You missed a pretty big part about the Let's Go games. Red and Blue are not the protagonist and rival of those games but are NPCs. Chase and Elaine are the names of the protagonists and Trace is the Rival. They go on the same journey that Red and Blue have in the other timelines. Red and Blue seemingly went on their own journeys previously. However, since the Let's Go protags are the ones who deal with Team Rocket, it seems they went on a slightly different journey then their counterparts of other timelines. That means, the Red and Blue of the mega timeline could still have had their journey in 1996. But the events of the Let's Go games could have happened much closer to Ultra Sun and Moon as Red and Blue are older and with the aforementioned appearance of Mina.
Yeah, LGPE can pretty neatly be placed at the latest in the 2009 if we go with the assumption that Red and Blue started their journey in 1996 at 11, did the journey up to defeating the Elite 4 if not Lance as well, Trace says that Blue defeated the Elite 4 "years ago" that could be 2 years to who know how long. So maybe LGPE is around 1998~2009... BUT the real answer comes in if we think Mina is 19 in 2015 then we can place LGPE in 2009
@patrick you should make an updated version of this video, with the given information above along with other comments I read from others on here, and also after POKEMOM ZA
Don’t remind me Don’t remind me of how I named the rival Blue only for Blue to show up later in the story prompting me to quit playing the game altogether because I didn’t want 2 characters with the same name
43:46 u say that as a joke but in b2w2 drayden says he didnt have pokeballs when he was younger even tho legends arceus comfirms that they have existed for a least ~150 years so assuming drayden isnt like 200 years old u can assume that unova has always been pretty disconnected from the rest of the regions
Interestingly, in PLA Pokeballs are presented as commonplace in other regions like Kanto, where they have a Pokémon League already set up. It's possible that either Drayden sounds even crazier then or Unova was one of those place where Pokeballs were introduced much later.
@@Ditidos Maybe opelucid city and drayden specifically were more disconnected considering its focus on valuing old things and the past in White & White 2. While the rapid growth of Black & Black 2 happened long after his youth.
Poké Balls have only been around since 1925, so Drayden's statement is a lot more reasonable, and Legends Arceus can only take place no earlier than 1925.
I think you’re making a lot of unnecessary assumptions from the 96 on USUM Red’s shirt. It could instead be his birth year on this timeline. Even if it is the year he started his journey, LGPE has new protagonist/rival characters and only features Red and Blue as secondary characters, which explicitly puts LGPE after Red’s journey. You can totally justify LGPE being on the primary mega timeline.
Amazing video! I must say one thing though, regarding the ”Pokedex expansion”. After gens 1 and 2, the implication has not been that the new generational Pokemon are ”recently discovered”, so that should not be a factor in the timeline placement. This note came to my mind when you used this point to refute the idea that BW2 would be at the same time as XY. All the pokemon that new and are revealed to us every generation, have existed all along in the pokemon world, we just havent seen them as they are not habiting the older regions. In other words, when Red was choosing his starter at the beginning of the timeline in FR/LG, some kid in Unova was choosing his Unovian starter and was ready to capture all the 150+ Unovian Pokemon that he has been accustomed to living there. And at the same time there is some kid in Sinnoh/Alola/any other region, was traveling and catching the local Pokemon as well. Going back to Unova, its whole lore was that it was so far away from other regions that almost no other region’s Pokemon were living there, thus BW1’s lack of old Pokemon before post game. It means that Unovian Pokemon have always lived there and not just recently discovered species. Same with Sinnoh, Alola, Kalos, etc. Also, obviously now we have Hisui which is way before FR/LG and the sinnoh Pokemon (+other region Pokemon loving there) existed were know about already. So in a way, Pokedex expansion and the total number of National dex kind of breaks the 4th wall and is not actually ”all known species in the world, at this time”. Sinnoh very much existed with its Pokemon during the events of 3rd gen games, yet its Pokemon were not in the national dex of FR/LG and R/S
Also regarding mega timeline, and fairy type. To me, Sycamore’s statement of Kalos only Megas, and Fairy types being recent discovery + the tweet linking XY with BW2 could suggest the followong: XY are actually part of the ”non mega timeline”, and it is ORAS, that actually start these ”mega timeline” shenanigans. Now hear me out. In the non mega timeline, Megas are only in Kalos, which is the reason why they haven’t been seen in any other game so far, and why Sycamore doesn’t know about their existenece in Hoenn or other regions. Fairy types also being an recent discovery could mean that the distinction between some Normal types being Fairy types actually etc might not have been streading all over immediately, explaining why BW2 didn’t have them yet; the Fairy discovery might have been made in Kalos, since there are some Fairy types like Flabebe which was mentioned together with the type reveal, and that is why they were classified there but not in Unova yet. And the total number of Pokemon in national dex isn’t really an actual factor like I explained in my original comment above. Now, it is actually ORAS and later some other games like BDSP that start making things weird not only because Megas are now in both Kanto and Hoenn too, seemingly even before the events of the Kalos games, and so are Fairy types. These factors could indicate that in the Mega timeline, not only are Megas much more spread out to the world, the lore for it is more spread out to the world too (for example Rayquaza is the actual first Mega Evolution that happened, while in XY it was implied to be Lucario, in Kalos) but it also seems like Fairy types were discovered muuch earlier already in that timeline, which is why they existed already in ORAS and BDSP. BDSP didn’t have Megas, but could be that Sinnoh is just left out of that party unfortunately at that time period. S/V in this scenario could be in either timeline, as Roaring Moon’s dex entry is talking about ”phenomenon in another region” which is clearly talking about Kalos, so it could be the world where Megas are Kalos specific, but could also be in the world where Megas are everywhere (this would however beg the question why are Megas not appearing in Paldea if it is close to Kalos?) BDSP must happen at the same time as Johto events still because of the Red Gyarados tv report, and for some reason I have hard time justifying ORAS just randomoly being much further in the future this time, after the events of of Johto and Sinnoh. Yes, some of those elements suggest that Hoenn is advanced in ORAS compared to R/S/E, but some events are also more or less identical to the old games, like the actions of the evil teams etc, and some events are even indicative that ORAS takes place before the events of Emerald, like Battle frontier still being under planning (even the Battle Tower was just a concept still, which existed already in R/S), Steven still Being the Champion/Wallace the Gym Leader, and the meteor containing Deoxys still coming down from Space (compared to being already on Birth Island). For those reasons, I believe ORAS does take place around the time the orignals take place, but in this Mega timeline Hoenn has big part in the Mega lore, and Fairy type was discovered much much earlier, maybe together with all the other types, which is why even Hisui has fairy type classification. And BDSP/Johto happen after ORAS like normal, and so on. With this idea, Mega Timeline Kalos could be very different from the Kalos we got to experience. Maybe much more is known about the phenomenon as it is more spread out, maybe Fairy types existence wouldn’t have been brought up because it is just an old type like any other. Just some thoughts that came up, thanks for reading if anyone did lmao.
@@grydon6422I completely agree. I didn't understand why he said that the gen 1 and gen 2 games were in the same timeline, while B2/W2 and the X/Y games were not just because the former didn't have fairy types in t. Gen 1 didn't have steel nor dark types.
