The trouble with Tufas! 

Great comment. Lots worth considering there. And you're exactly right; acidity _can_ prevent concrete curing, and it's even used as a (spray-on) surface retardant for exposed-aggregate finishes. Note that Portland cement is alkaline. Because there is a (relatively) large ratio of cement to aggregate in the 3:4:5 Tufa recipe, there is plenty of room for it to absorb (neutralize) some of the acidity from an aggregate and still be able to mostly cure. I'd like for us to discover the reality here, but I'm not really in the mood for stoichiometry problems this morning; suffice it to say that these pots were not really brittle, because they had already survived a decade of use & weather. It was a sheet of heavy ice that did them in. Oh, and I worked as a concrete guy for a time, too. Cement is rough on the hands. Not as bad as being a bricklayer, though. That job's hand hell.

Right, just don't throw them outside for 7-8 with water/ice wrecking them, turn them over at Least!

@@patriciacole8773 zone 5

Sand works better for strength and durability.

@@vaderladyl sand and portland cement is your basic mortar mix. of course its strong. just buy a bag of mortar if that's what you're going to do. then mix in the perlite and whatever else. they used animal hair in the middle ages.

exactly. He was probably right about the time: the water would have sat in the lower layer of the snow when it refroze. The expanding ice in the saturated part just ripped the bonds apart. The surviving ones may have been on top of something, and the one that was sideways, may lose a wall still...

Thanks.

I feel your pain. I've lived around woods like that. Suffered from poison ivy for most of my life (even went delirious and was taken to the ER over it once). But you can get in those woods and work them, a piece at a time. Pull the nasty plants and select/encourage better tree growth. It will be rewarding work. We call it 'reclaiming real estate.'

And I'm sure that you would have provided the correction for me, right? Which is why I'm now a miserable captive here in this weird bubble of useless scrutiny. It was an almost irrelevant detail, as are most all definitional discussions. And I waste away my productive hours foot-noting each and every one, to the incessant tune of each and every viewer's idiosyncratic preoccupation. And just to return the favor: it bothers me when someone uses a comma to separate independent clauses without a conjunction.

@@pocket83squared i didn't know you were so insecure, and i was genuinely thanking you. It bothers me when people don't know the difference but mistakes don't bother me.

Yeah, but we _can't_ know the differences about everything. I don't mean to sound insecure. It's just that there's always something, and it gets tedious. Sorry if I'm being nasty.

@@pocket83squared Yes people, I know that I am replying to an old comment, but this made me laugh! Nicely played

It looks to me like some sort of sedum (stonecrop). That's certainly the sort of environment they like to grow in.

The point is kinda how earthy these pots are. Adding fiberglass would be a circumvention of that. They don't really need reinforcement. Just don't allow them to sit under 4" of ice and a foot of snow.

Aye, beam them to the Klingon engine room where they'll be no tufa at all

They ate all the quadrotriticale. Bastards!

This probably sounds pathetic, but it's too hard! Lots of work for a game. The distance is just too extreme. Father-in-law was over, and I'd figured we'd play, but we just ended up hatchet throwing instead.

@@pocket83squared Hatchet throwing is a great alternative!

That's probably a bit drastic. Water alone could speed up the neutralization with a good, long soak. Just be sure that the (cement) cure process has fully finished first.

@@pocket83squared Yes, water alone can do it also, but it is much faster using water with some vinegar. I don't quite understand what is so drastic about that. lol

​@@user-re3td7fu1d Because Tufas are enormous, so it'll take not only a huge vessel, but also lots of vinegar to alter the pH of so much solution, which will then be a minor pain to dispose of. Soaking them in the creek for a day or two is as far as I'd reasonably go. If you're in a hurry, Tufa is probably not for you; it takes days to de-mold, and then over a month to fully cure. When I _do_ have to dispose of vinegar solution, I dump it in the (limestone) gravel behind my garage. What doesn't neutralize will help keep the weeds down.

@@pocket83squared Hypertufa pots are enormous? Funny blanket statement to make. One can make them whatever size ones wants, from 4 inch pots to very large ones. Anyway, you seem rather argumentative, so I'll leave you to it. I was just pointing out another method that I have used to neutralize hat was quite successful. But you do you. I wish you peace.

The unsolicited advisor accuses, "argumentative." Okay. Thanks for stopping by to give me permission to do myself, but we're all stocked up on sanctimony.

