The Curious Terror Of The "Anti Joker" 

Would You Use A Bloom Seed?

I think the anti-Joker already exists: It's Ra's al Ghul. He's calm rather than chaotic, he's about control rather than anarchy, he's patient and thinks Big Picture rather than impulsively and in the moment.*(see amendment below) He sees Batman as kindred, whereas Joker sees Batman as the opposite who complements him. And he's soooo sssserioussss! (Ra's also likes to address Batman formally as "Detective" whereas Joker likes to address him informally like "Batsy")

An anti-Joker would have to be good, wear muted colors, and be somber, unostentatious, brooding, and ... you see where I'm going with this.

Bloom was very underrated, and it's sad no one's done anything with him since Snyder left. Unfortunately his purpose was to show how cool Batman is that he stopped him in a single issue after everyone else struggled for like 12 issues.

Imagine how terrifying Mr. Bloom would be in live action.

"I demand to be taken seriously" the anti joker

He looks like if Slenderman dressed like steve jobs

mr. bloom is the anti-joker because he's underexposed, unlike the joker who is overexposed

I think making Mr. Bloom into a kind of 'eldritch possessed' super-drug cult-leader character that exudes a kind of far-gone madness in juxtaposition to Joker's more focused chaos might have been more compelling. Make him into a meta-powered 'other' thing akin to a king-in-yellow analog. Still mortal and stoppable, but clearly attached to something WAY worse.

Ahhh Bloom I loved that guy. He was like an eldritch drug pusher . I haven't re read super heavy but that's how I remember him

Future writers should lean into the Lovecraftian aspects of the character. Not only does he look freaky, but make his goals and motivations unknowable and less political like a Lovecraft monster.

I’ve always had a soft spot for Mr. Bloom, he was definitely one of my favorite new villains to come out of the New 52. His spindly design, his status as a super-drug dealer preying off the loss of the original Batman, and his rivalry against Jim Gordon during his time in the tights. However, I never really saw him as the “Anti-Joker” like Snyder billed him as; a cool antagonist for an experimental storyline, sure, but not nearly up to snuff with someone like Joker. Was happy to see him get some recent love in the Task Force Z storyline :)

I like Mr. Bloom but his twist identity reveal always felt like an afterthought. Though I think there’s a great opportunity to make him a reoccurring villain for Duke and some potential for very powerful storytelling.

And here I've been thinking the "anti-Joker" was Jared Leto. The only thing that separates Mr. Bloom from the "normals", is one bad gardener.

I just imagine Batman encountering him in a dark alleyway in a more normal and human like form. He begins to give a speech similar to the one he gave to the citizens of Gotham. At the mid-way point of the speech, we watch as his fingers begin to grow and sharpen, followed by his arms growing to the point the all but drag along the floor. Then his legs begin to contort, twisting in ways that should make them break as they increase his height leading to his torso and neck beginning to stretch. By the end of the speech, Batman stares up in horror at the sky-scraper sized, human like monster that stares down at him.

I really like his monologue where he thanks the rich people for helping gotham while brutally murdering them and at the end thanking them to allow people like him to arise. The Sarcasm and his calmness did a really good job defining his character.

Most random thought but I feel like Mr. Bloom would work great as a Dream Villain. He would be like a deep, dark thought that Bruce might have far in his mind about how anybody could one day become a villain for reasons that he may not understand because "they fell through the cracks". As this thought gets louder and louder, he would become bigger or more of him would appear as more Mr. Blooms rise up until Batman ultimately comes to a realization that so long as he or any other hero can serve as a symbol for hope, maybe people won't become a Mr. Bloom.

I think what they were going for is that the Joker is too big a character for any writer to be able to stake a definitive claim on them, to say "this their origin, this is what makes them tick, everyone has to deal with that now". But with Mr. Bloom, they seem to be saying there isn't that much to Bloom as a character - that Mr. Bloom is more the expression of an idea (dissatisfaction with society) rather than a person, so while you CAN give them an origin, it won't really matter.

If Batman himself isn't the Anti-Joker, and he must be chosen from the Rogue's Gallery, the Ra's al Ghul is the Anti-Joker. He is the opposite of the Joker in almost every way, and haunts Batman just as deeply.

