So happy you're covering this case. This is one of the only channels I trust to truly handle how horrible and sensitive this story is and provide genuinely insightful and accurate information.
I’m in my doctorate program to become a board licensed forensic psychologist. I am soooooo happy I happened across your channel!!!! And I’m in Seattle!
Wow. It's crazy that Dr Honda has such close ties to this case. I live in Utah and everyone here knows this case. It was all over the media. I still remember when he blew up the house and how it seemed like such a sick and unreal finale to years of insanity from him and his family. Such a tragedy.
Oh gosh. Guys…. As said with the trigger warning. I listen to true crime a lot, but I wasn’t familiar with this case and 8 minutes in…. Whoooo. Devastating. I feel so bad for the kids and the grandparents. If you’ve ever had the situation where you feel you need to legally drop off your kids in an unsafe situation and have worried about them getting killed while there…. Have support around. Will be looking forward to the commentary. I def heard the trigger warning and I’ll be ok. But wow. This one is heavy. And in my case close to home. In situations like this, you sometimes truly don’t have control, but know that ex parte right to hold them back if the dangerous person has an event coming up (I know the danger zones for my ex… he def has triggers) and always be open to suggesting a visitation center as an option. Lots more protection there. (Although when someone does something like this, sometimes there is nothing you can do.)
And the way it was stated really did make it something easy to imagine. So, while I usually don’t get super affected by true crime. This one got me. Those poor sweet boys and poor family, friend, social worker, community.
@@vanmcrtny I was a Patreon member but then the RU-vid option came out and I preferred to watch a video rather than just listen to audio so I switched. I’ve definitely noticed a lot of Patreon content on RU-vid. I guess I assumed that, since the RU-vid subscription is a little more, we would get the Patreon content as well 🤷♀️
I don’t know, I’m so mad at the social worker and the 911 operator!!! The social worker has a responsibility to take care of the kids. The kids were in her hands !! Break a window or something don’t just stand there. And the operator needs to get fired
As a social worker, you aren’t allowed to do things like that. You can’t break into property whatsoever. We aren’t like police where we can just forge in unfortunately.
@@malyunabdi7293 it’s pretty wild but when I was in training they emphasized that even if a client attacks us physically, we can’t hurt the client, we can only try to get free and then run away. I know a social worker who defended himself against a physical assault and nearly lost his license and career. We have so many limitations! It’s really hard!
I would agree as a social study student and future social worker that it's not usually within our power to break property, but I wonder if it would be okay to do so as a human in an emergency and following the ethics that we should protect clients and people in need of help, and especially to protect children
I’ve been waiting for this one. It’s so horrific and beyond sad. I’m also so angry at that 911 operator even though I’m not sure if a rapid response would have changed the outcome.
i don’t know if you’ve done this before Dr. Honda, but i’d love to hear your thoughts about the correlation between the mormon church and these types of crimes as they are not uncommon. Chad and Lori Daybell, Ruby Franke, Ron Lafferty and more have all committed violent crimes against close family members. From my own experience, I can see how religious extremism (specifically Mormonism) can influence people who are susceptible to psychosis or persuasive people, but I would love to know your thoughts!
I have always thought that Josh was handled with kid gloves because everyone was Mormon and they couldn’t imagine a good Mormon like Josh doing something like killing his wife. If he had been imprisoned, those 2 precious boys would still be alive. Sad sad story.
This is a case that did make its way to where I live, but I'd forgotten the details. When you mentioned the conclusion of the investigation after the fire, I felt absolutely numb and terrified for what the children went through in their final moments. Had to take a break for hours before coming back.. Societies lack so much in fundamental crime prevention and violence reduction, almost no priority is applied to important relevant research, developing and adhering to effective measures/strategies by all the involved sectors/agencies which can contribute to said prevention and the education of the general public, starting from school. Let alone all the instances of personal bias, perpetuation of harmful stereotypes or human error where even a near-perfect system would fail, most of us are very far from feeling remotely safe in our daily lives even when we are aware and cautious. I'm very thankful for you covering and analyzing the various aspects that did or could possibly have contributed to these crimes and tragedy.
I don't understand why the courts did not at least send a police officer with the social worker when everyone knew that he was a potential murderer and was in a more agitated state from the recent court hearings.
I had a job with social services in the foster care program and was often in dangerous situations. We could ask for a police officer to accompany us, but there was often no officer available. I was nearly killed by gunshots on two occasions and once had a former convict (murder) tell me he would kill me, chop me up and drop the pieces in the swamp, and that he would get away with it because he'd done it before. Then he said, " You have two children, don't you?" That was enough for me. I quit my job and moved with my children to another town. People like to criticize social workers, but they have no idea of the things this job demands.
Yes to be clear I don’t blame anything on the social worker. I said that the courts like the judge should have assigned a cop to go with the social workers to help them in case it gets dangerous. I agree that social workers are very brave and do a very important job. If I was the social worker going to Josh Powells house I would be very scared. Maybe I should have explained it differently but your response basically validates everything I am worried about. Social workers and the kids should be given more protection when they go to homes if criminals or men that have wives that have mysteriously disappeared and are in the process of being evaluated to potentially losing their children.
