Hey there Ezra - any chance you could let me know what you think of how I establish the power grip on a throw: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-u0qAOQGtpiw.html - This is something I put out for followers of the college team I help to coach. (apologies for my lack of a microphone)
Went to a Stokely clinic and he said grip doesn’t matter use what’s most comfortable for you and the power grip doesn’t necessarily mean you’ll get more power That’s just what the 1st person to use the grip called it and it just took off from there
Been working on rounding for like 2.5 years now, and only yesterday started playing with the thumb on the rim. I realised, now what i need is more spin in the disc, coz my technique is totally okay. The way to get more spin is probably going to be to go away from power grip, into more of a pinch grip
Spin of your disc is what gives you more distance hence more glide. Using 4 fingers is better then 1 or 2 fingers in this scenario .There is no question that a fan grip or so called power grip dives more distance. If you throw it correctly on a full release you will hear a snap when released. I changed my own grip about 2 years ago and once I got used to the power grip witch took about a full season I went from 280ft to 330ft consistently and now a few years later making 360-400ft. using the right disc for me. I would hardly consider the power grip fake when once you are comfortable learning this method I am sure it would help your distance get better one way or another. Fantastic video. Keep up the good work
Another reason why maybe some of us can't get snap. Because if you look at the pinch grip fingers, they're already in position to snap without a disc in the way. So I will be trying this I hear the audible snap from some players and never from others.
I found this out by accident last night. Loose arm and a pinch for main contact. More spin, more nose down, more speed. Gotta rethink all the release and timing tho'.
I've tried the pinch before and never got much out of it, but this time even the pinch was loose during the throw. At the point where I wanted to release, I actually "pinched", and found the snap. For me anyway, keeping every thing loose, including the grip, changed the tempo, and I didn't grab on till the end. Dead straight throws. Counter intuitive, but the first time I've seen my drives fly, no stalling and dumping at the end. It's the spin. Once you feel it, you know it's right. Even the screw ups flew.
I dropped off my pinkie a couple years back. It let me throw a bit further AND it lets me control the angle a bit easier. Something about my wrist. So I guess I was almost doing a pinch grip, anyway when I switched to that. Pinkie off, three on the plate, pretty tight together, thumb almost exactly opposite my index finger.
Front Vs Mid vs Back loaded grip. The further forward your pressure point is, the more distance but less accuracy get. Same for back loaded grip but in reverse, more accuracy less distance.
I think your on to something, I’m gonna give it a go. I forget where I picked it up from but i tried 3 fingers leaving off the pinkie and I got a extra 50 feet based on this I’m guessing my ring finger is acting as the pinkie. I’m curious now what leaving of the middle 2 fingers will do cause the disc will def rotate a little more just coming of the pointer
I can't throw with a power grip, my middle finger got torqued at an old job years ago and when I power grip I can only throw like maybe 5 times before it hurts like hell, I use a modified fan grip and I am WAY more consistent and I don't mess up my already jacked up finger. I definitely throw farther using a modified fan grip, it just feels odd for some people who are on that power grip train so they don't want to try it, but it works great.
I had issues trying the "power grip" early on I couldn't hit angles at all and had zero confidence in where the disc would go when it left my hand. I decided I would fan grip everything and then come back to it. My accuracy was on point I got more distance I felt like I had that "feel" with my throwing that gacmve me so much confidence. Eventually I "maxed out" my distance where the ran grip couldn't hold up when trying to throw max ish distance, so I wanted to revisit the "power grip" mind you this is over a year later. I hate the power grip they teach so all I did was take my fan grip I was so comfortable with tucked my finger into the rim and BAM added at 50 feet immediately and after practicing with it for a while maybe 70 feet altogether. With confidence and accuracy. Best thing I ever did
I use a one finger power grip. Sounds funny, right? But I found that with my index finger slightly curled on the bottom of the rim, my middle finger on the inside of the rim in the tightest part of the power grip, and my ring plus pinky finger curled up on the bottom of the rim as well, that I get the best snap and it feels soooo secure in my hand. It improved my accuracy so much as well. For mids and putters, I will only throw those discs with a full pinch or fan, even when trying to rip on them hard. My point is: find what works the best for you!
