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The Real Difference between EMG's and Fishman Fluence Moderns 

DylanTalksTone
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We cut an EMG and a Fishman Fluence In half
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Fishman Fluence - sweetwater.sjv...
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30 сен 2024

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Комментарии : 197   
@DylanTalksTone
@DylanTalksTone Год назад
Before anyone asks... These were both new functional pickups. #science
@jannik19191
@jannik19191 Год назад
According to electrosmash, the preamps of emg pickups are also quite interesting. Instead of being wired in series, the two coils are connected to the two inputs of a differential amplifier, resulting in a configuration somewhat close to a humbucker wired in parallel. This results in a much higher resonant peak than in a regular humbucker.
@szaki95
@szaki95 6 месяцев назад
They actually fuction like two separate coils, because they don't interact physically like parallel connected humbuckers. It's more like two single coils connected to different channels of a mixer.
@fragtagninja1633
@fragtagninja1633 5 месяцев назад
That might explain why they retain dynamics so well despite the higher output.
@christopheranderson2100
@christopheranderson2100 Месяц назад
Good to know, and while everything about active pickups is interesting, this approach is just the obvious way to do it. A single op-amp (a tiny chip) has an inverting and a non-inverting input and can be used as a summing amplifier or a differential amplifier. Regardless, the advantage of having the two signals treated separately is that you can adjust the circuit so that a small coil and a large coil are balanced (at the same signal level). So coil 1 could have 500 turns and coil 2 could have only 100, and they could still cancel. Or perhaps one coil is above and the other is below. If you just wired the two coils together and amplified the whole thing, you'd have to have the same amount of turns on both coils, or if they were in an over & under configuration, you'd have to match them somehow (this is what noiseless single-coil pickups do). The only thing I can't explain is why you would want to use a differential amplifier if the two coils are already inverted with respect to each other (as they would be), but humbuckers are pretty wierd once you start coil-splitting, and op-amps are wildly more complex and amazing than I understand or can explain. Op-amps are also used to adjust the tonal parameters of the pickup (basicallly as high-pass and low-pass filters) and often feed their output back into other op-amps, and it's all highly confusing. That's why I'm super interested to watch this video. :)
@Ottophil
@Ottophil Год назад
Good content. I find it hard to explain fishmans aren’t wound to people. They can’t grasp the pcb layered magnetics. Some of my friends insist that all actives are the same
@Hesohi
@Hesohi Год назад
I couldn’t grasp layers of PCB making up coils.
@mihailmilev9909
@mihailmilev9909 Год назад
Lol
@mihailmilev9909
@mihailmilev9909 Год назад
@@Hesohi oof, well at least u do now right?
@mihailmilev9909
@mihailmilev9909 Год назад
@@Hesohi right lol
@souldreamer9056
@souldreamer9056 4 месяца назад
I also find it hard to explain. Most my friends say “what’s a guitar pickup?”.
@coffeedudeguy
@coffeedudeguy Год назад
I’m used to Rose Anvil cutting open heritage work boots, so this feels right at home 😂
@scottakam
@scottakam Год назад
It's a bit surprising that active pickups haven't made more inroads, considering the potential they bring in terms of tone shaping and variation. I don't think it's really an objection to batteries. Nobody really complains about batteries in acoustic guitars.
@daniloberserk
@daniloberserk 9 месяцев назад
It's just mumble jumble critics on internet forums really... Some people are biased without even trying tbh.
@genghisghost
@genghisghost Месяц назад
the difference is shitman flatulence sounds like shit and EMG’s sound good
@GByePorkPieHat
@GByePorkPieHat Год назад
This was educational and just a lot of good clean fun. Thanks, Dylan!
@fragtagninja1633
@fragtagninja1633 6 месяцев назад
Ive never seen a sawzaw fail to cut something before.
@RexCoggins
@RexCoggins Год назад
More of a coil tap…
@DrJeebles
@DrJeebles Год назад
My favorite EMG artist is Lars Frederiksen, but his pickups are passive. I'm blown away by how solidly those pickups are built.
