The Clone High Reboot is a Pandering Trainwreck 

Can you review Dead end paranormal park? I've seen reviews talking about the LGBTQ rep and I think that's fun, but I'd like to hear someone talking about both the episodical plots, and the overarching plot!!!

So Cleo was Velmafied...?

How did Lord and Miller mess up so bad. I will never understand that? After years of making amazing works of art, this season is by far their worst work.

9:38: You need to Drag her, Slay her, sippin in that true tea hunty for your characters for that style of comedy to work. they changed

@@a17yearoldonyoutubeluigi Even tho I like Clone High's recent season, I have to say... this one feel more like a some random Nelvana/Wildbrain cartoon, because of the simple humor, wacky poses and wild cartoony sounds.

Plus this show was already stale with them using old TikTok trends like sea shanties that are ancient in internet years.

@@SchmergDergen that's why you don't put memes in your show...

Calls the original show outdated yet that's the reason *IT GOT A SEASON 2* If clone high wasn't the way it was regardless of how "outdated" it was, it wouldn't have a cult following

@@Saltedroastedcaramel Also I find it funny this was supposed to a more 2023 version of clone high yet they still refer to old movies. Like goonies was made in 1985.

@@suitdoggy4707 And the goonies hasn't been referenced in years . I probably only seen that movie once in my life and I don't think I watched it completely

I'm honestly surprised they didn't do that.

As much of a good idea that is, I genuinely doubt they'd do anything close to that as they seem like the type of writers who unapologetically love Hamilton and thus wouldn't make fun of it like they do with everything else they like.

@@oldoutlet6946 Oh my God...a Hamilton that outright dislikes the musical would have been a goldmine of jokes.

@@eatatjoes6751Sounds like the type of clone I could get along with. Don’t see the hype for it. Hell, i’m more hyped for Les Miserables and Phantom of the Opera.

@@hiddendesire3076 Having Hamilton as a side character who tries to be part of the plot but everyone instead bugs him to rap for them would a good running gag.

you could even continue the abe joke by making them both have crushes on each other because he gave up on cleo, except now he’s too insecure in himself to ask her out and doesn’t know if she really likes him or not (even though she’s still explicitly telling him she likes him every episode

@@wren_. Either that or have Abe get Cleo, only for him to realise that "Joan was the better person" Except, in Clone High fashion, they could spin it so rather than Abe realising that Joan was better because of how nice she was and supportive of him, it could be for something petty that Cleo does. Either that, or lean into how a lot of people feel like Joan only liked a certain vision of Abe, with Abe realising that if he went with Joan, she'd be no real better than Cleo's manipulations.

This would have been the way. I also HATE how they made Abe do a complete self aware 180, and the fact that he's not selfish anymore. There was absolutely nothing that pushed him to do that.

That would have been more in line with her character. They really missed a comedic opportunity. Insecure and simp Joan was just not funny

It would've been funny if they wrote her as traditionally goth, and have her basically be depicted as the class crush who everyone adored, only for them to leave the second their view of her was shattered and that she wasn't a trendy goth girl, but instead just a lazy stoner type.

Exactly!! I honestly hoped Cleo would at least get a redemption arc. She was very smart and like manipulative (but iconic like I love her). And in season 1 there was small hints of like why she was that way, first off her mom is an alcoholic and if I remember correctly in one episode she mentioned how her mom would throw things at her. She also mentions a lot of times how other men have like touched her and it’s kind of gray area bc she never mentions if she wanted to or not. ANYWAYS not trying to make this show deep. But I really hoped we would at least get redemption, she does have empathy for Joan but she also sees her as a rival for both Abe and JFK. I wished that in this season the friendship between Joan and Cleo would somehow develop. IMO Cleo shouldn’t be w either JFK or Abe. Idk I just was very disappointed in how they just made her a mean girl trope.

i loved that about her character because her clone mother was actually incredibly well educated for her times which is rarely mentioned fact about her and also broke the stereotype of the popular girl being stupid

It doesn’t help either that the real Cleopatra was considered attractive because of how intelligent and powerful she was, not because she was physically “hot”. The whole things about Cleopatra being physically attractive was a trope invented by Shakespeare, but her being an intelligent high-achiever is accurate to the historical figure.

