Carl kills a young boy who worked with the governor that surrenders! Check out my channel for the other walking dead part. Subscribe and rate for more videos.
Vilkku he was doing it slowly because if he moved too fast they could get scared and fire off a shot. carl had no right to kill a FLEEING boy who didnt want to fight
When someone says "Drop the weapon" and your immediate response is to continuing holding onto said weapon and tell that person "Take it" you're pretty much asking to get shot in the face. When the man says drop it he means DROP it, not "come take it from me" which is pretty much an invite for one person or the other to get blasted.
yeah in my, head to line that shotgun up and fire it is not that big of a motion, and given that it was a kid I bet he had some bold notions in his head
@@TobiasTheWolf yes, he should be blamed for a stupid decision. Being a victim does not absolve you of all previous wrongdoings or make all of your actions reasonable or correct
not really, rapidly droping something triggers nerval reflexes which spring in action under certain ( THIS SITUATION RIGHT THERE!! ) circumstances ( yes... also IRL, not movies). therefore carefully/slowly lowering something makes sense as the person on the trigger sees every single action you´re doing. Idc who´s at fault just wanted to make this clear
When someone tells you to drop your weapon in the zombie apocalypse, you don't slowly lower it/ move towards the person telling you to do so. You drop it.
Dazuka Himori Ohh here we go it was in here somewhere. A guy or girl that like a to repeat themselves incesively or say absolite bullshit the whole time. Plus its the zombie apocolypse and my home is being attacked by his group. I would have shot him for being in there. Especially after all that. Yeah I'd happily drop him
No dude he was drawing the gun at carl cause you can see him giving the gun to carl but he gave it with 1 arm so if carl took his shotgun the boy would pull the trigger and shoot carl
Yeah see the thing is, he was told to *DROP* the gun. He instead tried to hand it to Carl. Too risky. It was justified, in the end. I would have done the same.
@@HakoTaco1 In situations like this you have to act fast and you can't always afford to put extra time and risk into thinking further and leaving room for someone's error. This is a situation of life or death. Don't you dare compare this to corrupt cops. Corrupt cops wouldn't tell someone to drop the weapon, they'd shoot them regardless of what they did, even if they followed their exact instructions 100% as told. This is not the same as something a corrupt cop does, you fuck.
The kid came toward Carl like Rick came to Shane back in season 2. Rick offered his gun to Shane and used that to close the distance to kill him with a knive. Carl watched that scene and I think that is part of the reason why he killed that boy.
@shane long it's a kid, a child who has a gun pointed at them, a child who understands what a gun is capable of, do you think a child would be thinking of doing a false surrender? No! He was going to surrender, so as to not die, but trigger happy Carl over here be like:blam
Carl looks more like Negan than Rick. Negan was tough and no mercy for anyone. After he turned good man because that s what he was inside and Carl became good and brave young man when he was grown up. Carl was the only one in the Rick band to defend a little bit Negan. Rick is not so good than Negan or his son, he did bad things many times for nothing. Rick take care of what is good for Rick only.
***** But when in doubt and afraid (as u noticed, the trembling of the hand), u take the more certain choice than the uncertain one. If Carl would have believed him, there's no telling what this guy would do! Even if that guy is scared as well, that would even increase the chance of him doing something stupid against carl and hershel. Carl was still a kid and Hershel was an old man. If they got fooled somehow, they would not stand a good chance against this dude. This was war. He came to kill. And the big TWD lesson is u take no risks. Especially in this situation it was too dangerous for Carl and Hershel to play the game of trust with this guy in a time of war.
Just don’t forget that he’s a kid man he doesn’t have the mental stability of a man and that’s hard you know.. He lost his mother by killing her ( he was obliged to) but he saw that Shane wanted to kill his father so I guess he’s traumatised that’s why he did thqt
That was the most suspicious and ambiguous “surrender” that I’ve ever seen in my life. He took 10 seconds to fully lower his gun, kept his finger near the trigger while he was doing it, and the whole while he was making eye contact with both Hershel and Carl, like he’s trying to see if one of them will look away so he can try to take a shot at them. Carl was completely justified in shooting him. It’s better to be safe than sorry, especially when one’s behaviour is that ambiguous.
