Isn't it crazy how history sometimes just keeps repeating itself? Like while Covid was going on I'd heard a number of US reporters say that the US was also battling a major wave of fentynl addiction at the same time & there being large amounts of fatal overdoses that accompanied such wave. I actually had a couple of friends that lost beloved family members to both Covid & overdoses. One was a 30 year old female that they found passed away from an overdose on the DC Metro. Apparently she had went & got her some stuff & did too much on the way home. Sad. I had met her and been around her a few times but didn't really know her. And to be honest, I know the major part of Covid is over but not sure about the fentynl addiction & what is going on there. Probably still happening & still going. I think the US will constantly battle drug addiction unless they legalize most drugs & let doctors start prescribing them & that way there isn't waves of uncut carfentynl causing easy overdoses.
43:00 I was told that the engineers responsible for writing the specifications for the National Full-scale Aerodynamics Complex (NFAC) realized it was going to be heinously expensive so they so they bumped the specs to 1.5X what they actually needed before presenting it to congress. I can practically hear the impersonation Drach “Why yes senator, we know it will be horrifically expensive. It would be very difficult but we might possibly be able to scrape by with a facility that is only 2/3s the size of what we’re proposing and therefore you could save money with such a drastic cutback in our specifications.” And with a stroke of a pen, the engineers got exactly what they wanted.
It sounded very unrehearsed, to the point of having been said prior, possibly. Problems at Casa de Drach ? Unwittingly devulging private matters ?..... 😂 Love me some Drach, evermore !!! 🚬😎👍
"People Suck Generally." Not only does that bit of pith summarize the difficulties of long range planning, it also summarizes the reason we need navies in the first place.
Yeah, that is ONE reason for navies. They are also just cool to have, study, see, serve in, watch youtube vids on, debate, etc...😎 But, in all seriousness, yeah: Martitime commerce and communication is so important that it only takes one bad actor to create the need for sea power to be both essential to statecraft and to prevent exestential threats to peoples and nations. Ret. U.S.N. Admiral James Stavridis has an excellent book 'Sea Power' that is worth a read- it's kind of the naval equivalent of Jared Diamond's (great, but potential overgeneralization of history) 'Guns, Germs, and Steel.'
I don't think it's that incredible that you forgot about plummet mines. Not that they are particularly forgettable, but sometimes the expression "I have forgotten more about than you will ever learn" is revealed to be painfully accurate. Happens to the rest of us all the time.
35:56 Don’t forget, you usually need to keep using your shipyard, road, network, or whatever infrastructure while you’re upgrading it. They didn’t shut down the Panama canal for several years while they expanded it; they needed the tolls to fund the construction. But upgrading-while-operating adds significant cost. My dad, a highway engineer, told me that using a temporary bridge while replacing a highway bridge added 50% to the total project cost. I reckon expanding a shipyard would require relocating roads, rails, shops, storehouses, water, electricity, machinery. Handling that while still building ships would add extra costs, and probably would reduce productivity.
My thought on the Italian Carriers is that creating a Naval Air service (which would likely include land based aircraft dedicated to naval duties) would pay the highest dividends in improving the air/sea coordination.
That 'Finding Nemo' submarine looks more like it was rammed than mined, a 'v' shaped hole just behind the conning tower caused by a destroyers bow & keel, possibly inflicted whilst it was attempting to dive. Also the periscope is bent forward from the point of impact suggesting that this was caused by a nearby collision too
The problem with the Swedish Costal Defence Doctrine is that it looks good on paper but the reality was that most of the key Swedish costal areas lacked anything that resembled the 'ideal' layered defences while the Navy lacked the ships necessary for an effective defence of more than one strategic region. Essentially the navy could protect Stockholm while other regions had to make do with tripwire forces made up obsolete ships and armed merchant auxiliaries. Bringing c Kustflottan" (the main body of the Swedish navy) into action to defend southern Sweden would have meant exposing it to German air attack with at best limited Swedish fighter cover while it was straight up impossible to reach the west coast and the key port city of Gothenburg in combat conditions due to the channelling effect of Swedish and German minefields. (The only passage was a narrow channel and I'm not even certain that the Sveriges would fit). It is also interesting to note that once WW2 was underway the construction of new heavy units was cancelled (The two ships of the so called Thörnell design approved in 1939) and instead construction focused on destroyers, submarines and mtbs. By 1942 the so called "light fleet" which was arguably rather jeune ecole in a number of aspects was confirmed to be the future of the navy and the construction of the needed ships including the cruisers of the Tre Kronor class was approved.