@DrJeebles
@DrJeebles 11 месяцев назад
Nice to see some recognition for Rancid. I will let you know when I get a set, for sure.@@roymartin500
@cycomiles4225
@cycomiles4225 7 месяцев назад
Marty Friedman. Also passive EMGs.
@FairlyUnknown
@FairlyUnknown Год назад
I knew the fishman fluence pickups were boards stacked on top of each other from watching your video on the single "coil" version, but it was really cool to see how the EMG was put together. I never looked into how they were made, and now I know!
@mihailmilev9909
@mihailmilev9909 Год назад
Yeah same. Somewhat insightful ig that it looks just like the Fluence in a way with the naked eye
@mihailmilev9909
@mihailmilev9909 Год назад
Also nice pfp, I think I may have seen you before. Where is it from?
@gibfen1235
@gibfen1235 3 месяца назад
As an embedded designer, our RF devices used traces on a circuit board as the antenna. By "stacking" or "layering" the printed circuit boards, PCB, to achieve the electrical characteristics. Fishman uses a similar technology where the "wire windings" are actually traces on the layers of their PCBs. PCBs and manufacturing processes makes each PCB pickup match the next PCB pickups. You do not have differences between pickups because of "how" they were wound. But being in industry I WILL say that unless Fishman tightly monitors these PCBs, the materials and tolerances CAN change, ie save material money. This DOES happen. So the pickups today may not match those 2 years from now. Only time will tell..
@zacharycochran8096
@zacharycochran8096 Год назад
Fishman does a thing..and does it very well..but they are really 1 deminsional..I had a schecter with them in it..I liked it but didn't love it..being fair not a fan of active pickups..
@sweezyjackson4935
@sweezyjackson4935 4 месяца назад
Fishmans are over priced hype.
@roberthastings708
@roberthastings708 Год назад
Thanks Dylan. Who thought this was a normal channel? I knew dremel would be involved. Love this stuff.
@erikrummel6277
@erikrummel6277 11 месяцев назад
That Fluence is crazy looking!! I wanna see one of those printed circuit boards. And I wonder how many they have layered and if that’s how they change the character of the pickup ie; modern, classic, specific artist…. Thanks for the really cool video, I hope you’re getting enough add revenue to pay for the cost of the pickups 😂
@paintbox48
@paintbox48 Год назад
Hi Dylan…I’m a 75 year old guy that fiddles with guitars just for a hobby. I live in the UK so don't know the best way to contact you. I’ve got a question that’s puzzled me for a while now, and wonder if it interests you enough to comment on. Simply put - why don’t we see more involving ways of controlling tone in an electric guitar, other than just using a single capacitor to just roll off treble? I realise there are a number of switching options like phase reversal, series/parallel, split coil etc. but we don’t see much on contouring tone like there is in amplifiers or even electro/acoustic preamps. Is there a logical reason for this? Cheers Terry
@martianmurray
@martianmurray Год назад
Cool, I’ve been kinda curious about active pups. The battery thing is a turnoff but it’s good to learn.
@bennylarsen1907
@bennylarsen1907 Год назад
I felt the same way, but after getting some EMGs myself, I've come to find out that they actually don't use that much power. A set of EMGs will supposedly run 1,000 hours on a 9 volt battery. At least according to themselves.
@666takecover
@666takecover Год назад
@@bennylarsen1907 yeah, they're using a super simple differential amplifier design which draws 80 microamps (0,08mA). In comparison, a Fishman Fluence Modern draws a whopping 2,5mA which is more than 30 times that of an EMG - and the reason why they sell battery packs too. :D
@EvilDragon666
@EvilDragon666 11 месяцев назад
​@@666takecover TBH 2.5 mA is still not terrible, and totally worth it for the added flexibility and more balanced sound vs EMGs. IMO.
@NicoViergever
@NicoViergever Год назад
Very interesting, thanks. Made me think: maybe you could do a video about on-board preamp-boosters? They were a big thing in the late '70s. Clapton and Gilmour used them in their Strats and still do. I got one (make/brand unknown) in my '79 self-assembled Strat and people are amazed by the tone and versatility. Although out of fashion for years, there seems to be new interest in these on-board preamp/boosters. I am curious to see what there is on the market now (haven't seen many) and what you think of them.
