For this movie it is important that this character is an astronaut and not a random person off the street. He has had years of preparation for space and isolation.
When you have a million people applying for a job, you pick the best one. For a mission like this, you could literally get six superheroes. That's not the unrealistic part.
@@duxbellorumdraconis This. The book does a slightly better job of covering this and goes out of it's way (a few times, actually), to mention this. Chris Hadfield even commented on this after reading the original book. On how accurate, not just the science of space travel was, but on how the astronauts acted. That you train to not focus on the big impending doom, but rather on just fixing the next step in the problem and then the next etc, because trying to take in everything all at once would overwhelm you and the last place you want someone to freeze up under pressure is on a dangerous space mission.
@@tryveliek7799 "That you train to not focus on the big impending doom, but rather on just fixing the next step in the problem " That is exactly how I approach life. I write down all the steps I need to do a project, then work on what needs to be done first, then next, etc. etc. If you focus on the whole project all the time, you drive yourself crazy. I've read the book and have a copy of the movie. While Andy Weir did an incredible job of getting information from numerous experts to write the book, my biggest complaint is that he failed to consult a farmer or gardener. You ***cannot*** grow potatoes in 4 inches of soil. I've been growing potatoes for at least 20 years and my raised beds only have about 8 inches of soil and I get a lousy crop because the roots need more ***vertical**** space to grow. Both the book and the movie, especially, show Hadley trying to grow potatoes in 4 inches of soil. He would've been better off to dump all the cannisters that folks had stuff in and put the soil in there and then planted the potatoes. Anyhow... that's my two cents worth. :)
@@kalinystazvoruna8702 Andy Weir has mentioned in various interviews that, while he tried to keep everything as realistic as possible, some parts of the story only worked if he fudged the accuracy somewhat. I forget all the things he mentioned specifically, but the big one I remember him saying he disliked having to include, was the Martian storm that kicks off the story, as he knew at the time that Mars doesn't have a thick enough atmosphere to produce a storm with enough force to tear up equipment and knock over heavy stuff the way it does in the book and movie.
I have seen astronauts in interviews confirming how realistic the positivity and solution oriented attitude is. Astronauts selection criteria include temperament and attitude, so while it might not be realistic for us „normal“ people, it is credible for Astronauts...
They say that, but no astronaut has had to live in isolation on a planet for years like the fictional Mark Watney. They are in fact normal people, no matter what training they've gone through. There's no way you'll know how well you'll handle that type of situation.
@@taral1671 Try looking up the famous "Houston, we've had a problem" transmission. Not the Apollo 13 movie one, but the actual radio clip. Those guys are eerily calm for such a life-threatening situation.
@@ocadioan Spot on. Astronauts are selected for their ability to problem solve in high stress situations. Going into hysterics or having a mental breakdown is not useful when you need to make split second "do or die" decisions. That's why the early astronauts were test pilots. They were used to the fact that you need to keep a cool head when things go wrong, or you're dead. They feel stress sure, but compared to the average joe on the street, they are absolute masters at keeping their emotions in check and fixing the problem.
@@taral1671 another example is soyuz 5 landing. There was a failed speration during reentry and the cosmonaut knew that he would burn up. Instead of crying or panicking, he stayed calm. Even during reentry, he was writing notes and voice recordings to give information. He even thought to cover himself over the notes and voice recordings to make sure it had a good chance of making it. Lucky for his, the service module that failed to detach melted first, and his capsule flipped around with the heat shield. And to add to his badassery, once he landed, the first thing he said was a joke about how the cigs the recovery crew gave him were cheap and bad.
@@taral1671 he wasn’t on mars for years but a little over a year and y’all who never watched the movie or read the book so quick to judge how unrealistic this is based on two random guys who probably never watched the full movie either.
I think the reason why Watney doesn't break down more is because he has a very dark sense of humor. The book explains it a bit better, but I could see it in the movie too. He is in a dark place mentally, but he tries to see it the best way possible. I'm kinda similiar in that sense that I'm a pessimist. That doesn't mean that I'm all doom and gloom all the time. I tend to call it positive pessimism. "Smile, because tomorrow will be worse". It doesn't meanyou should give up, but cherish the good things you have today because you might lose them tomorrow. A dark sense of humour helps with that. I can make fun of this hardship, so I can work with it
When I had a close call with a house fire, I was by myself and managed to just get my dog and cat into their carriers and outside, and call 911. Afterwards, while the firefighters were putting things out, I was... not perfectly calm, but making sure my mom was ok (she was in hysterics) and my brother (the fire started in his room so he felt guilty). I didn't even think to bring a jacket outside, I just got the hell out of there, and it was February. A neighbor offered me a jacket. I said, and I quote: "Nah, don't worry. If I get too cold, I can just go close to the house again." I broke down when my aunt came by, finally, but I think that that little joke helped me keep my sanity for a little longer.
Ahh my dark humored peoples.... We should thank the morbidly humored eras before us for engraining such twisted ways of seeing the world into our beings ¦} I enjoy it very much
@@remakethestars2683 "I wish I could tell you that I laughed in the face of death, that I came to terms with my own mortality... really, all I could think of was AAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!"
You guys talk a lot about the character of Matt Damon not showing the trauma he's suffering and that he does not spend enough time lamenting on himself. The issue is that you are not considering the very specific psychology of astronauts. Those guys are specifically selected for their capacity to always be optimistic, to always be solving the problem at hand, there is always a solution to your problems and it's your job to find it before you die. In my opinion and also a lot of astronaut opinions, the psychology of Matt Damon's character is the most realistic thing about that movie.
And in the books he was stated to be a special specimen in that regard. In their testings he not only withstood the stress tests better, he was also able to relieve the tensions in his teammates with his humour.
I don’t know if I agree. If you’re interested, look up the Podcast ‘The Dome’. There were a number of isolation tests where people, picked for this reason, we’re put in the same dome for over a year and they get very stressed with each other. I think these events are going to change a person and showing that change as trauma isn’t going to negatively impact the movie. I’m ranting, I’m sorry. Have a great day!
