Touch Screen MS-DOS PC from 1983 

That was excellent problem solving. It shows how dead ends and false assumptions can lead you in the wrong direction, but using common sense and observation can keep you progressing forward.

I was gonna say to hit up curiousmarc on YT for all things HP, he's probably got one or at least may have a line on the service manual.

Niall Fleming Or the Imsai guy also great Retro Computer Channel and Former HP guy

You've taken away my chance to comment that those error codes clearly mean "Fault with error reporting system". Heh. Anyway, this must be one of your very best repairs yet, considering the lack of documentation and that tricky board.

Maybe it's just me but I can't figure out which pages you mean. I opened that link and tried PDF page 88, nope. 8-8? Nope. *-88? Doesn't exist. Anyone able to find it?

How old are you ?

​@@revoltosotintan I never saw this comment before. You asked how old I am. Well, now I'm 68.

This probably was one of the best products you could get as a professional back then, the level of integration was ahead of its time because we didn't see similar products from IBM until 5 years later. HP always gave me the impression they are behind the scenes doing their professional focused products very well but they had problems with the commercial ones. This is on my perspective on have been a salesman for the company about 15 years ago, their public commercial PC products were a little of a clown show withe very dubious decisions. Later I got into IT and now I'm working in mainframe and learned what they are about really. All their professional products are top notch, I have owned several office HP laptops and they are the best I tried, best ergonomics, durability, service, I even bought them second hand for relatives and they still kick strong. They are the one of the few who offer the 6 del/ins/home/end/pgup/pgdn row in 14 and less inches laptops, which they are absolutely mandatory for my work. I had to work with a similar Dell for a while and asked for an HP replacement because it just wrecked my workflow. Those are the good details.

@kevinlsims7330What are you talking about? HP didn't make copy and fax machines, at least not in any significant quantity back then. The printers and plotters they made were designed to be used with their test equipment, just like their computers. Their main business was test equipment and computers of various sizes. The LaserJet and all that came later. Also, it's really, really not necessary to capitalize every single word in a sentence, it comes off as really obnoxious and difficult to read .... Also, if you read what the original commenter said (who actually worked for HP and would probably know better)... this wasn't a "blunder", this machine still sold very well because, like their other computers before and after this point, they were designed to be used with HP's test equipment and engineering tools to create custom test and verification setups. So you could have one of these machines connected to a whole rack of HP test equipment on an assembly line, and do extensive testing to make sure your product was working correctly. This was HP's bread and butter during the 70s and 80s. Go check out the HP test equipment catalogues from the 1970s, their computers were listed in there because that was how they viewed their computers first and foremost -- tools to be used with test equipment to automate and log results.

Yeah good point!! Like all the HP scientific and test stuff back then :-)

@1000 Subs with just Playlists Not really sure, all I know is I have a 2005 HP laptop that runs well with no heat issues, and three HP laptops from 2008 and 2013 that have absolutely terrible heat issues (i had to remove the plastic vents over the single tiny cooling fan to get it to stay on during summer this year), and I've had two HP printers fail fairly quickly recently, plus my grandma got an HP printer where the wireless function, which was one of the main selling points, stopped working after a couple days, and when we went to return it, there were two other people in the queue with the same printer. After that, that model of printer was advertised as a USB printer only, with no wireless functionality.

1000 Subs with just Playlists - the Compaq acquisition is what really did it for the consumer stuff, they spun that off to Compaq. If you look at the computers just before and just after that, the difference is obvious. Their enterprise grade stuff is still alright these days.

HP started going down hill when they started having a string of successively worse CEOs who cared more about lining their pockets than actually making good products. it's pretty sad.

@1000 Subs with just Playlists nice username made chuckle! I've seen some really creative ones though so definitely a good one. Story behind it? If there was one?

this was also my first year of seeing 3d graphics running on some development prototype display of a car rotating in air, it was a dodge Charger Shelby graphic picture rendered in 3d and it was eye candy never seen in the bay area. They also had a Ink "Plotter" that was huge but could print in color! like an artist, it would spin a color pallet of ink jars, pick the pen and like modern 3d printers, it would draw using vectors. I would say I was amazed, but now I think I spent too many hours wasted as a youth. HP security officer (AKA globe security) 1986 - 1989

@@trs-80fanclub12 same time, I had a Highschool buddy who's dad was sales director of HP Germany. You can imagine the stuff this guy had in his basement... it was amazing. He sourced HP-11 calculators for his inner circle at school, have mine still, running like new. Programmable calculators weren't allowed to use in school, but the teachers turned a blind eye because they were so impressed that we could handle RPN.

