Joel isn’t trying to replace Sarah. He was finally speaking openly about her, probably for the first time in 20 years. He was just sharing, something he doesn’t do often.
In the show it felt that way. But in the game it feels more like he's more open and accepting of Sarah since Ellie. And now has moved on and looks after Ellie like a father.
Nor did he lie about the hospital being attacked by Raiders. I mean, technically since there was only one of him the hospital was attacked by a Raider, but...
@@hawke5311 true, so he technically didn't lie about either of them. They stopped looking for a cure because they were too dead to look for one and they were attacked by a single raider.
a much better lie he could have said was that marlene tried to stop them killing her and he helped her, but they killed marlene and he had to run. she still might have been mad about not being able to give her life for a cure.. but he could have said that when he woke up he was being marched out to be executed without being told anything; he defended himself and killed some people.. interrogated somebody and learned that they were going to kill her and the doctor didn't really know what he was doing.
Just call her the original actress, not original VA who also did mocap. It was not mocap it was performance capture. So simply: Ashley Johnson originally played Ellie in the game. No restrictions.
The ending is essentially the trolley problem. And, in the words of the co-showrunner Craig Mazin, "the thing about the trolley problem is that it's a PROBLEM!" Some audience members really want to poke holes in the scenario in order to justify themselves being right. They're kinda deluding themselves a little. Is the Fireflies' decision murky? Yes. Is it serving a greater purpose? Also yes. Is Joel's decision murky? Yes. Is it serving a greater purpose? No. But he loves this kid and will absolutely not let any harm befall her. Did Ellie deserve a choice/to be informed? Yes. Did anyone give her the choice or inform her? No. Is she actually fit to make this decision? Who's to say, prob not. Would she have sacrificed herself? Yes. The entire situation is intentionally murky & grey & complex. Both sides having justifications for what they did is precisely what makes it so good. It's not meant to be a comfortable decision. And that is good. But if you were to ask Marlene or Joel if they would do what they did again... They'll say yes. And then there's the third side of Ellie & her situation. Everyone chose for her, no one told her. It is a tragedy through and through. Because Joel saved Ellie, but now their relationship is almost certainly affected by the lie Joel tells her.
Yeah I always felt the whole "Well maybe it wouldn't have worked" is a big cope. The story is much more interesting if it's a definitely would've worked scenario. Trolley problem wise even a 1% chance at a cure i'd do it cause the benefits outweigh the negative.
There is no cart dilemma here.This dilemma was taken from the novel by F.M. Dostoevsky "The Brothers Karamazov". Quote from the book: "The happiness of the whole world is not worth one tear on the cheek of an innocent child."
@@Ejay669 Neil (show runner/game creator) has said that in this world the cure will 100% work (logistics for distributing it are a bit more difficult) and that Joel doesn't care about that. In the show they kind of made it seem more of a chance than a for sure thing but in the game they made it seem more of a sure thing as it was designed to be.
@@Ejay669 The problem is even if they were successful in making a cure, it's not like the world would just go right back to the way it was. Everyone split off into smaller factions/groups and would likely not want to give up their power or resources, and what about the dilemma for all the people that resorted to raiding or slaving? I feel like the cure would just end up being treated like every other commodity and not a whole lot would actually change.
Ive played the games but never thought about how joel carried ellie out of the hospital the same way he was carrying sarah out of the city at the beginning
I personally really like how the game did it, even if the show didn’t fully recreate that part. Not only is Joel carrying her the same way, but in the game he’s running for their lives again, and the theme playing is the same one that plays when Sarah dies.
@@charlyjordan3545 It's absurd. Made more sense in the game, but only some. The show is great overall, you just can feel the weight of the writers here too much. Marlene is established as someone who gives chances and choices all throughout the plot, and then suddenly, nah she didn't ask Ellie after stating herself that she knew ellie would do the right thing? Please.
Yep! Just that background was CGI (in the scene where they fed it) cuz they built a blue screen stage in the giraffe's enclosure at the zoo. But the rooftop where they look at at all the other giraffes was a real set, tho.😊
Think about how Ellie feels after all of this. Getting told that you're the first known person to be immune and that it can lead to a possible vaccine/cure. Having all of these terrible experiences happen to her and all she can hope is that it'll all be worth it at the end once they reach the fireflies. At the age of 14, she'll be a savior of humanity... All for her to sleep through the entire process at the end and to be told by her most trusted confidante that a cure wasn't possible and not only that, she isn't that special since there's dozens just like her. She's hoping all of her losses would have some meaning at the end and she pretty much gets told by Joel that she'll eventually get over it/move on. I cannot wait for part 2.
