*INFORMATION AND SHOW NOTES* The first 1,000 people to use the link will get a 1 month free trial of Skillshare: skl.sh/classicalnerd09221 *Show notes/clarifications:* - In general, the line between proto-spectral, spectral, and post-spectral composers can be murky-more so than for many other techniques, schools, or trends in contemporary music. You may disagree with me putting Tenney and Haas into a more spectral camp while excluding Saariaho, and that's fine; I think it serves well to illustrate how elusive these terms are. 27:58 - Rădulescu _escaped_ to Paris. I did a video (pronouncing his name even more poorly than here!) some years ago, which provides a little more detail about his life, but much less about spectral technique. 32:28 - Daniel Kientzy [ kientzy.pro/en/biography ] does _far_ more than just work with Romanian spectral composers. I didn't want to imply that that's the only thing that he does. 37:44 - Originally a piece of IRCAM software called _Orchidée,_ it's since become _Orch-Idea_ [ www.orch-idea.org ], which allows for interface with Max/MSP as well as doubling as an English pun that illustrates what, exactly, it does: orchestration ideas. 38:12 - I'd like to thank new $2 patron *ScriabinAddict53,* who joined up after this video had already been rendered and submitted for sponsor approval. Finally (for those who have clicked through), a word about sponsorships: the PhD-student life puts enormous pressure on my time. Regardless of my passion for making this content, it isn't financially sustainable without sponsorships. Without Skillshare stepping in, it'd be unlikely that I'd be able to carve out the time to produce monthly videos.
Sadly we lost the amazing spectral composer Kaija Saariaho a couple weeks ago. May she be remembered through her music for decades to come. Rest in peace.
This is probably one of the best summations of spectralism done in a coherent way. I am very happy about your inclusion of Romanian spectralism. I am wondering if you are considering a follow-up on Hyper-Spectralism (Romania) and Saturationism (France), especially considering the wonderful female Romanian composer Avram.
Haas’s “in vain” is extraordinary not only for the harmonic battle that you mention, but also for the overall form. The music seems to analyze itself during the course of the formal argument. For example: The perpetual downward runs that open the piece, and which recur later, are at one point gradually slowed down to near stasis, allowing one to hear the individual chords that earlier whizzed by. It turns out that they are almost conventionally beautiful, with heavy emotional weight. Yet Haas has said that it’s the other sections-the lights-out episodes based on overtone harmony-which represent the more “ideal” music, a sort of glimpse into a Utopian rainbow land. An epochal work, a masterpiece quite unlike any other.
OK so I’m a drone musician myself and it’s fascinating to hear about things I’ve been developing myself from a different perspective, albeit from the perspective of waveforms not the harmonic series. I’ll have to follow this rabbit, thanks for the stimulating and informative presentation!
To offer some insight, just working with waveforms is not so far from working with the harmonic series if, when you work, you take into account the relationships between different waveforms, both in frequency and amplitude. I think the beauty of working with the harmonic series is that it ties together the physical, the aesthetic and the conceptual realms very seamlessly. For an intuitive introduction and development into this concept, I recommend you to check out W.A. Mathieu’s book ‘Harmonic Experience’. The first few chapters dwell on dronality. I reckon it will have a significant impact on your practice.
I've written a few electronic drone compositions, and I actually did work with notes and the harmonic series similar to how spectral composers do, although I wasn't really very aware of spectral composition at the time.
very nice video! It was a wild ride studying the spectral movement in College. My teacher knows these people, José Augusto Mannis, check out his music it's freackin awesome. When we mentioned about our interest in spectral music his answer was "oh really? cool, I was part of the movement in Paris". All our jaws hit the floor. This happened somewhat frequently, like when we mentioned pieces and he was like "yeah I remember.... I recorded the debut....". Seeing a well made youtube video like this really brings glee to my heart on sharing about this paradigm of music. Especially since you layed out perfectly how the composer's feel about the label "spectralist". It is kind of seen as a discipline without a proper name. Almost if applied acoustics would make more sense. Btw, curious that you mentioned Wagner as a precursor, normally we mention Debussy, as if you see his "harmonies" of dissonance and cossonance as rough and smooth, his music has a very diferent perspective. Although still very coherent. Writing music, using these techniques doesn't feel like your a "spectralist" more like your using a "contemporary harmony/orchestration", although even that is reductionist. But it still feels within that "type" of category of discipline in music. And I feel you had a great exposition on how people think of this and perceive it. I'd be curious if you mention Live Electronics and other ElectroAcoustic Music that derive/intertwine with this paradigm. Peace from Brazil
It would be cool to see you do a deep dive on synthesis and analogue tools. These really are a new class of tools to work with! Very nice work, I love your video essays
Always love your videos, finding them immensely informative and fun, but you have out-done yourself here. This video caused me to realize, among other things, how much I truly admire spectral music and how much I have missed luxuriating myself in it in all of its forms, as I have not listened to this music much in the past few years. And, as much as I find the French spectralists mesmerizing, I have always found the roumanian spectralists more intriguing and flat-out weird. Great job and keep up the good work.
