And still some Americans believe there should be no control of gun ownership. When will you look to successful models used elsewhere in the world and give your citizens proper and genuine protection.
This is really a good idea that I've never seen suggested before. Particularly since the rumor is that Mark Harmon got the NCIS gig based on his performance on TWW.
Absolutely agreed. They're both starring on CBS shows, shouldn't be too difficult to arrange. Maybe even have her play Gibbs new love interest, and someone he finally ends up married to?
The amazing thing part about The West Wing is that there are dozens upon dozens of moments just as brilliant and poignant as this one. I watch this show and literally cannot comprehend how they managed to pull it off so masterfully, esp. the first 4 seasons. As amazing as this scene is, the real electricity of TWW comes with the dialogue, and I think it's the best written drama of all time. And how much do we love Allison Janney as C.J??? What a character!
I couldnt stand her still can't stand her. LOL I can't even think of who my favorite character would be then or now. Will maybe he after all as hard left as he was was realistic non the less & when it mattered like when he condemned the president for not sending troops to africa & pointing out how the president did for other times including his own daughter or cj or charlie & then again when he decided to accept the offer of the annoying new vp in Barlett's final term knowing that the vp would likely be the if not one of the top people for the party going forward & thus most able to keep the party moving forward especially in life after Barlett. While everyone else saw him & treated him as a traitor & betrayer & they remained stuck in the now lame duck president who would be pushed to the back even by his own party as the past living out the last few moments of his relevance & a president who would have only more & more issues not just from republicans but is one party as the president would be questions by even his party on most if not all of his decisions from here on. As people in his own party move to become his heir his replacement the next "king". A president's peak is the end of their first term if they get reelected its just downward from there regardless of how much they won by or how much people in both parties agreed with him or loved him.
I've always been a fan, but recently completed watching the entire series, start to finish, all 7 seasons. Took maybe 6 months. Of all the books, movies, or TV shows I've ever seen, I think The West Wing taken as a whole is simply the greatest story I've ever known.
@zoefschildpad I dunno - it makes my top 5 or so for the series, along with the Brothers In Arms and The Little Drummer Boy scenes. Say, do you think they chose their music intentionally?
I've watched this maybe 10 times and I just realized how good the writing in this scene is: "a secret service agent walking into the middle of an armed robbery? That's just bad luck". If he only knew how really true those words were
Some of the best acting we've ever seen in the show, Ron's fantastic. We've watched him stone-faced through so much, even getting his hand half shot off. The only time you see emotion from him is when he tells Leo that Zoey's been kidnapped, and his face here as he's telling C.J. tells you how he feels about his people. CJ is fantastic, and the story lines crashing into one another like 6 things gone instantly wrong at 80 mph on the highway, just amazing writing, acting. Best show on TV.
@therese christiansen Sometimes the Emmys blatantly play favorites, esp with women they like. Janney was one of them. Kathy Baker from "Picket Fences" was another as was Juliana Marga-whatever from "ER" when Clooney, Edwards & Wylie never won for their unbelievably great performances. Janney was very good but other women acting at that time were, too.
this might be the most moving 5 minutes of television Ive ever seen. Yes, a lot if it has to do with the music, but CJ's anguish on that bench is palpable
This three episode arc got Mark Harmon his NCIS role. The CBS guys thought he was just a “pretty boy OK actor”. Although how they thought that after CHICAGO HOPE and the Ted Buddy movie I can’t imagine. This scene was a shock. We all thought all danger was over.
The agent who tells CJ that Simon was killed also played a depressed/angry husband who went on a killing spree in "Grey's Anatomy." He's a wonderful actor.
+Julie Davis Look for cast interviews about working with her. and how she was discovered by Paul Newman Have fun searching. "my favorite scene's were any with Allison"
Such a poignant scene with Buckley’s rendition of “Hallelujah” set as the backdrop. One of the first TV shows to use this song correctly! It was meant for a scene like this. And not as a freaking Christmas carol lol
I don't know what the greatest tv show is but any list of the top has to include the West wing. Everyone always says "sopranos, the wire, breaking bad" but the West wing was as good as any of them.
Peter Clemenza Sopranos, The Wire, and Breaking Bad don’t have a built-in anti-constituency of hate driven people saying the show is the spawn of the devil because it often shows liberals trying to do good; and it sometimes shows “conservatives” succeeding in doing evil.