Went out today and threw pinch and automatically got more distance. I think the term pinch should be used more than grip. I can rip with a pinch because the disc actually acts like the tip of a whip when it comes out of the pocket.. Wish I knew this sooner. I enjoyed my game more having the added distance to my throws.
its about what gives you the most contact to the disc. drew and simon will throe 4 fingers when they are going for max distance. they use modified power grips in tournaments for 2 reasons. 1. more control 2. they dont need their max distance of 600-700 feet 99 % of the time, as most shots at most courses dont call for it. 90% of players cant throw over 450 therefore they will often need their max drive to have birdie looks. I think you are just over thinking the grip.
Exactly, the elite throwers don’t need the power grip for most shots, they throw further than most people even with the fan grip. I lose a lot of distance with fan grip but use it when I need more control.
Agreed, Drew Gibson pretty much says this in the video that author used of his fan grip. Not sure why he misrepresented the info Drew gave in the video
You are just back loading your grip. Basically you are releasing with the back fingers instead of your index finger so you are getting way less spin on the disc. With a power grip you can control spin with what finger is the release finger. I agree that it isn't the best grip to learn first but I do think it is the most versatile grip.
different grips for different size hands. I use one finger on my forehand, which would be impossible for people with normal size hands. like Stokely says, find the grip that works for you.
I played around with these grips a while back. I used to emulate pros and curl all my fingers in super power grip. But my accuracy was terrible. Mod fan grip would be ideal as you demonstrate but full fan gives me bad distance but fairway hits almost every time. Actually helped my game cutting back on distance. I even sometimes cheat my palm a little further on the top of the disc. Your not going to bomb throwing over the disc like that but in certain situations it really forces nose down angle. Making neutral discs drift right slightly the whole way. Not a power shot but gives me another shot shape
This would maybe explain why I can throw a mid basically as far as a driver. I do modified fan/power with mid ranges.... guess I gotta try it with a driver this weekend.
What did you do to keep the nose down on this new grip? I can feel way more spin, but I cannot get the disc to stay nose down with this grip. If I can do that, I should be looking at an extra 50 ft easy.
I am a firm believe of the modified fan grip for everything up to a 8 speed. Power Grip, if front loaded, will get you more distance 9 it does for me). You might have been back-loading your power grip, causing less speed and spin.
I think one of the reasons the four finger grip is not as successful for you to get more distance is your anatomy. If you bend all four fingers inwards the tendons of your wrist are already tense at setup. This tension puts a limiting factor in speed and range of motion of your wrist. Just try to bend your wrist inwards with a fist or an open hand and see the difference. The fan grip relaxes those tendons and the wrist has more freedom to generate power, your hand will move faster with relaxed tendons. There can be persons that are successful with this but it seems they have more fexibility in their hands to pull it off. A professional player that has thrown tens of thousands of discs is more likely get this flexibility. For the rest of us its hard to do.
I found when I tried power gripping it was really hard to find where I needed to release the disc. I like the modified fan grip a lot more cause you can just let the disc rip out. Plus the snap sounds cooler.
When i try full power grip i tend to grip lock and my release goes far right. One time off the tee i launched it prob 300 ft at nearly a right angle.. so pretty much a bomb for me but no distance gained towards the basket 😂. I now only tightly grip thumb amd pointer. The otber fingers are on but they aint doing much lol
First off great video. I think your confusing throwing a disc for alot of power and throwing discs for distance. often more power does not equal more distance, more spin does.
I think the issue beginners have with the power grip is that it's really difficult to consistently get all four fingers out of the rim if you're not already getting 400+ ft power. The disc has to rip itself out of the hand for the most consistent release. The real purpose of having more fingers inside the rim is to make the initial rotation more explosive as the disc flings around the pivot point with a higher impulse, but I think the same effect could be achieved with the pinky-forefinger grip and perhaps with more consistency for some people. The main benefit I can see is, with enough strength in the pinky, the overall friction of the grip could be reduced for cleaner releases which are very important for both easy distance and extreme distance. I am a frequent modified-fan grip user, but I haven't tried the pinky-forefinger grip, and it looks quite interesting.
