My favorite part of the Dark Imperium is how much Guiliman despises his own work. He knows it needs to be changed eventually. I do think it was initially a compliance test and was not meant to last 10k years.
Chris Coulson indeed. I need to do more reading, but I think Roboute deserves to have some Grimdark in his tale. He’s getting that soon. If they won’t do it, I will. But I’ll always flag that it’s just theory. I’m my mind - compliance test and something very dark indeed. But we’ll get to that part. Thanks for your suppport, Chris. It is very appreciated indeed. :).
@@kelman727 Well, we know Ultramarines are idiots. Not an original thought between them for ten millennium. And if someone did go off book ( Like Uriel Ventris) they gets kicked to the Eye of Terror.
Guilliman created the Codex based on the events of the Horus Heresy. After 10k years he deemed that it needed an update to deal with the numerous changes that he had seen since his return. Guilliman created it, he can change it.
The Codex is also the Great Crusade: the greatest hits. He took lessons from the other Primarchs and incorporated them into the work - Corax on using auxiliaries, Perturabo on siegecraft, etc. etc.
@@jackmyers8687 admittedly Guilliman is not the most original thinker of the Primarchs, this has always been his weakness and how other Primarchs defeated him in wargames. This does not mean he can't create new things, only that this is not an area where he is as gifted as Corax, the Lion or Horus. What Guilliman excels at is standardizing and improving. Seeing Corax's use of assault Marines gave Guilliman the idea of how they could be used. Then he standardized their weapons, equipments and standard operational patterns and then he improved upon them by giving them vast flexibility in terms of equipment and situational probability to maximize their effect on the battlefield and then he codified that into the assault squads we know today. 10K later his base opinions and ideas still work, so that tells you about his effectiveness and foresighted.
Interesting that Guilliman regretted putting ordinary humans in charge of Ultramar. As well as restoring it to 500 worlds, he’s been imposing Space Marines as its new rulers. The guy that said Space Marines were there to serve, not rule...
That was the plan, but the regular humans fucked up pretty bad over the last 10,000 years. But even as far back as the crusade he had plans to have the Ultramarines be statesmen and adminstrators when the crusade ended.
Timothy Lester Not the same thing as rulers or overlords, though. It’s been drilled into every marine since the heresy that the traitors turned because they wanted to rule instead of serve.
kelman727 True. The original idea was not for them to rule outright, but as we now have a bunch of superstitious corpse worshippers running everything into the dark ages, the choice to have his Marines rule directly was basically made for him. Until he can weaken the Imperial cult enough to have a revised “Imperial Truth” in power, he cant let a bunch of ignorant religious types get in the way of a functioning Ultramar. And if he can fix Ultramar then he can use the lessons he learns in the process to fix the Imperium at large.
I think it amounts to 1. Breaking it into individual worlds makes it less effective at dealing with threats, but is theoretically morally the better option [which can't be afforded] 2. If its not going to be broken up, it has to be run by genetically loyal servants of the emperor, because such a large realm couldn't be left to regular people for 10k years. Given a long enough time frame, entropy will eventually take it's course, no matter how many good governments come and go. I'm sure he believes that civilian rule is preferable, but that the Imperium simply isn't capable of fostering it. Rome had a DEEPLY ingrained Republican culture, and was only able to maintain that for centuries; what kind of a culture do you have to have to ensure that your semi-autonomous sector doesn't try to secede given 10,000 years in the context of WH 30k-40k? Essentially he was acting idealistically and regrets not being more pragmatic given what eventually happened to the rest of the Imperium.
True there is Loyal Primarch's currently M.I.A.. But I think that's a cheap shot ! We don't have all the answers to why those Certain Primarch's are M.I.A. And as for Roboute Guliman, he was foolish for thinking he could fight Fulgrim. And it's clear that Warhammer40k/ Gamesworkshop plays favorites for the Ultra Marines 🙄
Maximillian Rampertshammer it’s a fair cop, guv. (Passes Max the heavy flamer). Yep I deserve immolation for this one. Just wait for ‘Dark Prince’. Months off, so far it’s Looking rough for our Poppa smurf. :). Thanks for watching, Maximilian. Always. :).