I'd argue that because of the presence of sylveon and other fairy types in PLA you could place the version of XY that we play at the same time as the "non-mega" B2W2 and have an altered version that matches up more to every other game in the "mega" timeline wherein fairies have long been known about but were predominantly researched in and just before XY
Legends ZA will most likely include fairy types (in the same way every other Pokémon games does now), so if LZA happens to take place in the past that would mean we would have a new version of present day Kalos where fairies have been long known. That way, we could safely place XY on the "non-mega" timeline.
I always thought that gen 1 to gen 6 (in its original state of ultimate weapon being fired) narrative timeline could still work since nothing in XY itself implied a mega timeline and non mega timeline which only became more fractured and confusing because of USUM and ORAS. Even mega evolution on a gameplay level in XY was setup as something of a rare phenomenon that not many trainers had plus the lack of fairy type and megas in BW2 and older games is just simply a gameplay limitation (even then XY only established fairy as being recently categorised not that it didn’t exist at all, its like how steel and dark didn’t exist in rby but nothing contradicts their existence) rather than a narrative one so it shouldn’t be taken literally. This also would fit with that Masuda interview with not taking the timeline too rigorously as they the games generally provides some outlines but certain things that would contradict things typically are gameplay things. Personally I think the timeline probably would be simpler if ORAS, USUM and lets go were disregarded or isolated completely leaving just the classic og gen1-2 and the most extensive one with gen 3-9 (without ORAS, USUM and lets go) as those three games are more responsible for causing the biggest narrative headaches in this series.
I share the same opinion as you, specially since megas aren't a thing in gen 8 and gen 9 implies it's exclusive to another region. Not only that, but ORAS gives an alternative origin to megaevolution tied to Rayquaza and another meteorite if I remember correctly.
The biggest wrench in any timeline is always going to be X and Y. I'm like 80% sure the mega timeline wasn't a thought yet when X and Y were being developed. Because of this, Fairy gets treated like a new thing in only this game. PLA allows you to get fairy moves and evolve eevee into sylveon which makes no logical sense if the fairy type is new by X and Y. It's a similar thing with Mega's, you get an immediate retcon in ORAS that Hoenn has them like 7 years earlier or however long makes sense. It's my personal belief that there's another timeline which is essentially just the non-mega one, but X and Y occur as we see them. It's the only way to make sense of the contradiction inherent to X and Y's offness. At least until Z-A hopefully explains or gives insight into these contradictions.
I had the same thought, XY do fit quite nicely with all the previous generations, with the Fairy type being new + Kalos exlusive megas. It’s ORAS and then some of the other games like PLA and BDSP that mix things up as they are earlier in the timeline but have fairies/megas etc, which should not be the case
The fairy type is a bit of an anomaly with PLA but even in PLA and bdsp, they could easily explain it by having the people at those eras thinking and categorising them differently at the time like some as normal types or pure typed etc in the narrative sense (mechanically still operate as fairys). A key point to consider that is important is that XY mentioned that it was recently “categorised” as a new type. It’s like how pluto was once a planet but later on was then re classified as a dwarf planet. The type technically still exists but poke scientists only fully agreed on its categorisation at the time of XY and said reclassification took a bit to fully catch on worldwide. Megas on the other hand can also be seen as something so rare that the amount of people who had it and were knowledgeable about it were far and few between at the time so its easy to simply assume that the characters of the old games never encountered it at the time of said games story. The game even mentioned that trainer in the past achieving mega evolution with lucario ORAS on the other hand is too much of a contradiction on a fundamental level as it not only contradicts the older gen games in various details but it contradicts the games in the same generation way too much. It really cant work and has to be isolated to make the timeline coherent and not a mess
@@davidgarcia9503 Like, i personally always classify the timelines like this Basically, all the timelines start with Kanto, but the events don't run parallel. Timeline 1 - The Original timeline - Red/Green/Blue, Gold and Silver, Ruby and Sapphire, Diamond and Pearl, Black and White, X and Y, Sun and Moon, Sword and Shield and Scarlet and Violet Timeline 2 - The Third Version timeline - Yellow, Crystal, Emerald, Platinum, BW2, USUM Timeline 3 - Remake timeline - FireRed/Leafgreen, Heartgold/Soulsilver, Brilliant Diamond/Shining Pearl, Omega Rub/Alpha Sapphire (Discovery of Mega's in that timeline, hence the exclusion in BDSP) Timeline 4: Lets Go timeline Timeline 5: Legends Timeline (Hence the inclusion of the Fairy typing early in this timeline) Timeline 6: The timeline referenced in USUM, where the evil leaders won.
I don't know why people worry so much about Fairy Type when building timelines on Pokemon. Just because it had been discovered in the future that doesn't mean it didn't existed in the past, it doesn't even make sense that only in recent times people found out that a Jigglypuff is unaffected by a Draco Meteor? Same thing apply to Gen 1 and 2 with the addition of Dark and Steel, how didn't anyone found out that a Magnemite can't be poisoned? Type is something way more gameplay related than lore related and shouldn't get that much attention in the process of building a coherent timeline.
is this a joke? most fairy type pokemon were normals for decades. fairy is new. they retroactively made things like jigglypuff a fairy type. Fairy was added to make the typings more competitive.
@@dogsbecuteit is. I think he's asking about in-universe. Because that shit bothered the fuck outta me about X and Y. I get walls of texts about the origins of Mega Evolutions and how to use them. But all I get for fairy types is "Fairy types exist now, bye!" With zero in-game explanation of why Pokemon I've seen/used for 14 years between Gens 2-5, have been A. hiding a second typing or B. got retyped all together. Granted this is a major nitpick (especially for a game series aimed at children). But God damn was it infuriating/immersion breaking when I first played Y.
For mega timeline Red, it seems bold to assume it was suggesting the year 1996 purely from text on his shirt. It could be “gb” resembling the original console.
Doesn't it makes more sense to put X&Y, Sword&Shield and Scarlet&Violet in the non-mega timeline and assuming that Sycamore's words on megaevolution being Kalos exclusive is true while BDSP, ORAS and the gen 7 games (including Let's Go) happen on a diferent timeline where both the fairy type and megaevolution are things neither recently discovered nor exclusive to Kalos respectively, more so since in ORAS megaevolution is due to Rayquaza hypercharging Deoxys' meteorite and destroying it before it reaches Earth 1000 years ago rather than AZ's superweapon charging the stones in Kalos 1000 years ago. For Let's Go, being the same timeline as the other gen 7 games and ORAS, the Red and Blue of Let's Go already finished their adventures quite a while ago over being the protagonists, so taking Mina's age into account seems like a more uselfull piece of information to use than Red's shirt to dismiss it as a diferent timeline, in my opinion.
