The Most TOXIC Mary Sue Gets Kicked Out 

psychiatrists should play dnd undercover during their training, would be a great field study lmao

There is a very important takeaway from this post: *SPEAK UP IF SOMETHING IN THE GAME IS BOTHERING YOU.* I made this mistake myself; I didn't say anything about a player who was making me uncomfortable because I thought I was the only one who had a problem and maybe my discomfort was a me problem. But after they left, at least one other player AND the DM also expressed grievances with them. You're often not alone with people like this, and even if you aren't, you shouldn't just let yourself be uncomfortable; D&D is supposed to be fun.

I am convinced that 90% of dnd players need assertiveness training.

I made a character once that was neutrally aligned. He was cursed with good rolls and I wanted to kill him off, it got really difficult when I invaded a goddess' temple and pushed a tower on her, killing her. My character got extremely rich and famous all because of good rolls. I betrayed my party and had many of them killed making my character into a sort of oblivious but devious villain. However my DM rolled with the punches and the other players actually enjoyed the session. I retired that character because of obvious reasons and rolled a new character. The DM had us go after my old character and eventually killed him. I think in my case I didn't take anything that happened personally and I got really into the RP so much that it enriched the session. Then the DM played off what I had done. My group are all fairly close friends so if we have a disagreement it doesn't bother us on a meaningful level. If Sue could divorce her characters from her own ego I believe she could have been a really good player. She's creative and gets into the campaign lore, shame she was such a bitch.

"Gradually starts to show her true colors." My dude. *Two years* of some of the most toxic madness I've ever seen coming from one person, and she was swinging right out of the gate. Didn't take more than one session. 'Course I feel bad for the OP and group, but someone needed a backbone in this situation, desperately.

I've actually dealt with the opposite of a Mary sue, where an oc has like so much trauma and things done to them that they always want the spotlight and something bad is always happening to them. Like, don't get me wrong, some trauma or conflict is good to have in a character but not to the point where its that whole character's personality.

When I first listened to this episode, I was irritated that OP and co put up with this for two years. But suddenly last month my friend group and I realised that we have been in the same situation for the past year, and it was only when we had a ‘straw that broke the camel’s back’ moment and discovered other people with the same problems with this person that we finally started seeing all the red flags. We confronted her and then the trash took itself out. Several weeks later, we are still unearthing red flags and shit that we should never have let slide. Hindsight is a bitch

I played a blind Druid once, my DM and I agreed it would be cool to basically have Toph from Avatar, so she used tremorsense to see. It was gifted to her through magic and was bound to her, so dispel magic would take her “sight” but it would regenerate in 1 minute.

I've never actually seen a female version of the neckbeard trope, but that's pretty much what i expect sue to look and act like.

Two years of this?! I kinda think she literally just had a list of "Things I want to get away with". And after the first year she just kept adding more things. "I'm the youngest but I'm also the party mom" makes me think she wanted to be everything with the way she switched characters.

As an editor, I’ve read many Mary Sue stories, but one that stood out to me with how entitled she was, was about a girl named Raine. Raine came from the highest of nobility and got everything she wanted. She was praised and loved by everyone. She was the most popular girl in town. She was perfect. But her one “flaw” was her “evil” parents. And I’m putting these in quotation marks for a reason. Her parents were so “evil” they wanted her to study for a test and didn’t give her an expensive present. She spent over 8 chapters crying about how she was the victim of abuse and about how terrible her life was. The next chapter, half way through might I add, was about her getting magical powers. And you should already know she mastered them instantly and was the most powerful magic user. She left home to live a “perfect” life with people who basically worshipped her as a god for how powerful she was. And that was the end. The next Mary Sue story I want to add was about someone named Frost. Frost was a normal girl until her sister disagreed with her, then she ran away from home, crying about how hard her life was. “For some reason she became the most powerful being in the universe,” and that is a quote from the book. Frost did not train to use her powers, she was instantly the best, she could use every weapon perfectly by touching it, and her one “flaw” was that the power was dark. And that didn’t affect anything, it wasn’t like she was given a power and it slowly corrupted her as she used it more, that would be smart. The entire story was her killing random people for no reason then crying victim when she got caught. If people didn’t immediately bow down to her as their next god, she would kill them and keep crying about her “broken soul.” It was definitely more interesting than the first story, but for all the wrong reasons.