You're definitely leaving out when Drew and Simon both say they use a modified fan grip for CONTROL, not max distance, in which they actually use power grip. Most pros still use power grip for distance shots, James Conrad even power grips his putters!
Simon said in one of his own videos that he throws fan grip on 90% of his golf throws for better control. He only resorts to a full-on power grip for wide open all out distance shots, or especially 360 backhands. I think the real secret behind the pinch grip giving potentially more power/spin/release speed is giving the thrower a looser arm. Some people really tense their arm up when trying to clamp the disc down as hard as possible during a power grip. A looser arm is a faster arm.
I agree with the looser arm. That's the main reason I don't throw power grip. I can't get my arm to just flow and be relaxed and still hold on to the disc with a power grip. Between a pinch and a fan, I feel like the disc is actually more secure with less effort, meaning my arm swings better for the throw.
Personally I think it is the fact that you have more control with a pinch/fan grip. I noticed that it became easier to hit my lines and keep the disc flat.
I enjoyed the video and appreciate your perspective, but I have to say, I disagree. As I understand it, these power players use the fan grip for comfort and accuracy reasons BECAUSE they throw so far already that they cann afford to sacrifice a little bit of their full distance potential. When they go out into distance contests they almost always use the power grip.
the important parts of the grip are: 1 the pinch point; 2 plate/rim feel/control; and 3 you need some way to keep the disc in contact with your palm through the throw. For me the fan grip does not keep the disc in contact with my palm (during power throws), so as i come through my 'hit point' the disc claps back into my palm, it hurts, a lot. The main issue with the 'power' grip is its harder to define the pinch point and feel isnt great. The main benefit is that you can keep the disc against your palm easily, without having to tense your arm too much. Just focus on the pinch point and the mechanics of your curled fingers should take care of the rest. I would say the reason you are losing distance with a power grip is because your power grip does not have a defined pivot point, so the disc is kinda sliding out of your hand, not rotating. Also if you dont get the disc to palm chop that i get, then you dont need the power grip for your current power, or you have really strong hands and may never need the power grip. Note: Notice what the pinky is doing for the power throwers, its the same thing the power grip does for me, guess i should do some pinky curls :P
@@JoshJackson13 I'm still rocking the 2. It's comfortable and have a 450 golf shot. After 17 years I'm scared to switch lol. When the original commentor was talking about palm I was a little turned away. Thumb pad is plenty.
Reason why it's coming out faster is because there is a fulcrum that the disc spins around (your pinched fingers being that) making the disc have more rotation.
I’ve pinch gripped for 20 years now. I’ve tried to switch for more distance but ultimately I NEVER felt comfortable with the “power grip”. After about a month of trying to change, I simply went back to what’s comfortable in my hand. I pinch with my thumb and for finger and my middle finger guides the angle of release out of my hand.
The problem is that you're not actually establishing a locked in power-grip. You have significant issues with the very basic element that is "gripping" the disc. Please check out the following video, originally posted for followers of U of Toledo's Rocket Disc Golf sport club last spring: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-u0qAOQGtpiw.html - If you go to the 2 minute mark, this video establishes how to LOCK IN the power grip, effectively creating the "pinch" you describe in this video. Establishing your grip in the way I instruct could also significantly increase the distance you are getting from the "pinch" grip that you're demonstrating in your videos as well. I do not believe you're actually achieving a strong grip with either of the grips, even if you are seeing better results from the pinch. The pinch is providing you with a boost in grip, but not fixing your underlying problems.
No matter the grip, there are body mechanics and timing issues. It depends on how far down the rabbit hole you want to go. My advice, if it feels good, do it. And just enjoy that fact you are with friends doing what you love in the moment. If you make it too complicated, you start missing shots due to not using your natural body athletics. Sure try some things but be careful not to get too hung up and forget how to laugh at yourself. 52 years of disc golf for me.