Drach~ I need you to...uh, sorry. Would you kindly produce a segment on naval operations within the Spanish Civil War ? Between the Republican & Nationalist battles & attendant neutrality patrols ? I think there'd be plenty of meat on the bone to get into.... Thanks for your consideration in this & keep up the awesome naval historiographical endevours !!! 🚬😎👍
Miniature rifles and hand guns are typically 1:6 or 1:12 scale and are usually chamber in 2mm. At one time, they were popular enough in the UK for special ranges to be established for their use. Typically, such ranges were 100 yards or less for the miniature rifles and, if built for miniature hand guns, were considerably shorter. There are a couple of manufacturers in the US that still make such firearms and ammunition, although I've never seen them in my area.
@ 0:51:37 The Japanese did plant mines very deep in their Home Waters as an Anti-Submarine measure. So did the (British) Royal Navy between Ireland & Wales also between Ireland/Northern Ireland & Scotland as an Anti-Submarine for German U-Boats. This way surface ships could maneuver freely, including Zig-Zagging, without worrying about finding a mine "the hard way"! But yes, those minefields were "diluted" with mines far apart to prevent the mines from hitting each other due to their extremely long anchor cables.....
1:03:11 Pirates in the golden age of piracy would keep their cannons ready loaded. However, we aren't talking about the most disciplined lot, so how long and what level of degradation would occur who knows. We do know that due to the smaller cannons most were armed with, they weren't really looking to punch many holes into ships, which would not be healthy for the cargo either. So the fact it may have delayed, change the range or make it underpowered would be less of a factor for them at least. At the same time when you keep in mind the distances you will first spot a vessel from even if it jumps out from a headland, to beat to quarters even if that took 10 - 20 minutes, you will probably be waiting a further two to four hours plus before you are in range and if you really don't want to fight, well that can stretch for mutiple days in some cases.
We usually tend to keep small cannons (if using loose black powder) loaded for a maximum of about an hour, because after that point missfires tend to become more common. However, there are two difference factors. We don't load shot (for fairly obvious reasons), and in modern times, especially with the general public nearby, safety is a much bigger factor than in the 1600s.
You mention southern Italy which was heavily Greek, Tarentum was very much a naval power even though it was founded by Spartans. Was a thorn in Rome's side during their conquest of the Italian peninsula.
36:00 It’s all the same as why road networks are so hard to improve to accommodate larger vehicles. There’s a lot more to it than “rip up this existing road and pave a new one that’s a meter wider each lane.”
If it helps, try breaking the Swedish coastal defence ship's name down into syllables: Dris-tig-het-en. Won't be as easy as Äran, obviously, but might help anyway.
Thanks for the detailed response! the comparison with combined arms in land warfare is really interesting and gave a really clear picture on the whole thing. I guess any military doctrine that does work usually boils down to bringing everything to bear synchronously.
To answer the question about miniature rifles, this relates to rifles of 0.22in calibre. The time period mentioned they would be 0.22Long Rifle and based on converted, from 0.577-450 Martini-Henrys. The Society of Miniature Rifle Clubs was founded by Lord Roberts, of Boer War fame, and is now known as the National Small-bore Rifle Association, based at Bisley Camp, Surrey, along with the National Rifle Association.
Outside the Dreadnought sinking the submarine, what is the smallest ship sunk by a post Dreadnought battleship? Conversely what is the largest tonnage difference of a small surface ship sinking another surface ship. USS Archer Fish obviously wins if you include submarines.