Yeah and she raised awareness about awareness 👀

This show was 100% written by a bunch of stereotypical chicks who think that every popular girl is dumber than them

Modern teen dramas in themselves feel like parody. Have you SEEN Riverdale? Beyond season 1, the show goes completely off the fucking rocker snd simultaneously becomes better and worse with each passing season.

Satire would require self awareness, and/or talent. Something I refuse to believe modern movie and show writers have. Even those who had it once upon a time

​@@NotsilYmerejI guess you don't watch any form of television or film. Imagine thinking no good content exist because one thing you find is bad

@@G-LukeJA one thing? I wish it were only one thing. I’ve considered the idea that it may just be because I’m getting old, but then I find independent stuff that I can legitimately enjoy.

@@G-LukeJA velma, she-hulk, modern star wars, brie larson, strange world. new little mermaid, primos, lightyear did you blow from stupid town? because there's definitely more than one shit show, not even counting other forms of media. are you that willingly blind to how much more shit and shittier media is than it has been before?

As someone who absolutely loves the original Jeanne d'Arc, I get how you feel. I hate shippers sometimes.

They Britta'd her, but they Britta'd Britta-ing her somehow. How do you Britta Britta-ing a character? (If I am speaking gibberish to you, this is your incentive to watch Community)

iirc the creators said this season was supposed to show how the show would be if Joan was popular instead of the way she was in the first season. It’s on purpose, I think she’s going to return to her usual self in season 3

@@user-ob6nc1dw8y I get that Clone High Joan isn't actually Jeanne, but Jeanne took her own immense popularity with grace and humility. It's probably just my obsessive devotion to the saint speaking, though.

It's because they're scared to make any of the the main cast other than Abe and Toper have bad traits. The reason why Joan was so good was because she also had her flaws and sometimes even acknowledge them. Now she's a hallow person who's only purpose this season is to bully Abe, fuck Jfk, and talk about how much she was bullied or girls didn't like her.

The new writers literally hate him and so do the new TikTok fans, it’s weird.

Same here! I’ve always enjoyed Abe’s obliviousness

White Male, there you go, that's why

@@SchmergDergen The new writers ARE the TikTok fans

ben riley fans in across the spider verse : first time

They aren’t even fans. That’s the problem.

Or 'tourist' as what fake fans that try to push out original fans are called.

it is practically never a good idea. A writer needs to be clear-headed about what they're writing. They need to have a certain point the story is tied to, and they need to be unafraid to make things weird or difficult in order to drive home that point. That's when the story becomes engaging. Many fans are too indulgent to portray the necessary nuances.

Its letting the wrong "fans" make it. They find the safest ESG hires to make these reboots. When 2000's humor was wild. It was meant to mock rather than be slightly edgy with a subliminal message and meeting the current narrative. It used to be rebelious, now its compliant. If you told me the people who worked on Velma worked on this i would 100% believe it.

Nah, the writers of this weren't fans, fans can make awful garbage but you'll be able to tell if it's garbage made by fans, meanwhile this show reads like it was made by a text prompt.

That’s some major dramatic irony

@@Ag_33 Yeah, looking back I didn't watch the whole video before I made this comment! Let this be a lesson.

To see Clone High take the piss out of show’s like Riverdale would have required effort and understanding of humour, and we already know that HBO doesn’t have a lot of that.

@@snowbunnie1113 ESPECIALLY not the HBO Max division. You see The Idol? Devoid of humor, or quality!

Season 2 became what season 1 was satirizing.

As someone from Mexico, here a lot of people tend to devaluate frida and her art (most likely as a result of her over exposition) and I find that really sad. She lived a very tragic life and her paintings were her only output. Even as someone that doesn’t like her work that much, I can see the rawness and tragedy in her paintings and appreciate that.