It was better than those two. There's not much to equal it. Deadwood is excellent. The 6-part British series Edge of Darkness is also very fine indeed.
+Phelan We get your point, but he made a human mistake. The shop owner was scared, but did he not know there was an accomplice? Could he not say something, or point?
+Phelan Given the context, we're perhaps meant to reason that his mind was not entirely on procedure and protocol at that moment; he's in a very good mood, and distracted by thoughts of the reason for it. This makes it even harder to take.
+Phelan I completely agree with you; "Simon's" training would have come before any other thoughts; a sort of in-the-moment muscle memory? I just think that Sorkin was using poetic license in this regard. I was standing in a crowd once, waiting for a presidential candidate to walk into the Student Union at the university where I worked and to which I was headed for lunch. It started to sprinkle; I'd leaned down perhaps 40 degrees and was reaching to take my umbrella out of my tote bag, which I'd put on the ground, when a hand grabbed my right forearm very, very firmly. I can't believe that that SS agent covered so much ground so quickly - or had even seen me, three people back from the path the agents had formed for the candidate. He took me aside and quickly (and very politely!) searched me, my purse and bag. Great respect for these guys!! An article, w/a photo of my frisking, made the front page of the next day's student newspaper, and I had a very unique bruise for ten days!
What I find amazing about this series, over and above the superb acting, scripting etc, was how they got the casting so good, so perfect. Each actor brought something special, something different and of such quality.
These five minutes always make me cry. I always loved CJ for her strength, and to see her break down meant so much to me, because it shows that even the strongest of us can break down. 💗
I love Danny and CJ in the end but I still weep for Simon. So honorable and a shining example of measured masculinity. He runs along the lines of Gibbs from NCIS. As fictional characters go Simon Donovan makes me proud to be male and an American.
Joe Foran, I honestly feel bad for you. Such anger shouldn't exist. I'm sure this is what your parents taught you. So this comment isn't your fault. You're a product of your upbringing. And for that, I feel bad for you.
It's not what I took from the scenes with Richie, but that was not some of Sorkin's better work. He's perfectly capable of writing smart, thoughtful Republicans who disagreed with the President. This was like a cardboard cutout of a politician. Every Republican who's a member of the State Assembly has a better answer than that.
Josh and Amy arguing about politics, only to be interrupted by the crushing reality that Donovan was just killed. I'm reading too much into this, but it's a poignant example of how academic debate is one thing, but real life is something completely different.
You're not (reading too much...). They're both good people, and their relationship is over now... But at that moment all the drama of THAT event is entirely superseded by a terrible (almost boring) tragedy. 😭😭😭
The best writing ever (my humble opinion) - the West Wing. And the way he was shot to death...completely unexpected. Just when he secured the robber and made a funny comment about the candy bar - gone. As in life. Completely unpredictable.
+Bill Leslie - The use of Dire Strait's Brothers In Arms at the end of The Two Cathedrals episode might be the best I have ever seen, although I think It's been removed from RU-vid.
If anybody is a fan of "NCIS", this song was on tonight's episode. I love this song, and as soon as I hear the first chords tonight, my mind went right back to this episode...the same hauntingly beautiful song, and the same great actor, Mark Harmon.
Yes! I time shift NCIS and just watched that NCIS episode yesterday. As soon as they started to play, I did the same thing- remembering this episode of West Wing. Up until the shooting, I thought the story arc with Janny was great. But when Harmon walked into the liquor store, I really hoped what I knew was going to happen, wasn't going to happen. I really liked the West Wing and have been a Mark Harmon fan since 240-Robert. This was probably the most powerful moment in the entire series.
Andrea, It was season 2. He played a Secret Service agent assigned to protect CJ. I don't remember exactly when in the season he started, but the one episode title I remember was "The Black Vera Wang", referring to a shopping trip where CJ tried on a Vera Wang ballgown.
CJ won almost all the time in the White House. I just wish she won this one in her personal life. I know it's just a TV show, but, the West Wing always seemed to have a sense of reality to it. As far as I know, Mark Harmon & Allison Janney are alive & well.