I've always been interested in the harmonic series as a universal expression of music. Seems as though spectralism can be understood as cross cultural. Great video!
If I can make a suggestion for a composer you should cover, I’d love to see an episode about Anatoly Lyadov. His piece Kikimora is one of my favorite pieces of all time.
Awesome presentation and topic! Very well prepared my friend. I personally loathe almost everything beyond the late romantic era, but I still respect the skills these masters had, even if their compositions sounds horrible to me in comparison to traditional composers. Thanks for the upload!
I am enjoying your quality educational contents as usual, but If you could talk about Aaron Cassidy composer, it would so very great. He is distinctive, fascinating and unusual :)
Thanks for the video! Tristain Murail was still teaching composition while I was at Columbia University in the early 2000s. As an undergraduate, I never had a class with him personally, but all my TA's did! I also got to attend a performance of "Winter Fragments," which was my first exposure to the "IRCAM sound" of mixed live music and bell-like electronics that you describe. This video was quite a nostalgia trip for me! The influence of Spectralism was all over the music department at Columbia, and even the undergrads had to analyze Grisey's Partiels, along with Varese and some of your other mentions. After college, I was less and less involved with new music and I now work in the visual arts. But I've always clung to the Spectralists' central insight about the unity of harmony and timbre. It has a retrospective power, so that you can almost understand earlier music through a Spectralist lens. (One teacher began class by playing Partiels and the overture to Montverdi's Orfeo overture back to back!)
4:20 Isn't rhythm the only factor here? At small enough timescales, rhythm becomes pitch to our ears, and at even smaller you also get timbre (assuming the dominant pitch here is the root note). But maybe I am getting ahead of myself ^^
What is the end result? What is the cost of dwelling on negativity? What may come from the removal of flesh and blood? Sounds are interesting and may come of tuition, but without flesh and blood the reality of a market place will destroy as it has learned music.
The minor triad can be represented in the (harmonic) overtone series as 10:12:15. It's there, but its root is the 5th harmonic instead of the fundamental.
There's likely a particularly high concentration of people watching this video and in this comment section who are very grateful for your scale generator website, myself included.
@@doesthishavetobearealname7647 16:19:24 has a much higher complexity than 10:12:15. You could also use 6:7:9 to get a lower complexity. I am a big fan of 22:26:33, which sounds almost identical to 16:19:24
Love this video! My senior project in college was an analysis/explanation of Grisey's Vortex Temporum. While I don't listen to a ton of spectral music these days, I still feel a strong connection to it and enjoy the occasional delve back into the music 😊
I was somewhat familiar with Grisey, Murail, and some of their students, as well as with several of the other composers you discuss here, but the Romanian spectralists are all new to me. I consider myself someone who knows a fair amount about 20th-century music; how exciting to find something completely unfamiliar! I'm rather surprised I hadn't come across your channel before. I look forward to exploring more of it.
very interesting indeed! I played (electric) guitar on a Grisey piece at The Proms in London a few years ago - I had no idea he was a spectralist! I will definitely be watching this video again as it's full of great stuff to check out, many thanks!!!
Ana-Maria Avram was great and part of Romanian Spectral scene. will be nice to have something about her and add some perspective to the typical all male narrative ..
Spectralism: talent-free, communist poseurs desperately seeking recognition as academic musicians. “The new things aren’t beautiful and the beautiful things aren’t new”-Franz Liszt
Thanks for this, I've been waiting for this video for a long time. Romanian spectralism is a completely new thing to me, I've heard of Radulescu briefly, but haven't actually listened to his music, I look forward to exploring more!
Dear Sir. I haven’t abandoned my favorite musical commenter. I’ll be sending my new number to you on Patreon. Best Buy illegally charged my card for services I’m not aware of involving a computer I purchased from them. So please expect a new debit card and things shall return to normal. So embarrassing for me. Robert Shapiro. PS Look for a publication, in some form, detailing the progression of Schoenberg’s music. It might be a Doctoral Dissertation, or a book. Many best wishes from a dedicated fan. RS
Fantastic video! Per Nørgårds use of spectralist techniques is actually far more extended and varied than is mentioned here. Just look at his piece for organ "canon" and of course his 3'rd symphony! Again fantastic video
Oh I know that I am not exactly the target audience for this video. I am basically a three chord country music kind of guy. But I find these concepts interesting. And I have been considering something along these lines in my own recordings however trying to keep a chord structure and melody line going. I know it’s not the same thing that you’re talking about here but again it was very interesting. Thank you very much.