One thing to mention is that if the Admiralty had gone out on a limb to create triple turrets for the QE's they might well have gone the whole hog and fitted small tube boilers which would have given the RN ships with 12 15/42 and 27-28 kts as built thus meaning that at refit/rebuild no loss of firepower would be needed to keep them comparable with the classes you mention in terms of speed and they would remain superior in firepower
At 23:15 I believe the problem of maintaining a reliable rate of fire for secondaries (while still having a shell that did a reasonable amount of damage) is why the British, French, and Japanese all settled on a roughly 5.5" (139-140mm) gun after WWI.
The G-50 was slow but it was faster than the Fulmar and more importantly the G-50 was a pretty good dog fighter which I doubt we can say that about the Fulmar.
00:35:56 On the question of dockyard infrastructure, look at HS2 for a good modern example of an important part of the problem: land cost. Coastal land always demands a premium and buying it to expand is very expensive. And even if this isn't a problem, consider the failure of Christopher Wren's plans to rebuild London like a version of Paris after the Great Fire: land ownership. Modern London still has narrow medieval streets instead of Parisian boulevards because all the owners whose homes and premises had burned down still owned that plot of land and either wouldn't sell, or demanded above the market rate.
For an example of power needed to pull things, a young girl once pulled a Loco down the track to advertise a new kind of wheel bearing (probably roller) it was in like 1880 or something. I heard it on Well There's Your Problem, most likely. I tried to look it up, "girl pulling train" does not give any results. Correction, it gives lots and lots of results, but none of them are not x-rated.
oof, but Roller bearings probably would have been what was being advertised (though I imagine that it was completely staged stunt with them mounting the locomotive on a subtle grade and gravity was doing all the actual work)
Very cool to see the Finding Nemo sub looked at. I'd love to see more IDs / technical info on surprisingly authentic ships in movies/etc where one otherwise wouldn't expect it. :)
'Fail to prepare' almost always translates as 'Prepare to fail' However, poor little Algernon does need his treats so badly - he wants to be a politician when (if) he grows up!.
Re: Deforestation due to naval construction- It is possible that Southern Italy, having its forests cut once in antiquity, could never, and never really did, recover, in any amount of time... Places like the U.K, most of the US, Canada, Scandinavia, etc, too) are lucky in that when their forests are clear-cut they can regrow and reestablish themselves over the course of mere decades or centuries. This is not the case everywhere, as, in a less forgiving climate, a single round of deforestation could have the possibility of meaning the end of any potential for a forest to ever take hold there again due to a new predominent biome establishing itself, or due to erosion removing soil and/or nutrients, or even the forest's losing endgame of desertification. (And, now, climate change, too, effects all of the foregoing, and thus may also inhibit re-forestation...) (Ok, so, all that follows is just details) The Amazon basin is infamous for such losses- after forest is cut, erosion and changes in the ecosystem kick in and lead ultimately to a permanent change in the local biome... The Cedars of Lebanon suffered a simaler fate, as do many places where slash-and-burn agricultural practices are used: Southern Italy may be or have been in the same situation due to naval building programs in antiquity as was considered here, but I don't know if that is definitely the case. Other examples may be the redwood forests of the Californian coast, where the lack of a climax forest may mean that the old-growth will never return, even given the thousands of years it would otherwise take- and ths Sahel region south of the Sahara, which is rapidly disappearing in part due to its anthropogenic loss of its (always sparse to begin with) forests and other plant life, while, on the other hand, in the Pacific Northwest temperate rainforests of Washington State, British Columbia, and southern Alaska, a climax (stable old growth) costal forest of Douglas and Silver Fir, Hemlock, etc, may re-establish itself in as little (little?!) as 600 years. In the grand scheme of things, I suspect deforestation due to naval building programs are generally not a major driver of permanent forest loss... Although, considering the efforts amd expenses that some nations have undertaken to gaurentee that forests of species of trees with naval utility remain, maybe it has... Consider the U.S's former appropriation of Live Oak, and the mantiennce of thousands of acres of government oak just for the maintenance of the U.S.S. Constitution- one ship versus the many thousands which existed worldwide. As a final thought, I think Cuban Mahogany maybe an even more tragic case and an instructive example- its use in ships and the exaustion of the supply, over a relitively short time period- a couple of hundred years- lead to its value rising to the point that it became too scarce and expensive for use in ships, or for anything other than fine furniture or decorative pieces (a conceit of frivolous, hubristic wealth which consumed the remnants that shipbuilding left over) and even that is almost completely banned now as it is literally an endangered species- an example of the needs of shipping leading nearly to the extinction of the species! Cheers, and thanks to anyone who rea all of that! Thoughts?
