The Redemption of Cyberpunk 2077 

To be fair I'd be down with him analyzing and breaking down the themes and motifs in both red dead redemption games.

@Nagger cobbler provides a c unique perspective to red dead

Cobbler is really good at introducing something else to us and circling it back around to what the title is

Same, and it gave me December 10th flashbacks

That transition was smooth af, though

Yes it is.

THANK YOU I completely agree and I’m glad others do too

Eeeeeexcept for me scratching my head about that Capitalism bit wondering if he thinks there’s *really* a better solution If not and he’s simply stating the obvious, fine; I agree Just am genuinely curious if my pessimism is founded or not

Well there's no need for that..

Ya a lot of video essayist just spout dumb shit that doesn’t mean anything. But he uses analogies and comparisons really well. Maybe just bulk up the videos to also cover counter points to his own argument

"A game where the player can do anything is a game that focuses on nothing" - Yahtzee crosshaw

Well said no more need to be said

The embodiment of what went wrong with cyberpunk 2077

😔👊 socity

I really hope if they ever decided to make Witcher 4, they don't listen to some angry casuals who says the game are way too long.

Yeah, and I get why some people might say that all those little immersive mechanics might be a chore for them, when you've spent hours feeding your horse, brushing it, comforting it, bonding with it, customizing it and then it dies, it hurts more. Cleaning the guns is not that big a deal as it doesn't need to be done that often and looting might take a while, but you already get so much stuff that it isn't really necessary, I liked the slow gameplay in the open world and really felt immersed. I wish rockstars doesn't get rid of all of that because of complaints like that, because for me, that's where the magic was, not the missions when hundreds of enemies are launched at you, but the slow, quieter, immersive part, with well made animations and attention to details.

@@factoryreset855 honestly I really wish RDR2 had a lot less heavily scripted story moments where you are forced on a path, slowly making your way to a marker to go into a cutscene to go into a shooting gallery to go into another cutcene and more of the classic rpg elements where things just kinda happen themselves and you get only vague hints on how to approach things. It would transition into the freeroam, slow-paced survival segments the OP was describing much more organically imo

@@Spiderella3959 Yeah, the mission's structure was the weakest part of the game imo, while the open world's structure was it's strong one. I wish they'd rework the way they design quests, nowadays when I play, I just roam the map and do side content instead of doing the main story (already finished it once)

lol

@@Spiderella3959 This is exactly the point of this video. RDR2 was developed for 8 years, by about 2000 people according to google. It already was a massive undertaking and developing an immersive and "free-er" quest system would also be one. It's the same reason why mechanics in Bethesda games are not perfect, and why CDPR's games are really strong at the story, quest system and worldbuilding but nothing else. When developing games you have to make trade-offs because it's insanely expensive, the technology moves fast and the more things you stuff into your game the more you risk having a stable and performant product.

Clearly he wasn't your best bud if you pushed back his funeral for a bunch of random bullshit that TRIGGERS those calls. Seriously if you actually treat the death of your best friend with the respect it deserves and go there first nothing interrupts it.

^ literally went to his funeral the moment i could. no one interrupts you. :shrug:

@@arkhamcreed4326 going into the neighborhood triggers those calls, Only thing I did beforehand was clearing Watson as much as I can BEFORE the heist

@@stardust_2339 that’ll do it because you have to much street cred

Wait what

Me: *deletes game I AM THE GREATEST GAME DESIGNER

You only really beat the game when you go outside and play some B-ball.

Wasn't that the philosophy behind Ico on the ps2?

Can't have a bad one if you have none at all Big Brain alert

Had us in the first half, not gonna lie

They're just A.

The ad timing was perfect too

@@sweet-lara They're more A then I

Well, each person has their own taste I guess. I personally hated all the time-wasters in RDR2. So much so I never finished it. I might even say that it disrespects my time by doing so. But hey, good to know there are people liking that kind of stuff.

I understand, but is it really necessary for me to hold (A) to bathe or when I need to craft 200 split point bullets individually? Making me hold a button over and over again when I could just relax and watch a (skippable) animation ruins the immersion for me. There isn't a minigame when we skin animals or set up camp but I still appreciate those things and believe a minigame would make them worse.

