Thanks to Spacedock for joining me. Check out Spacedock's audiodrama series, The Sojourn here ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-dTq72QaSSsY.html
Rowan and Daniel ! ! Before I subscribed to your channels, I was alone. All I cared about was money. But now, with you here, I've got a family. I've re-evaluated my entire life and I finally know what's truly important in the universe. I trust you and I believe in you and I wouldn't get this far without you! I'm a gambler and I'd put my bet on you. I've got muh ship and muh crew, and you can trust me too!! You can believe in me, because we're in this TOGETHAAAA ! ! ! !
I'm presently re-reading the RCN Series of books by David Drake. These are Science Fiction novels which borrow heavily from the O'Brian novels where starships use sails to enter and traverse the "matrix", a series of bubble universes, in order to travel faster than light. And because electronics would interfere with this process the sails are manipulated by crews on the outside of the ship using hydraulics and wenches. It's a very "low tech" science fiction series with a protagonist modeled after Lucky Jack Aubrey and a female version of Maturin. I highly recommend them.
After learning how Kirk was based on Horatio Hornblower, my response was "who is Hornblower?" So, I found out and read those books. They led me to Aubrey and Maturin, and eventually that led to the Sharpe books. Star Trek is educational.
I had no idea he was based on Hornblower but the themes are IDENTICAL, exploration, unknown places, the sheer risk of being far from home... it was so obvious haha.
@@ink3539 Being sometimes weeks out of communication meant that Hornblower/Kirk WAS England/the Federation and had to wear the big boy pants. Today, you could almost have people in the Pentagon or even the White House directing individual fighter planes in real time. Takes a lot of the thrill and responsibility away.
@@dbadaddy7386 Definitely, well that's oneof the best lines of the movie tbh, this ship IS England - as a French person it was kinda weird rooting for the Surprise. It's was a real genius move to transpose all of this in space - a huge part of what makes Star trek exciting is this old-maade-new again.
The Aubrey-Maturin books are an amazing read. The language used really makes the period come alive. Lots of the little gems throughout the movie were taken from different books and are a great example of the humour present in them
i startet with the audiobooks some weeks ago, after a german historian commentet on master and commander, now i am halfway in the second book, and they are great.
I absolutely agree. The film isn't plot-accurate, but it perfectly captures the spirit of the books and how they can be both funny and tragic at the same time.
Ive always said, this was the stuff Star Trek was based on. Glad Im not the only person to see it, as far as Im concerned this is a Trek film in disguise. Researching new species, strange places, far side of the known world, Captain and his creww struggle to survive. Love this movie.
@@listerofsmeg884 ...He didn't have to mention it. It was assumed. He named the whole darn Series after a very well known naval Ship of America so it would have the name and feel of "Ships" weather they were in open sea or in open space. And referenced how similar they are in mindset and purpose in the shows their self by the writers. There are models of sailing ships in the sculptures on the wall with the space ships in the series and movies. A perfect example of this is in the series Enterprise with the NX-01. It has a 20th century naval ship look and feel to it so we could relate to it easier. Named the series and flag ship after an American Naval FlagShip. Designed ships like naval vessels in the beginning of the story. Naval tones and procedures on ships. Burial at sea and burials in space. I hope this helps clear up your ignorance and improves your knowledge and understanding of something you seem to know everything about already.
It's a lovely thought but Star Trek came first. The first of Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey/Maturin series was from 1969. I like to think that POB was a Trekkie but he was living in a cold-water cottage in the South of France at the time and almost certainly didn't have a TV.
This is the movie I immediately thought of when they brought the MACOS on board Archer's Enterprise. A ship of cramped quarters with a contingent of Marines hunting down the attackers of Earth sounds a lot like space Master and Commander 😊
This movie is kind of a mashup of bits of several of the O'Brian novels. The novels are sometimes difficult to get through, containing large paragraphs that sometimes meander. But they are still excellent and tell great stories. And they are peppered with humor that is still quite funny to this day. "Aubrey, you have debauched my sloth" is a line that had me laughing out loud and still makes me smile to this day. I didn't know that about Cochrane; I looked up his Wikipedia entry and you can definitely see the parallels. It's always good to learn something new about literature you love. Thanks again for this wonderful essay. I thoroughly enjoyed it.