@@lewiserickson1087 I am talking about real astronaut and the way they are selected. Indeed most random people would kill eachother if you put them in such a setting
And the other thing to consider is his sarcasm. Sarcasm can cover up a LOT of emotions because it's used as a means of venting while also as a way of finding a way to laugh in the face of not so pleasant circumstances - because the alternative is to cry or scream, neither of which was going to help in his case because he was literally in a life or death situation. The drive to live is a VERY powerful motivator. And even having been in some emotionally trying situations, I know that you have to choke down emotions in certain situations. The worst psychological impact of doing so comes AFTER the trauma is over.
You can hear this in the video if you look for it: The video is about how, from Johnathan's perspective as a therapist, typical people generally react to situations such as these. This makes sense for the subject of the video, but it does mean they judge the realism of Matt Damon's behaviour through the lense of normal humans. From that perspective, where they 'expect' the movie to teach us about ourselves rather than some astronaut, Matt is too upbeat... because typical humans would be like that. In a better definition of 'realistic' -- where Matt being an astronaut and not a typical human is taken into account -- Matts behaviour would be judged differently. But that is not really important for the context of this video. It is still useful to know, lest you get the wrong impressions about your own reality. But I can totally see why they John and Alan saw it they way they did.
I remember reading Martian when I was deeply, clinically depressed and being perplexed by his will to survive and get out of there rather than just offing himself or laying down and waiting for death, it actually made me more willing to keep going
He survived by using his greatest characteristics. His humor was a huge weapon and despite all the challenges that pulled him down and broke him a little it was his effort to maintain his personality that kept him focusing on surviving and solving one problem at a time. It's got to be one of the greatest survival stories made.
Same. 30 years of mental illness and instability. The book and movie inspired me to keep battling it and say "Fuck off, illness. You won't drag me down." Am actually a lot better now. (don't get me wrong, my battle was 10 years long; it wasn't just watching one movie, but still it helped a lot)
Just goes to show the power of stories, mate. Narratives like this, fiction or non-fiction, can be very powerful and affecting because they tap into the truths we all need.
I’m a nurse and once had a patient who became a quadriplegic at a very young age from no fault of her own. I met her years into her new, altered life, and she was exceedingly cheerful, kind, and optimistic. I asked her why she was so happy, when many others in her situation are not. She said to me “I can be happy and paralyzed or sad and paralyzed, but either way, I’m paralyzed.” She told me this 5 years ago and I still remember her example and it still inspires me to choose a good attitude no matter the circumstances.
"From no fault of her own"? How many quadriplegic folks end up that way because of something _they_ did? The only example I can think of is reckless/drunk drivers but I'd imagine they're more likely to end up dead most of the time.
this channel is the most hidden jem in all of youtube! i love smaller channels because they actually pay attention to their comments and viewers its all great! but this channel one-hundred percent deserves more subscribers than it does
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The dude is an astronaut, not a shipwrecked FedEx executive. NASA literally trains and tests these guys for situations of isolation and failure _exactly_ like this.
You can only train so much for any scenario. His reaction when he realizes it's over reminds me of soldiers that have found a way to cope during deployment but as soon as they finally get back there's just this overwhelming sense of relief.
What test would be applied for 2 plus years of zero human or any life contact? An afternoon or a day or two of isolation wouldn’t compare. At some point the mind would break
Being someone who's had *anxiety attacks in the middle of a room with nobody really noticing, I'm a huge fan of subtly acted but clear terror in movies. And also of this channel! Cheers.
I have no psychology degree, I have read that panick attack and anxiety attack are two differents things. Do you know if you had panick attacks or anxiety attacks?
@@trekadouble757 Hello! You're absolutely right, I have a bad habit of writing panic attacks instead of anxiety attacks. In moments of social shame or embarrasment, or when confronted with certain failure, I often experience anxiety attacks based on social anxiety. I don't have them as often nowadays, however, as I have graduated from the unfortunately shame and failure heavy highschool! :) I'm kinda charmed you asked! Hope I answered your question xP :)
@@bjaogh Hey! I mean to write anxiety attacks, I'll edit that now. I always mix the two up :/. I believe the difference between them is that panic attacks are seemingly random, and can come at any time from out of nowhere, where as anxiety attacks are deeply rooted, and caused by heavy anxiety. That's mostly just my guess tho xP :)
When my daughter was born she had a double lung collapse and the doctors were visibly stunned that she was alive. People were shocked by how I was handling it and that I looked perfectly calm and in control. When I ran into two friends away from my wife at the time and the situation and they were putting my daughter on a helicopter to be treated with a procedure that didn't exist I dropped to my knees and started sobbing uncontrollably because I had asked the doctor outside the room to be brutally honest with me. He had told me that no child a month premature had ever survived a double lung collapse at birth. I knew the whole time that there was a near zero chance that she would survive. So yeah, I know what you mean. I'm glad to say that after a doctor spent 48 hours off shift with my daughter and the nurse spent 24 hours off shift, they saved my little girl. She's now a teenager. You do what you have to do. Unfortunately, I think the harder you have to push it out and push it off, the harder it hits you when you finally let it in. It was the hardest thing i've ever been through in my life, and i've been through a lot.
@@arunshajiabrahamThanks. To this day any time I have some money I donate to sick kids of Toronto. They will never understand the gift they gave to me and how much it truly means but every day I thank them for every day I have with my little girl.
I'm so glad that I had watched Gravity before I saw this movie. If I hadn't, then I would have spent half the movie wondering why Matt Damon was vlogging. But as George Clooney tells Sandra Bullock in Gravity, "You never stop talking to mission control." Remembering that helped me enjoy this movie more.
you cannot make orbit from the hubble to ISS to Tiangong, these 3 entities has wildly different orbital inclination that would require not only alot of energy to correct, but more complicatedly would require a correction at their orbit intersect that could not be calculated without a navigation computers, you can't just fire your thruster and reach it, it has to be timed with the intersect and there is no way u can do that on EVA.
I think the emotion you see in the scene where the crew is about to bring him back is not only from being so close to the end, but also hearing a person’s voice for the first time in over a year
on the last point of saying if he had been the one on mars he wouldn't have made it long is actually explicitly stated in the book .IIRC Watney says at one point that it is only possible to survive because he is the botanist and chemist of the mission, if he wasn't there would be no way to even try to go on. Also made clear in the book is that Watney was chosen at least partially for the mission because of the personality traits he has of his humor in the face of adversity and his drive to keep going as being an essential part of the psychological well being of the crew.