8:30 Presupposes GB could have afforded the enormous cost of this work on the QEs. Given how fiscal austerity allowed only two ships to be modernized as far as they were, and one received little more than a lick and a promise, it’s unlikely any two would have received even more extensive work.
Hi Drach, I recall a time worn you said that, if you had to lose an actual British Museum Ship to have The Grand Old Lady preserved, you would chose,, reluctantly, M133. I must disagree, for a few reasons: M133 fits the drydock She is in perfectly, so losing Her, may result in losing that drydock as well, and , therefore more British Naval History, She is one of 4 unique/ iconic ships grouped together: Mary Rose, Victory, Warrior, and Heraelf. I would rather, also reluctantly, lose Belfast. She is not anywhere near Her WW2 configuration in Her current preserved state; She was once advertised ,by The IWM as" The Last All Big- Gunned RN Ship: (6" guns are big ,seriously?!). Also, She would probably need to be moored in the north of England , or somewhere in Scotland, like Rosyth, Scapa or on The Clyde, so would show respect to those areas Big in 20th Century RN Capital Shipbuilding and Basing
I wondered if you’ve been following the remarkable progress made in restoring USS Texas? Any plans for a revisit when she’s moved to her new berth in Galveston?
Well, most navies would not be trying to do what Germany did with Blucher (ie, run troops past the forts with the intention to BLOODLESSLY occupy Oslo). Blucher was a victim of a policy based on NOT fighting the Norwegians as much as possible. If Germany had wanted to destroy Norway's armed forces in battle, Blucher would have sat 20,000 meters away and flattened the old forts, never getting within range of the old guns. Germany would have landed troops somewhere else and had them take the forts by land BEFORE the ships tried to sail past.
@ 0:19:16 Also, certain plants do take out much more nutrients than can be restored by the fertilizers (from "the end result of a properly feed animals") can restore...
hi Drachinifel, could you do a video on Operation Safari at some point? It was one of the biggest historical events in the history of the Royal Danish Navy, and the biggest during the ww2
1:03:14 I’d be more worried about loaded cannons spontaneously firing. A first rate has upwards of a 100 cannons loaded with volatile black powder, and those suckers don’t have safeties. Throw in some decks heaving in heavy seas, jostling the tubes….
@ 0:23:15 The Worcester class cruiser was held up due to them trying to get a single ramming system and that finally got around to using two systems (one for Low Angle (anti-ship) and one for High Angle (anti-aircraft), unfortunately these came in too late for WW2 and about the time they were experimenting with Guided Missiles which made a par of niche ships to be considered too expensive for "peacetime" naval budgets,,,,, I can only imagine what the Korean War would have looked like with all 3 Salem class and both Worcester class ships being used for shore bombardment!!!
49:20 Wait you mean “building an aircraft carrier” isn’t the only thing you have to do to have to do to have a naval air presence? Asking for a Freund.
Well with the triple turreted QEs that causes all sorts of butterflies because if the refits are 28 knoters they are going to be deployed much different than historically
The alu strip in copper pot is *very* close to a DIY anodized metal capacitor. Anodised metals layers usually have high dielectric values ... Won't work with hydroxide electrolyte as that would strip the oxide layer. (While not 100% sure, i think the electrolytes in alu foil electrolyte cap are caustic, which should remove the oxide layer?) I've had success using yorkshire tap water as an electrolyte. NB Reducing the water level of such a capacitor after it is charged up can seemingly increase the voltage... Could be very useful wrt keeping a capacitor voltage constant as it's charge drops.
