I love your premise that you don’t have to buy the whole groupset, it’s just too bad you do have to buy a new frame as most gravel frames for the next hour don’t have Udh compatibility
@@a1white It's ridiculous pricing because the bike and component manufacturers think that only very wealthy people ride bikes so they can afford to be ripped off, that, and they play off of our stupidity!
You couldnt buy a good racing frame for the cost of that racing groupset. An s-works crux frameset is about $5,000 and the bike with this drivetrain is over $12k. One can get a new complete rolling bike for $500, $1,000ish with gears. Im looking @ a scott speedster 30 with 2x sora on sale for $944. Same bike with 11spd 105 is $1,350. For $2,200 i can get 12spd SRAM AXS 2x road groupset on a carbon frame.
Whining about prices is kind of boring, but this is really outrageously expensive. I'd really like to know the manufacturing cost of these groupsets. It's high-tech, well-built and innovative, but 4k for shifitng gears on a bicycle... It's still pretty basic stuff, no?
Well they say its compatible with all the other axs stuff so it will most likely work. I don't know how large the weight difference to the xx1 is or if the xx1 derailleur is much sturdier.
Cost aside, which is a different conversation, the benefit of “gear count” is particularly useful on 1x setups. This is because the more gears one has available on the cassette, the better one can optimize cadence. On 2x setups, cassette gear count is less of an issue as 2x10 provides plenty of gearing options. But SRAM is a 1x forward company and going to 13s (or 14), much like Campy Ekar did with its 1x only gravel groupset release, makes lots of sense. So discussing cost and whether we “need” 13 or 14 speed cassettes is a bit of a “vintage” conversation. Frankly, 2x10 is unnecessary as 2x8 also provides enough distinct gears (about 13-14). The short answer is no. We don’t “need” any of these new drivetrain mechanics but from an evolutionary design perspective, it sure makes sense and is nicer to ride. I enjoy riding my 2x8 30 yo vintage Cannondale but love riding my plush 1x12 electronic gravel bike. So much more comfortable and easier to shift. And speaking of electronic, there is also good reason to believe that this cassette (or any 13 or 14 speed cassette given appropriate freehub) would also work with RD’s such as the one made by WheelTop. Not sure what the lowest gear spec is on the current road RD though. A gravel RD is supposedly on its way.
Most excellent video Waz. 👏. Your pace and delivery were spot on sir. I got all the info wanted and more in a nice, watchable, 8mins. I've seen other presentations (well one so far) and whilst detailed, yours was like a finger of fudge ...just enough to give a bike a treat 😊😊😊😊
Warren is incorrect about the old 1x Red power meter setup being a single piece. This is true for the 2x chainset but the 1x allows you to swap rings (I have it). This is at about 4:50. Otherwise great video!
That would be the axs 107 bcd powermeter, the previous gen red has single ring integrated to the powermeter, but you are absolutely correct you could buy a 107 bcd pm and ring and that’s compatible with all road 8 bolt cranks
32mm internal rim? My MTB's are all 30mm internal with 2.4 tyres while my gravel has 25mm internal and a 50mm tyre - what tyre width is the test bike running?
The wider rims means the tire has more air volume, which in turns means less air pressure. All that helps to give the bike a smoother ride and puts your side knobs more in contact with the ground.
@@buckroger6456 flatter profile, which means slower rolling and the bike doesn't want to lean over. I hate 35mm rims on MTBs, they just plow into corners rather than lean over nicely. 30mm is the sweet spot for most MTB tires, 35mm is for 2.6s and plus tires.
@@mrvwbug4423 100% agree about the rim width. I run wide rims on my hardtail, but I also run 2.6 tires and love em, so much cornering grip. I will say that some tires run more round or flat compared to others. I know maxxis highroller 2s run more flat profile, while DHR 2s are more round.
So on this setup, how do you check derailleur alignment, and better yet, how do you adjust it? We can’t assume it will be spot on either. After all, they can’t even get brake caliper flat mounts right, or bb shells and faces as they should be. Is it because it’s mounted right to the axle centerline and not the frame, that no misalignment will ever happen?