Yes, that is good advice. Though these would've been broken even _with_ a drainage bed, since they were sort of encapsulated in a block of ice. The weight crushed them as the ice's expansion ripped them apart underneath.

I haven't made this, but from other videos I've seen, they use equal parts of the 3 ingredients by volume (plus water). So you can use any random container as your measuring device.

Yes, Tufa dries quite quickly. Water runs right through it, almost the way it will through a screen or mesh. As for the porosity of cement, that depends on what you mean. "Cement" usually refers to the binding agent (sticky part) of a concrete, for example, _Portland Cement._ It's unlikely that you'd use a cement alone to make pots. If you did, the pot would likely be very hard, dense, and brittle. If you're asking about concrete pots, then yes, those would also dry out fairly quickly, but probably not as fast as terracotta does, simply because they'd be more massive. You can imagine a concrete pot as also behaving like a screen or a mesh-though a much tighter one than Tufa. It would take some time for a concrete pot to totally dry out. Concrete can also be sealed with oils, waxes, or sealing compounds designed for the purpose. Sealing it would _really_ slow the pot's evaporation. Note that if you do make concrete pots, they have a leach period; this means that before certain plants can flourish in them, some of the chemicals may have to be rinsed away. pH may also be a consideration. The process can take _lots_ of time.

You get some interesting stuff over there. From a naturalistic point of view, it would be like a new world for me to explore. As someone who has not left his continent, it's a bit magical to watch outside interviews with Attenborough or Dawkins, or to see the grounds of Darwin's house. There's something almost fantasy-like about where you live. You might feel a similar way if you were to visit here?

​@@pocket83squared The plants are the best and most under-rated part about here. I mean yes we have the Chelsea flower show and kew gardens - but they're a circus to nature. The real beauty is the wilderness growing on roundabouts. Those are the real islands.

If you've ever played a _Final Fantasy,_ there's a giant creature "Goobbue," that has plants growing on its back. Thing terrified me. Of course, I was a noob. Never got too far into a FF game.

@@pocket83squared Nah, I can't stand Final Fantasy. Even the older sprite ones aren't particularly interesting despite me loveing RPGs. But while we're mentioning creatures I do love the Carbuncle creature they have. The carbuncle is a rather interesting unknown aspect of unicorn lore and heraldry.

@@pocket83squared I should probably warn you since you Google things. If you Google "carbuncle" don't search the word alone. It's a rather gross medical condition. Add the words gemstone, monster, or heraldry.

@@VagabondTE aren't carbuncles just garnets? I wasn't even aware there is a medical condition by that name...

@@VagabondTE though I did use to have a recurring dream (nightmare?) involving digging a gemstone out of an equine forehead, and images of unicorns still trigger traumas, so maybe I did know at one time of the unicorn lore.

In general, yes, but it depends on the plant. We've had the best luck with succulent-type plants using these pots. You _could_ alter the recipe for different properties: for example, using more Portland (or even the addition of sand) would make a pot that holds moisture for longer. Of course, there will also be trade-offs for doing so--like the higher weight of the vessel and the increased cement that will now leach out. As with all gardening, it'll take you some experimentation to 'get' the stuff.

Good question. I'm reasonably confident that it could be trusted. You might want to increase the Portland cement of the mix, though. Also note that it would be tough on the fish until the structure has finished leaching, which will take at least a year or two.

@@pocket83squared could I use polystyrene (styrofoam) ?

First, there _are_ smaller bags out there, if you can find them. Call around. -or- Go to your local supplier, and they'll have pallets full of the stuff. Plenty of bags get broken, so there's usually some loose powder on the ground. Explain to the kid working there that you just want to try out a cupful of the stuff, and chances are they'll just let you have it. Or ask them for a discounted smaller quantity (a broken bag).

Hmm. It won't make a difference. +/-5% is less than the error you should expect because of how compressible peat-moss is. The 3-4-5 mnemonic is a rather simple & valuable trick, so you might be asking for a ratio screw-up. ... Consider that mine lasted the better part of a decade, and those that weren't under 6" of ice all winter are still functioning as they were on year #8. My opinion (since you are here, I will assume you want it) is that the recipe should not be modified; it's not really reasonable to expect a better result. ... Besides, even if additional cement did give the result "more strength," the opportunity cost would be a heavier pot that drains slightly less well and takes longer to leach. At 25%, moss still doesn't show up until around year 6. The recipe is trust-able. Wikipedia usually knows what it's saying. Either way, good luck.

