Something to notice... in tcgplayer, for the whole previous month, there were nearly no sales of Dockside Extortionist up to Sep 21st. It was like 1 to 10 sold each day, mostly 3 or 4. But on Sep 22nd, 181 were sold... and the ban announcement happened on Sep 23rd. Does tcgplayer list the sales of a day as the previous day's, or is this a confirmation that a lot of people knew it was going to be banned? Hmmm... I wonder.
This could also be a function of different timezones. I'd love this to be real though, any further proof of insider talk makes this whole situation more damning
I’m not an investor or a competitive player or anything. I just casually play with my buddies and once in a blue moon I might visit my LGS for a game or one of their edh tournaments (I say tournament loosely because there will maybe be 4 groups at most with the winner of each playing a 2nd game, and the event has a very casual low-stakes vibe) I almost never binge for super expensive cards, preferring to just make optimized budget decks. Jeweled Lotus was the only time I ever spent over $100 for a card, and it was just so I could put it in a fancy little frame and put it on my shelf. I just thought it was cool, and i proxied it after to put it in one of my decks. That being said, yea this ban really bummed me out…probably still gunna use the proxy in my friend group games, but sadly I can’t take it to my LGS where people had all their Gaia Cradles and other busted cards. Couldn’t have the one nice thing I finally decided to splurge on a bit, just to show a modicum of pride in a hobby I enjoy.
Sold my entire collection (roughly $10,000) 2 years ago. Haven't regretted it once. I've been to 2 preres since then and gave the cards away after. Everybody should just print there own cards at home.
Pretty sus that they just reprinted Lotus and Crypt.. then when the sets are out of print they went "YEETUS! HAHA YOU BOUGHT OUR USELESS SHIT CUZ IT'S BANNED YARHARGETSHREKTSHITTER!". Best case scenario it's the rules committee being dumb, worst case scenario it's WotC setting up for a series of rugpulls. If we see Mana Vault/Ancient Tomb reprints in upcoming sets, I'd get ready to see them being banned shortly after the sets rotate out of print since they are similar 'fast mana' cards which seem to be exploding over the bans of Mana Crypt/Jeweled Lotus. Sidenote; I entirely support the banning of Lotus/Nadu/Dockside, Crypt I find less convincing because they undersell the downside of the card to justify satisfying WotC, but it's whatever. I stopped playing when my playgroup embraced Lawd o da Rangz: We Wuz Kangz so it is what it is, something I'm not going to do anything about cuz the 1 crypt I own and have owned for a long time is in a deck that only comes out to punish asshole plays anyway. (aka it sees extremely little play and I cba to pull crypt out of it, if crypt is the biggest issue you have with that deck then your priorities are wrong) It's just a shame to see the game going downhill faster and faster.
I own and run a small LGS. Buying and selling cards literally keeps our lights on. Bans like this that blindside everyone straight up feels bad. Bans will always annoy and upset players but when a ban includes some of the most sought after and played cards in a format and it has an effect on my business is not cool. The RC needs to publish a watch list of cards on their radar. So LGS’s and players can make educated decisions and risk evaluations on what cards they want to purchase, sell, and hold.
The real reason to walk away from the game because of this is the financial setback coupled with the expectation that WotC will now have a bunch of expensive chase cards coming up to replace them. I believe Rudy's assessment of that will become very true because $$$🤮 I'm tired of being a cash piggy for this game. At least other games don't tax you the hardest just for the rudimentary needs of playing like MANA GENERATION to even use the rest of the overpriced cards.
I think the real reason people are upset is because the rules committee which caused the collapse was working hand in hand with Wotc for over a year. They knew that Wotc was going to release said cards in ixalan and commander masters to push the sets hardcore and all of a sudden after the sales were made and distribution had stopped, the RC came out with a blindsiding ruling that affected a ton of people, players and stores alike. I don’t think they should have that power. Straight up made me quite the game because I buy special versions of these cards because I like the artwork and now I can’t play what I want because 5 a-holes decided to ban cards they didn’t like in their play groups. Dockside banning didn’t even make sense. The RC made a statement last year that they weren’t going to ban it because it scaled with power level of the play group. Everyone chased mana crypt and jeweled lotus. I think it’s all extremely fishy and so they have lost my trust as a consumer. Really bad look for both Wotc and the RC.
