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The Truth About Class Identity: Hearthstone Quick Take 

The Penniless Player
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Didn't see the post Blizzard made? Gotcha covered: playhearthston...
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Credits for the final image (and the image used in the middle of this vid) go to Maiconcrvg: maiconcrvg.dev...

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25 авг 2024

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Комментарии : 670   
@caddaddy5817
@caddaddy5817 5 лет назад
We need to hall of fame Forbidden Words because it’s against class identity for Priest to be able to remove 4 attack minions.
@Monica_aka_Kansas
@Monica_aka_Kansas 5 лет назад
LOL
@andrwarrior
@andrwarrior 5 лет назад
TRUE LUL
@mrsweetkandy7673
@mrsweetkandy7673 5 лет назад
Not sure if you say this joking or not, but they specified that this concerns classic/base cards who're supposed to guide new players to the class core identity. For the expansion cards however, they like to give them new directions
@andrwarrior
@andrwarrior 5 лет назад
@@mrsweetkandy7673 NOT FALSE LUL
@Codeblueninja
@Codeblueninja 5 лет назад
Prophet Velan: Double your healing effects. Others: And damage? Prophet Velan: What damage?
@Xerrash
@Xerrash 5 лет назад
Holy Smite LUL
@Notmyday2009
@Notmyday2009 5 лет назад
Hearthstone: Is time for nerf! *Hunter start to sweat* Hearthstone: YOUR AGE OF TERROR END HERE... PRIEST! Priest main: I guess I concede now!
@joshuakei8925
@joshuakei8925 5 лет назад
@@Notmyday2009 *vanish, not banish
@freewilly1193
@freewilly1193 5 лет назад
@@Notmyday2009man some punctuation and verbs. Please.
@chinyang1200
@chinyang1200 5 лет назад
Me as a Priest player : Phew ... Thank God my deck is a Kamen Rider Decade Deck this nerf doesn't hurt me
@Enja_Near
@Enja_Near 5 лет назад
Rip mind blast. I will ignore this and continue playing nomi priest.
@argumentumadhominem3977
@argumentumadhominem3977 5 лет назад
Healing is useless if it is capped at 30
@antusFireNova
@antusFireNova 5 лет назад
Appearently the idenity for Priest Is bouncing from One of the best classes to One of the worst every year Edit: wow I never got so many likes thank you all ❤️❤️❤️
@somalianpirate7305
@somalianpirate7305 5 лет назад
Purify :^)
@alexstrigle5599
@alexstrigle5599 5 лет назад
True, I think the last expansion Priest was legitimately strong in was Knights of the Frozen Throne. But hey, with the new expansion coming out, who knows what Priests can pull off
@muiltinormal8329
@muiltinormal8329 5 лет назад
Al’ Akirerino Kripperino Idk I'm pretty good w priest atm and i started with it last month
@brendenlim2158
@brendenlim2158 5 лет назад
Al’ Akirerino Kripperino uhm k&c pre nerf. Priest was still one of the TOP decks. Look at the world tournament lul
@JohnThems
@JohnThems 5 лет назад
Not true. That's also Shaman's class identity.
@NarfiRef
@NarfiRef 5 лет назад
In WoW, Shadow Priests are known for their face melting.
@dragonslair951167
@dragonslair951167 5 лет назад
They're not really known for massive burst damage, though. Mostly just DoTs and debuffs.
@remyllebeau77
@remyllebeau77 5 лет назад
@@dragonslair951167 All of the shadow priest characters I have played would beg to differ. Yes, dots are a great part of the toolkit, but mind blast and mind flay are nothing to overlook. There is a reason I will be happy to play shadow if I end up playing classic.
@dragonslair951167
@dragonslair951167 5 лет назад
@@remyllebeau77 I can't recall a single point in WoW's history where Shadow Priests were anywhere close to the best DPS for burst damage. I can recall plenty of times when they were good at multi-dotting and sustained damage, though.
@remyllebeau77
@remyllebeau77 5 лет назад
@@dragonslair951167 Thankfully, I was playing in a different area of the game.
@WeedStriker
@WeedStriker 5 лет назад
@@dragonslair951167 During Wrath you could just spam Devouring Plague because it had no cooldown + it dealt a percentage of it's total DoT damage as soon as you used it :p
@hattheduck2359
@hattheduck2359 5 лет назад
Shaman weakness: card draw and card generation Wha...what? Did blizzard have Alzheimer? Did they forgot Hagatha, mana tide totem, or underbelly angler?
@Reco-Sco
@Reco-Sco 5 лет назад
Don't forget Spirit of the frog
@knightseeker8248
@knightseeker8248 5 лет назад
Yeah, when I play that class I have to be careful not to burn my drawn cards lol
@knightseeker8248
@knightseeker8248 5 лет назад
@Vinicius Raposo is it crack? If so gimme some of that good stuff lol
@aimbotarrow5981
@aimbotarrow5981 5 лет назад
They’re also releasing a EVIL Totem that literally gives Lackeys out every turn
@christopherIF
@christopherIF 5 лет назад
Or the new generator totem
@algeanephila
@algeanephila 5 лет назад
"priest identity isn't of being able to deal huge damage frequently" Yeah That's exactly why priest use mind blast combos Because they like Need a way to win the game Unless Blizzard wants priest to IDK Keep healing throughout the whole fatigue Where they still lose to warriors?
@DT-yw4ob
@DT-yw4ob 5 лет назад
Tbf they could bring the spell that let Discipline priests of old convert all of their healing into shields for a few seconds, aka Hs healing to amor for 1 turn.
@sammerson7126
@sammerson7126 5 лет назад
Dude, you don't need damaging spells to do damage, priest is inherently a control class, take the board and buff your minions. Simple as that.
@algeanephila
@algeanephila 5 лет назад
@@sammerson7126 the thing is that priest is made to be too slow and controlish, a strictly board-related plan won't always work with that Even double divine spirit inner fire is a combo The thing that people didn't get is that mind blast isn't used as a damaging spell, very rarely you will see it in any deck that isn't OTK, at maximum you would put it in miracle priest as a 2 Mana draw, but that's it
@algeanephila
@algeanephila 5 лет назад
@@DT-yw4obthat could be cool but I don't know if it would make much difference Discipline priest sure needs a lot of implementation of Blizzard wants to make it the meta
@algeanephila
@algeanephila 5 лет назад
@@sammerson7126 I think not only that would be the problem As put by Blizzard themselves priest is not the best buffing class (it is meant to be paladin) as their buffs usually just buff health And without some way to put serious pressure it usually won't work because a strictly control tempo matchup is that, a control tempo matchup, priest don't usually get powerful minions so there wouldn't be much of a win condition except with a almost all-neutral deck and this is very limiting
@leonardoraele
@leonardoraele 5 лет назад
"With these cards priest would be able to develop a tempo strategy" > Shows two low tempo minions
@rorysmistakes
@rorysmistakes 5 лет назад
Oh god he released a video the day that an expansion announced. What is his luck?