@@pocket83squared it's more how I like to look. I use 1 part peat moss, 1.5 parts vermiculite perlite blend and 1 part Portland.

Western Central PA, right on the tip-top of the Laurel highlands.

You might be thinking of Tonga or Tuvalu. Tuva is over by Mongolia. It's famous for its throat singers. That's why Feynman wanted to visit.

Thank you Tuvalu was it.

That's not entirely accurate. Water absorbed will not be enough to break Tufa apart. These have survived many winters outside. They were finally broken by becoming enmeshed within a thick layer of ice during a freak storm. Tufa properly made is loosely packed; it has spaces between it, which will provide ample room for internal water to expand during a freeze. Excess water simply runs through, because it is designed to drain. This pile was under a foot of snow which then melted and re-froze. The stresses were enough to break plastic.

Where are you located?

@@pocket83squared In Chicago, north side of town. We're currently using some unused Loyola property for our community garden.

Thought about this considerably, and I must say no. 1) Shipping it is just too expensive for a usable sample. 2) Introduction of any organism into a new environment is irresponsible without first making lots of considerations. 3) It might be illegal. Sorry about this. My impulse was to send you one, since I remember you being around here for a pretty long-time, but I think it's a pretty bad idea. As a general rule, in our gardens on this site, we try to encourage the local flora and fauna to the best of our abilities. Even though we are often selecting for species that we prefer by removing those we find undesirable, we still try not to introduce new things except where we will not compromise for reasons of utility. For example, addition of a new variety of fruit tree to enrich fertilization, or the use of goldfish (in a closed system) to control mosquito larvae. I'm becoming a bit of an ecological curmudgeon, so sending around a native plant is just plain against my better judgment. I've noticed back in my hometown that the use of decorative pear trees has now displaced much of the indigenous tree varieties. For example, contemporary garden pop-culture considers Black Locust groves to be scraggly looking, so people prefer lollipop-shaped novelty trees in their suburban landscaping. Shame, too; the Black Locust blossom has an unequaled springtime scent. Not to mention that it grows a strong wood that fluoresces, or that it has a hot-burning, fast-growing fuel. Sigh. Short-sight for appearances! Further, trees also have a sound; each species' is distinct. Locust leaves flutter quickly in the wind, which causes a certain 'fffffff' tone and appearance that is characteristic of only that. Its removal and replacement by something foreign is a small, quiet tragedy. Such is to replace an old orchard with a strip-mall. Perhaps relocating one little moss variety does not have such huge ecological reverberations, but I nevertheless refuse to adopt the pattern.

That pile of semi-broken Tufas was left outside all winter. They had already survived several winters outside, but this time, a sheet of thick ice formed in and on top of them, causing them to crush and split. The remedy would've been to have prevented them from being encased in ice in the first place. In order to make a pot that's truly ice-proof, you would have to add sand/gravel for body. That means you'll need to thicken the walls to keep the mass together. Problem is, now you've made concrete. As a material, Tufa has limitations. All things considered, 3-4-5 was/is a great recipe.

Thanks@@pocket83squared - I needed to know so I can figure out what to avoid when creating my own.

Never forget Tulpa from Ronin Warriors

And then you realize there's a Tulpa community on the internet of people purposely trying to inflict mental illness on themselves just so they can see their anime waifu IRL

And there's also Tuvok, the Vulcan who helped that guy from _One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest_ overcome his mental illness. *EDIT:* Don't google 'waifu.' At least now I know. Cartoon wife. Got it.

@@pocket83squared ahaha.. poor innocent Pocket. He has lifeu, not waifu.

A layered joke like that might end up being a washout. Maybe you should consider digging up a dirty pun instead.

@@pocket83squared I've been forbidden from using puns by my children ever since the cereal homophone debacle of 2013, in which my constant reinterpretation of the back of a cheerios box was not well received.

Thanks for the lecture. You sound really smart. Especially at the part about the "micro-frost." But I think you may've missed the point about how these actually broke. Part of Tufa's shtick is that it will withstand freezing temperatures _without_ being any worse for wear. Many of these had already endured a decade's worth of winters before finally biting the dust from a fluke, glacier-like ice storm. Now go and never leave your own where you prefer. Absolute words are like nails on a chalkboard; they're always characteristic of a preachy twit. Also, your comment was an annoying distraction.