Its kind of hard to sympathize with OP when they never called her out on her behavior. Some of the thing vented here seemed oversensitive or nitpicky too but again, talk to her. I get that shes horrible but shes not gonna get any better if she doesn't get to know she's doing snything wrong. This going on for 2 yeaŕs is frankly absurd.

Sue is like a girlfriend that wants an open relationship but doesn't want you to sleep around, who will tell you about her other sex partners and get mad that you're not jealous, who complains that you don't give her room but wants to be with you 24/7, who gets into all sorts of stupid situations and then bitches when you don't stand up for her, etc... 1/10 won't girlfriend again

"Disliking her character was the same as disliking her." I don't see a problem in this particular case.

I have this one character who expects everyone to treat her like a Mary Sue and the rest of the guys in her rebel group would like to give her up to the bad guys. She's fun to write.

Some people can be horrible. Just because they hide behind 'tragic background' or 'marginalized group' doesn't change the fact that they're rotten to the core. A lot of serial killers have tragic backgrounds, but there are millions of people that went through horrible stuff and never turned into abusers themselves. There are no excuses.

"Every time OP crits on me it feels so personal!" Yes, I'm sure that OP was willing the dice to roll 20's because he doesn't like you, not just weird luck for a 5% chance for a specific number to be rolled.

As a nonconfrontational person, I understand OP's stance to a point but it's so frustrating to watch this from an objective view. She should have been kicked out aaaaaaages ago.

Long story time: My first roleplay experience (2013ish) wasn't tabletop or dice based, it was forum based, we were a bunch of teenage werewolves trying to blend in at a college with a mystery plot. Five of the six members got along brilliantly, each having exceptional writing skills and consideration for each other's characters. We were all in different timezones so each entry would usually be a pretty long paragraph as nobody could do quick fire back and forth, and we would all take a turn to write and if someone hadn't posted in a while, we would wait for them to catch up. Any interactions between characters would be open for interpretation, ie my male character (Vane) and the other male character(Ryan) would scrap a lot (and while the other characters would be trying to break them up, the players in the OOC chat would be commenting on the scrap like a wrestling match) but a typical entry would end with something like "Ryan threw his arm out in a powerful right hook" and it was up to the other player to determine if their character dodged it or took it (I usually took it as Ryan was faster than Vane, who was stronger). My wolf's main flaw was that he had a heart condition which stopped him from being OP as he was the biggest/strongest wolf. The party generally used him as a tank for the first or last part of a fight, my own rule for him was three "rounds" of combat and then he needed to dip out. At one point we were fighting the big bad, which resulted in everyone desperately trying to save the party's cinnabun character, including Vane overexerting himself through 8 rounds of combat. This lead to a scene where Vane was essentially having a heart attack and the party frantically trying to save him (we had all had our big, main character moments and I was the last in the limelight) and as it was near the end of the story everyone in OOC was like "Oh my god, is he going to die?! You've got to give him a happy ending! Who's placing bets on if [I] will kill Vane off?!" Sounds like a fun campaign where everyone had a great time right? Almost. We had a Mary Sue. She was a werewolf/vampire (vampires didn't exist in this universe until she insisted, and she also tried to be part dragon, which we shut down) and butted herself into every body's limelight moment. She was always perfect, always on it and she would meta game using info from OOC that her character wouldn't possibly know. Her own limelight moment was her finding her old video camera with happy times of her and her brother on it with her watching it silently crying. There was no build up, no context, we were all awkward and then she never mentioned it again (I ended up in a different roleplay on that forum and she used the same character and the same moment). We often tried to work around her while still letting her have fun. When Vane was having his "will he, won't he" moment, Sue's character picked him up bridal style (again this dude is like 7ft tall, she was 5'5" at most), placed him on the bed (missed the part where we were still in the woods), bit his neck and....infused blood into him? Her paragraph described how his wounds disappeared, his breathing steadied and she turned to the group and said "He'll be okay, he just needs to rest" We all told her in OOC that we would be disregarding her post and continuing from the previous one as she had just ruined the climax. She threw a tantrum OOC and in game was sat in the background saying he deserved to die for being so stupid. (We later found out Sue the player had a crush on Vane the character). Vane did survive but at the cost of never being able to transform again. For our next campaign, we made our own website with a password and never told Mary Sue about it so she thought we disbanded after the last campaign. We had spent the whole year of that campaign trying to guide her, help her improve, explain where she was doing things right and wrong, all was met with arrogance and dismissal.

