I think you mean several 10,000 dollar bills to replace that, not several thousand dollars.... Those are far from cheap!!!! Great video!!! That is actually pretty rare for most people to see and understand what you just showed us...
Very cool video Shaun! I remember reading about that incident too, happened over Great Britain if I recall, imagine the strength it takes to suck a pilot out the front window! Someone in the cabin crew held onto his legs. He did survive. I bet that experience would be hard to get out of a pilots mind after that!
Thank you! These are great, Shawn. And (dweeb alert!), the more systems tech-y, the deeper the dive, the better. Cool beans. Loved the Falcon three-holer in the background. Thanks again.
About the aircraft that lost a flight deck window. The captain did live. A flight attendant was able to hold his legs inside the aircraft. The entire event was a fascinating story.
Since the bolts that were removed seem to show no sign of galvanic reaction, the window frame, the bolts and the seat, where the windshield is placed, must all be made of the same corrosion resistant metal. The metal looks like stainless steel, or is it some special aluminum alloy? The aerodynamic seal, is it made of vinyl, silicone rubber or something else? Whatever the material, it needs to withstand tremendous changes in pressure, temperature and moisture. Nicely done!
Is that sealant 3M ultrafast urethane? I used some to glue my license plate on when plates were getting stolen. I had to use a torch and melt it off the back to get it loose when it was time to change it.
How much does a Window cost? I used to be an Apache mechanic when I was in the Army, and this is almost the same process. Of course, the window was not this thick because it doesn’t pressurize.
Why are the windows fitted externally so that he pressurization differential is trying to push them out. If they were fitted internally then they would be seated naturally more firmly as the differential increased.
We see the different pieces involved, but you did not show the removal or fitment of the gasket, so I just spent 5 mins to learn nothing. Could you please cut in the process so we can see how the gasket is removed and installed, I know I'm not A&P cert, but I love to learn everything.
I couldn't find any prices but I've heard that front windshields for turbine, pressurized aircraft are more like $20,000 and up. Are they really only a few thousand?
Yeah MEK or MPK methal poly ketone is some bad stuff man. I used it at Boeing while working on the 787 and its known to get in your blood stream and cause cancer. Great cleaner, not so much for the human body. Sealant is what they use as a pressure filler, pretty kool stuff. Keep up the good work.
Ethyl, pronounced like the woman's name. Is there any type of adhesive that is used on the bolts, i.e. Loctite? The bolts are reused? Would think through their life they would see stretching from pressure and depressurization cycles.
I don't believe loctite is used on these because they have a self locking nut plate, but I'll have to verify that one. The bolts are allowed to be reused because they are torqued to such a low specification, so there is no stretching happening here
Corporate Pilot Life Thanks, that makes sense. I don't imagine this happens a lot during the life cycle of the aircraft, locking nutplates loose the ability to lock after too many reuses, but then you could replace the nutplate too. Wonder what a job that would be? Do you know if these bolts are titanium? Do you know when you will be back to SNA? Would love to say hello.. Apologize for all the questions
Paint jobs on jet aircraft are typically done based on hours of operation. Frequently before an aircraft builds enough hours, they're sold off. If the surrounds were topcoat painted, there would be a different color peeking out. The green primer shown is a corrosion inhibiting chromate containing primer. It's much simpler to inspect for hour check requirements with just the primer in place. Aircraft designed in the past 10-15 years use a primer system that's non-strippable, so that the topcoat can be chemically stripped unless the fuselage is a composite. Based on the color of the sealant, it looks like PR-1750. There is a quick cure version called PR-1755 that allows for fast field repairs. The bolts are a NAS583 series. Not sure what the part number is for what appears to be stainless steel, but to replace 100 fasteners would probably be close to $2,000.
As a former HS 125- 700/800 driver you pronounced it incorrectly. As it’s a British aircraft it’s AL HUE MIN EYE MUM. We had work done several times on the 125 and the 1-11 while in the Uk and they get indignant when you say, aluminum. Yes a Captain was sucked out of the front windscreen, and lived, when it popped out. It was a BAC one eleven. Im 100% certain of that knowhat, I
The "accident" to which you refer was caused by an engineer using the wrong length screws. It wasn't an accident, it was an inevitability. It was bound to happen because the wrong parts were utilised. A classic tale of the law of unintended consequences. We all learn from such occurences. Some are caused by laziness. Some are caused by incompetence. Some are caused by Corporate pressure. The term "accident " is usually used to describe a chain of events that lead to an inevitable outcome. Unfortunately, in aviation, the outcome of chains of events that re not normal, is usually catastrophic. Is it safer to travel on an aircraft that is due for a major overhaul or safer to travel on that same aircraft is on its first flight after one?
The fact that technicians used short screws causing the pilot to be sucked out the window........quite disturbing. So basically flying is like playing Russian Roulette because we will never know if the technicians actually did their job right.....
The bolts you usually replace every time will be torqued bolts. Those you never reuse due to the required stretch for torque already having been used. They can't be re-torqued as a new one.
Normally since these screws are such low torque (normally less than 75 in/lbs after final torque) they can be reused as long as the heads are in good shape and there is NO damage/ware on the shank.
@@phantumdrummer That IS some small torque values. Any idea what the bolts are composed of? I spent 21 years as a GM auto mechanic, much of the low-torque value bolts were for things such as aluminum intake manifolds and the occasional auto transmission. It was rare to have an "always-replace" policy on bolts, but when there was such a policy, it was for things like the joint between the aluminum intake and the polymer plenum assembly.
