Thank you for the kind words. Remember that downward pressure is more important than pushing in or speed. Also, if your hands get "warm" blisters are sure to follow. While I haven't met anyone who could stop their quest for fire before getting blisters, it is still important to put out that once you get blisters it will be a few days of healing before you can practice again. Let us know when you get your first coal. After that, your next challenge should be strap drill!
Yes, yucca is amazing. I wish it grew here. It is an important source of fire making, cordage, soap, food, and medicine wherever it grows. The center stalk often grows too fat for hand drill, but perfect for bow drill.
The coal dust is a combination of the board and spindle, with the less dense of the two comprising most of the dust. In remote or unfamilliar areas, the straitest material, perferably with a pithy center and/or that you can put a dent in with a thumb nail would be what I look for for the spindle. The fireboard would also have to pass the thumb nail test. Each would also have to be dry and free of resin. Thanks for your kind words and I hope this proves useful. Downward pressure is the key.
For simplicity hand drill is preferred. Here in ME the humidity makes bow drill our "go-to" friction fore method, seconded by Strap Drill (see our vid). The Hand Drill works in dry conditions, especially winter, as it is primarily a desert technology.
Hello There I have been hand drilling close to 20 years and just wanted to let you know that I truly enjoy the video and have a great admiration for you on how generous you are with all of the great advice that you give to all that ask about hand drilling! Sir you are truly a remarkable man! Best wishes to you always! Alberto
Thanks for your interest in our School. e've been running classes since August, 1989 and offer weekend and five day courses as well as six month long apprenticeships. This would be a great time to come out and check out the school/meet the instructors. Let me know if you have any questions. Much Respect.
@DeeCollecter Nice Job! The cedar here works well, but there are also many other local alternatives. With cattail, the dust stays that vanilla color, right up to the point where you get your coal. A Burdock spindle is impressive. You should have no prob. now w/ mullien or horseweed! Handrill technique is diff. because w/o the bow, there has to be more emphasis on downward pressure, NOT speed. Great work! Hope to see you at an event!
Here in Maine the most serviceable boards are northern white cedar, American Linden (Basswood), Willow, & Balsam Fir. Balsam Fir is the most common, willlow is the easiest but takes the longest to dry, & cedar is the best all around. In your area check to see if the wood you are working with can be dented by a thumb nail, containes no resin, and is dry. I hold it to my cheek to see if it is warm as one of the ways to tell if it is dry, but black dust, lots of smoke and no coal means too wet.
Very clear and straight forward instruction, and I appreciate your attention to 'floating', which I have seen only a few instructors touch on (useful on short spindles). I take it that if you're out in a remote area where it's hard to find the specific woods you've cited, you'll have to improvise and experiment to find what works well. Are there specific qualities to look for in principle? Like harder board and softer spindle? Also, what makes the coal dust? Is it a combo of board and spindle?
For the fireboard, you can use most any wood you can imprint a thumb nail into. Basswood (Tillia americana), Cedar Thuja occidentalis L.) and Balsam Fir (Abies balsamea L.) are the dominant "go to" woods in our region for being so common, ease of getting a coal, and personality of the wood. Like Bow Drill, however, you don't want to limit yourself to a species list. Maple will work old enough and your skills are good. Spindle=any pithy plant w/ a straight stalk. Try mullien & horseweed.
True, the flowers are also useful medicinally, w/ several medically active polyphenols, terpene, mucilage, saponins, and tannins it reduces inflamation stimulates fluid production in the lungs as a valuable expectorant, and sooths coughs. Infusions and smoking the dried leaves and flowers are the traditional way to adminster this plant and I have used both succesfully for coughs & cold induced asthma. Oil based infusions of arial parts are also useful antimicrobrial drops for ear infections.
There are 2 primary reasons the spindle w/ polish the board rather than generate dust. The 1st is form related; many folks concentrate on speed of the spindle & neglect the more important aspect of downward pressure. Next attempt concentrate on increasing downward pressure & slowly working up to full speed. Be mindful, folks tend to push in insread of down, creating blisters. 2nd is wood/spindle density issues, caused by leaf scars on the spindle, knots in the fire board or wood density.
@ultrasuperpaperman Assuming the species you listed or local to your area and are all there is, the two best woods mentioned are Balsam Fir (Abies balsamifera) and Willow (Salix Ssp.) With these, a willow spindle on either a willow fireboard or an Abies fireboard would be a great place to start. Once you get smoke, let us know and we can figure out what herbaceous bianuual plant stalks might work once available.
@LostInTheGroove100 More important than the species is the condition of the wood. In most conditions, oak is either too dense or too punky to get fire from. In it's dense state it is a great "work out" wood. Every once in a while you can find a dead standing oak that has degraded just enough to pass the finger nail test and make an excellent bow drill set. As far as hand drill, maybe as a fireboard, but in this region it just doesn't have the characterisitics for a spindle. Good Luck.
