I was in the school at Bethel around 2009 and read Victorious Eschatology by Harold Eberle and Martin Trench (Not a school book). The scriptures opened up to me in ways that were previously veiled. After finishing the book, something literally lifted off my body and I felt so light. I was amazed how being under false teaching about the end times and scripture carried an unseen heaviness that I didn't even realize was affecting my life. That same week I went to school and Kris said the Lord had been teaching him about a kind of “Apostolic Eschatology.” The timing was stunning. As I made my way to Kris after class to ask him if he had heard of Harold’s book, someone else got to him before me and asked him the same question about that book. He had not heard of it at the time. The triple witness of the experience was so meaningful and I’ve had more hope and understanding of the scriptures and everyday life ever since. To understand the scripture in context to who it was written to truly unlocks so much. Thanks for the interview!
It is dangerous to title this “The Truth” about the end times. As a person in my 20’s, I would love to believe that this message is true. But something is off. I randomly looked at my Bible app verse of the day before bed and this was the verse: 2 Thessalonians 2:3 NLT “Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction.” Remember to ask Holy Spirit about teachings and always test teachings with Scripture ❤️
Paul also said in 2Th2.6 that the "restrained" was then holding him back.. meaning both the Lawless one and the restrained were both contemporary with John. They'll tell you a bunch of stuff, like the 'apostasy, but it also means 'rebellion'. Some historians say the rebellion among the Jews destroyed the city in 70ad and the Roman's only stopped the rebellion. All in what you read I guess.
Keep praying for our brothers and sisters to return to their first love and to a love for the truth. Strong Delusion comes to those who don’t have that love.
He is teaching that Nero was the man of lawlessness - but I agree with you. And the irony is that these words were likely written during the start of Nero’s reign - when someone had falsely told the Thessalonians that they had missed the Rapture and that they were in the tribulation. He wrote II Thessalonians to straighten things out and to remind them that the blessed hope was still to come. Man of perdition would not be revealed until the restrainer (Holy Spirit present with the church) was first removed.
Thanks for this discussion. I’m thankful that Chris and Rich want to give the church hope. If our preaching of the gospel doesn’t give people hope then we are doing it wrong for sure. There has definitely been at times an unhealthy preoccupation with end times doom and gloom, but if you’re saying, “God’s main judgement was in AD 70 and it will never get that bad again” I will say the 20th century with all it’s massive suffering surely disproved that. The early church was preoccupied with the return of Jesus in a very healthy way, and that lasted after the destruction of Jerusalem. The New Testament writers emphasize that keeping the Lord’s return at the forefront of our thinking is essential to live lives of holiness. 1 John 3:2-3 “Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is. All who have this hope in him purify themselves, just as he is pure.” 2 Peter 3:11-12 Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. Titus 2:12-13 For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people. It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, while we wait for the blessed hope-the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, If we deny that there’s a shaking of all things right now we have our heads in the sand. Anyone working in the public sector in California knows there’s a good chance you will lose your job if you don’t want to affirm someones delusional identity who is transgender. I think the American church needs to wake up to what’s coming and to feed the sheep the food that will sustain them through suffering, and that’s the coming of the Lord Jesus in His Glory. It’s what the early church did, and it’s what we must do.
Who reads the complete verse by verse chapter by chapter book by book of the word of God here? It is the only way to discern truth. Blessings to all my brothers and sisters that do that!Keep on learning and growing in Gods truth !!!🙏🙏🙏
Our desire for Jesus to come imminently is not supposed to be about having Him fix things, it’s supposed to be out of a great yearning for intimacy and nearness with Him…
This is it. So so good. I studied under Welton when I first started examining this topic. So much study since. When you honor the text, and look for the consistency of the Father, there is freedom. Not fear. There are a few things we can expect, Jesus to come back again, the resurrection, the just and good judgement, and the new. Earth and Heaven reunification. So much good. He’s victorious. Let’s go after it. Here’s to the true revelation of the good to come. Let’s partner with it.
