The Original Plans for The Hobbit 

I’m still convinced that PJ-if given enough time-would’ve knocked it out of the park. Del Toro may have also. Instead, we got the worst of both worlds: del Toro leaving late in the game & PJ with little prep time, not able to surround himself with the talent he had before (F Walsh & P Boyens), left to cobble together whatever ideas of another artist’s work he could while under tons more studio scrutiny and micro-management under a huge time constraint. It’s honestly a miracle there’s anything good to say about these movies

Ever since I know what Jackson had to deal with, I feel sorry for him and the whole project. I really wonder how the movies would have turned out with him as a director right from the start, enough preperation and only two movies.

I think the visual differences between the LotR trilogy and Del Toro's Hobbit could have been easily explained by framing the fist movie as Bilbo telling the story of his adventures to a young Frodo, who has never been outside the Shire, and wouldn't know, for example, what Orcs or a Dragon looked like. And so we would literally be seeing them through the lens of Frodo's imagination. Very similar to the idea behind Tarsem Singh's movie, The Fall. And then it would make a lot more sense for the second movie to be visually closer to LotR, as it wouldn't have the same framing device.

I both love and hate this channel. I love it because it is entertaining and gives us a look into "what could have been," which usually is a heartfelt, genuine improvement over what we got. But that is also the very reason I hate it.

Remember don't blame Jackson for The Hobbit it was a very troubled production that didn't have much prep work.

The saddest part of Del Toro’s vision never seeing the light of day is his love of practical effects. I would have loved to see a more practical take on middle earth’s special effects, especially the uncanny valley effects that Del Toro gravitates towards.

The idea of Del Toro’s fantasy like world slowly and seamlessly becoming Jackson’s darker, slightly more realistic world sounds like it would’ve been amazing. Real shame it didn’t come to fruition

I still feel so bad for GDT. 2:58 PJ didn't do this, it was the studio demanding it. PJ did stellar work with the mess he had to organise. But even him can't turn shit into gold.

A friend of mine worked on the Hobbit series before Del Toro left and shared this unique fact with me: Del Toro intended to film several scenes throughout both films using minor adjustments to the colour grading to imply that Bilbo was making up parts of the story entirely. These small adjustments would signal that Bilbo wasn't being entirely honest about what happened on his adventures without making this super noticeable. There is even a line from Del Toro's screenplay that plants this idea early in the first film, when Gandalf tells Bilbo "all good stories deserve a little embellishment." This was Del Toro's creative solution to remaining truthful to the kid-friendly nature of the book, without contradicting the tone of the LOTR trilogy. Jackson did not honor this detail written into the screenplay, and so therefore the barrel sequence for example is played tonally consistent with the rest of the film.

Del Toro is one of the best filmmakers out there, and his visual style has never failed to disappoint. Had he retained control of the film, I have no doubt that it'd be just as beloved as Jackson's LOTR trilogy 😊

It's honestly really heart breaking what happened to the hobbit. I'm sure Sir Ian and Peter felt it during his scenes. There was no capturing the magic of the Lord of the Rings in this circumstance. Once again, big studio execs ruining movies. If those delays never happened, Guillermo's idea would've been incredible, maybe not LOTR level, but certainly much better than what we got, and a much better experience for everyone who worked on the films.

Nah, let’s be honest. In the universe where Del Toro’s movies were produced, fans are moaning “imagine how much better they would have been if Peter Jackson had directed!”

Jackson’s was also 2 screenplays. The studio forced a third film after filming. The second screenplay was cut up in the editing room, and reshoots were done to stretch it.

It was a sad story when it comes to The Hobbit films and what could have been. That said, given the recent success of Pinocchio, I would be open to GDT doing an animated version of The Hobbit to enable his vision but also expand his fantastic stop motion work.

I was too excited to see GdT's "The Hobbit". His movies have what he calls "eye protein", and are amazing to watch! His creature designs would've been wild. I'm sure his Smaug would've been ugly, asymmetrical, and scary as Hell!

I want PJ bigatures version. With practical effects and models, and props. And the studio giving them enough time to do it so it didn't need to all be greenscreen. I wish it had been shot on Super35 and film instead of 48 frames per second 3D video. Should have been two films.

We saw some of it. The design for Mirkwood and Thandruill's Elvin Cave were based on Del Toro's Minatures.

The concepts for Smaug are a thing I think about often. Something about the mouth specifically. Knowing Del Toro I imagine it would look creepy.

I like to think that Del Toro's version would have been awesome! I liked almost everything I have heard. I am not sure about the dragon, but it sounded promising.

I've always wondered why they put the Elven/Dwarf love interest there? It didn't need it all! :(

You are quickly becoming my favorite channel. Love all these what could have been videos!

The Hobbit trilogy that we got was obviously a misfire which we can't 100% blame Jackson for. That being said I'm not sure Del Toro would have been the right fit either. He makes interesting films to be sure but I feel a lot of his work is style over substance. The Hobbit movie we should have got was one where Jackson actually had time for pre production with a limited budget and no greedy studio interference.