I'm reminded of the OG CSI season 9 ep 1 "For Warrick." The song they played "Come Tenderness" by Lisa Gerrard, the way Nick shakes his head as Catherine passes him in the alley, the way Grissom is with Warrick, it's all too sad. Perfect song.
+Antony Phoenix - If you ever get a chance to watch the TWO CATHEDRALS episode, it ended with Dire Strait's Brothers in Arms. One of the best melding of music and film I have ever seen. I say film, because that episode was worthy of being a theatrical film. Best wishes, Ted
Sonya Bykofsky the play President Bartlet is watching in this episode is called “the war of the roses.” The two factions vying for power during “the war of the roses” both had a rose as a symbol of their faction. The house of Lancaster had red roses as their symbol while the house of York had white roses as their symbol: that’s why it was called “the war of the roses.”
I had not noticed the connection before. But is this the one where he authorises Shareef’s murder. Because I think it parallels Richard III. A good man who stole the throne and probably ordered the death of his nephews. A flawed hero.
Every time I watch this I think something different but this time all I could focus on was Josh, the chances are he didn't know Simon was no longer protecting C.J given that they had only just caught her stalker an hour or so before and so the fear that must have gone through him as he considered the possibility that something happened to C.J someone who he has a sister dynamic with on the show is perfectly encapsulated by Josh's pause, the way the scene goes from yelling to deadly silent in just a few words the way he stops breathing stops doing everything, even Amy stops because she knows the pain Josh must be feeling. Perfectly acted by them both
A street cop would have assumed there was a second and even a third. Plus he should have had a ballistic vest on under the shirt... the shots still would have hurt a ton, but maybe he survives. Still this kind of thing happens even to experienced street cops...too often the guard is let down too soon.
Just a thought, maybe the clerk didn't realize there were 2. I tend to lean that way since the clerk seemed slightly relieved with the one in custody. Hard to say.
@@GLH5MHIL True, a SS agent would know how to clear the room, plus he should've been wearing a vest protecting CJ. It might have been better if it was a drive-by shooting
I thought this was one of Josh and Amy's best moments in the series. They're having a vicious argument about idealism vs pragmatism, practicality vs progress, and they drop it immediately because someone who neither of them knew, but knew was close to someone they cared about, was lost.
You aren't the only people who notice that this was unrealistic for a trained agent to not secure his surroundings. In fact, the secret service agent who trained Mark Harmon for the role called him up and asked Mark Harmon why didn't Donovan check the perimeter! Of course MH could only play it the way the writers wrote it. Honestly, I think they just wrote that scene for dramatic purposes, not really because of realism. Still, it was a powerful scene nonetheless.
SO true Carl...I mean how often when so many of us just go to the store to pick up something simple & as in SImon's case, a candy bar of all things, something as sweet as he...and yes, gone in an instant...I literally jerked in my seat..I thought at the very least, he would have been shot in a non-fatal area so as to keep us going for his character (or almost died). For me, this is solid writing because it takes guts as a writer to kill a character that the audience loves & cheers for.
@nyraider91 Considering the position the second robber had from where he shot, he still had a line of fire on the store owner. The store owner was already terrified and couldn't even alert Donovan to the existence of the robbers. Donovan figured that out from seeing the empty cash register himself. So the store owner probably thought he would still be shot if he said anything, regardless of Donovan being present and having revealed his status.
Such a hauntingly beautiful song, fills me with emotion everytime. The video description credits Jeff Buckley, this is his cover, however the song was originally written and performed by Leonard Cohen, who died yesterday. RIP
@@nickhansen8874, god I hope so. Especially since the president tried to undermine our democracy AGAIN. He called Georgia’s Secretary of State to get him free votes
While this was a really well done scene, I’d have to ask how a secret service agent who forgot his handcuffs, his body armor, to check for others in the store and who walked away from a suspect (who he forgot to Mirandize) which he secured with a bow tie, to get a Milky Way... could ever have been on the Presidential retail. I loved this show... but come on!
Donovan was off duty. He was headed back to the field office to change into some more comfortable clothes so that he could spend the night with Claudia Jean. And the thing with the Miranda rights is a myth cooked up by non-Americans, police didn't read Miranda rights to any of the protesters who took to the streets during the George Floyd protests, and it was okay, because they lawyered up faster than you can say "Miranda" so, if someone knows they have the right to an attorney, they damn well know that they have the right to remain silent.