@ThorsShadow
@ThorsShadow Год назад
Tosin Abasi did an interview back when he switched to Fishman. Back then he said, that they could change the sound of the pickup "almost in real time". He said this had made it extremely easy to dial in his desired sound. Never got wtf that was supposed to mean. It makes so much sense they would be able to just "shut off" individual layers of the pickups and thus change the sound. Similar to when you make a pickup with more or less copper wire.
@jimmyjames2022
@jimmyjames2022 Год назад
Really interesting EMG ZW vs Fishman Fluence video thanks! Only question left for me is are magnets ceramic or metal alloy but good luck scraping the epoxy off to test further. I support Dylans's Patreon especially for these tech deep dives, so thanks again.
@currituck
@currituck Год назад
EMG 81 Ceramic magnets EMG 85 Alnico 5 magnets
@These_go_to_eleven_1959
@These_go_to_eleven_1959 4 месяца назад
The EMG inside looks exactly like a mini dimarzio X2N pickup. There are pictures online of it not cut in! half!😂
@WilliamHaisch
@WilliamHaisch Год назад
2:30 Just look at all that raw tone dust falling out of it! 😂
@shredward666
@shredward666 2 месяца назад
I will always be an EMG fanboy. No other actives I’ve tried compare. I also feel that many people dismiss EMGs because of their limited experience with them, having only tried an 81/85. I always suggest people try a 60 or a 57 in the bridge position. Totally different sound and feel than an 81🤘
@radfury23g32
@radfury23g32 Год назад
Broooo I just ordered a single Fishman because my bridge pickup crapped out, I woulda just given it to you man no need for the violence!
@Ninjakutsueki
@Ninjakutsueki 11 месяцев назад
No idea what the impact is sonically, but I'd be curious to see the measurements of the magnets (in mm) between the EMG and FFM.
@kenwilliams7597
@kenwilliams7597 Год назад
Criminal destruction for science....Ouch !!! ..So we don't have too. 🧐
@dataplatter
@dataplatter 5 месяцев назад
Can you extract the active PCB from the fishman fluence, maybe boil it to soften the epoxy? I would love see what active components they use
@5urg3x
@5urg3x 3 месяца назад
I wonder if you could use the EMG with the Fishman preamp and vice versa if that would do anything
@msi1985
@msi1985 6 месяцев назад
Warning ⚠️ 2:32 might not be suitable for the feint of heart! Disclaimer: pickups were harmed in the making of this video!
@johnpick8336
@johnpick8336 7 месяцев назад
I have wondered about this. Thanks for destroying pick ups so we don't have to !
@TruthMan1234
@TruthMan1234 6 месяцев назад
Be nice if they engineered the 3 voicings to be accessed by mini dip switches on the side of the pickup, vs having to take the PU out and move the pin harness.
@nethbt
@nethbt 8 месяцев назад
FISHMANNs got to be the most overrated pickups ever.
@820hurleyj
@820hurleyj Год назад
I watched the Fishman video first on the Modern Fluence pick up. They said the bridge pick up had a ceramic magnet and the neck has some sort of Alnico. Which one did you cut open on the Fluence? Neck or Bridge? Fishman says there are 3 voicings. 1 & 2 sound virtually the same to me but voice 3 was an amazing Single Coil sound. Unfortunately, they only played voices 1 & 2 in a very distorted metal sound. It was a very good metal sound, but I want to know how they sounded clean as well. I found a Phillip McKnight video where he demoed voices 1 & 2 in both clean and distorted but he didn't have the "coil split" function wired up and I "assume" the "coil split" wouldve been voice 3. I'll check out your links to other videos but so far I'm still really confused (and impressed) by these new-ish Fluence pick ups.
@d3w4yn3
@d3w4yn3 Год назад
coil tap versus split, but at more than one interval. pretty cool!!!
@andrewbrowning6357
@andrewbrowning6357 Год назад
They don't actually, the Fishman pickups only use the ends of the coils, there are no taps. The voicing comes from switching capacitance in and out before the preamp.
@alexcorona
@alexcorona Год назад
You used the wrong tool for the job, you needed a bandsaw. Pretty sure you could find a neighbor who has one, or had a shop do it for $5.