Dr. Honda, love your channel!! If you have any questions about Mormonism, I'd be happy to answer those for you! I was a social worker and I'm starting a program for mental health counseling soon! I also grew up, left then rejoined the church so I have kind of experience inside and out with the religion. What I would say is that one of the main things that sets our religion apart from others is that there are not pastors who are trained or spend years becoming a pastor. Instead everyone kind of has that role together so yes, "they were in, in the church" but so is everyone. For the most part any adult member of the Church should be able to enter temples and get called on to give the sermon on Sunday. A good way to think of it is if you are joining the Mormon church, it's a commitment similar to becoming a priest or pastor of other churches. That's every member. It's why our church seems to require more from us-- which is something that definitely sets us apart because you wouldn't think twice about a Pastor at another church wearing certain religious clothing or holding themselves to a standard of not drinking, gambling, swearing, or sex outside of marriage.
side note: I was raised Catholic, and iirc to be married in a Catholic church you're usually required to be a member of the specific church you want to marry in (maybe there's some exception if you're going to the church where the local diocese's bishop is?) and go through like a few months of counselling at least. I remember being angry as a young kid when my mom told me I *had* to be married in a church and couldn't opt for an outdoor wedding lol. Another random detail I found out is that because I was baptized, Rome retains that record and counts me in their global census. I don't know of any way around that as a US citizen. They don't offer excommunication anymore 😅
I think it depends where you are. In other countries, you don’t need to be a member of a particular church, you just need to talk to the priest (and pay their fee of course). But what should be universal for Catholics is that you need to have all your sacraments prior marriage. In some places they’d do all the sacraments right before the wedding ceremony if you are a newly made Catholic
I think you are right it must depend on the area and the church you belong to. My father was raised Catholic and my mother was Protestant. They were married in a Catholic church. She would go to mass with us all the time, but never participated in the kneeling parts. Since she wasn't Catholic, from my understanding, only Catholics can participate like that in mass. She obviously never took communion either. I have vague memories of her standing to sing with us. I know for God parents they require them to be Catholics in good standing.
Can only church members attend Catholic weddings ? I didn't think that was the case, but my knowledge is pretty narrow. I do know that temple weddings you have to a member and in good standing (paying tithes).
@@CommunicationCrackdown oh no, anyone can attend weddings, funerals, regular masses, etc. The only "exclusive" aspect is receiving the Eucharist, which is for all Catholics of any congregation.
I'm so excited for this, and this will probably be the one and only time I pay for a RU-vid membership so I can hear it 😂. I'm from Utah and was living in the PNW at the time he murdered the boys. It just seemed so close to home. I've followed this case extensively and can't wait to hear your take on this. When the Cold podcast ended there were search groups here in Utah going out and looking for her all over again. It's heartbreaking.
As an expert witness in DV/IPV Susan did everything she could in this horrific case. Asking what she could do only puts blame on her. The primary blame rests with her husband. Please don’t victim blame.
Before Chris watts this guy was the absolute worst case I’ve ever seen. How does judges and social workers live with themselves making decisions that’s many times so obviously dangerous for children. All in the name of “ fathers have rights too. “ Appalling
I'm not sure why, but as soon as you started by saying the social worker arrived at his house with his kids, this story all came back to me. I don't remember his name, and I don't remember superbowl Sunday, and I don't even remember what happened to their mom. But everything else... I guess that's what happens when you watch too much true crime.
You could have had the most amazing, brilliant, experienced, respected, reliable, and helpful 911 operator on the planet. How would that have changed the outcome of an explosion that literally leveled the house 🏠 within two seconds of the call 📞 being made?
@@sunnyscott4876 I never said it would have changed the outcome. I said they were useless. Huge difference. The lack of empathy and human decency by 911 operators is mind blowing.
@@sunnyscott4876 They could have offered some advice to the social worker, considering it was NOT two seconds since the call started that the explosion happened. And let's not forget, this isn't the only case in existence, far from it. A more timely and appropriate 911 response would have DEFINITELY saved lives in many other incidents. You keep commenting and defending clearly inadequate work from the officer when we should be looking at what they could've done better, even if they're not criminally responsible in this incident.
Very good topic. I've been following this from the beginning, when Susan disappeared. I became even more invested back when my now teenager was a playmate of Charlie and Braden. It was a casual relationship with them and their grandparents. We would often meet at a park in Graham and the kids would play together for an hour or two. On rainy days, it would be at a play area in McDonald's. For months. I knew the kids names, the grandparents knew my child's name. We were more casual, "hi how are you," kind of friends. First names only. But it was a regular thing, at least once a week, if not more. We talked a lot because we were all grandparents who were full time caring for grandchildren. We could see the plume from the fire from our back deck. Wondered what it was. As the story came out, pictures shown, interviews with the grandparents, etc., I was shocked. I knew about Susan's disappearance. Lots of speculation. Lots of concerns about the behaviors of Josh they shared. Lots of concerns about the boys' well being. Total shock. If only there a way to find more answers and not just speculation. And why there seems to be so much of this kind of thing emerging from this denomination.
Also, should the social workers who manage these supervised visitations be armed or more trained for a possibly violent parent or family member? This isn’t the first time things like this have happened.
@@sunnyscott4876 it might not have worked here, but maybe in some other cases. There was a case recently where the mom and the social worker were both killed by the father’s family.
@@sunnyscott4876 I don't know if things would have been changed, but having someone who is an authority figure who also is armed might have intimidated him to not attempt to do what he did. But I could be wrong. It's just an awful situation. Perhaps his supervised visit should have been done in a special police building where there is more monitoring and non-uniformed police officers hanging around, so as not to scare the kids?
