The Pride and Price of Representation 

Exactly, when is the last time you saw a conservative gay character from these types of writers? Or some other type of gay character that doesn't fit neatly in their own politics?

Agreed. Hiring writers/creators based not on talent is a big mistake.

I agree with what you said, and the irony is, at least for me, someone else's sexual orientation (or even just preferences) isabout the least interesting thing I could know about them. To elaborate: it has zero bearing on me unless there's an attraction there, and then it's only about whether or not there's a chance the feelings are mutual. I do not understand why anyone ever gives a crap about what two (or more) consenting adults get up to.

@@relo999 Maybe being conservative isn't worth inclusion, because it is the boring part, and you jsut default to LACK of it as "the opposite side" in your black and white world view. Maybe your selective reasoning is just bullshit and you've read brooding , boring daddy figures into the subtext of charcters like Batman ever since you became a sad thirty-something. And now the daddy aspect is forefront in a ll these "interesting" characters. Their stereotype, by literal definition. Oh wow, Logan, how non-woke, the bat family, how original.

By and large they are whole community is one big stereotype machine. It is all they have. In their real lives and in fiction.

he choosed Fab man as code name, of course he is a joke...

@@ALDAL not to mention the costume

it's like south parks se(a)man .

The problem with these representational focused is they obsess over the What and forgo the Who the characters are. Funny thing is a one could write a character who became a superhero in hopes of validation. They could even internalize their lack of recognition and taken seriously because they happen to be gay. But this should part of their character development. Hell I would even throw in a superhero who is respected give the protagonist a “Reason you suck speech” and end with the whammy the respected superhero is also gay.

I agree if someone whats be taken seriously, they would dress and choose a professional codename. You act as if. The guy writing this has ZERO self awareness. I think most people would rather be saved by Homelander than Fabman.

Woke: *white savior syndrome intensifies*

The ouroboros devours its tail..

one of two things happen when you hear people cry stereotypes are bad, either A the realize that boiling everyone down to a single characterstic, a stereotype is all you have or B they defend their use of said stereotype by saying its only X-ist/phobic when _you_ do it.

This is also how people on twitter are like when claiming anime characters to be lgbt according to them Why are they like that actually?

@@depthstrider68 It's either a fetish thing or they're so brainwashed all they see are rainbows.

To be fair, there are some guy charectors that constantly talk about the church they just had sex with. Constantly flirt with girl charectors. Constantly have sex with girls, etc. That is pretty much the exact same thing. It is equally annoying to me too.

@@1faithchick7 True but those characters you mentioned just like these new woke variants of them are also easily forgotten.

there's nothing wrong with showing a straight or gay or lesbian character flirting in itself, or even having an active sex life. Or characters that make those things the most important things about them/the only things about them. That's an mediocre if annoying character trait in moderation. I think the problem is how common it is for new and newly changed LGBT characters to make it their only real personality trait at the expense of every other trait and even story. There are great examples of LGBT characters from years and years ago that people just pretend don't exist or don't know exist because it's not extremely emphasized that they are. Instead, the characters focus on other more important aspects like what kind of person are they, what drives them to be a hero, a villain, or what propels the story. And most straight/white ECT... characters from competent writers I've seen don't hyper focus on the facts that the character is straight or white. They just write the character as an actual person and everything else is incidental. Best advice I can give any writer for any character. Write the character like a person first, and anything else is just incidental. The character is female? Cool, now write a character that happens to be female. Don't make the fact that she's a girl the most important thing, it's just one aspect. What else is there? Is she kind, rude, funny or straight-laced?

@@SebasTian58323 Pretty much on point. I have no issues with gay characters if they are well written and contribute to the story and plot. Like if the only thing a gay character does is constantly wave rainbow flags or just talk about pride over and over again, then that character is just annoying and forgettable.

@@1faithchick7 If I saw a straight character only talking about that during an entire episode or movie, I'd complain about it too since that's just lazy horrible writing and serves no useful purpose to the story.