Problem is that in the game it's revealed she isn't the first and they've failed multiple times before at synthesizing a cure. All the fireflies are doing is practicing the definition of insanity. They need something to believe in otherwise what's the point?
@@Benjammin0629 Oh yeah? Your reading comprehension ain't that good or you've been regurgitating what other people (who have terrible reading comprehension) said? Here's the transcript of the recording that a lot of idiots keep pointing out as evidence to what you're saying. PLEASE give me a breakdown as to the way you understood this recording. "April 28th. Marlene was right. The girl's infection is like nothing I've ever seen. The cause of her immunity is uncertain. As we've seen in all past cases, the antigenic titers of the patient's Cordyceps remain high in both the serum and the cerebrospinal fluid. Blood cultures taken from the patient rapidly grow Cordyceps in fungal-media in the lab... however white blood cell lines, including percentages and absolute-counts, are completely normal." "The girl's infection is like nothing I've ever seen." LITERALLY the 2nd sentence tells you THERE HAS NEVER BEEN ANY CASES LIKE ELLIE. The 4th sentence: "As we've seen in all past cases..." If you have below 3rd grade reading level I can maybe understand why so many people are confused by this. BUT IT IS CLEARLY talking about the way OTHER/NORMAL/AVERAGE (idk how else to explain this to someone that can't read) are affected by the Cordyceps. Source: thelastofus.fandom.com/wiki/Surgeon%27s_recorder Aside from the obvious, as someone that sides with Joel. Your reasoning (besides being based on not being able to listen/read properly) COMPLETELY ruins the story of TLOU. All the development that has happened is for naught. The story is all about how a father chooses his daughter over the entire world. It isn't about how a father after taking the time to reason logically and scientifically, decides to pick his daughter over the world. Next time please don't just say what other people are saying and actually play the game. Obviously if you only watch cutscenes, you'll actually miss the parts where there's plot development and/or dialogue in-between the cutscenes.
Great reaction as always! I feel like, yes, Joel needs Ellie, he is incapable of losing her, but not because she's a replacement for his daughter. In fact he has been trying to not get close to her all this time, until he couldn't help but to open his heart to her in the winter segment after she went to unspeakable lengths to keep him alive. Ellie is really the only person who changes him and brings out this side of him. Joel sees Ellie as another daughter, different from Sarah. He even tells this to her when he describes Sarah: "Not to say the two of you are the same." - I think people are misinterpreting that scene where they're walking through the woods. He's simply able to share a happy memory, because he's with the person that makes him the happiest - Ellie. He loves her for who she is, he has become attached to her and wants to get to know her. We'll probably see this when he tries to give her a "normal life" back in Jackson, trying his best to make her happy every day, and working hard to take an interest in her tastes. Joel lies to Ellie, as any parent has done - lying to protect you at any cost. Parents usually carry very large weights to protect their children. It doesn't even feel like a lie in his heart, because he's got her back and they're going home. In that final scene, Ellie basically tells Joel that she is tired of seeing everyone she loves die. She's trying to tell Joel that maybe she was meant to die too. And Joel tells her that if you keep going, you will always find something to live for - something that will keep you going when everything else falls apart. But Ellie knows that Joel is lying to her, she knows it, but she accepts it, and it hurts her, because he lies to her. And she will for sure hate him for it if she confirms the truth. But right now she knows she needs him just as much as he needs her, and after all, she finally found someone, someone who was able to be with her, who didn't leave her and saved her life - a father. "Everyone I've cared for has either died, or left me. Everyone fucking except for you." Can't wait to see how they adapt Part II!
I also saw a therapist break down the scene in the woods. She said that he also talks about how Sarah would have liked Ellie because he's trying to further justify his actions to himself. He needs to believe that Sarah would have wanted him to save Ellie. He needs to believe that saving Ellie was the right thing to do, even when he knows there's a good chance Ellie would have wanted to go through with the surgery. It's not just about sharing happy memories, it's a psychological defense mechanism that Joel is employing to convince himself more than anyone that he was doing the right thing.