Guilliman: Oh it was never meant as unquestionable dogma merely as a guide! It was meant to prevent another all out civil war by limiting the power of one individual. Said by the man who assumed a position leading the high lords of terra(a position that still bears his name). Said by the man who used that position to enforce the codex as dogma upon the legions of his "brother" primarchs with the threat of being declared traitor if hey don't(threatening to create another civil war). Said by the man who siphoned off reinforcements meant for Terra during the civil war to fortify his own newly created imperium instead. The codex succeeded. It crippled the imperiums ability to wage war so it crippled his main competition for power. Guilliman merely succeeded where Horus failed.
Inquisitor, this post right here. But seriously, that's an interesting take on Guilliman's actions and who knows, perhaps if he wasn't put down by Fulgrim I wonder what else he would have done to reshape the imperium.
It may just be my inner Nassir Amit talking, but uh... I doubt Sanguinius would appreciate the close-knit brotherhood that was the Ninth being effectively castrated and disemboweled, much less the Imperium being usurped from within. What Horus failed to do with a hammer blow, Guilliman achieved with a duelist's blade. Oh, and one more thing. Has the Lord-Commander not suffered enough? Has Dante not earned respite? Why place further burden upon his groaning shoulders? Why risk breaking the Imperium's gilded defender with the strain of fully half the galaxy upon him? It wasn't necessary. I say let the poor man rest. He's earned his sleep a thousand times over. I want to be proud of the Chapter Master and Lord of Angels - the Ninth are my Legion and chapter of choice after all - but it feels more like Guilliman wants to have someone to shunt the blame to if anything goes wrong in Imperium Nihilus.
The Codex has always made me think of the Washington Naval treaty. Washington has always been damned for not preventing Pearl Harbor...... and it did fail. What it didn't fail in was stopping the great Anglo-American naval war of 1929. The codex will/has failed, but it worked in the short term to stop what was coming sooner. I will neither applaud, nor damn, Robute for it, like I will neither applaud nor damn the first Washington treaty.
Ahhh the eternal question. What was the Codex actually for? I have about 6 competing theories at any one time. Love this setting. You honestly can see it from so many different angles. Magnificent escapism. Thanks for listening, chill. :)
I think Robute did the best he could. Part of what seems to be lost on so many of the Primarchs is that the Emperor never intended to micromanage human beings or to really rule them. The Imperium was not about dominating humans, it was about guiding them. Unfortunately the type of command structure chosen, one which encourages authoritarianism muddies that whole thing up. Hence the Heresy. The Emperor was meant to protect not to rule, that is why although he effectively maintained veto power he let the humans rule themselves. He at least partially understood that he doesn't and perhaps couldn't really understand the plight of baseline humans. Indeed this fact is a major reason why the Imperial Truth failed. The Emperor forgot that most humans live miserable lives of toil and fear death. He wanted to tell people "Life sucks and then you die." and expected them to be okay with that even when he knew that it was possible to reincarnate through the Warp; just that it was no longer safe to do so because of the growth of the Chaos Gods. (Particularly for Psykers.) What might have happened if he had said I am going to create a safe passage for rebirth at the very least, while omitting the Chaos God stuff for the peasantry? Robute meant for the codex to be a guide and not the word of god it has become for far too many. It was a reaction to the direct aftermath of a massive civil war, and must ultimately be understood in that context. Humans have forgotten the context behind the words and treated it as a talisman that will protect them if they blindly cling to it. So it is in this way that Robute experiences a smaller version of the failure of the Imperial Truth with his own work. Let's be real, the Lord Commander is going to need all the Astartes, Skitari, and people with functioning brains he can get to at least weaken the more fanatical elements.
The backing music is excellent in these videos, you always manage to pick something that sits in the background without distracting but adding to the tone and impact.
bmsr13 thanks Bmsr. I love Guilliman too. I just have a weird way of looking at him I think. I love the potential of a darkness in Roboute that he doesn’t even notice himself. It’s all just entertainment though. Glad you enjoyed it. :). Many thanks for your support.
