Duval's performance was the standout performance. Jack is simply playing Jack.... Compare his work in The Shining to Joker in Batman. A different character that is mostly the same. Jack plays Jack in nearly all of his roles and people like it, but he is a very one dimensional actor. Now compare Duval's character in The Shining to her character in Popeye, for instance. HUGE variation in her characters. She is completely underrated. Her performance in The Shining was stellar.
Stephen King needs to stick to books, he is not good at Movies, you simply cannot compare the two. He is a great writer but not a great director of film.
@@LUCCI_25 His movies turn into a long drawn out disaster because he tries to make the movie fit too closely to the book. I am talking about when he tries to direct the movie or micro-manage it, look at "The Stand". Yes when a director interprets his idea into a movie it works well, but they are 2 completely different artforms and nothing alike.
The thing about the book is that jack was very kind and didn’t feel unhinged so when he goes crazy at the hotel it’s very obviously “oh the ghost are making him crazy” but in the movie he’s almost always so tense and irritable. So you have to wonder how much is the hotel and how much is jack. It feels way more believable that way and I really like it personally
First time I properly watched it i didn't like it because he was already bad before he got to the hotel. Second time I realised how genius it was to make him already bad before he reaches the hotel. The hotel is the crucible of white, male, misogynistic, racist violent imperialism, not a ghost house that takes over innocent people. It's an expression of something deep and evil within humanity
Did you read the book? Jack is an abusive alcoholic way before they even get to the hotel. The only reason they go to the hotel in the first place is because Jack got fired for assaulting a high school kid. Jack broke Danny’s arm way before they got to the hotel.
You obviously didn't read the book, because it's obvious from the start that Jack is a disturbed person, with deep seethed anger issues. He has been violent multiple times before even going to the hotel. In fact he has to take the job at the hotel because he was fired from his job as a teacher for assaulting a student. He is a man with an enormous ego, and it's because of his narcissism that the hotel is easily able to manipulate him.
Well it more than the ghosts just making him crazy they just abused his flaws and made him believe he was in the right and that Danny and Wendy were trying to harm him and the book shows how are mistake like a tiny rip in a piece of paper can be ramped up to 1,000 , tearing the paper in half, by just a single external source
“Scream and be stupid.” Damn, Steve! I saw her as human, vulnerable, terrified and did anything she could to protect herself and her son. Shelly did an awesome job, imo. Doubly so having to put up with Stanley’s abuse the entire time, hospitalizing her from all the trauma, screaming, running and hyperventilating.
I'm sure there's a certain dichotomy of both pride and resentment. But, whether you like it or not, the movie has been influential in the book's success. Perhaps, Kubrick should have given the movie a different title. I don't know, but neither will you.
Meh just seemed like a generic horror movie to me. It's hard to watch after reading the book because all the differences between the book and the movie are so glaring.
@@rustyshackelford7651 there is so much meaning in the shining it’s insane. It’s not just a horror film and it most certainly wasn’t generic. It was far from generic.
@@rustyshackelford7651how on earth is it generic? Out of all the random adjectives you can use as criticism you pick that one lol. And is does it differing from the book negative? It's not like the book is objectively perfect and any derivation from it is a mistake. In fact I'd say the movie is a lot more interesting
Shelly Duvall should of received an Oscar for her role as Wendy Torrance in The Shining sad how underrated she was and she was an incredible actress RIP 🌹
I think Wendy in the movie is perfect. If you were trapped alone with an axe wielding psycho you’d be a blubbering mess. But through the whole thing she fights for her child even though she’s afraid. That’s true bravery
@@marianadelgado5449 They explicitly mention the film in their comment so probably not, but any excuse to recycle some internet speak towards them I guess? I've read the book though, and the one main difference is that he describes her as hot with big jugs. Also it's an adaption, not a recreation, something which King has never quite grasped.
@@comment15 Adding to this, not saying Steve is bad at writing women characters in his novels or anything. But he shouldn’t go around boasting about writing interesting woman characters when he needed his wife’s help with this very same thing in his original draft of Carrie.