@@thecollector4332 exactly, i thought they were going to reveal the new frida felt like a hack because she wouldnt be actually artistically creative even if skillful, since her intro was she skateboarding, i assumed it was a wink to how the original Frida was an amputated and had a dozen of health issues Like not to take it into a way too drama heavy stuff, i feel it would have been funny if they had made topher and frida the new popular power couple of school, topher would be like the parody of those rich white kids that are all about social issues even if are swinging in their parents' money, and Frida would be liek those artsy kids that pretending being super deep in their art, but is actually very much an air head that doesnt know what the hell she is talking about

@@KnucklesxReala911 I still liked what they did with Topher though (up until the last minute). You gotta remember, these are new human beings that don't attain the memories of their clone parents and are only aware of them through others' means, so it makes sense if Topher was this super socially aware person that constantly has to bottle up his terribleness inside considering how critical people are of Colombus. It would've been funny if Frida, realizing that Topher was struggling to express himself, finds it in herself to help him since she's actually a good person. And then after making him comfortable enough to be himself - That's when they reveal that Topher's "true self" is to spout out the n-word (or something). To be the most edgy kid in the block. Except the person he's only not edgy with, and genuinely respects, was Frida, who now is in a dilemma for 'On one hand, I made this kid happy and genuinely respect me, on the other hand, he's an asshole'. That directly makes fun of the 'good girl fixes bad boy and turns him good' trope.

I.. actually don't know much about the background of Frida. What was happening there?

@@sleeplessstudios7626 Frida Kahlo was born with several health issues, her childhood was filled with surgeries and she lived in isolation from other kids. Among other things, she suffered from polio. Which left lifelong sequels to her body. But the most damaging incident in her life happened when she was eighteen years old. She was traveling alongside her boyfriend in the bus when it was suddenly hit by a streetcar. The accident broke Frida’s spine in three parts, two of her ribs fractured, her pelvic bone fractured as well and her legs were also severely damaged. This accident (and the subsequent 20+ surgeries) left her immobilized for months, and that was what motivated her getting into painting. She often painted self portraits that depicted her broken state. The accident (combined with her medical issues) also meant she could never have kids, which was something she desperately wanted. Her being unable to conceive children and the various abortions she had left her with a horrible depression (and this was also something that was reflected often in her work). She later got married to Diego Rivera (one of Mexico’s most important muralists). The marriage had several highs and lows, the lowest low being when Diego had an affair with Frida’s sister. Which led her to have several affairs with both men and women (she even had a relationship with Trotski when he was exiled in Mexico). They divorced and remarried (with an agreement of living together but without having sex) The last tragic incident in her life happened when they had to amputate her leg due to a gangrene infection. This incident left her bound to a wheelchair and gave her a terrible depression. She tried to commit suicide multiple times. She eventually died at age 47 from a pulmonary embolism. This is skipping all her art career and political activism of course, but this brief recap of her life may give you an idea as to how tragic and depressing Frida’s life was.

Now that could have been funny, like she’s completely misunderstood what “the Underground Railroad” was because she’s dense, but the show would never dare make fun of Harriet Tubman. She’s is to modern Western liberals to what Gandhi was to India in 2003 - a sacred cow.

@@snowbunnie1113 You know, until something about her is found to be compromising about her status and then people will completely step away and act like they never liked her in the first place just so they won't look bad for not knowing the "facts" before because that's what it means to admire someone these days: to hope you always liked a clean and infallible person.

Trains and guns.

i actually think this would be a great idea. she could be like those types of teens on social media nowadays who DESPERATELY want to be seen as progressive and smart and correct about every social issue, but have an extreme fundamental misunderstanding of what those issues are, like how a lot of infighting happens in queer, diverse, left-leaning communities on social media over pointless labels rather than actual issues people really face, for example. the clone could have an obsession with wanting to be just as progressive and helpful to society as her parent, but not have any idea about what she did or how she did it, thus leading to the misunderstanding of thinking the "underground railroad" refers to trains. she'd be like the types of kids who will write a whole callout doc on you for using a "problematic" word to identify yourself with, without paying attention to any of the things you actually say, do, or think

That and being really good at digging tunnels.

They did get a couple of them back, that’s why there’s like some funny jokes here and there, but not enough of them are there to save the show.

Hell even Abe and JFK’s histories are never touched on except for one shitty assassination joke. There was potential there too, Kennedy was actually the peaceful resolution type while Lincoln had no problem playing dirty war politics to achieve a good goal. Both were more authoritarian than history books portray them as. Neither had a conversion arc and were always allies to civil rights, but were naive in the beginning and intensified support as the presidencies progressed. On a lighter note, both had socialite wives who spent way too much of their money buying fancy clothes

Ngl I wanna see dat between Abe & Harriet, missed opportunity y’all🗿

what you described is exactly the type of unironic moral-learning melodrama that this video is entirely against.