I pulled my foil extended Lotus from a gifted collector box back in 2020. I have decided to grade it and display it in a frame, and hold my Dockside until the price stabilizes and then trade for credit for new cards. Luckily I never bought a Crypt, though. I never really played my Lotus but it still sucks to see it get nuked What I do for proxies is print the image on paper and then cut it out and insert into a sleeve with a basic land
So, I'm that exact person who happened upon a foil Crypt in my LCI pack, and held it cause it looks really cool and I could fill a slot and justify proxies to snooty players. It sucks that I'm down 200+$ on the value of it but I mean I'm not getting rid of it. It's one of the coolest things I've opened (cooler than a serialized Millstone) and it's a memory for me. I'm also exactly that player that's been making galaxy foil proxies by stripping the ink off the acorn galaxies. I 10000% vouch for using 91% isopropyl or acetone and a paper towel or cotton ball. And patience. But the results are very worth!
I bought two boxes and got one in both, gave one to my friend who had just had his crypt stolen for the box he had pulled 50$ value out of his box and got all the Hakbal cards I actually wanted out of it lol. I love Ixalan because Explore is my favorite mechanic and am laughing because they are both worth 60% less after two days. whatever lol
I'm more anxious about the chain of effects on the general perception of card value long therm. If they start banning cards like Jewelled lotus that was not really much of an issue and suddenly loose all its value, what does it mean for your collection at large. I don't have much money, I spent a bit on magic with the expectation my collection after 10-20 years+ would hold some value and I could sell them back at that point to add a bit to my old days limited funds as someone with disability. I legally can't have a pension or play Wallstreet's game without being cut off from government support. I was under no illusion that many cards would drop to 0 or near zero but when 3 big tickets get knocked down in a single round of bans, big tickets that were just sold as the big tickets of sets... well, I expect more crap like that in the future and so do most people... confidence is gone and since magic cards are a fiat currency based on confidence, there will be a global effect. How can Wizard even justify the insane price of their boxes and boosters if your pulls are worthless short after? They can't, it cost pennies to prodduce and they are lazier and lazier with the production droping artists for AI, droping paper quality and print verification. At the same time competition is rearing its head in the CCG sphere with much lower prices and better quality cards. Anyway I'm done buying magic on my side, have been done for about a year. I just can't afford to pay a big price for worthless paper. I'm keeping the cards I have to play with friends but I won't invest a cent more in that greedy incompetent compagny until they right the ship and do right by players...
Jeweled Lotus should have a version that says it's only possible to have it in the deck if commander's CMC is 8 or more. It would then fit the intended idea of making big creatures viable commanders while not contributing to a turn 1 busted 4 mana commander.
I was "lucky" enough to pull three jeweled lotuses from three Commander Legends boxes, as well as a Dockside from the List in Lost Caverns of Ixalan. I've never trash-talked anyone about these bans, but damn, I do NOT agree with these bans...
Why have your channel never been suggested to me (ive been playing for over two decades, and watched movies on youtube since then).....Btw, its an awesome channel.
Dude, you're absolutely right about the type of players complaining about this. A lot of people think it's only cEDH players that hate this ban, but all of them are actually really excited for this ban since it's really changing up the meta of cEDH. If you play casual, you can always rule 0 and ask your pod if they allow you to play with these banned cards, and if they don't, you were probably the reason these cards got banned in the first place.
I lost money on the cards. It sucks, but that is the risk you take. However I'm still playing my game and having fun. Things should've been handled better.
Try hards in the format of weak and fairylike “men”? That must be .001 % of Commander players. Most are just trying to chat and share pictures of their cats…
Jeweled lotus was a mistake of a card. It should have had the same restriction as Jegantha where you can't use it on generic mana costs. That way, it would give you a reason to play more commanders with three mana symbols of the same color.
I lost some money on this. i opened a mana crypt in a pack and threw it into a deck, what has me a little mad about the ban is there are soo many cards that needed to go before crypt and lotus.