I discovered many wonderful books through watching movie adaptations first, if it weren't for The Shining movie I wouldn't have read the book, in fact that's how I discovered Stephen King and this applies to the rest of his work.
@@jesustovar2549 that’s actually how I like to go about experiencing movie adaptations of books. Movie first, then book. Cause it’s easy to cast aside the expectations for the book when I have the movie in my head but harder for me to do the opposite. I did that for Trainspotting and enjoyed that a lot.
I read the book before I watched the film and can say that it was one of my favorite books. I also watched the film after and that too ended up being one of my favorite films. Both are pieces of art
I read the book too. Deadly dull until page 52. Fantastic thereafter. Counseled many friends to just make it to 52. They all thanked me for it, as it was SO hard to get there. Saw the movie at least a dozen times since then, 9 times in the first month of its opening.
There’s a theory that the camera is the hotel’s ghostly presence, and that the camera moving with the axe is the hotel’s influence and power contributing to jack’s madness
Yeah. I think a lot of the commenters here have not read the book, lol. Both are good. The book's ending I think was particularly personal to King, and was one of the parts he was most upset about having been changed. The movie doesn't really give him that moment of clarity where he fights the possession / "alcoholism" long enough for his family to save themselves. Seeing alcoholism destroy his family is what motivated King to stop drinking. So I would agree. I don't see artistic jealousy being much of a factor here, especially since he admits there are many parts of the movie he does like and that he's a fan of Kubrick in general.
He's a writer. He doesn't like people messing with his creations. Kubrick is Kubrick. I've read the book 4 times and I have no idea how many times I've watched the Shining. i went the opening week when it came out with my stepfather and had to explain what happened in the movie to him after. I have to admit his confusion was half of the fun. He wasn't alone.
@EducatedBrutethat's what I'm thinking. Maybe Kubrick was a bit too subtle about the supernatural elements and the hotel itself being possessed but it definitely is. The impossible geometry of the floor layout itself makes it clear. But that's a detail I had missed completely if it wasn't for the analysis in the documentary "Room 237". Many of the rooms cannot be were they actually are. The "gold room" is also a mystery and we never see where it's even located.
@@BourneKnightSpeak for yourself, it's probably one of the worst king adaptations. People praise Kubrick's work to show off but they're just repeating what the mob is saying. It's not a good movie.
@@simonbennett6202Stephen king isn’t even that good an author pal. Literally makes pop horror books for a massive audience. He has a great mind and cool ideas, but Kubrick’s adaptation is genuinely better than anything he’s ever written
@@simonbennett6202 People praise it because it's an excellent movie, and rightfully don't give a fuck that it's not a faithful adaptation. I'm glad it's not. Kubrick's story is better.
Ironically Kubrick probably did more for kings reputation than any other person. Kings name is associated with one of the greatest movies ever made even though only the bare bones of his novel are in the film. Kubrick's adaptation works better on screen than the novel ever could, as proved by the mini series
@@ArcanumAscent true but Carrie has never been as iconic and talked about as The Shining. I don't think any movie in history has been scrutinised and debated about as much as The Shining
@Mark-lj1dj I absolutely love the shining and kubrick is my favourite Director but it is definitely not the most discussed movie of all time, not even close to it
The opening of the movie was unforgettable! The music, the drive through desolation and throughout the movie Jack Torrance’s blank stares into eternity. All characters to me were great. The Shining is truly terrifying and mesmerizing. One of the greatest movies, ever!
I've read several Stephen King books..I did not find any of them to be 'warm'. In fact I'd say the opposite, he has a very dry, calculated, reporter-like style that is usually devoid of emotion. Feels like reading a newspaper article Edit: I think his journalistic style is why he is so successful in writing about the supernatural. It's the contrast between his 'matter-of-fact' style and the supernatural subject matter than makes the story feel authentic!
