The v-log profile is necessary to achieve a larger dynamic range. Noise can be suppressed during post-production, but additional levels of dynamic range cannot be obtained with color correction.
Any Log Profile is typically NOT made for low light. Thats why you also overexpose it by 1 or 2 stops. So it's totally normal to produce alot of noise.. Also the standart profiles do aply noise reduction in camera, thats why they might look cleaner. However in post, with heavier grading, you will notice the downsides of those in camera corrections as you usually loose details all over, which limits your ability to reframe/zoom in post. In Low Light use an HLG profile with the correct settings. It should give you the most dynamic range with the cleanest image.
@@GEXAR Not as I am aware of.. I do own a bunch of Sony, Canon and Panasonic bodys and Sony also just has it's LOG and HLG profiles.. and the log profiles usually suck at low light too. They have different versions for different scenarios, but that's for higher end productions which need perfect image quality all the time. If you mainly produce for social media most of those "quality" topics can be ignored completly as nobody will ever notice the difference if you not tell them what to look for.. On the other side with panasonic their low iso noise is actually one of the most pleasing ones, as it looks more like movie grain and in most cases is therefore not distracting.. something Canon and Sony can not say for their noise "quality" :)
@@GEXAR No Prob, glad to help ^^ To me the S5II is finally an all-in-one camera with basically no shortcuts. Best video features in any hybrid cam, period. 6k, anamorphic, 10bit 422, 60fps, C4k (the best 4k mode imo) Good enough AF (finally on A7III level, which was always good enough) and the footige of Panasonic cams is soooo easy to grade and work in post.. AND they are cheap compared to what they offer! The only downside is that I miss Tamron lenses for Panasonic.. lately they came up with very interesting focal lengths, nobody else did..
I have the Panasonic S5ii. People never talk about the amazing low light performance of this camera. They want to talk about the IBIS which is great and they want to talk about the great auto focus which in my opinion is as good as Sony. As you can see in this small test switch to another profile and you get incredible results. It's without doubt the best camera I've ever owned. And the one thing that makes it even better is the price, I got mine off Amazon brand new £1700. And that was the kit with the 20-60 lens and free extra battery. NO BRAINER.
To me these are the most incredible prices. Lumix S5 for less than 1000 bucks on the secondary market and Lumix S5II for 1800 from the store.... There are no better options. The closest competitor is the Sony ZV-E1, but it is more expensive.
Yes it is. But I think V-Log is only a way to manage the exposure. Only a different way for the sensor to manage the light (curves). Th sensor dynamic range is the same in all color profile. The problem is to manage in post contrast and color with different profile. V-log is not the best for color (everyone says the opposite; let's talk about). I have a GH5.
V-log is only bad for low light. As for the dynamic range, as far as I know, the range is better in log profiles than in regular profiles. For example, try setting the zebra on your camera to 100 percent in a regular profile and see when you start losing information. Then switch to V-log, and you will see that the zebra disappears because the dynamic range is greater.
@@GEXAR no. The curve of v log is more near the uman eyes. Other profile is more contrast (the zebra tell this). The sensor dynamic range is the same. Another problem with v log is V gamut; is large more of the rec709. If you haven't a monitor with adobe rgb 1998 or more you don't see the real color..
@@lvca.avellino I won't try to convince you, but here's an example of an article. *Dynamic Range:* Standard profiles (such as Standard, Vivid, Natural, etc.) usually offer a limited dynamic range. These profiles are designed to produce an image that is ready to use without further color grading. Log profiles (such as S-Log, C-Log, V-Log) are designed to capture the maximum dynamic range of the camera. They record more information in the shadows and highlights, allowing for more flexibility in post-processing. *Colors and Contrast:* Standard profiles have higher contrast and color saturation, making the image more "ready" for use straight out of the camera. Log profiles have very low contrast and appear "flat." This preserves more information, which can be utilized during color grading.
GH4 owner - GH5 owner - GH6 owner.. Been using V-Log a LONG time. Also a S5ii owner...and I have been using that camera on Cine-D only. After this video, I might actually start shooting FLAT. "Standard" isn't a look I want but I think "FLAT" will be just fine and not too baked in.
In the next video, I do a test with the same NR in V-log. I think this is a more fair comparison. But yes, I also like Flat more than V-log in low-light.
VLOG dives to the very bottom of the sensor's noise floor in order to sample 100% of the sensor's dynamic range. VLOG (and SLog) does not create noise, it "reveals" noise that is hidden buy other gamma curves. Other curves dont sample that low into the sensor's "basement".
This is not true. V-Log uses ISO 640 to get the best dynamic range but it will be more noisy than other profiles who use ISO 100, no matter what you do with gamme curve.