@@CheddarDrip ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

​@@CheddarDripit is still a better version than what we got.

As were Confucius and Frida Kahlo.

The whole issue with Harriet could have just been solved by making her a clone of someone else (like Billie Holiday or CJ Walker) the writers never did anything interesting with her being a clone of Harriet Tubman anyway.

They did say that the new clones were a separate project, so it's entirely possible there's two Tubman clones walking around. It actually could have been funny to have her and the Harriet from season 1 bump into each other to point this out.

@@snowbunnie1113 Literally I always make jokes that she could have been Rosa Parks and it wouldn't have changed her character in the slightest. She could be any dead black female figure from the past and it would have been no different than her being Harriet. Same with Confucius.

Apparently she’s shown being defrosted in the reboot (haven’t watched it). They need to meet

Who are even the new writers?

@@Denbortomalla People who grew up on tumblr, wattpad, and reddit

i agree to a degree but at the same time having older people (boomers) write teenage characters often leads to portrayals that feel dated or out of touch with the actual youth cosuming it. so maybe a collaboration would be ideal? where everyone gets input and can veto decisions. just a suggestion, idk if that would be an actual solution

Wait so the creators are actually gen zs and STILL depicted are generation incorrectly???

@@Denbortomalla dumb-asses who lack selfawareness

I havent even seen the og show and Im angry at it! Though, maybe I shouldnt be? I mean, Ive only experienced the first season through second hand clips (and this video) and Im about the age of the people rediscovering it, maybe Im somewhat part of the problem? this season still sucks lemons though

@@the6597 You don't have to be an og viewer to know season 2 is garbage. Honestly it makes you more qualified to take the piss as you're not effected by nostalgia. Not to mention people like you were the audience in mind for this season and ya'll still didn't like it. So everyone crying that old heads are just blinded by nostalgia can go right in the trash with clone high season 2.

​@@Caterpillartearsplease accept that other people may have different opinions than you, its a much better way to live than getting angry at everything you disagree with

That's not a fan, that's someone who despises said IP and wants to "fix" it to suit their ideology. That's how shows like velma are made, you think the creators of THAT show are Scooby Doo fans? Hell no.

@@Neoniq41 i should've put "fan"

Yep!

Agreed 👍 👍 👍 👍 👍 👍

He was part of the OG cast watch the original show he was a background character and I had some speaking lines. Sadly he's been reduced to a giant race joke.

you know what would be funny? if they did an episode satirizing school shootings (topher is the stereotypical “quiet kid”), but then at the last minute he stops himself because there’s too many minorities in the school and he doesn’t wanna come off as racist.

When someone showed me the leak I actually thought Topher already existed, and when I had to rewatch the first season I was shocked to see him nowhere

What about sun zhu, miyamoto musashi, or guan Yu?

@@zaptrapelectric2634 Diminishing returns come into play.

Buddha and Attila I thought were already background characters as well in s1. You're right, I can only think of those three off the top of my head. At least for ones who id recognize a caricature of.

Bro same. I literally call Harriet "CJ" in my head because it's just way more fitting.

They would have had way more comedic value if they would have gone with a Chairman Mao Zedong clone instead. Given he was a horrible historical figure and the father of the modern Chinese Communist Party/PRC especially with China’s rise to major world power in the last 20 years. He could have either subverted expectations by being anti Xi Jingping/modern China or leaned into his dictatorial “clone dad” and been used as a series antagonist. Confucius is such a lame historical figure to satirize. There’s nothing obvious there to poke fun at. Or they could have at least made him an overbearing teacher character who thinks they’re way more wise then they actually are constantly peppering in flowery poetic sayings that ultimately mean nothing or don’t have a place in modern society. The character they ended up with is so unbelievably lazy.

Honestly I could see his character working mostly as-is, but with just a few tweaks. He could want the same recognition that his clone parent got, but completely fail to understand WHY he was so revered in the first place. He could be smart, but completely socially inept. Thinking that he's every bit as wise as his clone parent, but also making the assumption that intelligence and wisdom are the same thing. So every attempt he makes to gain clout and fame through his "wisdom" falls completely flat on its face because his ego gets in the way of realizing that he has no idea how people actually work and thus, he gives the exact opposite message he was trying to get across.