The problem with that is PLA has you very obviously document fairy types in some vague past in Sinnoh. So this splits Scarlet and Violet into timeline two by default because Laventon is shown as part of the history class, and Scarlet and Violet very clearly happen post Sword and Shield. X&Y do more easily fit in the non-mega timeline, though. Maybe the non-mega timeline Scarlet and Violet just... don't have Laventon, or this Laventon finished the Dex in a world where he didn't learn about Fairy types. Though yeah, assuming Red's shirt having a 96 means what year his adventure took place in is a big stretch. Especially when Let's Go very clearly shows Red can't be the Kanto protagonist that beat Giovanni given you do that in Let's Go which is a game you can meet Red in.
Yeah the PLA fairy type is a mystery. Could be explained away similarly to BDSP but also could be explained away through some accident with Laventon's research. Maybe a proper comprehensive record of his findings never made it through whatever the fuck happened in Pokemon history between the end of PLA and the beginning of the modern games. Who knows? Can only speculate for now.
@@davidgarcia9503 Yeah, but it's not that unlikely to think that the events of Legend Arceus happen only in the Fairy timeline (I'm gonna call the timeline where ORAS games happen the fairy timeline and the one with the other gens as the non-fairy timeline since it's more descriptive as fairies are new in one but not in the other) while the non-fairy timeline has Laventon documenting things without the interdimensional stuff, thus without your help (or Ingo) and no fairies to speak off. Heck, now that I think about it, it's possible that this time shenanigans is what creates the timeline split as the one in where the protagonist fall in (presumably the D/P/Pt one) and thanks to their increased Pokémon knowledge notices the fairy type creating the fairy timeline or could even come from after the discovery of fairy types, but that's unlikely as it would imply only a 4 years difference between B2W2 and DPPT, unless we assume that the rocket grunt's child in BW is not his biological children, for example if the mother already had a kid before meeting him.
@davidgarcia9503 Laventon being shown in S/V has nothing to do with the topic. Laventon could still exist in this theory, in the non mega timeline where Fairy types were only discovered recebtly during XY time. This would just mean that Sylveon either wasn’t in Hisui in that universe, or it was mistakenly classified as Normal type like so many other Fairy types. It’s even pink like many normal->fairy types like Clefable and Wigglytuff.
@Ditidos Mega evolutions origin was not changed in ORAS, not sure where you got that story from, I’ve never heard anything like that lol. The small lore change was the fact that Rayquaza was actually the very first Mega Evolution to occur, instead of a Lucario in Kalos, and it happened 1000 years ago without a Mega Stone when people were wishing for Rayquaza’s protection when Kyogre and Groudon were rampaging and stronger than ever. However, Rayquaza’s ability to Mega evolve naturally was due to its diet of eating Meteors in space, but it is strongly implied that it might have been the Ultimate Weapon’s launching to space and back during the Kalos war that affected the Meteors in close by space to give this reaction, just like the energy crystalized to mega stones back on Earth. So the origin is the same, it’s just that Hoenn has much more of a role in the lore of Mega Evolution.
It’s always a treat to come across a great video like this one and see a small subscriber count. Why you may ask? Because when he’s got 100k I can say I was here since 1% of that 😂
I feel like the assumption that the 96 on reds shirt means his adventure was in 96 is a stretch. Also this completely ignores the existence of fairy’s in PLA. I’d personally assume that X and Y as we see it is in a weird alternate timeline where fairy’s are new information and megas are Kalos exclusive, and there’s some unseen equivalent to X and Y in the mega timeline which doesn’t have this information. Either that or PLA and Scarlet and Violet have a seperate timeline.
Yeah the fairy stuff would mean that PLA BDSP SWSH SV would have to be on a different timeline to the Gen VI and VII games. Totally agree on that as a viable interpretation. Depends on how strong you lean in on the gameplay continuity > narrative continuity. Even though the fairy type was only discovered recently in the mega continuity, you'd have to assume it always existed. So I take the stance of the fairy type just exists for gameplay reasons as it doesn't really interact with the narrative (100% on this for BDSP - 85% on PLA). As for the 96 on Red's shirt in SM - yeah I agree, it's nothing definitive. It could just be SM Red's favourite number lmao. It's not necessarily relevant for constructing the continuity though. I used it cause I wanted to date every game with a year in every timeline haha.
I think of the Pokémon universe as being a location based multiverse, that as long as you travel far enough you can enter other universes. Essentially that they're spread out beside each other rather than stacked on top
The years being confirmed is a first for me, nice work. As for the types and numbers on the dex, I think those can just be brushed as retcons, since all the professors have their own pokedex inventions independently of oak except for elm, who works with him. this means events in non mega games can happen in mega timeline, just adjusted for fairy type.
47:45 What about the possibility of the mega timeline having a few events shifted forwards in time again, and '96 is just the year of Red's birth? I think that would be kinda funny in a meta way.
55:38 Great video. Is it maybe possible to combine the Mega and LGPE, and OG timelines? Is there something in LGPE that says it happened in 1996? What is stopping LGPE from happening much closer to Sun and Moon? Does anyone give a date for the in-game events?
Nope, its all speculation. Like, its kinda impossible to determine a timeline anyways, due to us getting many references in games relating to previous games.
I've been trying to plot out a full timeline with ALL possible splits (from the version you play, to the protagonist, to your starter choice, ect.) for a while now, and this video has helped a lot with providing new info. To explain what I mean, you actually mentioned around 14:02 about not being able to "draw straight lines" between specific versions, but it's not impossible. At the very least, we can disprove certain connections. For example, in Heart Gold you can find Kyogre at the Embedded Tower, after the events of Hoenn have occurred, but Kyogre is never awakened in Ruby, only in Sapphire and Emerald. This means that any timeline with Ruby on it cannot lead to Heart Gold, only Soul Silver, and vice versa with Sapphire, while Emerald could lead to either. In the same vein, if we dip into spinoffs for a bit, Ranger features both Groudon and Kyogre, and even mentions that they're in Fiore to heal after a battle they had after being recently awakened, meaning Ranger can ONLY exist in timelines containing Emerald specifically. Another interesting thing to note is that Mega Salamence is only referenced in Violet, and not Scarlet, which makes me wonder if Scarlet could theoretically exist in a no-Mega timeline. The founding of the Academy was like 800 years ago, making it one of the earliest known splits in the timeline, and I'm not sure what was responsible for the name choice between Naranja and Uva, but maybe Megas had something to do with it? Who knows. The funniest thing I've realized during this endeavor however is the fact that the split caused by the Ultimate Weapon 3000 years ago might not even be the earliest point that a split occurs, for a pretty bizarre reason. In Moon and Ultra Moon, time is inverted, meaning that AM and PM are swapped, the date changes at Noon instead of Midnight, ect. This is a fundamental difference in the very reality of the world compared to every other game in the series, meaning that these two games CANNOT coexist with ANY other game (or even with each other, due to all the plot changes in Ultra), and thus must take place in their own timeline where the the time & date system were invented differently way back in 1500 B.C., and/or the entire planet's rotation was somehow de-synced by 12 hours at some point, which is just wild lol.
The problem is that Scarlet still references Sonia's book and we know that Sword and Shield are on the same timeline as the Alola games, due to the Alola games mentioning Power Spots and Galar referencing the Aether Foundation by giving us Type: Null
Tbh, Rainbow Rocket is a bunch of Gym leaders who all succeed their plans from alternate realities of Gens 1-6 (Which is featured in Episode RR). Cyrus’ timeline would be right there with the other evil teams.