You are not required to be Mirandized when being detained. He didn't actually arrest the suspect, merely detained him. He had to have them send city or state police, they would Mirandize and take the suspect into custody. The thing about this scene that kills me is why didn't the cashier say something about there being another suspect.
@@MandatoryHashTags technically you have a point. However I would then have to counter with; “he failed to give the suspect ANY information about his situation. He did not mirandize nor did he state “You are not currently under arrest, you are being detained at this point while this situation is being investigated.”
The one thing that bothered me about this scene and something that makes it clear Sorkin knew nothing about firearms or tactics, no way would one of the Secret Service's best not be aware of the possibility of a second gunman. He would have made god damned sure the store was clear before lowering his guard.
I've re-watched The West Wing multiple times over the years and I still can't sit through that scene in the store... I either fast forward past it or get up and walk away for a couple of minutes... Tragic.
And after West Wing, we got to see "Ron Butterfield" (Bartlett's chief Secret Service man) on NCIS. "Toby Zeilger" (communications director) played bad guy Harper Dearing on NCIS (after West Wing). Nice to see these talented people.
Also other from WW guested on NCIS. Alan Dale, 1st Director of NCIS was in a couple of episodes of WW, Kathleen York who played Toby's ex, played one of Gibbs ex wives on NCIS, Steven Culp was in both NCIS & WW, Danica McKeller was on NCIS, she played Will Bailey's sister on WW, Terry O'Quinn was on both shows, and others
which is why this is TV not in real life, this is for dramatic effect, so even if it's not real, it's just how they did it. Everyone knows no SS agent would do that, even the actors themselves knew it, the actor's SS trainer even called him about this, but unfortunately this is how they wrote it, and not everything on TV has to follow real life.
I second the notion and even though as I mentioned earlier, I know that this is a TV show, but it is rare when you find a far out series which entertains, makes you think, gets you involved (since M*A*S*H) and a few others, but this was BEFORE cable became digital, this was intense for a lot of us. I want to write like that. I am aiming to write in a way where I will earn responses like yours in my novels. I will keep at it, but I hope that my writing will involve my audience such a response!
As a side note the Secret Service agent who told CJ the Simon was killed guest starred in NCIS as Riley in the two part Enemies Foreign and Enemies Domestic
Ron Butterfield! Head of the President's Secret Service security detail. Played by Michael O'Neill. He's so convincing, people think he is/was an actual agent.
+David Miller He was just great in the role. My only problem with the final episode of the series - and it really bothered me - was the absence of a scene in which Bartlet thanked him, or handed a letter to someone to give to him.
This show used music in the best possible way to underline emotions. This, and "I don't like Mondays" from 20 Hours in America - I will never stop weeping.
Next to the scene where her dad shows his dementia (and of course Leo passing away) I would categorize this as the second/ third saddest scene for her.
This instantly gave me Designated Survivor vibes when First Lady Alex Kirkman had her car accident. I played the song Only You in Designated Survivor as background while watching this and damn, it has a lot of parallels. I mean I adore Danny Doncannon to bits but I always thought what it would look like if CJ and Simon ended up together until Season 7.
I think they did that on purpose to show thinking about CJ all the time was making him sloppy. There were scenes in previous episodes where the stalker was around but the agent was too busy flirting to notice. He even said to CJ he was becoming slow and unprofessional. He didn't deserve to die but it highlights the stakes of his profession they can't afford to make mistakes, and he made a big mistake by mixing his personal and professional life.
As someone who knows dramatic tropes, I could feel a pit forming in my stomach the instant this scene began, but I kept hoping against my instincts that it was going to play out as an 'Aw shucks, good guy showed up in the right place at the right time' scene. Alas...
That's what I said. I mean I know this is only fiction and is a series, but when writing this good gets you involved to the point where you reach for the screen and our response is "Nooooooo!" Now THAT is something! I enjoy chatting with the folks who enjoy the same crime dramas (or any well written program). It's like being in a theater or sharing your living room with the neatest people in the United States. This is what makes the positive aspect of "You Tube" so very pleasant!!
A true disappointment in a show I luv. I always wonder why the gentleman behind the register didn’t give him a signal of 2✌️… I guess because it’s a tv show and they didn’t want his character getting serious with CJ