The entire sloth-debauching sequence is just wonderful. The Enterprise needed a pet sloth. Yeah, what Richard Lawson says. They make you smile, laugh, but there's also sequences that can really make you cry.
Master and Commander is actually one of my all-time favorite movies - and Russell Crowe's acting plays no small part in it - I think if he ever deserved an Oscar, or a nomination it would be for this role rather than Gladiator or A Beautiful Mind. But to come to the Star Trek reference - when watching Master and Commander, I was struck by how similar Aubrey and Maturin are to Kirk and McCoy (as welll as the dynamic between the characters); I initially thought the Star Trek characters were inspired by these two, but actually quite a number of the Aubrey/Maturin stories were written AFTER Star Trek first aired. But they certainly share the same source materials, i.e. the Hornblower stories or more accurately the biography of Thomas Cochrane, which inspired both Hornblower and Aubrey (so via Hornblower it indirectly did inspire Star Trek). But Star Trek has been known to also embrace other naval stories - the scenario in The Wrath of Khan, for instance (having to go inside the reactor to repair it) may have been (partly) inspired by the K19 disaster (which is interesting because that actually happened on a Rusiam vessel).
My parents regularly re-watch both Hornblower and Sharpe. I would also recommend Longitude about the creation of navigation clocks and Heart of the Sea as the true story Moby Dick was created from. I do like swashbuckling age of sail fiction. So much so that a friend of mine has bought a 48ft sailboat and we are going to take it to a sailing adventure through the historic Eastern Canada Canal network.
The character of Kirk as originally envisioned was a lot more introspective and Hornblower-like. You can see this in his portrayal in the first half of Season 1
"A ship is a tool that turns cooperation into freedom" - one of the best and most beautiful insights I've heard, especially off the cuff. I'll strive to remember it, thank you.
Thank you for a great introduction to a fantastic movie and book series. I really wish there'd been more films, especially a follow-up that could have explored Maturin's natural element - intrigue on land - where Jack is very much more of a fish-out-of-water. The beauty of the books is that it's not just about naval combat - or even naval life. They really do span every aspect of that period with domestic affairs, life in London and in the country, travels in India, venturing into North America and Africa and a score of other places. And taking you on that journey are the bluff, sanguine, instinctive, sometimes foolish, sometimes far-seeing Aubrey and the reserved, analytical, at once cold-blooded and deeply-romantic Maturin. Together to my mind the greatest friendship in literary history.
Great movie! In the books Maturin was a spy for the British. That was one of the nice call backs in the movie, when Aubrey says something about French spies and Maturin mentions that Britain has spies too.
READ THE BOOKS! The film encouraged me to plow through the series in 18 months and I don't regret it. There's an antic, almost sophomoric comic element the movie only touches on.
For clarification: the pictured disc is not a 4K disc, but is the steelbook repackaging of the original Blu-ray. There is currently no 4K UHD disc of Master and Commander. It's actually very high on people's wish-lists, primarily because there is a widespread desire to hear a Dolby Atmos or DTS:X remix of this audio track - which I would be interested in as well, but I would hope that if it does get a 4K release that they include the original 5.1 track as well, as it is seriously outstanding.
I've always wanted to watch this movie. After hearing you two discuss it I'm going to finally watch it this weekend. Great having you two together. I've been a silent fan for some time
I've read all the Aubrey-Maturin books, first over 20 years ago. I re-read them every few years, they're that good. With the lockdowns this year I pulled them back out for another read through. I truly wish Netflix or Amazon would make a series out of these books, there is so much more to these characters than what you saw in the Russell Crowe film.
Master and Commander is probably my favourite movie of all time. Its a huge shame that it never got the intended sequels its deserved. I would highly recommend reading the book series they are based on.