@rinkerthemaker looting takes 5 decades. theres one time waster i can think of

well said

Nah

Visibility becomes a curse. RU-vid channels die because they try to monetize everything they make to a growing audience.

You mean 5 dollar Bj's

He can't do both?

That's exactly what I would do.

Another feature people wish they would add to Cyberpunk.

I really liked the city environment, even though it was lacking in detail. I recently played it for the first time so I never saw how rough it looked at launch. I still ended up getting bored of the game and started another Witcher playthrough lmao

You call it a dumpster fire yet you played it and enjoyed it?

@@wesleyleigh4063 yah...you can do that..

@@tyler547 that's a shit game as well

Despite the bullshit I hear I still want to play

You write this comment everywhere.

@@mikhaelgribkov4117 And yet he's not wrong.

not wrong

So if redemption doesn't matter you want them to like, shoot the game to death in broad daylight instead for justice right? Idk man it's still a pretty kickass game

@@patrickobrien1198 emm, what? Do you replied to wrong comment? By the way, they should be the ones to get punished, not game. People were all to foolish to buy into "We aren't like other companies owo" and forgive some stuff, but now it's clear, they are new stage of asshole corpos who are self-aware and know what strings to use.

*Laughs in Persona*

Yeah I agree with you...... I liked those added features

@@kaz_1392 dude if you don’t want to be immersed then have a dirty gun and horse. These features may negatively affect the pacing, these minor flaws are so small you can look past them. Also if I’m gonna buy a gun and customize it with many designs I appreciate the cleaning, watching my guns going from dirty to clean you can appreciate these subtle details. To add on I feel like the horse is very crucial for the game and the idea that you can take care of it helps me enjoy and be immersed the RDR2 world. If you don’t like this game you should play the assassins creed franchise.

@@calebpark1185 ???? I was on the side of I like the fact that you have to clean your gun and horse..... Did you read my comment properly?

Yep, the big part of RDR2 is that it's more than an open-world crime game - it's a wild west immersive sim - with a good story on top. Those little things sell you the fantasy of being in that world.

Ye except the part that they won anyway. They got the money and on steam the reviews are so good and i dont really understand why. This is so shit compared to a lot of indy games that cant be so hyped due to budgets. CDPR failed everythin,they knew this game was bad but..you know money are money so who cares "i hope we ll get fans trust again" well fuck you. Yes i played the game and as soon as i saw the wanting system ,the basic thing this game needed,i new it was gonna be so bad. Nobrainer refund

@@3093DaNieLe3093 Unfortunately the state on consoles has taken most of the attention from players and media to a point that a lot dont even see the utter failures in game design and quality of quests etc. CDPR also used this as a small cover up, directing all attention to "fixing the consoles" and just acting like they didnt know something was really wrong with the core game itself. I do not think they will use this as a learning experience to better themselves, quite the contrary I believe. They never made so much money in that short period of time. They literally made back the develepment and marketing costs for the entire project with the preorders alone. The only thing the managers learn in a big corp is when they make big money, they did something right, so they will believe by overhyping and deceiving customers they can do the same again in the future as they did now, if they really wanted to better themselves they would have atleast adressed the problems with the core game itself by now. Its the same thing that happened with Bethesda, they made FO3, FO4, Oblivion, Skyrim and all of those games were overshadowed by their "bugginess" and thats what players and media paid their attention to in these games, also leading to them to completely overlook the poor game design of all those games. The only reason why a somewhat bigger piece of the player base started acknowledging these issues is because Obsidian showed the players that they could make a far superior game compared to Bethesda and that in just 1 years time with FO:NV. This lead of course to the fact that Bethesda instantly stopped working with them ever again, because they didnt want them to overshadow their internal production or force Bethesda to increase their quality to not contrast as much. In addition to that in such big corps like CDPR (and yes CDPR is a huge corp, their net worth is significantly higher than f-ing Ubisoft and Rockstar) due to product issues that damaged their brand, design leads and engineers will be fired and also removed from the board. Instead the people who made the big $$$ (by overhyping, lying and deceiving their customers), the marketing people, are those who get to be more represented in the board and the decision making process. This automatically begins an unstoppable process where marketing gets more of a say over the company compared to the product people (engineers, designers, etc), which basically means "full throttle into the dark side". Its the same thing that happened with EA, Ubisoft, Bethesda and many other once small and innovative companies that grew into huge corps and placed the people in the leading positions that made the most $$$, and those were the marketing people.

