The 'I Love U' prop + Gemfan F3 and F4 

Hey so where and when can we get the 5.2” props? This is so cool

@IntotheP You can't say that they're copying everything. That's just not true lol. The differences are pretty obvious I'd say. The motors aren't even slightly similar, Steele's motors are 2306 but Bob's aren't. I'd recommend you to get some knowledge about the subject before you acuse someone of doing something they obviously haven't...

@IntotheP some things are copied, sure. But it's not like moving towards 6s is all thanks to Steele. I'm not trying to take any credit away from Steele and his knowledge, but it's not like the entire market os following one person's believes without any scientific research on their own part. All I want is for people to see the value in everyone's work instead of just claiming someone's work as a copy. I don't care about how closely Kabab's motors match Steele's. He has put in so many hours refining them and that he should be credited for, no matter what it may seem like from the outside.

Hahaha 🐿️

😂🤣😂

Why no 4 blade 5552 or other flash props i got up to 110mph on the 5552 on xinge2207 they sure are fast but not enough grip to rip.. I love 4 blade props i wish there was many more and 6inch 4blades would be killer too

4 blades feel great but are reeaaally inefficient imo

There's so so so much more to discuss but this is the basic ideas. The 5.21" is only ~3.3mm longer than the 5.078" props but the 2.6 pitch on the 5.21" is comparable to 3.5" on the smaller prop. You loose a little response but you get quite a bit better altitude control and efficiency. The response loss is still annoying however.

I use DJI everything because I'm just too lazy not to. It's so easy to wire up a vista and it does video and control. I actually don't like the DJI controller at all but it's good enough and so so easy to use. I recommend it over everything else because it just works with zero fuss. It's worth the extra money to me.

@@Kabab makes sense. Thanks for replying :)

It's available now fpvcycle.com/collections/new-products/products/gemfan-5226-the-5-21-i-love-you-prop

I actually had a day off for once so I spent 2/3 of it making this video. It was nice. I also tried really hard to get decent audio. All of the video still came from my phone and the GoPro on the quad. Didn't even have any tripod or anything else with me.

Many have actually been doing that lately with throttle limit features. It's a good option if you don't have a motor of the right Kv but electronically, a more appropriate Kv works out better for torque recreation, electronic noise and amp draw.

And we love you!

yes they'll come in the grey and solid white

they do

I'll be coming back. Just extremely busy with the actual work of learning the content to deliver

There's a new wave of 3" props that will be coming in the future with M3 mount holes

@@Kabab That's great to near about a new load of props on the horizon, but M3? Doesn't that mean I'm going to have to replace my t-mount motors?

@@licensetodrive9930 long horizon. We've got m3 motors coming that are also compatible with M5 mount

@@Kabab Interesting future for motors & props then :)

give it a couple of days dude.

yep the think tank fpv helipak is still the very best bag that exists in the industry

It's made to fit as is

I can only fly here very early in the mornings for about 8min before trucks show up to set up for about a dozen 5yr old's birthday parties on seemingly any given day.

yes we will... very soon dude!

@@Gemfanhobby please please find a stiffer material that will allow the 5.21x2.6 prop to be made lighter 😁

I really don't know how but I just can't stop thinking about all of it all day even though I don't get much time to fly. I also spend a LOT of time trying to figure out how to setup things to make it as easy as possible to fly.

about 3:40-4:10min. Almost double that of the F3 and F4

A lot of the time the best battery is the one you can actually get. Here in the US, gnb makes the best battery for the money. The battery also happens to be the best product as well. CNHL and ministar don't make any good batteries. Sure they work but they don't really compete with the highr end gnb and tattu packs. Tattu is way way overpriced however.

@@Kabab So its GNB then? Was considering the two CNHL line I mentioned becouse they are really cheap. Like 18 bucks right now on sale.

@@bangomargit right. CNHL is really really cheap but you kinda get what you pay for. Gnb just isn't usually overpriced and has top shelf performance with the 100-130C variant cells. The lesser C variants are not as good

Hypersmooth is not nearly as good as RSgo. I also want my raw video as well. Maybe I'll want it to be raw. It's absolutely not worth upgrading for hypersmooth. The hero cams have way better video quality however

Hopefully just another week or two

@@Kabab Oh how exciting! I shall keep an eye on your store then!

@@Kabab Question: do you all intend to carry the FPVCYCLE 5 inch imperial 1800kv motors anymore?

it's fine. more and more people are moving to the lower pitch props and higher kv however. It just seems to feel better on the throttle and makes it easier to control.

About 2wks for all these props. The 51433 is still excellent but I'd actually trade it for the F3 and F4. They're some really really excellent props.

They're available now on the site.