@@NoctemAeternusMusic I never said otherwise. Joel did what he did because he loves Ellie and is incapable of losing her. He couldn't care less about what she thought about the surgery at that moment. That fact probably never even crossed his mind until Marlene brought it up in the parking garage. All he knew was they were going to kill Ellie, so he simply stopped them. It was like an instinct for him, he didn't think about it.
@@ecotton600 Sure, that's one way to see it. I personally don't see it that way. In my comment I just basically repeated what Pedro Pascal himself said about that scene in an interview, and he probably knows what was going on in Joel's head at that moment better than anyone else. "He's just riding this unconscious wave of delusion mixed with gratitude. Even though it comes with such a big lie, it doesn't feel like a lie in his heart, because he has her back and they're going home. It's the first time he's able to share a memory [of Sarah] that makes him happy, because he's with the person that makes him the happiest - his daughter, Ellie." - Pedro Pascal
@@proteh Ellie is still some form of replacement for Sarah. Joel is fully aware that Ellie is her own person and loves her for that. But it's still some form of replacement. He even does it subconsciously by comparing certain parts of Sarah and Ellie in the second-to-last scene.
One viewpoint I think is worth mentioning is that in the real world, parents make medical decisions for their children all the time. Ellie has suffered so much trauma, and probably suffers survivor's guilt, and also guilt for not staying awake with Sam like she promised, and probably even some guilt for other things like shooting the guy attacking Joel in Kansas City. I don't think she could necessarily make the decision to sacrifice herself with a clear head - she might in a sense want to sacrifice herself to balance her karma, or save her soul, or think that it wasn't fair she lived and Riley died so she "needs" to die. She also hasn't experienced enough of life to truly understand what life is, in all of its good and bad. She's seen many of life's horrors, but she hasn't seen enough of life's wonders to really know what she's giving up. Just as one example, she doesn't yet know the joy of being in a long loving romantic relationship with someone. So I don't think Joel would necessarily be wrong to say, "no, you're too young to make this decision; you need to wait a few years and grow up before you can decide if you want to sacrifice yourself for all humanity." I do think him lying to her is another thing, though, and much harder to justify.
What bugs me, and I don't see a lot of people pointing it out, is that Ellie can't even decide for herself yet, because she is a child! At least wait till she is 18 to EVEN ASK HER if she wants to sacrifice herself, but as a 14/15 year old, even if she chooses to give her life, she CAN'T, she is too young to make that decision! I think Joel, having taken completely the father role now, did what any parent would do: Protect your child, whether the child likes it or not. So I don't even see it as a gray area, he just did the ONLY thing he could do as the father of a teenager!
@Savage Jaeger *Potential Spoilers* I wouldn't say that the game's themes could remotely be described as "revenge is bad." I think it's a broad exploration of *hatred,* (in contrast to Part 1, which is primarily about the value and downsides of personal relationships and love). Part 2 explores hate from every perspective, and on every narrative scope - from its literal/main plotting, to its metaphorical subtext, and minor stories told through found-objects. It talks about revenge, prejudice (religious, gender, racial and sexual orientation), war, political schism, jealousy and personal resentments.
@@Im_Jaeger The story direction and order of events are done well for the story they tell, they just aren’t for everyone. And “revenge bad” is not at all why it ends the way it does. SPOILERS: In the end, Abby has become like Joel and Ellie has become like Abby. Ellie didn’t want Abby to kill Joel, so instead she doesn’t kill Abby. Ellie didn’t get to forgive Joel, so instead she forgives Abby. Everything Ellie does for Abby in the end is because she wanted it for Joel, but this is the closest she can get, not because of Abby or revenge in isolation. Unfortunately, it was a particularly long story, and narrative repeatedly misleads you by hiding from the player what the characters already know. The fact that the second last scene is the missing puzzle piece for everything from the beginning does little to help comprehend the story unless you go through it again. I, too, would have preferred a different story, but what we got absolutely has its merits.
When people said Bella Ramsey doesn’t look like video game Ellie, I was like….”She looks like the voice actor, Ashley Johnson, though. It’s fitting tbh.” And here we are coming full circle with Ashley playing Ellie’s mom.