Gavin Botha thanks Gavin. I try to make it entertaining but always try to let it be known when I am theorising. It’s fun. Thanks for your support, as always. :).
Blue Buda lol. I am hoping for some real fireworks when the Lion awakes. More tension, more conflict, means more drama. Yummy. Hoping Lion totally loses his *sugar*. Roll on civil part 2. :).
The first would just do it his way. Its not his way to just throw a fit. Just like when he rules Caliban. I think of how Typus thought about kneeling to Horus and when he saw the Lion he just did it by instinct. He is tarzan mixed with lancelot. Its the inquisition that would need to fear him not a loyal brother.
Baldermort: There is one treatise, one book, one tomb of wisdom, that is the most important, influential, consumed and quoted in all the history of Humanity. Imperial Citizen: Can I read it? Space Marine: No. Ecclesiarch: Wait, did that citizen just imply that they can read? Imperial Citizen: Um...no? *Inquisition has entered the chat*
I honestly do not believe that Guilliman ever planned on becoming the de facto Emperor and focused on cementing his power hold. I honestly believe that he was just doing what he believed to be right. Much like his father. And much like his father he, for all his power and wisdom, was still a man. And as far as I'm concerned, the smartest people tend to make the dumbest of mistakes. And now, 10,000 years later, Guilliman is forced to confront all of his mistakes and failings. Now he has to suffer as his brother Rogal had suffered. He now bears the weight of the entire Imperium on his shoulders. Fitting, isn't it? That only now can he truly appreciate the burden of command that Rogal had to deal with. How it must torture him inside to finally understand the brother he betrayed. Now it is his time to give penance. Just as it was his. The truly tragic thing is that the Dream could have survived the Heresy. Even with the loss of Horus, Sanguinius, and the Emperor. Guilliman and Rogal BOTH were experienced with growing and maintaining solar empires. One could say that their talents would complement each other entirely. If they had ruled together as the Imperium's equivalent of Co-consols, then the Dream really could have lived on. But pride, arrogance, and paranoia won out in the end... tragic. As the old saying goes: The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
So, food for thought. Funny thing is, I wonder if the authors who originally created Warhammer put as much thought into the backstory as much as us fans do? In any case, well spoken and well thought out. Thank you, Orator, you have done the subject well:)
At first, probably not. Ork lore in particular has pretty much always been built backwards to justify cool ideas. Ork WAAAGH! isn't the reason scrap titans hold together, Orkz have scrap titans that don't collapse under their weight, and if you really want to know why, it's "because WAAAGH!" At a certain point, though, I feel like people either got really invested in this or that, or newer folks weren't as keyed in to the ad-hoc nature of the lore and wanted to expand on genuine questions raised by the lore established.
Haha Guiliman playing the Long Game against his brothers is a pretty fun idea. He definitely seems like the type. It's one of the reason why I finally decided to do the ultramarine chapter as an army in the first place. I kinda like the master strategist character types. The one that can make even a failure look like it was part of the plan.
oh, if you liked that then you are going looooooove 'Dark Prince' when I am finally prepared to complete it. As long as people know its all just entertainment and fun, I am all good. Just never take my work too seriously. Its only entertainment and designed to be thought provoking - if I have the skill. Thanks for watching/listening. Really appreciated. :)
‘It’s Guilliman, what do think he’s doing? He’s building an empire.’ -Malcador In many respects I suspect the Guilliman is the most like the Emperor of the Primarchs. As he was designed to be.
Thanks, Stevo. Alas, I have no life. I can have one again if the channel grows or I quit. Hmmmm. Know which one I prefer to happen. In the lap of the (algorithm) gods I guess.
Your voice is like a cross between David Bellamy and Keith Szarabejka. Relaxing informative authoritative and threatening. Perfect for the stories you tell
A Codex Compliant Chapter reminds of a US Army BCT; small enough to do Combined Arms Warfare, but can have trouble with going against “Peer”/“Near-Peer” adversaries due to it not being big enough at scale- -at that point you need to “Re-Division”/“Legion-Up” to get to scale.