He might have just being cautious incase one of them tried to shoot him. Plus he did ultimately drop it so him looking like he was about to shoot them could have just been some idiot mistake
@@liamellis-mergl8065 Still, Hershel told him to drop the gun, not to slowly lower it while making eye contact with both of them. When someone tells you to drop a gun, you drop it immediately.
@@proctorritter5176 But Hershel later said that the kid was surrendering, and that Carl murdered him. Carl even admits it before he kills himself. I think an out of world explanation is best: this scene was poorly directed/executed.
@@sneed3529 nope, it’s just like this whole “cops are murdering blacks” BS…if you do not comply when someone with a weapon tells you to, you are presenting yourself as a danger. Just watch the guy’s eyes as he makes no movement to lower his weapon and stares at both as he draws closer, which is a well known tactic of showing dominance to another! Negan even calls Rick out for doing the same thing in the season 7 premiere, and that’s why he went out of his way to instill a more submissive attitude into him. It’s ALL about body language, and this show has never been “poorly written or directed,” that’s just your inability to grasp actual great content 🤨
I mean what do police do when they catch somebody with a guy let me just quote it for you ok police:sure I’m tell you 1 time drop the weapon slowly. It this boy moved fast they would of got scared and shot not knowing if he was tryna kill them or not
@@jdsworld6452 You can just slowly remove your finger off the trigger then lower the gun to the ground with it not being aimed at anyone. What that teenager did was incredibly suspicious, and no matter his intentions, it's a fact that the way he did it would have allowed him to try and kill Carl/Hershel. He was a danger, and you don't take useless risks like that in the apocalypse.
@@jdsworld6452 He didn't do as instructed, you can't surrender your way. He was slowly closing in, as though he was counting on Carl being hesitant. And Carl had zero close combat experience. So it was definitely threatening to him.
I don't know. Maybe Carl didn't have to shoot him, but that kid sure looked like he was gonna try something. They said drop your weapon not come closer and try to give it to us. Says "sure" but suspiciously proceeds to inch closer. -.-
There is absolutely no way you could attempt to fire a gun the way he was handing it over. It takes two hands to effectively fire a shot gun and he was passing it over one handed. Even if he tried something, any smart person could realize that it would be literal suicide when you have two guns pointed at you. Carl also practically stated he killed someone who posed no threat simply because he didn't want to risk the POSSIBILITY he may try something. Taking his gun and forcing him to run would have been more effective without putting weight on your conscience. Also, remember he isn't some skilled tactician/manipulator, he was drafted over and only had days of experience with shooting.
Galen223adept It has nothing to do with whether he can shoot the gun or not. When you're in a situation like that (skilled tactician or not), you do what the people who have the upper hand tell you to do (which was to "drop your weapon, son"). If he had no ulterior motives, then he would do as he was told. The fact that he decided to come closer, increases the possibility of him trying something. If the kid dropped the gun and Carl still shot him, then I would agree that it was not justified.
yoyoheads Uh, it does matter whether he can shoot the gun or not because you only shoot someone if they are an immediate threat to you. The boy did not display any behavior that he was trying to attack them, so Carl did shoot a defenseless person. He was running away from the battle to begin with! But again, when he said for them to take it neither Hershel nor Carl objected to it. It was a good few seconds of silence from both parties before Carl shot him. It's not like he still had the gun raised towards them, he was complying with giving him up his weapon. "He didn't comply exactly the way I wanted so I shot him" will not hold up in any legit courtroom if they were surrendering! You can even see him kind of slowly lowering his weapon in one scene. He inched closer because he took their silence as acceptance with his request since they didn't object to it. Just because someone doesn't follow your exact specifications, doesn't mean they should lose their life over it. Especially since if Carl had a big issue with him coming closer he could have shot him in the leg, gave a warning shot, ANYTHING! But he chose to kill him. There were a million and 1 ways that the situation could have been handled better, and Carl chose the one where the guy ends up dead. Carl even states that he shot him because he did not want to take the CHANCE of him coming back for retaliation. Not that he didn't follow directions, not that he was coming closer but because he based his action on past occurrences, so no that's not excuse since that wasn't his reason for doing so. It was a killing that served no purpose especially when not too long afterwards they allowed the townspeople to join them. His death was pointless, point blank.