@ADERRICKHAND This set and all that we do is/was gathered moments before the demonstration. Your skills will improve the the poing of gathering the best materials as your eye gets seasoned to how to spot good materials (spindles and fireboards) as you move through the landscape. Glad to know you are out there practicing the skills. Good luck and don't get discouraged, each blockage is really a call to growth in the skill set.
Excellent work my man ! The hand drill is the one skill that has escaped me for years- I am very good at creating blisters on my palms, and some smoke. Do you guys offer private instruction?
time is relative to how fast you are able to spin the drill and how much pressure you can achieve. Go untill the hole turns brown or black and grows to be the same diamater at the drill.
Sounds like your right on with your experimentation. Burn a small depression in before removing 1/8 inch or so of the songy material and make sure you don't have any nodes (leaf scars) as part of the rim of the end that makes contact with your fire board. If smoke "hugs" the spindle, keep twirling gently until it disperses before "pouring it on". Remember dark to black dust, or no coal. Light dust means you need more downward pressure.
@kingspade350 Poplar works great. The challenge is finding a dead peice in the wild. If you harvest it and dry it at home, no problem, but in a living off the landscape situation poplar degrades quickly once dead and holds moisture too.
Good point about blisters as I'm about to try hand drill. Since I've been bit by the friction fire bug I want to keep at it steady due to what they call muscle memory. Your info will be invaluable for that, cheers!
@UrbanTrickzter13 Anything you pick up off the ground will be too wet. A dead, suspended branch that you can put a dent in with your thumb nail works best. Higher is dryer, and on facing south to get the full exposure to the sun works best. In damp Environments you may still have to dry out your set before using it.
The trouble is finding a circular piece of bamboo. Each time I like there is a groove produced by the leaf scar in the ones that have the right diameter. but we are in an area where bamboo is rare.
It depends on your skill level. Thats like asking, how long does it take to run a mile. But if you cant get one withen a few minutes, your should change your technique or materials. The fastest coal is under 3 seconds but ive seen people take there time and take two whole minutes to create an ember.
What color is your dust? THe most common mistake is folks emphasizing speed over downward pressure. The "feel" of it and sound should be similar to working with a medium to fine grit sand paper and your dust should be dark brown to nearly black. The darker the better. Emphasize form and downward pressure over speed and remember to be fluid during the transitions and breath. Watch for warming, you do not want to get blisters. It will delay you sometime for a week. Good Luck!
Have you had much success with the fire plough technique? I used (no expert) what appeared to be a hardwood stick no bigger in diameter than my index finger and cut a gorge through a piece of pine. The best I could do was to produce a slight smoke toward the end, but I couldn't even get lint to burn. This brings me to my next question (may sound dumb): what is suitable tinder that fine coal or sparks can light? What would you use in a pine forest in, say, Northern Arizona or Colorado?
i have a few questions (a) what kind of wood can you use for the hand drill method (b) can you cut a spindle for the fire out of wood with a knife (c) for the board could i just use a flat piece of wood with a hole in it
that will come in good use but im going for a swedish flint because the flint i have no can run down and i also use flairs in my kit but i dont use them often
@primitiveskills cool video man. Does you really need a hard wood spindle/soft wood board - can you do it with the same type of wood. Just asking out of interest.
i know this might not get answered, but i hope it does. How does poplar work. I find that it is super soft, and i passes the thumbnail test, as far as an amateur can test. I have gotten a coal and alot of smoke, with the bow drill, so can i use it for the handrill method. Btw i mean the base board / fireboard.
It's important to keep the skill alive. These things also tend to get inside and change you somehow. That first fire is always special, but there is that "more" that happens when you realize wood, that anifestation of water, air, sunlight, and trace minerals, can be coaxed in to fire and that we are connected to a lineage of fire makers going back thousands of years. Not to mention the connection to the landscape it encourages.
Use a softer spindle and you will get a coal. Try mullein, horse weed, or elderberry. Any straight, blemish free spindle with a "pithy" or sponge like center will do. Please let me know how it goes.
I live in Vegas and it's almost, if not completely, impossible to find a suitable spindle and board. Luckily I found some old place that some guy apparently had boards and stuff that he sat on. But the spindle is a major problem.
Thank u for ur time and help...;D I finally got my notch and was able to make 3 index finger sized coals in under 1 min. ea...;D...but my tinder got wet and I couldn't blow it into a flame...;P
I'm having a problem that is driving me nuts.. I used to be able to get a lot of smoke but now I can only polish the damn wood lol.. I'm using Mullein on cedar. I've tried fixing up the spindle and nothing.. Thanks in advance.
could you please list the good types of wood for the spindle and fire board in the description? i really wasn't able to get what you said. also, if you could please reply to this comment and say what types of good wood are in Georgia. Thanks and this helped me a lot.