@@StewartCB What's weird is that something seemed a little off with the background or bluescreen compositing process, so that the giraffe still seemed sort of stiff and robotic, and I thought it was CGI anyway. But I've only seen giraffes a couple times in my life, so maybe that's just how they are.
12:03 Yes that part! In the game it’s a frequent mechanic, so when you do it here Ellie simply doesn’t show up as a great way to mix story and gameplay while subverting expectations. Then Ellie sees the giraffe and runs off, dropping the ladder.
They didn’t give Joel a choice , they wouldn’t let him talk to her , woukd y tell her , didn’t wanna do other tests , just take her brain out , after Joel saves her , if he tells her , it’s too late , she hates him, feels guilty for ever , so once Joel is forced to save her , it’s too late . Had they let Joel speak to her , she would have agreed , he would have reluctantly agreed too. It’s on them
Exactly 💯 I've been saying this ever since I first saw this show. They gave Joel zero time to process the information. They did not allow him to talk to her before hand. They just rushed it and assumed he wouldn't bond with her after their 6 month journey together.
After the first game, folks called bullshit on their attempt to find a cure. I’m guessing this time around they attempted an explanation and people are still calling bullshit.
It's been great to join you guys as (two of you) you experience the story for the very first time. And Dani was a great host as she never let on what happens in the story and helped to answer questions whenever possible. Looking forward to watch y'all go through S02, whenever that may be :)
As the first episode was called "When you're lost in the darkness...", and the last episode is called "Look for the light", both of these titles describe a parallel between Joel and the Fireflies. With Joel, he had been "lost in the darkness" upon Sarah's death, and then he meets Ellie who becomes his light in which he had (although, involuntarily) found. Whereas you have the Fireflies who believe themselves to be a faction of "light" in the darkness that descended upon humanity from the first episode. This should remind one what Joel said to Ellie, in that final conversation to this episode, when telling Ellie that you always need something new to fight for. I don't believe Joel views Ellie as a "replacement" for the loss of Sarah, like one would be replacing a lightbulb that had burned out. Love is probably more complex to understand than even the Cordyceps infection, itself, for whatever that doctor/surgeon would be able to understand, or has understood, about Ellie's immunity. There are many moments where Joel comprehends Ellie as not having the same personality as Sarah. In fact, I believe Ellie has more the identical personality of Joel, which is probably why he didn't want to be anywhere near Ellie, to begin with, for fear of seeing himself in her and how broken she would become through various experiences... just like he did when this apocalypse began.
I don't know. It definitely felt like some form of replacement. Yes, Joel is aware that Ellie and Sarah are different, but he keeps on comparing them. Which is a sign of replacement. I don't think he does it consciously, but it comes of like that. This scene in the game doesn't come across nearly as creepy and weird as in the show. Not sure if that change was planned or it just translated this way to viewers due to the change of media format.
The fungus spores can't travel THAT fast through the blood stream, but she did cut the cord with the same knife that was just in the infected person's neck. And the throat is where the spore tendrils come out of, so the knife ended up infecting her.
Im sure others have told you but youre right.... that woman in the intro is the voice of ellie in the game. Actress is ashley johnson. I watch her and her friends play d&d on critical role. You guys should check out the animated show that came from ashleys d&d game. Her and her voice actor friends played a 3 year long d&d game that became a show. Ashkey created and voiced the character pike. Also laura bailey voiced the same nurse in this episode as she did in tlou game. Laura is also in the d&d show. Its called Legend of Vox Machina. Its very graphic and adult humor.
The girl in the green pants is the first reactor I've saw who was able to sympathize with the fireflies. I feel Joel wanting to save Elle and Marlene deciding to sacrifice her are both very nuance decisions but people simplified it by thinking it's just good vs evil. Your analysis was so refreshing to hear that it made me subscriber, thanks
There’s no “right” answer…..it’s all about perspective. That’s what makes the game and the show so great. That being said, even if the Fireflies did successfully make a vaccine, it’s too late to save the world because there’s no global infrastructure anymore. The only people that would get the vaccine would be other Fireflies or they’d use it to get people to join them. They would never give it to FEDRA members or any citizens in the QZ who supported them. The vaccine would just be another tool to help them win their war.