Personally i love my characters having flaws. I dont understand why people dont like having flaws on their character. It takes away from their personality.

After hearing stories like this I’m glad my friends and I will all openly talk about disliking someone if we do. You be surprised how often “being confrontational” actually leads to way less confrontation

To all the people asking "How did they let this go on for two whole years?", I can totally understand how it happened. There were *two* guys in my old gaming group that I hung around with for about that same length of time. One was a Mary Sue with Main Character Syndrome (in an Alternity: Dark Matter campaign, which is a Supernatural/X-Files inspired contemporary horror setting, while the rest of the party chose to be an FBI agent, a private eye paranormal investigator, a touring punk rock musician, and a Winchester Brothers-style monster-hunting drifter, he insisted on playing a "billionaire computer genius and master of an obscure South American martial art.") who openly told the group that we were only there to be his sycophantic sidekicks. The other only seemed to game as some kind of nihilistic performance art where he did everything he could to sabotage or outright scuttle the plot for the other players. One day, while we were waiting to meet up with them, I finally let it slip to my brother that I really didn't like either of them. My Bro: "Then why didn't you say anything before now?" Me: "I thought you liked them, so I put up with their nonsense for your sake." My Bro: "No, I can't stand them either. I just didn't say anything because I thought *you* liked them." And so, after years of both of us hating them in silence, we cut the pair of them off and cast them aside like the gangrenous pinkie toes they were to our great relief.

I honestly can't personally understand how DM/GM/ST's and players let stuff like this go on for so long. Like just the other day there was miscommunication between my character and an NPC that was more between me and the Story Teller. I was getting frustrated and was starting to take it out in game. I got two sentences in and was like "Wait, hold on, out of character talk. I feel like I'm being targeted and punished for something I didn't do." ST: "You lied and were caught." ME: "No I gave an answer, but not the one she already knew about. My character at this moment believes she covered her tracks well enough and there isn't a current issue with the guy she killed." ST: "Oh, I thought you were trying to avoid and then give excuses." ME: "Not excuses, just thought prosses in her defense. She admits to her mistake and honestly apologizes for it." ST: "Alright, I think I understand. We'll roll back to before your outburst cause that sounded like it came out of the frustration of the miscommunication." ME: "Sounds good to me, and sorry about that." ST: "No worries, happens to the best of us." And that was it, we went right back into playing. No issues, no revenge, no meta/OOC punishments. We were good, the rest of the party was good and even commended the two of us for how we handled the situation. The more I watch videos like these the more I just feel I've gotten really lucky that I found a great gaming group.

I want to put some of the people from these stories in the game together and see how it goes. Sue, the cringey cheater, the jealous DM who kept trying to kill the friend of his crush, etc. It would be glorious.

