Hey Wes. I just have to say that I think your criticism of the 22nd tournament arc isn't really valid for one reason. You say every plot element was just standard shonen and that made it predictable. But dragonball is what set that standard in the first place. You can't use it being basic, standard shonen as a criticism when it's what set the standard. It's like criticizing star wars for being a standard Sci-Fi adventure movie when it's what set the standard for Sci-Fi adventure movies in the first place.
I liked the beginning of the Buu arc a lot because it showcased not only the aftermath of the Cell Saga, seeing as he’s the only villain in Z that the world was allowed to remember, but also because it slowed things down a bit and showed a more everyday-life for the characters. With 7 years of peace, the characters are just allowed to live. Gohan goes to school and shows what his life would be like outside of the world-ending threats. With his strength and good nature, it only made sense that he’d be interested in fighting crime and even becoming a super hero of sorts. It’s a nice contrast to the more hectic stuff that preceded and followed it and felt more like a school slice-of-life-meets-shonen type of vibe.
Dude the baby arc wasn't awesome. It was straight FIRE. Dragon ball never had such high stakes before. Baby accomplished way more than any other villain. He conquered the planet and it's people body and soul. Including the Z team. Goku was alone and extremely out gunned and out numbered. The COMEBACK WAS CRAZY SATISFYING.
for real Wes you should do a top 20 or 25 Arcs in Anime/Manga, i think that could be an interesting topic and a way to cover all your different favorite series in one big video.
I appreciate finding a content creator who recognizes Dragonball Multiverse as a superior tournament arc compared to Super's. It's refreshing to see this viewpoint being expressed. While I have a few dislikes about DBM, such as the excessive focus on Bra, I agree with Wes that it effectively presents what a multiversal tournament for this series should be like. DBM succeeded in presenting a more engaging story by focusing on different outcomes for known characters rather than introducing numerous irrelevant characters that the audience won't be/gets no time to be interested in.
It’s literally the tournament of power but done so much better it actually makes me mad how shit the actual arc is in comparison. And this is coming from a former DBS fanboy
I know you only left out the Garlic Jr Saga because it would need another arc above GOAT to represent how it is the peak of human creativity. It just wouldn't be fair to confine that masterpiece to the description of a tier in a tier list, and I fully agree.
Goku Black arc’s ending is like the Bad Ending in a video game. My favorite arc in Super despite its many, many flaws. Black and Zamasu were a force to reckon with. Vegeta’s speech to Black and overall development is just great
I too cried when GT ended as a kid. Still makes me watery eyed if I watch it now. There's no other way it should be done. If Toriyama & Toyotaro ever 'end' Dragon Ball, that'd be a good ending.
I didn't watch all of the Dragon Ball anime, but I did watch the Battle of Gods movie and I love it. I like how Goku got humbled by a higher presence like Beerus. It showed that no amount of training could make you on par with the real deal. He did manage to achieve the God status for a moment, but only with the help of the other four saiyans. And even then, he found it difficult to control the God power and loses it after a while. At the end, he admitted defeat and accepted the fact that there are other beings in the universe that are far more powerful than he is. The Saiyan God form is cool (for once, the form does not make Goku bulkier than usual). And the fact that Goku could only obtain this power through the help of the other four other saiyans means he could not spam this form all the time. Plus, Goku could not control this form and loses it after some time. This means that the power of God is too much for mortals, Goku included. ... Of course, the Resurrection of Frieza happened later (I also watched this movie) and everything I appreciate about the Super Saiyan God instantly got nullified. Personally, I don't like this movie because Goku and Vegeta now got taught by Whiz and Beerus for some reason (Beerus is a God of Destruction, not a teacher). Also, both Goku and Vegeta now managed to obtain and control an even higher form of Saiyan than the Super Saiyan God. This destroys the concept of power scaling because now, both of them are matching the power of the Gods, which makes them too OP for the rest of characters in DB universe, hence why the next tournament is against the Gods. In my opinion, they should just make the Super Saiyan God the highest form of Saiyan. Make it an ultra-rare thing and cannot be used often. However, I know that the DB fans likes to one-up the power scale with each new DB entries. Well, each to their own, I guess.