About the anti-Joker , there is,in my opinion, two. One is Lockup, who is more an agent of oppression and a minor villain. The second one is Ra's. His origin is very detailed , sometimes his motivation can be interpreted as eliminating the chaos, is secretive instead of over the top and , this is a stretch, Joker causes Batman to lose a son while Ra's through Talia give him one

To me, Mr. Bloom is like Onomatopoeia. They both appeared for a brief period of time. We know almost nothing about their pasts. And they haven’t been since, except for small tie-in stuff that don’t do them justice. The only difference between them (except the obvious) is that Onomatopoeia has been adapted into live action but almost everything about the character was changed, apart from the wardrobe. Seriously, they literally could’ve replaced Onomatopoeia in the Superman & Lois show with Silver Banshee.

Isn’t the whole point of Killing Joke is Joker proving to Batman that anyone could become him after just one bad day? He even tries to use Gordon to prove that point

The why you described Mr. Bloom makes him sound better as a classic Chaos Rep in a Shin Magami Tense game. A creature preaches about how the stimming idea of Law unreliably restricts personal happiness and remedies this by gifting way to obtain personal power. Unfortunately they are happiness from a demon’s perspective that are more Mental Archetypes given flesh instead of bound directly to human perspective. Always anything is good and permissible as long as you are the strongest person, with eating some of the weak for more strength is just an inevitable quirk of the world.

As typical Snyderisms go, it either works pretty well or not at all, and I think this is the latter. Isn’t the idea of ecosystems that plant life has to be communal in some sense? Plants that contribute to a larger biosphere work well, but an invasive species can throw it out of balance. So Mr Bloom should be preaching co-existence, saying that the corrupt of the city have uprooted (haha) the fine balance or society. And what does blowing up the city have to do with a well rounded world view? I like the idea of a plant villain being representative of what can happen when you don’t remain vigilant against the “cracks” of society. A small failing can become a horrid mess of weeds if not caught before-hand. Gets at a different angle of the unending war against crime, that once you get rid of it all, you can’t just leave the garden unattended as people or the systems can tend toward corruption if not watched. Hey, bring him back and do some other stuff with him. We’ve kinda lost Ivy as a villain, so we need another plant bad guy!

Mr. Bloom reminds me of a dark and gritty reboot of El Seed from The Tick lol

I like the creepy factor of Mr. Bloom- I wish they'd bring him back, maybe just changing a few things that didn't work the first time. I don't think they should just throw him away completely.

I always think bloom is terffriying in the concepts of addiction, he mostly fits well having people using drugs and being slowly rotted from the inside of the various chems they pump in, while at the same time feeding the very parasite that peddles them the poison, I think bloom should defiantly focus on addiction, if they do that and not sell bloom as the anti-joker he can be one of batman if not DC most iconic villains. he does not care about people, philosophy or even ideas, he just a parasite and only cares about selling his goods to many hapless victims.

I do love his speech bubbles, it definitely sells his vibes

Maybe, they call Mr. Bloom as the anti-Joker because its the difference of the one bad day that created Joker while its the mere mundanity of life that can create a Mr. Bloom. Compare the story of the killing Joke were Joker tries to prove that anybody can become like him if they experience a bad enough day. (But then in that story Joker failed in his goal because Com. Gordon stayed sane and stuck to his moral.) While in the Superheavy arc, Mr. Bloom is just showing the citizens of Gotham how shitty their lives are and gives them a proposition to get powers to change their situation like the child that accepted the seed. Mr. Bloom actually succeeded in showing anybody can become him if just shown the proposition. Thats why I think Mr. Bloom can be labeled as the Anti-Joker, because anybody can become Mr. Bloom while nobody else can become the Joker.

I would love eddy from abbot elementary to teach Bloom what gardening actually is

I still don't know what's creepier, Mr. Bloom, or Jim Gordon without his moustache.

Mr.Bloom had some interesting aspects that could’ve made him a Poison Ivy 2.0. (Especially now, given how DC trying to push her into a hero role.) I can see the lovecraftian features mixed with the corruption allegory would work for an Arkham Game. This character could be a good foil for Superman. However, I feel like you to go hard on the horror angle to make that work. But that’s just me.

"Oh, no, they're the same again." Brilliant.

