I'm not a beginner on guitar but I prefer to use a plugin when it comes to background strumming on a pop production. So much cleaner and easier. Thanks, Woody, and send my regards to Fredrik the trucker ... ;-)
it was quite easy to get a clean recording, well, apart from the playing fails, fret buzz, squeaks and unwanted muted notes... :) Fredrik is the man, didn't know he was a trucker, i'll have to revisit the lyrics.
This sounded beautiful! And the plugin sounded great. The song you recorded is called "Balladen om Fredrik Åkare och unga fröken Cecilia Lind" written by Swedish composer Cornelis Wreesvijk. Nice work 👍🙂
Absolutely love your stuff Woody! You really are a straight talking guy who doesn't beat about the bush and just says it exactly how it is ! Please keep it up Woody Buddy! - You're a refreshing breath of fresh air to the reviewing world! Long may you reign Master Woody! x x x
Absolutely bang on Woody! - If only we who are totally incompetent at playing guitar had access to a rocking guitarist to come do our guitar bits for us for free or for a future favor /payment in kind - then problem solved! But life isn't always that easy or kind so in the meantime we dig into these types of plugins to get us as near as we can be to the talented guitarist we would love to be! - Ace review as always - Your comments at the end really hit the reality nail on the head mate! - love it! x x x
that's great you enjoyed my wrap-up, i thought i was fumbling around a bit on the points I wanted to make. i really should have offered the chance to record the guitar part to my talented viewers, perhaps it's something we can revisit in the future, thanks for the comments Wayne.
For strings, I use my professional violinist friend to record his violin on top of my sampled strings NI library. So the track is like a veneer of real wood in covering the body of particle board (small sample size - basic ROMpler) or plywood (large deep sample size i.e. N.I.). So it's good to combine real and sampled instruments together! Do it with vocal background chorus too!
Absolutely true! It’s amazing how much adding a real soloist helps mask the deficiencies of the samples. It grabs the listener’s attention. Sort of a like a sleight of hand trick :)
Not sure if you did this but when tuning only tighten the strings. For instance if E string is F, bring it to D first then bring it back up. This prevents the guitar going out of tune quickly because the string gets stuck on the bridge and neck moldings.
I searched through the comments section to see if anyone had an answer to what song woody was playing or practicing. I guess I'll drop by in another week. Woody does convince me to practice music more rather than just programming it, and I agree with the "search and compromise" approach to plugins to be honest. Not fun when you have an idea in your head and your current workflow or tools don't get it down immediately.
Fun fact: The first song you are referring to is "Sommaren är kort" written by Swedish singer/songwriter Tomas Ledin (who also was a background singer for ABBA). That song is also recorded in english and is called "Taken by surprise".
Really enjoyed this video since it is exactly my experience with this plug. It also was a pleasant surprise to hear Una Corda which I thought sounded really sweet.
I’ve been waiting for a comparison like this since I keep having this argument all the time. This is a most fair comparison addressing the strengths and weaknesses of both. A change of strings wild make the guitar sound a lot better, as would spending some more time rehearsing the part, but it’s absolutely fair to compare the sample library to grabbing a dusty guitar :) The clashing of the grooves is the biggest audible problem in the result with the sampled guitar, like you say.
nice sum up Markus. I think you can look at the VST as a good source of inspiration when creating a new track from scratch, but it was a bit tedious/impossible to find an exact match for a pattern that you have in mind to compliment an existing track.
Could you tell me what platform are you using to record the instruments and put them all together? as you show in the video, thank you very much, excellent video, I subscribed.
Guitar is my primary instrument. The sound quality of the guitar plugin was very good but is inevitably let down by the limited number of presets, but for putting a guide track together for a real band to follow it works well, at least for music where the guitar isn't the driving instrument. I don't think your guitar was quite in tune. It could be that the high action is causing intonation problems. If you got that fixed you might play it more often. The bass guitar plugin was surprisingly good. The real guitar could've done with some EQ and reverb. You could also consider double tracking it. I quite liked the Band-in-a-box version. Interesting video!
The guitar is my main instrument. In my case, I think it comes down to pride/ego, as there's no way I'd let myself use a plugin for guitar. Having said that, as I'm not a very precise rhythm guitar player, I'd happily chop things up for timing purposes. I can't conveniently play or record an acoustic guitar in this house, so I haven't touched one for years. I'm currently investigating getting a piezo pickup bridge for one of my electrics to make up for that to an extent. I'd say plugins like that are a good option for less capable guitar players. As you say, people like me have to rely on "artificial methods" for drums and strings etc. The sad truth (for me) is that the plugin probably sounds better, in terms of clarity, consistency and quality than anything I could cobble together myself, particularly for a "pop" style recording where the guitar is just a backing layer rather than the focus. That said, I'd never use one. Oh well, we're allowed our little vanities and indulgences when doing something that's supposed to be fun. Your closing points are interesting. Obviously, the real guitar track could have been better and offered a better workflow if you had the kind of home studio where the acoustic guitar and recording setup were permanently at the ready. Incidentally, my favorite mic position for recording the acoustic guitar is aimed at the 12th fret. I just need to get the WoodyPiano plugin installed to make up for my crap keyboard skills ;-) Another interesting video. Thanks for making it.
