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The One Argument that Just Annihilates Protestantism 

The Catholic Skeptic with Hugh J Quinn
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28 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 335   
@kofiadjei-frimpong9279
@kofiadjei-frimpong9279 Год назад
God bless you for standing for the truth. One has to choose either to follow one's feelings and opinions or the truth. Catholics have chosen to follow the truth.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@kofialdjei-frimpong9279 All the Glory to God, by his grace. Thanks, please pray for me, God Bless you.
@kofiadjei-frimpong9279
@kofiadjei-frimpong9279 Год назад
One needs faith and works of love to gain eternal salvation. St. Ignatius of Antioch, a disciple of Apostle John, puts it this way: "Faith is the beginning and love is the end. Martin Luther's faith alone doctrine was never from the Holy Spirit. @@_ready__
@kofiadjei-frimpong9279
@kofiadjei-frimpong9279 Год назад
Eternal salvation requires both faith and works of love. Faith is the beginning and love is the end. The commandments are works of love. It is not a trivial instruction.@@_ready__
@geoffjs
@geoffjs 8 месяцев назад
@@kofiadjei-frimpong9279agreed and huge damage and confusion as a result
@39knights
@39knights Год назад
Joe Heschmeyer just did a video "Is the bible self-attesting" which is a great discussion on this topic as well.
@halleylujah247
@halleylujah247 Год назад
Thanks for this. My invincible argument is Matthew 18:15-19. Have you heard of St Francis De Sales? Have you read Catholic Controversy? After listening to this I think you would love that book.
@Dave-wu5ic
@Dave-wu5ic Год назад
just finished reading this book. what a masterpiece! those "pretend reformers" don't stand a chance against De Sales...because he has the truth. this book will definitely provide the confidence & knowledge to defend the faith.
@eddyrobichaud5832
@eddyrobichaud5832 Год назад
The faith that is not based on scripture.
@voxangeli9205
@voxangeli9205 Год назад
​@@eddyrobichaud5832, how come? Did the Bible create our Christian faith and our Christian Church? Or did the Christian Church created our faith and the Bible? Which one, @eddyrobichaud5832?
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@halleylujah247 I love Francis De Sales, but no, I haven't read that book, I will getting it right away. Thanks Halley, God Bless!
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@@eddyrobichaud5832 Try and actually listen to the video Eddy, and Jesus Christ, the Living Word established the Church, and Through His Holy Church, He gave us the WRITTEN Word of God.
@N1IA-4
@N1IA-4 Год назад
Excellent job as usual, Hugh. It's unreal how Luther and his heirs turned everything upside down and created false churches with myriads of different beliefs. Bible Only simply doesn't work. Indeed it can't. It was never ever even a thing before Luther.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@soakland5 Pray for these Protestants, they need to see the Light of Truth, before it's too late.Thanks for your excellent comment, God Bless.
@geoffjs
@geoffjs 8 месяцев назад
Yes, well done Hugh. How do we get Protestants to see the light?
@vinb2707
@vinb2707 Год назад
Just had a friendly debate on this subject today at the Bible study that I attend in my Catholic Church. There are two Protestant gentlemen who come all the time because they love how knowledgeable the facilitator is when it comes to the scriptures. They also enjoy how in depth we go when studying the word. Right now we are in the book of Acts. There is absolutely no escaping the reality that early church was established by Christ Himself and that the Apostles were given authority by our Lord. There arguments come up short in these debates because they will only stay in the scriptures and use interpretations that have been passed down to them by others. They cling to their own faith traditions and refuse to see what the scriptures clearly reveal.
@ralf547
@ralf547 Год назад
Jesus, in the upper room after his resurrection breathed on the disciples and gave them the Holy Spirit, and the authority to forgive and withhold forgiveness of sins. I believe it. They then had that authority. But would the sins of an unrepentant grievous sinner still be forgiven IF that sinner confessed to let's say Peter and Peter absolved him, but he was lying about being contrite and full well intended to continue in that sin? So I believe the authority given to men to forgive sins comes totally from Christ, and if Christ wouldn't absolve that confessor, the priest's absolution would not be valid.
@vinb2707
@vinb2707 Год назад
@@ralf547 that is exactly what the Catholic Church teaches. The priest is essentially the vessel in whom God’s grace flows through. It is not the priest himself that forgives the sin, but Christ Himself. Only our Lord can forgive someone’s sin. As far as the individual who is seeking forgiveness, they must seek forgiveness with a contrite heart. The priest usually has no way of knowing what is in the individual’s heart and mind, but God does. And so if they are trying to use the sacrament as nothing more then a get out of jail free card, they are gravely mistaken.
@ralf547
@ralf547 Год назад
@@vinb2707 agreed
@ursamajor1936
@ursamajor1936 Год назад
What's astounding to me is that, in the early church, the multitude was illiterate and yet, when i was young i had many catholic friends and attended mass with them however, the mass was in latin and no one knew what had been said. Also, the catholic families didn't own bibles. I was happy that i was brought up protestant because we had bibles and i loved to read. The first time i read the bible i was 10 years old and read it cover to cover. What drew me in was, 'In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth and the earth was without form, and void.' Awesome, simply awesome is our Lord. TY for the videos. I am enjoying them.
@gabepettinicchio7454
@gabepettinicchio7454 Год назад
We all had the missalette, which translated the Mass from Latin to English. They were lined up along the front & back of each row of pews.
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
And in those missals all the Bible readings were clearly laid out. Any Catholic could easily find these readings in their own Bibles. Post Vatican II personal missals were greatly expanded to include vast swaths of the Bible through Sunday 3-year cycle and weekday 2-year cycle, laid out all full for each passage. The average Catholic in the pew, as of the 1970s, can everyday, easily find the Bible passage that the entire world Church is reading, meditating and praying on that day. This is a great resource!
@gabepettinicchio7454
@gabepettinicchio7454 Год назад
@@OzCrusader As a little boy, my mother simply took the time to teach me how to follow & participate. I believe this had a great overall effect on my faith.
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
@@gabepettinicchio7454 yes, parents’ teaching profoundly affects their children, who must grow into adults themselves, being responsible for their own decisions and relationship with God.
@elizabethbarberis9957
@elizabethbarberis9957 6 месяцев назад
I was born in 1951 into a Catholic family and my family had a huge bible.
@RCEmichaelreavey
@RCEmichaelreavey Год назад
Bamm Bamm Rubble. You have exhausted and nuked Sola Scriptura. I often wonder what it would have been like to live as my ancestors, illiterate, and praying for food during the Great Hunger. Fratelli tutti para 15
@tknciliba4743
@tknciliba4743 3 месяца назад
The Catholic council excommunicated Nestorius for his false beliefs. How many priests did the Catholic Church excommunicate for the violent beastly carnal unforgivable ravaging of young boys?
@Pat.hibuleire
@Pat.hibuleire 3 месяца назад
No praying on young boys in protestantism
@dangeroso121
@dangeroso121 10 месяцев назад
The Council of Rome canonized scripture in 382 AD. Martin Luther's 95 Theses were posted over 1000 years later in 1517 AD. Catholics and Protestants share the same history prior to the Protestant Reformation, therefore, Catholics and Protestants get their cannon of scripture from the very same place.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic 10 месяцев назад
@dangeroso121 Yep, so?
@dangeroso121
@dangeroso121 10 месяцев назад
@@catholicskeptic So that's where Protestants believe that scripture comes from. That's your question isn't it?
@ralf547
@ralf547 Год назад
I will say that archeologists are feeling confident that bits of the NT can be dated to within 100 years of the resurrection. But as you say, even with limited copies of epistles and gospels, most of peoples' knowledge came verbally. But reading Acts makes it clear the Holy Spirit was very instrumental, and surely He presrves His word throughout time. I'd like to see how many of those other competing books/epistles date to a time that would even make them candidates. Jesus did tell the Apostles they would have what they needed to brought to mind by the Spirit. And when the canon wss set, it was the Holy Spirit leading the Church in the decision. Is the Spirit still leading the current Pope and Magesterium in their leading of the Church? I want to see the infallible Catholic interpretation of Books of the Bible.