Similar to the P3, the F3 and F4 are boarder line blades that will still work on our quads. The blade rigidity is just barely enough. It wouldn't work out even with just 1mm added to the blade end.

@@Kabab yeah you can tell they flex hard and would need to be beefed up/redesigned for larger versions(I throttle scale 90% to avoid tip flattening/more feel), yet could still be made lighter than the older 6" props currently available

@@badfourlife this whole dilemma is why I worked on the 5.21" prop

6 are in development!

@@Gemfanhobby awesome, love to hear it!

The motor size and craft setup and weight matter more. The 5226 is mainly intended for more cruising speed and efficiency

The F3 for sure 100%

We're still working on a different material that will let us drop some weight off the prop. Then it's easy to increase the pitch a bit for speed, altitude or response.

Agreed! I’ve also had concerns about prop reviews and how they translate to higher elevations. I’m at 4000ft, and it’s very possible I’ll seek footage from 8000ft+. Edit: I should also add that when I asked about this on Chris Rosser’s channel, he suggested slightly higher kv motors (going from 17000kv to 19000kv). That may be something else to consider.

@@platty9237 I asked him, as well, about the 450mph tip-speed thing and how it relates to elevation. He explained that the compressive properties of air don’t really change just because there’s less of it. The battery/kv relationship stays the same until a pretty unrealistic (for us) elevation. The example he used was turbo-prop planes maintaining engine speed while altering the pitch of the propeller.

See the comparison in the description of the video. They are very similar but the F3 is more efficient for sure and I believe a bit faster but I didn't have a set of the P3 with me to test side by side.

@@Kabab Thanks! I'll have to eventually give them all a try to see the differences by myself... 😂 Keep it up! Awesome content like always!

Try the 5.21". If it fits, there isn't another 5" prop that will be more efficient. Otherwise, the 51433 is probably going to be one of the better options. The best option is to drop some weight

there's more blade pushing through the air. Also more weight....the two aren't able to be separated from each other in the real world. For a longer blade, you need a thicker root in order to resist the centripetal forces and keep the blade shape at higher RPM's. If you're using the same material, the weight goes up and the extra inertia is there but the drag of having more blade is also there in a big way. Adding 1mm is more like adding 3mm because you have 3 blades. I'm definitely not an engineer so I don't look at the numbers beyond a general idea of things. We've actually made a bunch of versions to test for what's going on. The same exact blade just drawn out blade tip by 0.9mm and only 0.12g of weight added was significantly less responsive than the shorter blade. It could be the weight that's making the impact but imo the very noticeable loss seems like it's coming from more than just the slightly increased weight.

Yes they fit

Those ones I gave him were actually the previous 5.25" version. Well, one of them. We moved down to 5.21" to get a little response back.

@@Kabab Interesting. I'm pretty sure I could hear that the motors had an easier time quickly braking down to idle. I've been considering trying 5.5" on 5S with that setup. The build is around 670 grams with a Runcam 5 Orange and an 1800 mAh 4S. I built it to be more of a cruiser that can freestyle, using Lumenier 2407 1700 Kv motors on 4S. It's great for proximity and flying a few inches off the ground, but I'm curious to experiment with it. The arms are on the shorter side for a 6" frame, so it could be great with a 5.5" as well.

@@Perforator2000 higher load props can help transitioning from max rpm to about 50% but then it's the weight of the blade that the motor is fighting and struggles with.

yes. the hero 5 has WAY WAY better audio. Sadly they nuked the audio on the 8 and 9

We're waiting on delivery

Yeah. In my case, they're generally not critical.

the camera has a huge FOV. It's also not that low of tilt. It's actually more like 30deg. The motion blur also gives the speed effect that makes it look faster. If you cover the bottom half of the screen and just look at the trees it doesn't look like I'm going so fast.

I meant to say cuts the exposure range in half. the ND makes it not able to see as well in the dark and the shutter limits how much light it can handle. So the overall exposure range of the GoPro is probably around half as much with the settings I've given it.

@@Kabab 👌🏼makes sense, thank you

Sbang sbang?

The F3 will do that for you if that's what you're looking for. With it's 5.078" length, it'll do it more efficiently than other high response props too

@@hakeemjimoh425 lol

At about 20deg the props are out of view. I don't even remember if they're in view of the dji cam. If they are, it's just the very very edge

@@Kabab for live streaming events having the props out of the dji camera feed is huge. Next time you fly could you share some dvr footage from the dji camera?

@@BuddsSkyCam sure but to get those props out of view you give up quite a bit of durability and balance.

@@Kabab with my rig that Iam streaming with already has a naked gopro and should never touch the ground...lol...