I read this book numerous times. The crucial point was that Watney was built as a character to survive this problem. Book conatruction wise Weir went backwards. He made a terrain and an enviroment and then he created his character to complement the enviroment. So in a way hes "built" to live on mars.
@@lindsaygilliss9644 That’s less backwards and more how writing works. If the whole point is someone being stuck on Mars, you gotta make the character work with that setting
@@katphish30 I love both. The movie is easier to digest but didn't touch on several salient points. The book showcases his humor and thought process a lot better but the math and technicalities all go right over my head lol.
The one thing about the Martian that most other Astronaut movies don’t do is accurately show how astronauts deal with stress and problem. Astronauts are picked because they are problem solvers, every single one. Listen to their stories an you will see that even with all the checklists and procedures, it is the astronauts ability to problem solve. They don’t have the emotional breakdowns, panic attacks, and other drama that Hollywood likes to portray. This is because those types of people are weeded out in the training. Panicking doesn’t help in a crisis, solving problems does. So when you are isolated, get a routine and work on your problems one at a time. You may be amazed what you can accomplish.
It's not all that common that a movie captures something for me that the book didn't have (usually it leaves stuff out), but when Watney walks out of the shower and you can count his ribs, it punched me in the gut. The fact that the character could keep it together and stay focused while literally starving was pretty amazing (and inspirational).
I've lived the past 20 years in almost total isolation due to several medical reasons, and from my perspective it looks like the writers got it right with Matt Damon not being super down, super angry, super fearfull and depressed all of the time. When it comes to survival, you just don't have the time and energie to be like that. You have to DO things, plan things in order not to die. Having them, is something totally different than acting out all those feelings and emotions, because that does not help. In fact, that would make survival even more difficult. When it concerns not just an hour, or a day or something like that, so you have to survive for months or even years on your own, depending on your own mind and ability to adapt and improvise with what you have on or with you. Besides that you need to be able to just... live. That means living like everything is as "normal" as can be. Otherwise you don't HAVE a life worth saving in the end. You'd end up an emotional mess and die anyway. The keyword is: adapting. Otherwise, if circumstances do not kill you, your own fears, anger and sadness will.
I have lived in isolation most of my life so quarantine is pretty normal to me, but I think Jesus and God has helped me so much. He’s given me this peace that goes beyond all. Jesus has died for me and you all. Thank you
That's a good point and something that gets touched on in the book. He talks about how getting upset won't help him and that to survive he has to keep moving.
I think you miss the mark a little bit on this one, he's not being quippy for us, he knows he's basically being quippy for whoever's going to find these hard drives near his desiccated corpse. He's whistling past the graveyard, and it's mentioned in the movie, and more in the book, that his characterization is that in stressful situations he deals with it with levity. Like any good astronaut he does not let it get in the way of working the problem, but he knows when he's making those vlogs that he's not expecting to ever see anybody who will watch them. If you look at it from that perspective, the guy is wearing his stress (but rarely, if ever, panic) on his sleeve pretty overtly. You see 80s one-liners from the protagonist. I'm seeing some kid who's having to keep their younger siblings entertained while he makes dinner at 10 years old.
The trembling after a stressful event happens to gazelles or impalas after running away from a predator. It’s natural to feel that and it’s okay...you need to discharge the trauma or else you will keep it stored in the body.
@@serpentinewolf7085 for the gazelle, yes, its tremors are simply its body processing that adrenaline and "winding down" after the trauma. (Trauma can be defined as "an extremely threatening event".) But it's still a useful analogy for the human experience with trauma, and for PTSD. Humans have similar trauma responses fueled by adrenaline, and similarly need to have that "winding down" stage afterwards. In the PTSD books I've read, "discharge the trauma" is kinda shorthand for "the trauma is over, we have experienced the adrenaline, and now we're going to wind down". Part of winding down is chemically processing that adrenaline, and part of it is mentally processing the emotions that we experienced during that trauma. This can look really weird from the outside, but it needs to happen! If humans don't/can't exit that stressed state of mind, can't escape the threatening situation, can't "wind down"... you can easily see how the brain gets in the habit of persistently re-experiencing that terror and producing that adrenaline. And the brain can and does absolutely wreck the body like this (what people mean by "store the trauma in the body"). All because we never got what that gazelle got - a concrete end to the trauma, and a chance to "wind down".
@@serpentinewolf7085 I mean, to be fair, many major causes for large releases of adrenaline *Are* trauma. Plenty of exceptions obviously but they are pretty closely tied
I've read the book a couple times, and I think it deals with isolation a bit better. It's also stated, I forget if it is in the movie, but in the book, that Mark is a much more positive guy, and not having him around the rest of the crew, really affects them. Would love to hear your reaction to the book if you ever get to read it. It's a really good book. Also, the joke about dying to disco music is way funnier and way different in the book. In the book he says, "how can Aquaman control whales? They're mammals. Makes no sense." I find that much funnier.
Alan here. I've read the book a couple times as well. (I still harbor dreams of getting to make it as a 10 part miniseries for HBO someday.) It does deal with the isolation better. I mean, you can only do so much with a ~2hr runtime. Gotta lose some stuff. I really enjoyed the movie, but you're always going to lose something from the source material.
@@CinemaTherapyShow yeah. That's true. This movie is, I think my favorite, book to movie adaptation but I still prefer the book. It was also the first movie I got to see alone- since I can't drive I usually have to see them with somebody else- so this movie has a special place in my heart. It felt good to be able to talk about the movie with other people, and react to it on my own.
I also like the main message of the book more. It's not so much about one person powering through any problem in his way but about humans working together, casting aside their differences and giving up opportunities for personal gain in order to save one person. The book leaves the reader with Marks thoughts about this support and solidarity which we can see often when there is some sort of catastrophe or a hike is lost in the mountains. The last chapter always gives me goosebumps.