I don't agree with that, I'm reading Misery right now and it's very immersive. Puts you right in bed with Paul and makes you connect and feel for him. Very "warm" feeling like King said
That's not what I got out of it. Many of his books are immersive, especially his earlier works. You're right there with Jack and his family. And that final unmasking part was so great. Jack in the book is a victim. In the movie, he goes full villain. Even in the sequel, Jack is a bit of a hero. I won't spoil it for anyone. I did hear that the book is rooted in his own families struggles with alcohol.
@@carmengogeidnas9670 you need to read pet sematary then. Several pages are dedicated to describing how louis stays in a drunken stupor to numb the reality that his kid was killed
Nothing annoys me more than the Shelly slander. That girl helped make the shining & she was so ab*sed during the filming that she made a mental breakdown & ended up homeless living in her car & now she’s passed away.. it’s heartbreaking af
That’s what makes the shining so good, it’s bitter and cold. You can feel the intense atmosphere throughout the movie because of how isolated the overlook hotel is. It really terrifies you.
Jack in the book has a certain side to him that is lovable, that is constantly reaching to do good, trying to be a better husband and father, and you can feel the family dynamic just trying to stay together. In the movie Jack is cold from the start.
Kubrick was a genius. King is not. He's good at thinking up spooky premises but his execution when fleshing out those ideas into complete stories is mid.
@@goatwarrior3570 have u even read any Stephen king books. Because u realise he doesn’t just do horror. Shawshank redemption, the green mile, 11/22/63? All of the shining and other stories Kubrick did was from other people. Also he only has like 2/3 classics. King has 10/12
@@owengibby Yes read a couple of his books, they're very poor. He comes up with some good premises but his writing is very weak and he never knows where to take a story so it usually drifts into nonsense. Fortunately, film makers were able to make some classic films inspired by his work and many of the film adaptations are far more famous than the mediocre books. Green Mile, Shawshank Redemption and the Shining would be good examples where the film is vastly superior and more widely known than the original book. Stanley Kubrick was a genius film maker with a great number of classics to his name. A far more intelligent, talented and respected artist than the oddball King could ever hope to be.
@@goatwarrior3570 I’ve read all of his books. There’s nothing wrong with his writing style. Sometimes simplicity works and it shows coming how their some of the most popular books of all time. I’ve recently just re-read the shining and the shawl shank redemption and their either the same level or better. And especially those books are his most focused. I just don’t think ur a big fan of king are a bit bias and you’re more of a movie fan than a book fan which is fine I guess.
As a huge fan of both the book and the movie, I find I best can reconcile(not sure if this is the word I'm looking for) the insane differences of both as just keeping them complete seperate entities. As if neither is in association with the other. Then, they are both their own masterpieces and I love them better for it. If I were to compare either to the other it just wouldn't make sense. I do understand SK feelings because it's his baby 😅 I think a lot of authors would feel the same but then again, that's why they aren't out making movies. Rambled and out of order thoughts just to say, they're both awesome by themselves.
I freaking love Stephen and The Shining was a phenomenal novel, but c'mon, he gotta give some credit to Shelley Duvall for that chilling performance. Her portrayal of fear and agony is palpable, it's what makes the movie work. Clearly Stephen had a different idea on the story as had Stanley Kubrick. That doesn't make the movie or the book less of a masterpiece. But hey, the true legend here would be Mike Flanagan who managed to make the best sequel in existence, combining both King and Kubrick's visions. THAT'S some real hard work to do, apparently.
Most terrifying horror movie ever made! Scares me every time I watch it. Of course my name is Wendy so that does help. The music alone , Jack's face, Danny's scenes. Shelley Duvall was fantastic and it makes me sick that she was physically, emotionally, verbally abused while filming this movie.😢 Mr. King should be embarrassed.
I didn't think it was scary. In fact. I hated it the first time I saw it. But something kept pulling me back to the movie. It stays with you. It haunts you. The misogyny, the unreliable narration, the debate if it's psychological or haunted. And the iconic images, one after the other. Many layers. Now, after many viewings, it's in my all-time top 10. Kubricks Shining calls to me, haunts my dreams, Stephen's book doesn't.