In the context of your musical practice, I think the spectralist attitude would be most helpful and make the most sense to apply in the composition and manipulation of timbre. You could start by thinking how does the sensations provided by a chordal instrument differ if its timbre differs. For example, if you use an electric guitar, crank the volume of its amplifier and pay attention to the particular sonic qualities that arise by using different pickup, tone control, volume control and playing attack combinations. The next step towards manipulating the possibilities of this experiment would be to delve into the electronic modifications that can be made to the instrument’s circuit to enhance a particular sonic quality or behavior of the circuit, which is a rabbit hole of its own but very much worthy of exploring too. I hope this information helps!
@@unoaotroa It helps a lot. The thing is, I have been thinking about this for quite some time I just never knew there was a name for it all. For instance, oh I love the open de note on guitar. De 3 just sends chills down my spine. I love that note and I can’t explain why. I have thought about writing a composition just around the D chord using mostly slide resonator style guitar. A.k.a., dobro. Playing around the D chord I have two dobros in different tuning‘s and can re-to notes to help me fine different sounds different octaves. And then maybe some mandolin on top of that. I’ve contemplated it for a while just never have gotten around to it. The fact that I do not read or write music and will be doing it all by ear makes it problematic but I know that I can do it because I have been riding gospel songs for 30 years.
Am I mistaken or is a minor triad formed between the 6th, 7th, and 9th partials? It would technically be termed a septimal subminor triad I think because the third is flat by about thirty cents but still. Also I think there’s a much closer one higher up-16:19:24. The 19th harmonic is only a couple of cents flat of a 12tet minor third I’m pretty sure
if we need to talk about spectral music, we have to talk the first man: Toshirō Mayuzumi, and now the second spectral musical school: Philippe Hurel, Philippe Leroux, Jean luc hevare. there are more important than Hass.
Really informative, thanks! I’d heard of Murail and Grisey and was intrigued by what I’ve heard of their work, and it great to know more. I wonder: would Eliane Radigue vaguely fit into Spectralism? Her influences are mostly from musique concrète and Buddhism, but she often used analogue filters to pick out the harmonics from electronic tones as part of long, hypnotic drones, and has been working more recently with acoustic instruments in ways that emphasises subtle shifts in timbres more than traditional harmonic movement.
I was thinking along those lines. In fact, I'll pose there is a sinecdoque in between the spiritual dimension and the acoustic dimension of Eliane Radigue's works. And however unintendedly, spectral depth always seemed to me her fundamental aim, albeit perceptually slightly subdued by the ongoingness of the droning.
I am a huge classical music nerd myself as well as a former classical pianist and I am so addicted to your channel. I love that you cover both the major and sadly forgotten composers. I requested Albeniz previously somewhere but I'd be so thrilled to see Kabalevsky, Ibert, and Babadjanian as well! Pretty please!!
It seems like spectralism could be an interesting starting point to talk about the composition of various genres of electronic music. I haven't yet finished the video as I type this, but I'm wondering if anyone has done spectral compositions that make use of additive synthesis.
Hi,I have to questions :) - do you know any classical "songs" in which we have harmonic Major/ionian b6 or any modes of harm. Major?? - what is/are,most problematic hands/fingers movements on guitar during chords changes of course? Your top 10 :) which part of which compositions?
Amazing directions cited here ! I only knew of the Romanian Radelescu so finding out that many Romanians were investigating the spectra and questioning issues some ten yrears before the French was great news . Wonderful that you traced roots of this trend all over the world !
Doing an analysis exam in Italy about a guitar piece written by Murail, "Tellur". Thank you for creating this content, it really helped me out to have a wider knowledge about spectralism without having to spent countless hours finding sources and read them. Great job
Amazing content! Keep it coming, so insightful and direct. Thanks. P.S. just a suggestion from a new fan, i think you might benefit from better lighting and color processing))
Great content, thanks so much! There is one passage that I did not completely understand: "One thing that sets Radelescu aside from other Romanian spectra lists is his affinity for what Teodore (some Romanian surname) calls 'mimetic spectralism'. Mimetic spectralism pitches harmonic and inharmonic spectra against each other to create tension." Could you elaborate a little bit on what you mean by that? A Google search hasn't really yielded any useful results.
