Rowena new Queen of Hell? Or Ketch new King of Hell. There is quite a bit they can do with the characters even if they do stay dead. A Rowena ghost arc wouldn't surprise me either.
'' but it is SUPERNATURAL they aren't going to STAY dead'' yeah, cause all of the deaths we had so far people has been ressurected right? Bobby, Ellen, Jo, Charlie, John, Meg....
Hey, you don't have to be rude. I'm just saying that there isn't anything the writers achieve out of killing off 3 characters other than receiving less viewers. Cas and Crowley are no doubt coming back, i just doubt that Rowena will.
It helps set a dark tone of helplessness which they want for a season finale. The Winchesters have lost all their security blankets or crutches. This was illustrated actually when Cass healed Dean's serious injuries. They lost the Colt, their Mom, Cass, Crowley, Rowena..its just them and their B-Tier friends now (Jody, Garth, etc....certainly helpful but not Angel or King of Hell helpful). I wouldn't be surprised if all the characters returned TBH. Mary and Lucifer aren't dead just trapped in the alternate dimension, which is important because it gives them an excuse to revisit this in the future. Castiel is probably going to be brought back by the Nephilim or Chuck or Amara (yes, I think we very well may see them again for this season). Rowena will remain dead, but dead doesn't mean gone. I think she'll return as a ghost or even more likely a demon (Queen of Hell and all that, like Mother like son). Crowley is more on the fence, I could see them leaving him dead as it felt like a proper farewell for him. Would be funny though to see him brought back as a self loathing Angel who just hates being an Angel and wants to go back to being a demon, lol. And that puts the whole Rowena vs Crowley feud at a whole new level, especially if he wants his throne back. (Although I would seeing Ketch in the King of Hell role as well, I imagine if they went that route, Rowena would pull a power play or coup at some point. Now that said though, that is a bit excessive to bring everyone back, so I wouldn't be surprised especially in Crowley's case if the death sticks so that this finale still retains its gravitas. Supernatural has cleaned house like this before and I remember when they killed Rufus and Bobby and a ton of other characters back in what was it, season 8 I believe? Point being it seemed like a mistake at the time, but it allowed them to bring in and develop new characters. I do have to wonder though if this upcoming season will be the last, as this is going to be a hard finale to top.
Gotta give it to the writers - they had real balls this episode. I don't really like how they handled Rowena's death :(. Hope she comes back in the future
NetherStar Entertainment Yeah that pissed me off too! Right up there with Charlie, such BS lazy writing. There were a ton of filler episodes this year that could have been cut to better pace the end so Rowena wasn't such a throw away. I understand having to take her off the board but really?
Typically when they kill a character off screen like that is not because of the writing, but more or so the actor. She probably didn't want to or couldn't come back.
This particular nephilim is superior to archangel but still inferior to God/Amara. Honestly the power levels have been toned down so much compared to earlier seasons. Angels power have been scaled down to almost any human can beat them. Archangels too.
He better revive Crowley too. Ya gotta do it, Jack! He deserves it, he promised he would slap the gates of hell and he would be the only demon Winchester's would see, he promised...
I didn't see this reaction before watching the episode, but I knew about Cas' death and it destroyed me. (possible spoiler) now that ik he's alive I'm fine, but when I thought he was gone for good i cRiEd
My reaction was similar... I accidentally read that Cas and Crowley died this episode before I watched it, so I knew they died and I was in tears before I even watched it, but before I watched the episode I had to search on google 'Jody Mills' just to make sure she didn't die...
I know darlin...still crying about it myself...not our Cas! Crowley sacrificed himself to save the day and who would've seen that coming? We need M2 back!
castiel's gonna be fine i mean he died like 10 times ever since season 5. chuck would reconstruct him or the nephilim. but crowley is who im worried about.
CAS is back. Jared messed up at JIBcon and mentioned Cas being in a future episode. Misha then confirmed it in his panel. Not sure about others. One of my fave things about this episode though is that you saw what would have happened if Mary refused the deal with yellow eyes. Bobby said he met Mary Campbell who lamented her lost love John, so you have to assume that Mary refused the deal. Turns out the boys were the only ones strong enough to save the world. So she messed up her sons lives but saved the world.
What the actual fuck, I mean, Rowena, Crowley Castiel they fucking kill the most badass characters in the whole show in just ONE EPISODE They better bring at least Castiel or Crowley back but things would not be the same anymore without them
That Nephilim is super creepy. I wanted to believe he could be good, but after that creepy smile I'm not so sure anymore. So he showed Castiel a future "without pain, without suffering, paradise on earth"? I'm not buying it. You know what comes before paradise on earth? The Apocalypse. But introducing an alternative universe brings a lot of possibilities for bringing back some fan favourites. Crowleys and Rowenas death hit me harder than Castiels, but I don't want to believe they're all dead. I loved Mary kicking Lucifer's ass. :)
No, the Apocalypse brings paradise because it destroys most of the human population, the cause of turmoil on the Earth, but human destruction is not the only way to paradise...if it's possible. The world, on its own, changed a lot for the better in a few thousand years just by human 'evolution' alone and more conscientious people stepping up and others trying to stem the chaos. Compare 2017 to AD 17 to 2017 BC, it was so much more awful in the past, so it can still get better.