Whatever comes out those speakers is what counts to my ears. I don't really care how it is achieved to be honest. I like the vst guitars and the drums. Saves so much time and effort to get what would prob take a lot of work and skill to achieve the same goal. I can't play guitar but I can with Synths and plugins 😂 making music is what counts. Oh.. Scarborough Fair is the song it reminded me of from about the mid section. Great video Woody.
The Band-In-A-Box version was the surprise sleeper in this review; not bad. The plugin is probably best, over a real guitar, if you are exploring for ideas, or composing in a volume restricted environment.
Enjoyed the video and your post recording comments. Pros and cons to each side of the debate. As a guitarist, I would prefer my actual performance be recorded vs a sampled instrument. As an engineer and producer, the ease of building an acoustic track late at night while the family sleeps makes the plugin a very valuable creative tool. One could build the entire track, trying out alternative strumming patterns, then when happy, re-record it with a real guitar at a suitable time. The dynamics of the sampled performances are very good in a mix in my opinion. Plan on buying it, along with the finger picking one. Cheers.
I’m a guitarist but it’s a very long time since I played in a band so my timing is crap. A sampled track locked to a drum groove makes a good platform for fills and leads played “ real”
I guess it all comes down to personal preference and how you want to use it. As a guitarist, it's far easier for me to just pick up the guitar, plug it into my audio interface, and put down a quick track. Rather than scrolling through preset samples, trying to find the right one for the song. Don't get me wrong, the samples do sound nice, but there is one real important thing that you can't program with a plugin.. And that's feel. Feel or groove is the driving force in a song, and you can't program (yet). Yeah, I guess you can get it close with plugins these days, but I still prefer the real thing.. However, I was suprised by that bass plugin! It sound really great, in my opinion. I can play simple stuff on the bass and lock in with the groove, but I can't play any real technical stuff on the bass. Unless I use a pick of course, but I personally don't like the sound of a pick being used on bass. But I'm really digging that plugin you used! Might end up getting it, for putting down quick bass tracks :) In the end, I thought it didn't sound too bad with the samples, but I much prefered the real thing.
funny, even with my playing, people enjoyed it more. the virtual guitar has controls to adjust timing, groove, swing, intensity, but totally agree, it's a lot quicker to just play what you hear. i enjoy the scarbee bass every time I play it.
If I'm not mistaken, you played these: "Sommaren är Kort - Tomas Ledin" and "Balladen om Fredrik Åkare och den söta fröken Cecilia Lind - Cornelis Vreeswijk"
It really is !!!! I am going to buy the bass vst, thx for the tip. In terms of piano i’m using « imperfect samples » which has a unique upright piano sound with flaws that are specific to this Kind of piano…listen to a demo if u get the chance. I’m also using « noire » When i want to get something purer, flawless …
This video came just when I was having the same dilemma :) Add a better mic, and your live guitar recording would have surely been a lot better than the plugin. Nice video Woody !
I preferred the way you played the real guitar, but the tone of the plugin. This could be easily corrected by some EQ. On the other hand, the sampled bass guitar wasn't bad at all, and since you played it yourself (although on a keyboard), there is no need for a real bass there. I'm a keyboard player as well (a very mediocre one by the way), but I cannot play the guitar. I have no other choice than either to learn to play the guitar, or use plugins... or actually ask my dad to play the guitar part for me :D However he's not a trained session musician, so explaining what I want him to play can be a bit tricky. I'll have a guess on the name of this Swedish folk song: "I'm taking Anna to Ikea on my Volvo" :D
someone should write that song! yes, perhaps you found there where you cross the line, it's when you go from using your own playing to a factory programmed pattern.
I enjoyed this. I am contemplating NI Strummed Acoustic. I play guitar but find I never get just what I want. I also use BIAB which I thought did a really good job here. Back to the drawing board. As I said I really enjoyed this video.
Great video as always Woody and an interesting experiment! The real guitar also sounded the best to me. I often mix real guitars with BIAB and virtual guitar tracks which to me gives the best of all worlds. The real guitar tracks seem to fool the ears into making the virtual guitar tracks sound more realistic.