@39knights
@39knights Год назад
"...... I want to see the infallible Catholic interpretation of Books of the Bible...." That is not how the infallibility of the Catholic Faith operates. Besides it wouldn't matter even if the Church did produce such an infallible commentary; protestants would still be protestants and reject it to the preference of their own opinions. The Church has infallibly declared the 73 book canon which protestants have still ignored. So what makes you think an infallible commentary would be met with any better reception????
@ralf547
@ralf547 Год назад
@@39knights Well, I'm not a protestant. I think protestants would take an "infallible commentary" from the Catholic Church and scrutinize in excess. Perhaps some would be Bereans, and others just scoffers. But if the Catholic Church can infallibly interpret scripture, we should be able to take scriptures that are contested by different groups and at least have the Catholic infallible understanding. But If that isn't how the Catholic Church's infallibility works, what good is it. Does it even exist?
@39knights
@39knights Год назад
@@ralf547 "....But If that isn't how the Catholic Church's infallibility works, what good is it. Does it even exist?....." Infallibility does exist but it has a place and purpose. In the 2000 year history of the Church it has only been invoked perhaps 5-6 times; not everytime the Pope or Councils speak. The question you ask has to be asked of God. The Church doesn't use its superhero power of 'infallibility' whenever it wants to win arguments. It is the Holy Spirit which moves the Church to do so when necessary for the good of our Salvation. If God has decided that such a commentary is not necessary then you have to ask Him why and not the Church. What God did do is leave a living Magisterium to aid and guide us to Salvation in every generation. So when King Henry's court of moral and biblical scholars advised him on scripture and divorce; and when Rome sent him their direction on how to interpret it; then you know for certian Henry was wrong and the Church was right. That didn't do any good anyway; whether the Church would have said it infallibly by an infalible decree or the way it did.
@danvankouwenberg7234
@danvankouwenberg7234 Год назад
​@@ralf547protestants are outside of the Church. The Pope cannot speak infallibly on their faith and morals if they are not in the Church.
@danvankouwenberg7234
@danvankouwenberg7234 Год назад
​@@ralf547the Church has only interpreted a handful of verses. The scripture speaks for itself. None of these things are secrets and there are better sources than lay Catholics in a comment section. You can search the Catechism online.
@BMG0091
@BMG0091 Год назад
Do you even know why protestaism began?
@atrifle8364
@atrifle8364 Год назад
The same reason as the fall.
@BMG0091
@BMG0091 Год назад
@@atrifle8364 ?
@atrifle8364
@atrifle8364 Год назад
​@@BMG0091- Us wacky humans, always needing a savior
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
BMG0091 1) Genuine corruption in the Church 2) Reaction to it: Pride and arrogant presumption , from Luther , " because there are some things being done wrong, therefore it must all be done MY WAY".
@jonatasmachado7217
@jonatasmachado7217 Год назад
As a former Baptist, now Catholic, I totally share your views. Deciding which books are in the Bible, preserving them over the centuries, studying them and interpreting them can only be a collective enterprise. Besides, the books of the New Covenant were written within the Church, by the Church and for the Church, the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. The Church established the biblical canon with the authority vested by Jesus Christ on Peter and the Apostles, under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. I will eat the Lamb in communion with the sucessors of Peter and the Apostles.
@For3nity
@For3nity Год назад
@@_ready__ Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has *eternal life,* and I will raise him on the last day. [John 6:54].
@For3nity
@For3nity Год назад
@@_ready__ Jesus said so, I believe. If you don't believe then it's up to you. Why risking your eternal life? He is waiting for you to eat his flesh and drink his blood for you to have eternal life. Go receive him faithfully in the Eucharist... daily if possible. God bless...
@jeffscully1347
@jeffscully1347 Год назад
​@@_ready__it appears as though you're on the wrong channel.
@charlottelauzon3147
@charlottelauzon3147 Год назад
@@_ready__after 2000+ years later we, unlike Jewish understanding of the OT and covenants and temple worship, you do not have the lens to see how the first century Christian saw the fulfillment of prophecy in the covenant of Jesus sacrifice and Eucharist.
@charlottelauzon3147
@charlottelauzon3147 Год назад
Whenever you read in the OT of God instituting a name change, it involves a change of status or mission (think Abraham, Sarah, Jacob, Peter, Saul). For Simon to Peter it is two fold, status AND mission. Peter (the head) who holds the keys of the Kingdom when the King leaves (when a King leaves the kingdom he leaves the keys to his most trusted person to govern the kingdom until he returns) and “rock” being the foundation to which He builds His church. I believe in most of the name changes, there is a covenantal bond instituted. Jesus instituted the new and everlasting covenant of the Eucharist through which is implemented by Peter.
@timboslice980
@timboslice980 Год назад
Don't feel bad for the drive by anti catholic comments. They almost never watch the videos. If they did they'd interact with your points or at least know what your video was about. I just found out protestants didn't remove the dueterocanon from scripture until 1825 and they did it to save money. I think it was this channel... learning so much.
@rhwinner
@rhwinner Год назад
I remember bibles, protestant bibles, from my youth in the 70's that had the deuteros in a back section. They may have _started_ the process of removing the deuteros in the 19th century, but there were still bibles printed in the 20th century that still contained them. This is not ancient history!
@gabepettinicchio7454
@gabepettinicchio7454 Год назад
...And that puts their soul in great danger!
@timboslice980
@timboslice980 Год назад
@po18guy Oh yeah I just learned that not too long ago. I was a calvinist for 10 years and never learned all the other side of the coin. Protestants are good at hiding their faults and accentuating their positives when it comes to history. I've heard countless hours of people talking about Luther's life. They'd say he was troubled, not that he threw his excrement across the room. They'd say he demoted the dueterocanon to apocryphal works but that it was the historic view of the jews. Since I wasn't all that interested in Jewish history I was duped. Protestantism thrives on ignorance and every mainline denomination is breaking apart. The catholic church gained 500 million adherents in the last 10 years! Were now the biggest denomination in the USA! United we stand, divided they fall.
@timboslice980
@timboslice980 Год назад
@rhwinner yeah my grandad would be 91 if he was alive. He was gifted a family methodist Bible that had the deuterocanon in there. I asked him about them, I said what are all these books? His reply kind of floored me.... "he said they were scripture for ages but fell out of favor... people just didn't think they were that popular anymore so they removed them." I was like wow this must be 75 years old, the date was like 1905. It was a massive tome with beautiful colored images. Then it hit me... how can books of the Bible just be removed because they were unpopular and then people claim the Bible is inerrant? It was one of the many straws that led me to leave the methodist faith and christ altogether when I was 18. Apologetics 23 years ago was non existent in my church. Logic was only 25% of the quadrilateral
@gabepettinicchio7454
@gabepettinicchio7454 Год назад
Yes as uninspired.
@martinmartin1363
@martinmartin1363 Год назад
The Jews never said definitively what was true scripture or not from what was available before and during the life’s of Jesus and his apostles,they read Enoch,Maccabee,jubilees,etc etc and believed it and Enoch is quoted by James l think 🙂 this was about 3 hundred years later, and they played god by rewriting the meanings of certain words and disposed of anything that prompted the catholic faith. The church was built on the oral tradition because the majority of the known world was illiterate, but there was over 90 gospels being preached in the church and so the church defined what was scripture and put it in a book form the bible which means the book, and the church got rid of the false gospels and the false shepherds promoting them the heretics, the Gnostics etc etc. The Protestants play god to this day interpreting the bible to suit their will and views and opinions and add in what is not there just like the original false prophets. Every Protestant is his own pope and council, just like Luther announced when excommunicated from the church he said l am my own pope and council, and this is how it is to this present day with over 40 thousand Protestant denominations and counting, because they are all there own pope and council and can form their own individual church, they are not part of the church the Catholic and apostolic church ,and are righteous rebels. God bless
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@martinmartin1363 Very important points, thank you.