@@SucheMeineSocke agreed. I can appreciate book's messages, but I feel like the world needs the message of the book more right now. We spend way too much time considered with what makes us different, rather than thinking about why were the same. I think, for most people, if they thought of the latter, they would realize that, for the most part, people have a lot more in common than they have differences. Also, I feel like the book is funnier. I wish the movie was rated R. A lot of the humor in the book comes from the swearing, and the inappropriate jokes, which the movie wasn't allowed to have as many of. I love the blue joke! It's childish and stupid, but that's what makes it funny. Also, one of my favorite quotes from the book: "Why can Aquaman control whales? They're mammals. Makes no sense." There are so many more, but that one came to mind just now. That book is so quotable! 😀
Yeah . . . the trouble I see is when people who don't have the maturity to properly read and understand others try to use this tactic to break the ice. It's way too easy to end up picking on someone who's just used to keeping their head down, without either side really understanding the other.
In the classroom scene (my own favorite scene in the movie, which wasn't in the book) you have to remember who Watney is talking to. These are astronauts in training. The elephant in the room is that they all know that there may be situations where the best they can do may not be enough. The point is that what he is telling them is a strategy which gives them the best chance of survival.
True - though that's kind of the problem, because the audience he's talking to on screen (astronaut students) are as you say very different to the cinema audience (average people who will apply the advice to general life, or for whom it will reinforce that existing belief that effort overcomes everything). It works in the film, but it has a dual role as being the film's final advice to its audience, in which case this channel's interpretation makes more sense. It might have worked better if his on-screen audience matched the cinematic audience better (so e.g. they could have just had him giving a talk to the general public).
I loved the whole movie and the final scene. Even if I am not as qualified as he is, what's wrong with being encouraged to keep doing the next best thing when the alternative is definitely doom? At least I would be distracted from my imminent doom and feel I have tried my best and, if luck was on my side, put myself in the best position to succeed. I think the only "problem" is just that he added the phrase "then you get to come home" like success is a certainty if you try hard enough, thereby implying that if you don't succeed it means you didn't try hard enough. But as an audience, I didn't take that too literally when i watched it though i guess some people might.. On second thought i sorta understand the cancer example... But i think it is because cancer is different. Doing the "next best thing" (going through chemo) can have strong side effects that really ruins quality of life whereas acceptance might buy you a few more "good days", so you might want to weigh more carefully your chances of success. Whereas Matt Damon's character was in a situation where, if i remember correctly, the actions he took was mostly either helpful or benign depending on luck, but didn't have a huge risk of making his situation worse.. Except that final risky drive to the meeting spot...
@@coffeeteamix Yeah, and even the final risky drive was a choice between definitely starving to death in a deteriorating hab, or try his chances at getting to a pick up point. Crucially though, he didn't just try his odds, but actually experimented and prepared to improve his odds as much as he could.
@@coffeeteamix It's "Then you get to come home, or you die". As opposed to "Then you get to come home, or you failed miserably because you should've given up a long time ago." Unlike normal people, astronauts don't have to spend the rest of their lives regretting their choices because they will die soon after.
I remember a conversation I had on a deployment. "Yeah yeah, we just got blown up. But did you die? no, good now get back to work." Dark humor is what sustained me, and the movie quote game.
@@sarahcox2957 Same. I was in the Navy -- on a ship in port -- on 9-11-2001 and my buddies and I spent most of the day playing D&D and cracking jokes about needing to cancel Christmas. Someone got all pissy about how can we goof off at a time like this and we were like "look, watching CNN all day isn't going to bring those people back to life, and our boiler is torn apart for repairs, so we're not going anywhere. Keep yourself sane so that we can be ready when it's our turn."
A few years ago, a lady was stabbed 3 times in front of where I worked--once in the neck, once through the hand, and once in the arm. I grabbed gloves and gauze, and ran out to help, and 2 other guys who saw it happen also ran over. The three of us patched her up and waited for the ambulance. I was calm, and rode high on that adrenaline until it was over, she was taken to the hospital, and the police had interviewed me. And then, in the quiet, is when I lost it. It's like all that adrenaline catches up to you, and overwhelms you.
A few years ago I actually read the book this movie was based on, and from what I remember it did go deeper into everything then the movie was able to. Understandable, they had to make the movie a reasonable length, so they couldn’t throw in everything. And of course some things just don’t translate well between the two mediums. But it was interesting to see things directly from Watney’s pov, and get to literally read his thoughts. The time jumps were smaller as well, it was a little slower paced, so we really got to see how things progressed with closer detail. Lotta science stuff, still had it’s humorous moments, but all in all there were a couple of things that got left on the cutting room floor, and a few things they added on. One particular thing I thought was cool is that we would take breaks from Watney’s POV and jump into the people back on Earth, or the rest of the Ares crew, and get into their minds as well. The Ares team grieving for Mark, then finding out he’s alive and feeling both relived and guilty, deciding to go get him against orders. The pressure the NASA team feels to quickly get Mark home, all the while trying to satisfy the higher ups and make sure the rest of the Ares crew isn’t put in danger. All that has a nice window into the characters minds. I’ll have to go back and reread it, freshen up my memory. I do remember liking it.
@@CinemaTherapyShow Highly recommend the book! I actually think they did a really good job with the movie as well. The book is excellent and definitely worth the read. Apparently most of the science is pretty accurate too, which is cool.
If u want the psychological intensity that that situation would create, read the book. I won't say it's better cause it's two different experiences, but it's really freaking good
Part of the will is just training. Astronaut training involves hundreds if not thousands of "what if" scenarios to try to teach them to work the problem and get to a solution.
Have had the "I'm completly competent and in control handling this situation. Oh, it's over? We're done? Oh good. {completly looses her sh*t}" experiance myself. Much better to loose it after the crisis than before or during.
I’ve had that experience too - minor fire in the lab and I was alone in the room. Got the fire out, then called a friend and broke down. Sadly, I’ve developed problems with anxiety (not related to previous experiences). I tend to get anxious about things I can’t control, assuming the worst will happen. Maybe not being able to do anything to really solve the issue is what makes it worse.
One of the benefits of being pre-traumatized is that any current traumatic event leaves you detached and shuts off enough of your emotions so that you can handle shit calmly while everyone else is freaking out, and then you have your breakdown once it's over and for days or weeks afterward.