One simple, humble question… in Mathew 24:21, Jesus says, “For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be.” If the prophecies in Mathew 24 were referring only to the destruction of the temple in 70AD, what do you do with the generation that saw 6 million Jews annihilated during the holocaust and well over 50 million lives lost total? Verse 21 says there is a tribulation coming that surpasses even the events of World War II. The events described in chapter 24 May have been fulfilled, in part, during 70AD, but verse 21 says “there has never been, nor, shall there ever be” a tribulation such as what Jesus was warning us about in these verse. I fully embrace a radically victorious, powerfully miraculous, supernaturally righteous, and triumphantly all-conquering church who will “do greater works” than even Jesus did in the 1st century, but it is in the context of great tribulation such as the world has never seen. If we are not prepared for such a unique time as what Jesus described, we won’t rise to the occasion.
This is a great question. Sometimes we think number of deaths should be of more significance than the specefic generation that killed the son of God himself. In 70 A.D. when the Roman Armies came in and leveled Jerusalem, it was so horrific that it eventually got to the point that moms were eating their dead kids to stay alive, since the city had been shut up to create a huge famine. The descriptions of the horrors with weeping and gnashing of teeth were unlike anything seen before and can be found documented in the writings of Josephus, but it's as heavy as Jesus said it would be. I think it is important to look at the original translation also to see what something means. We should mention Jesus often used extreme imagery to make a point which offends literalists minds, like cut your eye out if it causes you to sin, but he did this so listeners would take heed in what they were hearing for their own lives and the lives of their immediate generation Those who cut out their eyes literally, probably regretted the results since change is an inward thing. All of Jesus' words line up perfectly with what that generation experienced if we just look further into the context and what actually happened in history. It is quite stunning when the eyes are opened to see how accurate he was.
This is a great question! I believe it is an example of biblical hyperbole like we see in Ezekiel 5:9 where God was describing the destruction of Jerusalem in 586 BC or Daniel 9:12 which also describes that same event. Another example is Zephaniah 1:2-4. The Lord begins by saying that He will wipe off the earth every living creature, but then He clarifies that He is actually only addressing the people of Judah and Jerusalem. Another aspect of Matt. 24:21 is that I believe the Lord is speaking covenantally, not in terms of raw numbers like we do (because I agree that WW2 and the Holocaust were horrific events where millions suffered and died). However, in the first century there was a massive shift taking place. God originally was only in covenant with one small people group (Israel). Now through the death and resurrection of Jesus, the plan of salvation was open to all people. The spiritual forces that controlled the rest of the planet were being thrown down as the Lord called all people to Himself. Finally, Matt. 24:34 must be considered, "this generation" would not pass away until "all these things" take place. Jesus was putting a time frame on His prophecy that we cannot ignore. I hope that helps!
When you read Matthew 24, you notice that verse 14 ends with, "And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come." So he wraps up one answer and then continues with another. The following verses warn about the "abomination that causes desolation", which is the context of verse 21 that you quoted above. And then, "immediately after the distress of those days" another set of signs happen (v. 29). And THEN, will appear the sign of the son of man (v. 30). In other words, there are a lot of "and then"s before the day of Jesus' return described in Matthew 24. This leaves a lot of time between then and judgement day for events such as the distress you are referring to in verse 21 to happen. So it is possible that the tribulation that Jesus referred to did happen immediately after the abomination that causes desolation after the destruction of the temple. It is also possible that this tribulation began then, and continues to this day, which would include the holocaust. It is also possible that the abomination that causes desolation, for the disciple's whom Jesus was talking to, was something that happened in their lifetime AND something that will repeat in some way in a future time (a double meaning, like some other prophecies given in the Bible). Each of these perspectives are believed by some very smart biblical scholars. We have to hold our convictions about these things humbly with a grain of salt. I think what you said is wise.
