The character that ruined fun...(Slayer discussion with Yata) 

Correction. The risk reward is in his favor until you knock him down. At this point the guy literally doesn't have anything except PRC super

@@invarkul7831 Risk reward is always in your favor when you knock someone down lmao (Still has better defense than HC post-KD)

@@jotogoat it would be really fucked up if HC had any form of defense considering his character . also the way you say it makes it sound like slayer consistently kills characters of one touch and only high HP characters of 2 wich simply isn't true . he got bad neutral and in return he does a lot of damage . that's all . he is basically worse sol

@@pizzadelivery4655 his neutral isn't "bad", just linear his whiff punishing is some of the craziest in the game, and a character with crazy built-in mental stack forces you to think a lot about poking or counterpoking.

@@jotogoat having linear neutral is pretty bad xD his dashes also make his approach kinda limited or rather he just has to work around them. he has literally nothing for projectiles in any way shape or form that arent just system mechanics. the only cool thing he really has for neutral is that his momentum retains in a really unusual way when jump canceling his dash

Imo after playing as Slayer and vs Slayer he does deserve it (most of the time) against better player. Getting in as Slayer is much harder than ppl think cuz good players just counter K mappa with spacing, back jump or 6p. When playing as Pot just spamming KBMF in neutral would sometimes get u CH that takes 60%+ of Slayers HP, get you oki ~40 meter at relatively low risk of being -2 if Slayer somehow blocks. You I'm pretty sure you can potbust all the dandy step mixups, get massive CH on MH and having garuda oki if you read K mappa is strong af

There's just something about facing Slayer that feels so unfun to me. It just doesn't feel like an equal measurement of skill at lower floors.

​@@esseubotit's the amount of damage he does with very little effort. easy inputs. one buttons switch. every hit by him guaranteed 60% of your hp lost. basically u gotta play lame vs him

It got me lol

Not only that he didn't manufacture a massive counterhit via grab, nor was he constantly plus, and he definitely could not punish full screen zoning with impunity.

@@HellecticMojo he did manufacture the counterhits in rev2, it just wasnt a well-explained mechanic. he also actually needed them to combo into bunker in the old games

@@ckorp666 true, I guess I should clarify massive counterhit. Strive version of BSUniverse is definitely way stronger than previous version in terms of effect to the point that it's regularly worth aiming for whenever possible.

Bro but even if “slayer is doing what he has always done” , that doesn’t mean it’s fun to play against. If it’s shit design now (which imo it is, nothing fun about losing all my health in two interactions), it was shit design to begin with

Once upon a time every character was a two interaction character

@@RavenUwU605 cant wait for the "win against slayer any%" speedruns

ok smartass, what is the counterplay? What is the counterplay to stop him from just gaining meter on anything and doing an ez W on the broken super that combos on EVERYTHING ASIDE FROM PILEBUNKER? What is the counterplay for full screen mappa k (and it has to be a reliable counterplay and not like "uhhh just time 6p I guess" because slayer thrives on counter hits)? What is the counterplay for the free 4 way unreactable oki? What is the counterplay to control him in neutral without playing a zoner? What is the counterplay to not allow him to just do loops which I personally believe is a bug like srsly how is he allowed to just do 70-80% combo on a REGURAL hit without meter?

one interaction*

every character has a counter play but they don't 2 touch you what are you talking about?

@@bluecolt5860 I agree, these are really interesting.

How could you!? You've doomed us all. /s

I told people they weren't ready.......no one listened to me and to be honest they can hold that.

Yknow I would be more for this opinion if we didn’t have other characters in the game that kill you off of 1-2 interactions that also have knockdown into 50-50 guess for game. We are talking about a game with both sol bad guy and goldlewis. The game just is high damage for anyone who isn’t an objective mixup character.