Most writers under 30 didnt really read comics so they just assume they were all "white men who came from privilege". If youve only read a few batman or superman books thats your impression. If youve never read them and people tell you they were all racist then are you really going to check for yourself? No. Why would you even bother try to respect the source if you hear the creators were mostly white men and so were probably racist?

Brownstar

You're talking about people that despise themselves and their own lives, but don't have the will to change. That's why they have a desperate need to see themselves in the "perfect" characters they create (characters that have full control over their lives, and the world around them, bending it to their will). They project what they want to be in the books. They want to be powerful enough to belittle everyone else, to always have the last word, to be constantly praised for achieving nothing and to be loved while giving nothing in return but their broken, toxic and useless selves.

​@@azureaki Damn 💀

Yeah, I don't want to "see myself" in characters. I want to see interesting characters and maybe related to them, which is not the same thing as trying to be them.

I'm thr complete opposite of Light Iamgay and even L for that matter yet I love both those characters even if both are irredeemable.

I want to read books to pretend I'm not myself. The last thing I want to see in a character is myself.

That's honestly a great analogy!

​@@Gurt_The_Hurt is it? It falls short in so many ways. The similarity is that...the LGBT writing isn't effective. I guess the word "posture" applies, but a lot of modern writing would be slightly improved if written by someone capable of producing something that had style over substance. It's more like if you handed a random person on the street a sword

Bad example! Sasaki Kojiro was a great swordsman who lost because he surrendered the initiative to an opponent that was brutal and unorthodox than him. If Miyamoto had to of fought in more traditional battlefield, the outcome may of well of turned out differently. At the very least the sharpened oar 'probably' wouldn't of been...maybe, it the Master of Five Rings after all.

@@VolkColopatrion well surely there are so few of those that don’t imbue all of their works with their own sexual preferences and ideas on politics and gender that they just become lost within all of those who do.

Comparing Social Justice Wankers to a master swordsman who lost to a legendary swordsman and died in battle is a MASSIVE INSULT to that master swordsman.

It's not funny for making fun of it anymore. It's just sad

The comic is the joke.

​@@robinthrush9672 oh but they can use it tho.

There is nothing wrong with reaching for the low hanging fruit. They do it all the time.

Like the alien whose super power is probably to shove his head up anyone's ass without Hancock's help?

Hey What did you say Tom Taylor he a good friend of my

I love how "Broken Glass" has just become his nickname overnight. Though it does actually sound kinda cool, like a pro wrestler, and not, well, that guy.

Donny Cates is mental? I liked Buzzkill.

Fascist mannequin

@mr.cobalt1668 IKR, it's an utter joke. 😄

Well the idea of ‘villains’ is unfashionable. A bunch of kids left school having felt victimised and wanting retribution, but the things they want to do to lash out would make them ‘villainous’ so they’ve entered the creative arts and are trying to rehabilitate villains… so they can justify treating people like crap but not be perceived as evil. I’m so sick of “10 heroes who were evil”, “10 villains who were right all along” articles… all written by people who mentally never left high school who want to punish the world.

She-Hulk (TV show) was a very reluctant superhero. She said something like she associates superheroes with "man babies", narcissists and adult orphans. Helping innocent people and saving lives and even fighting for justice did not seem to appeal to her at all. She did not want any superhero work she might grudgingly undertake to interfere with the most important thing in her life, which was being a lawyer. Oddly enough, she was both mediocre and unprofessional as a lawyer, and scatterbrained and insecure in her personal life. There were so many negative female stereotypes that one wonders why a self-proclaimed man-despising female showrunner and female writers did this.

@@brettyates7054 ...then, at the other end of the spectrum, you have the idiots who live in an idealised fantasy land who think that comic book 'heroes' should somehow be taken seriously, rather than seen for the heavily caricatured escapism/wish-fulfillment they actually are... Swings-&-roundabouts.