@hector-m-carrillo
@hector-m-carrillo 5 лет назад
I interpreted the statement as, "this is what we want the class to be" not " this is what it is" So i saw this as "spring cleaning", cleaning up when doesn't fit the decor anymore. And of course deck types are going to be limited by comparison, it's the nature of creating a strong identity. The hope is that the "identifying cards" can become stronger, so the class overall goes sideways instead of nerfed/buffed. Stronger in its niche, weaker elsewhere. It's the kind of balance changes that i love in DotA. Prevents homogenization.
@illiji915
@illiji915 5 лет назад
@@Wolf_ManJack "this is what we want the class to be, not 'this is what it is'" Just because some of what they said doesn't line up with the current standard possibilities, doesn't mean they're lying. They were defining what they think the ideal class identities are so I would wait and think about this more on the next set rotation when most of the cards that break these ideal boundaries for each class rotate out and all we have is the cards they designed after making this announcement.
@TheGloriousLobsterEmperor
@TheGloriousLobsterEmperor 5 лет назад
Trust me, as a Priest main. This is perfect Priest identity and Hearthstone is actually going back to Priests identity before Gadgetzan. The worst class in the game by far!
@argumentumadhominem3977
@argumentumadhominem3977 5 лет назад
Turn two hero power and emote. The light shall burn you.
@thevomit5851
@thevomit5851 5 лет назад
Why not do rotate mind blast next expansion? I was literally the only one playing Vargoth mind blast in legend and believe me, it was not a strong deck. Blizzard basically just told me to fuck off until next expansion. What a mind bogglingly stupid decision. Nerf a tier 4 class instead of Warrior, great idea!
@daridon2483
@daridon2483 5 лет назад
@@thevomit5851 That's because it's true class identity is the ability to wave between top tier class to a literal joke one. The meta one has ended already so blizzard had to continue the tradition.
@Krasser_Crusader
@Krasser_Crusader 5 лет назад
They had us in the first half, im not gonna lie
@vjgodlybang
@vjgodlybang 5 лет назад
“Maybe, Blizzard is planning ahead, so that that weakness is exposed.” Baku, and Genn just want to speak.
@sapper12b71
@sapper12b71 5 лет назад
Hey man please dont give up please keep making vids, you're the only one I've ever truly enjoyed.
@afonsotopa9164
@afonsotopa9164 5 лет назад
Same here, a whole new expansion, come on where are you????
@maxtiemann9903
@maxtiemann9903 5 лет назад
Only issue I take with penniless' argument is that he cites what priest has been IN THE PAST. I'm pretty sure Blizzard stated that they were going to make changes to standard so that the class identity changed to be what they described. That's their justification for moving the cards out, not that Blizzard felt that the cards didn't fit with the previous identity of the class. These changes were made with the future in mind, not with the idea to ultra nerf certain class playstyles, such as combo priest (at least, that's the way I read the announcement).
@maxtiemann9903
@maxtiemann9903 5 лет назад
This is probably a relatively new decision. In case you didn't know, the cards released in each expansion are designed and tested almost a whole year ahead of time (this coming from Ben Brode's interview with the witchwood expansion.) Being a more recent decision, the blizzard team probably didn't have time to change their design plans. We might see these changes go into effect as early as the first set next year.
@paigelove2666
@paigelove2666 5 лет назад
So, a couple of things. 1. These changes cannot and should not be thought about with the current meta in mind. Rogue doesn't prolifically use vanish? Priest isn't winning with mindblast decks? That's not the point of this. That would be the point of a nerf, but this HoF is prophylactic. The point is to mitigate classic and basic cards and make them more consistently thematic. 2. On Rogue, the trouble was more than likely that there's a lot of things Vanish does that cards like sap and shadowstep don't do, and it isn't really cheap enough to use it the way you'd use shadowstep or sap. The concept of Rogue relying on cheap spells to mitigate the board and allow for tempo is counterintuitive. Further, vanish is a midrange and control bane. Any meta where Rogue is allowed to control/play for slow combo, it can do so because vanish will physically destroy cards and enable fatigue past a 10 hand size. Given the number of nerfs/HoFs directed at Rogue combo decks, (Leeching poison and Coldlight oracle, to say nothing of Caverns Below) this makes sense as a tool they don't want Rogue swimming with. It's a card that warps entirely how someone thinks about fighting Rogue and about playing minions, and is outright dangerous to maintain in Standard. A lot of cards are, but Vanish also works Uniquely. 3. I played a lot of Raza Priest and Clone Rez Priest, and as far as I'm concerned, good fucking riddance. Mindblast is a terrible card for Priest to have. Yes, one of priest's themes is "narrow but powerful spells", but the damage aspect from that comes from synergy with darkness amplifiers. Why use "your heals deal damage this turn" if you can just run the best face damage burn spell? And then Shadow Essence it? And then Vargoth it? And then Rez Velen twice and cast it a few more times? It's not only inappropriate for the classic set, it's also just annoyingly inappropriate for Priest. Should priest have high, flashy burn combos? High damage out of nowhere? Sure! But let that be from synergy and from emphasizing strong minions, rather than from mage/hunter style combos and burn. Further, all copying gets more and more dangerous if mind blast is around, as Vargoth and Shadow Essence already showed. Shadowreaper Anduin being antithetical to this idea is the point; the death knights were built from the ground up to be corrupted, twisted versions of the heroes. For some, Jaina, Rexxar, Anduin, that meant turning very far away from their class identity, and blizz said that from the start. 4. For a beginner, both of the new classic cards are better than their old counterparts, by a significant uptick. Mindblast is useless without big combo support, Radiance is at least a sigh of relief for a new player, and gives Priest meaningful baseline healing. Vanish is a clunky and useless card for beginners, but the poison battlecry may actually see a lot of play in basic/starter decks! 5. "Limitation" doesn't mean "weak". "Limitation" means "You can do this, but only with a very near and dear mechanic." Paladin CAN reduce cost, but only for specific things or by jumping through prismatic hoops, for example. How good those mechanics are, or how many there are, is irrelevant.
@autumngrace7742
@autumngrace7742 5 лет назад
all I see is the downward spiral of classic and basic sets just so players need the strong cards that go away every two years from new sets which means more money for blizzard with their “surprise mechanics” that they just love after joining up with actidivision :/
@BlueZombieBlood
@BlueZombieBlood 5 лет назад
You are the worst with video timing. Lmfao. But I'll always be here to watch your videos, no matter how many important announcement come out right before your video comes out.
@NyJoanzy
@NyJoanzy 5 лет назад
Sylvanas in WoW: "hey, remember that time I went crazy one day, burned through 6 conflicting character motivations then landed on 'evil for lolz'. Was this worse?"
@pilp5259
@pilp5259 5 лет назад
So now priest has a legendary war golem as class legendary wow well done Blizzard! Well done penniless
@sammerson7126
@sammerson7126 5 лет назад
Yeah dude, velen is only a 7/7, nothing else
@marceline9510
@marceline9510 5 лет назад
The removal of vanish hurts so much. All I had was a F2P Tog rogue and now I have 0 board clear and i'm losing a great card for bounce...damn
@uff4634
@uff4634 5 лет назад
i dont play vanish and it still works. No one is playing vanish in tog rogue. Vanish is only a thing in Pogo. Vanish change is really good to make the game better
@uff4634
@uff4634 5 лет назад
@@duckycraterisawesome2662 but for that combo you need 3 cards.