I do believe most of the big throwers have larger hands and a traditional power grip isn't comfortable. They can get all the grip power they need with a fan grip. I've also heard most of them say to experiment with different grips. Whatever works best for you is the one they recommend. With smaller hands and wide rim drivers, using a fan grip might not work. If you have great grip strength, then no matter your hand size, fan might work best. Everything boils down to "what works for you".
@@Handsx maybe not stats, but that would be interesting. I think people forget guys like Marwede and Buhr might be fun but they’re incredibly tall which creates their power combined with technique. The guys in my gym that lift heavy have mad grip strength and great technique.
I had a fan grip phase as well when i was playing a round with a much better player and he said he fan grips mids/putters (we also played ultimate together and he said he fan grips that 100% of the time). I was surprised so i went into the field the next day to try it out and it SUCKED. I mean i was out there for a good 3 hours and got nothing even resembling a good throw. With an ultimate disc it was doable but with every type of disc I felt like i was sacrificing a ton of power and it felt very awkward. In the end I decided I would much rather practice my aim and form with the power grip than try to regain 50 feet of lost distance with a fan/pinch (and i dont have 50 feet to lose in my game lol). The bottom line is that I think power throwers can throw with these grips because they have 50-100 feet of distance that they have no problem sacrificing for the control it brings. On most courses, it will be a lot better to throw 450 controlled as opposed to 600+ with less control. Therefore, they will rarely throw with the power grip. Finally, your personal results are certainly interesting. I think it's definitely a good idea to experiment with other grips, but to say that the power grip is blatantly bad and shouldn't be used is not the conclusion I would draw from this evidence. Different things work for different people, but until I see conclusive evidence otherwise I will be very skeptical of any claim that the power grip is not the longest throwing grip on average for most people.
I'm wondering if another benefit of not using a powergrip is that it forces you to be a bit smoother in your throw, like a less abrupt acceleration due to holding the disc with a bit less force? As a powergrip main, I'm actually excited again to give new grips a whirl. Good video!
Interesting, I think the main reason people will throw easier and further with a pinch grip is because it's easier to get nose down. Extend your arm and look at the disc with both grips, the majority will probably see that it's much easier to get nose down without powergrip.
Obviously form and timing are the most important factor. I can fan grip a 9 speed and throw it 380ft but I've been working on it for about 11 years dedicated. I still use the power grip for everything including putters and after years just realized it works best for me. It's definitely not fake and i cannot fan grip a huge hyzer
Great video! I've been battling with getting a good grip on my drivers and about a month ago I got frustrated in the field throwing with a power grip on my drives. Huge ripping sound when the disc left my hand, but the disc just never got around to gliding and flying well. At that point I just started playing around with grip and noticed that with a modified fan grip the disc was leaving my hand much faster. The difference was like night and day. I'm thinking that with my long fingers using a power grip means that the disc is ripping from my hooked middle finger, which is stronger than my index finger and that's also causing some kind of resistance, that slows the disc down right before it leaves the hand. With a modified fan grip I am able to pinch the flightplate as hard and comfortably as I want with my thumb, middle and ring finger without it slowing down the release of my disc, since the disc ultimately just "slides" off the middle and the ring finger with less resistance and pivots around the index finger. I have never had a good long throw with a loud snapping sound that came from my middle finger hitting my palm. When I have a really good rip it sounds more like an "oomph". I can't even try to rip max distance drive with a power grip any more since I can't pinch the flightplate comfortably at all really, I just squeeze the rim into my palm and that results in my middle finger resisting the disc leaving my hand to a point where it leaves noticeably slower with less spin.
Yea I started throwing without my pinky after I dislocated my middle finger. I grip hard and when my release timing is late my fingers get yoinked. Without the pinky helps me stay loose.
@@Jason-Moon I agree, at first it seemed awkward because it would actually come off during the middle of my toss, but I've gotten used to it and feel the distance is better..
what about AJ tho? i remember he talks about the power grip ALOT , so if he doesn't do it to a tee than that makes sense, also i've heard paul mcbeth "power grips" everything
The title of this drew me in faster than a hungry piglet to the trough ! Well done. Very nice post, never have enjoyed the power grip. Time to experiment.