I’d love for them to take another crack at the hobbit with his vision and just make it separate from the LotR trilogy by Jackson. I really liked the hobbit movies that we got, but there are some things I wish they did differently such as using far less cgi (something I wish more movies would use less of) and some story things being different as well.

I'm that rare breed of person that loves Jackson's The Hobbit films despite the bloat and flaws. Still, I'd have loved to see Guillermo's version. As an aside, I wonder if one day you'd be able to cover the project that Guillermo left The Hobbit for: At the Mountains of Madness. There's not a lot of info out there (as far as I know, anyway) but I'd like to see it nonetheless.

Let's all agree Hobbit would've been 100x better with less CGI

That editing of the scenes involving the green pasture, the blue tint, the crimson tint, and the yellow part was somethinf else tho~ 👀😳☺️👍

Hobbit should have been an animated movie. In fact it still should be, GDT should be brought back with whatever time and budget he chooses.

Thanks for this series. They are great! Already watched 3-4 and subscribed! :)

I have never become a fan of a channel so quickly, love the content of course but also love the comment sections, a peace loving community for movie buffs❤

"Computer, access all files on Guillermo Del Toro's The Hobbit and extrapolate a feature film based on his vision. Put them in a cinema on Holodeck 3."

I said this afew weeks ago. These videos are amazing and all the work you do. Keep it up and I will always be watching them. Thanks 🍻

Del Toro has done some interesting fantasy films. I think that the movie should’ve stayed as just one movie and kept it as a children’s book, but I think Peter Jackson did good work considering he only had 4 months of prep time. I think the biggest problem I have had with the Hobbit movies is the difficulties in knowing each of the 13 dwarves. I mean we already know how Thorin is and maybe Ballin as well as Gloyn who is Gimli’s father. I think flash backs and scenes with each of the dwarves would’ve helped the audience get to know the dwarves better. I talked to someone who read The Hobbit and she said that she had a hard time differentiating the dwarves and felt like they were very two dimensional. I think Del toro’s version would’ve been interesting but we wouldn’t have gotten the Battle of the Five Armies which I really enjoyed watching.

Jackson didn't want to make three films. He only wanted to make two. The decision was made before the first movie premiered that a third film would be made. He mentions this multiple times during the documentaries on the extended editions of the films.

When you consider the circumstances of PJ’s involvement, it’s honestly incredible that the first movie turned out as well as it did.

Does anyone else get the impression from watching this channel that studios purposefully select the lesser versions of the potential stories/films to move forward with? It’s insane how many of these would have been far superior to what we got 🤦‍♂️

When del Toro moved to Wellington, he rented a second house just to house his library. James Cameron was the one who talked del Toro to leave the project because he believed there would be too much meddling from PJ.

If Azog looks like a "video game character" then god damn that must be some next gen video game for 2012 dude. Idk how people saw it as poorly rendered. Also Ian never broke down on set, that's just reddit's nerd misinformation freakouts

We need to get a two-part comic series based on Guillermo Del Toro's vision of *"THE HOBBIT".*

Above all the fact that the producers thought the dwarfs had to look fuckable is so incredibly depressing.

I'm curious, out of all the what could have been videos you've done, what film would you liked to have seen the most?

I like the trilogy and even the extended editions. I didn't mind that it was split into 3 films. I still would like to see Del Toro's version. I don't see why they can't make it now as a "reboot". I do want to see Del Toro do a Hellraiser remake in his style.

I have loved to watch Guillermo Del Toro's version of the Hobbit. It would have been a very different version from what Peter Jackson made. I think some fans would have been disappointed because the style would have been very different from the style of the Lord of the Rings trilogy, a stange looking Smaug and no on-screen The Battle of the Five Armies.

I would love if Del Toro was given another chance to do his movie. I doubt it will ever happen I think the door is open with how it turned out.

I for one am happy about the design choice of Smaug, and I think Martin Freeman was brilliant. Other than that Del Toro’s version would have been so much better.

As much as I adore the LoTR trilogy by Peter Jackson, Guillermo Del Toro's Hobbit would have been amazing and a perfect addition to the franchise. It's a shame that in our reality we will never see it... but I like to think that an alternate version of our reality exists, and that version is enjoyed and celebrated by many! Heh heh I soooo delight in the "many worlds" theory! ♥

I think Jackson was the only real choice for this tbh, after his work on LoTR - I'm curious about the original two-part structure though, I've done an edit myself but who knows how it compares to the original?

Tt Games, (Who you might know for making the Lego games, actually pitched a non-Lego Hobbit game. Which would've come out around the time of Part 1 in 2011. (Which is when Part 1 was meant to come out before the delay and the change from 2 films to 3.) There's even a video on RU-vid about it. The game had test levels made using elements from LOTR, but it all fell apart due to WB wanting the game to be a new story set at the same time, along wih all the stuff going on with the film.

The Missing Reel gag was just in the theatrical cut of the movie. The scene was filmed and is part of the full movie version, unlike what was implied in this video. Should have made that clear.

The missing reel with the lap dance scene in deathproof is included in the original version of the movie and can be found on youtube.

I honestly can’t imagine a Middle-Earth movie by del Toro since Jackson perfected it.