​@@dronesclubhighjinks if a man wrote shehulk he would have been cancelled as a sexist and a bad writer. What women loved is that men didnt like the show and it was created by women. The show itself was immaterial. How many times have you heard female fans talk about the show or watch the reruns? How many videos do you see dissecting what was so great about it? Women stopped caring the second it was over.

but there is only the oppressor and the oppressed ignore the fact that bdsm and dominatrix's exist no No submission = slavery so all must fight the oppressors white men and ignore all the gay and bi men just call them right winger if they disagree yeah yeah we're all tired of this bs

BASED.

​@@ahoramazda6864 And that is precisely why so many gay people today present themselves as extreme stereotypes; you know, the thing we all wanted to get away from in the first place? I mean, just look at the cover of that book. Pink hot pants. A leather harness-clad BEAR? My God. It is to weep. 🤦‍♂️

The baseline of a hero is being a hero. This comic isn't abt heroes, just trying to use the label of superhero. Like putting lipsticks on a pig.

Too many people today only know how to look inward, but don't know how to look out at the world around them with any great understanding. When you're writing with basically your own small lens you see the world from, you come across as shallow and petty, unless the reader sees everything the way you do, which isn't going to be a whole lot of people, no matter who you are.

"Let's see if it pays of for them"

Villain drops a F-bomb They cry and cancel his m on Social Media instead of fighting. The villain gets his account banned and the city is still vaporized by the nuke/space laser the heros we're to retarded to notice.

10/10

Hmm...I wonder if there might be some offensive term for gays starting with "F" 🤔😂

He even named him fab man you know you can make the B into a G and oh no!

Brutal. Savage. Rekt.

And that would be killed by homelander for the lulz

Or a SNL TV Funhouse skit from the 90’s.

"We join our heroes the Just-us League of Superdouches in their headquarters, The Hall of Wokeness..."

@@Blakefe You mean, like the “Ambiguously Gay Duo” skits?

I didn't even notice they leathered up the bear till this comment. That's south park levels of parody. How can someone write that unironically????????????

When you framed it like that it really made me think. That's got to suck. Having your sexuality inexorably tied to deviancy or rather what could be interpreted as deviancy by members of your own community has got to be infuriating. However, the hilarious thing is that when I saw the bear in the bdsm attire I immediately thought of furries, not the gay community.

The oldest types of stereotypes. Blacks, gays etc are truly treated and made like simpletons, it's a huge shame. Besides the fact that it's parody level, it brings conflict, confusion, worsening yourself-mentality and it divides people (who are normal folks co-living with each other in the same West, with differences - be it skin, sexual preference etc - and identities that aren't outlandish stuff that make them contrast like they look like different species).

'Member complaining in the 90's that all gay characters were two dimensional caricatures where their only character trait was 'being the gay one'. I'm so glad we moved past that as a community to clap like brain damage seals every time someone chants the magic gay letters regardless of how awful it is. There's going to be textbooks about how a protest movement was converted into the ultimate non-discerning consumer group that buys product and gets excited for new product.

I'm a bi man and I've had to deal with more sexism from lesbians declaring I'm confused and a tourist than ever from str8 peeps. One even said I sounded gay for complementing a man's beard and course I said Really you know what that means commenting on someone about their beard when they're bi again calling me a tourist I should have Slapped that B so damn hard instead I tried talking it out no they don't respect men of words these days when it comes to well the feminists they don't respect men at all and its getting very out of hand with the Misandry

I'm pretty sure that Marvel cancelled that series before it even came out

That could honestly be a decent story, him dealing with his own poor naming choice and how easily people that oppose him could twist it. It doesn't even need to lay on the homophobia angle thick, it could be the more realistic "should there be people with such unchecked power exist?" and it being used to mock the guy.

For me, the only useful one out of that bunch was Trailblazer, as I was seeing a combination of “Dora the Explorer” and “Fat Chance” from The Venture Bros.

You just had to remind me that shitshow with the "internet gas" existed huh >.> I mean what in the unholy fuck is "internet gas" even supposed to be?? It doesn't make any sense *-head explodes-*

Imagine how awful they were that even SJW marvel cancelled them

Yeah, that really stuck out to me as a particularly idiotic point. How self-centered and validation-starved do you have to be to discuss your sexuality with a random cabby?

He has a personality disorder. This is not normal paranoia.