I just understood something. Pinching the disc with thumb and index finger uses muscles in the palm. Powergrip, where all fingers hold the discs, uses also muscles in forearm to grip the disc. Those same muscles also move the wrist and are somehow connected to muscles in upper arm. Flexing those forearm muscles increases resistance in elbow and wrist and makes them more stiff, which reduces the whip effect (which is way more noticeable with no disc in hand, I often practise throwing inside with nothing in hand and increased blood pressure from the whip hurts my hand when I get it good).
In the video he says "if the full power grip makes you throw further, then the power throwers would be doing it" which is just inherently wrong. The whole reason power throwers can use a looser grip is BECAUSE they can throw further. They choose to use a less powerful grip in order to sacrifice distance but improve accuracy because they have more than enough distance to compensate for the sacrifice. If they were all in a distance competition, they would all power grip. It's literally the same principle as discing down. If you can get there with a slower disc, then there is no reason to throw a faster, less controllable disc.
So a few days ago i tried the pinch version, (i saw some other youtuber talking about mechanics of a throw and just spotted him using it). I could not controll the disc at all, they all flew out early at a solid 20+degrees of my aim. My spontanous thought is that the power grip might be abit more forgiving if you still have some arch in your throw, while the pinch just flies straight out. tho should be said i'm still very new to the sport. But anyways my guess is most beginners will have an easier time to get results with a power grip therefore it seems that it's a better grip, more people teach it and you have a positive feedback loop.
I literally can't power grip putters or mid ranges. It just gives me literally 0 control. However I think I might try this pinch grip thing. Because I myself am also sick of throwing anhyzer to get an over stable disc to go far. Or less stable discs being "beefy" lol. I can throw a hyzer flip with a lightweight understable fairway driver. But my absolute farthest I've thrown in fieldwork is about 360'. I'm usually not going much more than 310'-330' on average.
This is a hard sell. Simon and Drew have both stated that they use fan grip to control their distance potential and power grip for max distance. If anyone is throwing farther with fan vs. power… I have two thoughts 1. You are improving your release angles as fan grip allows easier control over the disc. Better nose and hyzer angle = more distance. 2. Fan grip is an inherintly weaker grip which leads me to believe you are probably gripping too hard with power grip. Don’t death grip the rim. Grip as lightly as possible while not allowing the disc to be flimsy in your hand. This allows a quick and efficient release. Just some thoughts…. I am not a pro.
The more fingers pressing down on the disc causes increased friction and that limits the transfer of energy into the disc leaving much of it in the hand upon release. In theory you could throw the farthest with only two fingers but that would take a strength the fingers couldn't reach without eventual damage or injury. 3 would be next, then 4, and the power grip is actually last. The reason it seems to work for some is it puts the wrist in a more proper position for a clean release. It would limit how far you can grow if it becomes the only way you learn to power your drives. Remember, the power travels down the arm into each point of the joint and releases into the object throw, and because all things have variable shapes and mass, there is a backlash of energy that returns into the hand of the point of release. Limiting these contact points forces more energy transfer into the disc. Also over gripping or tightening the grip works only well if the point of contact is released in concession along the path. The lightest grip you can get away with and still make the disc receive the point of energy transfer is the most efficient. It takes a tremendous amount of practice to achieve your own individual feel for this. It's the same principle for most sports. My advice is to practice and not think so much about mechanics, and instead learn to power while relaxing throughout the entire shot in a controlled way. I see too many over thinking their shots which limit their natural motion and lessen the point of release energy transfer.
I think you are misinterpreting the reason why it's called "power grip" its because it is the most powerful grip in relation to the players hand to the disc meaning the most stable and easy to control, not because it generates the most power/distance when throwing.
so i use drew / scotts for 450 foot drive.. i have a broken middle finger, it forced back into straightening it, so had to go back to grip, that with a knew left knee dip ive added 50 feet with a broken finger.. but i had adopted the power grip which got me the snap sound out of hand sound, and up to 400 from 350. but its odd breaking finger meant i went back to 300-350. and in 5 weeks ive added at least 100 to game. i broke own finger wiping suncream off hands for a shot. im 5 weeks of 10 week splint on finger, i may keep it on if i throw 450 with it, 🤣 but its very odd series of events to force me to re think.. grip, reach back, knee dip, and backhand slap, smooth follow through. all add 50
The grip by Simon that you show in this video is a fan grip for good reason. He's holding a Discmania MD1, a 4-speed midrange disc! If you're going to break down the power grip of a Pro player, you should reference how that player holds a high speed disc, not a midrange. It seems that the full power grip is the easiest for beginners to learn, and then the various modified power grips are more advanced techniques. I certainly wouldn't say the power grip is fake.