@@Fableheath I play Bedman? We need 3 to 4 interactions in order to win Sol feels fightable hard but fair and atleast has respectable combos and he's mix ups come from using meter Meanwhile Slayer is basically anything hits red rc into charge dust, close S, forward HS into pile bunker 😐 wow so muchhhhh skill Goldlewis was carried by white wildassault Slayer literally 2 hits and its half your life gone If he connects just 1 pile bunker on the corner is guaranteed wall so he always has meter and access to the 2 meter super that he doesn't even need thanks to all the damage he has naturally its not comparable to any other of the characters is not ok

Who you play i play aba my mistakes aren't bad enough to get me killed

@@stevensingleton4870 literally answers nothing Aba is not a big body character and has multiple defensive options plus jealousy mode gives her crazy good damage and mobility If you didn't know now you will Bedman doesn't have a lot of health like the otgrr big bodies

​@@xilef_0078 Yeah, I main Bedman? too and would really appreciate an effective health buff or any kind. Bed's offense is actually pretty solid right now but he still crumbles easily for a two-step character.

I didn't know axl was goin through that😭

@@macanudo6206 ppl downplay slayer bc theyre on floor 8 and havent discovered 2H or learned how to mash a super motion and react w/the button. i feel u fellow axl, it wasnt this bad in the old games

@@stevensingleton4870 nah my message was too dramatic, it isnt as bad as millia (as it should, millia "should" always have a good MU against axl). Its just annoying how he has counterplay to our strongest stuff like that. Things like F.D.B. , intertwine ant tilt or even white wild assault are much more interesting to interact with axl stuff IMO. Aditionally, it doesnt feel fair that the slayer archetype (that "should" lose to axl) get this treatment while other "losing" archetypes like asuka and bedman get litterally nothing to counterplay our stuff. Give me interaction, but make it fun !

@@ckorp666 im not even that good at the video game lol, a low celetial among the others. But i can't imagine how fighting slayer feels like at the lower level, dude exploding you and you don't even know what a frametrap is (nor does he, but he manage to do it anyway). More tutorials on the counterplay should come from the game itself. Has for today, they only shows you how to block crossup pilebunker, and how to (badly) interupt master's hammer.

Axl Pot hasn't been an actually bad MU in a few years, GL no longer has some of the worst MUs in the game after WA's introduction. It could be test/pot, I'm not sure what's the worst currently.

jacko v asuka is pretty bad

@@7AM_Tzar after test getting full screen arbiter sign test/pot has become a bit less pot sided id say still not great for test but its not as bad

Asuka axl is the worst

@@galaxieschild4235 full screen arbiter really doesnt meaningfully make the MU better, it prevents the situation in which pot can just wait and flick fullscreen and test is required to approach, but in the entire MU test still has the same losing conditions. Not as bad is like going from 6.5-3.5 to 6.4-3.6, it doesn't change more than one game out of 100.

I would just like small tweaks, a bit less damage and hp. Slightly better backdash and both would be happy imo. But idk. I actually have fun fighting him as testament, but maybe just because I’m just really good at guessing. Lol

@@RainyKiwi testament has great activate frames on all her specials and can start their game plan while making space making sure that slayer won't do anything for free They also threatens the same space slayer does and wants to occupy, just much safer, at the same time setting up their win con so it makes sense that they can reliably just keep that monster from ever getting in while doing decent damage in the process AND/or getting plus frames AND/or setting up her next stain But for the majority of the cast this is not possible Not that it should be the case but more so that slayer has a bad match up in testament (especially with the buffs)

@@Swag-Bot-zf5vp maybe, but most testament players I have talked to hate slayer and say he is a very rough mu. On top of the fact I’m not beating him at range. My game is generally in the neutral since he can close the gap instantly with k mappa as soon as he gets an opening. That being said with the teleport changes I can generally kite him around and set up safe jumps and apply stain pressure as soon as I land counter hit.

@@RainyKiwi so it's almost a rush down testament playstyle that u open up with a HKD from neutral Testament is the the original Johnny? I like it Most people to be fair aren't gods and can't play well all the time. And this might only be their thoughts because slayer is a really unfun and I'm sure most people saying that slayer is a bad mu are either A are unaware or not training against slayer openings B Are scared players that let slayer get away with a lot Or get hit from slayers fake minus follow-ups (I am one of them) And/Or C Lose in one interaction and call it a bad MU which sounds fair But if he was a fair character this point wouldn't exist U would definitely benefit from using ur specials as well as another openers anything safe against slayer can't be wrong Also THE THEY THEM NEUTRAL Their buttons are not bad either Some of the best in the game and makes perfect sense why u use them too U still obviously use stain because y wouldn't u It enables this play further which sounds really fun (I will definitely try it and lose) Slayers k mappa is exactly why u would benefit from using ur specials more because it stuffs all slayers best ways in K mappa Dash Dandy into follow up And it forces neutral to be a difficult place for slayer which most characters can't achieve If at all This is a good Convo No hurt feelings Just Testament being cool Just like a weed

slayer player detected also to counterplay against him you have to have literally bought him and labbed against his specific weaknesses, which literally amounts to strive being p2w at a point. Me personally, i didnt spend $100 when i first bought the game, and im not tryna spend $7 to play against slayer.