@@NEETKittenmaybe have his terrible advice be taken seriously by the other characters because “he’s confucius so therefore he’s right”. the only one who wouldn’t fall for it would be cleo, because she knows how people work.

@@wren_. That would have been perfect!

Hallway monitor

more fanficy than that my immortal?

So much current media seems like fanfiction, all the social recluse fanfic writers of yesteryear have been given power to create and the result is this.

Calling this show fanfic-y is an insult to fanfiction writers because I have read some REALLY good fanfiction over the years that shows something can be good when you put a little effort into it, even when done by a fan. This show is just an insult to fanfiction.

I'm surprised they didn't use John Brown (JB) alongside Harriet, just change his hatred of slavery to bullying/discrimination, and also be the trope of guy who takes it too far even though they're morally in the right

@@drakunauger3324 Oh yeah, John Brown would've been fantastic. The guy was insanely interesting and...pretty insane, they could've done so much with him. Also, make the character have a fake giant puffy beard.

Probably no because this is entire history themed show, not 1/12 history. Might as well dig up whatever Swiss dude taught both George W Bush and Osama bin Laden at school, and make that a "historical" character.

They didn't really do a lot with the new clones relating to their originals, besides maybe Frida with her art. In the first season, half the gags were relating to their clone fathers/mothers and their fates.

They shouldve even made her stupid twister play into an actual meaningful play about who the original harriet was and what she did because she herself takes pride in her people and the things her clone parent did. Wouldve been a fun lil history lesson too

We can blame shorts format for this, this goes down to tik tok users butchering songs and removing the intro for the "good part" with no build up. Initially because they had to, but later because it was just how they did it

I think the character designs are a big part of this. The new clones don't look like they're from the same show as the old ones, because they've got way more contemporary designs, and the old clones got to keep their usual looks because they were already part of the Clone High "aesthetic", and it really takes away from the watching experience. What beats me is how the hell they thought the new clone designs wouldn't do this.

@@user-gp5yz5yz4x this gimmick has ruined music for me, it is absolutely frustrating. Still recovering tho lmao

One example is everywhere at the end of time or in a few cases miracle musical (yes I know a few more music ones)

And then flanderized her into a pretty popular crazy girl, undermining all her intelligence because pretty girls are all evil ??? Wow...... never heard of that one before

Futurama reference?! Pog!

A lot of current writers have the same emotional maturity and world views as annoying teenagers on Twitter.

Bingo

Pretty much

"capitalism bad" is it

@@kingofcards9516 who asked again?

so true, candice is just a pointless and annoying character

Yeah, at this point, I’m more interested in them than the students.

@@LoG_9961feels like a self insert for the new writer, cramming a glass ceiling into Clone High.

@@SchmergDergen damn that's probably true

@@LoG_9961 who's Candice? Ok I'll let myself out now

Yep, they complain about the dynamics of writer’s rooms from the past while making you yearn for writer’s rooms of the past.

In only the second episode they make a “joke” about the writers room of the 2003 show being bad because there was only *one* woman on the team. So what? The 2003 guys knew how to write comedy which was why they were hired! 🙄

@@snowbunnie1113 exactly, she was actually gifted a job and her resume speaks for itself… sexism or did she do really well for her talent level?

@@SchmergDergen she didn’t. The one woman from 2003, Erica Rivinoja, is now the show runner and she is well known for having more misses than hits and is probably the main reason why season two feels so off.

@@snowbunnie1113 yep. The privilege she has while still biting the hand that feeds is remarkable.

I dont remember them removing his er-uh

Funnily enough Total Drama creators have stated that they lifted art inspiration from Clone High (they're both Canadian cartoons), so it looks like it's come full circle lol

​@@samantharedacted9226how the turns tabled

It really was dude 😢😢😢

Give it a Chance season 3 will come out and they'll bring Gandhi back and they'll reveal season 2 was a joke 🥲

It's kinda more like a monkey's paw wish

@@IsaiahAmos017 A man can dream...

What's the point of this comment? You're just paraphrasing the video

Nah people can hate any character without missing the point

@@LonelyGamer4 dude shut up, im just agreeing. LMFAOOOO comment police

It would take more than a click on Twitter to come up with that. That’s why.

I saw someone comment that Harriet looks like a Total Drama OC and now I cannot unsee it. (Because it’s true)

Frida Kahlo was a really colorful person, so it makes sense to make her colorful. She was also extremely weird and eccentric.