@sammerson7126
@sammerson7126 5 лет назад
Damn, almost like that's why they did it
@kilianlang3316
@kilianlang3316 5 лет назад
@@uff4634 how is it good for the game if no one plays it. that simply doesn't make any sense. seems to me they are just taking away a card that made rogue fun.
@tnylraelc
@tnylraelc 5 лет назад
Im laughing at the "class identity" break down its almost comical Hunter limitations card draw > master's call Mage limitations minion swarms > conjurer's calling Shaman weakness card generation > underbelly angler And the best one! Warrior limitations(lmao) card draw/generation > town crier, omega assembly, dr boom??
@dylanking4229
@dylanking4229 5 лет назад
Yeah remember when Control Warrior was a thing and you spent half the game armoring up, playing one minion every other turn maybe, and DRAWING/CYCLING CARDS?
@MrMarclax
@MrMarclax 5 лет назад
None of the cards you mention are part of the classic set though... Expension cards are allowed to break class identity cause they allow, for a period of time, a class to play a style of deck they shouldnt play if it were just the classic set to keep the game fresh.
@tnylraelc
@tnylraelc 5 лет назад
@@MrMarclax yeah good point guess thats why they havent made rogue any board clears lmao!
@MrMarclax
@MrMarclax 5 лет назад
@@tnylraelc who knows whats going on inside of blizzard's mind
@AziSlays
@AziSlays 5 лет назад
@@MrMarclax that still doesn't explain why they hall of famed Mind Blast.
@Andrewlik
@Andrewlik 5 лет назад
Inb4 "What do you think about Saviors of Uldaman?" and "What about that Succubus art change?!"
@lukekidsos3424
@lukekidsos3424 5 лет назад
Andrewlik apparently succubus looks terrible in the morning
@WalrushGaming
@WalrushGaming 5 лет назад
1) Making a 28/28 from a 1/7 isn't "direct damage from hand", it's a buff and health manipulation, a staple in the class. 2) Mind blast is one of the very few class cards in standard to have an effect meant specifically to damage the enemy hero, and given the health-based tendency and power of priest, it seems hard to justify in my mind. Also, Mind Blast is way too inflexible for a tempo deck like you mentioned. Put in a better late game card instead. The one problem is that board manipulation is a huge theme in rogue and although there is a lot of priest AoE support, none is in classic. 3) Rogue is a combo-oriented class, to be sure, but all of its removals is single-target and/or damage-based. Vanish is neither, and also does symmetric (usually a Warlock theme) clear (A specific rogue weakness like hunter's) and is honestly weird given that Vanish in Wow works more like Valeera Hero card's battlecry.
@dicemm5544
@dicemm5544 5 лет назад
Great, factual, analysis of the concept and mechanic of the card and comparing it to similar cards with similar themes.
@patrickbateman8217
@patrickbateman8217 5 лет назад
We won't nerf the actual problem in wild:Big Priest But we will nerf Priest in standard even tho it's not a problem cuz class identity
@johangodojolo8652
@johangodojolo8652 5 лет назад
That's because they dont care about wild. The whole reason they made it is so they dont have ti care about any more. The only time they will step in is in big cases like the giant problem.
@headhunter335
@headhunter335 5 лет назад
@@johangodojolo8652 yeah, the giant problem and apparently Aviana. I hate them so much for considering wild format like a junkyard. Most of the people don't even try wild because of blizzard treating like a junkyard with no hope, where all the shit goes after its life period.
@GeekProdigyGuy
@GeekProdigyGuy 5 лет назад
@@headhunter335 Blizzard doesn't care about wild as a competitive format. There's nothing particularly wrong with that. Wild is still fun, and the meta is probably not even close to solved, as people mostly just play variations of archetypes that were in standard, but with a few OP additions outside of that archetype's standard rotation.
@AziSlays
@AziSlays 5 лет назад
@@headhunter335 which is ironic because Giants were less problematic than Big Priest. Giants could be used by every class and were usually used to supplement other win cons.
@headhunter335
@headhunter335 5 лет назад
@@AziSlays blizzard employes simply do drugs, that's my explanation
@karlcardell1276
@karlcardell1276 5 лет назад
If in priest every becomes op in the future, just know I main'ed him during this dark time.
@argumentumadhominem3977
@argumentumadhominem3977 5 лет назад
You mean pre Raza reaper times?
@illiji915
@illiji915 5 лет назад
If priest ever hits Raza levels again I am uninstalling the game.
@OnEiNsAnEmOtHeRfUcKa
@OnEiNsAnEmOtHeRfUcKa 5 лет назад
Same. I've been a F2P Wild Priest Main ever since I joined in the Old Gods expansion. Started with mainly Divine Spirit/Inner Fire decks, but eventually ended up with my own personal abomination called RenoQuest over time. People gave me a lot of shit in the Raza days, but I was already on that path, I didn't give a fuck if it was good or not. Still play it post-nerf. Anduin's my fucking boy. So polite I'd never want to replace him with an alternate Priest hero even if I did have one.
@WanderingQuill
@WanderingQuill 5 лет назад
I agree. I loved priest but haven’t really been able to play it much. With this it feels like they nerfed a class that was already struggling
@thesword8015
@thesword8015 5 лет назад
Fair point. I have always had a soft-spot for Priest (mostly because the class was garbage in the past and I like making decent decks out of bad cards) so I know what you mean.
@remyllebeau77
@remyllebeau77 5 лет назад
I was having a fair amount of success with a version of tempo priest that relied on having a one drop (0/2 deathrattle gnome) that you buffed with extra arms, and then you try to close games with mind blast. That is over once they put in the changes.
@devin3944
@devin3944 5 лет назад
Mind blast is a must in alot of priest decks they shouldnt have taken it out of the classic set, even if they will be releasing lesser versions of mindblast each expansion
@thesword8015
@thesword8015 5 лет назад
@@devin3944 Even though Mind Blast is most likely a design restriction. Have you ever thought of why Priest gets so many bad cards? It's because Mind Blast is a lot of damage in one card that can be combined with Velen to make an outrageous combo. Velen has more than one purpose, so do not say that he should be Hall of Famed. Overall, without mindblast in standard, the designers can creatively make newer and better cards for Priest in the future, therefore making Priest stronger in more ways than just burst damage.
@devin3944
@devin3944 5 лет назад
@@thesword8015 then nerf mindblast damage... I understand what you are saying, but this is just wrong. If you think a 5 damage spell is restricting, you dont get what actually makes a card restrictive. Baku and Genn are great examples of cards that limit design creativity, since they both heavily impact the start of the game, without even needing to be played. Plus they force the balance team to rethink the mana cost choices for new cards. Overall I don't believe the reason for removing mind blast was reasonable. To me it seems like they want to just make more money by releasing new versions mindblast like cards per expansion.