Yeah, Jack the nephilim, will most likely bring Castiel back. I don't see how Crowley could come back though. I hated how they handled Rowena's death! And I think Mary could survive Lucifer with the help of Bobby.
And he seemed 'over it all' when the Lucifer thing didn't pan out. Meg once said a demon needed a 'cause' to keep them going, interestingly. Lots were for power, Crowley hit the peak there, some worshipped Lucifer, obviously that wasn't an option. Even revenge (Luci didn't work out, Mom was dead.) I think he just was...ready, and wanted it to mean something. Even if only a final screw you to Lucifer, and saving the world.
jack is not stronger than lucifer... if anything weaker. lucifer ia rch angel jack is sone of an arch angel and human so.. jack dont have power to bring angels back only arch angels and god amara can do that.
I honestly don't really mind the other deaths, but I really hope Crowley comes back. Crowley was always so cool and interesting. I loved that character so much. I really do hope somehow he is brought back. I can't seem to watch the show without him in it. EDIT: Now that I think of it. The spell Crowley used didn't work when he offed himself. The only reason the door closed was because the nephilim was born. Crowley is known for his cleverness/sneakiness. I bet that spell did something else for him. It may bring him back from the dead. Possibly stronger. I bet he was planning something we don't know about.
The main theory: Castiel will be revived by nephilim. Remember the episode when Dagon wanted to kill Castiel? Nephilim gave him his power to save him. It means that castiel is important for nephilim
All season they teased Garth and did we get him, no. For season 13 I want garth back and Gabriel. Since Cas has passed away Gabriel could come back to mourn then meet Jack and decide to help him.
This is Supernatural. Castiel and Crowley will be resurrected very soon. Perhaps in the Season 13 premiere. Rowena's death was handled really poorly but again, its Supernatural, so she'll probably be back. Mary and Lucifer most likely won't return for a while, perhaps the final season (Season 14 most likely) or the Season 13 finale.
Sam McLatchie I think the opposite. Mary and Lucifer will be the Season 13 part 1 driving plot line probably, and when they get to know Jack he might revive Castiel.
WTF First Rowena, then Crowley and Cas and finally Mary!! Please Chuck let us at least have got Bobby back, and you know that next season they'll be going after Mary!
reader 99. I honestly don’t give 2 shits about Mary. I only would want her back so Dean and Sam can be slightly more happy. Otherwise she can die permanently for all I care.
the times cas died....or somebody else....i am not so sad now....the only thing that is difficult might be crowley because for fuck sake mark sheppard did a bloody good job and should keep doing it.
That smile at the end looks evil as fuck, I cant tell if that is just a red herring or not though. He will probably bring Castiel back in the first episode of next season though.
Reading the tweets and posts about this episode on twitter and other places made me realize how stupid Supernatural fandom actually is. Castiel has probably died more times than Sam & Dean, they will never actually kill him off. Nephilim will bring him back to life in the first 10 minutes of Season 13 Episode 1.
And now we have a whole summer to speculate, theorize and write fanfics. Was it really this verse Cas ? Is Crowley really dead ? Rowena being the Queen of Surviving, is not showing her dead scene a hint that she's not dead ? (I hooooope) Are we going to see more of the alternate reality ? So many things, the show could do so many things with what happened now ...
People are saying that Mark Sheppard and Misha are contracted for next season, so there is hope they're both coming back. If it's just earth 2 Cas and we don't get real Cas back, a lot of fans, myself included, are quitting.
VTL77 seriously? That's just crazy to quit because of one character that wasn't even a character for quite a few seasons to begin with. And yeah we all love Cas wholeheartedly, I myself love him more than even Jared, but as a dedicated fan whose watched for 12 seasons why would you quit now?
He has been in 9 of the 12 seasons. He's a main character. And a lot of fans feel like we're being queerbaited over Destiel, and killing Cas off for good would be the final straw that breaks the camel's back. SPOILER ALERT: All of this aside, Jared messed up at JIBCon and let out a spoiler that Misha recorded voice work with Jared and Jensen for the 13x16 animated Scooby Doo crossover ep. So I'm not so worried anymore.