@shanewalton8888
@shanewalton8888 Год назад
Thanks for taking one for the team, Dylan. It was really fascinating to see what was inside all of my EMGs
@mihailmilev9909
@mihailmilev9909 Год назад
Same. Except I don't have them.... Still tho!
@DigitalVG
@DigitalVG 8 месяцев назад
What I think in the comments ... You need a proper work bench and an angle grinder.
@Dude_Guyman
@Dude_Guyman 5 месяцев назад
Not sure but I think you might have voided your warranty!
@cliffsmithguitarlessons
@cliffsmithguitarlessons Год назад
Nice one! I'm just glad you still had all your fingers at the end of the video!
@maxmustardman298
@maxmustardman298 Год назад
The question of questions would be how is the longevity of those stacked boards
@SO-bp2uc
@SO-bp2uc 5 месяцев назад
Very cool video! Especially if you’re a nerd like me 😂
@ed713ca
@ed713ca 2 месяца назад
Is Dylan just too damn cool. Just kidding
@roberthastings708
@roberthastings708 4 месяца назад
I watched this again. It's as great this year as last. I love this stuff. Thanks!
@meyersguitars2196
@meyersguitars2196 Год назад
So glad you did this as I have always wanted to see what they look like on the inside.
@strzalZokna
@strzalZokna Год назад
Good vid, thou I recommend you to buy some angle grinder😅
@henrybelfiore8488
@henrybelfiore8488 Год назад
Brother, you need to buy yourself a bandsaw for the next video
@Vegitobluuuuu
@Vegitobluuuuu Год назад
The saber blade is a DLC blade plus it’s a fusion blade so..
@shaneaintit2171
@shaneaintit2171 6 месяцев назад
slipknot's def my fave emg artist
@rudycastillo6369
@rudycastillo6369 10 месяцев назад
slayer metallica emg all day reb beach david gilmore emg
@OfficialDreamTheater
@OfficialDreamTheater 11 месяцев назад
Fishman>EMG, BUT... EMG is the OG.
@mikecarbone828
@mikecarbone828 Год назад
Salutations Dylan! Very interesting comparison, totally different pickup construction, I did not realize that the Fishman Fluence pickups were so different inside, I have an Epiphone Prophesy Les Paul with the Fishman Fluence pickups and I really like the way they sound, but I had no idea how much more complex they are than EMG powered pickups, however, I was very interested in seeing and learning how they are able to get more sound options out of a single pickup. Thank you very much for posting this video and sharing this information with us all! Please have an excellent and awesome day! ☀️✨🎸
@grr2852
@grr2852 9 месяцев назад
That hurt to watch lol but very informative
@jason.martin
@jason.martin 11 месяцев назад
Very informative !!! thanks for sacrificing these pickups :)
@NobotyBoi
@NobotyBoi 8 месяцев назад
The way all actives should be treated 😂
@eyeofamon
@eyeofamon 5 месяцев назад
Are you sure that's an 85? The 60 was designed as a Firebird style pickup, but put in the full humbucker case for marketing purposes. I have taken a 60 apart and verified this, but never taken an 85 apart.
@DylanTalksTone
@DylanTalksTone 5 месяцев назад
It’s an 85
@jamietristan7818
@jamietristan7818 Год назад
Great content, I'm convinced to buy fishman pickups now
@snowcamellion
@snowcamellion Год назад
Very interesting. I've changed out my pickups for EMG's, and I really liked the solderless connections end to end. I was curious if the Fishman fluence had the same thing. Doesn't look like it, I see from your video there are pin connectors but looks like they need to be soldered to the pots , etc.. At least that's what it looks like from a diagram but I could totally be reading that wrong. What's your thoughts on the solderless connection? I've had good experiences with it.
@rferguson3
@rferguson3 10 месяцев назад
Yep, Fishman have solderless option, as well. Although, I'm pretty sure that in order to utilize coil tapping, you still have to solder one small connection, on the opposite side of the pickup (opposite of the side that has the solderless hook-up)
@vanguard9067
@vanguard9067 Год назад
Couldn’t just take it apart, huh?