I always hate talking about scary movies with people. There’s always those “tough” people who are like, “That wasn’t even scary” followed by some passive aggressive judgement. I noticed those types of people always lack a good imagination. It takes a wild imagination to truly appreciate good horror stories.
Kubrick - master of the cold horror abyss the family is sucked in to. Atmosphere beyond belief, rhythm of escalating dread and horror until that horrific culmination. Kubrick did great at his stab at the horror genre. One of the best haunted house films ever.
Kubrick being the chess player calling King in the middle of the night to ask stupid questions, making King think he could start calling Kubrick stupid, making King look stupid.
The Shining is one of my all-time favorite novels and Kubrick's adaptation, though no-doubt unfaithful, is one of my favorite horror movies. There's just no other movie like it. It's so unique.
Imagine if he became wise in his old age and said "yeah I was doing a lot of coke and my ego was the size of the moon, Kubrick's film is legendary and did a lot for my legacy"
@@jeremy4375 Well the comment is one day old. Time will tell if it’s “underrated.” The word underrated gets thrown around too loosely these days on the internet.
I love Stephen but such a harsh review of Shelley. Her performance was raw and realistic. How I would expect someone to act when their husband goes insane. Her emotions were a wreck and she was absolutely terrified. She made the movie
I agree it’s amazing but it isn’t a good adaptation from the book. And what I find funny Doctor sleep is a better adaptation of the book but people don’t like it as much
Sorry Steve you got this one wrong. I understand that it was far removed from your vision but it really works. I'm glad the story can exist alongside with your book. Just like I'm glad Arnold Schwarzenegger's Conan can exist along side Robert E Howard's Conan.
I loved Shelley. That woman went through hell. Tormented the entire filming. All her emotion was 1000% real and you could feel it. Amazing actress and performance regardless.
They were two different interpretations. King created these characters but when transforming the novel into a film Kubrick used his typical cold approach to characterization & focused on film style & technique. The 1997 tv movie w/ Steven Webber & Rebecca DeMornay was the opposite-centered more on character development than film style. Both are good.
King has also said Kubrick knew nothing about horror, but look at all the lazy cliches in his miniseries, like the stooge in the wolf mask jumping out at Danny.
To be fair, Stephen's description of Kubrick's movie as "cold" is 100% correct, AND the reason the movie is so d*mn thrilling, suspenseful, and outright horrific! I read the original story and did view the TV mini-series, which is closer to the book, and I found it to "comic booky" with the visuals and story presentation, not scary at all.
As the creator of those characters, he is giving his opinion in relation to how they were portrayed as opposed to who they were supposed to be. He has every right to dissect the film this way. When the tv version was made, i was so confused as to why Wendy was so different, but after reading the book I understand that Rebecca Demornay was much more as Wendy was written.
The Shining as a movie was actually very warm in my opinion, even during the parts where there was snow. It gives off a very nostalgic feeling and it really feels like it’s pulled straight from the reader’s mind. Like it was written by someone who became inspired and fell in love with the novel, creating it in the way they saw it, and likely how many others saw it: Steve Kubrick.
@@Oxbloodmage from what I’ve seen over the last few years that’s not the case either. Stephen King has the media literacy of a middle aged wine aunt in the 1990s, and thus he sounds like he gets all of his political opinions from the TV. It might not be so bad if he wasn’t such a colossal douche bag about it-especially when he’s proven wrong. It’s always interesting when an otherwise intelligent individual adopts all of the same political opinions as the media illiterate harpies who host the View.
From what I’ve learned in recent years, Kubrick is in the lowest circle of Hell for what he did to Shelley Duvall on The Shining set, so King can bad mouth his movie as much as he wants as far as I’m concerned.