@Hungti Well those nerves got him killed. This is the walking dead. There’s no mercy. No surrender, no society. Just death and wickedness. You just survive somehow
Herschel on overwatch, kid will never get an aimed shot off wielding a shotgun one handed he can barely hold. At best he'll aim, be cut down, and when it fires it'll go flying. Finger was out of the trigger guard, Herschel's was in. Kid doesn't know Herschel, but Carl does - and Carl likely thinks Herschel will hesitate. Kid will have no idea. I'm not assigning blame to Carl. Blame's a simplistic construct. This was adrenaline and fear - Carl's and this kid's. That kid saw the writing on the wall. He saw the look in Carl's eyes. If you watch it again, it isn't malicious intent. It's slow, gradual, inescapable fear. Looks the same as resistance because it is. It is illegal to resist here? Is it illegal to be afraid? To freeze? To clench up when you're scared? The kind of fear that'd make you freeze, when you realize the kid has the silencer, and doesn't give a damn about Herschel's overwatch. When you see the dynamic and realize, horrifically, you can't physically let go of the gun because you're too damn scared... because the kid isn't reaching for it? You mean to hand it off, but you're clenching it, because your adrenaline is up and your hand is frozen... and there's no hand coming to take it from you. Your instincts are telling you not to throw or drop the shotgun, which may have a hair trigger? You ever been really scared? I mean running for your life scared? Happens maybe 2-3 times in your lifetime. I can only think of 1 time, and it was nothing by comparison to this, but I vividly remember leaning back and away from a railing, and my hand didn't give a flying **** about what I was telling it to do. No threat, no immediate danger - just something in my body didn't care. That railing was too important to it. Ever been in a serious traffic accident? Lotta people have trouble letting go of the wheel despite it being utterly useless. There's a reason taking prisoners in war time has the geneva convention. Carl's no soldier and presumably, there's no law in this world, but there's a damn good reason to take prisoners. Justified doesn't mean anything, it's just a concept people make up and stands solely on the ability of the world to determine it, equally, and do their best to abide by it. But it doesn't exist. It's a mental construct we use to be the best we can. To communicate intentions and live by a communicable standard. Carl was not justified here but don't get me wrong - I appreciate your sentiment. I'm not assigning blame. There's no two situations in the world that can ever be directly compared, especially in a lawless world - even in ours legal precedence is barely held together. You just do your best. If there's any measurement of justification that's apt in all situations, it's that you do the best you can. Maybe this was Carl's best - but I can tell you right now, it wasn't Herschel's best. Herschel's a great man, and a great character, but if anyone failed here it was him. Decisive action was needed, the ambiguity strangled everyone here just as sure as a squeezing trigger. You put two kids in any situation with two guns and let simmer, well, you've made a mistake. But inaction has always been Herschel's weakness. "First, do no harm". Doctor's creed. Not a great motto for a stand off. There is no law where it is not enforced - except by those who choose to be beholden to it. You can't have it both ways. He chose to throw it aside here. Herschel chose the same with his own inaction. I'm not saying they were wrong. No one can tell that for certain. We all empathize with all parties, it doesn't innately make them terrible people - hell, a lot of this could've came down to blood sugar, fear, and shock. But it was certainly not justified. He made a choice to let justice go in lieu of survival. That's how it goes sometimes. The world doesn't stop turning - but justice was not served here. That saying, "Justice is served?" that's a verb. You uphold it and it thrives, survives, and grows based entirely on the ability to exercise it. We shouldn't, and he shouldn't, presume any justice was served here, abided by, or even really considered here. It's no small distinction. You serve justice. That standard never changes. Let's not pretend it was served here in any capacity. This is just something else.