It's a smaller prop so it's not going to hold up to the weight of the quads I must run today. A 4.9" prop cannot provide the same kind of disk loading performance of a larger bade. It's unfortunately just not possible. I wish I were wrong

@@Kabab for sure not if you are just cruising and looking for long flight time. have you tried it with a 1950kv motor though? all the juicy sbang guys are running 700g and up. propwash handling and response is just superb. look up MariusFPV, hands down the best freestyle pilot out there imo ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-u9W1_RpcnOQ.html

@@terrorbirbfpv4732 definitely some excellent flying. I don't consider myself particularly good but I like a really responsive quad just like the next guy however for actual utility I really need a quad that will give me a minimum of 3min no matter how I fly it. 3min is efficient to me and means it'll hover for probably 6min and give me 2min of use which is usually how it goes. It just doesn't seem plausible for a 4.9" prop to be able to match a 5.21" prop in efficiency. The F3 and F4 props are also excellent and 5.1" yet still can't really approach the 5.21" low pitch prop. Also, 1900+kv 6s is really really nice to fly but even less efficient. The motors I've made at 1870kv in this video produce probably a bit more power than a 2207 1950kv but will do it with better throttle control and more efficiency. They definitely weigh a bit more too at about 34g now with the new bearing. All in all, my style and goals here are very different. I need my quads to work for utility first. The Flippy floppies come second but it'll definitely match these sorts of Flippy floppies. Next time I go fly with more than a pack or two, I'll fly more flippity n floppy 👌

@@Kabab Fair play. The Sbang guys are going for different flight characteristics. I just noticed that Blackbird FPV put a lot of R&D into his motors (T-Motor Blackbird) and his props to achieve his type of flying (pretty much invented Sbang and most of the pilots doing that style are flying his motors and props). Thought it would be interesting to you if you didn't know about it already. He's not as open as you are about his development, but some take aways from an old interview I saw: N48 magnets, which are weaker than the usual T-Motor F60's. Wider motor winding for more torque. Bigger air gap. All for having the extra top end at the throttle for throw needed for those juicy flicks. This was for the v1's when he was still on 4S ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-V2ZNIjibDLI.html

@@terrorbirbfpv4732 the use of weak magnets and wider air gap are to mitigate the negative effects of high kv and 6s on a largish volume stator that has tallish magnets. Using strong magnets and a tight gap would cause so much electrical noise that it may not even work right at that kv. Even if it does, it'll cause heaps of electrical and physical noise. It's a technique that works, but to me it's sort of an easy way out. Many pilots will say the weaker magnets are better because it's smoother or whatnot but it's primarily just because the weaker magnets and wider air gap is easier to run with less to even zero hassle. Stronger magnets with a smaller gap will always give you more power, more back EMF, more efficiency, more everything. It's much more difficult to build a motor to manage these effects and also more difficult to run a motor like that. There's nothing wrong with it at all but if you think about it, no matter what you do to the stator, you cannot surpass the magnetic flux of your magnets or you'll start to demagnetize things. So the use of less than the best magnets nurfs the motor entirely and the wider air gap just kills power and efficiency....which also makes it easier to run high kv high voltage. I also know how tmotor makes their motors so I understand why it went that way to begin with. It's a lot more complicated than that but basically what the pilot likes is what the pilot likes. Nothing else really matters. I tend to do a lot of high speed cruising with not a whole lot of quick moves. High kv 2207 motors, especially with weaker magnets and wider air gap, are gonna be way better for poppy movements like the style you're talking about but would not be a great choice for higher speed cruising as that stator size is much more prone to have thermal issues earlier on during consistent operation. The prop also has a lot to do with things so that's a whole new level. Above everything, I do not, will not and cannot support anything tmotor does. They are one of the worst companies in this industry. They rip off everything they do from someone else and will gladly take any free marketing they can get at the expense of anyone. They actively work to copy lots of my work and have no issues copying a product outright for anyone that asks. It's a disgusting company in our industry and nobody should ever work with them or buy from them. But of course I'm just one person and the general people in this industry don't really care about any of that. They buy whatever. So I just stay away from them and do whatever I do.

I've tried them. They are good but the response is similar to 6" and not comparable to a smaller blade. Anything past 5.25" tends to feel more like a 6" than a 5" as far as my testing goes

@@Kabab ok, i tested them on 6" frame, auw around 570g with session5, speed, smoothness and efficiency was beyond every other prop, i can get more control only from 51433 props, which i currently use mainly due to T5544Cs poor durability....

It's not here yet. It's gonna come in probably a week or two. FPVCycle will be the only place that has them at first.

The props are coming to fpvcycle first in about 2wks.

right, that's if you're holding a camera. A camera that's plowing through the air at 100mph isn't gonna suffice with 1/60....more importantly, to record at 1/60 during normal daylight, you're gonna need at least an ND32. Darker ND filters are harder to make good quality and tend to impact video quality more.