A cool “new” villain that nobody bothered to build on

I think one way you could definitely view them in opposition is in HOW they approach their philosophies and world views. The Joker is usually very singular, they're the only one "in on the joke". He'll have henchmen and do villain team-ups of course, but even with Harley and Punchline, they were never entirely IN the Joker's "space". Meanwhile, Mr. Bloom was very much invested in getting as many people as he could to think like HE thinks. To a point of dependency and justification at some parts. He's desperate for other people to agree with him, and indeed it's a component of his power. The few times Joker HAS tried to spread his perspective to others (usually via chemical alteration), he's almost always disappointed they don't actually get it, or even finds them ANNOYING. Even during the period of "the Three Jokers" (which was still kinda dumb), there is an inherent friction at them trying to work together and move as a unit. It's almost unnatural.

The only Anti Joker is *The Creeper*

part flower part Slenderman

Mr Bloom would make a cool Doom Patrol villain.

Thanks for introducing me to this character! I love the idea of a villain whose villainy takes the form of empowering others to be their worst selves. Mister Bloom would work great as a metaphor for evil enablers and the criminal drug trade. As for an anti-Joker, I recently came to the conclusion that the Joker exploits and displays the ridiculous rules of society, especially society not killing him expressly because he is an INSANE murderer, rather than a logical one. An anti-Joker would be an oppressive authoritarian, a dark reflection of Bruce himself, exploiting power and authority to terrorize his victims into “being good”. Imagine someone who uncovers some forgotten document that gives them absolute legal authority over Gotham. Armed with technical legal and moral high ground, they set themselves up as a secret cop/judge/jury/executioner of Gotham. They could be used to examine the nature of the law and authority itself.

Mr. Bloom design and power wise can work as an Anti-Joker. The Joker is an eccentric man who wears colorful outfits that uses tools to accomplish his goals. Mr. Bloom has a much more subtle outfit choice, has superpowers, and has an overall less human appearance. The thing is both are working for chaos in one form or another. An Anti-Joker, in my opinion, would be more obsessed with the concepts of order and destiny. What if instead of anarchy, Mr. Bloom spread his seeds because he believed Gotham as a city was going against its destiny? What if he believed Gotham was supposed to be plagued by crime? What if he revealed himself in order to make sure Bruce would become Batman again? What if he fought for the continuation of Batman's crime fighting career, one where people continued to suffer and die, unable to escape the cycle of crime and violence, because fate says it so? And what if, even if he is defeated, he wins?

“ I beg your pardon, never promised you an anti Joker garden.”

While you focussed on the ‘opposite of’ meaning of ‘anti-‘ there is another way it might be used in this context and that is ‘anti-‘ as in anti-hero and anti-villain. In both cases it doesn’t mean ‘opposite of hero’ or ‘opposite of villain’ or an inversion, but rather a character that plays the role of hero or villain (respectively) but does not have the typical traits associated with that role. So, an anti-Joker might also be a character that serves the same role as the Joker, but without (or possibly the opposite of) the typical traits of the Joker. And in this respect, Mr Bloom might be a sort of anti-Joker. In some iterations, Joker is an anarchist who just wants to ‘burn it all down’. Mr Bloom wants to ‘regrow it all’ after first slashing and burning what is there. In this way they serve a similar role (an antagonist seeking to destroy Gotham) but for different reasons and with different traits. However. I think even using this version of ‘anti-‘ he is a weak anti-Joker at best because I think he still isn’t well enough defined in terms of his traits and persona.

So Mr. Bloom is basically Slenderman with a flower on his face. So, Slenderman itself is like a weed that corrupts the children to do his bidding.

We need to see an animated feature length treatment of this character penned by better writers! Mr. Bloom just screams of explosive creative potential in an animated form! I want to see how he moves, how his petal face emotes, while being dignified with a better story! Also i want to see his powers interact with Poison Ivy's, on a small or large scale! Thanks for explaining this guy!

This feel poison Ivy and Joker poor science experiment It isn’t much anti-joker but mirror joker. If he stay with the idea of creating order, unifying people and as creepy has he appears.

Didn't realize Mr. Bloom survived the new 52.