@martinmartin1363
@martinmartin1363 Год назад
@@catholicskeptic @catholicskeptic I love listening to kyle clement and Robert Haddad, brant pitre and Scott hahn and now you. I find the best revelations of truth come from little know channels and those who preach the catholic faith because there not trying to please anyone or looking for a great award etc, they don't want to win debates, they want to win hearts and minds, my favourite lectures are by father John hardon and he taught protestants and Muslims and Hindus there faith with the catholic faith thrown in for good measure, he understood their religions better than they did and showed why they all pointed to the catholic and apostolic church.
@EddyRobichaud
@EddyRobichaud Год назад
Maybe 40 000 different denominations but one catholic church with false doctrines
@martinmartin1363
@martinmartin1363 Год назад
@@EddyRobichaud Like the doctrine of the trinity 🤣
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@@EddyRobichaud Yeah, those false doctrines,from that false Catholic Church, hmm. Well at least those 40,000 are clear on the simple gospel of Jesus: " Yeah, just ask Him into your heart ". "Well hold on, you have to repent." ""Actually you don't, just believe ". "Well wait, we don't choose Jesus, He chose us, no work's involved "."well sure, He chose us because He knew in advance we'd have chose Him". "Huh? No I just decided to accept Him". "So you're saved, then?" "Yep, saved, and always will be!" "Oh no, you could lose it!" "Lose what?" "Why your salvation, of course." "Hey, I speak in tongues, I know I'm saved." "oh, that's not for today!" "What's not for today". "Tongues, healing, miracles, that all stopped after the Apostles all died". "What???" "Yep no more gifts, they just lasted until the Bible was complete". "No you guys are both wrong, the gifts started again in revival, at Azuza Street." "No that was of the devil!" "Wait, I read in Mark that those were signs of those who believe." "No that's not for today, anyway Mark is just for the Jews, only Paul's writings are for us today". "Yeah but Paul said, forbid not to speak with tongues." "Well not that part of Paul's writings ", etc. , etc. Now multiply this conversation into the thousands, with thousands of more different doctrines, in those 40,000 different churches, where everyone just goes by what the Bible says! Each person's private interpretation of the Bible, that is . But yeah, the Catholic Church is so false, according to one of the private interpreters , interpreting the Bible, given to them by the.. Oh no, the... Catholic Church!!!! 😆😂🤣😎
@josephssewagudde8156
@josephssewagudde8156 Год назад
In my country, when a preacher calls on people to go and confess Christ as their personal lord and saviour, they tell them to go to a "Bible believing church for nourishment" if indeed that church sprang from the 1517 martin Luther insipired reformation, it is not the one Jesus said he will build on peter in Mathew 16:18
@rhwinner
@rhwinner Год назад
Hugh really appreciate the substantive and knowledgeable talks that totally belie the click bait titles. Good stuff.
@eddyrobichaud5832
@eddyrobichaud5832 Год назад
Sorry, but all he says is not concrete.
@voxangeli9205
@voxangeli9205 Год назад
​@@eddyrobichaud5832, how come? Can you pls explain why?
@voxangeli9205
@voxangeli9205 Год назад
That's a cool start, Hugh!😂😊 Luv it!❤🎉
@MrJohnmartin2009
@MrJohnmartin2009 7 месяцев назад
Sola Scriptora is Quasi Humanism Based Upon an Invented Oral Tradition The entire bible is based upon a received oral tradition from the OT prophets, and later, Christ and the apostles. The apriori existence of an inspired oral tradition implies the bible is a written tradition founded upon an oral tradition(s). Similarly, the biblical canon including the doctrines of biblical inspiration, inerrancy and infallibility are oral traditions not included within the bilical text. To hold a sola scriptora position is to acknowledge the biblical texts historical dependence upon oral tradition with doctrinally framed formulation of the biblical canon by revealed oral traditions. Noting the dependence of the biblical text upon revealed oral traditions and holding to the position of the biblical text as the sole infallible rule of faith and morals presumes the prior oral traditions were infallible as divine revelation granted orally and transmitted orally. When the oral traditions were selectively written down as inspired texts, and after the apostolic age, according to sola scriptora, the prior oral traditions are not longer existing and binding. And yet, the written text being dependent upon oral tradition is an ongoing, historical witness to inscripturated, oral tradition, making the original oral traditions continue to be infallible and binding. The prior oral traditions presumed to not longer exist and bind the believer are actually always partially contained within the biblical text, which bind the believer. By correctly presuming a prior revealed oral tradition and an inspired text documenting the oral traidtion, oral tradition is both denied as a current source of divine revelation and yet always included within the biblical text. Everything inscripturated was from an oral tradition and represents an oral tradition in written form. The entire biblical text is in principle and in fact, an integration of oral tradition and written tradition forming the biblical text. To hold a sola scriptora position is to preusme upon a two fold source of divine revelation within the biblical text by the oral and written tradition's particpation within each other. Similarly, the oral traditions on the biblical canon and the nature of inspiration, infallibility and inerrancy are always contemporaneous with the biblical text and presumed to be normatively binding to hold a sola scriptora position. The lack of biblical witness to the canon's extent and the nature of biblical inspiration presumes an ongoing, normatively binding oral tradition with a sola scrptura doctrine of the biblical texts infallibility. Therefore, oral tradition both permeates the biblical text and defines the biblical canon. Ironically, a sola scriptora doctrine must deny the value of revealed oral and written tradition by affirming the scriptures as the singular infallible source of divine revelation currently operative, when the exclusivity of the inspired text is not taught within the biblical text, nor within any oral tradition located in church history. By sola scriptora affirming the divine authority of oral tradition prior to inscripturation and framing the biblical canon and nature of inspiration, the sola scriptura avocate affirms the binding nature of oral traidtion. And yet the doctrine of biblical inspiration singularity and biblical infallibility singularity are both human traditions not found in divinely revealed oral tradition, nor the biblical text. A human tradition of the biblical texts singularity invented at the reformation is a relatively recent human oral tradition euqalt to, or superior to the divine oral and written traditions presumed by sola scriptura. Therefore, by affirming oral and written tradition with an invented human tradition, sola scriptura both affirms and denies the binding nature of divine revelation as the supreme rule for faith and morals. Inevitably, sola scriptura affirms at least one human oral tradition contemporaneous with divine revelation, implicitly equating the binding value of divine revelation with a human oral tradition of - scripture is the sole infallible rule of faith and morals. Human tradition is therefore presumed to be nromatively binding and directive of divine revelation, dictating the extent of divine revelation. In doing so, sola scriptura inevitably reduces divine revelation down to a form of quasi humanism, having divine revelation subordinated to a human oral tradition.
@martinmartin1363
@martinmartin1363 10 месяцев назад
The disciples quoted Jesus and the Old Testament to show Jesus is the messiah and the fulfilment of the Old Testament, New Testament was compiled later in the Latin vulgate, but still the common man was illiterate and only now in the 20th century we see the common man literate, education and books and the bible were for for the rich. And so primarily the catholic faithful learned the Catholic faith orally.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic 10 месяцев назад
@martinmartin1363 So very true.