The fact that the primaris marines are basically ultramarine infiltrators in different colors is indicative. Replacing chapters with ultramarines aka the Bog Standard Marines.
Man I am now hype fir that second part. This really opened my eyes to the scale of the peculiar practice that is non-compliance. The Dark and Blood Angles especially I never considered the particular aspects that so make them closely knit enough that they are a legion in function, if not name. Another thing that really caught my attention was the "Ultramarines successor chapter not only outnumbering the others but all of them combined." I cannot over emphasise how disappointed I am whenever a modern chapter catches my eye, i look into them and they are almost always either from unknown or Ultramarine gene-seed. Now i like the Ultramarines fine. I'm not a smurf hater. But it's like in anything where you have a bunch of interesting options but the same ones always come up. To me i almostvimmedistly loose interest upon learning they're Ultramarine, with only a few exceptions who are either cool enough on their own or they break the mold of what a ultrmarine descendant is supposed to be. Now I have some suspicions about where you're gonna go with the next part but I'm not sure. Either way I just wanted to leave an observation that I have noticed in my own research. Yes, some chapters are so closely tied to their parent chapter that they could be considered part if the legion. I don't feel this is true for all Ultramarine chapters. Plenty of them either don't care, dont like the Ultramarines, or the Ultramarines dont like them. Amongst all the old legions they seem be the least cohesive as a group, or at least it should be taken as a given. In fact I suspect that more marines form Ultramarines stick have turned to chaos then any other gene-seed line.
OH, they made some real mistakes. GW tried to make RG into a total Mary Sue and icon. But if you actually analyze his work and its effects -erm. WOW! But people have pressured me into not making Dark Prince, as they say the Ultras already get too much stick. so its on hold........ Thank you for taking the time out to share your thoughts. :)
@@baldermort aww man that's a real shame. Yiu had such good build up and I got real excited. I hope you come back to it some day. Regardless of anything else I would want to hear what you had to say. Plus Robby G and his offspring are fine. They're the faces of the company. And fictional characters at that. I'm not sure I understand the notion that they can be ragged on too much. Maybe I couldbif there was any risk of them disappearing all together but that wont ever happen. They deserve all the memes we can make because we have to put up with them. I like the Ultramarines. Sometimes I feel like I'm the only person in the world that enjoyed RG's primarch book. But they are everywhere. Anyone complaining kn their behalf needs to calm down. They're the most protected faction in the setting. Plus you strike me as a guy who'd never bash a faction needlessly. I equally anticipate a Guilliman video singing his praises some day
@@Sternly But that's the point: memetic hatred eventually just becomes hatred as newcomers come in and eventually outnumber the old guard. And they never realize it is just light ribbing and not genuine disgust.
@@baldermort What? You aren't going to shed the light on papa smurf? We NEED alternate opinions and view points. Legends have a darkness in them. The brighter the light, the darker the shadow...
shopsmart57 well said. But the ultras are getting such a kicking that they end being ultra aggressive. Sigh. It’s a catch 22 situation. Bugger. I loved the ideas and views. I think he improves by having a dark side. But they don’t see it. They just see any and all shine removed as an attack. Honestly, you would not believe what they throw at me. I remove it. But it’s deeply unpleasant. lol. Poor sods. :(.
“Worshipped blindly”? Spoken like a true heretic that blindly followed Horus. A moment of laxity spawns a lifetime of heresy. I’ll be keeping an eye on you...*subscribes*
Are you shocked that a legion based around the ancient legions of old Romii have a Leader a Caesar if you well that would have ideas of becoming Emperor.
Except the guy always refused to take the throne back in Imperium Secundus, and openly said it's be foolish for the one to propose the idea to also take charge.