@@ColdCanuck50 The hardware is normal aviation grade steel. The high strength of the bolt is needed more for the tension load it is holding while the aircraft is pressurized. The strength of the fastener in this case far exceeds the torque required to hold it in place. The load is then spread over a great area by using meny fasteners close together. It is also inserted into a "self-locking" nutplate. The torque is more to insure the screw does not back out once installed, more than it is to provide clamping force on the window. Thus the bolts can be reused as long as they are not damaged.
Oh this brings back some memories. Years ago I made a coffee table from a GII window (they where flat). Then years later during GIII production (these were curved like the Hawker) we got one that was de laminating like that one. We took it down the road and used it for target practice. We had .45 ACP, .357 Mag, 9mm and 12 ga. shotgun slug. The only ones to penetrate 100% was the 9mm and the shotgun. That was fun.
You should have left the blue tape on for 24 to 48 hours. This way everyone knows you’re looking through flawless glass. Also, don’t slam the doors, especially at high altitude. As always, I love the videos.
I work on Bombardier challengers, we pressurize and perform leak checks after every window or windshield change. Every time a part is changed it gets full operational checks and leak checks
Well, we actually didn’t see any of the change over but we saw a lot of what’s his name here. Want to see me pull a rabbit out of my hat? Want to see me do it again.
Yep! And Gary Laaks, they use the APU on the ground to pressurize the cabin with someone outside the aircraft leak checking the windscreen. I've also heard of a ground pressurization cart, but I've never used it on the Hawker. The Cessna Citations typically use the pressure cart for ground pressurization.
That an ole Netjets hawker? Changed many of Hawker Windscreens. The early 800xp and earlier didn’t have nut plates for the windscreens bolts which sucked bad!
The windshreen accident was British Airway BAC 1-11, it was the pilot who got sucked out. A few broken bones, but lived to fly another day. Great video!! Love these type.
Great vlog as always! It was a BA BAC 1-11 from BOH-AGP. The mec. had used (like) 0,7 screws, and not 0,8. He did not check with the ones he put in the trash.
So many opportunities for "that's what she said" jokes! Cool video, thanks for taking time to share it. The screws not all facing the same way is not good for my OCD but I am sure there are torque specs for them. Fly safe!
We had a few of those on the Cessna Citation Model 650. High up on the vertical fin, always put in dry, over torqued with coin slots rounded over, and of course heavily coated with paint to make them look pretty. Fortunately, engineering dept. provided an alternate replacement with equal specifications. Never even attempted using a coin slot driver. It was always; cut paint, drill head, and extract.
Hi Shawn! I fly a Hawker also and it is a pain in the ass the windshield. The delamination thing starts because of the Windshield Heat used improperly, the checklist say that you should turn it on when you go into the runway, but of you do so your are gonna be replacing that windshield very often. What i have seen with many pilots and what we do in mine is that we take off with the windshield heat off and when we reach an OAT near to +5 C we turn it on. No windshield delamination anymore. Great vids!
Was the window incident the British Airways one, I remember as a kid seeing a news report of a pilot hanging out of the widow as the plane landed BA5390 flight
Re-using windshield mounting bolts? Seriously? I guess commercial & military aircraft are an entirely different world. We never re-use hardware. In 21 years structures & sheet metal, I've never re-used bolts.
Great knowledge. I search for the thickness of Airplane windshields & got a better deal with your video though 3 years ago in which content was available. I learned plenty including that it isn’t glass. Thank You Sir. Respect from Western Massachusetts. ✊🏽
Coin slot screws!?!? Oh, man that sucks! I thought "tri-wing" screws were bad, coin slots are even worse to torque. I seriously feel for your mech's. Oh, on top of the bolt length being critical, equally as important is the special torque pattern. An incorrectly torqued window, though be it a very low torque, will cause a crack very quickly.
My friend was at the command of a Global 5000 out of Moscow a few years back when something hit his windshield. It sounded like the muzzle of a cannon. They had the grease smear analysed to find out what it was, it turned out to be a goose. The windshield was replaced although it didn't show any sign of damage, a 20 000$ job.
Changed a few of those Hawker windshields in my career....a few Gulfstream too. I'd use paint sticks to set up the distance all around the window then remove those once all the gaps were equidistant and place the frame. Not a bad job once you have an assistant install the heating element and thermistor wires. There was a service bulletin on those chrome bolts for Hydrogen embrittlement. The coin-slots were replaced by a tri-winged offset torque bolt.
You guys put MEK into a plastic cup? If you leave that overnight the bottom of your cup will dissolve and you'll have a messy puddle and some gooey bolts.
The accident you were refering to was a British Airways pilot in a BAC1-11. You are correct in the fact that a cockpit side window not the windscreen had ill-fitting securing bolts which at altitude failed, the window blew out sucking the pilot halfway out! The co-pilot continued to fly the aircraft whilst the senior steward held on to the captain by his legs, the plane immediately descended and diverted to my local airport here in Southampton UK. The captain recovered with mild frostbite, cuts and bruises but it must have scared the crap out of all involved!
It looked like there were some dings to the sheet metal and paint below where the job was done. Was that from the platform leaning against the aircraft?
Nope...the platform is covered with foam to prevent that from happening. My guess is someone used a ladder to clean the windscreen along the way and bumped it