The biggest problem with the ban is the RC waited 4 years to ban Jeweled Lotus and Dockside. Dockside they said last year they weren't going to ban unless it drastically became a problem being looped and abused. And Jeweled wasn't even mentioned as a ban possible or even a thought about ban in its 4 years.
MTG Jeweled Lotus. What happened? You had one job. lol Banning Jeweled lotus in Commander, the only format it can be used for. Is like Bane in the Dark Knight Rises blowing up the only bridge into Gotham City.
It’s interesting you bring up the gift thing because my then-partner and I opened up a bunch of Caverns of Ixalan for her to keep when I was getting her into Magic and she ended up pulling a Mana Crypt and gave it to me to keep; that card has more value to me than most of my collection purely because of the events surrounding it. Luckily, my playgroup thinks MC, Jeweled Lotus, and Dockside are fine, so we just rule 0 them into our games.
I agree with u on them taking jabs at wizards in there ban announcement. Overall im fine with the bans. 2 cards im sad about but its oh well i know better then to get upset over bans i know full well they can happen to any card at any time. I buy expensive cards from time to time but usually its to bling out a decks with a special print of a card or getting an og dual which yes i consider that bling they dont realy change the power of the deck.
I will say, it really sucks for all the poor people who get one of each staple whenever the price bottoms out, and it sucks for the store that's barely floating, but it's good for the game. You can't argue that all of those cards needed to be banned, and if you try to then you're not arguing from a genuine point of view. They all did bad things to the games they featured in, and weren't allowed at a lot of tables already. Better to make them be a rule zero conversation to include 😅
Like I couldn't really care about the playability of the card, I have jeweled lotus myself and I don't have it in any of my decks but it really hurts the collector aspect. Like in Warhammer if the price of a knight dominus dropped to a quarter of its price after i just paid the original full price I'd feel real heckin bad
I mean, I've already not been buying Magic stuff and just been playing with the commander decks I had. Now Crypt is banned and I want to give the game money even less because how do I know the next pet card I pick up because I think the art/legacy of it is neat won't get banned because someone got a bug up their ass about it.
That's the exact reason I didn't get a Great Henge yet. I think that card is disproportionately expensive to the level of enjoyment I can have for that value, plus the fact it creates cheap moments that aren't enjoyable at the other end, plus if it gets banned out of nowhere, I'd lose an uncomfortable amount of money.
Me and all my buddies like playing at higher power levels without net decking. We are all super bummed about the mana crypt and jeweled lotus bans because its cards like that, that make some of the less powerful commanders keep up. Also mono red is gonna be hurting seriously bad in cedh now since they really relied on fast mana and dockside.
i didnt buy my mana crypt. it was a box opening in our group.. we split the packs of eternal masters and i pulled the mana crypt. it was my prized card in my one commander deck i rarely played. Now its banned and its value tanked :( so.. ya now it sits in a binder.
If Jeweled Lotus tanks in price 100% the RC is going to make a killing when they unban it. Edit I got a jeweled Lotus as I thought it would be a more friendly version of Lion's eye diamond as it went it to my meme deck based on the cards that emulate the power 9. LED is still legal
Ive had a few good proxies in the past most i made with the blank foil and transfer sheet method but for the counterfeits i liked to right proxy on the back so the card doesn't look bad in a sleeve
I pulled these with the intention of having them f9r my collection. just as a collectors piece. now they make these pretty much useless. This will hurt the TCG stores the most, with 200 mana crypts now in total are not worth 1 mana crypt pre ban. Fuck you Wizards, you have made cracking packs and buy collectors shit pointless. You pull the best card in the set to have it completely banned and worth nothing. SELL SELL SELL a more massive crash is coming. You can't eat a Magic card when the Chinese activate their war plan.
i had some who wants to play chedh tell me that why ban dock side and hull breacher there fair cards and that just use removal when there out. i looked at him like he was crazy obivously
Anything that has value can go up and down. No one wants to lose money, such as houses, cars, etc. They banned the most expensive cards, but not a sol ring. Sheldon would not have ever allowed this.