I haven’t finished the video yet but when you mentioned the guy in black and white that thinks of the other version of opelucid city in either the sequel or in the same game he views the other version tyranitartube shows this event on a video about this concept from what I remember Edit: should mention that i also think that the differences between the dual games usually doesn’t matter
This was really good! I’ve been working on figuring out a lot of Pokemon lore, and the only important thing you understandably skipped over in this from what I can tell is Pokemon Masters EX. That game may be a spinoff and a mobile gacha game, but all of the information the characters say about their pasts and histories can and should be taken as canon, because through interviews with the developers we know that they are only allowed to write characters in ways approved by Game Freak with accurate information and references. By using their info, we can even determine which specific game versions and protagonists were canon, which I personally take to believe are the “true” versions of events- kind of like how it’s always Red that was the Kanto hero even if you chose to play as Leaf. The game confirms that the true canon versions and protagonists of each region are: - FireRed, Red - SoulSilver, Ethan - Omega Ruby, Brendan - Platinum, Dawn (I choose to take this as a BDSP-style Platinum, or at least one that just so happened to have some of the connections to PLA) - Black, Hilbert - Black 2, Rosa - Y, Serena - Ultra Moon, Selene - Sword, Gloria - PLA, Rei - Scarlet, no protagonist confirmed so far Masters also confirms that in FireRed’s time (which for this case I take to be a Mega Timeline version of the game), the protagonists of Let’s Go also exist, having adventure after Red did. But because Red already defeated Team Rocket, their adventure in this timeline isn’t the same as it was in Let’s Go. They still actually have their Partner Pikachu and Eevee though.
Hi, Kiskeym here! Great video, and thanks for the mention. Feel free to reimagine other articles in video format as much as you want, it only makes me happy if more people can get to them in one form or another. ^^ I've seen many in the comments being a bit dubious on LGPE placement in its own pocket timeline, and I can see why - even in my article I gloss it over rather quickly, and I should probably expand it a bit. As you said, Mina's age in LGPE and SM makes impossible to reconcile the two iterations if the former still takes place around the same time of the other Kanto games. Even assuming she is 13 in LGPE and 19 in SM, that would still leave a maximum of 6 years gap between the games. So... why can't LGPE just moved forward in the timeline like we did with ORAS? The reason is, this would still had them placed after ORAS, while Blue comments the Pokédex as something Oak finally was able to make: "And hey, that thing you've got there... That's a Pokédex, right? So Gramps finally went and made one! He used to make me just scribble on a map with a pencil about where I encountered Pokémon... You'd better do a good job helping him out! He may be Professor Oak to you, and sure, he's an old coot, but he's still my gramps! Smell ya later, newbie!" The Pokédex in LPGE is a new device, and coherently so it has its database only updated up to 151 Pokémon, while ORAS model gets updated up to gen VI. Likewise, Red and Blue are the only characters who visibly aged in SM, implying a lot more passed compared to the barely noticeable Wally. Moreover, Red and Blue mention having been the Kanto champions once, while they never reference such event in LGPE, while our rival still found no one after Lance strongly implying the role to be vacant. BDSP seemingly kept all cross-generational references of base titles, including Rowan working at his Pokédex with Oak, meaning this can't happen before Oak invents his in Kanto. With all the hints to Sinnoh being contemporaneous with Johto also being kept [eg.: Red Gyarados is still being filmed, Jasmine still decided to travel in Sinnoh] , it's safe to conclude a Johto version in the Mega Timeline also occurs at the same time of BDSP, carrying the necessary implication of a three-years [or at least a similar one] jump between Kanto and Johto due to their nature of sequels. Indeed, LGPE Sabrina still has a premonition of a new Trainer challenging her in three years, as a nod to our second trip to Kanto, so the events of Generation II definitely did not unflond in LGPE yet. All this makes impossible to just push LGPE forward to harmonize the Mina problem. Regardless, I think it's fair to displace the games just looking at their nature. These are titles meant for newcomers, especially carried by the Pokémon GO wave and accordingly present a completely different style for catching and training Pokémon. As always, changing continuity is more of a tool to add new concepts and ideas rather than a super-well-thought narrative scheme. With this, if they ever decide to continue the sub-series and make a Let's Go Johto and then a Let's Go Hoenn, they won't have problems to fit the games compared to already established titles like ORAS.
Hey, glad you enjoyed it! Crazy that you stumbled across this. I actually had a whole different script in the work unti I stumbled across your work on reddit. The more I consumed the more I realised you are more well read then I could ever be and thus my script became an ADHD injected interpretation of your article. Thanks for the go ahead to do more like this! Also, I have a burning question, how do you go about finding quotes? I noticed quite a few of your arguments have causal chains that often rely on quotes from random NPCs which I feel like I would never be able to conjure into my mind when theorycrafting. Do you do playthroughs with the specific goal of recording quotes and then add them to some sort of repository or do you just have a mad memory haha? Would love to know if you have a system or resource or something that I've just totally missed apart from bulbapedia. Tracking down and confirming some of your quotes and claims was a struggle to say the least! But you were 100% right down to the punctuation everytime! Anyway, love your work. Glad you enjoyed the video.
@@PATRICKurmom When it comes to analyze a particular game I do replay it and take notes, yes. Definitely not a good memory, on the contrary. :') Moreover, I have some textdumps to check if I missed something, although gen IV and V are more disorganized. I can send you some in private if you want!
Amazing video !!! Glad the almighty algorhytm suggested it to me! 2 small things i noticed werent mentioned : -Mauville city in ORAS is singificantly more modern than its RSE versions, so the fact that they take place later, closer to X and Y and modern cities as seen in black and white. - while its probably... forgettable and a mess to place in the timeline, we do find red, blue and even green in lets go pikachu, but they are already their grown up version , and not the 10 years old version that we find in RBY , FRLF. Its entirely plausible then than the 1996 on red shirt is its year of birth ( and ofc a reference to the first games in the series but am talking lore wise) , making him 19 yo in 2015 when SM takes place , and putting the lets go titles probably before that . Now if our favorite stoner fairy type captian is 19 in usum, aka the last year she can be a captain, that means she would be 13 in 2009 , which would put the game after the discovery of fairy type , but still would not explain how Kanto only have 150 pokemon in its pokedex , as it would be after gen 6. That is probably somewhat easy to explain tho, by mentioning the fact that the pokedex only records pokemon native , or at least found, in kanto , and since that would be the 1st time we go there in the Mega timeline there are no conflits with jhoto mons being found there in GSC. And we simply didnt get a national dex with other pokemons in lets go like we do in other games. Even paldea doesnt give the player a national dex, as most pokemon only available in events or transferable dont have pages in the pokedex anyway.