@ashchase8340
@ashchase8340 10 месяцев назад
First off Fishman are not Active pickups, they’re Active Voicing. The 9v powers the fishman technology. You can see what the fishman look like on their website without cutting them in half
@enacku
@enacku 7 месяцев назад
then why does ESP/LTD list them as active for the JM-II guitar? Fishman Fluence Modern Humbucker Ceramic (Active) What are you trying to say, I'm a bit confused?
@johnelmers3348
@johnelmers3348 8 месяцев назад
I've been so looking for a vid like this. Thanks
@geoffwhitemusic
@geoffwhitemusic Год назад
Have you tried a hacksaw?
@JoeyLizotte-di1vh
@JoeyLizotte-di1vh 11 месяцев назад
You left out Duncan Blackouts.
@MetalHead123345
@MetalHead123345 6 месяцев назад
Emg can go 24v im at that its great
@e.r.559am7
@e.r.559am7 2 месяца назад
Shout out to spyderco :)
@terrymcguniess7582
@terrymcguniess7582 Год назад
2:45 omg the horror.....the horror!
@garysanders3193
@garysanders3193 8 месяцев назад
You need to compare the EMG TW model to the Fishman Fluence.
@DylanTalksTone
@DylanTalksTone 8 месяцев назад
If someone sponsors the video I sure will
@patrickthompson3216
@patrickthompson3216 11 месяцев назад
I think it is important to note that literally cutting your pickups in half may affect your warranty
@philchiara5928
@philchiara5928 9 месяцев назад
might affect tone as well
@honigdachs.
@honigdachs. 7 месяцев назад
When he cut up the Fishman, I was expecting a frog to jump out of the pickup. To my surprise, apparently there are no frogs sitting inside of Fishmans. That would have explained why they sound so incredibly quacky.
@DreidMusicalX
@DreidMusicalX 5 месяцев назад
Pretty cool.
@justinreynolds3935
@justinreynolds3935 8 месяцев назад
Watching you saw 100$ in half is hard to watch.
@DylanTalksTone
@DylanTalksTone 8 месяцев назад
250
@NFedorov1989
@NFedorov1989 3 месяца назад
watch it at 1.75 speed .thank me later
@johnnybrown9581
@johnnybrown9581 Месяц назад
Thank u sire
@uh-ohstinky3581
@uh-ohstinky3581 Месяц назад
First half of the video made me sad like "WTF IS HE DOING CUTTING THAT IN HALF", but then I genuinely got an education on the pick ups and seeing inside them was very interesting. Awesome video
@kingpriapatius5832
@kingpriapatius5832 4 месяца назад
I love Fishman pickups. EMG and Dimarzio are still cool, but the clarity and the dynamics of Fishman are unique.
@BillySoundFarm
@BillySoundFarm Год назад
Dude. How did this video only get 5.9k views in 3 weeks and the Harley benton killer video did 27k in 4 days. I don't understand why this isn't way more interesting than that to people. Also, your thumbnails are really good lately. I know exactly what the video is going to be every time these days. I think I click on less of them, but when I click, I know why I'm clicking and I know I'm watching until the end. Great content man.
@Not_secretly_an_Orc
@Not_secretly_an_Orc 10 месяцев назад
Thought I was going blind till I realised the camera wasn’t focused a few time haha
@richarddwjensen
@richarddwjensen 5 месяцев назад
Hey Dylan, I loved this video as well as the one on myth-busting guitar shielding beliefs. Would there be any benefit to shielding a cavity and pickguard for Fishman Fluence modern humbucker install?
@KordTaylor
@KordTaylor 7 месяцев назад
BTW - I just recently found out that Firebird pups aren’t really mini-humbuckers.
@These_go_to_eleven_1959
@These_go_to_eleven_1959 4 месяца назад
Seymour Duncan has this cool wiring that allows you to set the amount of cutput from the one coil! It's called the "spin of split" mod. You can have one of the 2 coils only 50% on!