"Innocent, high class woman who is also extremely sexual and violent" Sounds like she'd absolutely love Camellia from Wrath of the Righteous Then flip out when she discovers her Alignment

I once played in an all Mary Sue party, we all (as players) knew each other and were close friends, we did this just for a gag and wanted to see how ridiculously this could get, every pc we have played was a Mary Sue archetype, this campaign was, as comically possible, awesome, we were just throwing shit at each other and at the same time keeping us all alive since our characters deeply knew they couldn't live with the thought of someone being able to kill one of them that wasn't in fact themselves, and they actually grew to be closer friends, still trying to show they're better than the others. The campaign ended with each of our characters building a reign that still fight to this day and are equally balanced, so it is a permanent stale. The party was composed of: a half-elf paladin, a Beast Barbarian/scout rogue lizardfolk, a necromancer gnome and me, an orc valor bard.

Alright, this story made me mad at OP's group. Hear me out. I remember how I was at Sue's place when I was 15-16, and when I found out that people secretly hated me behind my back, but NEVER said anything to my face, I was shocked. And thought that it's kinda stupid. I was an annoying kid, but I would've understood if people politely asked me to stop. But no one said ANYTHING, ever. What's the point of being mad at someone when you just stay silent and never tell them "hey, could you please not do that"? And instead, you just laugh about it when the person leaves and tell everyone what a weirdo they were. Please, people, LEARN TO COMMUNICATE. If you're afraid that they'll get upset or mad at you, remember that, as my therapist said, "someone's emotional reaction is not your responsibility, but theirs". If they become an asshole after hearing you out, that exposes their red flags, not yours. It's not the first time when I notice this problem in DnD players and people in general, and it's kinda annoying how people like to hate on someone behind their back because they didn't have enough confidence to talk to that person directly. Just... don't do that. Thank you for coming to my ted talk.

This is legitimately the first toxic D&D story I have heard where my desire to destroy the toxic person has reached 100

Oh my god!! My story!!!!! I can't believe CritCrab actually did it. Now to watch and relive my horror. EDIT: CritCrab, I 110% agree needing to do a session zero. I'm happy to say that since we booted Sue, I've held a session zero for every campaign I've run since, even if we've played together before. I learned my lesson about expectations and talking to players when issues come up. And yes, everyone saying we should've booted her much sooner, you're absolutely right! We were like frogs getting slowly boiled in a pot of hot water. It wasn't all bad at the beginning, and I naturally couldn't include all the decent moments in-between the bad (I tried to keep things related to the horror story.) That's why it took two years for things to resolve. It's been almost two years since I posted this story and I've gone a long way as both a person and D&D player since. With experience comes wisdom! I hope you all enjoyed listening to my suffering

I'm more interested in hearing why Sue was hanging with that group at all, she hated like every other person there. If you really don't like a certain type of people - just don't be a part of their group, for the sake of your own nerves

I find it comical that she doesn't realize that if a paladin falls they don't reclass, they just become an oath breaker

"Let me give you a list..." #1 would have gotten her kicked out right away, let alone the other reasons

OP - "Put up with for 2 years..." Me - ::visible eye twitching:: "Don't blame the victim, don't blame the victim, don't blame the victim, don't blame the -"

I'm a DM myself, and the last time I had someone acting like this damn marie sue, I kicked him out of both the session AND the room after 15 minutes of circus. As a DM, it's part of our responsibility to keep toxic players like this out of our sessions, as they only ruin the fun for everyone involved

A while back in a writing class we were doing a collaborative writing assignment with the entire class and the setting was a fantasy colosseum. Everyone was making and introducing their characters, but one girl made herself an immortal Mary Sue, and I decided to nip that in the bud as soon as possible. When it was my turn, I made myself the announcer and made it so that in the colosseum, all divine status' and their effects' would be nullified and force any character with any sort of divinity to fight on an even playing field as other characters, for the sake of the audience. The only weapons they could use were their own body, mind, and any weapon on their person. If the weapon was special in any way, it would only have the strength of a regular sword. A truly fair fight. That's girl's character was one of the first to go.

Hard to feel bad for a group of people that chose to put up with this so completely

DND PSA: if you don't have fun playing with a certain player, don't invite them to your next campaign!

I feel like Sue shouldn't be allowed within 100 yards of children.

