine ❤❤❤❤❤
There was an interview session thing at the airbus factory last week with Starmer and Reeves, it was mentioned re Brexit that it is vital that they improve trade relations with Europe and get a better deal
Do you plan on doing live shows in the US sometime? Half of you are sometimes in the US. Maybe see if you could get some US guests on a tour. Am sure it would sell.
1979-1997 what they did was sell state assets. They also brought SF into democratic politics, which is one positive. They wasted oil money on tax cuts for rich people. Anything else?
Big fan guys - I work in the UK film industry as a cinematographer and it’s an ambition to get into politics in later life - dream role would be as a Labour DCMS secretary, do you think every minister should have direct experience working in their field, and how important do you both think it is to their effectiveness?
And we mustn't forget those creatives who design podcast sets 😉 But if we want a cause for lots of the rest that is talked about, then look no further than the default phrase used "both of the main parties". We're a two party system that will not change without funding reform, accountable media, and proportional representation.
I’m not sure giving the vote to 16 year olds is a good idea. 40% of 18-19 year olds and 33% of 20-24 year olds are NOT even registered to vote. Address the apathy before widening the franchise. I do whole heartedly agree on compulsory voting. 13million people didn’t vote during the brexit referendum. 15.5million didn’t vote in 2019!!
The changes made to EYFS curriculum in 2021 allows schools to practise flexibility within their curriculum should they choose to. I think schools need more flexibility around current curriculum rather than a new one. I often wondered why one practise of outstanding practise did not translate in a different school. Its because each school is different, with its own unique challenges and so the cookie cutter approach doesnt translate well across the board.
Because we live in such as classist society you have to have gone to a private school, know the right people, and be able to do unpaid labour for many years before you can get your foot in the door in the creative industry. An arts degree is simply a waste of time for many working class individuals who can't do the former. Instead of dealing with the root of the problem by making a fairer society with more opportunities for all, the tories want to scrap arts degrees effrctively making it even harder for working class people entering the field.
Ratcliffe, once a pioneering oil refiner and fracker got fed up with Gov and naysayers and gave it up and bought a share in a mid-table football club. This is how demotivated UK industrialists are. Where is our Musk?; love or hate him, he has delivered for the US economy big time with very interesting work.
A warning amid all the money coming in from films and TV. Watch out for the bust in boom-and-bust with the clamour for more studio space: I get the impression that the overwhelming amount of the funding of productions is American so UK funding would be a forward-looking plan to keep those studios running and generate cash for the UK if Hollywood goes home with its money. They did this at the end of the 1960s/start of the '70s and the huge MGM Borehamwood studio closed at a month's notice. The British film industry has only seriously recovered in this century, again really with US investment.
10:07 Alastair please if you are trying that Rory gets inform on football matters you should tell him the real most famous El Loco from South America: El Loco Bielsa, who not so long ago was Leeds coach and now is managing Uruguay's national team
The SQA Scottish exam board give 49% of the marks in N5 maths for the correct answers and 51% of the marks for the appropriate working. Just in case any teacher is in any doubt as to what appropriate working means a marking scheme is provided. Children are taught to set out each answer in accordance with the making scheme. Thinking for yourself is discouraged. It would be very easy to change this. The government could direct the SQA to give full marks for correct answers without working and partial marks for incorrect answers with some correct working. This would free the teachers from the shackles of the marking scheme.
What is the problem here? - does SQA mandate that only 1 secific set of steps to solve a maths problem is allowable? - admittedly, that could be quite rigid - but, for most kids: teaching the methods to solve problems in logical steps to get the correct answer is as important as the answer itself. The correct answer is only the last (confirming) step. - with STEM subjects, I've found it VIP to teach most kids systematic metods to approach & solve problems before 'letting them loose' to do that on their own - often, the best way to demonstrate that is by following several, quite specific, worked examples - they then have the thinking foundation to apply that for themselves.
Secondary education needs substantial reform. It is now far too focused on skills needed in the past, rather than the skills needed for future employment. You’d be amazed how many youngsters still leave school with very limited IT and communication skills.
I would be happy with a small change in education. You could remove the English interpretation questions from the physics and chemistry exams. Teachers wouldn't even have to buy new textbooks.
There are 2 things in the UK that the government completely ignores. One is the creative industry, there is nothing comparable in the EU. I guess because, a) English is the lingua franca and b) London with its size has the critical mass. The other one is science. And both areas would boom much more within the EU.
"not much has changed" Brexit? Hospital waiting lists? Child poverty? Truss mortgage calamity, inequality? Rory Rory Rory, half the country are furious with what has changed.
Making money from creative industries is very different from having a worthwhile creative output. The UK film industry is virtually none existent. We sell or lease most of our studio spaces to these movies you're talking about (Barbie, Star Wars, Mission Impossible) and yes they employ London based crew. Yay. brings in money. Yay. But where are the British directors becoming household names? Where is the next Billy Elliot or Shaun of the Dead? Most people know Richard Curtis, Edgar Wright, Danny Boyle. What is the next generation of talent? I bet most would be hard pushed to tell me the last British film they even watched in the cinema, let alone who directed it. I sincerely worry about the state of our culture - it's been completely eroded through the 15-year abdication of responsibility by the government and this incessant focus on how much money and how many jobs the big Tom Cruise film brings in. It's seriously not that simple and I haven't heard a word from Keir on culture.