@TristanJCumpole
@TristanJCumpole Год назад
Fishman Fluence pickups don't seem to benefit from an 18v supply, however the original EMG preamp (can't speak to the newer versions) does sound significantly different with more voltage overhead. Whether this is straight out headroom or the supply voltage affects the frequency response from the current-limited circuit is beyond me. EMGs still do their EMG thing at 18v, but with a wider dynamic range than with a more-compressed 9v supply. For anybody that runs older style EMGs, I'd recommend this modification if the option is there. What I am curious about personally, is how many connections there are between the stacked PCBs of the "coils" in the Fluence and the tone-shaping preamp itself. If there are not too many, it should be feasible to have a preamp elsewhere in the instrument that is more complex than the one embedded in the single Fluence unit. If I'm right in thinking that the individual artist pickups use common PCB coil stacks with tweaked preamps and specific tone shaping, all many of wacky stuff could be done with a comprehensive preamp set in the control cavity. Moveable resonant peaks, everything.
@mortaman
@mortaman 11 месяцев назад
I have fishmans currently but been EMG guy for 32 years, I don't care for them and my guitar guy said they are wired differently so he can't just swap out as easy as you would another EMG any comments on what my guitar guys says
@shovington67
@shovington67 Год назад
Wow? I didn't expect the Fishman Fluence to sound so musical while being cut and having the video speed increased.
@claesvanoldenphatt9972
@claesvanoldenphatt9972 11 месяцев назад
Glad you didn’t do a ‘tone test’ because I can’t hear anything distinguishing any specific sound qualities on RU-vid. The platform does not lend itself to high fidelity listening, and most digital devices are entirely inadequate to high fidelity listening.
@Eswald
@Eswald Год назад
-1 for not using an angle grinder... But awesome vid. Fishmans (Fishmen?) look interesting in terms of technology.
@rendyandrian7149
@rendyandrian7149 Год назад
I've been waiting for someone to cut an EMG for almost a decade. As far as I know, before this video, there is only one video which cuts EMG. Even then it is a chinese copy of EMG 81 not a real one.
@Jshortca
@Jshortca Год назад
It's Greg "Kawk". He even says so. It's o.k to say that word. We're mostly all grown ups here. Myself not included.
@javiervillalobos7
@javiervillalobos7 Год назад
PM2 as a pointer? Check! ; Tip down carry? WTF!? 🙃
@paulneeds
@paulneeds Год назад
Didn’t Fishman say all of this when the pickups were announced? I know I read about the boards replacing coils in a review or something back when I bought guitar magazines…
@cchavez248
@cchavez248 Год назад
Lol, you had do much trouble cutting those because you forgot to puton," Let the Bodies Hit the Floor!!!!". 😁😜
@DamianoftheRyans
@DamianoftheRyans Год назад
INTRIGUING! I have had Fishmans befo', I do like them, but I like my EMGs more. Especially the 57/66 set. 😎
@timothypotter2137
@timothypotter2137 Год назад
We could learn so much if you cut everybody's pickups in two. Cut in half.
@formallynamed85
@formallynamed85 Год назад
Thanks buddy sorry for your loss tho but it was interesting as heck still curious about the magnets in each and my question is would they both be the same meaning like the emg are both magnets the same in it or one this and one that I figure so but the fishman I would really wonder especially when it comes to all the different signature models I dunno just coffee thinking lol
@luistijerina
@luistijerina Год назад
I think it was Greg Koch himself who said his last name is pronounced like “cock” and not “coke” 😂
@Eckerick
@Eckerick 5 месяцев назад
Great explanation of how Fishman uses parts of the "coils" to achieve different tones.
@ThorsShadow
@ThorsShadow Год назад
"To show you the power of an active circuitry, I cut these pickups in half!"
@GregStraub42
@GregStraub42 Год назад
Sounds like they are a really different design like Lace Alumitones in that they're not coils.
@valueofnothing2487
@valueofnothing2487 Год назад
EMG's are mini-humbuckers. That is amazing.
@buckchaser4725
@buckchaser4725 Год назад
You may want to call customer service to find out if you just voided the warranty. Who knows, maybe they’ll send you a new one.
@myeyesarewaiting
@myeyesarewaiting Год назад
Would love to see a destructive dismantle of the PRS SE Silver Sky pickups to find out what the extra pole pieces are all about
@diariesofamediocremusician325
A bandsaw would be the correct method to cut these, and would have gone through like butter with very little damage to the pups themselves. Its always interesting to see the insides of things that we never get to see.
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