I loved watching this film in the cinema. I remember reading an article where it did compare the relationship between Russell Crowe’s and Paul Bettany’s characters to Kirk and McCoy. Ever since then, I viewed this as a Star Trek film which did reminded me of Wrath of Khan.
Love that film, and this is a terrific video celebrating it. Although, I had read that *Kirk* was based on *Horatio Hornblower,* even before there was a _Next Generation._ And if you focus on the first few episodes of _STAR TREK,_ you can see that more reserved nature which *Spacedock* mentions (10:33) in the character of *Kirk.*
If you like Patrick O'Brian and Star Trek you should read David Drake's Lt. Leary series. If David Weber's Honor Harrington is Horatio Hornblower in space then Lt. Leary is the Aubrey series in space.
I knew from the thumbnail which movie they were talking about because I love Master and Commander: The Far Side of the World do much that I own the 3-disc special DVD edition! Thanks guys for introducing a great film to a fanbase that may have not seen it before!
YES. A few months ago I dug up my old blu rays, watched the bonus content and listening to how much Nicholas Meyer was inspired by naval stuff like Horatio was a fascinating insight. All sorts of cool info about TWOK
As a British born Afro-Caribbean man, I still find colonial era naval movies an interesting watch. I watched Master And Commander and found it to be a good movie, definitely worth a rewatch.
@@quangutusuranu True. I read about life aboard one of those ships. Indeed, I was on board HMS Victory in Portsmouth on a school trip in 1971 and stood on the very spot where Lord Nelson was fatally wounded.
I watched this film last year and really liked it! The Star Trek parallels kind of jumped out at me, too. I'm glad I wasn't the only one who thought so!
I also love the closing lines in this movie. After Aubrey orders the pursuit of the Acheron, and Maturin realizes he won't be going back to the Galapagos, Aubrey asks about the birds there: "The bird is flightless?" And when Maturin answers that it is, Aubrey replies, "It's not going anywhere." And they share a laugh and start playing. Oh, if you're interested, Hollywood made a Hornblower movie in 1951 with Gregory Peck in the title role. Look for Christopher Lee in support; he gets to duel, but they dub over his voice.
That Hornblower series of TV films was really very good. Worth getting. -- Patrick O'Brian's Aubrey-Maturin books and the Horatio Hornblower books are available from Audible audiobooks and in Amazon Kindle ebooks and in paperback. I haven't read / listened to all of them, but they're very good.
It really is down to the fantastic source material. Patrick O'Brian wrote of that wooden world in superb depth and detail - and the movie did it justice.
Apart from Hornblower and Aubrey/ Maturin, there is also Bolitho, which is massive and spans almost the entire life of the character. Great video! I realize my "tipps" were not needed, since you've already done your homework^^.
Which sci-Fi is based on what? Honor Harrington is Horatio Hornblower, but the Sci Fi version of the Aubrey Maturin books is David Drakes RCN / Lt Leary series. All 4 series are well worth a read.
I'm surprised at that rating. This film while not graphic as still pretty disturbing in what it implies but doesn't show, like the scene that kid officer had his arm amputated while he was wide awake.
I remember reading somewhere a long time ago that Horatio Hornblower was named as an inspiration for Star Trek by Gene Roddenberry. "Gene Roddenberry's original pitch for Star Trek described the ship's proposed hero (Robert April) as a '"space-age Captain Horatio Hornblower".' (memory alpha fandom dot com)
Yes, seen it dozens of times, one of my favourite movies off all. When it came out, it was peak Russell Crowe at the time along with Gladiator released just a few years earlier. I was in awe of Crowe at the time, I could watch both back to back. Fantastic collaboration between 2 of my favourite RU-vidrs, who I'm already subscribed to. And let's face it, all nerds love a team up, shared universe episode. If you enjoy this movie, the History Buffs channel on RU-vid does an excellent analysis of it. Edit; you did reference the History Buffs video. Great minds think alike 😉👌🏻👍🏻
YES. I have thought this for a long while. I also thought, around the time Master and Commander was released, that Crowe would play a great seasoned Kirk (TOS movies Kirk).