Yes, we can use elderberry, horseweed, mullien, and evening primrose as a few of the spindle materials available. Fireboards can be had by using non-resinous softer woods like basswood, cedar, balsam fir, poplar, and willow.
If it is non-resinous and dry and you can put your thumbnail in it and dent it it should be good. Put it against your cheek. It should be warm if it is dry, cool if you need to dry it. Outside, away from the "Matrix", it is important to practice essential living skills before they are needed. Start with something easy like horseweed and mullein stalks and move to more difficult ones like elderberry. Keep it fun and your skills will improve and be thee when you need them. Along the journey you will also develop a meaningful relationship with the plants you share your land with. Best of Medicine.
Don't insult a guy who is helping people. There is something called manners, and you need to get some. Although you're just jealous, that is still no excuse.
Actually, when you make living outside your real world it IS this easy. It is only difficult for Homo sapiens domestico-fragilus. Corn syrup, convenience, and conditioning make it seem difficult. Our children start friction fires to light the wood stove on a weekly basis. Our ancestors were quite successful at this technique, us being the proof.
steven shehan which is why video like this are so helpful. Knowing these techniques and tips saves many weeks of practicing learning them yourself. Of course you still need lots of practice, and you probably won't get it your first time. Which is why like all survival skills, you should practice it now, before you ever need to use it.
A paradigm shift is in order, that's all. In our "schooling" and military careers we pattern on brief periods of instruction to gain working knowledge of different skills. Goal oriented methodology trains "x" number of folks to have cursory skills dependent upon modern tech (POI's). Learning couched in a context that is fun and fulfills a need is easy & avoids blisters on ones hands. Martial arts is an example. Remember, 80 year old women regularly make fire this way, effortlessly. Technique
A rock or knife is used to make a small depression. Use your spindle as if to generate a coal, and burn down enough to create a hole the diameter of your spindle before cutting your notch. Each hole is good for about three to five coals before burning completely through. Other baseboard woods include willow, cedar, basswood, elder, sumac, and balsam fir. Other woods will work if they pass the thumb nail test and cheek test, a dent from your nail, warm to your cheek indicate soft/dry enough.
Hey John, an excellent technique for folks who need a little encouragement in the beginning of their training progression or a fire in a real emergency during less than favorable conditions. Using the string method is a great way of how important dwnwrd pressure is over speed in the balance between both. A slow, steady technique, assisted or otherwise, will produce a coal with the righ amount of downward pressure. It is more of an "asking" approach than a demand for a coal. More sustainable.
The premise of our school, & this skill, is you can return to the natural world & flourish w/o a knife or dependecy on modern gear. Anything else is due to a lack of skill level. "So easy a caveman can do it" makes no sense when applied to a culture bred to live in their heads w/o direct experiential learning to go on. It takes some practice, but fire off the landscape w/o modern tools in combo w/ the other skills offers a sense of freedom & enjoyment few experience. Plus, the quest is fun.
@123rajgurung The dust is what you're after. The accumulating dust will eventually glow and stick together. This is the "coal" you are after. Depending on the materials you use, you normally want your dust to be black. A lighter color dust indicates a need for more downward pressure primarily, or, in some cases, more speed or rotations per passes across the spindle. What are the materials you are using and what color dust are you getting?
@OooHesGood The notch gathers the dust in a single location and allows it to retain the heat. This later becomes the "coal". Picture a piece of pie cut neatly out of the whole pie and that is the rough design of the notch. I flare out the bottom to provide more space and air for the falling dust and stop carving just short of going to the center of the circular divit you burn into the fire board with your first few tries down the stalk.
We do it every day. The "nice little set up" you mention was gathered off the landscape 30 min. before the video was shot. It only takes a developed eye for the right materials. After that, the next challenge is shaping them w/o a knife. The skills are available to anyone who wants them. It's not a badge of prowess/ contest to see who is better. It's a vehicle that connects people to their landscape & offers a deeper sense of independence and self reliance. We look forward to YOUR vid.
@camcamalot That's way outside our backyard ! I hope my friends in the Primitive Skills and Bushcraft world might have some insights for ya. The basic characteristics for a spindle is that its straight, has a pithy center (spong like) and won't shatter from the downward pressure. Willow, cedar, and cottonwood should be in your area to use as a fireboard. Let me know what you come up with, I'd love to learn what I can use in the South!