@JBeezyForever
@JBeezyForever 5 лет назад
Y'all remember Purify? Betcha wish that shit was happening, doncha Priest mains?
@boofiman6082
@boofiman6082 5 лет назад
What do you think about the thicc cards losing their dummy size?
@pikapals41
@pikapals41 5 лет назад
Pass The Boof Man what do you mean?
@boofiman6082
@boofiman6082 5 лет назад
Cards like succubus and secret keeper are getting new art. The succubus is even being changed to Felhound
@gastrid206
@gastrid206 5 лет назад
They took away the thiccness from secret keeper 😞
@pablovirus
@pablovirus 5 лет назад
wha, really? where did they said that??
@FirewolfClash
@FirewolfClash 5 лет назад
pablovirus i think they didn't announce it big but they wanted to make the game "family friendly"
@orangesilver8
@orangesilver8 5 лет назад
Wasn't Blizzard always open about not wanting powerful combo decks? It's because the way Hearthstone works combos are often uninteractive for the other player, so if the combo is good then you kind of just can't do anything.
@nohbody987
@nohbody987 5 лет назад
I feel ya. I was floored when Bliz announced their recent card changes. I can only assume they want to take away cards we already have in order to print new cards that fall into similar categories instead of looking to expand class ideas
@thesword8015
@thesword8015 5 лет назад
That's probably the case. They most likely want Priest to have a new personality later on in this expansion. Hell, they are about to gain a twisting nether that silences minions before that next expansion. Clearly they have something BIG planned that they don't want Mind Blast disrupting with.
@RaventhortheWarrior
@RaventhortheWarrior 5 лет назад
So I agree with you for the mosy part, but I have some Devil's Advocate arguments. Let's start with shadowreaper anduin. The DK's are, in my opinion, the antithesis to most of the classes, and some of those are extreme. Hunters werent good with control or generation, and got it. Mages weren't good with healing, and got it. Priests werent designed for pings or reach, and got it. And anduin, shadowform, etc, could all be seen as board control tools (gaining pings) more than face damage, even if that's the only way they were used. Think about how few face-targetting abilities have been released for priest: shadowreaper anduin, and....well, healing spells with auchenai. That's it. Mind blast is the most efficient burn spell in the game. Fireball, which is sort of known as THE face spell, is 2 mana more for 1 damage. Mind blast wasnt just combo. It was a permanent staple. Removing it gives design space to print the 'limited' burn spells in expansions without reaching a critical mass with priest. Mind blast made it impossible to ever print damage spells. Think how impossible it was ALREADY to get out of range of shadowreaper, or spellstone OTK priest. Warriors would get to 140 armor and still die. Yes, other combos like that exist, but is that actually healthy? I actually believe priest has always been designed to not have face damage. It just bastardized the control tools it got. And for reference, this is from someone who grinded to top 100 legend with razakhus dragon priest, which used that nice mind blast ping finisher. I wholeheartedly agree with rogue. I agree that they're hurting priest when it already has so little. But I don't agree with them being liars or going against what they've done. It seems pretty in line, from my perspective. But I think there's weight to both arguments, and I enjoy hearing the perspective of someone who dislikes this change, it opened my eyes to the reality of burn priest. And yeah, rip that surrender to madness lackey priest dream :^( Edit: holy fucking wall of text. Typing on mobile made me really not realize the thesis I was producing.
@leotamer5
@leotamer5 5 лет назад
DK Shaman, DK Druid, DK Warrior, DK Paladin, DK Rogue, and DK Warlock are all perfectly in flavor. DK priest is in flavor for shadow priest, which was in the core set with its on-play effect being mass shadow word: death (a basic set card) and your hero power is a strong variant of when you are in shadowform (a core set card) and has a name that is referential of it (void form) And it is arguably that Frost Lich Jaina is a reference to frost mages, which had a lot of surviability with ice block and aoe freeze. And so the only deathknight that strays far from the themes of its base class is hunter, which is potentially more so due to the nature of hunter as a fast, face deck and how lower cost hero cards are harder to design because of how impactful and complex they are.
@IIXzmozXII
@IIXzmozXII 5 лет назад
The problem with Mind Blast is that it inflicts DIRECT face damage all in one turn and you being unable to play around it, while the Divine Spirt/Inner FIre combo allows your opponent to respond to the threat. In short, Priest is supposed to lack "burn".
@kongxu4582
@kongxu4582 5 лет назад
Can you play around a fireball??? And in wow theres "shadow" priest that has insane dmg
@illiji915
@illiji915 5 лет назад
@@kongxu4582 is priest a mage? no, didn't think so. Also you can play around fireball by pressuring the mage into using it for minion removal and thereby preventing 6 to your face. I see a lot of people making the "but there's such thing as shadow priests in wow" argument a lot so here's the actual comparison between WoW priest and HS priest. In WoW they choose to specialize in healing or damage. In HS They are like being both at the same time. No sort of shadow spec requirement on Mind Blast means any priest can cast it for full damage. I think maybe they should print some cards and change shadow form. Maybe have shadow form give them like +1 spell power or something. There's a couple other ideas I have on the matter but the specifics of it aren't as important as the point I was trying to make. Basically, Priest needs a way to choose holy/disc type cards and affects or shadow type. Mind Blast as a card isn't the problem. The problem is there's no trade-off required for priest to access such a strong burn face card/strategy.
@juhopeltonen467
@juhopeltonen467 5 лет назад
Omfg just when i opened zereks cloning gallery and malygos
@danrideout7295
@danrideout7295 5 лет назад
Class identity? For over a year Druid could draw as many cards as they wanted, gain infinite armor, kill anything and Blizzard did nothing. But sure. Why not take Priests out back and shoot em.
@calebsklena903
@calebsklena903 5 лет назад
Dan Rideout I cried at this comment
@zisopblackman2878
@zisopblackman2878 5 лет назад
For the record druid sucked at hard removal
@dicemm5544
@dicemm5544 5 лет назад
@@zisopblackman2878 They seem to think that class identity is a bad thing and that it didn't exist until now, whereas if you listen to arena players talk about class identity defying cards like Dark Iron Shulker, Keeper of Uldaman and Naturalize throught out all these years, you'll see how all this up roar is not only stupid, but if they were to do it they should have done it the moment the Hall of Fame came into existence. Constructed players are literally the worst at analysing the basics of this game, for they never think of them because the game has become more complex and combos are always more than the sum of their parts, therefore making you think of each individual part less. And let's be honest, 95% of the people who play hearthstone aren't deck builders. People making competitive and meme decks are the people who are the deck builders, not the rest of them who netdeck it.
@milosuscumlic4095
@milosuscumlic4095 5 лет назад
This always happened before blizzard announce something that was to op with that card. They don't want to limit card desings. I know this are REALY bead news for clasic set but ,maybe something better show up. Also radince is the WORST card in the game...for now.
@thesword8015
@thesword8015 5 лет назад
YES! I agree 100%. Mind Blast can be considered quite a restrictive card. Therefore, getting rid of it creates a more flexible version of Priest. Who knows? Priest may turn out to be GODLIKE with this new design space.