Thank you for that info

The 5.21 prop will be on FPVCycle before anywhere else and we'll be the only ones to have them in the solid white color too. They'll also come in the translucent grey color. We're getting the other props too but I dunno if they're already for sale elsewhere.

Maybe? Not yet? Will be soon if not. We're getting out stock of all these props in a week or so at fpvcycle

In one week will be available in US

@@Gemfanhobby we'll get our batch in a week? 🤩

They'll be on fpvcycle first as I was the one that worked on them with gemfan. About 2wks from now.

@@Kabab thank you for letting me know!

It's not. The 5130 is a super skinny prop intended for the sub 300g auw 5" builds

@@Kabab So which prop is the best for a 350-400g 5" 2203?

@@rawpicsfpv3516 the f3 100%

@@Kabab Makes sence, thx!

We were working with 5.25 and 5.28 but then went down to 5.21 because it just had better response and still had most of the benefits

@@Kabab I was eyeballing an HQ 5.5" and going up a motor size to keep response. I'm also 730-40g. Trying different props myself it felt like a little more pitch could help, actually liked the 51455-4 but the response was pretty slow. Hopefully these 5.21 are listed soon. I keep throwing money at my screen and nothing is happening, :D Thanks for doing all the hard work!

@@DriftaholiC going past 5.25" starts to feel much more like a 6" than a 5". It's really hard to keep the response when going up in blade size.

@@Kabab I've never flown anything bigger then a 5" but I assumed with a big enough motor for response and enough weight to keep the "disk loading" similar the same flight characteristics can be achieved. Your 7" video's shed a lot of light on the differences to me but they all seemed like you needed a lot more stator vol. Maybe we need to maintain a stator vol/prop weight + some for added inertia of the dia.

@@DriftaholiC actually the larger motors start to have inertal issues with their own bells. You can't just keep adding more motor to get more performance at some point unfortunately

Anywhere you can find 😔

@@Kabab yeah.. i really like this frame (and actually all the work you've been doing for the hobby), but it looks like its been designed for DJI control only. I'm still on analog so finding a place for the crsf rx shouldn't be a problem but i'm upgrading to dji soon. Still would buy it and work around this issue. Awesome job mate!

@@Acosta_RC it's not only for dji. You can design and print any mount for the rear and mount anything anywhere. It's actually designed for analog with two full mount platforms side by side. 30x30, 20x20 and whoop mount on both platforms

correct. flattening and fluttering at high rpm

Just to play devils advocate for a sec........is it the motor or the prop? Is the motor spinning above the props capability or vice versa?......meaning would the motor benefit from a higher pitched prop or is it 'overspinning' a lower pitch prop than it can handle? Or am I just spitting into the wind?

@@minkorrh I'd add one more thing to the mix. The weight of the quad also matters. If the quad was probably about 50g lighter the props wouldn't have any issues. There's no one factor that can be singled out. Unfortunately it's not that straightforward.

@@minkorrh Probably a thicker prop that won’t bend at high speed?

@@MindRiderFPV adds weight though

also big difference in 1/120 with 30FPS i put my gopro on 60fps with 1/120 and now i just realized why my recent videos look too motion blurred.. need to chage to 30fps or to 60fps with 1/240

Yeah I can see how that could be confusing

It should. Yes. Fits on the cad

@@Kabab nice! And its no problem that the front and back props get reeeallly close together?

@@rawpicsfpv3516 it is a problem but not a big deal. Actually I'm not totally sure if it'll fit. I'll put it on the product page for all the frames. That's the one frame I didn't confirm

Considering T mount is an absolutely awful mounting mechanism, I won't be making a T mount prop or lobbying for it at all. I do however have some motors coming with M3 mount shafts which weigh as little as T mount and are a heck of a lot better....and are also compatible with M5 mount props. Higher pitch props also don't tend to be efficient. You need enough pitch but not too much. The 5.21"x2.6 is really realyl efficient. We might make a twin blade version of it for the light 5" quads.

@@Kabab looking forward to 3mm mount, that sounds like just the ticket for lightweight, i'll never complain about half as many fasteners to deal with, and it'd be great to use 5mm props with a spacer. The 2.6 is good but hoping for something in the 3.5-4.5 range would be more efficient at higher airspeeds as far as an air screw.

Maybe a week. Waiting on delivery

Think Tank FPV Helipak. Still the very best FPV backpack that exists. Nothing else comes close.

Would be super aggressive. Similar to a true 5 pitch on 5.1"

@@Kabab not for me, I fly 4S at 2400kv, you fly 2200kv in 6s that is equivalent to 3300kv in 4S, I’m I wright? I’m flying HQ 51x41 and I’d love to trade this 0.1 from pitch to length