Just what the fuck is wrong with these people? They just got rid of 6 main characters( Cas, Crowley, Rowena, Mary, Kally, Lucifer). 100% castiel will be back, 50% Crowley will be back cause someone needs to rule the hell. Mary and Lucifer are gone. It will be the dumbest idea to reopen the portal to bring Mary back
Probably the demons will go after Asmodeus for him to become the King of Hell. There's a good chance he does not even know that Ramiel and Dagon were killed, maybe he did not even know about Azazel's death. I think Castiel and Crowley will not be returning so soon, they've done that killing and resurrecting several times, I think this time it will be different. If Lucifer's Son dies, perhaps the "apocalyptic universe" too, including Mary and Lucifer, or simply both will be sent back to Earth. The idea is to leave Sam and Dean alone, just as it was in the beginning.
They have already left aside interesting universes in the series: "TV Universe" - 5x08 "Real Universe" - 6x15 Besides taking very little advantage of Purgatory.
Perhaps they use some spell (similar to Henry's) and travel back in time to find Samuel Colt, to repair the Colt and use the Colt to kill the Nephilim. Or, my favorite form, Jesse Turner ends this son of a bitch.
Yeah I don't know....whatever this episode upset me :(. Are they low on cash and have to get rid of every top character or something!? I'm most upset over castiel
love that "bitch face" "bitch face" lmao, Rowena's death was so wrong, she deserved a better one. Then the boys lost everyone again.... it hurts....I know Cas will be back, RIP Crowley and Rowena
I had the same reaction... I just sat there staring at the blank screen for whole 5 mins, having no idea how to comprehend cas's death 😢😢😢 I mean, after each eons of existence, he just now figured his purpose and finally had a family who always stood by his side no matter how much he messed up 😢😢😢 this is so unfair and I don't care what they do, but I want Cas back or Chuck help me 😡
As i am in the UK i literally just watched it and i actually want to cry edit: I literally can't even i just can't do anything now! RIP Crowley Castile Rowena ❤️❤️❤️😭😭😭
The only thing that saved me after this episode was seeing Misha at A18 being all cool and joking around, because before when he thought he wouldn't be on the show anymore, his attitude was a lot different. So for me it was kind of obvious that Cas was gonna be back. And then Jared screwed up and spoiled it on JIB con and then Misha came to SDCC to promote the show and finally it was actually confirmed by Bob Singer that Cas was gonna be back. Although it was also said that "Cas is more dead than usual", so there's that...
Two Thoughts, one, when Crowley died that was the life needed to close the Rip but it stayed open for the killing of Cass and for Marys Brass knuckle sandwich, and the way Sam took off into the house he might be thinking the Nephilim can save Cass.
OKAY SO WHAT IF CAS ISN'T DEAD? Our Cas, at least. There _was_ a Bobby Singer, surrogate father to Sam and Dean Winchester in "our" dimension. In that alternate one, though, it was a completely different Bobby; he was like a military general. Sam and Dean were never born. But Sam and Dean's birth would never affect Castiel's existing…what if the Cas that Lucifer killed wasn't from our dimension? What if he killed the alternate-reality Cas instead?
Castiel has been killed numerous times and revived, Jack the nephilim will bring him back I think! What would be awesome is if Jack could either restore Castiel to his regular angel status with wings to where he can traverse to anywhere like before, or upgrade Castiel to an Archangel status! I think season 13 will be about Jack going to the alternate earth to save that world and bring peace to rebuild it, but I think Michael will break out of the cage since it was damaged from the darkness! I think that Michael was not only going insane from the cage but I think Lucifer may have past the mark of cain to him in turn corrupting him! But these are just thoughts of where the writer's of supernatural may go from here! Cannot wait for season 13! And TB, I know how you felt about Castiel, Rowena, Crowley, and Mary! I was mostly shocked when it was Cas who got shanked by Lucifer! But lucky for us, Jared Padalecki accidently gave spoiler's during a panel Q&A that Cas was coming back! :)
Crowley isn't coming back because Mark is leaving the show.. Cass is coming back because Jared accidentally said that he is.. And I really hope Mary can come back..
One last thing ... hugs and a cup of tea... this was a bad one but SPN does have a habit of bringing people back. And maybe skip this weekends Buffy recap give yourself a break.
There are a lot of things that the writers have forgotten but I choose to ignore them all thanks to season 11. That was my favourite one so it's all good for me.
I still pray for the day that the Winchesters face a formidable enemy that doesn't underestimate them, instead of ending in a dumbass surprise attack off guard..Azazel wasting time with his monologue instead of ending it and quickly prevent any means of defense or retaliation which he could have done easily and instantly, Lucifer toying with Sam in season 5 instead of throwing the horseman rings at the center of the earth, just please, Chuck, give us a villain that legitimately perceives them as a threat that is able to get resources, knowledge and means to destroy you and get the best of you so stop screwing around and just go at them hardly, swiftly and smartly and end them quickly and if not, fail honestly, idk if we've seen anyone do that except maybe the BMOL