@LemorasCards
@LemorasCards 5 лет назад
The problem is they're trading the permanent staple of what is essentially priests only consistent win condition, with having to print new ones every standard year so priest has some way compete. Which is what I think the big nerfs to classic is doing wrong, we're getting huge shifts in class identity every year to where we might as well not even have classes at this point.
@nileboy5055
@nileboy5055 5 лет назад
@@LemorasCards Not to mention making wild priest insanely strong
@Crawdithe98
@Crawdithe98 5 лет назад
Um, excuse me, but did you forget about Acidmaw? Millhouse? Duskfallen Avianna? Harbinger Celestia? Majordomo? Flame Leviathan? Cursed Blade? The Boogymonster? Honestly, I can go on if you like, but I'm too lazy, so here's a list instead: hearthstone.gamepedia.com/Worst_cards
@afridge8608
@afridge8608 5 лет назад
@@LemorasCards what competitive priest deck runs mind blast XD only competitive priest deck is nomi a deck made amost entirly by spells that doesnt even run mind blast
@EnderPryde
@EnderPryde 5 лет назад
Penniless... the issue with vanish is that it isn't a *weak* board clear, just a generic power level board clear that lends itself specifically to non interactive play patterns. Combo rogues are typically the go to decks that use it, but historically it has also included Kingsbane, mill rogue, malyrogue, and miracle rogue, which haven't always been *good* decks, but have always been frustrating decks because they often win or lose by very non interactive means. As for mind blast... I think Blizzard is more OK with damage in priest in expansions, rather than the base set, since its easier to meter what level of surprise damage is available with rotating sets, rather than an evergreen card like mindblast. Shadowreaper Anduin is OK because it was only in the standard meta for a year and a half. Divine spirit inner fire is OK to be evergreen because it requires more steps to make it OTK your opponent (having a big minion, having it survive, and collecting the combo pieces). Auchenai is OK because it adds a bulky, inefficient 4 mana card into the mix of costs for combo pieces, and adding it to revive pools is very inefficient since the card itself is not much of a threat on its own, where velen and Malygos are legitimate threats as 7/7s and 4/12s respectively, and good face healing you can aim at the opponent is limited to expansion sets. But mind blast OTKs often don't have counterplay options available for every class, while everybody COULD play around inner fire OTKs with sufficient taunts/secrets/transform/kill/minion combat.
@Freekymoho
@Freekymoho 5 лет назад
No one actually buys that mind blast somehow violated the sacred, true class identity of priest. It was litterally in there since launch, they've had years and years to decide that mindblast wasn't appropriate.
@KaiGaiNikiCh
@KaiGaiNikiCh 5 лет назад
A lot of people say Priest players are complaining about mind blast being HOF-ed but frankly the problem with why we all are crying foul is what they REPLACED mind blast with
@zjorritte1634
@zjorritte1634 5 лет назад
Good to see you're still alive Penniless. I agree with what you're saying, those class identities come really out of the blue. Anchoring a class to a determined identity I think makes the variability in classes very low, especially if they continue to print cards that only fits their 'class identity'. Hard to make whacky ideas like control rogue or whatever work if they only print cards for tempo oriented decks.
@lyca7016
@lyca7016 5 лет назад
Priest's class identity is losing so they had to remove face damage.
@SeisoYabai
@SeisoYabai 5 лет назад
While I agree with your conclusion, your premise is pretty distinctly flawed with Mind Blast. Blizzard is saying that Priest is not supposed to deal direct face damage from the hand, while you're comparing that to expensive options/combos that give you the ability to deal more damage to *any* target, through either minions or your hero power, or converting healing into damage. A card in Magic that reads "Deal 3 damage to a monster," "Deal 3 damage to target player," or "deal 3 damage to any target" are vastly different and often incur a higher mana cost.
@thezuccubus
@thezuccubus 5 лет назад
Why is everyone saying he failed due to the new expansion? The logo can be seen near the end of the video.
@SebastienPatriote
@SebastienPatriote 5 лет назад
Blizzard is pusshing more and more players to ignore standard and play wild instead.
@robertlupa8273
@robertlupa8273 2 года назад
"Apparently, the concept of Priest being anything other than control is a forbidden idea at Blizzard HQ." United in Stormwind Shadow Aggro Priest: *Hello.*
@dioguito
@dioguito 5 лет назад
Blizzard: Removes 2 common cards and nerf preparation instead of the aggro deck itself Me : loses hundreds of dollars spent in packs to do cool combo decks that I like that WERE NEVER VIABLE COMPETITIVELY
@illiji915
@illiji915 5 лет назад
just because your decks weren't competitively viable doesn't mean prep wasn't broken AF dude
@OnEiNsAnEmOtHeRfUcKa
@OnEiNsAnEmOtHeRfUcKa 5 лет назад
Shouldn't have given them that much money in the first place, no offense.
@jonasboel2473
@jonasboel2473 5 лет назад
If preist can't deal face damage. How to are they going to win?
@sammerson7126
@sammerson7126 5 лет назад
By using their minions, like every other class
@andreamaffeis1512
@andreamaffeis1512 5 лет назад
@@sammerson7126 Because u win with minion, SURE! Not kill command, fireball, eviscerate, soulfire, hellfire for control lock/even lock it's PURE reach, or continuing: savage roar, and bloodlust maybe save from here, but still spell. Lava burst, holywrath(particular deck but still spell) Onlyone can safe here: Warrior and STRANGELY, it's a tier 4 in wild. Think at what are u writing man... it's a hint. Friendly purpose:)
@kronniichiwa9909
@kronniichiwa9909 5 лет назад
@@sammerson7126 but then were is the class identity
@sammerson7126
@sammerson7126 4 года назад
@@andreamaffeis1512 That's still technically winning with minions. Besides, you just went on about spells, when the discussion is about class identity. You also forgot about how Warrior has Mortal Strike. And I should be thinking about what I type. Priest is all about healing, big minions and powerful but slow effects, not just a quick 2 mana deal 5.
@sammerson7126
@sammerson7126 4 года назад
@@kronniichiwa9909 In their spells, like Radiance, Shadow Words, Power Words and Mass Resurrection
@Tike22
@Tike22 5 лет назад
The thing I don't understand is that just because classes have weaknesses doesn't mean that shouldn't have options to help support lessen that weakness. Rogue shouldn't have board clears yes, but they should have access to weak ones, same goes for the case of Preist. The "balance change" was done purely because they just didn't want them in standard.
@thesword8015
@thesword8015 5 лет назад
Easy point here. Rouge HAS weak board clears, at least one. Fan Of Knives. That card can be used with spell damage to boost the power of the card, making it a decent board clear. Not to mention the potential of Unidentified Contract which can sometimes deal with 3 minions. The Mind Blast switch did not align with the class identities, yes. But it did align with opening up design space for Priest in general.
@Peace-fw7ul
@Peace-fw7ul 5 лет назад
Hey , Penniless . I've read your last Patreon post regarding your struggles and I am just checking to see if everything is alright . You got a big community that supports you no matter what ! . Loads of love and stay safe .