@31:10 when the Pennsylvania had guns on its second gun deck that were shorter barreled than the lower deck cannon, but longer than Carronades, were they of the type/class of gun called 'Cannonades', which were in use (mostly on merchantmen, if I recall correctly) as eary as the 1800-1810s? Cheers! P.S. Is it correct thea the term 'Carronade' comes from the Carron Ironworks which produced some of the early (were they the first?) guns of that type...?
Drach, at 33.00 in to the drydock there is a photo of two ships of the line being used as depot ships, do you know which ships they are and where they were?
33:15 Sorry for the: "mmmhhh actually" moment, but in the second half of the XVIII century the Venetian navy build a serie of big frigates/fifth rate with specific accomodations for the transport and handling of masts, cannons and other special supplies for the fleet.
In the deforesting of southern Italy you mention the construction of "heela shafts" if I heard that right. What are they? Google searches have not been informative.
25:45 i don't think the weight is a Problem for the hydraulic, but for high elevation the rammer must be under the gun. but that`s were the ammunition supply is placed.
Richelieu was the ship I was thinking about in this case, theoretically all angle loading with high elevations but at the higher ones the rammer struggled
If the Queen Elizabeth class had 12 x 15-inch guns and small tube boilers, they would have been the greatest class of ships in RN history bar none, rather than argubly the greatest Class of ships.
During the age of sail, when a major storm was obviously imminent, did captains of ships ever order the guns to be relocated to the center line of the ship and secured with ropes? This would in theory make the center of gravity more, well, central, and the ship less likely to roll over and sink during a storm. Was it a practical option?
The problem with shifting that much weight is its effect on roll. Move everything to the center line and you might be running the risk of her roll being so fast that she rolls the sticks right out of her self, with the added risk inherent in having so many heavy things (the guns) away from their normal securing points that one or more will break loose and now you have a several ton charging beasty careening around the deck until it can be smothered into submission if it doesn’t go though the hull first. It’s a good thought but in practice I would say a fairly poor idea.
@38:36 - proportion to dig out and dispose of the volume of ground is... Cubical to the length of the ship. Basic math. Over-simplified but close to reality.
19:10 Drach, having underwater torpedo tube launchers near the bridge seems like an intuitively natural position, if launches were ordered from the bridge. What factors played a role in the placement of underwater torpedo tubes?
I am going to be a pedant. Around 5:30 you said 'Statistically significantly more likely'. That is actually a term with a formal meaning. Was this just a combination of two words, or did you actually mean there is empirical evidence that the difference between the extra turrets would improve performance. My first thought was you probably didn't mean it in that sense, but given your predilection for wargaming simulation have you actually run any simulations, or are there any historical records that support that conclusion. Intuitively the more guns you bring to bear the more likely you are to do damage, but it did get me wondering how much extra firepower you needed to make a provable difference.
Dear Mr Drach, It seems that a ship with degaussing is relatively immune from magnetic mines. It seems also that they are not immune from magnetic pistols on torpedoes. ?
Yes, because amongst other things relative distance is key, degassing can reduce the signature so as not to trip a mine 30ft below, not so much a detonator 10ft away.
So if the QE''s were originally built with 4 X triple 15 inch turrets what about the R's? Would they have been built the same or would they have even been built?
Sweden did mine their waters, and did say to Soviets, "you dont need to know where mines are, just stay away". Finns and Germans knew where mines were. In practice Sweden had to protect their commerce through Baltic Sea, else Germans would had volunteered to help them.
I have a question regarding Pennsylvania's unified battery. Stability wise would an all 24pdr battery be successful? It seems gun wise, while you wouldn't have the 32pdrs as a hammer, you would be equal and significantly better on the other two decks.
Considering the shortage of steel during WW2, could the USA have gone back to building ship hulls out of wood, either partially, or maybe even whole? I'm thinking primarily anti-sub escort vessels like corvettes, but would it also have been feasable for bigger ships to have the "nothing" parts of an all-or-nothing armour scheme made from wood?