That sounds so exciting!

Yes, I remember that all the Bay Area front desk people had these monitors for security.

And these days such systems run as bloated servers on top of Windows, and are usually not really impressive for how much resources they need to run.

Remember the thin paper? omg , and it was soo much like burning an image lol

Kleenex dispenser! OMG that's too funny. I actually moved the machine off the bench and stored the GPIB cable and mouse in there. It's shockingly handy!

Since these machines were built at the calculator division facility in Ft Collins Colorado, I guess they didn't have all that far to travel :-P

Mine does not have a thermal printer but I have a Thinkjet that now works after replacing the ribbon cable to the print head. It still amazes me you can still get the print cartridges. So I use the top for storing fanfold paper.

Which would have even be more hilarious if someone mistakenly thought the printer was a tissue box. So they hit PRINT... and then proceed to pull the print from the machine and blow their nose with them. For a machine that was intended for mostly scientific purposes, having a built-in thermal printer kind of made sense, though.

I'd say that's a 10-4 affirmative a good buddy on that one. Also with the compressed air a note with sound when using dust off or or similar ran into this on an old Gateway machine. I was having some issues with it overheating. And in one day it wouldn't even stay on for a few minutes. Popped open the case and sure enough heatsink was packed with dust. A lot of other things as well including the fan. And processor heatsink fan of course. I was using the dust off or similar and I was doing this in my bedroom big mistake one big cloud of dust and I'd use so much I was not feeling good because of the effects of the dust off or whatever it was on me and I was not aware they do that so be careful. Best weapon to do it outside in generals not just with the nature of the stuff but the dust cloud as well just undid all my cleaning for that month it seemed like.

Conclusão, não mexa no que esta quieto.

@@aaronbrandenburg2441 I use an air compressor. And do it outside, of course. Best also to wear a mask or respirator, especially if you think mice might have been in there.

@@aaronbrandenburg2441 or run the vacuum above where you're blowing out

The dust was not the main part I was referring to who is actually the the stuff that's used for the dusting spray that I was having problems with there was enough of it in the air that I wasn't feeling so good yeah and got to my respiratory system that was the big part they be running a big fan but I had no idea I was going to need to use that much and didn't know how much dust was in there's heat sinks and everything so vacuum cleaner would not have really done anything for the spray itself but dust maybe but still would have been a real mess. And I did not have time to disconnect everything and get it outside plus it was raining and I had to get back going on something I was doing immediately on the computer so no options other than to do it is there and at that moment sometimes things are like that but learn my lesson about using large quantities of dusting spray in a small size room.

... in stark contrast to ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-zFA3szW9nWk.html

Adrian isn't a user.

@@stinchjack totally 100% agree if you own it which it seems like apples case s he has said you don't really own it just like software that you don't own and many other things that once you purchase it it should be yours and be able to do what you want with it including having anyone you please to repair it as you can tell I thoroughly agree with the point in full! Just like they say in the maker community if you own it you should be able to take it apart modify it whatever and if it doesn't fit your needs you should be able to modify it the way you want warranty void if removed should be outlawed completely banned but of course companies have to protect their rear end if some like really screw something up but trying to do something past what can be fixed it would fall back on them because of something the user it done to their own equipment I understand that however that should not interfere with reasonable things that someone is doing technically we have the right to repair in some situations however there needs to be legislation that's consumer orientated and protects our rights to our own equipment Etc and Legacy on legislation of what can and cannot be doing like in the case of apple and others so you open it you broke it or you try to fix it sorry no parts for you or you touch a screw we don't touch it no repair for you or sorry you can't program that part your device no longer works we didn't do it you did when actuality that was what the product was designed to do to prevent it from Dean. Buy legitimate repair services or ady hot for assume that would be able to fix something normally companies are so pigheaded that they want you to buy a new device in many cases I think about the song All speakers deliberately at least a first breaking them I'm sure this was not the first taste of this heard of others but can't remember at this time all I've heard about this but this will only continue to happen worse and worse the community needs to get together someway somehow and Soldier on until whoever takes notice and changed the laws to reflect what would work and be reasonable for both sides of things if possible and be able to get things appointed there are ways in which a company could say no to repair if something's jacked up to the point that it would have been unreasonable for a user to do something or a repair got a rolly but yet comforter butts when appropriate and so that people cannot just get a new device because they checked it up and they're not able to in the person tries to pin it on them when it would not be the right thing to happen in a reasonable situation. Butthead yet have rules and legislation that would State exactly what a manufacturer I would or could not do and clear guidelines as to what is appropriate and acceptable in cases such as these and others that both sides could agree on at least as much as possible and work for the good of all that's watch as possible it might be a pipe dream to have this happen but it needs to get a lot better it's just crazy either or just make your project open source and be done with it that might just solve it encourage cell phone repair don't turn it into something that's a death sentence for the device.