@marnea1
@marnea1 2 года назад
What exactly were these struggles? I'm only asking because I used to watch this guy pretty regularly and I was always curious what happened to him, and why he abandoned his channel right when he seemed to be on the upswing.
@daniellee5084
@daniellee5084 5 лет назад
The thing is mind blast is a card soley meant for face while the other cards can be used for controlling the board.
@fabimoor5128
@fabimoor5128 5 лет назад
Unpopular opinion, dying spontaneously as any control class is no fun, and hurts my soul... It hurts so so much...
@davidhearn356
@davidhearn356 5 лет назад
Priest is one of those classes that you hate when it's strong but love every other time
@DuckApproved
@DuckApproved 5 лет назад
Yeah but isn't it super fun losing to the same mind blast combo deck every year? I also love the divine spirit/inner fire deck every year also. Absolutely thrilling.
@griz276
@griz276 5 лет назад
If you can't see that coming and mitigate it by taking away key pieces or shutting it down early then that's on you, not the combo.
@DuckApproved
@DuckApproved 5 лет назад
@@griz276 Say that to the people who lost to that deck in any pro tournament my guy. Aka Malygos and Velen ressurect priest
@imthisrandomguy
@imthisrandomguy 5 лет назад
Man, so glad I found your channel, enjoying the content a lot so far. Cheers from your new sub :)
@geld1gelld422
@geld1gelld422 5 лет назад
The worst decision is remove the booty from the secret kepper
@papapiggie6697
@papapiggie6697 5 лет назад
I think it would be cool if you did an in-depth analysis of the history of every class in the game
@joshuakei8925
@joshuakei8925 5 лет назад
Priest mains: I guess we play wild now... Oh look! Its this insanely op deck called big priest! Wooooo hooooo I can't stop winning! Fuck standard, I'm staying in wild forever!!!! And so more players go to wild
@joelpettersson4055
@joelpettersson4055 5 лет назад
I’m only enjoying hearthstone when I’m playing wild. Sure it’s dumb and unpredictable but man, it’s altleast fun.
@watermalone2309
@watermalone2309 5 лет назад
I like wild because I really like the cards I use to have. All the variation makes any deck work.
@adamxue6096
@adamxue6096 5 лет назад
Why aren't everyone in wild yet? You get to play our lord and Savior Yogg Saron so I don't see what makes you stay in standard...
@jansommer5735
@jansommer5735 5 лет назад
Adam Xue because I disenchanted my wild cards to craft newer cards
@adamxue6096
@adamxue6096 5 лет назад
@@jansommer5735 Well, in my honest opinion you made some big time mistakes. You are here to have fun, unless you plan on hitting legend and is working very hard on that or is actually attending at tournaments etc. But otherwise, keep the wild cards, you are going to be able to pull off stupid combos in wild, with friends, and you can laugh and actually have fun. If you disenchant everything, you will be at a great disadvantage later on when you want to play with these cards since disenchanting is a huge net loss.
@ZerFayt
@ZerFayt 5 лет назад
As a combo player, I would love to see a format for hearthstone where they have all the cards in their original state.
@narayanafry3314
@narayanafry3314 5 лет назад
Been playing for a few years now, and I played a lot of Mind Blast decks and played against a lot of Mind Blast decks. All class identity talk aside, aren't you a little over the card? It's not exactly like it provides interesting interactions beyond assembling spell damage buffs for it. It's not like you can't still do that in wild.
@AriharaNanami773
@AriharaNanami773 5 лет назад
1:10 ‘hunters can go to face’ made my day
@thevomit5851
@thevomit5851 5 лет назад
I was like the one person playing Vargoth mind blast priest in legend. Yeah nerf my deck and not warrior, makes so much sense! I was maybe gonna play a bit this season but I guess I'll just sit this one out and do my dailies. Great job Blizzard!
@CallMeHector
@CallMeHector 4 года назад
I came back after the new revamp for priest 4:37 Well, Penny, Blizzard just got rid of them all, plus Divine Spirit
@MrGetownedLP
@MrGetownedLP 5 лет назад
I hear your pain but I played the most at the height of Raza Priest, and am still bitter over that
@mochapoke3100
@mochapoke3100 5 лет назад
I personally think they should have made a proper board clear for priest to be in the standard set so they don't have to keep printing replacements, it's only gonna get worse in wild ( where priest has like 7 different boardclears)
@argumentumadhominem3977
@argumentumadhominem3977 5 лет назад
Excavated evil would be fine
@SordMasta
@SordMasta 5 лет назад
you are right, but i also agree with bliz that combo decks should not be that prominent. i have played plenty of OTK mage and priest, and while it works great, it feel like playing solo at the mercy of your draw.
@RobertN734
@RobertN734 5 лет назад
To make your point, you need to prove: 1) burn spells are an identity of Priest, and 2) that changing that identity is bad. You never actually made an argument for why the change is bad, just that it is. You said both that class identity is arbitrary and up to Blizzard to define, which leaves room for them to change their mind. You came close when you brought up the other Shadow Priest-themed cards, however you missed one clear distinction: all those cards can deal damage to the board, while Mind Blast can't. Those Shadow cards aren't burn damage, they're control tools. The Inner Fire combos are also significantly different, because the opponent can be proactive about denying them. Mind Blast is the only priest card that exclusively deals face damage. Blizzard initially imagined that as a path to take Priest design, but after several years they realized they don't want burn combos to exist in Priest.
@mirkofraccastoro7573
@mirkofraccastoro7573 5 лет назад
Great video, put into words all the messy negative toughts i had about theese changes
@jumusjumbuck
@jumusjumbuck 5 лет назад
There's plenty of cards that needed nerfing/hall of fame before Vanish/Mind Blast, Savage Roar for example.
@doc99ism
@doc99ism 5 лет назад
Priest can (naturally) our heal everyone and poison rouge sounds legitimate
@zafoulis
@zafoulis 5 лет назад
Mind blast as face damage i think they referring to the fact that it doesn't need the player to Target the enemy hero. So it goes not only through taunts but through "your hero cant be targeted with hero powers or spells" effect (with that neutral minion that i cannot remember its name). So it's the directest face damage that can exist.
@dend1
@dend1 5 лет назад
Blizzard was right to get rid of vanish. I drop a board of expensive minions, rogue shouldn't be returning it all to my hand at once as if they are a defensive class
@autumngrace7742
@autumngrace7742 5 лет назад
But then what would rogues do? That just completely stops the control/combo variant of rogue from literally existing. I am not a fan of rogue but I don’t think limiting rogues to tempo for eternity is a good sign
@PanAndScanBuddy
@PanAndScanBuddy 5 лет назад
Re: Vanish - if you or your opponent have near to or a full hand, every vanished card over hand limit dies. I'm surprised we haven't seen Bomb Rogue pulling off a huge combo by filling the board with bombs, filling their hand, and then playing Vanish.
@PanAndScanBuddy
@PanAndScanBuddy 5 лет назад
Mind Blast is the card that Priests reach for whenever there is a Tavern Brawl that lets them duplicate that card. It sucks the fun out of it.