"Giving him an origin woukd almost cheapen him" and then Geoff Johns proceeds to push that the Killing Joke origin is the actual Joker origin

The only way I can see he's kind of an anti-Joker is if he's an anarchist who's actually trying to give power to the people, rather than one who just wants to burn it all down or be at the top of the heap. I really like that his powers are vague and seem to be just based on what looks cool, or what it looks like he could do. Like how a kid would play with a toy

Anti Joker could be bad. Auntie Joker... That could be even more horrifying. Especially if it's just Joker dressed up like a middle-aged aunt.

I think the "Anti-Joker" thing does work in a sense. Because only The Joker can be The Joker, The Killing Joke proves this to a degree, it's not just one bad day to become like him, it's the right set of circumstances. Where as Mr Bloom, anyone could become like him, the hundreds, thousands of people disillusioned with life and the way the world is, any of them could pick up a seed and a hood and do what he does.

All I can think of when I see Mr. Bloom is, "WE'VE GOT ONLY ONE SKY! BLUE, RED, AND BLACK PARANOIA!!"

Sounds like they had an interesting concept with Mr bloom, but I'm not really seeing that actually play out in the character. The concept of a vilian that could be anyone, like anyone could end up becoming them, so even when beaten or unmasked that's not the end. Sort of a memetic being that continues to emerge from those "cracks" and the dissatisfaction. In a supper natural or "I'm Spartacus" people just taking the mantle up. Would be neat to see batman have to deal with a "symbol" as counter to his concept of having to become a symbol because a man can die but an idea lives on.

Holy hell a comics channel that isn't just an A.I voice explaining the plot? Hell yes

Anyone could be Mr Bloom with the right push? You mean, like... one bad day?

Oh yay, you used "the spooky voice". I'll always remember it from your Corpse Factory LP. 😅

As someone who likes Mr Bloom as a character I do understand the complexity of it but you need to replace the idea of him being an antithesis for him being a synthesis. In short the best way to understand it is joker is at his best when he is written with three core concepts as the foreground anonymity choas and the climax, a good joker forgoes the origin because it keeps you guessing his chaos is bombastic wild and always a spectacle and because of this you always know that Batman and the joker going to have to come to blows leading to the climax; however, mr bloom is those things in the background instead of three pillars on a stage you have an idea on a painting. Mr Bloom isnt just anonymity but paranoia he isn't just chaos but anarchy and with him it's not the climax but the suspense getting there. When Mr balloon does his thing not scared of him because you don't know his backstory but because anybody you know from the mailman that delivers your mail to your teacher to your neighbor can be Mr Bloom at any time, he's not just chaos he's anarchy so when he destroys its not to put on a show its to tear down the stage finally with joker it's all about the ending the last hurrah with Batman with bloom it's tension of what is he scheming what is his plan who will get hurt and what will be broken. I think when you look at Mr Bloom you need to not look at him as if he is the inverse of joker but the improvement of joker and I'm not saying he's better then joker more so he's more fine-tuning of his ideas to match a more adjusted and techy Batman. In short jokers ideaology and identity was the soil so bloom could achieve synthesis and he something more for a different batman

I think the idea with Mr. Bloom is that multiple people can take on the identity of Mr. Boom. The Joker is assumed to one person throughout every appearance, whereas Mr. Bloom is explicitly meant to be a persona that is adopted by a different person every time they appear.

I fully believe that comparing bloom to joker just takes away from bloom, he’s an interesting character and has a very unique horror vibe

hmm i could see how mr bloom could be the mirror of joker , the joker being a specific person having had a very very bad day , but mr bloom like a weed and if his seeds can infect people at random and stay dormant until the current mr bloom is killed

Mr. Bloom IS underrated and really complex. Did a whole video on the Superheavy arc myself and loved it

Mr. Bloom is definitely my favorite comic villain to come out of the modern age. He really feels like an eldritch cryptid like creature that fits perfectly in batman's rouges gallery. He isn't a replacement for some status qoue or a rework of something that already exists. He feels like his own thing.

...wait, Jim Gordon was Batman? I love the design of Bloom, very creepy and creative! He feels like a corrupted eldrich life coach.