Serviceable by HP or a repair shop, not the end user. There’s still a difference of welding it shut to having it easily come apart in a modular fashion.

@@0xbenedikt not really my point though but I seriously saying so just so you know.

"I haven't watched anything this riveting since Apollo 13" But he didn't use any rear projection effect while filming the repair of this computer.

Maybe it was just a main bus B undervolt? ;) Though I just thought either he didn't show it on video or he didn't test the power rails.

His channel is so absolutely amazing!

As did I :) Lurch -> Perifractic -> 8 bit guy ->Technology Connections -> Adrian. A great saturday!

I watched this right after Technology Connections as well. Some very 'touching' content today.

@@falksweden Say What? Don't you watch LGR? If not, shame on you! lol just kidding :P

@@BertGrink I do, but not before Adrian yesterday. And Big Clive, RMC, EEVBlog, Mr Carlson, Dave Tipton and so on. 😁

HP seemed to use the same design philosophy on this as they used on their industrial and test gear. Totally not like a normal consume PC.

I mean, all the business stuff still seems fine, for now anyway. Though, I only have EliteDesk 800 G1 and G2 systems, and a more modern EliteDisplay S270n

Correction grabs tissue from paper exit SWAT for printer on top of computer and cries into the tissue on top of computer and cries into the tissue yeah we're friends in another comment as to what people had use that for a tissue holder seriously. What's build a device to allow you to use a paper towel roll to the front fake drawer of a older kitchen cabinet below the sink the paper towel would pass through with those decorative sloths that was poor ventilation to keep washer from building up under the sink excetera they knew do actually make modern drawers that have a place for paper towels wish they would do the same for tissues be a nice touch for either side of the bathroom. Or kitchen. By the way what the worst ideas ever had somebody say that their house smells like urine next to utility sink their place had a place attached to it that was shared with another Resident turns out there was a urinal like that of a portable toilet accept metal and the hose yes hose ran down took a right angle turn into a Copper hype and Waldo in your utility room running into the laundry machine tubs at first they thought it was an overflow or something else having to do it from the old systems in the house when they first saw it and then later on they realize what the smell was and what was coming out of it needless to say they are no longer sharing a residence they found out they were actually living there illegally and never got any compensation or anyone or anything they should have to even live there they just took it that it was a separate residence until they found out when they brought this up with some other issue when it was brought up turns out they are a lot more space there place quite by accident also not sure why but I had seen something like that except done with a dishwasher tailpiece in the bathroom sink of a place and there was a the urinal somewhere else in the house connected the same way except through the dishwasher tailpiece in the bathroom under the sink and thar was a second piece of tubing that ran back to the other room and there was a water valve connected to that which was also connected to the cold water of the sink and there was a second valve that was like that of a water fountain momentary wasn't sure what that was for but it did something somewhere but the other one washed the urinal except not from that room but from under the sink just injecting water straight into a t fitting where the two pipes connected. Before the dishwasher tailpiece. Another weird one at my grandmother's house there is a dishwasher tailpiece underneath the old bathroom sink can I figure out where the hose goes I suspect but I could be wrong that it's being used as a vent? However it's after the Trap before the sink drain I doubt there is anything any anak or anywhere near there that would use water that would need to discharge any water at all so kind of perplexed if anyone has any ideas please comment. Also I do like hp's equipment and computers pretty much I've had a few and use many others I used to have a terminal awesome sword that was HP that I used to use in my shop to run other equipment and other miscellaneous tasks and do some other interesting stuff even ran a couple simple games including Tetris and snake and a few others and yes one text Adventure or a few others I once played a arcade game on a piece of test equipment but and no it was not Doom either or that other one brain fart as to which one nor was it Wolfenstein or something like that but something else Something Like a Dungeon Crawler what are some graphics and some texts portions as well it was on a monochrome screen and used original controls for the test equipment to play it seriously I don't know but it's possible as an Easter egg on something too long ago to remember. This was kind of too early to really be on the scene where someone would hacked it into a device so I have no idea I don't even know who made it equipment or what it was I just remember playing the game and yes I also wants a piece of equipment it had an Easter egg of Tetris. I also played Crush the Castle on a piece of testicle that wants which was actually what Angry Birds is based on seriously not necessarily original game just based on another one like almost all games these days at least in the Google Play Store not LOL either too many games that are just a rip-off on another one or trying to turn to games into something they're not just to get a hit by using two parts or two different games and winding up with a game that's even worse than either one of course but what I would like to see would be Angry Birds Meats some sort of first-person shooter where you're playing birds instead of bullets and maybe all the other mobs are pigs or something