@ReganSpor
@ReganSpor 5 лет назад
I know why they got rid of vanish. Imagine: 10 Mana. Hero power, Zephyrs, Vanish. Next turn, repeat, and do so for the rest of the game.
@andreaskarlsson5251
@andreaskarlsson5251 5 лет назад
Inner fire doesn't deal damage from hand. It buffs a minion that then deals damage. They're different things...
@p.a.r.c1694
@p.a.r.c1694 5 лет назад
It's like amputate your kid's feets because he is growing.
@67tedward
@67tedward 5 лет назад
4:06 I just want to mention that before leeching poison was nerfed, vanish was oppressively strong in wild kingsbane rogue (at least vs control and midrange decks). This is because the deck would mill you super hard, making the only play for you to dump your hand on the board. But then vanish comes out as an ultra-high tempo card that puts all the shit back in your hand so you resume being milled. The fact this happened means that vanish isn't an inherently weak card, but more dependent on synergies with other cards to show its true strength. When incorporated alongside powerful mill tools, vanish becomes easily the best board clear in the game. But that's such a rare occurrence anyway, especially with coldlight oracle + brann being wild, which are the only two cards that even allow mill rogue to exist. Despite that, it has to be said that vanish existing might limit card development when it comes to rogue decks that don't care about if the opponent has card advantage (as it is with many combo decks). Or your theory, that blizzard hates combo decks, could be reasonable, as combo decks are where vanish shines.
@yotamshitrit6820
@yotamshitrit6820 5 лет назад
What hurts me most is knowing new players won't get the learning experience of understanding why 5 damage to face is really bad if you don't have a plan. Trying and failing to make Mind Blast work in different decks really elevated me as a player during the first year of playing.
@67tedward
@67tedward 5 лет назад
The funny thing is that taking away mind blast from priest makes its class legendary completely obsolete. Prophet Velen is now the worst classic class legendary in standard, being only ever used to double the damage of burn, and now priest has no good burn.
@raikaria3090
@raikaria3090 5 лет назад
x2 Divine Spirit Inner Fire: 3 card combo that requires a card to stick on board a turn beforehand [And not lose most it's HP] Mind Blast: 1 card
@cheezuschrist588
@cheezuschrist588 5 лет назад
Mind last: 5 damage Divine Spirit Inner Fire: at least 30 probably
@returnosf5043
@returnosf5043 5 лет назад
I've gotta disagree here: 'deal 5 damage *specifically* to the enemy hero' is a hunter card.
@danebengeschissen
@danebengeschissen 5 лет назад
They have it for 3 mana, its called kill command!
@leotamer5
@leotamer5 5 лет назад
Critical mass is a thing.
@johnshifflet
@johnshifflet 5 лет назад
Penniless was so pissed about Mind Blast that he just peaced out of Hearthstone entirely haha
@AaronMichaelLong
@AaronMichaelLong 5 лет назад
Hearthstone has been RNG-driven shit since Goblins & Gnomes. The designers have two goals: 1) putting in surprise mechanics, because most of their promoters are streamers, and streaming isn't built around sound strategy and out-playing your opponent, but randomness and memes. 2) Extracting money from players, because they all want to earn their paychecks, and quality cards from the basic set are downward pressure on making money from the tiny fraction of their player base who wallet-warrior their way to victory.
@Jaigarful
@Jaigarful 5 лет назад
Its been RNG nonsense since Vanilla. Ragnaros, Slyvanas, Knife Juggler's knifes could single handedly determine who wins the game. Nat Pagle draw, etc. Its all been there since the beginning.
@christina.morris
@christina.morris 5 лет назад
They've been chipping away at iconic elements of the classes for a long time, and for me, this latest round was probably the straw that broke the camel's back. I've never been so *unexcited* for a new HS expansion, but the direction they're taking the game just isn't for me. Their him-hawing about identity when they're actually making changes that gut core parts of the class's historical identities especially grates on me in this case. But oh well. I had a lot of fun during my couple of years with the game.
@dioguito
@dioguito 5 лет назад
Fucked up on diablo, on Overwatch,WOW and now HS. Blizzard wants to go bankrupt
@JohnSmith-kb4re
@JohnSmith-kb4re 5 лет назад
With the amount of bad choices Blizz has been making I won't be surprised if they introduce a loot box system to Classic
@johangodojolo8652
@johangodojolo8652 5 лет назад
The HS fuck ups have already passed. Right now it's in a really good place. If you asked me like 3 months ago I would have agreed but Rise of Shadows was a really good expansion with a lot of meta diversity. The mind blast rotation is gonna have a very small effect on the game in general.
@WoodsRunner
@WoodsRunner 5 лет назад
I know your upset but I think you’re too generous with descriptions. For all intents and purposes, banish is a board clear, and mind blast is the strongest face damage spell. With that in mind, besides mind blast priest doesn’t have “face damage”. Shadowform and velen can be used for minion destruction, and in conjunction can be used to slowly deal damage over time. As well, inner fire combo should not be compared to mind blast, period. This is like comparing mimirons head with quest mage, just because they’re combos doesn’t mean you can compare. One is direct damage with a spell, the other is a combo of spell cards used to allow a minion on the field to deal lethal damage.
@thatsprettymint1942
@thatsprettymint1942 5 лет назад
I think your point about class identity being malleable is true, but you also have to recognize the fact that expansions rotate and so those cards that shaped a class' identity in one expansion go away for newer cards to take their place and once again alter the identity of the class. Classic and base set cards will never go away unless they're moved to the hall of fame of course. Blizzard wanted the framework of each class to have a certain identity, and while vanish by itself didn't really alter rogue's identity, mind blast in my opinion (along with Blizzard's) did for priest as no other cars does direct face damage only in the history of priest's collection. Edit: Also, cards that turn healing into damage don't exactly fit inside the same bracket as mind blast. Same with inner fire and divine spirit, as while they do end up being used to buff a high health minion to hit the opponent in the face for massive damage, they're still buff cards at the end of the day and can be used for other things aside from hitting face, as can cards that turn healing into damage. Mind blast is restricted to face damage, the other cards are not. Second edit: Priest doesn't need mind blast to win and their "combo" deck history boils down to hitting their opponents in the face with a beefed up mind blast. They haven't had other combo decks, unless you count anduin priest, which hit their opponent in the face with their hero power until they died...not much of a combo going on there. That sort of "combo" deck, in both cases, doesn't promote interactive play and often only lost to either their combo pieces being burned or their opponent rushing them down with aggro before the priest was able to burst them down.
@WyvernKnightBright
@WyvernKnightBright 5 лет назад
Inner Fire and Divine Spirit was the combo win condition of Wall Priest, a Tier 1 deck, until Kobolds and Ungoro rotatated. It was also the win condition of Ungoro Silence Priest, and Test Subject OTK, which resulted in a horde of Stonetusk Boars smashing in face. As for direct face damage in Priest historically, Shadowbomber and Spawn of Shadows tried to encourage more aggro/tempo builds of Priest with Direct face damage. They never worked in Standard because Priest didn't have good 2 or 3 drops.
@alejandrom.