I will never understand the statement of CDPR having a "stellar career" like you and many many others claim, when they only ever became somewhat known after a single good game and nothing more. If anything, it feels like they were nothing but a one hit wonder.

@@arandom35yearold thats because they showed in TW3 how to make a game with passion and love. The attention to detail for the secondary stories and the quality over quantity given to gamers..not clients to scam. Cyberpunk turn the table upside down,ive never seen such bad product honeslty

@@3093DaNieLe3093 Yeah but a single product isnt exactly a stellar career. Or a career in thr first place.

Super based. Those are things I’ve enjoyed about the game but have never fully realized until reading this. Thanks dawg

I agree. This was the first video to truly make me realize what really makes Cyberpunk 2077 a bad game. It’s not the glitches or the combat or the RPG elements or the open world. All of that isn’t why Cyberpunk 2077 is a bad game… It’s a bad game because it’s a Jack of all trades master of none. It’s a game that can do a lot of things okay, but it never *excels* at those things. It lacks focus, it lacks vision. It is literally a game about everything… and yet nothing at all.

@@NoahDaArk Honestly it's a pale imitation of its origin. They screwed up when they made it into a basic video game RPG, none of the mechanics in the game match the originals they are named after. Cyberpunk was not an RPG that used Levels, Hitpoints or magical instaheals. Progression wasn't about improving stats or getting a higher level of the same gun or equipment you start with. It was a skill based game with realistic depictions of combat with firearms. If you get shot in your fleshy gut then you might die straight away or you might bleed out in a few minutes. Unless your as augmented as Adam Smasher and wearing a full suit of Metalgear hard armour then you're not standing in the middle of a hail of bullets like it's a light rain. If you are as augmented as him and wearing that armour, then you stand out like a sore thumb and the NCPD are likely going to call in Maxtac just to question why you're walking around in combat armour before you get anywhere near your mission. It's depressing that they failed to get the basics of Cyberpunk and made a generic video game RPG instead of working on what made Cyberpunk work.

Exactly, he atoned for his past, what happened to him wasn't justice it was a federal agency tying loose ends, John was no longer a threat and would have to suffer for what he did for the rest of his life through regret, he was also starting to become a productive member of society. I liked the ending because it was well written not because john got his comeuppance.

The government is just a bunch of killers and cheats anyways so he never changed who he was working for. Just the name he was working under

Came to say this. Ultimately the idea of “justice” is a frustratingly nebulous one that people literally have to go to college and then take more college to understand sufficiently for practicing law. Marston did atone for his crimes, however selfishly motivated he was in doing so, in the suffering of scorching every bridge he built his whole life while the remaining people he cared about were constantly under threat, all in the name of public service. Furthermore, he came out the other end a changed man with the potential of helping more people and breaking the cycle of violence by giving his son a proper father figure. Instead, a better man was taken out of society for the crimes committed by a long-dead scumbag. That’s not justice, that’s short-sighted vigilante-ism actively undermining societal progress, and just throwing the dude in jail to rot wouldn’t’ve been much of an improvement. Even the fairest trial would have a jury out for the man’s blood, because their angle isn’t pragmatic but emotional. I can’t blame people at all for hating him, but I can take issue with a system that refuses to see the potential benefits of punishing a bad man by forcing him to do good instead of removing him entirely such that he can’t contribute anything. More to Cobbler’s point, No Man’s Sky made many similar mistakes to Cyberpunk, was redeemed thoroughly, and is now a good game with a large, loyal, active player-base. If he was implying CDPR should just put the game out to pasture like Marston because redemption would be hollow in the face of the laundry list of fuck ups they made in delivering the game, I think that’s way too hasty a conclusion to come to. The devs CAN cut superfluous content, it WOULD make the game more enjoyable, and that WILL cultivate a dedicated player-base and set people at ease about CDPR’s intentions, i.e. they will “atone for their crimes.” In their case, with the age of games-as-a-service upon us, I don’t think it’s too late for reparations.