She was too young to decide it's very easy to manipulate a 14 year old to sacrifice herself for humanity. Joel did the right thing and no he doesn't have a weird obsession with her you'll see and understand why he did it next season
i meannn, sorry for bean 0 moral but, if it's the apocalypse and even if a fking 8 year old is the cure, you can't blame them for wanting everything going back to normal, i would have done the same if i was in Joel position ofc, but the Fireflies aren't in the wrong neither. Just put this, the whole humanity maybe 300,000 or 500,000 people (i just make the numbers up idk how many humans are still out there) for the sacrifice of one girl, i think is obvious where the balance would go
Glad you understood that they had every opportunity to keep her alive and that it would’ve been smart to stay small and keep studying her while they escalate. I think that shows their one doctor was probably incompetent as a scientist and his random evidence-free theory is unlikely to work. Joel should have explained it to her of course so they could plan how to get help from better scientists, preferably without harming her. Informed consent (in both directions) and allowing Ellie to keep her own agency is clearly the one ethical choice… which no one made. Great reaction as always!
Highly recommend playing last of us 2. That game was a masterpiece, and if the show follows it as closely as this season, you're in for a darker season and you haven't seen how bad ass ellie can be.
i love how they made the voice of Ellie in the game as the mother in show since she is really the one who brought her to life in the game. everyone who played a major role in the game also played in the show. the voice actor of joel was in the last episode, he was the one who got the machete to the neck. Marlene is the only one who played her character in both the game and the show.
“ It’s a small world.” Yes, I think when I a few billion people die over a weekend, and then more untold billions continue to die over the next 20 years, and through the entire course of the show we have seen multiple people die as well as just straight up mass killings of humans. So yeah I guess when your species is going extinct, the world does tend to get a lot smaller, hence the last of us. 😂😂😂😂😂
Two stories I heard about related to the story of this show. Neil Druckmann had said that they surveyed people’s reactions to the ending of the game, which is essentially the same as the show, and got drastically different responses on whether or not they would do what Joel did. 100% of parents said they would without a doubt. Those without children, only 50% said they would do what Joel did. Similarly, a political figure in Israel(?) had to make a difficult decision of trading prisoners for his own son being held hostage. He said that from a parent’s perspective, he would trade anything to protect his child. But politically, it’s not that easy to say.
Also he’s not trying to replace Sarah. That’s just dumb. He literally explains to her their differences. He’s just opening up to her, being the Joel from the start of the series that has that special relationship with his daughter. He’s bonding with Ellie like he hadn’t done with anyone in 20 years. Talking about your dead kid is a MAJOR step for parents to move forward. The reason it might seem “weird” is because we’ve spent 9 episodes of seeing nothing but “a-hole Joel”. Their talk in the forrest is the same vibe as him trying to play boggle with her and teach her how to play guitar. Only difference is you just saw him massacre an army to save her.
There are so many definitions, degrees, and interpretations of "replace." You obviously took the word too literally. More importantly though, it's pretty easy to disagree with someone's take without calling it dumb.
It's interesting Dani recognized Ellie's voice actor in the video game cuz this show actually features other actors from the game. The previous episode featured Troy Baker who played Joel in the game and one of the doctors in this episode was also in the video game.
The guy operating on Ella was not even a surgeon he was a botanist who was simply going to harvest Ellie's brain in the wild hope of being able to replicate the condition.
apart from the fact that Ellie is 14 years old and doesn't have the maturity to make that decision, Marlene and Joel would have made their own decision no matter what Ellie says, Marlene is the leader of the fireflies and her mission is the cure, they will make any sacrifice for this reason and Joel is a man who cares for his loved ones and cares about his family, Ellie not only healed his pain but also sees her as part of his life and he will not let them take it away from him, he will protect her no matter what , killing or lying as long as she remains safe.
The Fireflies main goal is not the finding, making, and giving a cure; but the overthrow of FEDRA (Federal Emergency Response Agency). So, they would end up weaponizing the "cure" by limiting who gets the "cure" in exchange for power and control over the people. In addition, their 20 years of experience in overthrowing FEDRA, shows how incompetent they truely are as an organization and could be seen as a guide to how ineffective they would be in being able to mass produce and distribute a "cure".