As much as I think she's in the wrong I also think that it should've not taken 2 years for an experienced DM to figure this shit out

Tbf, calling a player racist for anti human comments in game is ridiculous

Players like this need to be confronted on such issues way sooner. A non-confrontational attitude just doesn't work here.

The OP watched Sue harassed all of his friends, sexually harassed their PCs one by one through out the years, and only when it's his turn he decided to grow a backbone? The frustration hearing all of Sue's behavior being tolerated, gosh. Well, to the OP, your regrets are valid.

i was surprised when i found out "sue" was in her late twenties, from what you had described she was acting like someone in their early teens

Man, the OP was just as toxic by being so conflict averse. They played two years with this toxic singularity of a person and just decided to "see what happens" instead of kicking her out.

"It is what my character's nature is" means they dont want development. My ranger was blindly following the ideals of Silent Rain(merc group) of all goblinoids must die. After about a few weeks (in game) of working with the group he was given a choice of work with goblins or fight more enemies with little help.... He chose to work with the goblins with the encouragement of the party

Mary Sue is honestly one of the worse archetypes in writing. But if one does even manage to make a Mary Sue a good character that is well developed, that's not a Mary Sue. Edit: Dang there's some actual discussion about this topic lol. Second edit: Haha funny number of replies hahaha.

I knew someone like this and when they tried to guilt trip me, they freaked after they watched my apathetic face quickly become a grin for a second

This is one of the greatest example of my rule of no in character romance in the foreground. Everyone can do it but just off screen because it always gets awkward.

These guys are so annoying, just like, you're not the most important one, you are NOT the main charather, or if anything you are ONE of the main charathers.

Making an older character that seems/looks younger can be interesting, making a character that appears innocent but is s*xual (or vice versa) can be interesting, combining the two is never ok and belongs in some messed up neckbeard's headcanon.

This archetype has actually given me an idea. What is the character was a Mary Sue, BUT it’s because they’re cursed? Like, they wanna just be a normal person and experience failure, like normal people do, but they have a curse that makes them perfect at everything, which is super annoying for them, and they’re constantly seeking a way to cure this curse and live a normal life

Going to have to say; not confronting her early about her behavior lead to years of suffering for everyone. You have to hammer out issues early in campaigns. Everyone's time is equally valuable at the table and allowing players like that to participate negatively without recourse is negligence on everyone's part. You live and you learn, tho. Quite a story!

This is what I learned in school about 'group' projects: sometimes you get groups that pitch in their 20%/25% and things go well and sometimes you get groups where it's you and one other person (maybe) doing all the work to get it done... Then there's the group where everyone appears on the same page but one member fucks around the entire duration of the group project, affects everyone's grades but somehow comes away demerit free because they begged and pleaded and guilted the teacher/principal/other students into believing they were 'sick' and 'tried to do their best' but was unable/did not have her project work to turn in thus acquiring sympathy/pity from an outside source. I learned quickly that I absolutely dislike people that do this sort of behavior and thankfully am more aware of it nowadays.

It's like in South Park where they're pretending to be LotR and Clyde does a roll call where Kyle is a Paladin and he keeps being called the Jew. I immediately thought "you 4 are vital. The Rogue, the gray wizard, the cleric, and the Sue" "PALADIN! >:("

Tldr, being aversed to conflict tends to invite and grow conflict to obscene levels that are always worse than if issues were faced and dealt with earlier.

I loved how you used a picture of kirito when you are talking about mary sue's

Kicking her made sense. Buy I would say her being upset at never being talked to about her behavior and just getting booted, in her view randomly, would make her reasonably upset.

I am perplexed why, if Sue was so terrible IRL, people still played with her. For *two* years? Lesson learned: Life is too short to put up with people like this in your life. No game > horrible game.

I appreciate that you are like the only storytime youtube channel that doesnt seem like a ai generated content farm

This is why I like being the "Big bro" of any group when it's required, usually it never gets bad but making sure everyone feels comfortable in a session, even if it's something silly and small, is a good thing to keep track of.