A minor update on Ultramarines numbers touched upon by ol Baldermort, this video is still a good watch regardless. In the recent novel Avenging Son: A Dawn of Fire we learn that Cawl made an equal number of Primaris from each Gene Stock. Meaning we also have potentially tens of thousands of Primaris Salamanders and Space Wolves. That's all really, have a good day.
There are several instances where guilliman refers to it as a reference and not some sacred document. It is the falterings of humanity into superstition that made it so inflexible.
I would be fine with the stipulation of 1000 battle brothers. If the codex specified that each chapter could potentially have a unlimited number of aspirant recruits . That way loses could be replenished more quickly and it would mitigate the risk of a chapter being completely wiped out. In times of great threat like a Orc Waaaaaa or Tyrranod invasion the chapter could come together to form a legion.the battle and veteran companies form the spear tip to crush the enemies battle lines backed up by the vast numbers of Aspirant squads that serve as reserves and provide additional fire power.
Zekrom249 alas, brother my eyesight isn’t great and my computer skills practically non existent. My ability to find good art is...... sketchy at the best. (Pun untended). :).
*Makes his own empire *Make other Primarchs break up their legions *Enlist Belisarius Cawl to make thousands of Primaris *Appoints himself Regent and Lord Commander (Twice) *Takes control of legion sized space marine force of his own design FUNNY GUY that Guilliman...
This is the one that i always return to. I've seen barristers who aren't as convincing as this gent. I'm looking forward to the day we get the analysis of roboute.
Good sir, you are besmirching the good name and reputation of our Lord Commander, Rowboat Girlyman, with this. I have let the local Inquisitor know about this affront to Papa Smuff.
One thing that is sort of my head canon is that adding more space marines to each other doesn't have an additive, or even multiplicative affect on their power, but an exponential one
So Robutt Gollyman wrote a book, everyone was happy kind of, then he came back facepalmed after seeing what happened and told Cawl to release the primaris out of their deep sleep. And everything got effed up. Codex was fail.
You also kind of bolster my theory that the Emp made Guillaman as a caretaker of sorts... Perhaps he spent the least time in the warp of the sons .. is there a chart on who stayed the longest? I know Lorgar spent a decade there but what of the others...?
Every empire needs a bureaucracy. :) Hmmmmm. I am not sure! Now that is a very well constructed query. I will have to look into that. I have a sinking feeling that Black Library may not have the times to compare, but its worth looking. Do please remember one tiny point about Roboute when found. He was bathed in a corona of power. I'd hardly call that purer than the driven snow. :) If you find a duration list before me, please do put it up. Tasty information. Thanks for watching! :)
I think the reason why Roboute Gulliman was so insistent on "Codex Compliance" is the same as the Emperor's insistence on secrecy of the Warp: PRIDE. Each man was so confident (the Emperor in his foresight, Gulliman in his geneseed and legion) that his own way of thinking could solve everyone's problems that they saw their plan as the ONLY sound plan forward. The Emperor didn't really have a lot of time to dwell on his failings, as the Horus Heresy (as far as galaxy-spanning wars go) was relatively quick. Gulliman, on the other hand, did. He involuntarily slept for 10,000 years, only to bear witness to the perversion of his father's dream. In addition, I think he (sort of ) understands the limitations of the Codex. Not just in the religious dogma some follow it by, but by what a singular chapter is capable of: Scouts CAN do recon/assassination, but they're really not great at it outside of fluff. The Vanguard "Phobos" forces seem more up to snuff. Plus, scouts can suppliment the phobos marines as they still can be used to train new recruits prior to them receiving primaris implants. Likewise, assault marines can deal with most chaff, but struggle against dedicated assault troops. Now, they have a few better wargear options (eviscerators), but also the Inceptors provide close range fire support to better soften enemy units so assault marines can finish them off, even jumping in as durable (T5, 3W) assault troops that can take more of a beating than their lighter armored bretheren.