You bolt the RD to the rear axle not the frame itself, there is also a plastic washer that might take care of small frame alignment issues, so seems like the fact it’s threaded to the rear axle it would take care of it
The old model powermeter and chainring aren't one part. At least. Not the picture you're showing. The SRAM red road groupset has an integrated chainring/powermeter setup. The xplr doesn't.
For this amount of money, the new TRP & Classified 2x system is waay better. You can get the wider range, finer gearsteps and smooth shifting without all the cost of this setup. Even just using the Classified wheelset with your standard GRX setup is a better option. I love SRAM's innovation here, but the cost is crazy, and you still don't get sufficient range out of this setup.
Depends on what you're riding. For more technical gravel riding where you're encroaching on XC MTB territory, the 1x is probably going to be preferable
@@mfa81 I've ridden thousands of miles of gravel of all types. I have a pretty keen eye for the application of technology in this area. My reasons for saying the TRP is better is as follows: a wider total gear range (530% vs 460%), it offers finer gear steps over the entire range, it doesn't require a new UDH compatible frame, it allows for quicker jumps in fast-changing terrain, and TRP brakes generally work better than SRAM brakes. All that for less cost.
How can everything be compatible with the new 13 speed group, if all the other groupsets he mentioned are 12 speed?! Also with grx you can choose between manny different cassette options, use 105 12 speed shifters or the better gtx820 ones and use an 1x cranks you like. I fot the raceface next r carbon cranks with a garbaruk chainring
You need a new derailleur and I think that's were all the logic is while the shifters are only sending commands for up and down. I haven't seen a direct comparison yet.if they just made the cassette one gear wider then everything else could be the same.
I’m confused about the compatibility with mtb or road cassettes, so you’re saying it’s compatible with 12 and 13 speed? Or are there now 13 speed cassettes in road sizes and eagle sizes?
Hi there, the new full mount derailleur is designed specifically for the 13 speed 10-46 cassette. What you can do is mix the derailleur & cassette (as a pair) with anything AXS 12 speed- so that’s chainsets, shifters, & chains from existing mountain, road, and gravel Sram components. Thanks for watching! - Warren
I would never spend my own money on this. Got a shop deal? Cost plus 10%? Team provide your bike? Sure. But I think it's nuts for an amateur racer to shell out for components this expensive. My Cervelo R5cx with Force AXS may only have 12 speeds, but it's more than enough.
They keep improving derailleurs when the worst part of their groupsets are brakes, and they are the reason I would be reluctant to choose Sram ever again. I have an old enduro with Sram Guide and a gravel with Rival AXS. Both quickly develop squeaking after a servicing, which I have to do regularly because they also quickly develop need for bleeding. My 10yo bike with Shimano M7000 did more miles then both of my Sram bikes, brakes gets bleeding whenever bike is in service for some other reason, not because they require it, they get it much less frequently than Sram brakes, they work fine, and never developed a squeak. Previously I also had Shimano brakes, and I do not recall having any problems with them.
Actually, the new Red brakes are fantastic. I have been on Shimano for decades, and now that the brakes are sorted, I am shifting to Red XPLR for my new bike build for fast gravel riding and racing.
@@mrvwbug4423 it can't adjust for b tension which is needed if different cassette range, and sram have also been explicit that the next xplr mech can only be used with that cassette due to this
Hi guys I am having a hard time understanding why the road derailleur is different from the mountain bike one and which one is which. I am hoping for a nice derailleur that supports a huge climbing gear 40t or bigger
@brothatwasepic no problem. Also, most 1x12 Mtb gear sets have a great gear range of 10 tooth to up to a 52 tooth. I'm running sram 1x12 on my hybrid bike and it has a 10t - 42t for the rear with a 50t chainring. My Mtb has a 1x12 that is 10t to 52t and a 34t chainring. You'll have no problems finding a lot of great 1x12 setups.