The different animated movies from the 70s are vastly different from each other and have clashing tones, style, and designs. It seems Del Toro tried to make The Hobbit different but believable to where it may connect to Jackson's LOTR trilogy.

I loved the Battle of the Five Armies!

There no was a bad way, for a good way. Maybe The Hobbit didin't directed by GDT, but Pacific Rim came later and he gave us a beautiful and masterwork of the Kaiju and Mecha genere.

I actually enjoyed the Hobbit movies but this is a real eye opener for me. I agree it would have been much better to see Del Toro involved. 😢

Take a shot every time you hear "CGI-laden extravaganza".

They could have done two films: one ending as they were floating downriver to the Lonely Mountain as it comes into view, then the actual fulfillment of the quest.

Idk, I know that the Hobbit Trilogy of films wasn’t quite as good as the LOTR, but I still really love how they turned out, warts and all 🥰 🥰 🥰

While we have a lot of representations and illustrations of Middle Earth and Jackson has been pretty accurate in adapting it, I feel those are still literrary work who could be visually represented in many many ways and having two trilogies depicting it with the same aesthethic and now a TV Show reprising it makes it harder and harder to imagine a fresh-looking and imaginative middle-earth.

This breaks my heart.

Peter Jackson always looks like he slept in his clothes and has been playing video games all day.

I can happily sit through Jackson's Hobbit movies - I don't get the bad rep they have, myself 🤔🤷🏻‍♂️

Release the Del Toro cut! :)

I'm game for pretending the... Hobbit Trilogy... that we got... doesn't actually exist. So... now we can offer a brand new opportunity to GDT to make his Hobbit movies :)

you could do an entire second channel on del toro projects that were announced but never came to be 😔

slightly confused about Death Proof, when I watched the film the lap dance was most certainly in the film.

I love Del Toro's movies. I was seriously pissed when he lost the Hobbit. It should have been his big break.

Please do a video on the Rated R Scooby Doo movies ! I've never seen anyone really cover it

In a 2 parter, I would have liked it if Bane had left Joker out of prison but (a la Infinite Crisis) keeping him out of the carnage... Then in part 2, Joker comes back and fucks it all up for Bane, because he "didn't let the Joker play"..

In what version does the lap dance doesn’t show? I’ve seen every time I’ve watched the film

There is a wonderful, 2 hr 40 min hobbit movie inside those three movies.

This makes me sad we didn't get this

I still love the Hobbit films warts and all. But man would this have been magical to see, such a shame

Peter could've made a great single Hobbit movie if he was given more time and didn't use so much CGI.

I'm really sad we never got to see his vision for this

I’m still not over the fact that Guillermo didn’t get to direct The Hobbit 😭😭

James Macavoy would have been a great Bilbo and you know it!

Brian Blessed would have been great as Thorin Oakenshield!

0:46

Wish we got this version, was disappointed in the the cgi fest we got

MGM should redo the hobbit into one movie, start from scratch with the love they put into the trilogy

6:01 incorrect it was only shot this way because of the 3D not because of CGI.

"subverting our expectations"... ugh, he must be one of those guys who likes The Last Jedi

Where does these extracts from 3:47 to 3:57 come from ?

Why can't we just get a standalone 'GdT's The Hobbit'? Doesn't even have to have continuity with Jackson's. I bet it would be awesome.

A few months, weird Del Toro couldn't be arranged to return.

To me, the best way to watch the Hobbit flicks is to watch all three extended creations, and then watch the appendices for them right after. The documentary of making them is far superior to the actual movies, which I feel is a direct inverse of the LOTR trilogy. I dunno that’s just my recommendation lol

Okay, I’m down. Let’s make it happen.

What shocked me most was seeing a skinny Peter Jackson.

Hobbit is a hard book to make a movie out of, as there is not enough for 2 full movies, but to much for just one (at least with LoTR you can scrap things like Tom Bombadil and greatly shorten the chase to rescue Pippen and Mery, and Treebeard etc.....)..... but the Hobbit book there is not actually that much fat to trim to start with (certainly not enough to get it down to one movie).... I think Tel Toro would have absolutely nailed Riddles in the Dark and have probably taken Gollum to a level that went beyond The Two Towers.

How History changes...

Can we just have this Pinnochio style?

😮 The Hobbit was a childrens book... I'm not really sure what the movies were,. but there's a made for TV animated movie that I think almost perfectly captures the spirit of the book... just my opinion

Me and my buddies got super baked before the third hobbit movie and the whole time we couldn’t stop laughing at how bad it was

I am glad he is not the guy that finished it. His visual style would not mesh well imo.

Saddened that Del Toro never got the chance. The man has vision. Talk about a missed opportunity. Glad I never watched the film

I said from day 1 the Hobbit needed a new director, new cast, new everything

7:46 Ron Pearlman is not in The Hobbit. Beorn is played by Mikael Persbrandt.

Jackson's films are nowhere near as bad as people make out. It's not the Star Wars prequels level bad.

If Jackson didn't have 1.5 yrs prep time for his version, why didn't he pick up on what Del Toro had spent 1.5 yrs doing?

Considering I have not read any of the books, I thought The Hobbit was very emotional and well created