@@baldermort well, from what I've seen ideas, experiences and viewpoints can and are passed along through Geneseed along with genetic quarks. Any "genetic flaw" could and some eventually would spread out across the entire legion. What do you think would happen if a legion was infected with the worst traits of it's successors? The Thunder Warriors were quelled because they were blood mad and broken could the Imperium afford to do the same to the Blood Angels if they became a legion of nomadic flesh eaters? Undesirable chapters are far more manageable then the armies of the Emperor.
I hope that Guilliman sees what happened to the Imperium as a result of the Codex and weeps at the shortsightedness of telling a man on the edge of an enemy's borders that he cannot have a sword because he could cut himself
Baldermort maybe you could clear this up for me as maybe my info is newer or very outdated but I was under the understanding that Guilliman wrote the codex during the heresy around the time of the founding of the imperium secundus in an attempt to do the impossible and defeat the numerically superior traitors who he thought (after the betrayal of the word bearers) had already defeated the actual imperium. Maybe I'm wrong or I misunderstood your explanation here/ you havnt gotten to it yet. Can you confirm or deny my understanding in anyway good sir?
I've never liked the Ultra Marines and Reboot Goldyman still hasn't gotten over the fact that he should have been (in his opinion) the warmaster before Horus.
You made Roboute more interesting with this one. I want to see how his specific physical capabilities and powers are in battle. It seems he never gets a good description in this manner. At least in my opinion
Sean Cook phew. Good! It’s all only entertainment and a way to get people to love their armies and the stories more. Roboute is a fantastic character. :). Thanks for watching, Sean. It is appreciated. :).
'The Codex Astartes does not support this action' During the First Damocles Gulf Crusade, Commander Farsight was able to actually figured out tactics and methodology of the Codex Astartes. He's counter strategy was so effective, that Imperial Forces on Dal'yth was on the brink of annihilation. During he's raid on Ultramar Warsmith Honsou's forces were able to cause a very significant losses to the Ultramarines and their allies just because by using only Codex tactics, Calgar forces reactions and counter strikes were very predictable.
Well said! Any rigidity in thinking or acting is a weakness. One that the Imperium has gotten away with so far, but that time is coming to an end. Damn, good quote and spot. Thank you!
Excellent video, sir as always. You brought up a great point with the 2nd part: Seems that very few if any of the first founding chapters really followed the codex. From lip service to “Hell No!” Only the Ultramarine successor chapters truly followed the codex to the letter.
Thank you, Mr Kesner. I just like to try to get something a bit more interesting and thought provoking into a video if I can. Not always easy, but I try. The Codex, like its author, are very complicated when you look at them from more than a baseline ' yep, Poppa Smurf is just wonderful' perspective. Treat him like a human, with layers and machinations that even he may not be aware he is performing, then it gets more fun. Thanks for watching, as always. :)
Many thanks. Alas, I tried to google Kaga and only found the original non-translated clips on youtube. My youtbefoo is weak. :P Thanks for watching/listening. It is very appreciated. :)
@@baldermort ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-KTQux3wAphU.html They used to completely dub over Chairman Kaga. In later episodes, they only dubbed over when he isn't standing in Kitchen Stadium. Even later ones dropped the dub completely. The first voice in this video is the one I'm referring to. "If my memory serves me correctly..." Also keep up the great work!
Also reducing our Navy to a shell of its former self and Lost The Imperium the ability to wages War for 10k Years if we had the Force of 30k we would've wipe the Tau of the face of the Galaxy eons ago now if we invade the Tau now our Borders will be wide open Leaving Terra open for Orks Necrons Chaos and the Tyranids to invade anytime they want.
Ah, I know what you mean. It is weird when people cage their own creativity like this. Each to their own I guess. :) Thanks for watching. It is appreciated.
The fact that it's now based on outdated lore has not dimmed my enthusiasm for my pet theory in the slightest: Guilliman didn't write Codex Astartes at all, Omgeon did. When Guilliman slayed Alpharius the Alpha Legion didn't flinch because they knew this was part of the plan. In reality, Guilliman lost that fight and Omegon took his appearance and command, assuming command of the Ultramarines so smoothly they didn't suspect a thing (it wouldn't have hurt if many of Guilliman's sub-commanders had already been Alpha Legion deep plants). Omegon then went on to write Codex Astartes so the traitors would always know the Imperium's playbook and they could raid and pillage as they wished, every counter-stroke known ahead of time. And that's why the Ultramarines sigil is an upside-down Omega.