I hated the whole "Carl should feel guilty" subplot that followed this. The Governor just stormed their safe haven like a minute ago with with grenade launchers, but "Oh no, Carl shot someone one of their dudes that didn't drop their weapon when told. How could he do such a thing?".
It warms my heart reading all the messages saying Carl was wrong. It tells me that the world is full of hopeful and merciful people so if I ever find myself in a situation like that kid I can walk slowly towards the person and take my time to think of a way to turn the tables and get the upper hand. What a relief to know that people will give up the advantage of distance in order to let me "surrender" my way.
@@taloutezero most arnt. I haven't even found one, I'm sure they're there tho. It's.mostly a circle jerk of all you guys saying the same thing, claiming people are against him.
Well Hershel told that boy to drop his weapon, did he drop his weapon? No the way he slowly leaned forward with that shotgun looked like he was going to kill Carl & Hershel. If I was that kid I would have immediately dropped the shotgun & put my hands behind my head.
"Back at the Prison, when we got attacked, there was a kid," "A little older than me. He had a gun. He was starting to put it down and I shot him. He was giving it up and I just - I shot him. I think about him. What I did to him and how easy it was to just kill him." - Carl
An unknow dude got mentioned again after 5 season and yet we still didnt hear a T-dog after all those years,last time he was mentioned was in the same episode were he died lol poor T.
All the people thinking Carl didn't do the right thing are morons. The kid didn't drop the gun as directed and as he had agreed to ("sure"); instead, he maintained eye contact with them, approached them with his finger still near the trigger, and slowly turned the barrel towards Carl. Had the kid not intended to shoot Carl, he would have just dropped the gun.
"Take it" can be perceived as a threat in any situation, especially for a boy who had to grow up in the apocalypse and didn't get a chance to learn right from wrong. Carl learned how to survive
@@Shockkings0714 then just make sure to drop it in a way that's pointing to somewhere no where near anyone, that's what he would have done if that was actually his concern.
Poor Shane .he was right the whole time hershal just don’t see it that’s what got his neck cut of .carl will always remember Shane Shane told me you let your guard down your people die if Carl didn’t shoot ‘‘em the kid would killed both them .I mean look hershal this is the new world u gotta make the tough decisions if u really look at it This world just changes u if some one come to u with a gun to your had its Obviously u gotta the Decision to shoot first
Whether or not you think Carl was justified, what's important is that in HIS mind he felt like he could have handled the situation differently. This is a core moment in his development into a character that values peace and diplomacy over violence
Remember in his dying moments, carl said that he regretted his actions here. As he grow up, he realized he was wrong and was feeling really guilty. Soo carl was wrong here, at least in his eyes.
@@arcaneapache5832 No, Carl can still be right even if he thinks he's wrong. He had his reasons for his actions but then was punished by people who had their own perspectives. Ultimately he made the safe choice. Was the guy actually trying to surrender? Maybe or maybe not, but under those circumstances you don't have an obligation to coin flip your life just to try to save some guy who wouldn't just drop the gun.
“Drop the weapon son” *continues to hold onto the weapon and starts walking closer to the people pointing the guns at his head, all the while slowly turning the gun towards Carl*
Like I said, you cannot shoot a shotgun with only one hand you have to use two guns, so actually you’re wrong and that’s probably just the angle that makes it look like it, besides even Carl said he thought what he did was wrong so yeah it was wrong
Who wouldn't think it's the best way to survive when 2 guys are pointing their guns at you is to slowly "turn you barrel" towards one (this can't be actually observed. all you see is the boy turning towards him) in order to "try something", when that weapon of yours even needs two hands to be operated reliably. That kid was just afraid to the max and the whole sense of the scene was to make Hershel and the viewer aware that the whole shithole world they're in bestialized Carl to become a cold blooded killer while it creates suspense for the viewer if this will be for the better later or if he might turn into a psychopath himself. Hershel concerns how he cold blooded killed this boy are mentioned in later episodes (like Terminus) to make Rick aware that he might lose track of his son in a world as insane as this one, so he should take care of him and in the same episode Carl watches with what looks like a mixture of shock and fascination how Rick slices brutally up a guy that pleads for mercy and tried to rape Carl a few seconds before. Those scenes are meant to make sure to the viewer that Rick and Carl grow more and more into Antiheroes, despite their best intentions. That's what this scene is about. There's no hint of apologism in the series about this scene. Hershel doesn't find any words to express how Carl maybe did the right thing. It simply portrays Nietzsche's famous words that "He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he thereby become a monster. And if thou gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will also gaze into thee."