Wouldn't call this a mary sue, just a spoiled brat. I must say these situations wouldn't spring up so much if the DM would just put their foot down, or set up some ground rules regarding etiquette before a campaign starts. As for the players, show some backbone damn it!

Dnd Party: *has major issues* CritCrab: "but did you have a session zero? I think you should've had a session zero!"

This reminds me of someone who I roleplayed with who kept trying to brutally torture my character to death in NSFL ways without my permission because someone they liked was dating my character. I would just try to find comical ways for my character to get out of the situation because I wanted to avoid any serious confrontation while also avoiding being involved in that person's weird torture fantasy which I really wasn't comfortable with, but that just led them to accuse me of power playing. Then when someone else's character was mean to their's they went on about how terrible that person was being. Like bro...

The story is very clearly fake, just due to the fact that it fits all the “Reddit bad guy” archetypes, but it’s still a fun listen

Actually! Mary Sue’s do possesses flaws; though they’re superficial, do not effect the character in any meaningful way and are often resolved as soon as humanly possible.

Mary Sue is a fun archetype when it's just someone writing fanfiction or some s*** cuz it's fun for them. Mary Sue is not fun when in a DND party dealing with other people

Dude these people need to grow a BACKBONE. I understand people can be non confrontational but to play with someone like that for two YEARS!!! Ridiculous

Sounds like a lot of hurt could have been avoided if all of the players were able to communicate like human beings instead of pissing themselves at the thought of a confrontation. I get it, confrontations and discussions can be a bit unconfortable, but they are the only thing that can help when a group is having a miscommunication. They should have just spoke with Sue and told her how they felt, ideally 1on1 with the DM so she doesnt feel cornered, and see what comes of it. If she doesnt want to change, kick her. If she does, well there you go, problem solved, or at least its a step. Dont wait 2 years in misery just cause youre afraid to speak up, for the love of god

you played dnd for two years with a racist homophobic transphobe eith anger issues? at that point i cant even feel bad, these are not just redflags but the red sea.

I had a similar thing (though not as bad) in my college friend group. There was a young woman who was always a jerk to me, but I’d always been an easy target and was used to being picked on. It “wasn’t as bad as high school” and I was afraid that saying anything would lose me friends. I put up with her for 4 years, and then a decade later I reconnected with the group and found out that almost everyone had issues with her, and most dropped her like a hot rock after college.

This is why even though most people don't like confrontation it is ALWAYS best to address things like Sue as they happen, or you end up having to deal with it for a long time and it just takes away from everyone's experience.

God are there bigger confrontational cowards in this world than TTRPG players?

I'm often considered the "asshole" by my friends because I tell the most honest truth. If something is bothering me, I make it apparent, and I make sure it's just me it's bothering before I decide to not take action. Recently in the group, there were two people we finally got tired of. I myself am bisexual, and this guy we had in the group for about a year had gradually started to just be blatantly discriminate, even in the sessions with the other group members now. I got pissed off, because I had enough on my plate as it was, and after confirming with the group it wasn't just me who received this, I gave him a piece of my mind, and we kicked him out. This other girl in the group was extremely attention craving, she loved to tell her stories about her traumatic experiences, and wore them almost pridefully, which wouldn't bother me too much, except the stories could legit be something like her sister tattling on her. She made herself seem on the level of actual abuse with her 'trauma' or whatever, and she had anger issues like Sue here in the video, and also loved to be the main character. After I joined vc mid day to people talking about how much it was bothering them, I quickly banned her. Sometimes you may be the asshole, but the point is, you need to be able to lay your foot down, or make sure someone in the group does.

It always surprises how LONG some people can deal with these toxic types. I don't know if I lack patience, but for me after the second session of toxic behaviour I would be gone.