The final comment of "Sometimes the best thing we can do is accept our situation with dignity and see how much good we can do within it" is exactly what was done in the film when he started finishing the experiments when it seemed like he ran out of options. I think you both jumped the gun in the eagerness to poo poo the "I can do it attitude." The idea here isn't that you can beat anything, the idea is you have to try and if some luck comes your way, you can be successful.
I take your point, and agree with you! Don't remember if it made the cut for the episode or not, but Jonathan and Alan actually spent some time discussing that you have to do everything you can do. Just most of us aren't trained astronaut/botanist/mathematicians. So, even doing all we can, we wouldn't be able to, you know, survive for more than a year on Mars.
In truly traumatic situations, I have experienced that. I’m calm and on-point until it’s over and the crisis is past. Then it hits me all at once. However, my big psychology trauma came from not allowing myself time to properly process the realities I was confronted with. Probably something I would like you to touch on in a review at some stage - just how damaging the “macho male” stereotype and the insistence on not talking about or processing trauma is for people who do it.
(jonathan you are a legit hero :D ) And your final thoughts were so wise--sometimes we can fight what opposes us and sometimes the fight is to go through it with grace and dignity.
In Martian, after Iris probe explosion, there was a scene, when Mark was sitting on top of the hill. He was actually ready to die with dignity, like You wrote, because he ran out of his options. But he didn't commit suicide after that scene. I wonder - was It because he didn't give up hope for better days to come? Or maybe he thought he could do as many science experiments as possible, before death, like leaving some useful knowledge or legacy for the rest of mankind?
I think one of the reasons he was able to get through isolation was that he was always recording himself. It feels like talking to someone albeit it's a one sided communication, it's still a Form of communication and keeping sane. If he wasn't doing that, he would have succumbed to insanity caused by isolation way faster
I love this movie and I love the book too. And ever since I watched it, the quote, "If you solve enough problems, you get to come home" has been my mantra for anything stressful or overwhelming.
I was working at a summer camp once and during lunch a kid started to choke. Another counsellor jumped into action to dislodge the item in his throat. After she realized that the kid was OK she completely broke down and realized what could've happened had she not been there.
I think this is a really good way of explaining it tbh. While these traumatic things are happening you don't have time to think about the what ifs and the thank gods, there is an immediate problem right in front of you and you need to focus your whole brain on that, the rest rushes in later
My experience with something that was scary but didn't effect me until after was about a year ago around Halloween. I went to a theme park with my friends for an event they have there called "Halloween Haunt" where the park stays open very late into the night and everything is Halloween themed. The park is full, long lines everywhere. We were on our first line to a ride when suddenly a group of teens run past us and looking back. We were confused and soon after EVERYONE ran in different directions. Many climbing over the fence. There was screaming and we heard there was a shooter in the park (It was a false alarm, but we didn't know at the time).Soon after a police helicopter flew over with a searchlight on. I was worried, but I kept calm and kept my friends together and calm. The ride area cleared and we hid there behind some trashcans for a bit as it was out of the way before we left. After that incident I was very scared and thinking about what if it was real. I get anxiety just thinking about it and that place again.
I'm so sorry that happened to you. I'm not a therapist, but I had some PTSD issues and I think if you're still having those problems after a year it's probably best to speak to a therapist, if you can. Good luck either way. My situation has improved and I'm sure yours will with time and compassion - from your loved ones but also self-care. I also found CBT-based mindfulness really helpful for managing the panic/stopping a situation escalating that far. I dunno if there's any good stuff for free on here, but if you want to I could send you some of the audio files my therapist gave me, so you can try it..?
This story kind of touches on what you are talking about on the 11 minute mark. My mom passed away suddenly and my younger brother found her, I remained mostly calm, trying to calm him, calling my older sister, my aunt, my uncle, my dad and step mom. Informing the parmedics/cops of everything, I was able to keep a strong front but as soon as my dad got there (he couldn't get there quickly) I just broke down. There were other similar incidents where it was terror but I have learned that keeping those calm around you by being calm no matter how scared or sad you are helps the situation so much more.
That part in the storm when he’s trying to count potatoes is the most relatable to me. That part where he visibly gets overwhelmed and cries out feels so much like me in the throes of anxiety sometimes.
I always like to think that when someone is going through a trauma, you just get that fight or flight feeling. We’re so distracted with the survival aspect and just getting from place to place that we don’t realize or even accept what’s happening to us, but once we move on, finally finding that safe place to land, once we are stable, or close, we have that space to process. We have that space to just finally breakdown and accept what has happened to us. Without going into much detail, my own boyfriend for years was in an extremely abusive relationship with his ex-wife. She manipulated and abused him in many ways but he just accepted what was going on because he loved her. Once they broke things off he had just started to process everything but hadn’t truly accepted that it was over and therefore still in that fight or flight mode. Once he and I met, and the honeymoon phase was over, he started to experience some pretty clear symptoms of depression and PTSD from his previous relationship. And it was only when good things started to happen, like his newly found independence and seeing friends he hadn’t talked to for 5 or so years, that he felt safe enough to let those feelings out. Matt Damon and Ridley Scott as well as the rest of the cast, pulled off this scene really well. Having that feeling like being so close to the end of that and being safe and where you feel like you can express all of these pent up emotions, and the execution being so subtle but so real. Looking back and seeing that scene now, after being with my boyfriend and what he has gone through, it just makes this scene even more believable and honest.
I think another really important point is Watney's haste to reassure his commander that she made the right call with the information she had and that he doesn't blame her for it because that guilt would eat at most of us if we were in her boots.
The movie does show acceptance of what you can’t control when he went from hating the disco music to jamming out to it. But I agree the overall message of the movie doesn’t work in all situations.
Just found this video! The Martian was an instrumental book in helping me find my way back from a depression fueled psychotic break; mirroring the way I felt. Feeling a sort of isolation of the mind, knowing that to ever return to 'normal', I had to "do the work" of reconnecting to the world outside of the mental Mars I had stranded myself on. Knowing I had the option to just isolate and mourn my life, essentially waiting to die. Watney was a blueprint I didn't know I needed.
I can attest to the music thing. My sister used to do gymnastics and every girl had the same floor music. Every. Single. One. So I would be at her meets and quickly get sick of the music but a while later I would catch myself singing along to it.