In 1940s 6 of the 9 Million Jews in Europe were killed in secret camps, and the full aspect was known after. 2/3 were killed (while the rest went through the fire). In 70AD, however, the entire nation of about 1.1M all came to Jerusalem for Passover. They had to come, it was their Law. In that state, the Roman's erected their siege walls. An entire nation compacted in one place.. watching each other starve, die, women cook their own children... outside the walls, 500 Jews a day were crucified. Every day. Sure, Hitler camps were insane.. but Nero took people lice, tied to poles, dipped them in hot wax, and used them as streetlights by lighting them on fire.. screaming. Bit, what did Daniel say in Dan 9? That the first fall of Jerusalem was the worst thing up u til that time. That is, worse than Noah's flood. Clearly, it is not JUST mere numbers that matter. It is percentage of the whole, degree of suffering, etc. In 70AD, only 100k walked out of that city, and over a million killed. If it hadn't ended, no Jews would be here today. That's over 90% dead. Even when Ahab sinned, God considered it less punishment for him to die first, because he repented, and not have to see his family die too. So, watching 90% of your nation die in front of your eyes, compacted in Jerusalem as they were, is worse than dying secretly in camps and finding out later... Ultimately, Daniel 9.12 said Jerusalem centuries before was worse than Noah, Babel, all other judgments... the percentage, height of fall, degree of suffering. It is clearly not about numbers. Whether 70 ad was worse than the first fall, and worse than the holocaust of wwii, is up to the Jews and God to determine, but it would seem to be to me.
@CormackMcKinney Of course, Col 1.23 says the Gospel had been preached to every creature already... not that that matters to folks... But, Matt 24.29 says "immediately", but the words in Greek are "eutheos de meta", where de meta is "but after", and eutheos is the same root word as Acts 9.11, a street called straight. Straightway, directly, next (in sequence). Ted Noel had an excellent study about the word. The lexicon states it can have a time gap based on context, and many uses in the NT show it does.. John 6, the boat didn't "immediately" reach shore in a miracle, because the parallel passage shows they rowed. The word eutheos merely means "next in sequence" in the same way as a "street called straight" doesn't indicate length. "Immediate" means no middle and indicates a cul-de-sac. It's simply an imprecise translation. When coupled with "de meta", it means "next but after". Jesus is indicating sequence, and emphasizing order, but not timing. "These things" happened in 70AD, but "that day" no one knows the day or hour. Which is exactly what Jesus says in v34,36... these things ("when will these things be") happened in that genrleration, aka 70ad, while "that day" (the sign and the end) no one knew the day or hour. The second coming is yet to come.
I haven't been studying eschatology but God created me as a futurist and visionary. At first that meant looking at technology as the answer. Then God convicted me. Since I've fully submitted and surrendered myself to God, He has been sharing with me these very visions being discussed. God is waiting for Church, the body of Christ to fully embody the power and authority Jesus reclaimed for us on the cross and transform the world as we know it.
I'm trying to be open minded but God himself has told me things that don't jive with this theory. I think they are all happening again! God showed us once now he is doing it all again so we can prepare!
Thank you for this teaching! I have been listening to Lynn Hiles teach on victorious eschatology for years. It is such a vast topic with many moving parts. It really is Good News! Thank you both for taking the time to create teaching opportunities on this long overlooked topic. ❤
Best two starter books on this topic are 1. Reading Revelation Responsibly by Michael J Gorman and 2. Reversed Thunder by Eugene Peterson. Excellent exegesis here. It’s about time… Thank you both.
This is so good! Learning this view over the last 3 years really freed me up. I always had an internal sense that future readings just didn't sit right but I never knew any different. So great to have it confirmed.
Brilliant so glad you posted this . I found freedom from the end times stuff about 8 years ago through finding Jonathan Welton on Utube . My whole world changed and God freed me from the fear of the future I had been taught . Please be brave and keep posting videos like this .