The idea that he can come from anywhere is actually kind of fascinating sort of playing into the fact that he’s based on a weed

I love Mr. Bloom, he is one of my favorite villains that has been introduced in comics. I would love to see him make more appearances in cartoons or movies, but it's hard for new Batman villains to ever be chosen for adaptation because of how iconic the already established rogues are. I think he has a lot of potential, to be a villain from one of the Bat family members but I could see him working in other ways

I read Mr. Bloom in Joe Pera's voice. Steady, calm.

Every time you say, "Mr. Blue" ELO's Mister Sunshine pops up in my head. Thanks.

I think Bloom here is a good new villain with the potential to be a JL-level threat. I hope we one day get to see a story where the character isn't restricted to Gotham, but instead spreads worldwide, even getting heroes to implant the seeds.

I could see Mr. Bloom making a comeback in a story involving The Scarecrow (the story would probably be called The Harvest or Dark Harvest). It could be a team up between the 2 or a twist where one is trying to steal the others abilities/equipment to tweak and make something of their own. I feel like bloom could have used even a really weak version of the toxin to really convince people to slam those seeds and I’m sure scarecrow would absolutely love to add some practical use to the straw he stuffs in his suit lol

The worst villains are the ones that never shut up. And he looks like he could be taken out with one punch.

I had this thought a while ago but I always thought Mr. Bloom would've been better as a Superman rogue instead of Batman. 1. his powers being just as expansive as Clark's. 2. their physics are opposite ends of the spectrum. 3. it would've cool bringing some Gothic horror to Superman and Metropolis, yes, that's stuff specific to Batman and Gotham but I think that's what makes him perfect cause he can be that weed growing through the cracks and spreading in futuristic and bright Metropolis if not paid attention to. Like the fact Clark is flying high but Mr. Bloom is the 'man of the people' being close to the Earth.

While Mister Bloom doesn't feel like an anti-Joker as is, I can definitely see a seed there to make him a true anti-Joker. Joker is Extreme Chaos, Mister Bloom could be Extreme Order. You could even keep the existing story around him as-is without having to resurrect anyone, use leftover bloom seeds that come from somewhere to introduce a third Mr. Bloom who embraces the garden metaphor by trying to exert extreme control - treating civilization like a garden and people as flowers, complete with picking out weeds and cutting back any plants that are out of place.

Seems more like an alternative Joker then something antithetical to the Joker

It really is a phenomenal character design

mr bloom was in my opinion the best in task force z, i think his motivations and general vibe got way more fleshed out in that series.

i love how everything about mr bloom is confusing like its on purpose, like his entire existence is to confuse you to increase the freak factor

Partway through your reading of the actual Anti-Joker response, I realized that Snyder was essentially saying all it takes is One Bad Day for anyone to become Mr. Bloom, which was already a recurring theme of the Joker's. I think Mr. Bloom is the Anti-joker in how he operates though. Joker seems to be by-and-large a solo act with occasional backup, but Mr. Bloom specifically went about things in a "it's better for the people this way" fashion.

“Anyone can be Mr bloom with a good push” gee, that sounds an awful lot like “it just takes one bad day”

I always click on your videos bc they are well made and up my alley as far as content. ...but I also just wanted to say that your use of colors in your background when you are talking in combination with your personal style are really striking aesthetically It actually transitions really well to the comic book panels which obviously have specific color choices. And these small things make your videos seem a bit more curated than the average comic book channel. "Visually pleasing with great commentary." That is how I would describe your channel. A million thumbs up

Ah, Scot Snyder... I used to think he was the next Warren Ellis... Man did he go hard on proving me and everyone that thought like me wrong.

I think it would have been cooler if they leaned into the slenderman/eldritch creepiness more, maybe having the seeds under the right conditions turn normal people into Mr. Bloom so he can literally spring up from anywhere like the weed comparison.

Ever since Hush, who I absolutely hate as a character, I’ve been wary of new Batman villains. But Mr. Bloom and Professor Pyg coming out of that era has renewed my faith.

So from what I gathered from the interview’s answer is the Mr Bloom isn’t an Anti-Joker. He’s an Anti-Spider-Man. The idea that anyone can be under the mask.

Dangit Sasha! Now I gotta dust off my New 52 TPBs and give this a read again. Here I come bunny ears Batman. Thanks for keeping my love of comics alive and well. Love your content. Keep it coming!