Honestly that long winded training in the Saiyan Arc is almost all anime exclusive, so that manga version is just tight as shit. Gas gas gas all the way through. Such a well constructed story.
i'd put goku black arc above mid, while i agree the ending was the worst ever, the character interactions, fight scenes, transformations, and choreography felt like such a breath of fresh air after the janky ass frame by frame bullshit they had going in the beginning of super p̶l̶u̶s̶ ̶i̶t̶ ̶h̶a̶d̶ ̶v̶e̶g̶i̶t̶o̶ I'm not biased.
Anything in super is absolute mid at best. I'm re-reading the OG dragon ball and damn was it goated. I'd argue the tournament with piccolo Jr is the one of the top 5 arc of all dragon ball
There have been Gods being introduced all through out Dragon Ball, Beerus and Whis being added only made sense as a way to further develop Goku & Vegeta.
Kinda find it odd he says to look at Z from the perspective of someone who hasn't seen dragon ball or seen Z before but when he was talking about OG dragon ball he brought up criticisms comparing it to shounen tropes of today. Am I missing something or is this not a little biased? He still said OG was good I'm just curious. Multiverse has some big problems to with how the tournament kept gettinf derailed and how it became the Bra show for a while.
I'm talking about the story telling elements of someone who just got finished watching dragon ball in it's heyday transitioning to Z with the hype. and i only brought up that criticism for 22nd not all of dragon ball.
I will always stand by that as a CONCEPT the Shadow Dragon arc , or something similar, is the best way to end dragon ball. It could easily be the best arc of DB. Especially now when we had 4 sets of dragon balls active during the Granolah arc. Even now its still 3. Karma should come for them
Goku vs Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga will always be THAT fight it's so good narratively. This is the fight that I'm always looking for to any anime that I watch
always get goosebumps seeing that fight. especially when goku goes kaioken 4x when he was told he could die going past 2x. just such an awesome fight and establishes goku pushing it beyond the limit
I feel like a lot of people skip the Dragon Ball series and just jumps to the Z series. I personally go back to the first series mostly because the fights have more focus on the Martial Arts, but the comedy and the adventure is still a lot of fun to rewatch.
Bro I just finished reading the buu saga for the totally not mark review, and the intimidation he gave off wasn't less it was just different. Man turned chi chi into a fucking egg
One of the main things about dragon ball (Z in particular) is that it was many peoples first introduction to what anime really is like when not episodic. That first time feeling is impossible to replicate, even if you are watching it for the first time now.
The Universe of Tournament arc couldve been way better if they actually used the DB multiverse (No Vegito, No Broly No God Buu , No Universe where the Saiyans survived etc) Love Jiren & Hit tho
The ending of the goku black arc pisses me off more than anything else in dragon ball. Zamasu is in my opinion, the most unique and one of the coolest villains we've ever gotten. Especially merged zamasu. Him being a Kai it makes perfect sense he has access to potara. It's interesting how the fusion works. We know if 2 mortal fuse it's temporary. If 2 immortals fuse it's permanent. So we found out when you mix, it falls apart. Also kind of funny how he's basically just the same person when fused since he fused with himself. The ending made the whole arc less than worthless...
nice tierlist i get you about the buu arc, because the first half literally feels like it's gonna be the greatest arc ever but somewhere around the Super Buu-Fusions sections you can really feel it fumbling and losing direction and then of course followed by one of the most shameless retcons in anime history of bringing goku back to save the day, taking the torch back the torch that he had passed, yet even then that second half of the Buu arc has some of the most iconic stuff in DB history and it was always still highly entertaining personally wouldnt put the Buu arc at the top of my list but i respect it when others do, it really is peak entertainment
Damn you impressed me with your original DB/manga knowledge on this one. I didn’t fully agree with the rankings but I can tell you’re familiar with the series so I respect it
I see you homie, good tier list. I like that you gave a lot of respect to OGDB, not many people do that. However imo 22nd and 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai > 21st.