Great video Woody. It is possible to split and change the measures of the 4\4 patterns to make them 3\4 time. Depends how long you want to mess with them. I think Strummed Acoustic is very under-rated.
good suggestion benjamin, yes it is possible to adjust the length of the pattern, so you could trim it to 3 beats. probably even more fiddling around though before you find a pattern with the right feel.
Sometimes the real instrument is not what you want. I love the sound of a real sax but I have a song where the sax part is for a breathy synth sax. It's not the real sound I want! I think sometimes X is better than Y, and sometimes Y is better than X.
Recording an acoustic guitar, and having it sound good is very very hard. You need a really good player, guitar , mic and room. Most people don’t have a decent room to record in.
I'm a guitarist, so I'm always going to say real over simulated haha. But that plugin sounds more than sufficient for anything where strummed acoustic is a more minor part of the mix.
Interesting video. Thanks for sharing. From my view this really isn't a fair comparison. NI use world class acoustic guitars and microphones to make their samples. Guitars will have new strings. Without going that far I use a pretty decent old Gibson J45 and a pair of AKG C451 condensers to record my Gibson. It sounds awesome and to me sounds better than having to use pre-sets. I do agree with you that if you are not really a good guitar player, the NI Acoustic Guitar VVST's are pretty awesome too. Still not as good as a top guitar player with world class equipment.
I play guitar but the samples are better than me and as a songwriter who can play a couple of instruments but am much better on keys this sort of stuff is a God send.
I prefer the feel of the real guitar. With some practice, decent strings and similar micing setup as Native Instruments use, I think it might be on par.
It comes down to money and time (same?). I just can't afford to hire a decent guitarist and I'm definitely not that great on guitar. I'm years late, but I love your videos!
In my opinion the guitar plugin do a pretty good job, especially if used by mediocre or non guitarist players. id rate them this way: 1. Woody 2. Session Guitarist 3. BiaB Plugins like Session Guitarists, Orange Tree Samples Do an impressive good job if you are not really a guitarist. Band in a Box has also become good over the years, but still its not really for making finnished tracks. More like a good rehearsal tool or a tool for getting ideas for a new song. And even Woody are as he says only a mediocre guitarist, it still sounds better and more real than the use of these reasonable intelligent plugins .. especially when you know what is what. The chosen rhythm pattern prolly werent one of the best in the plugin... Next time Woody should play some Latin rhythms with lots of fingerplay 8^) I am not sure I would recognice the use of a plugin in a finnished professional mixed track of both live and "fake" instruments if I werent told wich one was the "fake". The quality of many Kontakt instruments is so high today that if a person really knows how to use them well they sound extremely close to the real deal. Good video Woody .. and p.s. ... Your guitar play isn't all that bad :)
It was great until he added the drums. As he suggests at the end, he would have been better off trying to record the drums live to get the right groove
Agreed, - But I think he knows that - This was not a demo of how to do everything perfect, just to demonstrate guitar versus guitar... Yes I recommend tracking to the final drum groove to get the feel you are going for. But in the creative process we don't always know what the groove is going to be till later on in the arranging process. I often rerecord parts after they are written and initially tracked...
Thnx for the interesting video WPS. When you really up ur programming skills u might find it harder to make a good choice when it comes to live mediocre vs great sounding guitar plugin...e.g. just some random tweeks on the dynamic curve of the guitar plugin notes would create even more of a human feel. And, of course, if u have superior programming skills, it could be a game changer. Just saying. But thnx nonetheless.
Nice idea. Although, the plugin sounds extremely good and is very handy, your human touch is a notch or 2 ahead. And don't worry... I play much much worse ;) Oh... the bassline was top notch!
Top vid as always. I think rhythm guitar is deceptively hard... Easy to sound ok but listening to Danish Pete and Tom Pierce and other pros when they accompany the pop stars of the day... They could never be matched by any virtual instrument Nice bass line
does Danish Pete have a history as a session musician for pop stars of the day? tell me more, I admire his playing and touch on andertons but don't know his background.
@@WoodyPianoShack... Oh yesir he does... Tom Jones... Olly Murs...Girls Aloud... and when you see him in this role it kind of shows how less is more... accompanying well in this context is just as big a task as any shredding I think Check out the Captain meets vid with him. I'm native Guildfordian so remembwr Andertins 40 years ago. Nice to see them. become world famous
you get all what they prerecorded. not what you hope to get. mayby next version. click these 6 note and vola it strum guitar mode you choose. no you get 1 key play this mode. no i want play as playing guitar
I know Woody, I'm just messing with you. Back in the days I heard a producer saying that same comment but with a very serious attitude to a cocky "session guitarist" that used to talk crap from other real musicians. I almost fell to the floor laughing! But seriously you are not that bad on guitar..., I mean it might be worst! LOL! Cheers!