I collect angels for nostalgia and Lands for some value - everything else I sell away. Last month I sold my Mana crypt for 120€ and no harm done to me but I'm a little bit sad for whom ever bought it.
It does seem like magic is going in the way of Yu-Gi-Oh as far as how fast they're trying to make the games go but I also hate the fact that they banned stuff play what you got and if I can't get around it good for you
I mean why do people care you can still play mana cript in your commander deck, just ask your friends for permission to do so or just don't tell em it's in your deck 😂
My playgroup talked about this alot with our battlecruiser decks. We agreed that lotus was fine since all our commanders were 6+ mana cost, but we rule 0'd a house rule that the lotus enters tapped
So, what youre saying is, people should start using creativity and stop making the skeleton of their decks the same 40 cards every time they put ine together.
Competitive magic is idiotic when analyzed as a whole. Leave that scene and stop chasing the stupidly overpriced cardboard. You and your friends will have more fun.
We already have the "You're a dick" list at our LGS. That's all we need. Our ban list is different from the Commander Rules Committee and we can always Rule 0 it.
tbh theirs always other options for jeweled lotus. like like red has Pyretic Ritual, black has dark ritual, green...well green has bird of paradise and god knows how many elves that can get you mana, blue has urza lord high artificer i know its more limited but fuck its something. white has a good land called karoo taps for 1white and 1 colorless. or if worst comes to worse and you need a good replacement for jeweled lotus you could go with the slower but just as good land lotus vale.. that's just my take on the new bans.. not the end of the world. just the end to an era. plant new seeds and play on gamers.
Good F*ing Riddance - Mana Crypt Every game - Every Goddamn Opening Hand. Dockside Goblin and Nadu Wing Wisdom didn't seem too excessive in EDH, but apparently some people take the game way too serious. * Only saw Nadu in Falco Sparra builds and Falco was 3x more annoying that Nadu?
I made a proxy sol ring ince by using acetone to wipe the front off a foil, then i sharpied a circle and used silver glitter over it, then in the text area i wrote "$40 for a foil sol ring? Nah dawg $3.50 in supplies and ten minutes with acetone."
I actually do write "proxy not for sale or trade" on the back of all my Chinese "proxies". And I only proxy cards I actually own, I'm not buying like 16 of the same shock land
Actual proxies made in America don't have thst problem, they will come with an obvious not real mtg back. It's counterfeits from China that are trying to pass as a "legit" card.
I think the whole "if you rushed out to buy those cards because only winning matters, you're an asshole" is very accurate. That's the reason why Jeweled lotus wasn't even really an issue. Most people weren't assholes and didn't play these cards. On the other hand, in cedh (those players wouldn't go to casual games) was actually better for cards like Jeweled lotus, because it enabled decks where the commanders would normally be too low on the power level because of their cost. I was one of the haters of the lotus originally, but seeing how well it improved cedh, I changed my opinion (I play casual as well, never seen anyone play it). It is a shame if you ask me, but then again, cedh players play with proxies anyways, so money really isn't the issue.
Go Fish doesn't have a regulatory body. No "casual" format does. WotC should double down and reprint all of these at common level and tell the committee to eat shit.
I see the point of your argument, but there's a point missing, the RC can not say what is fun and punish you for want a certain card. If a person is an asshole, he will cause problems despite the deck, this ban was awful and they nuked a lot of LGS, and the worst part is that WTOC allowed it and knew, because the RC said they were talking for over a year. And to prove my point let's do a simple math, the EDHREC only shows a small frame of the picture of decks, and there were 338k decks with a lotus in it, if you multiply this number by the avg of $100, that's 33 MILLION that evapored from circulation, the WOTC sites points out there are around 6k WPN stores, so that means an avg of $5500 loss to each WPN.
All the people who are leaving Commander over the bans are the exact type of people that the Rules Committee wanted to leave the game over the ban. And for those who are not leaving the games the bans were more to force The rule zero talk that wasn't happening with these 10 or 11 [ot of 10] power level decks. By that I mean I'm sure there is a lot of people now prior to the game starting saying "hey I have a man a crypt in this deck but this Commander otherwise has a way too high of a CMC to play. Are you okay with that?"