The new gravel-specific group set and wheel set from Sram is innovative. But there's no backward compatibility with previous bicycles and tires and there is no cross compatibility with other group set brands. The new wheels from Zipp have a new extremely wide internal rim width that is incompatible with most existing tires. The new rear derailleur is incompatible with bike frames that aren't designed for their "universal" derailleur hanger. It seems like a very aggressive ploy to impose a new standard in cycling that excludes its competition, forcing bike and tire manufacturers to design bicycles that aren't compatible with Sram's competition. Sram is a mega conglomerate that has bought out several bike brands that includes Zipp wheels, Rockshox suspension, Hammerhead navigational computers, Quark power meters, Truvativ components, and Velocio apparel.
That's a hookless rim. Problems for the rider and cheaper to produce. Only for real racers, everybody who values their wallet and health should avoid it.
The issues are with road bikes running high pressures Hookless are designed for low pressure/tubeless. You are safe as long as you have a compatible tire and using air pressure under 70psi.
A groupupset for social media. Just don't take it out on the trail. When the stone is in the way, something will have to give the frame or the derailleur, both significantly more expensive than a $5-10 hanger. Even if money were not the problem, this new level of waste of resources promoted by these companies is appalling. Their greed and the ignorance of the buyers led to the fact that everything became disposable.
Say what you will, but creating a new deraileur hanger standard hoping frame manufacturers would adopt it and then releasing a product that only works on that standard just seems.. anti competitive
I think there are cases when you can justify a new approach or incompatible standards. Here there seem to be advantages. If that's enough for you is your decision.
This approach has already worked for MTBs, all new MTB frames released have the UDH, and now, all new Gravel frames will have the UDH. This is a win for all riders, even if one does not choose to use the direct mount derailleur, UDH hangers are available in every bike shop, anywhere.
1x chains last about half as long as 2x and 3x systems due to the extreme angles the chain must go into, but that's the price you pay if you are a fast serious off-road rider on very technical terrain.
that argument doesn’t make sense. a 2x system still has extreme cross angle issues as well. riders still use the big chainring-6th cog (sometimes 7th or 8th) from the outside. the most a 1x system would do on a 13-spd cog would be 6 on either side.
What a complete waste of money these groupsets and the others like them are - these groupsets neatly define the marketing BS of the cycling industry, and all that is wrong with the cycling industry, the profit margins on these 'higher end' groupsets and bikes is significant, you only have to look at the price gouging that has been going on with the massive percentage discounts now being offered on bikes across the board to see how greedy the industry got, and equally with money draining out of it now due to the economic downturn how the venture capitalists are selling off/shutting down bike brands. That aside great video presentation as ever by Warren
Don't blame them, blame those so called cyclist that love spending their money over something stupid. "My hands are too weak to operate cable shifter! I need electronic! Boohoo!" 😂
Shimano is loosing ground to a point where i think they cannot compete anymore with the fast development of sram. Only huge bummer with sram is pricing. Love the new 13 speed groupset but would never ever buy this at current prices.
Nope. I don't give a crap about 13 speed or any of the new tech that sram is trying to introduce, and i still hate 1x on any sort of drop bar bike. Add to that the fact that sram brakes use nasty DOT fluid for their brakes which still feel worse than shimano, and I'll still pick GRX Di2 over this any day. Newer isn't always better
Maybe amateurs with a lot of money to burn. Pros are going to run XX-SL t-type, even with the 52t cassette most of your world cup XC racers are still on 34 or 36t chainrings depending on how steep the climbs are on a particular course. World Cup XC courses these days are either straight up or straight down, not much flat pedaling.
lol what a joke. Wheeltop eds with a rotor 13s cassette and 12 speed chain. $1000 and will work on any bike even my older 135mm qr bikes. No new frame, no special tires, no special wheels, just install, tune and go ride. SRAM is a joke😂. I will have a 2x13 electronic groupset for only another $400 added to my wheeltop so ya.