Anyone interested in the effort involved in loading a gun should watch this video. It's the inside of the twin 4.5 inch turret on H.M.A.S Parramatta during a live firing exercise. Parramatta was a Leander class frigate. Now, scale that up to 6 inch shells which are considerable larger. My action station in the RN was inside a 4.5 inch turret on a Leander. The gun is the same as fitted to WW2 ships and was in use in this turret from the 50s to the 90s up to the 90s. ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-WUO5EB_8FZY.htmlsi=ey_laW8IAIa-PsMr
Quite weird how they use the old-fashioned Dutch word 'obus' to designate shell casings. (1:14 in that video where an NCO seems to go "Obus, deployed" to designate firing) I mean it's true, but I didn't expect an expression rated "96% of Dutch people don't know after 1970" to be in Australia (its navy?) in 1990?
00:00:49 You make it sound too complex. There is heavy anchor with hundreds of feet of cable controlled by brake. Weight on end of line which lenght is set to desired depth of mine is connected to brake mechanism inside anchor. When launched, anchor box and weighted line are both set to unwind freely. Anchor and pilot line dive to depths leaving mine bobbing on surface for a while. Pilot line is in tension by hydrodynamics and specific weight. When pilot line hits bottom, the line tension releases, stops unwinding of cable from anchor, and "plunk" yanks mine to desired depth.
I would say that industrialization didn't help forrests at all. Although ships were now built of steel, the iron and coal mines had a huge appetite for wood well into the 20th century. Once these industries are gone, nature takes over again, as i.e. in the "Ruhrgebiet".
I think the Ruhr region was denuded already in Roman times, thanks to iron production. Before they figured out how to make iron with coal, it took prodigious amounts of wood. There's a long post on Bret Devereux blog going into more detail.
@@jbepsilon The Ruhr Region didn't actually belong to the Roman Empire ... wrong side of the Rhine (there were a few Roman positions along the Lippe though). Neither do I think the Germanic tribes did a lot of deep mining. In fact, iron was so precious to Germanic tribes, there is reason to believe they didn't do much mining at all. Still you're not wrong; charcoal was essential for any kind of metal works, but I'd connect that to the more civilized Gallic regions, better known as the "right" side of the Rhine. Being born and still living in "Aquis Granum", I have the strong belief that nothing good has ever come from across the Rhine. Ruhrgebiet, Berlin Warsaw, Vladivostok ... all the same ... 🙂
Follow up question on the historical accuracy of Finding Nemo: assuming that the sunken submarine is located in the vicinity of the Great Barrier Reef, would there at all be a mine field in the first place?
The northern force failed to actually achieve its objective: it lured away Third Fleet, but Seventh Fleet wasn’t lured away, meaning it failed at keeping the landing sites undefended. This is less an indictment of Ozawa, and more an indictment of the Japanese high command who apparently assumed that it was fine to lure away only half the American naval forces and launch an attack on the American landings five days after they’ve started.
@@Eboreg2 Well then it also failed since there’s also evidence Oldendorff positioned himself in such a way he could double back north and block off San Beradino Strait after dealing with the Southern Force, and actually did just that as soon as he received radio reports from Taffy 3; it’s a shame Kurita turned around instead of running Centre Force face-first against the Standards, which would at minimum slowed him down long enough that he’d never have gotten to the landing beaches before Halsey returned.
@@bkjeong4302 He was also incredibly low on Armor-Piercing ammunition and torpedoes. I imagine taking on Yamato with that kind of deficit would NOT have ended well.
@@bkjeong4302 That's... exactly what Taffy 3 did. Why do you think Kurita retreated? If Oldendorff's battleships had been "delaying" Kurita's force then they would have suffered a lot of damage and maybe even lost a few fairly heavy surface units.
Seenit myself. Death bya thousand cuts. Punks - half my age trying to tell me what to do. Re-inventing the wheel? Listen up - old man. This is how we do things these days ! We gotta new wheel! This one's slower - it's got 8 sides butting saves the planet !