@@piotrd.4850 As I say, it's based on outdated lore, from a time when it was the Alpha Legion not the Word Bearers that faced the Ultramarines, a time before GW awakened Guilliman. Against nullifications like that, the sigil predating the Heresy is a trifle: basically, says who? All the art? The depictions of Ultramarines heroics based on Remembrancer sketches from the Great Crusade? All that art exists now, in the 41st Millennium. Who says it hasn't been changed in the ten thousand years since all that stuff actually happened? ;)
THAT WAS HIGHLY INTELLIGENT AND DEEPLY ENTERTAINING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! U ARE THE GOD OF WARHAMMER STORY TELLING !!!!!!!!!!!! THE VOICE OF THE EMPEROR !!!!!!!!!! LEGENDARY LINGUISTIC !!!!!!! CYA 2 MORROW !!!
So rather than rebuilding the empire and continuing as the Emperor had willed, Guilliman instead betrayed the Emperor's will and destroyed all hopes of the future that the Emperor wanted to build. A far more effective betrayal than anything Horus and the Chaos Legions were ever capable of. Yes, he ensured the survival of humanity, but at the cost of turning the Empire into a nightmare that was the exact opposite of what the Emperor fought to create.
The Codex Astartes is not a failure by itself, but the sundering of the legions and the religious dogma that was applied to it, IS our failure! And continues to be our greatest failure...United we are strong! Divided we fall. And it is so much easier to divide when there are too many small kings and lords, and commanders. He was right at the time think like this, but in all his wisdom, he never had the foresight to see the simple analogy " if all you have is sticks and stones, then the enemy can only have sticks and stones" Once you define your forces and setup to one dogma, then you have already fallen, it might take decades or millennia, but the fall will happen. And the chink in your armor will just grow bigger with time..
I would like to hear from Lord Alpharius on Roboute and his Codex: "For all my brother's gifts, subterfuge is rarely amongst them. Roboute would never consider that by announcing himself, he gives his enemies a weapon. He lays down his tactics, disseminates them, trumpets them for all to hear. Do not mistake me - even knowing his methodology, an enemy would still be hard-pressed to best him, but with every battle he fights and every victory he achieves, his pattern grows clearer. Any army commanded by Roboute can be predicted. It may still emerge triumphant, but it is predictable. In the same manner, any enemy can know that the World Eaters will attempt to break them with brute force. That knowledge may not be enough to allow them to resist, but they know what form the assault will take."
Continued: ‘My point is that it is easy for Roboute to proclaim himself a mighty general when his troops obey his orders quickly, without question, and are singularly capable in all aspects of open warfare. He thinks that off the back of this fact, he can forge a legacy that will endure - that he can set down a method which any commander can follow and achieve the same results as he has. But he has not been tested against a superior adversary. One day, Roboute may face an enemy that will not engage him in the manner of warfare that he knows. His Ultramarines, the pale imitations of him that they are, may find themselves without his guidance, or find that what guidance he has left them is insufficient for the task. What will they do then, when the dogma they clasp so close to their hearts has failed them? When the commands do not come, or, perhaps more worryingly, their commander cannot be trusted? Will their spirit break? Perhaps, and perhaps not, but will they adapt? Of that, I am more doubtful. They will need to learn new warfare from first principles, and while they attempt that, they will be cut to ribbons.’
Your channel is amezing , best lore voice on youtube. So glad I stumbled upon it. Do you have patreon or something similar ? I would gladly support you to make more quality content
Valdimar Jónsson thanks a million for saying that, Valdimar. Can I ask how you found the site? I am not good at advertising and this could help. Only if you remember. Unlikely as that is. :). I do have a patreon account. If you go to my main page a link is in my picture thingy. Sorry, not great on a computer. But only if you want to do it. A watch and a comment/chat is just as important to us here. But of a tribe of really nice guys here so far. Something we are all trying to maintain for as long as possible. Hobby fun and hanging out only. :). Thanks for joining us for this one. I hope you like other offerings too. :).