There are real world references up till Gen 7, Raichu’s entry still mentions Indian elephants. Wally’s appearance can be chalked up to him being very sickly making him not grow much taller. Let’s Go probably takes place a few years after Red and Blue’s journeys taking place before the game and that the 96 on Red’s shirt is probably a birth year. 8and 9 is probably its own timeline. Roaring Moon’s entry doesn’t really confirm anything just that it is connected to Salamence not necessarily its mega. The BDSP Pokédex can just be a gameplay mechanic thing
From the beginning I imagined that Let's go would be apart from the rest, but to be fair, we didn't handle Red, we encountered him and faced him later, I mean, Red could easily do his Pokémon journey in 1996 and it wouldn't affect Let's go, the which happens some time later
Best placements of certain spin-off games: Colosseum and XD: Gale of Darkness are probably both sometime before D/P/Pt; and Colosseum is 5 years before XD. All three Ranger games are before D/P/Pt due to Manaphy in the first Ranger and the Griseous Orb in Guardian Signs. Also probably after R/S/E due to Groudon and Kyogre in the first Ranger. Go is after US/UM narratively, as its Giovanni is the same one as those games. Though, it's a different universe from the main games entirely.
Great video dude, i really enjoyed it. I personally never found the Pokemon timeline that confusing, i also would personally put BDSP in it's own timeline but that just my take on that.
Since Megas are referenced in Scarlet and Violet and Sw/Sh's events are also referenced, either a version of Sw/Sh with megas happened or Sw/Sh is in the Mega timeline.
Sugimori said they keep things vague intentionally because the mystery is more fun and that’s how games they grew up with were like and they wanted to keep that alive
I think Red having 96 on his shirt might not be the year of his adventure... if anything, wouldn't it make more sense if that was the year he was born? Or perhaps just a sort of throwback T-Shirt? If we assume a Mega version of the Kanto Events is happening concurrently with ORAS, then Mina being around 13 years old then would still line up fine with USUM being a total of 7 years later, as she'd be JUST on the threshold of stopping being a trial captain, which I think informs her character a lot better? But I think the other problems we run into with a lot of these later games, the farther we run into modern games, we run into them being products of Crunch as well? BDSP is so frustratingly clear that it is a crunch job, which I hate because I wanted it to be so good, but, regardless, yeah I have no idea in that regard.
Someone mentions that the Blueberry Academy existing for around or more than 10 years and Drayton being a second-year student for 3 or more years. Though, DLCs are inconsistent and can range between years or seconds in between the game (Sword, Shield, Scarlet, Violet)
i like your video and everything but if you’re going to have your speaking voice volume pretty low, you can’t have this 46:26 be extremely loud, i had the volume all the way up on my phone because i can barely hear you, like no exaggeration it makes me want to turn the video off
Interesting video. I myself tried to figure this out a while ago and came up with several timelines. I didn't make a video, but an image. This is what I discovered: For starters, the version-exclusive Pokemon determine which games are connected to which timelines. Growlithe, for example, are all a part of the Red/Gold timelines. While Vulpix is part of the Blue/Green timelines. This applies to legendaries you can get outside of their native region as well. Third game expansions count as their own separate timelines, like Yellow/Crystal/Emerald/Platinum. Secondly, there are different multiverses and this was confirmed in OR/AS. There's at least four major multiverses: the **Classic** timeline, on the Game Boy games, the **Advanced** timeline, which are generations 2 through 5, the **Mega** timeline, which are generations 6 up to Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon. And the current **Switch** timeline, which are of the Nintendo Switch games from Let's Go Pikachu and Eevee onward (the Switch games all being separate from the previous timelines, having a completely revamped TM numerical system, accessible PC boxes anywhere, no HMs, mandatory Exp. Share forced onto players with no way to turn it off, limited RNG for wild battles in tall grass, and for the most part, no Mega Evolutions.) All of these changes - typically for the worse - heavily imply all of the Nintendo Switch games are not in the same timeline as the Mega universe, especially the new TM classification order and the new battle mechanics. The version-exclusive Pokemon mostly remain consistent throughout these timelines, letting you know what games directly connect to their sequels. I can't show you the image I made, but it looks like this: CLASSIC TIMELINE A: JP Red/Gold CLASSIC TIMELINE B: JP Green/Silver CLASSIC TIMELINE C: Red/Gold CLASSIC TIMELINE D: Blue/Silver CLASSIC TIMELINE E: JP Blue/Crystal CLASSIC TIMELINE F: Yellow/Crystal ADVANCED TIMELINE A: FireRed/Sapphire/HeartGold/Pearl/White/White 2 ADVANCED TIMELINE B: LeafGreen/Ruby/SoulSilver/Diamond/Black/Black 2 ADVANCED TIMELINE C: FireRed/Emerald/HeartGold/Platinum/White/White 2 ADVANCED TIMELINE D: LeafGreen/Emerald/SoulSilver/Platinum/Black/Black 2 MEGA TIMELINE A: Omega Ruby/Y/Moon MEGA TIMELINE B: Alpha Sapphire/X/Sun MEGA TIMELINE C: Omega Ruby/Y/Ultra Moon MEGA TIMELINE D: Alpha Sapphire/X/Ultra Sun SWITCH TIMELINE A: Legends Arceus/Let's Go Pikachu/Brilliant Diamond/Sword/Scarlet SWITCH TIMELINE B: Legends Arceus/Let's Go Eevee/Shining Pearl/Shield/Violet The anime specials bridges some of these past events in new timelines that didn't get remake games, like Pokemon Origins showing you some of Kanto's events in the Mega timeline (Red's Charizard can Mega Evolve), Pokemon Generations showing off Johto, Sinnoh, and other regions during the Mega Timeline, and Pokemon Evolutions showing off older regions during the Switch Timeline. You got the gen 5 years REALLY wrong, though. It's only a five year gap between gen 4 and gen 5. The Rocket Grunt also probably already had his girlfriend before he got married, so could've conceived his son only a year later. The Pokemon World Tournament also doesn't show Red as a mature adult by gen 5; he's still a teenager, likely between 16 to 18. A few obscure Pokedex entries, like Porygon's, also confirm gen 5 takes place roughly around the same time of it's then-present year; meaning 2010-2011. Lastly, there was one reference (I forget which) that said Legends Arceus was _specifically_ 150 years in the past from the gen 8 present (150 because of the original Pokedex number.) Most of the games take place in the equivalent present year as the real world. So that would place Legends Arceus around the year 1869, which is also the real world period of the Meiji era of Hokkaido development in Japan, which was from 1868 to 1912.