Apologies for adding more comments so long afterward, but the one thing I don't see acknowledged enough is that Marlene (a character I loved) miscalculated Joel's attachment to Ellie. From Marlene's perspective, Joel was treating Ellie like cargo; he was emotionally shut down and wouldn't give them too much resistance once he'd delivered his "cargo." Marlene never expected them to bond, essentially.
She knew him as the guy who threw kids in the fire, her biggest mistake underestimating his capacity for change (which, in her defense, based on all the info she had available seemed bloody unlikely).
i'm sure someone in the comments has already told you ladies this fun fact, but, The actress who plays Ellies' pregnant mother is Ashley Johnson, who plays Ellie in the games :D
How Crazy It Must Have Been For Ellie(Ashley) And Marlene To Be Acting Out The Last Of Us In A Huge Budget Production, Especially Since It’s Been Years Since They Did A Scene Together
What makes the decision understandable is that the fireflies stated that she wasn’t even able to fully give her consent that this is what she wanted. Joel wasn’t given the option of saying goodbye and on top of all of that, they only said it COULD be a cure. Nothing about Joel’s decision is supposed to be good but the minute we say, “I don’t know what I would do in this situation.” Is the minute we admit we may have done the exact same thing in Joel’s shoes.
Also incase yall didnt know... marlene is the same actress that voiced marlene in the game. So ellies mom and marlene, the actresses, have been acting together since the first game as marlene and ellie... and hames from ep8, the guy ellie got in the neck with the clever, not the religious guy but his right hand man... that was the voice of joel in the game. So ellie technically killed joel. lol
A lot of people don’t seem to get why Joel did what he did. Joel did what a parent would do pure and simple. He’d rather let the world burn then his “kid” die.
Because she also knows that he is a heartless disconnected SOB. Realistically, she should be more concerned about not paying him for the job than about killing Ellie.
"he should have let her decide for herself" How exactly was he supposed to do that? They kidnapped them off the street stunning them both and knocking out joel. When he woke up she was already unconcious and in the surgery room and they didnt tell ellie what they were going to do and they wouldnt let joel see her and tried to kick him out. How exactly was joel supposed to let her decide for herself?????
Just wait for her to wake up. Realistically a couple of hours won't matter when they have a potential cure in their posession. But obviously that would complicate things morally.
Ellies mom played Ellie in the video game. The girl in the middle was on to something. the two other girls ignored her :D And it's not just "voice acting" She literally plays her, motion caption
Please run your mic audio through a compressor, the dynamic range is a bit crazy between loudly talking straight into the mic and quiet discussion facing each other. Idk what software you're using for recording but there should be a built-in audio compressor in any decent program. If not, you might be able to do it in editing.
I don't think anyone would sacrifice their kid just on the half-baked theory that them getting the thing in her head could cure humanity. It's not a choice between saving Ellie and saving humanity, it was a choice of saving Ellie and believing a promise made by desperate people. If I were Joel, I would tell her the truth right away. I'd say, "Ellie, they wanted to kill you because they THOUGHT what they got from you MIGHT save humanity. You might be OK with that, but I'm not. There was no time, they had you on the table with the knife ready. They gave me no choice. Sorry not sorry."
Think of this: Can a fourteen year-old consent to sex? Join the army? Drink? Give and organ? If you answered "no" to all of the above, then you have your answer about Ellie consenting. Unless you give her power over the other issues in terms of consent, then she cannot ever be able to give consent to being euthanized. That is what Marlene wanted to do to her. She wasn't even carrying out Ellie's wishes because she wanted to kill Ellie. As for Joel, he was doing the only thing Anna, Ellie's mother, asked of her. Joel was carrying out Anna's wishes. Marlene was in effect murdering Ellie. I'll leave you with this: Given what Dr. Neumann said in the 1968 section where there was no cure, no vaccine, no medicines. Then in the 2003 section where Dr. Ratna in Jakarta said effectively the same, "No vaccine. No medicines." What made Marlene think with their limited equipment and that doctor Joel killed almost non existent testing facilities, think they could create something scientists couldn't create when the world was whole and more advanced equipment were available? Quite simply, they had nothing and they would have killed Ellie for nothing. That's what Joel was saving her from. Remember in episode two when Joel was condescending to both Ellie and Tess about a cure. He said they'd said that about a billion times and nothing so far manifested. Bottom line: Ellie may have had cells within her that made only HER immune, but did she really have what it would have taken to create something that couldn't be created? Marlene was doing some gigantic leaping. To me Joel did no wrong. He was not replacing Sarah with Ellie. His words to Ellie when he said she and Sarah weren't alike, proved he wasn't. What Joel wanted was that second chance. That ability to have another daughter, and by extension throughout all the bad things he'd done, like he said to Tommy, there was a reason he lost Sarah and the reason he didn't die after attempting to commit suicide. He was needed for a somewhat "higher calling."