True he was essentially just working as a criminal again but this time for the government and once he had served his purpose to the state they gunned him down in front of his home and his wife and son. They didn't kill him because he was a murderer and criminal and needed to be punished for his crimes, they murdered him because they needed to tie a loose end that was it, it had nothing to do with justice or retribution for the victims of John and his old friends.

Quite a few modern "storytelling" "rpgs" tell a far better story in a much more beautiful way, take Disco Elysium for example. While the story is the strongest part of C2077, it's not strong enough to hold up the weight of the game.

​@@imbaby5499 We could argue over subjective taste all day, and I agree that Disco Elysium is a fantastic way to tell a story. That doesn't change the quality of Cyberpunk's writing, especially in the mainline story. I agree with the sentiment though, a lot of the game was outright botched and a good story doesn't make a good game. I'll suffer through a bad game for a good story though, and not everyone is the same. (Deadly Premonition is the ultimate example of this)

I love the Spanish reggaeton on the radio station. It was really authentic

Agreed, they did an excellent job depicting the loss of your best friend, a mother's son, a member of a community and the ripple effects of grief. When I got his bike, I never rode anything else for the rest of the game.

@@Shnap1337 stuff like that feels good because it's when your motivation as a player lines up with the motivation of the main character. This does not happen often in CP2077

I liked Jackie too. It's just so sad he had to die that early. The game barely gave me any time to get attached to him.

"Wake up the kids, get them out here, he's gonna talk about Skyrim!"

?!

The reason why you gave arthur bath was pretty wholesome

yeah dude that is one of the best part of the game

Just get a new horse lol

@@unclexbox85 I’m guessing you don’t know the scene his taking about

I think the point is if your game is an rpg, focus on making it an rpg, and not an immersive cowboy simulator. If you want to make an immersive cowboy simulator well then focus on that and lose focus on places that don't add to it. But I've never played Rdr2, that's just what i assume he was getting at

Not opinion, fact

I bet over half of them are just to get the game to work properly.

@@funnyman10912 ah shit he's got me.

No, they don’t. If you need 100+ mods to make it good then it’s not good

@@qwoovy2359 if you mod fallout you might get it. I started out with a couple, then it just lead to a landslide of random mods. It's easy to get over 100 mods accidentally.

​@@qwoovy2359It was already good. No one started playing Fallout New Vegas modded. Most modding is just to remedy the limitations of the shit ass oblivion engine meeting an 18 month development cycle.

I think you mean under cooked

@@jokey-mmmm4432 You clearly diden't watch the video

Makes it even worse that Jackie's death means nothing. If Jackie lived he would have to leave the city or just constantly look behind his back for people trying to kill or arrest him. And even if he did stick around he can't exactly help V he doesn't know anyone who could help V. Jackie would just be turned to a side character like Victor, who occasionally shows up to be your friend that doesn't do to much in the story post prologue. Hell, Jackie's death doesn't motivate V to stop Arasaka or literally anything, just makes him sad and he moves on after a funeral, a funeral that is optional.

I'm trying to get into development, myself. It's a truly mind-boggling undertaking, particularly if you're acting solo. Modeling, texturing, writing, animation, programming, DESIGN...it's just so much. It's incredibly humbling whenever developers email me, comment, or tweet at me. I wish you the best of luck and thank YOU for watching

@@DJPeachCobbler yes I'm also a starting developer although my strategy is to first make the mobile version and see how well it will be received

Yeah, I'm all for the realism but what Far Cry Primal did is best with the animation skipping that you can toggle on and off. 100%ing RDR2 you'll probably spend literal hours just watching that same skinning animation to get all the shit you need.

@@spoike7027 you obviously haven't played rdr2, you don't spend hours doing shit like that

@@cryomaniac3217 you obviously didn’t read what I said, I said if you’re trying to 100% RDR2 you literally spend hours watching Arthur cut pelts off dead animals. I have over a thousand hours on this game lmfao 🤣

@@spoike7027 I've 100%ed rdr2, you have no idea what you're talking about. It never got boring, and hunting actually became my favorite activity

@@spoike7027 and no, if you haven't already 100%ed the game, and said "probably" spend hours watching the same animation. You definitely don't have a 1000 hrs

It’s reminds me of No Mans Sky players

Or maybe they believe in redemption? Some of us don't like to play god, you know.