Haven't seen the video yet, but I'll say now what I roughly interpret the timeline to be: Legends Arceus --> Red/Blue, FRLG, Let's Go Pikachu/Eevee are three split timelines that also got split and Yellow is one more split of the timeline that didn't split Red/Blue leads to Gold/Silver, the primary Red leads to Gold and the secondary Blue leads to Silver. As does FRLG with HGSS and Yellow with Crystal, however Let's Go comes to a halt. Since Gold/Silver can't connect to gen 3, we'll assume that the Red/Blue split of the timeline stops with Gold and Silver and Yellow with Crystal. For now. Ruby/Sapphire are inbetween FRLG and HGSS and Emerald is too. Emerald splits to HGSS, while Ruby leads to HeartGold and Sapphire to SoulSilver. HGSS splits to Diamond/Pearl and Platinum, where Platinum is where the two timelines meet, and Diamond and Pearl is where they continue to split. BDSP does exist but we'll get to that. Platinum splits to Black/White which continues on with Black 2/White 2. Diamond with Black (2) and Pearl with White (2) and now the timeline is roughly sealed as for DPPt. It then splits to X and Y, and no Z to seal the timeline. X splits into Sun, Y splits into Moon, and after the VC release of gen 1 and 2, you could transfer pokemon from gen 1 and 2 to gen 7. So the Red/Blue timeline returns and so does the Yellow. Gold continues on with UltraSun and Silver with UltraMoon. Crystal however splits between the two versions. USUM leads to Sword and Shield, Sun and Moon does too, so the timelines are now sealed, which then follows through to Scarlet and Violet. ORAS appears to be separate universe from the universe in our timelines. In the Delta Episode, the Devon Corporation planned to use the dimensional shifter to send the meteorite containing Deoxys to an alternate reality. But Zinnia stops them. This allows the Ruby and Sapphire timeline streams to exist. As there was no Deoxys event. However Emerald does have a Deoxys event. Meaning there was possibly an alternate timeline where Zinnia couldn't stop the Devon Corporation and Deoxys landed in the Emerald Timeline. In fact Deoxys also is also found in FRLG. Which means there would be two other ORAS timelines which take place in the Kanto region. So that means there are two timelines where Zinnia succeeds and saved the Hoenn of the core timeline. However, there is another timeline where she couldn't save the Hoenn of the core timeline. And two more timelines where Zinnia couldn't save the main timeline and Deoxys was sent to two Kantos in the core timeline, which means in one split of the timeline we got fucked over twice, and in two timelines we got fucked over once. Anyhow, each of these timelines would seal themselves together with BDSP. Well, sealed into two splits. However, in BDSP you get Arceus by completing Legends Arceus. So the 4 ORAS timelines, now sealed with BDSP, would later not neccesarily seal, but connect with the main timeline, as the protagonist of the ORAS timeline travels to the Legends Arceus timeline and creates the first core timeline. This means ORAS was actually the beginning of the timeline. Ok this last one made this all so complicated. Tl:Dr ORAS -> BDSP -> Remake Kanto -> OG Hoenn -> Remake Johto -> OG only Sinnoh -> Unova -> Kalos -> OG Kanto and Johto go to Alola's USUM timeline, while Kalos continues with SM -> Galar -> Paldea
I think XY is in its own offshoot timeline. The whole thing about how 'the Fairy-type was just recently discovered' just doesn't track with how it's portrayed in later games. If in XY's continuity, the Ultimate Weapon was a little weaker, then its effects would be less widespread. Thus, Fairy-type Pokémon and Mega Evolution still came into existence, but they're much rarer and possibly completely non-existent outside of Kalos. This would actually allow XY to coexist alongside the events of Gens III-V without raising questions about why weren't seen before, and also works as an explanation about how they could've been only recently discovered (at least, by modern science). Frankly, the only thing that stops me from putting them in the Non-Mega Timeline is Zinnia's quote about a world without the Ultimate Weapon entirely, which obviously can't coincide with XY. Classic Timeline: Gen I and II. GBA/DS Timeline: Gen III-V. XY Timeline: Literally just XY. Modern Timeline: ORAS and onward.
There are two things you need to know : One, you apparently forgot that the Mystery Dungeon games exist. You see, the Mystery Dungeon games are canon to the mainline games, and we know this because Sinnoh Folk Story 3 mentions that there was once a time when humans and Pokémon lived close to each other, ate at the same table together, and even married each other, and that this was normal because there was no differences to distinguish the two at the time, which perfectly matches what life looks like in the Mystery Dungeon games, and the Mystery Dungeon games are known to take place thousands if not tens of thousands or even hundred of thousands of years before the events of every other mainline game, with Red and Blue Rescue Team and Rescue Team DX taking place 1000 years after the Ninetales legend, Explorers of Time and Darkness and Sky taking place 2 years after Rescue Team, Gates to Infinity taking place 5 years after Explorers, and Super taking place 3 years after Gates, and with Red and Blue Rescue Team, Explorers of Time and Darkness and Sky, and Gates to Infinity being on the non-mega timeline, and Rescue Team DX and Super being on the mega timeline. And two, your timeline placement of Legends Arceus being in the 1860s doesn't make any sense. First off, Poké Balls are known to have only been invented in 1925, meaning that in the 1860s there were no Poké Balls, and second, even if we account for that fact, say by having Legends Arceus take place in the early Shōwa period (i.e. the late 1920s and the 1930s), it still doesn't account for the many discrepancies and plot holes that Legends Arceus have, there's of course the implied existence of some modern tech, but there is something much more important to adress, a plot hole, specifically one happening near the end, because the story of Legends Arceus is very similar to that of Explorers of Time and Darkness and Sky, especially near the end, where you need to defeat the big bad (either Primal Dialga in the case of Explorers, or Volo is the case of Legends Arceus) to prevent the bad future from happening, and once you defeated him, you prevented the bad future from happening, however, this is where the similarities end, as after preventing the bad future from happening, in Explorers, which as we've established before, takes place in the distant past, because you come from the bad future, you start to slowly disappear into nothingness because by preventing the bad future from happening, you've essentially created a grandfather paradox and prevented your own existence from even happening, whereas in Legends Arceus, you don't slowly disappear and you instead simply continue to exist, implying that you don't come from the bad future, which itself implies that Legends Arceus can't take place in the past, because if it did, you would've indeed come from the bad future, and there would be one more similarity with Explorers, which isn't the case, and with that, the only reasonable option left is for Legends Arceus to take place in the post-apocalyptic future, which finally fills the plot hole that we're talking about, as with Legends Arceus taking place in the post-apocalyptic future, it means that you don't come from the bad future and that you instead come from the past, and because you come from the past and not the bad future, after you defeated Volo and prevented the bad future from happening, you don't disappear and you instead simply continue to exist, and this post-apocalyptic placement of Legends Arceus also resolves the many discrepancies of the past (pun intended), however, the fact that Legends Arceus takes place in the post-apocalyptic future also implies the existence of an apocalypse that set human technology back to pre-industrial levels, somewhere between the events of Scarlet and Violet and those of Legends Arceus, which is actually an opportunity, since we get to fill out more of the Pokémon timeline, especially on the future side (no pun intended), therefore, Legends Arceus takes place in the post-apocalyptic future, either in the 22nd, 23rd, 24th, or 25th century, but not the 26th, since Legends Arceus can take place 499 years after Diamond and Peral and Platinum and Brilliant Diamond and Shining Pearl at the latest, because the Spiritomb Pokédex entry in DPPt/BDSP states that Spiritomb was bound to a fissure in an odd keystone 500 years ago, and that Vessa says in Legends Arceus that hundreds of years ago, Spiritomb was sealed away, meaning that if Legends Arceus took place 500 or more years after DPPt/BDSP, Vessa would've said "(over) a thousand years ago" instead of "hundreds of years ago", as 500+500=1000, meaning that Legends Arceus takes place 499 or less years after DPPt/BDSP, and since we know that Diamond and Pearl and Platinum and Brilliant Diamond and Shining Pearl takes place in 1999, it means that Spiritomb got sealed in 1499, and it also means that Legends Arceus can take place no later than 2498, therefore, Legends Arceus can take place anywhere from 2100 to 2498. But otherwise, your Pokémon timeline is a pretty good one.