What I do, I consider the true power grip I pinch the edge of the lip with all four of my actual finger tips, right on the corner of the inner rim, not inside, and my thumb presses flat on top, ahead of my fore finger on the pinch line of my fingers, almost pointing out, the palm of my thumb is my control more than my thumb. then with both arms straight out, I swing back and immediately slam my left arm down into the fulcrum of my hips, creating so much centrifugal force, I barely use my right arm to throw. I open my whole hand as fast as I can just before my desired direction focusing on the release of my pinky being most important. Really good method for anyone with shoulder pain when backhanding. There is SO MUCH lost power in people's inactive rear hand! And I think this is even for pros...
So I can throw 400 420 when I go max distance. In gonna try this grip your describing because I notice the power grip doesn't work for me personally. I've always had issues getting consistent releases with the power grip because it has to be perfect for it to work. Thank you for this video
Everyone has different fingers. If you try to power grip and the flight plate blocks closing a finger or two, forcing them into position past the flight plate creates an unstable grip. I can't make a decent power grip on a 7-speed or below. Stokely, very big fingers, pinch grips everything.
Ulibarri, Mcbeth, wysocki, and hundreds of other pros use a power grip to say just cause ezra and Simon don't exclusively use a power grip doesn't mean it's fake lol
Scott Stokely does mention that he doesn't use the full Power Grip because his hand wont fit that way comfortably. He also suggests to try what works best for you, because it IS all about comfort. The basic Power Grip is just a place to start, like you said.
Where do you put the pivot point on a speed 12 or 13 disc? On the rim itself or on the inside of the disc? My main drivers are 12 and 13 and the inside area off the rim is too far in to comfortably pivot on for me and Im 6'5 and have very long fingers. Would you kind of pinch the rim for the pivot point? That seems most comfortable but it's already giving me a mean new blister.
fan grip is harder for broader rims (distance drivers) simply if your fingers are not long enough. i use fan grip/modified one, and the rotation point is crucial (index + thumb) dunipace speaks of thumb pressure and how crcuial it is in every throw. seppo paju recommends other grips than power too, and throws with fan grip, if o remember right
Hey you left out a key part of the power grip that makes the power grip. I’m sorry but you don’t know what your talking about. You didn’t even fully explain the power grip and your saying it’s fake. This video is very misleading
The picture with Ezra with his thumb out in the middle of disc I would consider it a modified thumb spot . Power grip thumb placement has always been on edge of disc, thumb pad pushing down and also using the pad of the thumb to help hold the disc. thumb up pushing down isn't as common but works also. Fingers sticking out under plate has always been a control disc better thing . But other than nice video...
The pros do a fan grip sometimes to control their power. Eagle throws just distance drivers and fd3s on power grip. They have more power than us. I will also say that if you don't have a thick pad on your hand below your pointer finger then power grip isn't comfortable for new people.
I was literally telling my buddies that my fan grip goes farther and that’s how it unlocked 550 to 475 and then not two days later they sent me this video confirming my suspicions
the reason they use a modified fan grip is because it slows the spin rate down. Those guys generate so much spin and speed that the disc become far too understable and the modified fan brings the stability back. I've always used a modified fan for my mid shots.
It’s crazy! Just yesterday I was trying the power grip because I usually do a somewhat fan grip and it felt uncomfortable and weird. Yea think I’ll pinch/fan grip it today🤡
Also thinking about it. People always talk about how Drew gets so much snap when he throws the disc, like it is loud. Maybe it has to do with the grip that he uses...