Sounds unbearable. Played with a genuine murder hobo before but they RP’d very well, we agreed (without them) we would place an invisible magical leash on him. Just so we could pull him away from any stupid mistakes. Murder hobo: I’m gunna climb into a dark corner and get my bow ready. DM: you succeed and gracefully clamber up the rafters. Entire rest of the party consecutively: Nooooo **pulls leash and murder hobo falls down with a thunk**. DM: (after a short pause) you take 1d6 fall dmg. Became a fun comical part of the campaign and while he snuck a few kills on innocents and only saved himself from our clerics wrath by 1 successful deception check, he became quite an iconic character and we don’t regret having a murder hobo in the party.

-She was racist. -Why didn't you kick her off if she got personal. -No, she was racist against humans in game. -Oh... Who cares?

Love the use of Kirito for the Thumbnail (Chef's Kiss) the perfect choice for a Mary Sue

so how many people left unprompted before you finally stopped and said "maybe I should ask the players how theyre feeling" in that 2 years?

Stories similar to this is why I don't allow sexual orientation or sex in my games. Had 1 player who wanted to have her character treated differently because she wasn't straight. I told her she could but it will never be an issue because I don't care as a dm or in regular life. She left 3 sessions later.

I don't play dnd and I just came across CritCrab's videos finding them interesting to listen to. So I've heard this as a repedetive point of complaint about characters being "racist" where it's an elven character towards human or dwarf to elf etc, do people actually find fantasy racism problematic like actual racism irl?? In the story OP and her friend found "the insults and racism flung from Sue's druid rogue were enough to make anyone uncomfortable" and OP was referring to Sue saying "that's just like a human to act this way." I personally don't find that offensive at all to the point where it's being deemed "racist". To me it kinda downplays actual racism which I'm a little uncomfy about dnd players using it like that. Just a thought.

The best kind of Mary Sue is the ones that don't realize it! It still baffles me when I had a situation where one member in my group was essentially becoming a Mary Sue up untill he realized it... And then blamed everyone in the group for becoming one.

As a middle-aged, player, I was much more non-confrontational in my teens & 20s, so I understand how a group could put up with such garbage behavior for so long. But now that I'm in my 40s, I ain't got time for that shit.

When listing off things she cares too much about you forgot about making sure everyone knew how nice yet sexually experienced her characters were

My god, these players have the patience of a saint.

Being honest, the only thing worse than a mary sue (or their male counterpart, gary stu), it's a mary sue that doesn't impact the story, like, I've found stories that are self inserts (the one I'm thinking now is a hunter x hunter fanfic), where the character just is there, like, they steal lines and moments from the original characters, but without the proper explanation as to why they know what they know (that line about not messing with you was one hundred times better when Killua said it, Kayli, drinking all the poison from that cheater and asking for another can of poisoned soda as a way to piss him off and telling him, "Oh, I'm inmune to poison, so, don't try anything with me, ok?" and leaving while drinking the rest of the poisoned soda was badass.). It's like, they want to have the impact of really well written moments without actually creating the right sittuation to it, and lack so much imagination. However, mary sues in DnD are even worse, because the story is not only about you, but about all of the players, and as such, becoming overpowered just because makes the rest of the group have less fun (Also, the dices are usually quite a funny way to balance out your outcomes, I have a half-orc barbarian that has proven time and time again that is a complete mess when rolling for perception, I have made like 8 rolls in perception, and only one rolled over 10, and that has become such a meme, that I'm going through with it more and more as a character trait of him, like, he is oblivious to the extreme, but has a heart of gold. It makes for really funny interactions thanks to those little quirks that handicap you in your campaign. Those flaws make for truly nice moments, like because of how oblivious he is, he was so fascinated by some magic ilumination that discovered how to transfer the magic of those magic lamps to torches, but forgot that they were in an iluminated area, leading to a moment of silence in the group, where my barbarian and the bard tried to create lights to see in an already iluminated area). DnD shouldn't have mary sues nor gary stus, it should have characters with flaws, and players that can be ready to make fun of your own character from time to time due to some surprising nat 1 or in general bad rolls.

while i understand that 2 years is a long time, this is, again, a group that has the issue of nobody speaking up. You don't want to look like the DM asshole that ruins a game because you kick out one player that you might be seeing as a problem. Because for all you know, others could be okay with the mary sue player (for some odd reason). so when i see people saying backbone was needed: Yeah, it was but it was also a hard area to step into without looking like an asshole DM

These are basically sadomasochistic testimonies of people tolerating assholes for way longer than was necessary, acceptable, or even sane.