Wow what a fantastic video! I've always been a big fan of Master and Commander and I was always hoping that they would have a follow-up to the ending of the movie a sequel It's not necessarily needed as the movie and spy you using your own imagination. Both of you nailed it on the spot with unnecessary explanation within the film I think it was just absolutely fantastic maybe we can ask Christopher Nolan to do part 2
21(really 20 and a half) books, really one story about two old friends across 20 years. The BEST naval fiction of all time. really sets the bar very very high for sequels. Recommended.
I always loved how the producers desperately avoided saying the enemy was an American. Those large frigates were American made and only part of the U.S. navy. The U.S.S. Constitution ( Old Iron Sides) is a survivor of these ships.
*another interesting aspect of ST to explore would be the huge collection of fan fiction stories...true there are bad examples of this as well but one of the more unique and solid ones would be a cross over of Next Gen and Firefly...called Lost in the Woods...it's an older story and one that i've read many times..think it would make for an awesome graphic novel in the same way Next Gen and Doctor Who crossed paths...another favorite of mine*
I've read a few of the Aubrey/Maturin novels, and I will say a few things in warning to anybody who wants to get into them. First, they're very deliberately written in the style of the time, which can be a style of prose that modern audiences have a hard time working through. Second, from the ones that I've read, each individual novel is not a complete story. There are certainly discreet stories within the overall narrative of the series, but the books themselves end and start in what can seem like very arbitrary places.
I can fully subscribe to that...One thing I have also noticed - O'Brian is very intent on showing how much he knows about the time and the field, and he uses a lot of naval terms, the designations of the various sails etc. to show how well he has done his homework. English is not my native language, but I am proficient enough to read English books without a dictionary by now - but I did have to use one for O'Brian. I think an author does have to make the world in which his stories are set believable and convincing, but O'Brian is clearly overdoing it, to the point of coming off as pretentious. I don't need to know the designation of every single sail that a ship during that time had to understand and like the story. He does, however, make up for it by creating stunning characters, with a lot of humor thrown in as well. I remember there is a scene in the first book where our heroes have to run really fast and Maturin remarks that Aubrey shouldn't run that fast as fat people are prone to strokes and the like...
@@jdloop I couldn't have said it better - I've also always had a problem with Jane Austen because her language is so much more convoluted than it needs to be; I did not have this problem with other writers from the era. But there is no reason for Patrick O'Brian to be that convoluted - he wrote his stories in the second half of the 20th century.
@@christianealshut1123 Christiane, Jane Austen wrote as they spoke at the time of course [AFAIK]. "I am all astonishment!" I could never get Shakespeare!! POB of course is modern, but writes as of that time, and wonderfully so. It is part of his magic. I am able to "get" Jane Austen and POB thankfully. Of course I am 75.... maybe those younger [and not born English speakers?] are getting further away from that language, as I am from Shakespeare.
I remember watching this video years ago. I think I still have it on DVD somewhere too. I never thought of it as a parallel to Star Trek before, so that was interesting. If I may ask, can your subscribers sponsor videos? I wouldn't begin to know how much that would cost, but after Daniel mentioned the parallels between Hornblower and David Weber's Honor Harrington series, I wouldn't mind hearing you two discuss that series or Weber's Safehold series.
I really see the Aubrey/Matterin friendship more akin to Sisko and Dax How often did Sisko indulge Dad's scientific curiosity- only to be sidetracked by it?
If you'd have gotten Drachinifel to join as well, this would have been even better, not least because Master & Commander got the naval aspect right as well.
The explaining thing: The 20.3 novels this film is based on by Patrick O'Brian are just like that. It is just like you happened into a time machine and appeared on deck. If you are a lubber you have no idea what they are talking about but you catch on. The Doctor (Maturin) was initially a plot device that allowed some things to be explained (I still don't know the difference between hawser and cable laid rope). I think the doctor part expanded over time. But mostly you are just standing there observing history. I recommend starting with book 5, Desolation Island.