I feel like the timeline isn’t as complicated as it’s made out to be, like the whole fairy type being new and mega in kalos and the new Pokémon appearing out of nowhere are only are just retcons at this point, they always existed, just like dark and steel types.
There’s two timelines a lot of them take place around each other also there’s some multi verse stuff it’s not that confusing there’s a reason people don’t talk or complain about it as much as people do the Zelda timeline
I think we’re mostly in agreement on what these timelines look like. Another good way to tell the general time frame of a game (at least for the earlier ones) is the technology they’re using, like how the Gen 3 remakes of Gen 1 use technology much closer in look and function to when they released, in 2004. I would say the biggest point of contention would be XY. Imo, it makes more sense for the XY we play to be on the “non-mega timeline” contemporary with B2W2, with the recently discovered Fairy types and Sycamore’s line about Mega Evolution. Meaning that it’s not a world where the Ultimate Weapon was never fired, and more just one where it’s effects haven’t been seen until a much later time. Therefore: A.) The version of Hoenn Zinnia is talking about in the Delta Episode is another version entirely, not literally RSE. I feel like having to disregard Sycamore’s lines as retconned over believing that Zinnia is referring to a world that isn’t RSE for the Game Boy Advance that we specifically played is slightly more grievous. I don’t think there’s anything that outright says Zinnia is talking about RSE, just the implication. B.) this would also mean that ORAS has its own version of Kalos that Mr. Bonding goes to and that has all its ties to Hoenn. Personally I think that’s why we aren’t getting a Kalos remake and getting Z-A, because if we were to see the Mega timeline version of Kalos, Mega Evolution would have been common knowledge and not something Sycamore would have to discover like base XY. Hopefully this interpretation makes sense? The Mega Timeline is better defined as “the timeline where mega evolution was discovered a long time ago, to be around for Rayquaza’s legend and Z-A” and the non-mega timeline is “the timeline where mega evolution goes mostly undocumented until around B2W2 when Sycamore begins serious study of it, and also it’s pretty much exclusive to Kalos for the moment.”
The thing is though If we place XY on the non-Mega timeline, the Alola games are also on the non-Mega timeline, due to Sina and Dexio directly referencing the events of Kalos in XY. Considering Sword and Shield references the Aether Foundation and Alola referencing Power Spots, Galar also needs to be on the non-Mega timeline. And considering we get Sonia's book in Scarlet and Violet, that one is on the non-Mega timeline as well. The simplest explanation is that there simply isn't a Mega timeline, but that all the Original Generation games (So all the games that start a new generation) are all on the same timeline regardless, while a second timeline exists for Third versions, a third timeline for remakes and a fourth timeline for the Lets Go games and a fifth timeline is a Legends timeline).
How does such a high quality and well written video only have a couple hundred views? Great video, I especially loved the real world explanation behind why the developers made certain choices!
On the topic of BDSP, if we take the very previous games into account, Dexit was a thing, so we can almost just say that BDSP having 493 is a Dexit thing and that's just a Regional Dex, not a National Dex. The thing that breaks this is fucking Sylveon. Eevee is able to learn Fairy Type moves, so why can't it evolve?
They need to fix this by making 2 main timelines. 1 that ties in all the current games and keeps building on that. And a completely new one with a definitive game/remake that actually ties into a chronological order and is all in the same style. There's always some slight differences between the counterpart games and the definitive game, with this there will be no canonity issues. Furthermore, the definitive versions have always been my favorites. Currently there isn't an easy way to play the older games without piracy, this will give new and old players a chance to explore the kanto and johto region again without having to buy an older system specifically for that game And we can all agree sinnoh deserves another attempt at a remake...
I consider Colosseum & Gale Of Darkness canon. They don't conflict with anything in the core games and can still be stories that don't affect the core story. There is one *small* reference to Gale Of Darkness' Kaminko in B2W2, but, it's more of a reference to his failed Pokémon Translator. Basically, there's a guy who is running a building Castelia City and he wants to make a device so Pokémon & people can understand each other better. It's a more *indirect* reference to Gale Of Darkness & Subtle enough no one would get the reference. Also, Wes' actions in Colosseum are basically up to interpretation. Is Wes stealing Shadow Pokémon and purifying them to make up for his past thefts or is he doing it just because he planned on double crossing Team Snagem? I'd say it was done to help a friend learn about the Snag Machine technology so he could make his own. That friend being Professor Krane. Here's my timeline: Legends Arceus ---> Yellow/ Emerald ---> HGSS/ Platinum ---> Colosseum/ BW ---> Gale of Darkness ---> B2W2 ---> XY ---> SM ---> Sca/Vio [Prologue] ---> Teal Mask Story ---> Main Story ---> Indigo Disk Story ---> Mochi Mayhem Epilogue Sword/ Shield, Crown Tundra & Isle Of Armor aren't in my Pokémon Story timeline because I skipped them. Now, they obviously happened, but, my character just never *visits* Galar. Also, the Ranger Games are *somewhere* in the timeline, but, It's impossible to place them because they can go *anywhere.* So, this is my interpretation of the timeline. I think Pokémon Company wants US to see OUR adventures as canon and build our own timeline of what we think the story should be as we leave out the weird ones like GO, PMD & Snap. Also, with the exceptions of traditional Gyms & a Pokémon League Structure; Colosseum & Gale Of Darkness can trade with the core generation 3 games, have main series mechanics & are RPGs.