@alejandrom. 5 лет назад
Vanish was used in fatigue Rogue and Kingsbane Rogue too, not only Quest, fortunately Preparation and the lifesteal poison were nerfed.
@TheMRFIRE999
@TheMRFIRE999 5 лет назад
-play rez preist -play the discount kelthusad leg -play the guy who casts a random spell you cast last turn -resurect 2 copies of the spellslinger minion -now have 3-4 of the guy on board -play mindblast -25 burst damage from hand
@matriox1v9
@matriox1v9 5 лет назад
The worst mistake Blizzard made was removing 3 card sets from standard each rotation instead of adding 1 and removing 1
@spikkle2627
@spikkle2627 5 лет назад
This idea of setting in stone the class identities is an excellent way to make the game stagnate. Aren't Blizz always going on about 'not limiting their design space'?
@thesword8015
@thesword8015 5 лет назад
Truth right here.
@dn272
@dn272 4 года назад
Well its nice that blizzard eventually redefined priest as a buff class that doesnt have damage with ashes of outland, justifying their decision.
@jdecker7
@jdecker7 5 лет назад
You hit the reason at 6:06. Mind blast has always been a part of that plan. They cant make more cards in the vein of mind blast because of mind blast. I'm guessing we will see cards that can fill the void of mind blast printed soon. Though I would rather have mind blast
@TigerKirby215
@TigerKirby215 5 лет назад
I kinda agree with the Vanish nerf since it effectively gave "the class with Preparation" a weaker version of Psychic Scream. Yes Vanish is nowhere close to Psychic Scream in terms of power level, but the point still stands that Rogue's ability to deny multiple turns of value was really overwhelming to certain decks. Sap is already regarded as one of the strongest cards in Arena because of the tempo swing, and Vanish is literally Sap over multiple turns. All that being said I think removing Rogue's only tool against wider boards was a really bad move. Rogue should've been given something else like a spell that would destroy a few random minions at once or they could've brought back Rogue secrets and made one that would sap an enemy that attacks you. (Lol Freezing Trap but imo Freezing Trap also really conflicts with class identity)
@anormalstopsign74
@anormalstopsign74 5 лет назад
Thinking vanish is sap over multiple turns is pretty ridiculous. Sap is SO much better
@user-et3xn2jm1u
@user-et3xn2jm1u 5 лет назад
Vanish doesn't deny any value, it only denies tempo, which is Rogue's whole schtick.
@kovacsistvanhetfield
@kovacsistvanhetfield 5 лет назад
Instead of helping priest to be playable they say: Anduin go heal yourself
@unkarsthug4429
@unkarsthug4429 5 лет назад
It's pretty sad. My favorite deck type is combo.
@danebengeschissen
@danebengeschissen 5 лет назад
True , the amount of planning your turns is just so much fun
@unkarsthug4429
@unkarsthug4429 5 лет назад
@@danebengeschissen Well, it's control with an actual solid win condition.
@qurkeymusic7485
@qurkeymusic7485 5 лет назад
I get the kind of argument being made and it does make sense. For vanish, I agree that it seems like it wasn't an issue of class identity as that is within rogue theme, however the issue it probably covers up is in the design space you are allowed to have when rogue has access to that kind of answer. Blizzard has already done this in the past when they nerfed rogues ability to grant stealth to minions to stealth for one turn (conceal, master of disguise). For mind blast however I think I can see what blizzard is going for. Mind blast is clearly on the shadow side of priest, but all the other shadow cards priest has follow the rule of "power with some limitation", shadow words pain and death kill minions for low mana costs, but only some minions. Shadowform makes your hero power deal damage, but you can't heal with it anymore. Forbidden words can kill a minion at any power (up to 10), but it spends all your mana. Mind blast breaks this with a flat, here is some damage, which, is a card that rogue already almost exactly has with sinister strike, at 1 mana deal 3 instead of 2 mana deal 5. I think blizzard definately could have done a much better job of explaining their decisions (I'm not even sure if they know their own class identities at this point) but I think there is an argument to be made for their side of the mind blast hall of fame. Radiance is still really bad though.
@sammerson7126
@sammerson7126 5 лет назад
This video is very misdirected. Vanish had the same problem as Coldlight, it could burn entire hands and also kill minions, remember how sending to a full hand works? Shadowreaper Anduin was never meant for face, it was meant for board control, hence the battlecry. How the fuck does shadow word death prove that priest does burst? Priest has always been a controlling class, and while radiance could do with some tweaking, I think that the removal of mind blast was needed. The divine spirit inner fire combo isn't damage from hand, its like saying your minions are from hand damage because they came from your hand.
@EXOdagr8t
@EXOdagr8t 4 года назад
Blizzard : We're removing mind blast! Playerbase : Only took you 6 months after zerek priest doing it's thing Blizzard : We're removing class bias from discover cards Playerbase : WHEN ODD PALADIN WAS DOING TARIM AND TYRION IT WASN"T AN ISSUE?!
@JeremyHoffman
@JeremyHoffman 5 лет назад
Easy there, tiger. You don't have to accuse a game's development team of "lying" when you disagree with a change or the explanation. You can have a difference of opinion on the best direction to take the game -- that doesn't necessarily make it a malicious "lie" on their part.
@Matthewcmiel
@Matthewcmiel 5 лет назад
I mean, typically blizzard hall of fames cards just before they introduce a card that WOULD be a good combo with the card hall of famed.
@kennethokubo3435
@kennethokubo3435 5 лет назад
The issue with mind blast when compared to other damage cards is that it’s efficient face damage with no cost. All the other damage cards come at a cost, either through being symmetrical or by effectively sacrificing your healing. If you ask me, it’d be more fitting for blizzard to have replaced mind blast with a version that simply does 5 damage to both heroes. As for the argument of divine spirit inner fire, that does fit in with the priest identity, because casting spells to support your minions is most certainly a part of the priest identity. Also on one final note, to say that that tempo priest deck you made is ruined by mind blast being removed is extremely narrow minded. There is definitely plenty of aggressive/ tempo orientated priest decks that don’t need mind blast thanks to the extra arms buff.
@gerrion25
@gerrion25 5 лет назад
RIP to our beloved cards. However... a few counter-arguments, if I may. Regarding Vanish: Board clear means the full removal of minions from the board, regardless of the minions' fate - Vanish sure does an awkward clear, but it's that minion denial that Blizz wants to be removed from the class in Standard. Regarding Mind Blast: Unlike Mind Blast, the Inner Fire Combo is reliant on the board state to deliver the OTK. Even if Priest has PLENTY of tools to correct that, the Taunt weakness will always be there and will hit the Priest should he lack those tools at a given time. What I think Blizzard is trying to say in this case is: "Powerful tools should only come from the expansions, and Basic/Classic should give you an initial approach before delving further - Control first, Combo second."
@argentpuck
@argentpuck 5 лет назад
Control needs a finisher (and control cards that aren't total ass). All those Priest combos that people complain about are control finishers. Combo decks are the ones that can OTK you on turn 5 if they've gotten the right cards drawn. Combo decks don't self-heal or dirdle around.
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