Excellent video! I noticed the same in my own tests. BTW, ISO 51200 is indeed excellent with the Std profile; I used it for even satellite movement shooting (see one of my shorts).
Tnx. This helped me a lot. I shoot last week with VLog in dark conditions and results were terrible 😞 Looking forward for Your next test video for Lumix S5ii
A couple of years ago, when I bought my first camera from Panasonic, I made the same mistake... And it was a paid project (I hope you don't have such a situation).
@@exnoob6773 V-log is bad only for low light, in other conditions it is good (in situations where there is a lot of overexposure, this is the best profile).
I understand the message of the video. But it isnt even necessary to go this high with iso anyway which profile you use. For low light settings you have to use the right lens and fps. F1.4 + 30fps = great video quality
You are misguiding the photography industry. Your analysis methods are incorrect. V log is meant for highly contrasting lighting situations caused by ambient natural light. Not for low light situations. NM Certified Photography Consultant. USA Ex Minolta, Ex Leica Ex Sinar.
Hi, it might seem that way if you haven't watched my other videos. This video only exists because people asked me to do these comparisons, I just gave them what they asked for.
@@aiseurnae5976 Thanks for the comment, now I'm comparing the noise reducer on the S5. I thought with S5II the difference would not be big, but after your words, I don’t even know. I already gave my S5II back, I can't compare now :(
@@GEXAR I never used noise reduction in V-LOG on my S5 because I really don't like noise reduction. I tried it on my S5II because it is the only profile I use with this camera since other profiles are now full of chroma noise reduction. Noise reduction always means smoothed out details.
Great video! Would you consider making a comparison video in the future between V-Log with internal Noise Reduction applied VS Flat/Standard Profiles in Low light?
Great video, thanks and some comments very useful too. When would you use v-log? If you're intending to grade would v-log still be the best option overexposing or not? Overexposing makes it the better profile for low light situations or would it still be not the one profile to use? THX
I would use V-log for serious commercial projects, when it is possible to immediately view the material. I would say this, it is always better to use native iso. If you have to raise ISO to achieve overexposure, I would not do it. Personally, when I use V-log, I set my exposure between 0 and +1.5 (If you don't expose the v-log properly, there will be more problems than if you overexpose. I use this logic). I don’t think that this is the best profile for lowlight, it’s hard to get overexposure in such conditions and you definitely won’t be able to use native ISO (I failed a shoot once because I was shooting in v-log profile, after that I don’t use this profile at night).
V log is a profile for those who need more room for coloring and styling footage for various reasons. If you don't have a need for it the best in S5 it's Natural in my opinion.
I was wondering why you used shutter speed instead of shutter angle. Everyone praises and uses the shutter angle feature in cinema cameras, but I also use the shutter angle because I don't know exactly.
Probably because on the first camera that I bought, it was set to shutter speed. Now it's just a habit, more convenient and familiar. And on RU-vid I think most people use shutter speed, it's familiar to both photographers and videographers when the shutter angle is unusual for photographers.
I use a Sony a7s3 for rent and have now bought a Lumix s5iix Log profiles will be noisy you can easily remove them in Davinci. Lumix has the option to keep NR in the camera to zero but Sony is clever you cannot keep NR to absolute zero that's why It feels less noisy in it but both are the same.
from the price-to-value ratio of 200% Lumix S5iix is the beast, especially for Video I used to rent a lot of lenses, place I live doesn't have any L mount for rent so I bought an EF to L mount adaptor now happily using EF lenses from the rental and Cine lens which as EF mount@@GEXAR
@@user-id6gs5xj9b Oh, I understand you, I have the same problem with lenses, no one here rents lenses with an l-mount. I bought 24-70 2.8, that's enough for me for now.
You're right. This is the issue with V-LOG. You can't get noise free image at low ISO like with other profiles. And on the S5II Panasonic has added way more chroma noise reduction than before for their standard profiles, so a lot of details are destroyed (I've made some videos showing the issue). So you can't anymore get a noise free image at low ISO while keeping all the details because if you use V-Log yes you keep all the details but there is a lot of noise, and if you use the standard profiles your footage is very clean but a lof of details are gone. With the S5 and S1, you could get noise free image at low ISO while keeping all the details, this is a huge stepback for some users like me who like to crop a lot.
Thanks for your comment! I think maybe they will change it with firmware, if possible. Then for me the only plus is the new autofocus in the S5II, I expected that they would do at least 4k60fps without crop and 4k120fps with crop. But alas, my expectations were not met.
@@GEXAR Yes I hope Panasonic will come back to the previous image quality with the next firmware. I'm using more and more my A7IV now, even if I really dislike the IBIS.