It's easy to make that complaint but can the British public identify any future talent other than from the US? What was the last German film you saw and who was the director?American companies dominate media and control production and distribution. Most British success stories start with a small budget film that propels people into international arena then they get poached by the Americans. Breaking the US monopoly on distribution is more important than trying to fund British films that can't get distributed.
"… nobody wants to talk about Brexit." I DO !! I want the perpetrators of this criminal act tried in a Court of Law. Russian money and interference, tax avoidance, Offshoring, all just brushed under the carpet.
Instead of complaining political parties are avoiding Brexit issue, you, as analysts, would try to analyze why this is so. Labor and the Lib-Dem are afraid of losing votes in the elections, aren't they? Then, how can you blame them for this? For some reason, it seems to me that Kier Stammer will return to the issue of Brexit after becoming prime minister.
By the way, if you are talking about Thangham Debonairre, just remember that she isn't actually liked that much in her constituancy and I wouldn't take it as given that she will get re-elected.
Britain has the finest Actors and dramatic productions in the world. Joe Mercurio, to name one. And what about my home country, Yorkshire's contribution - Screen ❤
The only thing you know for sure about a forecast is that it's wrong. It may be a little bit wrong or completely wrong. If you are very well informed about the subject of the forecast you may be able to judge which is most likley.
Quite dissapointed that 'The UK's Creative Industries' is in the title and yet they hardly touch on it. The Music Industry as well as the Video Game's industry, as mentioned by other commenters, is a huge contributor to the UK economy. Specifically the Music Industry has been decimated by brexit increasing the costs of touring for artists, additionally, the rise in energy prices is causing grass roots music venues to close at an alarming rate. I really think they could do with getting someone younger on the pod to a deep dive on the cultural and creative sector, as I believe there is a humungous generational oversight when it comes to these sectors of our economy - which are on fast-track route to being vanquished in the coming years.
I work for a university and we're all wondering which uni goes bust first and how many go during this parliament. There's a chance it will include Russell Groups. Unis aren't going to cut "Mickey Mouse" - whatever that is. They'll cut things like English Lit, History etc that don't get int'l students or cut Science and Engineering as they're very expensive. Some might even stop taking on British students. Lot of job cuts coming and angry powerful unions confronting the Labour gov
Any uni that's seen as lefty will go bust first. Unis that conducted studies that went against the grain will most likely be targeted first. It's the m.o
Why has Ridley Scott only got an honorary knighthood? He's from South Shields. Shouldn't he just get a proper GBE or KBE. Sorry, I know it hasn't got anything to do with politics, but it really stood out to me.
Yes, move the entire economy over to services and creative industries while other countries prosper from manufacturing. Countries that make things pay their way unlike Britain which is stuck in a post industrial wilderness with lack of investment. Germany has a strong manufacturing base, with many towns specialising in making one or two component products that are needed as parts for other things. Funny how Germany has not decided it needs to do more to boost the creative industries if it is so important.
Drinking is a oranges comparison, as the health detriments are multiplied by still undergoing physiological development. The case for voting is as simple as no taxation without representation. Even if they don't make enough to pay income tax, they pay VAT for things purchased with their income. Taxes are unavoidable, so voting should be guaranteed.
1:40 "no Government in modern British history has done more than 14 years". Conservatives 1979-1997 was 18 years. No, you can't count Thatcher and Major as being different governments (if you do you'd have to split up Blair/Brown and Cameron/May/Johnson/Truss/Sunak too)
A question, Rory talks wonderfully about the arts industry in the U.K. in this podcast, but in earlier videos on line he talks somewhat disparagingly about ‘populism’ as being something which is, let’s say, not to conservatives values. Please comment.
All of the parties are relying on ONE thing only to improve things in UK: growth! And yet the one thing that MIGHT improve almost overnight by up to 4% would be rejoining the single market......and NOBODY is discussing this......stunning
Loads of statistics and figures about the creative industries don't do it for me. I don't care about that shit. It's deeper and much lighter for me… going to work and creating is like not going to work. It's going to play. Playing. I love those gigs when they come along. Getting paid to play? Heck yeah
Empire debate is always well it was not all bad. Railways were built to remove wealth out of India and Wales etc for the benefit of the Empire not for the local community.
One of the consequences of Brexit which is overlooked is contrary to all the rhetoric around immigration and the impact in the UK, businesses created thousands of jobs in Europe in order to function post Brexit e.g. Financial services companies without a subsidiary already in Europe creating a subsidiary in order to continue using electronic passporting etc.
Schools are the common denominator no one wants to talk about. Its where kids spend the majority of their time, its where behaviours are learned and embolded, beit in the class or on the playground. You all keep asking why society is soooo fuqed up? Its the schools muckers, the heads, the teachers, the curriculum, the buildings, the system.. its a victorian vestige thats having a massive impact on our ability to make any meaningful change.