CoIdHeat Be careful what you become. Try not to lose oneself in the process. that's the problem with this world. Most people don't even know that they're already too far gone. The only thing that's keeping them in check are the laws and rules established in this Society. Once there gone, all Hell breaks loose.
@@CoIdHeat I know it’s 4 years later but I disagree. When you are in true fear, you don’t walk towards the source. Your fight or flight reaction won’t allow it, which is why people get stunned in the face of death. The boy was likely going to take Carl hostage, since Carol and Hershel look like pushovers at first glance. Looking at the kids face, it had zero fear. 100% nervous and you don’t get nervous unless you’re hiding/planning something you don’t want the other to find out. Plus, if you’re scared you’d drop the gun begging for your life... not walk towards the enemy’s child still holding your gun. Definitely was gonna be a hostage situation. I think this scene was misinterpreted by a lot. People misunderstood as the scene showing how the world is turning Carl into a cold blooded monster. If that was the case, this scene was poorly acted and could’ve done a way better job. There’s a reason why they had the kid hold his gun still, to leave speculation. I think the purpose of this is to show the ignorance of the people (Hershel) thinking you can survive by being a kind-hearted soul and seeing the “good” in people. The reason why I believe this is true is because the scenes get darker and darker after this moment (with Hershel even dying sticking to his ideals) with the group coming to a realization that you can’t survive without a little darkness in your soul. All the pure good people in the world are the dead ones who couldn’t make the tough decisions. This is Carl understanding that people who take chances get killed or others killed. In other words, better safe than sorry. Obviously everyone disagrees with this method at first but the survivors later in the series abandon that really quick as shit gets darker, regardless of their enemy showing mercy.
If the boy droppened the weapon in this moment 0:02 he would survived but instead he moved closer having the gun in his hand. Carl killed the boy justifiably.
Your welcome! Here's a fun fact while I have your attention OK looks like a little person sideways, and OGC is a dude jacking off. Now pay that knowledge forward.
This was my thought because Carl was being reluctant with him at first. If he had immediately dropped the gun on the ground as Hershel told him to Carl may not have felt the need to shoot him.
Carl made a stupid decision bc even if he tried something there still is Hershel to shoot him dead. He would be to stupid to. He was handing the gun towards him and it would be impossible for him to shoot him. You need to use 2 hands to shoot a shotgun well. Carl made a pretty idiotic decision
+Advanced Fate Dark days, darker nights, found my way across a hall without a light. Cause man I flow... LA JIGGY JAR JAR DOO. Dur dee dur dee dur. And all the walkers be like...
If someone went with a group, FULLY AWARE they intended to kill your friends and family, had a gun, was handing it over INCREDIBLY slowly, and just got back from attacking aforementioned friends and family, I don't think you people would be so kind to them either.
I love how this scene leaves you in doubt whether Carl did the right thing or not. Was this kid gonna hand over the shotgun or was he just trying to put them off guard and kill them? You can't say either with 100% certainty. That's the strongest point of this show - there aren't really any "good guys" and "bad guys". It doesn't tell you fairy tales about brave heroes and evil villains. Instead, it tells you what people are capable of turning into in certain circumstances, similar to "Lord of the flies". And it's damn right in that.