@@ThanatorRider He didn't punish her particularly, he was crazy like that with everyone. So many people worked with him on only one film and never came back because they hated it. Duvall also said she agreed to his verbal abuse between takes because it helped her get into the right frame of mind and still says he was warm and friendly, the horror of it is significantly exaggerated. I'm not saying she didn't suffer, she was going through a lot, but you really can't attribute that to Kubrick given it was a demanding role emotionally and he's always done a lot of takes, that's his method, and it makes amazing films. And Shelley has been far less critical of Kubrick than lots of other collaborators.
@@jpc2470 The thing is it's really difficult to differentiate the art from the "abuse". Hitchcock was no different, notorious for mistreatment, but it was all with a purpose. Lots of actors talk about how bad so many takes are, but so many also say (see Marisa Berenson) that doing it so many times stopped them trying to recall lines and gave it more immediacy. It's one thing if he coerced people, but he never forced anyone into anything, and he always worked just as hard as anyone else. So no, it was an important part of making those classic films, I don't think that makes me a worshipping film bro. I still sympathise with what she went through, it can't have been easy.
No one thinks ur “books are warm” dude writes about psychological thrillers/ & horror & he thinks that makes people feel “warm inside”😂 he’s kinda cray cray
Nice comment. I like watching film adaptations of King's books (Like IT or the Mist ) but all his books are thrillers and he knows very well that the people who watch these movies are thriller-horror films fans like me and many others.We don't watch these movies for a warm feeling, that's not what we expect.
I love the fact Kubrick didn't give a hoot about Kings story. He even went as far to include a shot of a crushed car that was the same colour as depicted in the book. Kubrick indicating, that this is his story now.
@@jpc2470You're right about the source material, he explicitly chose it for box office appeal. But there was a recent adaptation following King's novel and it was awful, Kubrick choosing it for commercial reasons doesn't change the fact that he not only improved upon the original but made one of the greatest films ever made. Barry Lyndon was a book out of print even in its day, of course he radically adapted it for the screen, and imo improved it dramatically. What was so wrong with it in your view?
So he decided that instead of making his own work, he just took someone else’s work, and only took the elements that he wanted? Then why not do what Blade Runner did, and rename the movie? Because Kubrick is an abusive asshole, that’s why. I do enjoy the Shinning as a film tho.
King makes some solid points. However, the real reason’s he’s bitter about it is because the material on screen ultimately wasn’t his material. It was loosely inspired by it. The thing King doesn’t understand is that when you’re making a film, you really have to throw out all the material at a certain point and do what’s best for the cinematic version of the story you’re telling and not anything it’s supposed to be based on. What works on page in a novel may not work well at all on stage in a film. It wasn’t ultimately King’s story on screen but it was still a great film. I think if he removed himself from his novel a bit more, he’d be able to see that
I wouldn’t think that’s the case. King is as successful a writer as Kubrick was as successful a director. A lot of authors are critical of movie adaptations of their work. The author of One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest didn’t like the movie. Roald Dahl intensely hated the Willy Wonka movie. There’s many other examples.
@@JacobDTulio That makes sense. The movie versions of the Shining and One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest are great in their own way, but also kind of shallow compared to the books, losing important themes and complexity in both. I'm guessing it's at least partly because both of those books are told from very introspective pov's, so the movies are forced to tell the stories from a more event-driven external perspective. Do you know what Roald Dahl's beef was?
@@0532MOET Sure mate, that's why the best directors of last 40-50 yrs consider him to be the greatest or one of greatest ever director. That's why his movies are considered widely as some the greatest ever in history of cinema, because he didn't the guy had no idea about anything 😅
@@mooma10honestly I forgot Stephen king wrote the shining. Never in my life did I associate here’s Johnny with Stephen king lol that was actually confusing
Well Stephen king wrote the shining and wrote the characters and story. Everyone who actually thinks thinks of Stephen King more than Kubrick cause it’s not Kubricks story
Wow I didn’t expect to walk away from this short totally understanding and respecting why he didn’t like a movie that I still think is a masterpiece. I feel like if it wasn’t based on his work he’d like it a lot more. His reasoning makes a lot of sense and he is able to articulate it incredibly well. Both King and Kubrick are masters of their craft.