@@GEXAR thanks for the reply ... does that mean, if i shoot crop on 24-70 f2.8 lens, on the tele end of 70, i wud get 70*1.5 crop = 105 f2.8? Kindly do reply as i am confused which lens to get with S5 ii, sigma 24-70 f2.8 or Pana 24-105 f4? btw... i only do video.
@@oscarm4154 I think a lot of people buying their first camera think that Log is the best profile for all situations. I remember a long time ago and I thought so.
So what do you all recommend I shoot in at low light, standard or hlg on s5iix? And what are we considering low light? I was filming just after sunset and it was very noisy. What about a dimly lit gym with a studio light set up, or a dark parking lot with a street light?
I know this question is only indirectly related to the video, but what's your general recommendation for STANDARD profile NR & sharpness settings (I mean in general, with acceptable/good lighting conditions, not at night). I'm guessing that perhaps leaving defaults NR & Sharpness to 0 may not be the best for a good balance between details preservation & "useful" noise reduction...
Hello, my next video is about NR. This video should close all questions.I just did all the tests and I'm doing video editing.Tests have shown that the base setting at NR 0 is the best option for all profiles except V-log.Personally, my favorite settings for the standard profile are contrast and saturation -2.5, all other settings 0.
Great video! Something I did not know. Have you noticed any poor af performance in low light? I did a video demonstrating how badly it struggles in low light but maybe it’s unique to my camera ?
Hi, I rarely use AF.But what I know for sure is that autofocus works worse on all cameras at night. Especially for those cameras with contrast autofocus.
@@GEXAR I think it's a thing with all logarithmic profiles, some need more light some need less. It has also something to do with the in camera noise reduction in some color Profiles.
@8KisOK If i was a sony, i would be in suspense.With Panasonic's new autofocus, Sony now has no strong advantages .... But Lumix is usually 2-3 times cheaper than Sony with the same specs.
Hi, I'm confused. In a more recent video about the s5 ii you said that cneD2 together with cneV2 were the best. Maybe in this video you only tried the s5 or you talk about the s5ii?
Hello, yes you are right. I then started doing a comparison with 2 cameras, made 2 profiles and they were the same and I thought that the rest were also the same. Then continued with only one camera (S5).Later, I accidentally noticed the difference, and made a new comparison in the last video. I definitely need to change the title thanks for the comment!
In my opinion, the main point is in V-log in a larger dynamic range and color grade.But I think I should try using NR in PP, you're not the first to say that.
Not really true. Shooting at 10000 ISO will give you noise with most cameras and most profiles, let alone super high ISOs as you showed in your video. Most camera's today can't be used well after 6400 to 12,000 ISO and if you go beyond that, you need to use noise reduction software.
Undoubtedly, the higher the ISO, the more noise there will be, there is no arguing with that.Sometimes you have no choice but to shoot with high ISO.The fact that some profiles work better in difficult conditions than others is what I wanted to show. It is unlikely that anyone will use above ISO 20000, this was done so that the difference in profiles would be more noticeable.
@@GEXAR Most people will go no higher than 12800 iso. I see your point but as others have said the reason is also because on other profiles NR is already being applied in camera. V-log is there to give you more control if anything.
@@edi18912 EXACTLY! I almost never use it, there is no need for me. But knowing that new editing programs have this function, Premier Pro, which is considered a pro program and is so many years old, does not have it!
Hello, I haven't tried. In theory, if you shoot in the same resolution and bit depth, there should be no difference.I'll put it in my notes as an idea for a video.
@@Jecerey On the S5ii and S5IIX, the normal profiles are worse, you can check this video, here is a comparison. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-AxlgzXeezlU.html
@@GEXAR, This camera is affordable for everyone who wants to shoot raw video :) We have it costs 80-120 thousand rubles new, which is about 1250 US dollars. It is called Sigma fp, it has been produced since 19, it has two native isos, advanced video and photo modes, it was seen in Hollywood next to Arri, and it seems to have a matrix from S1.
@@UriRa Я помню я рассматривал ее перед тем как панас взять, выбрал панас, он все же более универсальный и проще. Можно atomos взять и тогда тоже 6k RAW будет на панасе =)
@@GEXAR, я не соглашусь) Т. к. Сигма пишет рав на карточку, на диск без рекордера, на рекордер в прорес рав и на рекордер ВМ. Рекордер стоит почти столько как и сама камера, т.е. лучше взять две сигмы). У Сигмы есть хищник и El-zone, на панасонике это есть только за какие то сумасшедшие деньги. В общем камера уникальная, рав пишется легко и в обработке прост. Качество для логарифма недостижимое. Как то так)
@@UriRa Мне обычно 8-10 бит хватает с головой, но после твоих слов прям интересно стало. Можешь на мэйл скинуть какой нить RAW файл до 15сек. попробовать?