Finally! I learned about the "end times" after my mom converted from Catholicism to an Evangelical denomination. For years, all I heard was about how we were living in the "end times" and thought it was "off" even as a young child. It seemed so negative, fear driven and divisive; it was a huge difference from the Catholic environment I had been accustomed to and it made me distance myself from Christianity as a young adult. Years ago, when I was 33, I read a book called "End Times Fiction", which basically explained what the this interview is about. I made the decision in that moment that if I was going to believe in God, I was not going to believe out of fear. A huge burden was lifted from me; it was the beginning of a new beginning! I ended up back in the Catholic Church and one of the things I appreciated was that fact that they aren't waiting for the "end times". Their interpretation is that the Book of Revelation was written for the early Church, and in a nutshell, no matter how bad things may get (at any time in history), God has the final word. It was a message of hope. Now that actually made sense to me. After more life and reflection, I came to an understanding that many people who gravitate and cling to this negative understanding of the"end times" have some deep unresolved wounding in their lives. Psychologists and neurologists know that trauma sensitizes the brain and psyche to be more attracted to negative drama and thinking, so it stands to reason. I've also noticed that people who subscribe to the "end times" mentality are practically gleeful about those who will be left behind and punished. Could it be an unconscious projection of their desire for retaliation for whomever wounded them? My hope is that the Church will collaborate more with science and psychology and develop and promote ways to know ourselves completely to resolve our deepest wounds that are at the core of unhealthy theologies (and politics).
This sounds to me like an amillennial view. Most things become a symbol. Mathew states that ‘no human’ would survive, he did not differentiate between God’s people and their enemies. Mathew also states angels would gather the elect. Paul says a trumpet would sound and we would be transformed. There are holes in this perspective. Consider reviewing Dr Michael Brown’s work, Dr Craig Keener, and Dr Michael Heiser. It is a worthy discussion to continue and no matter one’s conclusion we must all live as you say, as if Jesus may come immediately and also as if it may be generations.
The scholars you mention are great. Heiser has a teaching in which he pokes holes on all the broad strokes views people tend to hold on Escatology. It's not so clear cut, either which way. Kris himself has said that prophecy is vest interpreted in hindsight...that the scholars of Jesus’s time got the prophecies about him wrong, too. So humility in the views we hold, is sooooo important. Blessings to you. 😇🙌😇
I am so happy there are more people instilling HOPE in The Body! I think part of the reason our culture looks like it does is because too many denominations have withdrawn from all areas of culture, leaving a vacuum for secular (and even demonic teaching) to become the leading voice and for faulty interpretations of scripture to be accepted as truth. It's time for The Body to OCCUPY until Jesus comes and make us a Bride worthy of His return.
Yes! I have felt the contradiction in me since the time I was born again at 19 and only when a BSSM student told me about it did I finally feel I wasn't crazy after all! Thank you!
This was great. Nice to hear this perspective getting some air time. David Chilton hits this topic really well in his book 'Paradise Restored- a Biblical Theology of Dominion'. Highly recommend for anyone who's interested. Spends a lot of time on understanding OT prophetic language to apply to Matt 24 and Revelation.
Yes this is the AMillenial view or post millenial in some statements. But saying that the return of Christ depends on the church it’s a little confusing and kind of pretentious. They did not discuss other passages of Isaiah, Peter or Thessalonians. My personal opinion on this is that we of course, used by God, Can make a difference and influence but this will takes us forever, it’s disheartening to think that Jesus is waiting for us to do something and he will be late another 2000 years. I choose to think that he will return to reign definitely even though we haven’t finished “our work”
Sounds great, but full of misguided ideas. Take the Bible literally and use Biblical end times teaching to promote holiness and inspire us to witness and save as many lives as possible….the great commission! Jesus is coming for his bride before the tribulation…our blessed hope!