Kinda sounds like a case of him just not being able to accept changes made to his work when adapted for the big screen. Clearly everything Kubrick did was the right ifea
How is everything he did clearly the right idea? Lol. Everything is flawed in different ways. Even the book. No movie/piece of fiction is without it’s flaws.
@@WopedomerKubrick had a much bigger ego problem than King ever did. Kubrick literally just took a story and thought “he could do better” by changing the story. Not to mention him wanting to make “the first good Science Fiction film” with 2001 A Space Odyssey, then proceeds to make an overrated film that wasn’t even the best Sci Fi the year it released.
That "Misery" (1990) Movie was insanely cold. I wonder what warmth that movie had, it didn't. And why didn't Stephen use that as an argument to critique - that movie.
i would say the opposite. book is one of the best I've read. kept me up at night, so nuanced and subtle but just terrifying stuff. the movie is also scary but Jack is more or less a psycho from the get go and the book really fleshes out the evil of the hotel and now it gets Jack. also, king's writing and use of metaphor to frighten you makes my skin crawl.
I like that it's a recurring thing that movie directors have to go in and fix up King's trash. Thank god we didn't get It with the young girl getting a train run on her.
Ever since watching the very faithful miniseries adaptation of The Shining, I have a greater appreciation for Kubrick's film and consider it the definitive version of The Shining
This is what makes Mike Flanagan's Doctor Sleep all the more impressive. It's a sequel to both the book and movie while also kind of a remake of the book.
The auther can describe with words about what the character was thinking in his/her mind , But in cinema , we can only watch and dive into the character feels and understand what the character is thinking and feeling.
Not just someone, arguably the greatest director to ever live, and arguably his greatest film. It always pissed me off how King dismisses the film adaptation as not to his liking when it is universally considered possibly the greatest horror movie ever made
Kubrick actually makes Wendy the central Character../ and she is the one going crazy not jack…. Rewatch it with this in mind, you’ll see a completely different perspective
The book and the movie differ in a few major ways and I respect Stephen King for his position on Kubrick's movie because The Shining was his story ultimately, but when King sold off the rights of his story to the studio that made it Kubrick's story to do what he wished on film. Stanley Kubrick was a master of cinema much like Stephen King is a master in the literary world. Definitely do yourself a favor and read King's novel as well as watch Kubrick's film because they take the characters through different storylines and you won't be disappointed with either version.
I had no idea, Mr. King - that you had such an indifference with "The Shining" movie as directed by Mr Kubrick. Actually, that movie is the first movie that scared me half to death as a kid. The first one that I really was genuinely scared! I was only about 10 years old I think when I first saw it on HBO late one night on a sleepover at a friends house. After his parents went to sleep, we sneaked into the TV room & watched the entire movie without his patents catching us! It scared the devil out of me and I still consider a classic. I'm 50 years old now but, back at that age, I was petrified. I too love all of Stanleys films...I am a big fan of your legendary work as well, Mr. King!
The Shining by Kubrick is brilliant. The writer of ALIEN would have ruined it had the producers not stepped in and fixed it. You can't always translate a book exactly to a movie. King should know that.
This is similar to Andrei Tarkovsky's Solaris, the writer hated it, because it wasn't like his book, but Tarkovsky responded that "he only wanted an illustration of his book" Which is why I love this film so much, Kubrick made an adaptation, not a literal translation, which is what makes this movie so iconic, as someone who's read the Shining, I can tell you is very different, but that's what is so great about it Unlike other directors that have no room for creating, because they are so worried on following the book word by word, Kubrick took the essentials and made something fantastic
Kubrick was the greatest artist we’ve had, at least since the Expressionism Movement during the Weimar Republic, and very likely the greatest filmmaker who will ever live. Stephen King is a master of unchallenging entertainment. Wendy was the killer and we are experiencing her delusional perspective in Kubrick’s masterpiece. Crafting this so elegantly that very few know this even 42yrs later is just a hint to how deep the iceberg goes.