Rick and his group are definitely the good guys, with their enemies the bad guys. It’s a different world and culture, all of our ethics don’t apply here. In this world, if you don’t drop your weapon, you are forfeiting your life
@Orion V so the governor murdering a bunch of people in cold blood is not bad? He literally tortured Andrea, he tricked the military guys by waving a white flag and then shooting the fck out of them. Im sorry but even in battle the white flag is honored. In the apocalypse there should be honor He also murdered his whole town basically because they refused to do what he said Governor was a piece of sht and he deserved a worse death than he got
Imagine being able to survive the apocalypse, your actually thriving, having a sortish good life, you avoided death several time, and you go into the woods one day, just to be killed by a little kid.
@@possiblek6351 the situation can't be solely linked to what happened in this scene. If he did it faster the cowboy kid would have get shooked so did that old man
Carl pulled the right move. That was a very strange looking weapon drop. He just moved closer to them, finger still near the trigger, gun barrel still pointed very close to Carl. Herschel was taken aback and thought Carl was wrong in killing the kid. Shane would have been all like "Good move kid, you did what you had to do" and just walked off whistling.
@@Monkey-kr7gb nah if you have a gun to your face and they say drop your gun you don’t keep it in your hand , let alone the barrel is pointed in carls direction thats too much of a risk
Stinkmeaner I think people are over reacting about Lori getting with someone a month after her husband died. Yeah it was messed up, but she ended it with Shane once Rick came back, and cursed him out for saying Rick was dead, thus showing she still loved Rick. It's not like she slept with multiple people after Rick's "death". So I don't get why people look at her as a slut.
@@MomoKanjaki I think Lori was a panned character due to not always knowing where Carl was half of the time and constantly trying to shield Carl from the horrors of the world for a while (among other things). And plus, there was an episode in Season 2 where she got into a car accident; I heard that episode, while it was somewhat good, got negative feedback because of her actions.
Carl was far more suspicious and apprehensive in earlier seasons because he knew in that world you have to be careful who to trust and what you do after everything he'd seen. Then for him to be bitten by killing walkers needlessly later on was a joke. It was so out of character because Carl knew better.
I know. They did Carl dirty. No.1: He would never go around fighting walkers because some nerd's dead mother wished so. No.2: In Negan's own words: "Carl is a badass." No way he got took down by 2 walkers. The amount of practice and experience he's had on the road, I wouldn't be surprised if Carl took down a small horde by himself. He literally fought of a horde off thousands in Alexandria with Rick and gang. Being overwhelmed by a couple of walkers? It's like the writers had a mid-life crisis when they wrote that blasphemy.
Carl had so many interesting storylines that were just abandoned. They really should've pushed more strain on his and Rick's relationship in the later seasons (like Travis and Chris in Fear). Should've never killed him either
Carl talked about killing this kid as he was dying from the infection. He still regrets it years later. Granted that was a very awkward and suspicious surrender. Just drop the weapon
Gotta remember he was slowly approaching the kid, who he likely thinks is gullible, and easier to submit. I think this was the right move on Carls part.
Carl didn't kill some "innocent" guy people. He shot someone who came to kill his friends and family and would have if they didn't get chased out. If I'm Caught off by surprise and out gun by the enemy and they tell me to drop my weapon, I fucking drop it ( unless I have no intention of doing so ) not hold it, and creep forward looking back and forth between carl and Hershel... Carl made a better choice than most of you would of. Slowly becoming a favorite of mine
To make matters worse for this kid... after re-watching this clip Herschel had a gun as well (i was paying too much attention to Carl and didn't notice the gun on Herschel's person). So this kid (or man) had 2 guns pointing at him and he didn't drop it. I think it's safe to say that all the characters in the show did not drive down from New York City and wound up in Georgia during this Zombie apocalypse. Many of the characters would have to be born or at least raised in the south and as a native new yorker myself... I fucking know better to drop that gun in that situation... You don't have tell me twice.