@felixmaliti5165
@felixmaliti5165 Год назад
I have gone through all you videos on the defects of protestantism. You have have urged well so I will comment on all of them here. Jesus did not write the bible and he did not direct that it be written. Even the apostles did not direct so. It was the Catholic Church which compiled the bible towards the end of the forth century in the councils of Carthage, Hippo and Rome.The church continued to adopt sacred tradition as the basis of interpreting the Bible. Sacred tradition was the interpretation of the teachings of Jesus Christ and the apostles passed over to the early church fathers or the successors of the Apostles. The church fathers wrote these interpretations in the book of Didache or the teachings of the 12 apostles defining sixteenth topic including the Eucharist as the body and blood of Jesus christ and baptism as regeneration of souls. Adoption of sacred tradition was in accordance to Hebrews 13:7-9 and in summary says we should remember the leaders who brought us the faith and imitate them and their teachings and we should not be taken away by Strange teachings as Jesus Christ is the same yesterday to day and forever. This has enabled the Catholic Church to maintain a stable doctrine. The Orthodox Church has also adopted sacred tradition and also maintained a stable doctrine. Equally important is interpretation of the bible. The bible does not provide methodology for its interpretation. It is only a collection of books. Martin Luther and Calvin as well as all protestants interpret the bible freely as they wish and hence the prevalence of more than 45 000 denominations over a period of 500 years. Peter in 2Peter1: 20-21 says the bible is the word of God and should not be interpreted freely or privately. Actually protestants intepret the Bible by trial and error methodology that is in Greek or Armeic or in Exegesis. Where does the bible say so. By adopting a trial and error methodology has resulted in many different denominations 45,000 as mentioned above. Everyone is preaching a different doctrine to the extent that many Christians have become disillusioned with christianity and have or are leaving the Christian faith or are agnostic or are now atheists to the extent that one third of the American population is no longer Christian Worse still the existence of so many denominations each preaching different doctrines has been difficult to present a united front against the evils consuming the society now such as same sex marriages false teachings and fake miracles, abortion, oppressive policy against the poor and unsound social and economic policies. Christianity should be the❤front runner in supporting these olicies but in some cases some denominations are actually supporting policies which suppress the poor. No wonder therefore Christianity is becoming somewhat irrelevant to the aspirations of many people in USA. Jesus established a church and gave it powers to bind and unbind and that the gates of hell would not overcome it, see Mathew 16: 13-18. The church mentioned here is the one mentioned by Bishop Ignatius of Antiok in one of his letters to his fellow Bishops and congregations in the latter part of the first century: that where there was the eucharist there was Jesus and there is the Catholic Church. Protestants have been hiding information from their believers by shortening the history of Christianity as starting in tin the 16 century after the reformation and that the Catholic Church died immediately after the death of the Apostles This is a false allegations as Jesus Christ asserted his church will never faulter. Listen to the video here in the Utube on 'Four Witnesses brought me home ' by Rod Bennett a former Baptist. The Catholic Church is run by fallible men who make mistakes even the apostles made mistakes but Jesus will always save and guide his church It is important that we read the history of the church from reliable and independent sources such as Google, the Book of Didache and the writings of the early fathers by various church fathers such as Ignatius of Antiok, Policarp of Smyrna, Clement of Rome and Justin Martyr available on Amazon. You will find out that if you are an Evangelical you doctrine is very rifferrent from what the early church fathers preached and practised. Furthermore I invite you to search in Google which is a universal and independent sources of true information and you will be surprised to find out that you denomination is a breakaway from another denomination which broke away from others and that your doctrine is not similar to what you will find in Google. Also you will find out the reformers such as Martin Luther, Calvin and others are not real heroes as your denomination points but were people who committed a lot of atrocities in the name of religion and preached doctrines different from those of the early churb. I think everyone of us would wish to follow the trueth and this is only possible if we due the following. 1. Pray to God to lead us to the trueth and read again. Hebrews13; 7-9 2. Search for the trueth by reading independent sources on Early church including the Didache and On early church fathers. 3. The Utube is very in formative on various topics such as conversion stories where we are informed of Pastors, professionals and businesses executives converting to the Catholic Church on being convinced and are ready to sacrify their high incomes and positions for the trueth. You should not fear the words Catholic Church it is this church which underwent brutal and sustained prosecution under the Roman emperors and thousands of its followers including most of the Apostles and succeeding Bishops died as Martyrs but still managed to preserve the gospels to produce the bible you are now reading in the forth century and spread christianity to the entire Europe and beyond. May God bless you let us keep in touch as Christians.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@felixmaliti5165 Excellent analysis and excellent presentation of the Catholic Faith, God Bless.
@apostolicapologetics4829
@apostolicapologetics4829 Год назад
Really good points! And those Jewish Breans accepted St Paul's oral Sacred Tradition teachings. The didache gives us a picture of the ancient liturgy.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@apostolicapologetics4829 Yes the Didache is very clear on that subject, amen.
@ursamajor1936
@ursamajor1936 Год назад
Oh dear! I've just finished reading through all of the comments. Would you all talk to Jesus that way? Does this discussion enhance Jesus's life and his gift of saving grace?
@PInk77W1
@PInk77W1 9 месяцев назад
“I just know Jesus and the Church are one.” St Joan of Arc
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic 9 месяцев назад
@Pink77W1 Yes they are indeed one.
@scottschultz2669
@scottschultz2669 Год назад
Hi Hugh, you are right about history of canon of NT. I noticed when Bible were written in fourth century AD. They didn’t books into chapters and verses til late Middle Ages when Catholic Church do that to make it easier for people to find specific writing.
@treceitalia7236
@treceitalia7236 Год назад
Ok, let me try to summarize your point as I understood it: - We know and agree that the Bible is the word of God, which means it is true and infallible. - We know the Bible is a compilation of several books. - There is the section called the Old Testament, which has books that the jews read, just like Jesus Himself did, and the other section called the New Testament, which has books, some are called letters/epistles. So the heart of the issue that you are pointing out would be this question: Who decided which books/letters were inspired by God and thus would be put together as the compilation of what we call The Bible? And this is, I suppose, what puts Protestantism in the hot seat. The "killer" answer would have to be that the Church was the one that had the authority to decide and put the books together, which would reveal the issue of the right or authority of the Church. Is this your point?
@DarinL
@DarinL Год назад
The church leaders at that time did not GIVE the Bible its authority, they RECOGNIZED its authority. They simply gathered together to confirm what the Spirit was already saying to the widespread, body of Christ.
@RCEmichaelreavey
@RCEmichaelreavey Год назад
@@DarinL Deep
@gabepettinicchio7454
@gabepettinicchio7454 Год назад
@@DarinL To add ... there were many other "false gospels & letters, along with roughly 20 heretical faiths, such as docetism, Montanism, adoptionism, Sabellianism, Arianism, Pelagianism, and of course, Gnosticism. All had to be dealt with, as did all the other gospels and letters that claimed to be true.
@matthewsymonds7772
@matthewsymonds7772 Год назад
Great video 👍
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@matthewsymonds7772 Thanks, all the Glory God. God Bless.
@francishaight2062
@francishaight2062 Год назад
Well said, Hugh!
@gabepettinicchio7454
@gabepettinicchio7454 Год назад
Hi Hugh. Were the men that wrote the NT, not members of the early church?
@rhwinner
@rhwinner Год назад
Yes, of course they were. 😀
@maishayangu9216
@maishayangu9216 Год назад
Ofcourse they were, except that at the time they were not specifically identified as catholics in the way we apply theterm today. Remember Jesus was not a christian but a jew of Judaic following, Jesus's followers were first called christians in Antioch, after the church(the universal) church had been established and it had become common knowledge that these people belonged in one group which had been identified as the "Way" of Jesus! The Jews had tried without success to eliminate these followers of jesus but the more they tried, the bigger the following became. So it only was natural to start calling them by the one term that could easily identify them whenever they went as being the followers of the New Way brought on by that "renegade" Nazorean!