Harriet feels like designed by 10yo deviantart artist. No offence to 10yo DA artists, but this isn't the design that even fits the show

At least Frida and Topher's designs are good and you can get somewhat of a sense of who they're supposed to be the same can't be said for Confucius and Harriet

Confucius' design is the worst character design i have ever seen, he's built like an umbrella.

oh she still had lines she compliments GFK right before the prom.

Lmao it was mocking the shitty reality tv that put people in awful situations for drama, they don't feel confortable risking the wrath of liberals anymore sadly ...

true. this and the creators losing their edge just makes the reviving of the show pointless ngl. like if they worry so much, maybe they should just leave the show alone in the freezer as it is i guess... just saying

That is just depressing to hear, so much for being "inclusive" those types of people are the ones infecting most modern media with their nonsense

@@Rex13013well remember what wise Sage Syndrome said “if everyone’s inclusive, no one will be”

Bruuuuuh ain't no way, that's so bad it sounds like a parody of LGBT activists, goddamn.

@@8nicopink868 Trust me, that college was full of some real backwards types, including this sophomore girl in my business management class who believed we didn’t need farms, because we get all our food from grocery stores. That situation halted our class’ dismissal and resulted in us spending half a hour to educate her on basic supply chains.

@@hiddendesire3076 That is just fucking insane. Seriously sorry you ended up in a college like that 🙃

That’s really the ultimate problem with season 2. The show was created to be a parody of teen dramas and now it just is one.

Don't you hate on Miraculous, it's a cinematic masterpiece.

@@princeimrahil6557 me when im lying

Hilarious? Its enraging, insulting, creatively bankrupt, generic but definitely not hilarious

@@snowbunnie1113 they should open season three with some sort of “and it was all a dream” line

The worst is when they act like she’s a better character now…

Yeah it wasn’t funny and they ran it into the ground, all because they had to get their views in AND reference a TikTok trend that died years ago.

@@SchmergDergen The Seaman song was a tiktok trend?

@@A23Channel1 sea shanties we’re tending on TikTok a few years ago, the same demo they yanked the show to pander to.

Honestly I found it pretty funny, and the Seaman song was catchy.

They weren't fans.

@@SchmergDergen They used elements that are famous within the Clone high Ao3 fan fic. by borrowing fan ideas for they show the show was been written by fans.

I've never watched this but Confucius has the WORST character design I've ever seen.

Same! Confucius is fine but not much to him, same with Harriet (no wonder they dated for 2 seconds)

Hate Frida's hands tho. Just seems really inconsistent with the female design rules in the show to me

Harriet looks like a Total Drama OC that was drag and dropped into Clone High, and I’ve also heard people say that Confucius looks like a Fortnite skin.

@@foxtoons1999everyone looks like a total drama OC

🗿

@@DarkenedOne🗿

Copy College

@@TheRealLifeKillerMoth Doppleganger School

Caricature Seminar Dead Ringer Extra-Curricular Credit

That's exactly what happened. Why doesn't this comment have more likes? It's so on point.

@plunkpianist Hi!

whatever matt and trey are doing certainly doesn't fit clone high. only south park can south park

namely homestuck…

​@lilacsbby4787 Oh yeah, the sequel that took the whole "Plot Hole" idea from the worst Channel Awesome movie.

See Also: Star Vs. The Forces of Evil

That sounds too much like Joan.

@icecreamhero2375 that is true, but considering the direction they took Joan in (her joining the popular group) I think it would be nice. Since maybe Harriet could help Joan have that "oh crap I have become what I hated" moment. Idk if I'm making sense haha but if they really wanted to keep the aspect of Joan losing some of her ideals that made her who she was season 1, I think Harriet would be cool to help her "see the light" bahaha.

@@spacefrog69 When I started watching the season I thought that was the point, that Joan was a poser and now, with popularity in her hands, she changed sides. Your idea for Harriet could work great, I can even envision an aesthetic of afroamerican ghetto/graffiti artist styles on her, but she needs defects (the point of Clone High is that nobody is a good heir of their genefathers, that everyone is terrible one way or another) and I propose her being too jumpy and ready to revolt (if the writers dared to do it, it would be actual social critique, but probably too touchy for today's America)

@enriquejoseantequerasanche6180 ohhhh yes, yes! That sounds amazing! I didn't even think of that. It's such a good idea, and it really does seem the writers wanted to make Harriet jumpy and excitable, so your idea definitely works! Thanks for your input. It added more depth to this idea!