Hello. Excellent ranking. Dragon Ball Z is my favorite anime period. It's always fun to listen to another fan talk about the show and universe. TERRANCE OUT
48:28 the crazy thing about this is that it really feels like some of the worst animation and story quality in DB, but then that one episode with Goku vs Hearts the animation budget just goes through the roof for no reason. It's genuinely insane how that scene has better animation than everything in DBS - including the Ultra Instinct scenes
It makes my blood boil that super is dead and yet this series will just keep going on and on and on and on and on long after there game they were promoting which no one ever played and tbh I never liked multiple continuities
I loved the baby saga, as a kid I was actually scared because just imagine, all the people you know, the people you love, the people you spend time with suddenly became evil and wants to unalive you without you knowing why.
@@lp-kt1huMui Goku having the gods stand up to him is one of the greatest moments in the franchise. UI being the amalgamation of Goku’s journey as a martial artists getting respected by the gods from being a low class warrior throughout out constantly pushing himself to new heights TOP is anything above mid.
Cell/Android Saga is my favorite; Time travel, mystery of the android threat, Vegeta’s pride turned up to 100, hyperbolic time chamber, instant transmission Kamehameha, Gohan going SSJ2, Goku sacrificing himself, Gohan and Cell beam struggle, Vegeta letting Cell reach 100%, Final Flash, so many great iconic moments. This arc really kept you guessing what was going to happen next and really had an air of mystery and suspense to it and Cell’s introduction was almost like a horror movie lmao man was sucking up everything 😮💨
Broly isn't bad but his second coming and bio broly misunderstood him alot so yeah I recommend you to rewatch the broly movie but in the english sub from Japanese because that sub makes the broly movie make more sense.
I think if you combine tien saga incredible fights plus the crazy world ending stakes at play with king piccolo saga. It's the most lit part of og dragon ball
I think I was introduced to your channel from your reaction to Spider-Man in Civil War. My favorite moment had to be when we all celebrated Kefla getting eliminated 😂
Ngl buu saga was my favorite too, I honestly just loved buus and mr.satans relationship, when buu went crazy over mr.satan getting shot I teared up and I don't get like that easy🤣 but the fact that everything they did was useless on him too, he was evil but innocent at the same time which in my opinion made him one of the scarier villians, an un killable baby that's murdering everyone and while not knowing it's bad was a crazy idea. Imagine you just got a 500 lbs unkillabke baby man with unfathomable strength crushing you wind pipe and watching you take your last breath while giggling cuz he thinks it's funny and just a game🤣
As a 90’s kid it’s tough to explain just how hyped the namek saga was when it first aired in the states. The show was popular before that but it EXPLODED in popularity when that shit dropped. “Only toonami”
Everything you said about the Buu Saga stands true. In my mind,it's not well written and wastes Gohan. But in my heart it's the series that made me a Fan of the series forever. Also,the artstyle during this Saga stands as some of the best anime ever put to the Screen during its time,especially with the character Designs having morphed into looking like they put millions of dollars into the Episodes. As for GT,I actually think Baby/The Tuffle Race and their Rivalry and history with the Sayians is one of the best Concepts in all of DB history and deserves a chance to reappear in the Super Canon as a Villan like Broly.
IDK about that placement for the Universe 6 saga. I really like Cabba and what they were doing with him and Vegeta, as well as Vegeta vs Auta Magetta, and as you mentioned Goku vs Hit. I will agree though, Cabba's design was pretty trash, he looks like a generic design from a Saiyan character builder from a video game, and the stuff with Frost really does not work for me.
Buu saga was the revelator for me. Seeing gotenks with purple hair And goku ss3 was my truest first experience of dragon ball It’s the best artwork your gonna find from 3 artists. Best faulcnor music. 2003 with toonami and buu was legendary for me. Thank you for this video I feel less alone