@jeffscully1347
@jeffscully1347 Год назад
All of the members of Jesus' one, holy, catholic, and Apostolic Church from the first Pentecost on, were Catholic. The Apostles, the disciples, the Virgin Mary . . . ALL CATHOLIC. All members of Jesus' Church. All Christians. The NAME Catholic, wasn't applied until the end of the first century, but that doesn't mean that those who belonged to Jesus' Church weren't Catholic. The New York Highlanders changed their name in 1913. The previous season they were the Highlanders. But they were the same team. Same manager. Same players. Same ballpark. But starting in 1913, they became known as the New York Yankees. In the 1990s, Kentucky Fried Chicken became KFC. Same secret recipe of seven herbs and spices. Same crispy goodness. Different name. In 1931, British actor, Archibald Leach signed a contract with Paramount Studios to make movies for them. At that time he changed his name to Cary Grant. Same actor. Same talent. Same haircut. Different name. Jesus' Church became known as the Catholic Church at the end of the first century. Same Church. Different name.
@rhwinner
@rhwinner Год назад
@@jeffscully1347 Same crispy goodness. 😁
@DivaProtocol
@DivaProtocol Год назад
that's your mega super ultra argument that destroy protestants? weak!
@RCEmichaelreavey
@RCEmichaelreavey Год назад
The hinge of the massive Fort Knox door illustrates the importance of defeating Sola Scriptura . Once you are able to reason that it was not until the 20th century that common people could read, and combine that with the paucity of scrolls available, make Sola Scriptura weak and untenable. The hinge breaks, the door opens. I read Scripture. I pray over scripture. My view is you believe you're in. John 6 verse 40 Being in is infinitely better that being out. And yet, I've learned that I can cross the ocean of life in a dingy or a Cruise ship. That why I am Catholic. That's why I receive Eucharist daily. Fratelli tutti para 15
@Sayheybrother8
@Sayheybrother8 Год назад
24:45 very good question and response to the infallible word argument.
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
26:51 Thank the Lord, I have found the silver bullet that silences and embarrasses Bible-alone anti-Catholics. Various anti-Catholic commentators on Catholic channels, who debate me, argue vainly that Jesus says in John 6:63 that “the flesh profits not”, therefore, at 6:53 where Jesus said: “I tell you most solemnly, if you do not eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you will not have life in you,” Jesus is speaking figuratively, symbolically, not literally. I then reply, “Our Lord refers to men thinking carnally in the flesh, not in the Spirit, who are unable to grapple with this shocking revelation. If Christ’s flesh profits not, then what was the benefit of Jesus sacrificing His own flesh on the cross at Golgotha?” I have asked this question about 10 times and curiously, on every occasion, my opponent offered the reply of SILENCE, because they dare not admit that 6:63 refers to the flesh of men, not His own flesh. As per other anti-Catholics, @_ready_ offers the SILENCE argument. Whereas @EPH-re2xj hopes his embarrassed bluster will convince me that I am wrong. They both fail miserably.
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
⁠@@_ready__Huh? Well does John 6:63 refer to Christ’s or man’s flesh?
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
@@EPH113 So that’s the best you got? Where does the Church say we cannot read the Bible and understand it for ourselves? You have no answer to my challenge?
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
@@EPH113 Oh please do educate this ignorant freelance Catholic with your pearls of wisdom. You have no answer to John 6:63? You tell me: to what flesh is Our Lord referring? Remember, it is 2 Peter 3:16 that warns against incorrect interpretation of Scripture. No need for me to go to the Magisterium.
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
@@EPH113 The Catholic Church does believe that Jesus Christ is God, Lord and Saviour. What makes you think we don’t? I read the acute discomfort in your sarcasm. Again, another protestant, phobic anti-Catholic has no answer to John 6:63-astounding. The plain reading of John 6:53 is that we must eat Christ’s flesh and drink His Blood. Do you not say Scripture is self-attesting, self-evident?
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
@@EPH113 I am so underwhelmed! You offer so many unconvincing words, totally out of context. Yes, as a Catholic, I agree with you 100% that Our Lord sacrificed Himself “once for all” per Hebrews. But in your fleshy, carnal understanding of John 6:53 you fail to understand that we MUST eat Christ’s flesh and drink His blood. The Mosaic Laws of becoming unclean by consuming Christ’s Precious Body and Blood have been fulfilled and replaced by the New and Everlasting Covenant in Christ’s Blood. Jesus is the New Lamb of the Passover for all generations. As John the Baptist said of his kinsman, Jesus, upon baptising Him in the River Jordon, seeing the Holy Spirit descend on Jesus and hearing the voice of God the Father, John said, “Behold the Lamb of God Who takes away the sins of the world!” John 6:63 says you must discern in the Spirit and cannot reason this revelation with your fleshy, earthy mind. Christ’s “once for all” sacrifice on the cross is perpetual, in heaven, outside time and the physical universe. For God, the moment of Christ’s sacrifice did not occur 1,990 years ago on Calvary. It is here and now, ever present, Christ mediating, pleading to the Father in His love and mercy to spare us from His just wrath and eternal torment. As the “once for all” sacrifice is ever present to the Father, we Catholics agree wholeheartedly that Jesus needs not be sacrificed over and over again. Rather, the Mass and Eucharist REMEMBER this eternal, perpetual, “once for all” sacrifice. We give thanks (the meaning of Eucharist) in memorial (Lk 22:19) to the Father for redeeming us by not sparing His Son and we offer up the perpetual, unbloodied sacrifice as we offer up our lives in thanksgiving and service. You fail to steamroll or impress me with your hyperbole and bluster, hoping that throwing lots of verses at me will fix the problem. Yet, you avoid answering my one burning question: whose flesh (which profits not) does Jesus refer to in John 6:63?
@martinmartin1363
@martinmartin1363 Год назад
You speak so plainly and what you say is easily understood, l would have loved to have found this channel years ago, because l understand the Catholic Church as you do it just took a lot of research to get to the same understanding you are preaching here on your channel, lm looking forward to listening to more from you. God bless you 🙂
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@martinmartin1363 Thanks so much. It's all by His Grace and unto His Glory. Please pray for me.
@martinmartin1363
@martinmartin1363 Год назад
@@catholicskeptic You and your family are in my thoughts, God bless you. My local priest said many times we are not called to like one another, we are called by God to love one another, we don't like everyone we meet, but we can love them and pray for them. 🙏
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@@martinmartin1363 Anen to that, thank you, God Bless.