@@baldermort I saw a comment on TheBorderPrince channel regarding your channel on making a co video with you. I will check your main page and I am looking forward in takinh active part in your community
Many thanks Valdimar. I had a look and saw the comment (because who doesn't at least dip into Border Prince - he's fun!) I did make a statement last night - on BPs site - that I would be up for a collaboration. Not sure he would be interested, but you never know. If we have a shared community then I see no reason we cannot give the gentle listeners a treat every now and again. But its in his court. Thank you for joining us in the community here. :)
Always follow. Can anybody tell me if this is true. Didn't Rogal Dawn make an addition to the Codex Astartes before he would ever break up his legion. The section stated that whenever the need arises a legion maybe reformed. Situations like the Ork Waa invasion of Terra or the invasion of Baal by Tyranids.
The Marine found a work around as they need to. The chapter heads understand what needs to be watched against. The codex is a minimum standard and primary outline of what needs to be avoided. The paths of the chapters might be broad or narrow or paved differently, but they go in the same direction set by the codex.
"Robute was left in charge of the emperium" No, he took power from Rogal with the threat of violence, being that he had the larger legion, due to "reasons".
As a guide to logistics and administration, it is unparalleled. Consider the source, after all. As a source of tactics and strategy it is undoubtedly useful. I would consider these its positive attributes. As for the negative, it did, in my estimation, work to break up the legions very effectively. The only legion that has managed to truly preserve its unity is the First. Even among other Legions that try to maintain unity, there is far too much divergence over time to work as a seamless whole. The Third War for Armageddon was a case study for this. Had one legion with that many companies come to Armageddon, the Orks would have been routed. Instead, there were dozens of independent Chapters using independent methods. Cooperation and councils are helpful, but no match for a unified command structure and shared internal culture/traditions. Further, the Codex worked to mark those who would not comply as outsiders. When new Chapters are founded, from whence is the geneseed drawn? Mostly Roboute's boys. Those who comply, such as the Raven Guard and the Blood Angels, receive some successors. Those who are suspected of Legion building, such as the Dark Angels, receive a few. Those who resist compliance, such as the Wolves and the Salamanders, receive none. Genetic incompatibility my ass. Settle some Fenrisians or Nocturneans on another planet. if the gene seed is so damn picky. It's about control. Finally, it ensured that, upon the introduction of the Primaris, he could effectively take control over all Astartes from within their own ranks. The Astartes were scattered, divided, leaderless and sabotaged by GW to ensure they could not resist his soft coup. For whatever it is worth, I see no villainy in the XIII Son. What I see is his biological father, so utterly convinced of his own rightness that he feels he must have his own way, to the point of megalomania. He has to control everything, not for power's sake or for his, but just because he can't stand to see things proceed in what he deems a sub-optimal fashion. He always means well, but there's a certain road paved with that...
Wasn't the earliest beginnings of the book also meant to cover states-craft? during the great crusade Guiliman had always believed that one day his sons would have to understand and know the empire building and diplomatic maintaining that he was so famous for, to find their place in a galaxy and amongst a humanity at peace. i suspect that before any possible redrafts he had truly believed that the marines and primarchs were to have their own place amongst mankind, and if not on Terra then perhaps amongst the 500 worlds. the thunder warriors would laugh at him from across the grave..
@baldermort I meant in the 10 thousand years since the codex was made. As the primarchs return with the ability to unite factions under one banner more and more opportunities for rebellion could arise.
OH, we;ll get to that, brother Turnil. I do have to get more introductions out of the way first. Gain more experience maybe. But hopefully not too long away. :) Thanki you for listening, brother Turnil. :)
Well its certainly time to bin the CA, Every chaos warband, army and pirate knows it and knows how to counter it. I can recall several times in books that the CA has cost whole squads of Marines.