Michelle Oh Exactly! Why take that chance. Especially since no one other than this guy would know what sort of shooting skills he had... and Carl sure didn't know.
For those of you saying he was lowering/dropping it, why did he say "here take it". If he didn't want to fight he would have obeyed the word of command which was "DROP the weapon". His body language and his refusal to drop his weapon suggests he was planning for retaliation.
The guy look young and effreyate too. Ofcourse he effrayate to surrender but he do and Carl decide to shoot him. That scene show how start change looking the the young hunter like a prey.
He didn't kill the kid, Nicholas was in front of him, fell on top of him, and set off a Rube-Goldberg chain causing a baseball bat to get wrapped in barbed wire only to then fall and hit Glenn in the head.
I once heard someone make the point that what really changed Carl was seeing Rick and Shane’s final fight and how Rick got super close like he was going to give his gun then closed in with his knife. I think that’s exactly what carl was thinking of in this and that when you are told to drop your weapon and stay, you do it. You don’t approach and give your weapon.
@@gatoloco8645 not true at all. Chandler didn't know they were killing him off and in fact had just bought a house in Georgia just to be closer to shooting. This is all very well documented so I dunno where you're pulling your stuff from. The real answer is he turned 18 so AMC would have to start paying him decently and decided "nah." Also Andrew Lincoln left in big part because they killed Carl. The writers on the show are fucking dumbasses pure and simple.
@@gatoloco8645 and the story ends with him in the comic. He was the main character basically and it was just one more insane fuck up the show did. I’ve long stopped watching at this point, it’s impossible to care.
I really liked how Carl brings this up in his last episode. For all its faults, this show did a great job showing characters struggle to move on from their regrets. Michonne's dream of being the poor person with the orange backpack also stands out.
Carl absolutely did the right thing here. The kid's group had just attacked so he should still be considered a potential threat even if he appears to surrender. When he held onto the gun and kept approaching, Carl had no way of knowing if he was going to try something. You never let a potential threat get within arm's length when you have a gun pointed at them because they could disarm you before you had a chance to react. Sure, the kid probably doesn't have the speed or skills to do so but Carl doesn't know that. The only thing he knows is that the kid was shooting at his group just a few minutes prior.
***** Carl told him to not move and put the gun down. He held onto his gun and continued to move towards Carl. That's all Carl knew. How did Carl know he was giving his gun over? It could easily have been a ruse to get in close and try to overpower Carl and grab his gun. You never let someone get within arm's length when you have a gun pointed at them, especially if they're bigger and stronger than you.
***** You don't surrender while still holding your weapon. Someone tells you to drop the weapon, you drop the weapon immediately. Someone tells you to freeze, you don't start walking towards them. Try that shit with the cops and see what happens. You don't think a scared, desperate person might try something stupid? Would you be willing to gamble your life on that?
***** If you had a gun to your face, you should do exactly what the person holding the gun tells you to do, nothing more nothing less. If you don't obey their commands immediately, expect to get shot. He could have easily been pretending to hand over the gun in order to get in arm's reach and distract Carl for a second and grab the gun. Neither you nor Carl knew his true intentions and it's not worth gambling your life on it when he had very recently demonstrated a willingness to kill you. Given that recent combat, he was lucky to even get a first warning. It shouldn't come as a surprise that he didn't get a second. Also, if you have a gun in your face, you are in no position to demand anything, especially that the person lowers his gun. Surrender is not a negotiation. I would've done the same thing as Carl. In combat, hesitation will get you and your friends killed. Ask any cop who's been in a firefight or any soldier who's been to war.
Carl did the right thing. I'm sorry, but when defending a one-legged old man and a baby, I'm not taking any chances. Hershel told the kid to drop the weapon. That means put the damn gun down on the floor and hands up, not try to hand it over while slowly approaching. The kid didn't do as he was told and he paid the consequence.
He didn't drop it, had quick eyes assessing if he could take them all, and was slowly approaching Carl with said weapon while also slowly angling it more towards the group. There's at least a 1/4 chance that this will go awry and he'll kill at least you and maybe Judith and Herschel if this delay goes on any longer. Do you risk that chance? If you're logical, no. Especially when the other party has played as a prior aggressor.