@ralf547
@ralf547 Год назад
We just keep saying the same things to each other. I hear you but still disagree on much. You don't appear to understand what I am saying based on your responses. This most recent video is filled with what I've been hearing you say for quite some time. My response would be much like many of my past responses. Here is a post I just finished. It's on faith alone vs faith + works. It's actually a response to Catholic criticism of Luther's adding "alone". It is too long even after I have edited it down considerably. Not much content from me, and lots of scripture references and Early Church Father quotes. I hope you will read it and respond if you like. But with this post, I am going to break from commenting on your channel. Will still watch. You must be tired of me and need a break as well. So here is my post. I'm not interested in winning a debate, but sincerely believe that this is what scripture proclaims and expects a Christian to believe. Luther shouldn't have added "alone" but I can understand the temptation since there's sufficient evidence for doing so. James read in it's entirety and taken in context shows how he is making the distinction between a said or empty proclamation of faith and real faith which always results in good works. Luther said that works are always the result of having saving faith. The good works don't save because (Hebrews 11:6) faith must first be present before any work can be pleasing to God. We do work out salvation with fear and trembling, but that is the the ongoing life of a Christian, sanctification, not an unbeliever working towards becoming saved, or a Christian actively helping with his/her own forgiveness of sins and salvation. Romans 3:28 "For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law." Faith APART FROM works of the law. Ephesians 2:8-9 "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast." So that no one may boast. That excludes us having any contribution to our salvation. Romans 5:1 "Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ." Justified by faith, no mention of anything else. Romans 10:10 "With the heart one believes and is justified." Justified by belief, nothing more. Gal 2:16 "yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified." Justified through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of the law. John 1:12 "But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God," What else is believing in Jesus' name than putting belief and faith in Him, and therefore we become God's children. John 3:14-15 "And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, 15 that whoever believes in him may have eternal life." Belief in Jesus bestows eternal life, not belief plus works. 1 Cor 15:56-57 ". . . God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ." No mention of a contribution by us. Romans 5:2 "Through him(Jesus) we have also obtained access by faith", no mention of works or our contribution, "into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God." Hebrews 4:14&16 "Since then we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession." . . . " 16 Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need." It is because of Jesus we can confess that we receive mercy, no mention of our earning mercy in any way. Acts 10:43 " To him all the prophets bear witness that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.” We are forgiven by our belief(faith) in Jesus, no mention of works. Romans 4:16 "That is why it depends on faith, in order that the promise may rest on grace and be guaranteed to all his offspring-not only to the adherent of the law but also to the one who shares the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all," Forgiveness/salvation depends on faith, not works, because is must be the gracious free gift dependent entirely on Jesus for it to be guaranteed. If it were dependent upon us in any way at all, there would be no guarantee. Gal 3:22 "But the Scripture imprisoned everything under sin, so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe." Again, faith is the essential, no mention of anything else. Romans 3:26 "It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus." God alone saves and is both just and justifier of any who have faith in Jesus. No mention of works or cooperation on our part. Habakkuk 2:4 "The righteous shall live by faith." Isaiah 53:11 "By His knowledge shall the righteous one, My servant, make many to be accounted righteous." Jesus makes us righteous, we don't and can't. It's easy to get into a battle of dueling Church Fathers, because they were fallible human beings just as we are, very often right and sometimes wrong. Nevertheless, here is what some early Church Fathers wrote: From Augustine's Letter to a certain Irenaeus: " . . . according to the command of the Law, all are indicted. And yet, by the works of the Law, no one is justified. . . . But when the Lord Jesus Christ came, He forgave to all people the sin, which no one could avoid. . . But he who is righteous has righteousness given to him because he was justified from the washing of Baptism. Faith, therefore, is that which frees through the blood of Christ, because he is blessed "Whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered "(Psalm 32:1)" From Augustine's book On the Spirit and the Letter. "These matters, having been considered and treated, according to the ability that the Lord has thought worthy to give us, we conclude that a person is not justified by the precepts of a good life, but by faith in Jesus Christ." . . . "In a justified person, there is no right work by which he who does that work may live. But justification is received by faith." From St. Basil the Great: "Indeed, this is the perfect and complete glorification of God, when one does not exult in his own righteousness, but recognizing oneself as lacking true righteousness to be justified by faith alone in Christ. (Homily on Humility, PG 31.532; The Fathers of the Church, vol. 9, p. 479) From St. Hilary of Poitiers: "Because faith alone justifies [quia fides sola iustificat]...publicans and prostitutes will be first in the kingdom of heaven." (Commentary on Matthew XXI.15) From St. John Chrysostom: "But what is the “law of faith?” It is, being saved by grace. Here he shows God's power, in that He has not only saved, but has even justified, and led them to boasting, and this too without needing works, but looking for faith only." (Homilies on Romans 3) From St. John Chrysostom: "They said that he who adhered to faith alone was cursed; but he, Paul, shows that he who adhered to faith alone is blessed." (Homily on Galatians 3) From St. John Chrysostom: "Here he shows God's power, in that He has not only saved, but has even justified, and led them to boasting, and this too without needing works, but looking for faith only." (Homily 7 on Romans) From St. John Chrysostom: "For you believe the faith; why then do you add other things, as if faith were not sufficient to justify? You make yourselves captive, and you subject yourself to the law." (Epistle to Titus, Homily 3, PG 62.651) From St. John Chrysostom: "Let us see, however, whether the brigand gave evidence of effort and upright deeds and a good yield. Far from his being able to claim even this, he made his way into paradise before the apostles with a mere word, on the basis of faith alone, the intention being for you to learn that it was not so much a case of his sound values prevailing as the Lord's lovingkindness being completely responsible." (Sermon 7 on Genesis, in St. John Chrysostom, Eight Sermons on the Book of Genesis, p. 123, Robert C. Hill translator) From St. John Chrysostom: "What then was it that was thought incredible? That those who were enemies, and sinners, neither justified by the law, nor by works, should immediately through faith alone be advanced to the highest favor. Upon this head accordingly Paul has discoursed at length in his Epistle to the Romans, and here again at length. (Homily 4 on 1 Timothy) From St. John Chrysostom: "We need none of those legal observances, he says; faith suffices to obtain for us the Spirit, and by Him righteousness, and many and great benefits." (Homilies on Galatians 4) I believe faith alone stands on it's own in the scriptures even should the verse Luther slightly added to be stricken entirely from the Bible.
@atrifle8364
@atrifle8364 Год назад
Proof texting is not thinking nor reading comprehensively. The number one hazard of Protestantism is that it teaches people to not read and that anyone's written words are fair game for their thesis.
@ursamajor1936
@ursamajor1936 Год назад
Ah, yes, saved by faith alone allows for the outflowing of pure love and pure forgiveness.
@TrueChristianityWithSandra
@TrueChristianityWithSandra Год назад
There’s just too much evidence that the Catholic Church is the True Church founded by Christ. Theological, Scriptural, Historical, and even Scientific. There is no other Christianity - just Heterodoxy.
@errorsofmodernism9715
@errorsofmodernism9715 Год назад
If people want to argue then why waste your time with them?
@For3nity
@For3nity Год назад
@getrit3007 Do you not know that if you present yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, *or of obedience, which leads to righteousness?*
@For3nity
@For3nity Год назад
@getrit3007 Is Jesus perfect? Yes. Is Jesus holy? Yes. Can Jesus sin? No. Is Jesus obedient to his Heavenly Father and his Blessed Mother? Yes. So, be like Jesus, by having him in you and you in him. How? John 6:56: Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.
@For3nity
@For3nity Год назад
@getrit3007 Did Abraham believe in God? Yes. Did Abraham obey God? Yes. Did Abraham trust in God? Yes. Was Abraham willing to give everything to God? Yes. So be like Abraham (and Jesus). Believe in God, trust him, make him your everything. Can you do it by yourself? No. So how to do it? By the grace of God thru faith. If you are given that grace with that faith, will you sin? No. Will you live a holy life? Yes. Will you automatically obey all the law guiding you to holiness without even knowing what the law is? Yes. So what is the most important thing for you?. Have a pure heart like Jesus and his holy and blessed mother Mary. But how? Love them. How to love them? Pray, ask for that love. Matthew 5:8: Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. God bless...
@For3nity
@For3nity Год назад
@getrit3007 You have no idea how to be truly saved and no more in slavery to sins. So I understand if you could not see how important to have a pure heart. Purity is nothing to do with work. But if you have a pure heart you will love others like Jesus and his blessed mother. God is love. God bless...
@For3nity
@For3nity Год назад
@getrit3007 You cannot be like Jesus by your own effort. That's why you have to have him in you to change you to be like him. David had no Jesus back then.
@DarinL
@DarinL Год назад
Hmmmm…. You are assuming that the Roman Catholic Church (as it exists today) is the only true expression of the original church. The Orthodox Church leaders would disagree with you. No one would (should) deny that “the church” (as represented by recognized, geographical leaders at that time) gathered together to affirm which books were recognized as “inspired” by their respective congregations. Such leaders did not GIVE the books their authority, they simply RECOGNIZED the intrinsic authority of those books/letters. This recognized list evolved over the years until it settled in today’s form. This is a fact of ancient church history. However, this is not an argument for (or proof of) the truth of the teaching, or authority of the existing Roman Catholic church.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@DarinL Respectfully, the Orthodox Church is really our sister Church: divided by schism rather than doctrine. There are few distinctions in doctrine, although Papal jurisdiction is the main issue. Both have Bishops in acknowledged Apostolic Succession , Seven Sacraments, Liturgy, Creed, etc. Some Orthodox disagree with this assessment, others agree. And yes certainly the choosing of the books to be in the New Testament canon was a matter of "recognition ", I wholly agree, BUT, the difference is , the collection of documents did not at all evolve to what we have today, quite the contrary , the 27 books in question are exactly the same from that first Council until today. And The Bishops made those selections in authority, as the Magisterium of the Church. That is the Catholic case for believing the selections were in fact the correct ones.