nah

His neutral is not worse than his defense bro 💀

All these new characters do so much, it's nice to see a character implemented with clear counterplay. Zato needs more buffs though, they made his weakness to bad. Frfr

You managed to go a whole comment without complaining about Zato. Proud of you.

i complain about his play style in the old games too, but at least he has to block sometimes now :) he'll be fine after some downtuning, and anyone who truly hates him should learn the matchup while he's busted & get revenge post-nerfs

@@ckorp666 totally fair. I still wouldn't say he is busted but very strong. Just outside of top 5. I still wanna see more buffs to lower tiers then really seeing nerfs personally. Justice for my boy zato.

@@Violet-Excellence i mostly just think his conversions are too consistent (think about how often he converted a normal grounded hit into a free bunker in the old games vs strive) and the crazy scooch on k mappa makes his neutral too oppressive for a char that's supposed to struggle getting in also in the old games, iirc there was some travel time on the anti-zoning super so u could RC at range, but now the whole thing's 0 post-flash, so as an axl player, i have zero way of threatening space and playing neutral until i bait it. i'm almost better off playing rushdown, since there are safe setups w/rainwater, but that is NOT how u want to be playing the matchup, esp on this patch since they finally remembered axl's supposed to be a zoner in this game

@@ckorp666 good points but you could fdc mappa in the old game which went even farther. Also the super change seems potentially needed because he lost so much air mobility/stall and could snipe at some situations with his air super. He neutral is super 1 dimensional now. However I totally agree his meterless conversion are way better even without counter. You could never get into pile meterless without counter or wonky float confirms.

It’s honestly just that compared to other characters, slayer gets way more reward which makes him feel a little unfair. It’s a situation where the Person fighting slayer has to put in so much work that it feels hopeless fighting because he gets almost double the reward you get for stuff that’s a small hit

Slayer is fine. Most of what’s being explained here only shows up in top level play and you ain’t there.

@@scrubzero1735to be fair this is guilty gear, your character isn’t broken but everyone else’s is

Strive is the most balanced GG ever. Which is not much but still

rock, paper, scissors. it refers to a situation in which any player could use a variety of tools and you have to just Guess Right (tm)

2H, the disjointed low crush that hits far as most f.S is being stuffed in neutral you say

@@HellecticMojo At this range he doesn't have any overheads to threaten you. My go to is just block low all the time unless he's in my face

@@invarkul7831 neither does most characters. No one calls Axl's neutral bad because he has no overhead. Acting like his neutral is bad because of a lack of overhead is gross oversimplification and frankly just being obtuse considering how long Nago dominated the meta before getting any kind of overhead.

@@HellecticMojo after beyblade and 2h (or 2s idk) nago is + cuz he can special cancel into very threatening combo or game ending bite. After 2h slayer can do dandy step which is more than reactable, K mappa that leaves him -2, p mappa that might whiff or just stay minus. Even if slayer could mixup with bite after 2H his BU is much weaker than nago's especially outside of the corner

@@invarkul7831 you are legitimately trying to argue that a character played badly is bad. Seriously, your argument for bad character is a whiff? Also you are just moving goalposts. You tried to argue that lack of overheads was a factor and now won't even argue for it and now saying that dandy is reactable while starting the argument with just "my go to is just block low all the time"

But here is the thing... people have been complaining about Nago and Sol since Launch. If you think they haven't, I do not think you have been interacting with the community enough to have an opinion on the topic.

@@matmil5 my point is that the complaints are far less common at this point. They're not nearly as hyperbolic anymore.

Check the elo on rating update for HC top 200 and then check slayers 200 and you’ll see your character is actually baby mode LOL

@@00pium_D3vil I mean he is newer so, the knowledge check gappening is bound to happen for a while.