11:30 I think the reason why most of the time people don't freak out in situations like that is because it's not a safe place to break down. I've had panic attacks and I've certainly freaked out in my head but I've never freaked out or had a panic attack in front of anyone - ever. For me it's always a safety issue. For strangers, it's the fact that I don't trust them to take care of me if that happens and for family and friends it's because I don't want them to see me like that or get burdened or anything with it. I always get through the moment and then run to my room, a bathroom, or a closet and freak out there. It's just feels safer for me. Idk if it's the same for everyone but that's what I would assume.
I think one of the things missing from your assessment is that he's an astronaut. He isn't going to react the same way an average person would with the isolation.
I love this film and the book even more! I feel like you don't see the trauma mark is going through. Basically the story is told from his logs for the main part, he thinks there could be a chance, even if he dies (which he actually thinks, if I can remember correctly) that his crew or his family could see it. And mark's a pretty kind guy, he doesn't want people to blame themselves for his death, so he keeps it light. I think the movie did a pretty good job with this: the more vulnerable parts are when the cameras aren't rolling so to speak. When he can process it just a little. I don't think he allows himself to process it until he's safe, because he wants to survive and he knows "if you solve enough tasks you get to go home". He had two choices, carry on and survive, deal with his physical needs or deal with his emotional ones.
I always thought during the movie, between scenes the guy has a breakdown or let’s his walls down for a minute. He’s alone on a planet and most likely will die, he definitely had moments in the middle of the night hand freaks out for a minute. The humor helps him not go insane and fall into a pit of despair. Which I really appreciated when watching the movie and reading the book. It’s space terror with a spoonful of sugar.
The thing you said about cancer is very pointnet. I heard therapists say that there's a HUGE problem in a videly-accepted concept of "beating cancer", like it's some sort of a fight or a course of action you can take to make it better. That's why a lot of people who are "losing" to cancer feel like it's their fault, that they were not strong enough or something. When in reality it's really a dice roll.
I think the abusive mother-daughter relationship, as well as the manipulation of the other mother in Coraline, would be really interesting to analyze from a therapist's standpoint as well as a filmmaker in how they convey the message and theme through claymation.
5:51 This is why I watch videos like this. I never would have noticed this detail. My appreciation of this movie, and all movies that use this detail, just increased.
The "everything is going to go south, and this is it or get to work" is very easy to believe. I do it every day. It's not about solving problems, it's about dealing with the "now", doing what needs to be done in that moment and then moving down the to-do list. Sometimes it's the only way to get through the day. " just keep swimming" - Dory in Finding Nemo
I was a case manager at a behavioral hospital and I had sooo many incidents where a patient became violent with me. All of my coworkers told me that’s it’s the job and I just need to calm down and move on. This is the first time I’ve heard anyone else say they had a reaction just like mine. It’s really nice to feel like I wasn’t being weak and that other people reacted like I did too. Thank you both!
Haha, I love how they say at 12:00 that Matt Damon's acting in the ascent scene is "a bit bigger" but still compliment him on his "acting choice". Looking at behind the scenes material, it emerges that this is actually NOT acting. Matt only had a limited number of scenes with other people and when the voices of his supposed crew companions were played back during this scene, he got emotional for real. They used that first take they shot.
Great topic gentlemen! I did read the book years ago long before the movie was filmed. When I finally did watch the whole movie, I had a greater admiration for the men and women who train to do the impossible possible. And yes, I did have a similar experience of being calmed and then shaking and shivering and a bit of crying afterwards. Many years ago when I was in H.S. I was working in a small restaurant there were six of us, but that day only two of us girls were there servicing and cleaning around the menu area. At almost closing time a couple of young guys just went in, we told them they only had a few minutes we were about to close for the night. That's when one of them showed and waved a gun at us. They ordered us to make them food, then asked us for the safe's combination (but the only person who had the safe combination was the owner/manager), then ordered us to step into the freezer, they brought us in and out of the freezer a bunch of times. Jen and I were calmed and just listened to them. Then a call came in through the backroom phone, it was the owner on speaker asking why haven't we clocked out or closed the cash register. We stayed calm and told them there was nothing to worry about. All they had to do was leave and let us close for the night. As soon as they left, one of them pointed the gun at me with a wink (like we will be seeing you again). I called 911, as soon as the police and our boss arrived we were both shivering and crying. A week later they found the guys who stepped into the restaurant and wanted us to identify them personally. Jen didn't want to do it, so I went into the station and they did not show me but I saw them. My whole body froze and I couldn't point. I was shivering and I stuttered 'That's definitely them" and I ran out of there. I never felt like that since. I can't imagine anyone a man or woman being put into a difficult situation that you have to endure, stay clam and just wait for that ring at the end. I can't imagine what astronauts have to go through in order to thrive in even greater danger. #CinemaTherapy #TalktoSomeone Don't keep it in.
I ran a 50 mile race this May on Antelope Island and empathized with Matt Damon’s character in the scene as he is waiting to reunite with his crew. I spent so many months of training, so many long hours every day putting miles in to get ready all culminating to seeing the finish line. Then I began hearing the voices of my family cheering in the distance when they saw me. I started crying. I managed to pick up my pace through the pain and exhaustion I ran faster until I crossed the line & completely broke down. You finally allow yourself to believe that you did it. That you made it. You smell, you hurt, you can’t stop smiling and crying. It’s awesome. The character went through 3 years with every day working the problem hoping it would be enough to get him home & at that moment he could see the finish line even if he truly was still in danger. He achieved the goal of surviving until help arrived. It was so well acted.
That thing that he says to the students at the end, that's something I've seen echoed by people like Jim Lovell (Apollo 13 astronaut) and Jocko Willink (SEAL team combatant swimmer, commander and instructor, at various times). Their attitude is basically don't entertain failure for a second: just stop a second, prioritise and deal with the problems you have in priority order. If you're successful you might live, but panicking or freaking out is not going to work. You keep working on the problems until either the problems have been eliminated or you are actually dead. Both men of course are highly, highly trained and famous for their unwavering bravery.
I was in high school. Working at my grandpa's cabinet shop. Contracts were slow, so we were remodeling grandma's kitchen. A coworker cut off his hand. Thumb, index, and pointing finger completely severed. I got him off to the hospital, reported it to grandpa, treated a coworker for shock, cleaned the mess, then put away all the tools and equipment. All that done, then I couldn't stop shaking. In the navy I operated nuclear power plants for twenty years. Same exact experience a number of times. I think the details of them are classified. I enjoy your channel. As a writer and really, as a human, your insight is helpful.