So just another activist character? Lmao, amazing. Exactly what we need in modern Western media...

@@Caterpillartears you are a strange little man

​@@Caterpillartears it's almost like you did not watch it

This is truly fascinating I had no idea 👍

Yeah, exactly. Sometimes some things are just better left to move on from.

Are we getting a season 3?

@@donkey0303 I think they got commissioned to make 2 seasons, so a season 3 is already greenlit

I feel the damage is already done. Even if season 3 was better, it'd still feel off due to the direction season 2 launched it in.

@@oldoutlet6946 maybe if they open season three with an “it was all a dream” retcon of season 2

Season 2 and 3 for the reboot were made during the production of season 1 and I think they're almost fully animated too so no I don't think they'll improve at all

Bruh, you just brought back like, a long dormant memory when you mentioned those Say what Gandhi YTPMVs, I watched the absolute shit out of those when I was too young to be using the internet and like knew about those maybe half a decade possibly before even finding out what Clone High was.

I had no idea Gandhi or the “Say What” meme were from Clone High until I watched a video on the series by an old RU-vidr I used to watch.

I was with you until you advocated for gatekeeping. It doesn't work. People will just ignore you, and you'll look like an asshole. The writers chose to go with new fans' headcanons, and it's shit. Gatekeeping would not have prevented that.

@@ashtoncommittedarsonbutina131 "...you'll look like an asshole." Yea, I don't care about what some idiot with an opinion thinks about my opinion making me look like an idiot (I'm not referring to you). If people are gonna warp something I love into garbage, I'm gonna die on that hill defending what I love. What you're advocating for (intentional or not) is for the surrender of my thoughts to the masses and agree with the people just because of numbers. If people took an anti-war message and started warping it into a pro-war message, would you still use that argument to not gate keep an artistic message? I don't really care what it makes me look like, I care about the truth. Not to mention, this video is a form of gatekeeping, even if Just Stop doesn't want to admit it. It's making sure people understand what makes the show great and that other people's takes on it are not good. Gatekeeping isn't exclusively saying someone can't enjoy something. It can also mean preserving what makes something great and ensuring others do the same as well. Like I said, I hate telling people they can't like something, but I'm not just going to let people say things I believe to be untrue leave them untested, like Season 2 being good, or even just OK. "Gatekeeping would not have prevented that." Again, don't care. It's the ethics involved in preserving something, not about it's effectiveness. Once again, I'd rather die on a hill defending what I love, then just surrendering my thoughts to whatever the majority says. People can have their thoughts on something, but I can still say they're wrong and explain why. Holding the majority opinion doesn't make one right.

@@androzani I haven't heard of that definition for gatekeeping. Of course you're allowed to have your opinions and share them, and critique others' opinions btw just to be clear, when I said "you'll look like an asshole", I was using you in a people in general way. And when I said gatekeeping, I specifically meant gatekeeping in fandoms

Yeah like episodes 9 and 10 felt like they were going in the right direction for the series. It’s not exactly like what the first season 1 was but I feel with time they can hit highs as good as season 1 but season 2 isn’t it

IDK 20 years can really change a person and their writing style. Look at popular comedians and celebrities from the 2000’s like Seth Rogan or Will Smith - they’ve become shells of their old selves and have lost what made them popular in the first place.

Who the hell knows.

That's honestly a dumb excuse. Like this was more of a passion project that got another go after a random spike of popularity and the main writers being behind it wanting it back (while becoming insanely popular themselves). And after 20 years, a year worth of teasers, they couldn't have made sure their other obligations were done with beforehand to focus. Or at least been able to over see more then just the tail end of the project? Just seems weird.

@@NEEDbacon Actually, you have a very valid point. Those two have been talking about wanting the show back for years on end. They even freaking included a reference to the show in the first Spiderman movie, so you'd think they'd actually care about this.

Him being racist was also something that he grew out of.