AKA: He has a job. It's understandable that a privileged woke story writer who is likely hired for his sexual preference or political ideology doesn't understand the concept of honest labour.

Exactly. Joe needs to be studied. Because if all gays feel as he does, this brand of sexuality is a ‘syndrome’ and disorder in par w/NPD. ‘All about Me - All the Time!’ And that seems to be what we are seeing. When one feels that his sexual identity needs to be known to all in every situation, that’s called a problem.

Just screams this person feels they need mention their sexuality 24/7 regardless of how off topic it is. They sound like a very boring person if that's your lead in.

You started your sentence with "As an openly gay man" If its arbitrary and not a identifier of actionable significance why state it as something to take note of? this is something regularly done in the lgbt community, prefacing statements with "as a __ person". This is what has lead to companies pandering to it in such a facile manner.

​@@EPC-ue2ci It's to emphasize the point that this is ridiculous

Yes, my thoughts exactly.

I think you kind of leave out a major plot point that while Titan, while one of the greatest heroes in the world, he hid the fact that he was gay, even down to having a hedro-marriage and son. Only after he was discovered by the press at a motel with another male hero did he "retire". But Yeah, the confrontation he had with Roy had a lot of build up and emotional investment. Him working his way back into the super hero community after that was a great story, good focus on who he hurt by quitting, and him try not only for his second chance, but creating second chances for others along the way.

exactly if you have to push I'm black or I'm a girl or I'm gay thats not an identity being gay and sassy is 1 dimensional and stupid even gays don't let gays get away with that Only Lesbians often do that and its caused a lot of domestic violence in that group

Off topic, but have I slipped into another timeline? The only Drew Hayes in comics I know was the guy who wrote/drew Poison Elves, and sadly, died in 2007.

@@JohnSmith-cn4cw Oh yeah. I was trying to avoid giving major spoilers for those who wanted to read the book but you’re spot on.

Alan Moore did a lot of work that way. Ozymandias from Watchmen, for exemple, was homosexual but it was far from the character's prime relevance. He was so many things besides his sexual preferences.

You're not. The novelity of a queer chracter wore off long ago....

That's such a simple yet effective way to describe it, and it's true, none of those people are interesting. They think that just being gay in of itself makes them special and unique, pfff please I've seen walls with discolored bricks more interesting than all of those people combined. The thing that annoys me most is when they seem like they're just doing it to make some sort of statement, instead of just being a normal person who happens to be gay or whatever. Yes, there absolutely are some who aren't actually what they claim to be, they just do it for quick and easy attention online. Can't say I'm too surprised honestly..

A character should have a personality and a reason for being outside of simply being LGBT. It honestly bothers me that they want to create this big drama about 'coming out' and whatnot when that just really isn't that interesting. Sure there's some interpersonal drama there potentially but all adolescents have their various dramas that come in different flavors. And the trope of the world that hates LGBTs is also kind of boring. As a straight person I have little to no interest in that. Give me a gay character intermixed with a variety of other interesting characters who all have a shared vision and mission in the world and you might actually have an interesting story. What makes the LGBT aspect interesting isn't the LGBT stuff itself, but what it adds in contrast to other characters and people in the story. LGBT is also more interesting when it is treated rationally. Straw-manning anti-LGBT people is boring. When you make a real opponent to deviance they usually have a wider range of concerns/issues/reasons for feeling that way that don't get delved into. It's dumb when you just have a villain twirling his moustache and insisting that all gays must go. It is far more interesting when the gay man has to get along with a man who's got issues with gay people and they have to learn to work together and respect one another despite their differences in opinion.

There is also nothing to be proud about. It's just sexuality, most animals have it.

one of the best gay characters even is bon clay from one piece. he identifies and both a man and a woman but its not his only character trait. he's flamboyant, loves to dance, believes love and friendship can bloom anytime, anywhere, and is extremely loyal to those he considers friends. hell, the dude's even trans since his powers let him be either a man or a woman anytime he wants. and i don't think oda was trying to do anything ground breaking with him. he just wrote the character as a character.