Books are amazing! You get so much more from the movie having read the books. While Russel Crowe was a good Aubrey, Paul Bettany was a near perfect Maturin. I would advise if you do start the series, get the companion book, "Patrick O'Brian's Navy." While the movie doesn't go into the technical aspects of sailing a war ship, the books do. A LOT! The companion book really helps as a road map into the era with some great historical context and stunning artwork to boot. I'd love it if they made another movie. Russel Crowe is fat enough now!
Having read a number of the hornblower and the master and commander series books you can really tell the influence on trek. It also (in my opinion) dissolves the kirk v Piccard difference when you realise that both characters are essentially hornblower, but at different points in his life (the hornblower books starting with him as a midshipman in the late 1790s, and canonical ly ending with him as an admiral during the coronation of Napoleon III). The master and commander series wonderfully took what hornblower had laid out and (in my opinion) improved upon it with both of the characters interactions, their friendship, their world view and their decisions to help one and other out. Plus the fact that although the characters are declared reckless and rule breakers they are in fact adhering to the rules completley... They (jack and hornblower) just go about implimenting them in ways which are not straight forwards (so working within the system as opposed to disregarding them). Trully a great series of books (although it should be noted that the first hornblower book was written in the 1930s, so language some of the language is dated... If you know what I mean) and I'd recommend the to any trek fan as it does change how you think of the franchise, and it also helps differentiate the age of sale style TNG and TOS from the wild west frontier town which is DS9. :)
Master & Commander is one of my ATF movies. I read Hornblower as a youth and have always been a ST fan. There have been many science fiction (book) series that either directly emulated Hornblower or drew a lot from it. One of the most successful SF book series out there is David Weber's Honor Herrington series, which I dearly love. I used to read snipits of HH to my boys and it was very influential for them. One of my boys eventually became my coauthor on our own SF series of books.
couldn't agree more. i have come to realize inside every Trekkie is a History Buff. and this film in every single detail nails the period. not just the language, but the characters such as the midshipman being very young. while i think trek somewhat succeeds at the 'one crew one ship vibe' its never quite as tangible as it is in the movie. i also like how you can see the naval traditions still present in trek, like archer inviting officers to dine at his table.
Back in 2003, the film made 212 million US Dollars in the worldwide box office, which was pretty decent, but, as you, guys, already mentioned it, the budget thereof was unfortunately very hefty; those 150MIL. I loved the film, by the way. Much, MUCH more than the first Pirates of the Caribbean that was coincidentally released the same year and thus there was no shortage of comparisons in the media of the day.
Well called! Of course you can enjoy the EXCELLENT Master & Commander without being a Trekkie, but I distinctly remember thinking just at the end when Captain Aubrey and Dr. Maturin looked at each other, realizing they'd been hoodwinked, how damn Star Trek that moment was! This was the kind of swashbuckling high adventure that's at the root of The Original Star Trek, right down to the captain being half a diplomat and often being so far away from his superiors that he had to make the call on what happens next. All that was lost when NextGen came around, but as I'm finally getting around to watching all of the remastered Original Star Trek eps, I see and feel it so strongly now.
Excellent video. Haven't seen this for years. Thanks to both of you for inspiring me to see it again. 👍 I know it is off topic, but wow Crowe was great in UNHINGED (2020).
As an American I can say it would really depend on how Americans are portrayed as the “antagonist,” as to whether or not Americans would hate it. The movie isn’t showing a good guys vs bad guys, morality story. It’s showing one group of people doing their jobs trying to outwit another group of people who are trying to do their jobs.
The Aubrey-Maturin Series is considered some of the best historical fiction. You guys should definitely read them (I might have done so before producing this video).
There are several audio recordings available. My favourite was the recording by Stephen Thorne 30 years ago, these are no longer available on Audible but the current Audible editions were recorded recently and are very very good as well.
The movie took stories from several books and combined them. Most of the time the baddies were French, but Jack tangled with Yank and Spanish ships. Maturin was definitely the scientific character, but he was also a spy with a drug problem and Obrien hinted at Maturin's ability to be ruthless.