Ahhhhhh that's explain it

😂

play Postal 2, a twisted view from the other side of what games can be

I learnt my lesson after brink

@@cloroxusthestainlessone4324 I had lots of fun with brink when I was younger

@@jiffy6969 so did I but no fucker else did which killed it for me

I really like them too, but i don't think it was really necesary for a game like this If this mechanics were in a simulation western game, then i will not have problem, but in Red Dead i really felt them unnnesary

@@mateoreyes6921 I loved it very much. Sitting underneath the huge sky, looking up at the stars while cooking some meat or coffee you bought from the town. I didn't feel like it was unnecessary, I felt like if that wasn't there, I wouldn't feel the same connection with Arthur. Feeling that loneliness most people felt when the travelled in that Era made it way more realistic and you believed that Arthur's story could've been shown in a Western Movie or something like that. The beautiful world was great and I haven't felt so good playing a game for a long time. Arthur is such a lovely character.

And as Angry Joe would put it: “they aren’t good games, they’re legendary games!” And indeed those three games are legends in what they do. The Witcher 3 is a fantastic RPG with an even greater story. Half-Life 2 nails being a unbroken narrative. And Deus Ex is a phenomenal stealth action game. There is no such thing as perfect games… only legendary ones

@@NoahDaArk man I gotta go play witchers

^^ great summary

I usually buy my games 2 years late when they’re 75% off and complete editions.

This is the best take so far. It definitely wasn't undercooked, it was overcooked. Had they stick to fewer features it would've been a great game.

@@eldennub They should have sticked with a Mafia-esque formula in all honesty especially if writing is their strong suit rather than shoving in under cooked features

Eh I disagree for certain game I can’t imagine not being able to play doom eternal this entire time

Yeah me too man. People complained exactly like this when san andreas introduced the fat and muscle meters and having to maintain your character. I like that realism shit, but I understand why lots of folks dont like to go through the motions

Same but barely did I eat or sleep

Yeah this guys channel is underrated

Fucking same here, man. Holy shit this video was SO well made and conveyed.

Thanks! It was a big pain, there were lots of rewrites and I wanted to cover so much, but I'm glad you liked it.

Same for me

I agree. I love a game that understands that all players aren't little kids that need 24/7 stimulation. RDR2 knows that we don't need to constantly have the adrenaline levels pumped up to 1000. There's time for silence, peace, and calmness, but there's also time for stress, adrenaline-fueled gunfights, and tense fistfights. It creates a nice balance. The sometimes sluggish animations compliment the fast moments very well.

Yeah I mostly ignored them as well and didn't really lose anything.

I would've talked about ludonarrative dissonance, but my poor subscribers have heard enough about it, I'd say. Thanks for the sub, next video's gonna be out of left field, but I hope you enjoy it!

I mean, just cause you're dying doesn't mean the world is gonna give you a handout. Gotta get money from somewhere.

Glados? GLADOS? TAKE MY FUCKING MONEY

lol yeah, I loved when Delemain started talking about testing. I liked the crucifixion sidequest as well, although I couldn't bring myself to participate. I tried to talk him out of it, and just ended up watching from behind the camera. My issues with the game stem from the fact that so much time was spent on other aspects of the game. There are great moments in the game, but it's just stuffed with so much *stuff* that serves only to distract me from those great moments. CDPR are great at RPGs, and I found the roleplaying opportunities few and far between. Like I said, when the game settles down and focuses on doing just one thing, it's great.

I felt the same way about the game, even tho this video gave me some insight why. It lacks focus. The story hooked me the most, the moments with the characters, but there was so much shit inbetween, kill him, steal this, talk to joe about steak, here a car you can buy. It took me out of it. And I said before: in x time the youtubers who shit on this game now will say it was a hidden gem all along.

What details? This city is giant hole with walking zombies and areas of unfinished content.

@@mikhaelgribkov4117 my city IRL is filled with zombies and unfinished content.

Yeah me to. I felt like a cowboy...those were days of my life

Completely agree, RDR2 had a few unnecessary bells and whistles but tbh you could avoid most of the unnecessary things like baths and sleeping if you just had the right items which is true in most games. It rewards exploration and gives things to burn money on, giving incentive to do quests along with the story instead of powering through