@DarinL
@DarinL Год назад
@@catholicskeptic By “evolve” I am referring to the fact that a couple of books (James, Revelation) were in some dispute in some regions. Having said that, with all due respect, my initial point remains (and your recognition of the Orthodox schism underlines this reality). Using the fact that local church appointed leaders, roughly 18 centuries ago, gathered together to affirm (not create) the New Testament scriptures is not an argument for the legitimacy of the present day iteration of the Roman Catholic Church. To do so would be akin to arguing that Moses’ role in compiling the Torah validates modern day Israel.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@@DarinL Respectfully, it was not "local church leaders ", the acknowledgment and selection of the books that make up the New Testament was first done by Pope Damasus and the Bishops of the Catholic Church, in 382,AD at the Council of Rome. And re-confirmed by the Councils of Carthage and Hippo in 393 and 394 AD. In oder to know which books are the infallible scriptures, you need an infallible editor to make the choices, Jesus Church is that editor.
@DarinL
@DarinL Год назад
@@catholicskeptic I’m actually not disagreeing with you in principle. Certainly it was the Church of Jesus Christ (as indwelt by the Spirit of God) that recognized and affirmed which documents deserved the title “Holy Scripture.” By the end of the first century all 27 NT books were written and received by the vast amount of churches. In fact, within roughly 200 years after the first century, nearly every verse of the NT was cited by one or more of the Fathers. The various councils (which were, in fact, made up of “local church leaders” that gathered together in one location) simply ratified and made official what the overall Body of Christ was experiencing. All of this to say: in my personal opinion, your title overpromised and under-delivered. I see no lethal argument against the Protestant movement. You are conflating things when you equate 3rd century church councils with the 21st century Roman Catholic Church. Much has taken place over the centuries. Just as the nation of Israel lost the plot at times and required a “remnant” to maintain the core of God’s purposes, so, too has the Church.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@@DarinL In terms of individual behavior, there is always a remnant who remain faithful. In terms of Doctrine, and historical accuracy, you are ducking the issues i raised in the video. Simply put, the God revealed in the Bible is a God Who changes not; a God who wants things done decently and in order; a God Who is not the author of confusion. ( Malachi 3:6, 1 Corinthians 14:33, 40)I do not believe that such a God would merely toss some manuscripts down from Heaven, to an illiterate population, over a thousand years before the printing press, and just wait for us to speculate, examine, and infer doctrinal truths. Jesus testified to His earthly audience: "the scribes and Pharisees sit in Moses seat, all therefore they bid you to observe, that observe and keep, but do not after their works, for they say, and do not"( Matthew 23:1-3) Clearly Tradition kept by men and passed down was utterly linked to proper transmission of the Word of God. Thus Jesus established a living Church, to establish doctrine, administer Word and Sacraments . Otherwise you only individuals and various groups preaching and teaching hundreds of different doctrines on everything.
@phillydelphia8760
@phillydelphia8760 Год назад
How about the several arguments that destroy Catholicism? Gonna talk about those?
@atrifle8364
@atrifle8364 Год назад
The arguments that "destroy" Catholicism involve terrible history, outright strawmanning of the Catholic doctrine and practice, and largely wishful thinking about Scripture.
@electrical_cord
@electrical_cord Год назад
Oh, you mean the Bible verses taken out of context, ignorance of actual Catholic doctrine, and conspiracy theories? Sure we can talk about those lol
@phillydelphia8760
@phillydelphia8760 Год назад
@@electrical_cord ohh I see, framing a discussion with your own context so anything different is wrong. Tell me more about ignorance 🙄
@electrical_cord
@electrical_cord Год назад
@@phillydelphia8760 Trust me, I've talked with thousands of Protestants. Either they don't understand what Catholics believe, or don't know how to do proper Biblical exegesis. It just makes me more Catholic to see that the other side relies on ignorance to remain in their beliefs.
@josephssewagudde8156
@josephssewagudde8156 Год назад
You will have to define catholicism but remember it is not a denomination like yours. You will have to debate against the church itself because the church is Catholic. "One holy catholic and Apostolic church". It is a description of the church
@jimstiles26287
@jimstiles26287 Год назад
Sir, How would a religious Jew living in 50 BC know which Jewish books were canonical and which were not? Did the people of God during the intertestimonial period have an inerrant and infallible majestarium? Jesus did not think so. Props to Dr. James White Jim
@paulsmallwood1484
@paulsmallwood1484 Год назад
A Protestant response to the question, who chose the books of the New Testament canon? This particular framing of the question has a number of built-in assumptions that need to be recognized. Most notably, there is a problem with the word “chose”. It assumes that the church proactively, overtly “decided” which books belonged in the canon. This usually conjures images of some meeting, or council, where people voted on books-some books making the cut, and others left out. Moreover, the word “chose” also gives the impression that there would not be a canon unless the church acted. It’s almost as if a group of people got together and an individual said, “Hey everyone, don’t you think we need a canon of books?” Then, after everyone nods their head in agreement, the individual says, “Ok then, let’s go find the ones we like the best!” But, as you might imagine, the problems with this whole scenario are legion. For one, the earliest Christians did not view themselves as choosing books, nor did they view themselves as having the right/power to do such a thing. Instead, they viewed themselves as receiving the books that had been handed down to them by the apostles. It would not have dawned on them that they could just pick whatever books they happened to prefer. If you had lived in the second century and asked the average Christian on the street, “Why did you guys pick Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John?,” I think you would have received some very strange looks. Indeed, I don’t think the question would have made any sense to the average Christian. They didn’t view themselves as choosing anything. Asking Christians why they chose the Gospels would be akin to asking someone why they chose their parents. No one chooses their parents. They were just kind of “there” from as far back as they can remember. In a sense, one might say that the Gospels, and the rest of the New Testament, chose themselves. What I mean by this is that they were recognized as the books bearing the voice of Christ by the earliest believers. Of course, this idea is fundamentally at odds with the common cultural perceptions of the way religion works, and the way religious power is utilized. The reason most people use the word “choose” is because they assume (even if they don’t realize it) that religious books are ultimately man-made enterprises. It’s always a group of humans somewhere that are imposing their religious views on others. And if the canon is merely the (arbitrary) choice of a bunch of humans, then it can be edited, reworked, rewritten, or even just ignored. Now, it is true that in later centuries there were church councils that made declarations about the canon (e.g. Hippo, Carthage, Laodicea). But these councils did not view themselves as creating or deciding the canon, but merely affirming what they believed the canon had always been. Info source: Dr. Michael Kruger. Note: It goes without saying that Protestants reject the claim made by our Roman Catholic friends that the church of the first four centuries is synonymous with Roman Catholicism. The two are not one and the same.
@christopherlampman5579
@christopherlampman5579 Год назад
I’m not RC but likely will convert. As I read the fathers I don’t see any universal cannon list. It was the 300 years before I see the current cannon explicitly listed out. Short of a council with authority now do I know, for certain, I have a correct cannon? Not a debate here, I’m a fellow Protestant trying to round out this square.