Too bad Jesus himself didn’t speak “literally” much of the time. His own disciples mention it to him in the gospels. The Bible is not only literal as truth itself is not only literal.
No pretrib rapture Read mathew 24 in its biblical context And read the bible from a jewish perspective because it was written by Jewish apostles and mathew wasn't for the jews only it was for everyone
The revelation for our times is that Revelation’s not for our times! And the word apocalypse isn’t what most people think it means… The preparing and perfecting of the bride comes before the advent and the appearance of the Bridegroom. She is being made ready for Him. And a huge part of that is realising who she is, her royal identity, and stepping into the joyous authority that comes with it. To be an apocalyptic acolyte is to be an active ‘actioneer’ of the opening up of the kingdom come, ‘on earth as it is in heaven’.
Yes, it is a Partial Preterist viewpoint. Many people don't understand the term, so I usually don't use it. There is a growing number of theologians who are exploring and embracing this perspective.
I think Neville Johnson does one off the best jobs preparing the body of Christ with the message of the end times. I highly recommend him, there are others of course but lately I have been listening to him.
this is all I see when I read the scriptures and it is contrary to what I was taught in church through out my life. I Was taught the hollywierd left behind version which is pure fiction and contradicts what you read in scripture. thank you for taking the truth about what the scriptures really say main stream.
no it was 2017 the jubillee for jerusalem but Israel also has their own jubille year. I did a study on the 6000 years of man and the 70 jubilee cycles from Israel becoming a nation and I have come to this conclusion god does not count time the way we do. Some say the 6000 years began when adam and eve sinned but I believe the count down began with Cain and his descendants or those who who sinned and rebelled against god and would not repent cain was the first one. the 70 years jubillee count down for israel could have began after Joshua and the elders served the lord but then another generation rose up that did not know /god and started serving idols then again I could be wrong but point is God does not count time the way we think he does so we shoulld never put on dates its foolish.
Kris, I was wondering if you have plans to put translation in your videos in other languages as Spanish and Portuguese. I’m from Brazil and I’d say that thousands of people would watch your videos if there was translation into Portuguese. I believe Bethel has so much to add to Brazil 🇧🇷 and Brazilians are hungry for a move of God!
I found recently what is really amazing how some words meaning from the Bible were twisted into negative! First is Apocalypse from Greek is just revelation but not gloom and doom. Revelation is something we receive from God that was hidden like gifts of the Spirit. Another is martyr which is wintess in the court but not someone who was killed because of religious persecutions! Even in modern Greek it means the witness in the court! Of course there were many killed because of their faith but I believe it has nothing to do with this word martyr!
Not a very biblically sound this ppl. He talked about verse 34, forgot the context of verse 30. Matthew 24 is talking about fig tree generation. Bethel I wud have to tell you has really strange ppl. I love them but their doctrines can da mn ppl
This is actually getting funny! Revelation was written 20+ years after 70AD’s destruction of the temple, so you might want to come up with a new idea. 😢
This "idea" is actually the way the Church understood revelation for hundreds of years, and is still the dominant view among those who study Revelation today. Biblical scholars who hold this view are aware that Revelation was written after the destruction of the temple; they believe (and it would have been obvious to most people in the 1st century who understood prophetic literature) that most of Revelation was about what had already taken place - and it is only the very end, including the day of judgement, that is about future events.
In Rev 4:1 the angel said I will show you what will take place after this. After what? After the church age which was outlined in chapters, 2 and 3. If we follow your view, why would the angel say that when John would’ve already known all that took place with the judgements?
@@robm7006 "After this" can refer to immediately after, or centuries after - and/or everywhere in between. When do you think the church age starts and ends? Many who study the New Testament, and Revelation specifically, believe that is the age we have been in for quite sometime and are still in today.