I remember hearing that bats and flowers are contrasting symbols in Chinese culture coincidentally enough. Note: Heard it from one of Lockstin's vids, but I forget which.

The way you voiced Bloom made me think about Jerome Valeska from Gotham. Really cool interpretation!

Blooms whole "The system is rotted, everyman should fight for what they want" is kinda similar to Senator Armstrong from Metal Gear Rising Revengeance

"Dead flower dolls." That's a morbidly beautiful description. Also, I feel like he would work better if he was an entity rather than a metahuman; something that feeds off the misery of a hopeless existence and the rot of the human soul.

I love the Superheavy arc so much, thank you for covering it! It always sucks to like a flawed thing that falls apart with scrutiny. Snyder's run, to me, is some of the best-written Batman (up there with Morrison)--I love his take on the character and this arc in particular felt like such a fresh new landscape combined with Grayson and We Are Robin--but this chapter is undeniably the least coherent in its philosophy, and I never totally got what it was trying to say. There are so many good moments that stand on their own, though--Gordon's suit contrasts so well with the spindly Mr. Bloom look, I love Bruce and Julie's playground made from the old Batcave trophies, I love when amnesia Bruce meets amnesia Joker by the place where they died, I love Duke's renegade Robin fit, I love the moment where Duke takes Bruce down to the subway to face his fears and he sees the oncoming train as a giant bat, and I always choke up at how tragic it is when Bruce finally remembers and confronts unwilling Alfred saying "take me to my cave." Now I'm just rambling. So many good moments, but you're right that they could all be tightened up--Bloom's garden warfare allegory is great, but doesn't really take root below the surface (I tried)

Here me out, maybe I'm wrong here... but maybe the term 'Anti-Joker' was marketing?

I didn't catch the Super Heavy arc, but Mr. Bloom did pop up recently in Poison Ivy and seemed like an interesting character who I would like to see more of.

Something that's interesting: in Greek, the prefix 'anti' doesn't only mean against, it means 'to try to take the place of.' This almost describes Mr. Bloom: he's trying to take the place of the Joker for Jim Gordon.

I honestly dont think they tried to mean anything with the anti-joker line in this level of depth in that the original question seems to have been interpreted as only applying to their origin- anf while I do agree with you thematically that there isnt much difference in effect, there is the idea that someone like Joker is beyond understanding in his madness while Mr Bloom seems to be more someone motivated by something that most people would at least be able to understand at a base level whereas the Joker by his nature seems almost incomprehensible to a sane mind. In other words the opposite type of motivation to their characters. I do agree that the philosophy of Bloom is a bit half baked but that does also kindof make sense with the idea of just some random person becoming radicalized in their own beliefs. Something like the Joker being the idea that anyone can snap with one bad day whereas Bloom is anyone can slowly, methodically and logically be extremised in the absolute search for an ideal which in this case could be fairness or equality where all other positive things are slowly sacrificed to achieve it. Help the poor and those who need it->realise you cant because a lot of it is systemic and you are one person->become more drastic in trying to achieve it.->Eventually lose sight of why you were going for those ideals at all (helping people) to instead just even the playing field which then in turn would result in some people being significantly worse or better off in an extremely unfair way in a world where everyone technically has a shot at equality and starts on an even playing field (if you disregard the things inherent to anyone as an individual and assume everyone is the same). Kindof like an unholy mix of the character Senator Armstrong with the philosophy of Robert Nozick. Do I think this is the idea there? No. But it is a somewhat interesting interpretation I think.

I always thought of Mr. Bloom's msg as being rebuilding a better society where everyone is a monster so everyone is equal, with Joker's normally wanting to collapse or twist the current society.

Aunty Joker for Uncle Batman Jim Gordon

When he’s preaching to Batman about joining him and taking the city, I just think “Green Goblin” lol

What are exactly his powers? Also, he's be more menacing if he was always in the shadows. Him coming out in the open doesn't make him scary.

I didn't even know homie existed until today. This might be my new favorite DC character.

I do think Mr. Bloom might be underrated... It just seems like a really interesting story or character or something.. scary but intriguing, like it's cathartic

That "I'll be Batman" panel ... Urgh... Nightmares

Thank you for doing this video on Mr. Bloom 🖤 he is getting his own action figure too 🤘