@39knights
@39knights Год назад
I've seen you make this argument before and it still fails no matter how many times you repeat the same erroneous material. You can play the semantic game all you want; but people can see through your verbosity to your underlying motive which is to deny the Catholic Faith by trying to rewrite history. The brute fact is there was no infallible list (a Canon) of the many inspired writings which existed among many others in the Christian Communities up until the point it became a concern in the late 300's. To believe there was is simply a fantasy. How the list came to be, which is the 73 book canon, can be described as 'chose', 'decided', 'drew lots', 'picked them out of a hat' or whatever way you want to say it. What remains the same is among all the ways in which bibles (the dependable/infallible list of the truly inspired writings from the non-inspired) have come to be; the only ONE which remains valid is the Catholic one. The KJV, the Mormon bible, Luther's bible, Tyndals Bible, Calvin's Bible, etc. etc. may have some parts correct; but are always deficient in some way. And it is the reason why they are deficient which points out the invalidity/falseness of the sect which created them.
@paulsmallwood1484
@paulsmallwood1484 Год назад
@@39knights I subscribe to the Nicene Creed, the Apostles Creed and the Athanasian creed. That is the Catholic faith and there is nothing about it that I deny. It is you that is suffering from a distorted view of history.
@39knights
@39knights Год назад
@@paulsmallwood1484 The part about the 'ONE HOLY APOSTOLIC CHURCH' you vehemently deny. That part of the creed refers specifically to the college of bishops united with the See of Rome or the Petrine Office. Just because you want to make up your own definition of that doesn't change the reality of the situation. You are in an apostate position from what those creeds teach.
@paulsmallwood1484
@paulsmallwood1484 Год назад
@@39knights It most certainly does not refer to that. You are reading Roman Catholicism back into history. The Bishop of Rome did not convene this council or even attend it. The vast majority of bishops who did attend were from the East. The Emperor Constantine convened and presided over the council. Yours is the apostate position. I deny nothing. I affirm with all my heart The Holy Catholic Church whose head is Christ, was founded on the Apostles and Prophets and to which all the redeemed are united.
@ryangallmeier6647
@ryangallmeier6647 Год назад
My friends, the attack and assault against Scripture Alone is very evident by the Papal Antichrist and her adherents. For 1,260 YEARS the Papal Antichrist persecuted the Church of Christ with its false doctrines and dogmas. She committed "fornication with the kings of the earth". And, she got people to "drink of the wine of her fornication" as well. Indeed, the "man of sin, son of perdition" sits in the Church ("temple"), of 2 Thes. 2. "Come out of her my people (the Scarlet Harlot of Rev. 17), lest you partake in her sins" (Rev. 18:4). See how all of Western History reflects the workings of Satan in the False, Apostate Papal church? (Dan. 7, the "little horn"; 2 Thes. 2, the "man of sin, son of perdition"; Rev. 13:1-10, the "sea beast"; Rev. 17, the "Scarlet Harlot"). *Soli Deo Gloria*
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@ryangallmereier6647 Notice how some anti-catholics utterly avoid dealing with, nor even responding to the facts and content of the video. They Just spue catholic bashing rhetoric. Everyone please pray for this deluded soul.🙏
@gabepettinicchio7454
@gabepettinicchio7454 Год назад
@@catholicskeptic That's all they got!
@OzCrusader
@OzCrusader Год назад
Pray, tell us where the Bible tells us that the Bible is the sole rule of faith. Look in vain for you will not find it.
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@@OzCrusader So true!
@catholicskeptic
@catholicskeptic Год назад
@@gabepettinicchio7454 That's for sure!
@philoalethia
@philoalethia Год назад
"The One Argument...." Okay, what argument? You didn't present a coherent argument. You presented a 48-minute rambling word salad centered around a rhetorical question: "How do I know which books should be in the Bible?" Obviously, you presume that everyone should accept that the only way to know what books should be in the Bible is the Church of Rome, but anyone who has studied this with any depth whatsoever knows that this is just transparently false. The reality is that various different authentic Christian churches have their own canons. Rome can determine the canon for the Church of Rome. The Greek Orthodox decide for the GOC. The Church of Ethiopia decides for the COE. And so on. The universal Church of Christ does not look to Rome for a unilateral determination of what constitutes Scripture, and there has not been any ecumenical council that addresses the question. Apart from Rome, the various churches aren't so delusional as to believe that theirs is the only right one. Indeed there probably isn't any such thing as one right canon. Rather, each geographical church selects those texts that they find central and inspiration to their respective groups. You then spiral into the whole infallibility question, and then what appears to be some kind of stream-of-consciousness ranting. This is just a horrible mess. The reality is that the witness of history and the Church of Christ does not present us with a clear answer on the matter of the complete canon. The canon embraced by most Protestant Evangelicals has good historical backing. Every text there is held to be canonical by all other apostolic churches, some of which add other texts, too. I think that some who desire a level of certainty and uniformity that is neither real nor realistic (I empathize strongly here) often impute such powers to Rome. This leads to messes such as the video before us. In any event, go ahead and present your "argument" as a formal, symbolic argument. I suspect that you will be unable to do so... or unwilling. That being the case, I ask you to state the truth here -- that you are actually unable to produce such an argument. However, to be fair, if you can produce a demonstrably sound formal argument on this topic (that employs the question of canon in order to "annihilate Protestantism") I will send a donation of $100 to the Roman Catholic parish of your choosing.
@rhwinner
@rhwinner Год назад
Hi, I don't think Hugh was presenting an argument for why all Churches should follow the Catholic Church's canon. That would be another topic. Rather, I think he was pointing out the protestant churches' 'memory lapses' on how the canon came to be formed in the first place.
@vinb2707
@vinb2707 Год назад
@@rhwinner that is true. He is making the point very clear that Jesus started a church. This point cannot be denied and ignored as so many protestants try to do. And it is through that very church that, the very church that can be traced right back to Christ himself, that we have those scriptures. To say that one accepts the scriptures and at the same time deny the very instrument used by God to clarify what is scripture and what is not, is irrational.
@philoalethia
@philoalethia Год назад
@@rhwinner writes: "Hi, I don't think Hugh was presenting an argument for why all Churches should follow the Catholic Church's canon. That would be another topic. Rather, I think he was pointing out the protestant churches' 'memory lapses' on how the canon came to be formed in the first place." He entitled his presentation "The one argument that just annihilates Protestantism." He then went on to make a rambling and largely incoherent set of statements loosely building upon a rhetorical question about who formed the canon. In the process of this "argument," he made countless false statements -- which is easy enough to do when speaking extemporaneously -- among which was the assertion that the canon was decided by the Church at the Council of Rome. That statement is false. If the Council of Rome determined anything, it did so only for the Church of Rome and not for the entire Church. This question of what constitutes the canon has never been a question formally addressed by the entire Church, and to this day different authentic groups in the Church of Christ have differing canons. Further, the canon embraced by most Protestant Evangelical Churches we among those embraced in the early Church, and every text therein is acknowledged as legitimate by all other authentic, historical, apostolic churches. Hugh is just wrong here.
@philoalethia
@philoalethia Год назад
@@vinb2707 writes: " And it is through that very church that, the very church that can be traced right back to Christ himself, that we have those scriptures. " That is a lie. 1) The Church of Rome is not the only one that can trace its existence to Christ. 2) The Church of Rome is not the sole group involved in the formation of the canon of Scripture. There are many good things about Roman Catholicism. There is no need to lie about it in order to promote it... or is there?
@atrifle8364
@atrifle8364 Год назад
​@@philoalethia- The Church of Rome is one specific church inside the Catholic Church, which has 22 distinct churches. The Church of Rome is headed by the Bishop of Rome. The Bishop of Rome is the Peterine office. The occupants of the Bishop of Rome can be traced back to Peter. Jesus put Peter in charge of his earthly Church. In order to find the Church of Christ, you need to find the living Peter. There is only one Universal Church who even claims Peter.
@michaelyocum616
@michaelyocum616 Год назад
Another great video. Keep up the good work.
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