Aaron Brandenburg holy fuck I nearly had a stroke trying to read that

Interesting! I'm still playing with the machine getting ready for my second video on it. Was HPIQ ever released for the 150?

@@adriansdigitalbasement HPIQ was never released. They got pretty far with it, but in the end... MS-DOS was done and working. HP added a number of applications on top that could leverage the other money makers (like plotters!)

Ey there viewers welcome back to the adrian basement channel. Today we're looking at an hp 150. Were using a fujitsu ram module...not a sponsor. Lol

I like both channels. Good troubleshooting skills are so refreshing to watch.

Also: "If I swap this component into that position, does the problem move along with it or does it stay where it was?" Basic problem localization, troubleshooting and jury-rigging skills can get you a very long way as a service engineer.

What's the data rate of these? You'd think if it was the 60s it would be pretty low, unless they account for increasing speeds over the years.

@@stonent 1 MB/s, I think. Apparently, National Instruments introduced an upgraded variant of the IEEE-488.1 that want up to 8 MB/s, but was also backwards compatible. Keep in mind, HP originally designed this interface for data logging and control of digital test equipment, not for moving large files around between computers.

BlackEpyon 1MBit/s is faster than a 5.25“ drive though. The choice was not that bad in my opinion.

I use test equipment everyday that still use this interface. They range from stuff built in the 60's to brand new power supplies, Oscilloscopes, and lots of other automated testing equipment.

But it would still backpower it via the ESD clamp diodes, so perhaps only cut the enable and tie it high.

Yeah they're just a long PCB with straight traces and edge contacts on one end and a edge con socket on the other. Defpom buys the PCBs from somewhere and solders the socket.

There's even a windows image available at the HP museum site that can be loaded via hpdrive. I wish i had the memory card so i could run it.

Hey, at least Roger Wilco got his space back after Adrian moved into the basement.

There's the whole story: ;) ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-STCGzanAyR0.html&ab_channel=HACKADAY

I've always heard those called bodge wires not Balch wires but technically either one would be correct I don't know if which one is technically correct as I said either one would describe it and it's possible people think you're saying one even though your might be hearing the other any thoughts on this? Please comment.

I've seen that done on a cheap Taiwanese modem board in the 90's. The PC board was produced defective and one trace was shorted to something, so they simply cut both ends of the trace and used a bodge wire. The company I worked for had bought hundreds of these modems and every single one had the same cut trace and bodge wire patching the trace.

I worked at an electronics manufacturing division of a major defense contractor, and we had a PCB fabrication area. We'd have a run of boards with bad or shorted traces on an internal layer, and those jumpers were used to avoid the expense of scrapping the boards and making new ones. A few times a hole was drilled into or through the board to remove the short. Sometimes the feedthru for an IC pin would get drilled out and an eyelet would be installed in its place and wires run to it. I didn't notice it on Adrian's boards, but on longer runs we'd tack down the wires with small dots of adhesive like RTV or epoxy.

@@scottlarson1548 Thats pretty common actually in older boards. Some cut trace here, some extra wires there. There are entire series of computers that have the same modification like that (Atari XE for example). It kind of looks excessive on this extention board though.

Fascinating! So it was a problem even when these were in use! Amazing only one was clouded with dust on this one.

Adrian's Digital Basement there was a plastic piece introduced to address the issue later in the 150A’s life. Turns out those holes would clog with dust and dirt, especially the bottom row, so bad, the PCB had to be replaced. The cover was flat on the top and on the bottom had round extrusions with a flat bottom that fit into the holes. It just laid on the bottom of the display. The other three sides remained unprotected. The 12” 150B the “Touchscreen II” the touch was optional. A touch screen bezel could be user installed and was sealed on all four sides

Printer, cassette drive, barcode reader wand, HP-41 calculator, ...

That's sad.

He wasn't tapping the screen, he was trying to cover up the horrible latter-day Pokemon designs with his hands.

Thanks!