@UrbanTrickzter13 A rock used to score around the spindle base until it snaps cleanly works just as well as a knife, and just as cleanly, the only flat part essential to getting a coal is the part of the fireboard that makes contact w/ the spindle. Abraid it flat w/ the same rock (this may take a litlle longer w/ more effort than carving). The notch can also be abraided in and is usually quicker/easier than carving it out w/ a knife.
@alraider100Here are some of the spindle woods local to Maine that we find work well; Horseweed (Erigeron canadensis syn. Conyza Canadensis), Mullien (Verbascum Thapsus), Elderberry (Sambucus nigra), Golden Rod (Artemesia ssp.), Evening Primrose (Oenothera biennis), Willow (Salix ssp.), and Cedar (Thuja occidentalis). Hope this helps. For a fireboard, start with dry willow, basswood, cedar, or poplar. Remember, downward pressure is the most important element in technique. Good luck!
@UrbanTrickzter13Cattail harvest in these parts is now, but I set them up to dry in the sun, bound and hanging high for at least two weeks before using them. They degrade rapidly if left to harvest later, so getting them now is crucial, and even then, they tend to be brittle. It takes practice, but once you get it, you won't want anyone else using your cattail stalks, as you know they will most likely crush them on you. Remember, dwnwrd pressure is more imprtnt than inwrd pressure or speed.
Friction fire is a humbling endeavor. The part tht escapes a lot of folks is tht it isn't even the fire that becomes important, but the journey toward understanding what makes it work. Matches/Lighters make it too easy. We lose awareness of the gift, the elements on landscape that offer the materials, weather, directions, the way our physical being has to interact w/ it all in order to create fire. Anyone who hand drills can work a lighter, but not the other way. It's about reconnecting.
@TheM40A3beast If you make a "hang loose" sign, the spindle would touch from extended pinky to extended thumb. The points would be short, like a pencil, but with a very abrupt taper, like the tip of a thick drill bit. Don't carve the bark off, but remove it using yer knife like a plane. Holde the blade perpinicular to the spindle and scrape back and forth. This prevents creating flat areas (carving creates a flat spot), and removes bark without compromising the cylindar shape of the spindle
First off, if your spindle is getting shiny.(glazing) Ussually that means your not putting enough downword pressure on it. But if changing out the board worked for you then more power to ya! Now with notches- it takes some practice in basic carving, a sharp knife (or swiss army saw, which some people prefer), also make sure you are cutting INTO the grain, not with it. (ie the side of the log not the ends)
It sounds like your fireboard is either wet or has degraded too much.Keep the spindle and trade to a basswood (Tilia americana) or Willow (salix) board and dry them out to first rule out improper technique, while you wait for your sumac fireboard to dry a little. Balsam fir from a dead standing tree gathered from it's highest elevation is my go to wood in the field.
It sounds like one of two things or both things at the same time. Make your tinder bundle the size of a robin's nest and compress it like a taco shell on the sides of your ember as you blow directly on the exposed top. This will minimize the dead air space between the fibers of your tinder bundle and allow the heat to transfer from the coal to the tinder.
@sirchristian12 They are available through out North America. A decent field guide is the Newcomb's Guide to Wildflowers, as it will train your brain to recognize plants by the same taxanomic features botanists and herbalist's use to identify plants and trees. Where are you at geographically, we could help with a species list to start you out.
@LoneHerper With handrill, it only takes a long time in the beginning or when moisture is an issue. There are folks out there who can "bust a coal" in under five seconds. That said, they are all humbled by native elders who use technique over force and have relied on this method for sixty or more years. They are the true masters.
With handrill, it only takes a long time in the beginning or when moisture is an issue. There are folks out there who can "bust a coal" in under five seconds. That said, they are all humbled by native elders who use technicue over force and have relied on this method for sixty or more years. They are the true masters.
What color is your dust? Are you poring your efforts in to too much speed over the more important downward pressure? What are your materials made from? Five minutes a day is a good way to approach and trouble shoot. If your on board, we'll have you getting a coal by the end of a week.
@GuamKomudo We did cheat and use a knife for the video. Having said that, the only difference between rock tools and metal tools is time. The bowdrill and handdrill techniques covered are done with materials gathered from the immediate landscape and shaped on location.
If you really are getting alot of speed and downward pressure, check the bottom of your spindle for a shiny glaze, if you are getting glaze, carve or sand it off and keep up the downward pressure. Also, ask around for what types of wood to use (im not fammiler with your part of the world)
@TheHornyGorrilaz Excellent job! Do you know what species of wood you used? Many of the same spindle plants used for fire are also serviceable arrow shafts, food, and/or medicine. Keep up the great work. Hope to see you on the trail.
When using a wood like white cedar the coal sticks togather so nicely that it almost never falls apart. However, your right sometimes coals can be brittle (basswood coals for example) and these coals need a little extra love and care.