Lol you can see her looking side to side when she said “that’s good casting” that’s the voice actress from the game wym good casting, you mean good casting of Bella ? Lol idk that’s what I was thinking
I loved everything about the hospital massacre montage. I love that the sound is muffled, and we mainly just hear this music. And everytime the sound of the violence breaks through (like that one guy's scream when Joel stabs him), it is effective. It is essentially from Joel's perspective. He's almost disassociated. Because he is of a one-track mind. Nothing matters to him, these people don't matter to him. Only Ellie and her life matters to him. Everyone else is just an obstacle. Someone who needs to go down. He has no emotions or rage or anything against these people. They are simply in his way. Also, reminds me of the Clitn Eastwood movie, Unforgiven in a way. The best gunfighter isn't necessarily the fastest or most strategic. The best gunfighter is simply the calmest and a bit lucky. And just like Will Munny... Joel's "always been lucky when it comes to killing." >:) Also glad that they didn't have him kill the nurses. He killed everyone who was a threat or in his way. The nurses were neither. Plus, the game *REQUIRES* the player to kill the surgeon and the nurses are optional.
In the game you can find various notes about the procedure and "The Possible Cure". Even the doctor knew that what they were gonna do was probably nothing and ellie would die for nothing and that was it, but it was a very small possibility of them finding a posible cure, or a start. But very small to the point that... It was.more delusional than anything else
P.s. i totally watched your intro recap because yall rock. You mentioned david was off burning somewhere now... i wonder if him burning is a connection to the religion he used to control people. Now hes burning in the hell ellie created for him.
The problem with letting her decide for herself is that she's currently a highly traumatized 14 year old girl, who recently had to kill a cannibal, and is currently suffering some form of PTSD due to it. We don't let 14 year old's make medical decisions now, let alone one's who aren't currently in the right head space. Ellie wants all the shit she went through to be for a reason, so in her current mindset she'd probably willingly kill herself just so there was a point to all her suffering.... BUT this isn't a sure fire thing. They THINK it could be a cure, they don't know.... they also spent zero time looking into non lethal options, they just decided its easiest and fastest to lop off the top of her head and start scooping. Its incredibly murky..... which is the whole point lol
@@Laochri Seems a little pointless. Definitely not enough material for that.There isn't much to tell in the time inbetween part 1&2. They mostly chill in Jackson and help to grow the community. The few pivotal and interesting moments from that time will be shown in season 2 and 3 anyway.
HBO announced almost as soon as the long-running SAG strike was over, the first shows to go back into production would be The Last of Us and House of the Dragon. Also that TLOU seasons 2&3 would cover the second game and both will have more episodes than season 1 I really enjoyed all your reactions for this show and I will definitely be watching more!! ❤ To you and yours ladies. Jon from Aus
At the latest in the scene after the giraffes, after Ellie tells that she could not stop halfway and has to finish the journey, it is clear to Joel how Ellie would decide should this require a sacrifice from her. In the end, however, he cannot accept this because he could not lose another daughter and bear it emotionally. He decides Ellies fate, and this is a deeply selfish decision, stemming primarily from his daughter's death, which he has not processed and accepted to this day.
Y’all need to play the video games of TLoU. It’s okay if you guys don’t but just recommending it so that you guys could play the 2nd TLoU, instead of waiting on the next season of the show.
38:06 laaate to the party, but its from Troy's (Joel game actor) interview? or sth else when he showed up in public and talked about ending of Part One. "He did, he did save the world. It's just that the world was that girl, and that's it."
I don't think Joel see's Ellie as a replacement he just refused to lose another daughter to something he see's as a delusional pipe dream as he said in episode 2. The reason he was talking to Ellie so much was he was trying to keep her occupied so she wouldn't be constantly in her head. She was probably out of it a lot since they escaped the cannibal resort.