One of my favourite tidbits about the movie is the scene where Watney is getting ready to launch again, according to Matt Damon, it had been him alone in front of the cameras for months, and Ridley Scott actually brought Jessica Chastain in to talk to Matt for that scene without telling him, and it brought that authenticity to his performance there.
I've totally experienced that! My sister almost died after giving birth and I held it together for her so she wasn't scared but as soon as I stepped out to call my mom all I could say was "mommy" and lost it.
I know I am late to the party but I just wanted to add that another movie that portrays the whole "getting emotional after the thing has ended" theme very well is "Captain Phillips". Tom Hank's performance at that specific scene is simply spectacular!
I only just ran into this channel today, and it has quickly become one of my favorite channels. Started with the Inside Out video, which I could highly relate to myself. But now I have to know has he told the story of the knife yet?
13:39 i have been in a similar situation, not on mars obviously, but i was lost in the woods for 6 days and this (at least for the short period of time i got lost) is all it is: Identify your problems prioritize them and solve them. My main concerns were ration my water and food, find shelter and build fire, and then find your way out
Could you do a video about Hal in Megamind? I've personally met several hals in my life and would live insight on how they work and why they act that way?
the book actually talks a bit more about the psychological aspect of it. they talk about doing training in isolation for an extended period, preparing for cases where they're stuck in a rover when the crew can't rescue them. and i think andy weir also talked about purposely creating a character whose social role in the team was to diffuse tension with humor and optimism. of all the crew he was probably the most psychologically well equipped to survive
Some of the stuff you guys said about anxiety might be so useful for me to cope with mine. Every time I used to go to a concert I’d freak out the days prior to it cause it was a huge deal for me, but next time I’ll just try not to think about it and focus on the little tasks I have to do for the concert instead of thinking about how big of a deal it is to me.
The experience of the tension of an intense situation releasing can leave you more shot and shaken than any intense situation by itself. All that adrenaline fading, or rushing in, wrecking your brain and state of mind for a short time.
That question is a set-up for a joke in the original book, too. It's even funnier in the book, and it shows how Watney was using a bit of escapism to deal with it.
around 11:30 ish. Best advice I ever got re: acting in a crisis. "The relevant part of PTSD during a crisis situation is 'Post'. Function now! Fall apart latter." So good on yah. Nailed that.
I get the shaking thing after a presentation at school or getting really excited talking to someone and think I'm making risky moves by picking a stupid topic or talking too much.
Dude that adrenaline rush thing is crazy. When I was in high school I worked as a lifeguard for several years and my 2nd year there I was the primary on a two-child save and I somehow stayed in the zone and remembered everything and then, an hour after it was over, the adrenaline wore off and I couldn't stop the tears because - even though everything went fine - there was so much unresolved emotion left over after the adrenaline that had to be dealt with and I just had to let it happen.
I really appreciate your videos. They are very informative, yet entertaining. You guys have great chemistry and the way you recount your own experiences never seems boastful, just genuine. About the falling apart after the action dies down: I'm a paramedic. In Germany where I live there's a way to become a paramedic that takes only three months, one month of studying and two months of practical training. Where I was stationed at afterwards, there was a big personal shortage so I was immediately put to full use and always placed with younger and still in training colleagues. I felt terribly unprepared and overwhelmed. I remember one of my first missions, where control told us "I have no other vehicles near, you're going to be on your own for a while". On my way there, were I was just sitting next to my driver I was shaking like a leaf. If I would've opened my mouth, you would've heard my teeth chattering. I was terrified. When we arrived at the scene, it stopped. There was no fear, I didn't even have to think, about what I was supposed to do, I just did. Everything worked fine and knowing how my body reacts to these situations has since helped me tremendously to stay calm.
Concentrating on the problems that you can do something about is also a theme throughout "Bridge of Spies" - a main character is asked several times if he's worried about an outcome and he always replies "Would it help?" Love that!
I think you have missed the fact this film is based on a book so it is not the filmmakers who made the decision on Watney's demeanor but the author. And the author goes into Mark Watney's personality, why he was chosen for the mission, and how he copes in grand detail that a 90 minute movie just cannot touch on. Read the book, it is brilliant.
I've been thinking about this movie a lot during quarantine (I'm in a country where we're not meant to have people over as guests even) not only because I like to pretend I'm just training for Mars but because I do things like talk to myself and pretend I'm recording videos and of course videocalling actual people, and I remember when I saw the movie thinking the diaries were really smart.
I just found this channel yesterday, and I absolutely adore you guys. I’m an aspiring filmmaker (at least at the moment), who attends therapy every Thursday, so seeing those two elements combined is really cool. I love the work you guys do, keep it up! On another note, do you guys only react to movies, or would you consider doing TV shows in the future? Thanks, guys! Keep being awesome!
The capstone wisdom of the film is a mindset shared by most astronauts. During a test flight for the Apollo program there was an electrical failure that could have been the end of the mission. In a later interview Armstrong was asked whether or not he thought about death in that moment. His response was something akin to "We were too busy trying to fix the damn thing."
I had something like what Jonathan said that he went though. Not the talking someone out of hurting their wife. One time a middle schooler at a private school I went to decided to push the intruder alarm, and the whole school went into lockdown. Nobody could leave the classrooms they were in. All of my friends were scared for their lives. The police came to the school. It was a mess. But when we could finally leave, as soon as I stepped out of the room I started shaking. The worst thing that came from that incident (besides the terror everyone felt) the stupid middle schooler is still in the school. He had lied and said that it was an accident even thought there was camera footage of him walking up to the intruder alarm (it was a button that had a large sign that read "Emergency Lockdown. Alarm Will Sound" ).
When it comes to things going wrong in space I think this movie did a great job portraying how someone who's highly trained, fit, educated and self-disciplined can overcome inconceivable odds. It's not without precedent either. Real life examples of things going wrong in space like Apollo 13 likewise showcased how people with "the right stuff" can get to work and get home despite there literally being a big hole blown out of the side of your spacecraft. In fact the Apollo astronauts were specifically selected BECAUSE they had personalities best suited to cope with situations where everything could suddenly go wrong.