From the tiptop, I give this playgroup no credit; if you bring me a player and say "This person is racist, transphobic, homophobic, and also-" I then remind you we strike people out for 3 failures in baseball, why would you give them more than that?

I usually like flawed characters because it's always relatable. No one here is perfect, but it's those weakness that makes us human and helps us learn to overcome those weaknesses to better improve ourselves.

Like Sue had dozens of red flags going on, and I understand OP needed to vent. But after a while they just seemed to be nitpicking, and not communicating at all just made things worse. Like this should have been dealt with in under 6 months by communicating with each other and Sue, giving an ultimatum on behaviour, and then kicking. That it dragged on for two years and ended in really a just "I think we should see other people" without addressing any problems is really just springing her on some other unsuspecting group. But I can also see that after dealing with it for 2 years, you'd just be done and want it over.

Congratulations, you just discovered a new type of multi-tasking. The karen-sue. Half karen, half Mary Sue, ALL horrible.

Lord, I couldn't imagine tolerating her that long. I had a player who always played edgy characters and always went against the party's wishes (ex. team wanted to stay out of a war and be neutral to both sides and he blatantly disrespected a king and got them in bad terms with 1 of the kingdoms.) I was always quick to call out if he tried to cheat or was going against the team. One day he cursed me out cause he crit failed like 4 times in a row and died in the first turn of combat (he tried to "style" on the enemies). Second he started cursing me out I snapped back thay he better behave or he would get kicked from the sessions permanately. Would you guess it? Never had issues from him again.

I'm 5 minutes in and I'm getting major "I was sexually abused as a child and now use hypersexuality to deal with it." vibes from her description. This girl needs a therapist.

Remember kids communication is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to any good relationship

I see Kirito is in the thumbnail here and his character in the anime is def mostly Gary Sue but in the light novels he actually has a lot more thinking a logic. Instead of saying stuff like in SPOILERS Alicization he befriends Eugeo and in the anime anything they put makes him seem like a good friend... in the light novels he's double sided. He constantly uses Eugeo for information of the Underworld and while he does want him to get Alice back, he also wants him to be a swordsman so he has extra money and knowledge of the Underworld. Progressive spoilers, there's also time in Progressive when he does very blunt things, and often ends up being confronted by Asuna who every time Asuna mentally breaks down, Kirito straight up avoids comforting her because he wants to but he doesn't know how. He also stagnates as a character for 90% of the arc, and doesn't experience much growth other than going from not being around people to being in the Underworld and leading it. Other than that he shuts out personal relationships, avoids teaching his student and his dead friend's student, etc. The anime just cut everything out to be quicker and have more fan service which sucks, he has more flaws in the Light Novel, and a lot more mental barriers he has to break through in the fight bc anime hates internal monologues and it kinda sucks. Animation is good, the plot isn't. The light novels are long but have more details on him. And I'm not trying to bash on your video, I do agree that anime Kirito is pretty gary sue.

i always like to imagine Sue's voice being Skeletor's. Goofy ahh moment

"We put up with her for two years" Okay yea, whatever that Mary Sue did, she was not the sole problem.

A Mary Sue is a bad character. Not because they do bad things, but not because they do bad things, but because they’re never, ever bad. It makes them boring and uninteresting. Having a character with flaws makes them interesting and gives them room to develop and change for the better

Never play with someone you would not want as a friend to go do other activities with or just talk for an hour over the phone. Also, saying you are a "non-confrontational" person is just a no personal accountability way of saying that you are a spineless enabler.

There is something to say about the people who put up with toxic players. They are enabling the person to be toxic.