About the Mina stuff, I think it makes more sense to place Let's Go in the Mega Timeline rather than its own separate because of two things: First off: As mentioned by other commenters, Red and Blue went on their journeys sometime prior to LGPE, but they still look to be fairly young. If we take Mina's age to be 13-15, and 19 in SMUSUM, set in 2024, then LGPE could happen at around 2017-2018 (matching up with their release period). The 96 on Red's shirt doesn't necessarily mean he started his journey in 96 either, but perhaps he could've been born in 96 or it has some other connection to him not related to when he started his journey. For instance, that could've been the year his father graduated from university or something and it's a way for Red to remember him, as there is no indication in game of what that shirt is referring to beyond the assumption we have based on our knowledge of the original timeline and it being an easter egg for fans. Secondly: I could see Mina being an exception to the retiree age considering Poni Island is not very inhabited like the other 3 islands to the point where they were out of a Kahuna for several years and not to mention, Mina doesn't even have a trial in Sun and Moon. She could very easily be in her mid 20s. My guess is Mina, Red and Blue are pobably all around the same age, perhaps Red and Blue are bit older, but I think that's a bit up in the air. Blue certainly acts a bit older and more mature in Let's Go and we know he traveled to the Kalos region at one point prior to Let's Go, so it probably has been few years since his first journey. One last tidbit that throws a bit of a wrench potentially, but also not necessarily, is that 20 years prior to Sun and Moon there was a trainer with a super strong Pikachu that caused Mimikyu to well, become Mimikyu. This could be referencing Red, pegging his rise to fame in 2004, and a few years prior to Let's Go which couldve occured between 2006 and 2008. This time range would peg Mina around 29 which, as I've stated before, isn't out of the realm of possibilities due to Poni Island being Kahunaless and having a low population for quite some time prior to Sun and Moon. There are several ways to fit this in ways that are less contradictory than the Fairy type existing in BDSP. I'll also say Opal, the Fairy Gym leader, in Sword in Shield was a gym leader for over 50 years prior to SWSH, and unless she changed types it's possible that Dexio and Sina were simply referring to only Kalos adopting the Fairy type recently. Perhaps during the time of BDSP Kalos did not officially recognize the Fairy type as a type but as a separate classification much like Sound moves. Legends Arceus even has Fairy types, so i think this is really the only way to handle this and I think it's kinda funny to think how there could be frequent debates on the validity of Fairy as a typing. I mean Nidoran Male and Female still have seperate dex numbers despite no other gender differences having something like this, so, clearly, the way classification is done in this world can change over time. Sycamore needs his funding cut. I will say this in defense of Sycamore though... When he stated that Mega Evolution is Kalos only phenomenon he may have not meant as literally as it may sound. For instance, for all we know, Mega Evolution may be a phenomenon almost entirely in Kalos, at least as far as Key Stones go. While we do find Mega Stones in Hoenn, it is never stated where any of the Key Stones came from. Key Stones, aside from the one rare instance in ancient history where Rayquaza Mega Evolved, which is a story that would be hard verify beyond the fact that Rayquaza has Mege Evolved in the modern day, never are mentioned to have originated from Hoenn. Dynamax in Sword in Shield is mentioned to be Galar Specific phenomenon yet G-MAX Melmetal was a legend hailing from another region, as in, in Gigantimaxed outside of Galar. Meaning, Dynamax is reffered to as Galar exclusive, they probably mean about 99% of the time and that the certain phenomenon that created Dynamax *can* happen elsewhere just for all intensive purposes it pretty much only happens in Galar. This is what I think Sycamore meant. As far as Sycamore is concerned, especially as in that scene you were *overhearing* him talk to Diantha, so perhaps the player missed additional context prior, Mega Evolution is a phenomeon that can only happen due to Key Stones explicitly found in Kalos and Mega Stones that have only appeared in either Kalos or Hoenn, so regardless of where you get your Mega Stone, you cannot Mega Evolve anything in the modern day without an item only discovered naturally in Kalos. Much like how Blue go his Key Stone from Kalos is Let's Go, Steven probably got his as well. We also know Archie and Maxie were initially part of the same organization at one point, which considering how their motivations both overlap to a certain degree (especially Maxie's) with Lysandre, they could of both easily have been members of Team Flare initially explaining how they have so much knowledge about Mega Evolution.
Let's Go is easy to put on the mega timeline, and it adds a LOT. Sure, his shirt says 96, but does that mean that's when he started out? No. And, Red never took down Team Rocket or caught Mewtwo: Trace did. This makes Kanto's story much more different, and, by extension, Johto's.
Id rather assume the 96 on reds shirt in alola is just a reference rather than assume it hard confirms mega red started his journey in 96 so lets go red cant be the same red because you assume it takes place in the 90s so mina cant be the same mina from sun and moon. If jasmine can travel back and forth between regions whenever we arent looking, then red can wear a shirt with a 96 on it as a cute easter egg and not hard call it evidence of timeline placement
Just because they do not understand the ramifications of the Link Cable does not mean it is not the case. They could have accidentally stumbled unto timelines and not entirely realize the ramifications, which I think is the intention with Zinnia's warning. Some of the real world references from Generation I are retained even to this day, so not exactly the strongest point of division, overall, on its own.
"There should be fairy types" The thing is steel and Dark were a thing in GSC but not in RBY yet they're in the same timeline, so it doesn't seem that broken to me Seems like another one of those gameplay things that are just meant to be accepted despite lore difference
Try puzzling the anime timeline then you will truly have a bigger headache, especially since the anime is confirmed to have many timelines diverging from each other.
14:13 exclusive pokemon for each gens are a big clue though, especially for Jotho. if you can't find growlithe in blue's version of Kanto nor silver's, then it means the two games are linked with each other, and not blue with gold or red with silver
Here is the thing BW2 doesn't need to have the Fairy typing, as its just recently discovered in Kalos Then placing ORAS before Kalos is problematic as well, since Kalos recently discovered Fairy typing, meaning ORAS events have to be after XY, cuz ORAS has Mega's. The discovery of Fairy typing, exactly placing XY on the non-Mega timeline. Basically here is the timeline Timeline 1 - All the Original Generation games (Read - Games that start their generation) Red/Blue/Green, Gold and Silver, Ruby and Sapphire, Diamond and Pearl, Black and White, XY (With the discovery of Fairy types), Sun and Moon, Sword and Shield and Scarlet and Violet) Timeline 2 - The Third version timeline - Yellow, Crystal, Emerald, Platinum, BW2 Timeline 3 - The Remake timeline Timeline 4 - Lets Go timeline Timeline 5 - Timeline referenced in USUM, where the Evil leaders won Sword and Shield are in the same timeline as SM and USUM no matter what, since the Alola games reference Power Spots and Sword and Shield references the Aether Foundation.
You can actually create more timelines 3 more to be precise by seperating each game in a generation. You mentioned this at the beginning that it's not really possible and while you are correct that it's not 100% accurate I think it's accurate enough. Basically every Pokemon game we play is either Pokemon Red, Blue or the definitive edition. Pokemon Red, Gold, Ruby, Fire Red, Pearl, Heart Gold Black (Reshiram has red fire), White 2, Y, Omega Ruby, Sun, Ultra Sun, LGP, Shield, Shining Pearl and Scarlet are the "Red" Universes as there names, packaging and legendary all use the color red and usually a legendary from the Red games is strictly tied to other Red games. The Blue games are Green, Silver, Saphire, Leaf Green, Diamond, Soul Silver, White (Zekrom has blue lightning), Black 2, X, Alpha Saphire, Moon, Ultra Moon, LGE, Sword, Brilliant Diamond and Violet. Lastly there are the definitive editions containing of Blue, Crystal, Emerald, Platinum, Legends Arceus and Legends Z-A.
In the second timeline, pokemon black and white taking that far after has one problem. In black and white 2 you can battle red in the world tournament, who has not visibly aged and is still wearing his frlg fit
I think Mina in Gen 7 might actually still work despite what Mallow says because her trial takes place on the uninhabited Poni Poni Island. It's stated a few times in the story that few trial goers make it that far, and that it's been a long time since anyone has. It even went without a kahuna for an extended but unknown amount of time after he passed away. The fact that nobody else lives there means that she may circumvent the 20 year age cap simply because there are no other options, and I don't think many young folk would be willing to move out to an otherwise largely uninhabited island.