If it's an April Fools joke, then we must be stuck in Groundhog's Day.

Nobody can. Comedians run out of stuff they can over exxaggerate quickly.

These SJWs make better villains than heroes.

@@Lastjustice They made Carol Danvers build a concentration camp in the negative zone for locking up “future criminals” and create a child army that wore Hitler Youth uniforms for going around and kidnapping people to stick in illegal prisons, all while hailing her as “the greatest hero in Marvel”, that says it all.

@@nvfury13 Fun stuff.

If I remember correctly, the former were shown to be immoral narcissists.

Yep, it bothered me the first couple of seasons - made me wonder why they claim to be training heroes, rather than just super powered people, because some definitely seemed more interested in being glory-hounds and/or bullies!

Worst yet, some where hero's for profit. You know something is messed up when even villains are disgusted by certain so-called hero's.

That was done purposefully

I cannot abide the one that is constantly crying.

Oh yes exactly this whole wokeness is a Lot like DARE Hello fellow kids sort of attitude it was pushed by universities based on critical theory which says all relationships are only the oppressor and the oppressed ignore the fact that bdsm and dominatrix's exist no No submission = slavery so all must fight the oppressors white men and ignore all the gay and bi men just call them right winger if they disagree yeah yeah we're all tired of this bs

And in just in EP2 he lament on that that he care too much of being on headline that he fall into the obvious traps and get his daughter kidnapped which show character grow and that help make him to be more than just an EGO super hero also everytime he start care more about being seen than being a hero it always present as bad thing.

Darkwing Duck also had a great set of villains that were a mix of batman and spiderman villains. Also his daughter and Launchpad were true believers so it all balanced out

Not to mention he ACTUALLY did do heroic things, maybe not for heroic reasons, but at least he was doing the right thing... most of the time

You can't do representation legitimately unless you don't care about equality. The moment the agenda steps in front of the art, you've gone from making entertainment to making propaganda.

Not a single article of profanity in my comment and it gets shadow banned anyways. Smh. This website is such garbage.

What did you say?

The franchise also make manga because they insprastion comes from Japan that they decide also make Nime and manga, so I tell you they the 3/4 best group you can look up

With the video topic in mind... What's your point?

His book has a joyfully silly amount of over explaining...

Damn right

@ronynninjastar2414 Tsk, if only it were that simple. Shoot I've been promoting my comics on Twitter for a few years and have yet to get a single sale. Eric July for example is succeeding for two reasons. 1. He's already built up the audience from his subscribers, and two he's got connections with people like Greg of Nerdrotic. Me? I lack such things because I'm an introvert who doesn't know who to talk to or ask for help. Hence why I'm having trouble with this.

@@DemonicRemption then I suggest you change some things about yourself. I'm also trying to do some self improvement. Read "The 50th Law" by 50 Cent and Robert Greene. It's a great book about fearlessness.

But hecwork hours on the shading!

Subvert expectations... make the bear the only strait one on the team.

​@@The_Real_Fomsie Like able-bodied people sneaking into the Paralympics. "You were straight this whole time?" "I'm sorry, it's just you guys have way better interior design in yor secret base!"

Agreed

Crime/spy drama is not my cup of tea, but this sounds promising and rife with conflict. The guy has to infiltrate both the criminal organization and the goverment agency at once, while his loyalty to both is actively questioned. Not to mention the eventuall reveal (because that's too good opurtunity to let pass). As far as I know, in simmilar stories, the spy has a sort of guarantee that the governent will back him up if needed, but not here.

@@Karak-_- There would be times when he would have to ask himself if the crime network are the good guys. There would be people he'd meet who are likable for various reasons. Where as the agency would be questionable as all hell. He'd start to legitimately wonder if his lover was the good guy. There would also be people who knew the lover in life. They would plot their own revenge. But then they'd realize what was happening. The side characters should carry on the theme of being one thing while looking like another. There'd be a grand mother who tortures people for example. A teacher who's a vigilantly who murders abusive parents. We and the protagonist would have to consider if these people are actually good or bad or somewhere in between.