Cormack: I agree with you that the church age is now and has been going since the Day of Pentecost when the Holy Spirit poured out as described in Acts. Do a search on the two previous ages and their timelines. The church fathers wrote about it. The Age of Creation or the Age of Chaos as some refer to it, started from creation to the covenant with Abraham (approx. 2K years). The covenant with Abraham began the Age of Torah as some refer to it. It lasted 2K years up until the new covenant that Jesus established in his first coming, called the church age or the age of grace. If the church age is also 2K years, we are very close to the end of this age...not sure the day or the hour as Jesus said we won't, but we would know the season which is what he warned us so much about. The next age to come is the Kingdom Age which will last 1K years. Kind of interesting how it mirrors the creation account. 6 days of work and 1 day of rest. Then, the new heavens and the new earth...all things made new! Can't wait! Also, can't wait for the Kingdom age! All the more reason to continue the Great Commission. Notice how this view was spun up as people hiding in bunkers scared to death? So not true and an unfair stereotype that they like to spread! We should all be winning souls if we want to be a Catalyst for the Culture! It's really that simple, like Jesus said it would be...."my yoke is easy, my burden is light" "go and make disciples". I didn't read "change the culture", which sounds really cool, or....hide scared in a bunker with years of freeze dried food! Another question for you, why would Jesus say, "when you begin to see these things, look up, for your redemption draws near"? In your view of timing I don't follow why Jesus would say such a thing. In the view most Christians hold which is that Revelation is future from chapter 4 on, this verse makes sense. How do you justify it?
@@robm7006 I think we are saying the same thing! I might have misunderstood your original post. But I'm on the same page with you about most of what you're saying. (Other than your more literal interpretation of the 1000 years and stuff).
Question: Even in terms of personal prophetic ministry -- it seems that prophesying dates and times is a tricky business. I have seen many prophetic words come to pass but not line up with their stated time table... why is that?
Hi, that is a great question, and I have directed it to our marketing team to reference for Kris’ weekly live Q&A sessions he holds on Tuesday via Facebook and Instagram. I encourage you to tune in to those live chats to see if your question is answered -KVM Team
Matthew 24:34 is clearly not saying that all these things will happen in the generation back then. The greek reads "genea", which is an ambivalent word in the NT and can either mean "generation" or "race" in the sense of a people (like Israel). What Jesus is actually saying is that "this people (of the Jews) would not pass away, until all these things be accomplished. You should study the NT in the original text, dear folks, and not in the Passion Translation!!
Psalm 110 is misrepresented! The LORD GOD says to HIS SON, “SIT AT MY RIGHT HAND UNTIL I MAKE YOU ENEMIES A FOOTSTOOL FOR YOUR FEET.” Everything is under the FEET OF JESUS! Not the church! Jesus commands us to spread the saving gospel of Jesus and HIS POWER AND HIS DOMINION OVER SATAN AND DEATH. Jesus waits for nothing except the timing of HIS FATHER!!!!
You cant understand endtimes without the old testament and Jesus couldn't come for 2000 years after the temple was destroyed 70 ad because there wasnt no jewish nation because israel must exist as a nation (ezekiel 38) for Jesus to return And dont forget islam which is also connected to end times
Why we have to plan for Second coming when He is in us and same Jesus would appear physically? Do we differ two Jesuses? It is sounds even not logical! Some say we have to ready but if He is not coming soon do wr have to live like our flesh desires? Really? So when we think like this we disrespect Jesus already! This theology called Religion which is warm like Christianity! The problem is Religion make us slaves of sin! Religion resurrect sin and make it alive because religion disregard what was finished by Him! Religion brings us in gloom and doom because satan was extremely religious and he made Adam and Eve to believe in lie that they need to do something to be like God ( self-righteousness) when they were like God. Btw, apostle Paul said , " Yes! There are many antichrists but so what we have anointing from Him! " He didn't panic like some now! Remember in times of Jesus even all perversions were legal and Jesus never panicked like some people in church now! He just preached the Gospel! In their time it was even impossible to vote against such marriages but the Gospel transformed that world!