@@Josama0214 No, but maybe he should have. When he let the other convicts in the prison go, one of them opened the gates and let in the walkers, which led to Lori's death. Also, in a previous episode, Carl hesitated to shoot a Walker that later killed Dale. You can debate if Carl did the right or wrong thing all you want, but don't forget the previous incidents in other episodes, and why the character of Carl may have made this decision.
Juding by the reactions of the rest of the town after this scene and how season 4 opens with the remainder of the town joining the prison, I am pretty sure this kid didn't mean them any harm. What makes this a great scene though is "right and wrong" is a social construct; Carl was neither right nor wrong, this boy had nothing to offer him being alive. Carl was only guaranteeing his groups survival.
From what I see and looking throught the comments it wasnt supposed to be a right or wrong question. Like you said the show itself pretty much says the kid wasnt going to do anything and every character says it was wrong from Carl (Carl himself aswell in his death scene in s8). But due to bad directing the kid inches closer and closer to them and his behaviour just looks really suspicious. And I think it wasnt intended by the directors to be that suspicious. In my opinion they wanted Carl to make a clear and obvious mistake but due to bad direction (they probably just wanted to make it more dramatic) it can be interpreted that the kid was getting closer so he can maybe take Carl hostage or something.
Yuumako Zenchō so what about experience? - instinct is what kept Carl alive. Hershel trusted experience now he is dead, Michone set her instinct aside and almost lost her life. Carl had seconds in a combat situation.
the guy from Alexandria didn't have a gun pointed at them in a combat situation - if they did Rick would have wasted him right then and there. Hershel is dead because he acted humanely to a mad man.
I remember this scene well. I also remember Herschel criticizing Carl's judgement call when he shot the kid. While I usually agree with Herschel on most of his stances, I disagreed with him on this issue. This wasn't a schoolyard brawl. This was war. They warned the kid to drop his gun, and he didn't. To top it off, he kept moving towards them. Carl had a split second decision, and did what he needed to. If he hadn't, he might have been the one lying dead on the ground. It was a life and death situation. Herschel should have been able to see that.
To be fair this kid took a whole minute to "surrender" and easily could've picked up that rifle and shot Carl in the face before either could make a move.
I don't know why Carl gets such hate. He went from a helpless annoying kid who just wanted to be useful, in other words Sakura, TO A TOTAL FUCKING BADASS WHO'S HAD THE MOST CHARACTER DEVELOPEMENT AND CHANGE THROUGHOUT THE ENTIRE SERIES, I MEAN HE'S DONE PROVING HIMSELF, NOW HE JUST WANTS TO KEEP HIS FRIENDS ALIVE LIKE HIS FATHER ONCE DID!
Uniqua No this was a justified kill in this world. If Carl let the kid go, the kid probably would've killed Carl or killed members of Carl's group later or worse. Take them out now so later they aren't a real pain in the ass....Best motto to live by in TWD.
+Muyanzi Reid He was putting he's gun down and carl didn't even think he instantly shoot him. He could be way faster only if that kid would aim that gun back.
Carl had a good reason to shoot, even 1 handed you can use a shotgun as long as there is one in the chamber. Also the kid never dropped the gun and had his finger near the trigger.
It’s crazy as a kid that I thought Carl was evil for this, but as an adult I can see He didn’t drop it and and was closing distance. If Carl grabbed it he could have easily over powered him and could have attacked him. Carl should have addressed this. But instead he just shot him. Don’t think it’s too evil anymore. Nobody hands over a weapon you always drop it. If it’s already pumped he could have pointed it at him and fired from the hip. By only moving a couple inches. The way he looked at Hershel it was like he was preparing for the next target. Carl made the safest call. But not the best call morally
Hershel also had a gun on the kid, so the kid was gonna surrender. I never thought it was very evil of Carl because that kid attacked them and would have been a burden.