I'm surprised JFK wasn't cancelled, based on Season 1, he seems like he would be the first one hit or right after

Yeah, I basically gaslit myself into liking season two, but I've broken out of that and realized how shit it is. I used to tell myself "well, it was flawed and not as good as season one, but it had its moments" but after rewatching a few episodes from season one and two, it's like night and day. I couldn't even finish some of the season two episodes, I felt embarrassed watching an unironic teen romance drama about real historical figures.

@pr3pkurz Did you also basically gaslight yourself into liking it?

Wasn’t it always an unironic teen drama since the beginning?

@@alexgomez6723 No, it wasn't and I'm not sure why some people thought it was. The entire first season was extremely tongue-in-cheek and self-aware. Everything was coated in layers of irony

You know that could be a nice episode that could make you feel bad about how shitty the boys world actually is.

@syrpwafy Oh yeah I'm a huge fan of the show, I think the main reason why most of the fans love Topher as a character is because he matches the same awfulness that the characters had in the first season, it's much safer to poke fun at him rather than Harriet Tubman who did such amazing things

Oh my god why

Wtf? Why didn't they do that with anyone else?!

Honestly having ANY writer hate ANY character should be an immediate no go. I can get having a character that's off to the side, or meant to be hated, but Abe was the main character. Who sure had flaws, but was part and parcel in being the MC. And was apparently hated for the stupidest reason of the writers not getting a joke. ANNOTHER notch for why they should have been hired.

It's a train wreck that you _actually_ want to look away from.

its as respectful as third birthday is to parasite eve, but atleast third birthday has a shitty dev cycle to excuse it being bad

It was because Christa Miller didn’t wanna voice a “POC” so they got an Iranian lady to voice Cleo and now she sounds as basic as ever.

Question, is Cleo's new actress a part of the voice cast because I'm sensing a pattern.

Ohhh now I hate the show even more.

@SchmergDergen then why the hell an iranian is voicing Cleopatra, who is supposed to be greek?

every time the mha fandom does fujo shit horikoshi decides to dismember miriko again.

Look at modern abridged series, it's always one note, oh we made them all a holes great writing, older abridged series with different characters having exaggerated extensions to their personalities were great. Creativity for fans seems pretty dead these days.

​@@PlsrateeightI think that's more a case of us only remembering the quality series instead of the trash that also came alongside the tropes

@@toekneemart5597 I'm not quite sure what this has to do with what I typed, yes there were trash series out there and most of the older series had their garbage variants, but most times every character wasn't one note even in the trash versions.

I think when people mention that, they arent talking about the fandom writing as a whole, but like the good 10% who do an excellent job writing fanfics of the series

It’s weird that they make fun of Topher for having “white guilt” and feeling victimised because of his heritage, and yet take every shot they can at white people (and only white people)...which ends up justifying Topher’s mindset.

@@snowbunnie1113man okay I kinda see what you’re trying to say but as a poc the white guilt mindset and similar such things topher displays just straight up really are super annoying and suck irl. Like I’ve met people like him and they are the worst. He’s a funny character, and I like him in the show, but saying that he’s justified in his weird white guilt mindset because the show made some white people jokes is kinda dumb

Right? If it’s funny it’s one thing but it wasn’t, they focused on Abe of all people isntead of JFK. How am I supposed to like Frida when she has the confidence to sing about her racist beliefs and cancel people.

@@nyxcat3621 as a POC myself, eff off. Applicability in media should not be ignored. They can't portray white guilt and then make fun of white people just like that. It comes as hypocritical. And the fact they're sincere about these topics doesn't help. At least as satire it would've made some sense, as these kind of hypocritical oximorons are becoming more and more common in modern narrative (being this reboot a good example).

​@@miserirkenyou clearly don't understand why people mention being PoC before describing their experiences. What you just said is literally just "well I'm poc and I don't like your take" whereas what he said is "as a POC, I deal with X a lot. And because of that, this is my take" the distinction here is that you're using your race to bolster your opinion whereas he was stating his race as a way to provide context to his life experiences. Please grow the fuck up.

im pretty sure a ton of people already have

@@nbewarwehonestly I just hear how much people “love” it. So to each there own I geuss

@@natsuki7325 Yeah, I'm the opposite. I've only heard people dunk on it. Maybe a few people say the later episodes are better, but no one say the whole season is good.

@@nbewarwe I've only heard people loving it or defending it hard so far barring this review.

No, mid is too nice, its bad