I like the idea that by solving smaller problems rather than think negatively about the mountain of problems you are facing, you can find your way out but sometimes, even thinking, be it positive or negative, is not an option. People often talk about fight or flight and in the process forget that doing neither is also a natural response. When faced with struggles, you can freeze and have all thoughts and rationality escape you, regardless of what you may like to try and overcome them. This movie is great and the positivity is important but without the training and selective process that Matt Damon's character would have gone through, he would have stumbled before taking the first step considering the odds he was set against.
I've always been put off by the trope "don't worry about things you can't control". It strikes me as absurd. Why would I worry about things I CAN control? If a problem is within my control, I'll take action to solve it. Sitting around stressing or worrying about things that I can resolve is wasteful and pointless. On the other hand, if something is outside my scope of control, THOSE are the realities that I need to come to terms with emotionally.... and finding acceptance in those uncontrollable realities is probably the most difficult thing you can do, but you have to grapple with it. You can't simply shrug it off and say "Que sera sera".... because those realities may very well come to pass and if you are unprepared for it, it could destroy you. Also, I enjoyed the discussion around the notion of "the power of positive thinking". I'm familiar with a saying: "whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right", and the sheer hubris of that statement baffles me. The very idea that one can presume to control the universe with a can-do attitude is laughable, and frankly an insult to anyone for whom life didn't work out perfectly, as the saying implies that if you fail at anything... EVER... it's because you weren't trying hard enough....
In Melbourne Australia, we did one of the toughest lockdowns. Curfews, mandatory masks, travel restrictions, limits on visitors and gatherings. Permits to travel and work. Police checks, fines. Non-essential businesses closed.
@@eurekahope5310 very fatiguing. Over 200 days total. But it saved our public health care hospitals and many of our elderly, who were the hardest hit. This was pre-vaccine. Once the vaccination numbers started climbing, the restriction eased.
The books are always better, but The Martian is just an absolutely incredible book. It's filled with all this high-level science explained in a way that anyone can understand
@@SamanthaLaurier Andy Weir’s awesome like that! I liked Artemis more than The Martian (and I still need to read Project Hail Mary), but all of his writing is fantastic, including his short stories.
11:30 my sister had to get spinal fusion surgery to fix her scoliosis when she was 14. The day of the surgery, my mom was putting on a brave face the entire procedure. It wasn’t until the head surgeon came out and told my parents she was okay and that the surgery was a total success that she let it all out
I loved Ad Astra. People were like 'it didnt have a story' 'it was so pointless' but I was like 'the story was his emotional journey. The point was dealing with his mental and emotional issues' which is something most people dont like to confront, but we eventually have to.
Hoenstly, I feel like a lot of people will feel that moment of extreme stress where they function through it and then break down once they're in a relaxed state. Sometimes it's really dramatic....sometimes it's very small. One time I remember having that experience was when I was living at my parents after university. Got up, found a note from my mom saying she'd taken my dad to the hospital and that she'd call as soon as she could. I never got the call, and was getting increasingly worried. Got to 6pm-ish, so I put on the news as a way to distract myself, and my parents walk in looking like ghosts. A doctor had diagnosed him with lymphoma - cancer in the lymph nodes, which means its spreads through the body fast. I had them sit down, then got up, started making dinner. Brought out plates of food to them, so on and so forth. Eventually they decided to try to get some sleep, so I bade them good night, went down to my room and just started bawling. Next morning, my dad's doctor calls us up - he doesn't have cancer, he has swollen lymph nodes. Which happens for lots of reasons. The most common one is that you're sick - your lymph nodes are basically the arms industry of your immune system, so when your immune system is going to war, they swell up and get really busy. The _least_ common one is cancer. You can probably tell the difference by looking at them hard enough, but with a CT scan alone, the only way you can tell the difference is whether or not the swelling goes down later. My dad didn't have cancer, he had a cold or something. But that one night when we thought he did, I was operating at peak efficiency to get him and my mom through it.
"I can choose to have a sense of humour." That has been saving me multiple times over during the pandemic. "There can be tremendous warmth in teasing each other and giving each other crap." Yes. "He has had to be strong or had to be focused for so long, [then close to the finish line or at the finish line, he unravels in emotions]." Yup.
Something interesting to look at is if Mark is the all-american-hero: how that image has changed. In the 60's that was a balding bachelor in his late 50's with a PhD who could bench press his body weight. 80's 90's it was a marine with celebrated PTSD. What is it now?
It really resonated with me when y'all were talking about how all the feelings hit you once control is out of your hands. I found out I needed to have a LARGE tumor removed in 2019 and, from cancer diagnosis to surgery day, I only had about a month to process everything. I threw myself into putting my ducks in a row: creating my Will/Living Will, deciding what I want done to my body/planning my funeral if things went south and updating my life insurance beneficiaries. I spent most of my time making jokes of my situation and focused on being my normal, perky, goofy self to comfort and reassure my loved ones. I didn't really take the time for myself to process EXACTLY what was about to, and could potentially, happen to me. On the day of my surgery, the operating team came and introduced themselves to me, gave me the low down, had me sign some forms and, even then, I was mostly trying to be upbeat for my Partner. But when the doctor came up and told him it was time - that he had to go sit in the waiting room with my family for the next 6 hours - watching him walk away and realizing I was on my own now and my fate was in the hands of strangers... I starting shaking and hyperventilating the moment he was out of sight. It really does all comes crashing in at once. All the courage and humor you needed to reassure yourself and your loved ones is no longer necessary or helpful. It's just you and this terrifying reality you simply cannot hide from anymore.
the book has this same kind of tonal shift too. Mark's main thing is that of the Ares astronauts he IS the best person to not only survive but thrive in isolation. there was a featurette before the movie came out where they interview the astronauts after being in isolation and you can see that the other astronauts are effected in some way...and Mark goes on a tangent on Aquaman's powers ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-E9LJkUwiYZY.html
The Martian is my favorite sci-fi book so far. The movie is good too, but the book shows you pretty much everything Mark is going through. It's awesome. Also, that scene you opened up with is hilarious. 😂
