Trent Horn Debates Me 

Trent's smart ass, "ok," at 18:01 would have me pooping my pants if I were debating him.

I didn't watch it yet, but I am already sorry for your loss Brian....this isn't because of you Brian. You are great! But we all know that Trent Horn is a Cyborg sent from the future to save the Catholic Church.

Brian is one of my favorite Catholic “explainers” on RU-vid. I will listen to him, intently and thoughtfully, regardless of the person with whom he speaks.

Brian is always that guy who explains things correctly and gently in the most understanding way from the heart and mind. Trent is there to level me up in the deepest technical and logical way. Both of them together is like combining 2 body parts of the Christian Megazord.

I love both you guys and this was very fun to watch. Thank you both for taking the time to make this.

Debate starts at 12:55

This is the collab I knew we needed. I'm excited to watch it !

Two of my favourite youtubers. Much love from Nigeria.

The collab we have been waiting for! I hope you will invite more Catholic apologists and RU-vidrs here, Brian.

I’m so glad I found Brian’s channel. I subscribed and look forward to seeing more content! 🙏✨

Great to see both!!! Nice!!

hahah i clicked on this video wondering what possibly Trent and Brian could be debating, wasn't expecting the devil's advocate twist 😅😅😅 fantastic vid

So excited, can’t wait!

Two of my favorite podcasters, both of whom are very sincere in their faith. Great show! ❤

Hi Brian, This is my favorite one you’ve ever done I think just about. At least in the top five I really enjoyed this. I never really have enjoyed Catholic answers for various reasons, but I know they’re speaking Catholic doctrine. I never really listened to much to Trent Horn and I really didn’t have a positive view of him… But this changed my mind. It showed me to be open minded and listen even when I have doubts. And maybe I wouldn’t like every single episode of discussions like this but I did like this. I thought you Brian were the best I’ve ever seen you and relaxed. Yes, just a nice guy. A smart nice guy. Thank you very much for this. It probably made me a better person which was definitely needed! God bless you both.

Excellent video. Thanks

Fascinating thank you for sharing.

Years ago, apologetics was taught in Catholic seminaries and universities (see the classic book "College Apologetics" by Fr. Anthony Alexander). Sadly, apologetics got a bad name and went out of fashion in the 1970s, to be replaced with seemingly endless "dialogue." The purpose of authentic apologetics, when done for the proper purpose and in charity, is to help both parties to reach the truth about the matter at hand. What could be more Christian than that? (Excellent video, BTW.)

Ah two of my favorite RU-vidrs! So awesome!

You guys are awesome. God bless.

I love listening to content like this while I’m mowing the lawn and I got to listen to this debate in its entirety while I did that. It was extremely helpful. I’ve actually done debates with abortion rights advocates before, and Brian’s argument was one that I have not heard before. I enjoyed very much hearing Trent’s answer to his higher versus lower forms of beings and rights argument. Thank you to you both. One of the cool things about this particular video was that I learned about Trent’s video series a couple of months ago while I was watching Brian recommend other Catholic RU-vid channels.

Good job mentioning the imbalance of logic and persuasiveness between opponents in theological and moral arguments. Really good to here commentary from you both on that😁👍

not yet finished with the video but enjoying it so much and Trent seems like he’s having a lot of fun!

I've been pretty invested for a long time now in finding if Christianity is true and eventually converting - Brian made probably the strongest case against God (for me) that I've seen. Scared me for a moment! But Trent never fails to pull through XD He also did a good job articulating what imo is the strongest case in favor of abortion - it seems ridiculously harsh and probably a lot of pro-choicers would intuitively distance from it, but I think it's the logical development/fleshing-out of what's at the heart of a lot of pro-choicers positions. And Trent pointed out that its hard for a materialistic atheist to make a case for something like equal rights. When I was a full atheist, I basically held to 'might is right' and believed I had to reject notions of 'equal rights' or morality in generally if I was going to be intellectually honest and logically consistent. If we want to live in a way that is logically coherent, rational, and 'good', and not in a way that most sane people would find repulsive, I think its Christianity or bust. There comes a point where the cognitive dissonance, willful blindness and distractions of the world/flesh just don't cut it anymore - we have to find God and eventually the beatific vision, or die.

Brian having better production quality on podcasts than most people have in their shorter videos

Great video... would love to see Jimmy on your show

Great job guys!!🎉🎉🎉❤

@Brian, love this! You're a great debater. Do more of these, please. Especially please do a similar one on something like "Josephologist Debates Me on Virgin Joseph" where you could play "devil's advocate" by taking the Non-virgin Joseph view and any Josephologist (Fr. Don Calloway, Fr. Boniface Hicks, Dr. Scott Hahn, Dr. Brant Pitre, Joe Rodrigues, Sister Miriam James, etc.) and they take the Virgin Joseph view. It would be a fun, in-house debate that would explore both of these traditions and see the pros and cons of each and see which one is actually the most ancient, the most Biblical, the most apostolic. And when you do, I'll happily add it to our "Josephology" channel's "Josephology Apologetics" playlist section. THANK YOU.

I really liked this format. I'd love to hear you guys do the same thing for cannon-law defined mortal sins. Things like civil marriages, or married couples using a condom, etc. I'm looking for theological arguments for such things to be classified as mortal sin.

Love it! Fun! Would have loved it more and been more fun if Trent Horn debated you on Joseph's Perpetual Virginity though :-)

Trent Horn is my favorite apologist!

You are both very inspiring

Wait what? How can two Catholics 'debate' these things that both surely agree on? Suddenly apprehensive that Brian is having a struggle... until reading RU-vid comments saying he just wants to practice arguing against the things he does indeed believe in, haha. Okay, phew! Glad you're okay, Brian. And no offence that I never doubted Trent Horn's situation; I've just seen his videos more recently and suddenly wondered if I'd missed a big turn with you.

God Bless both of you! Trent ❤

Wow, what a match-up!

I thought you guys were beefing with each other 😅 God bless both of you 🙏

Bravo, two very courageous gentlemen indeed. In hoc signo vinces +.

I subscribe to both of you and enjoy what you have to say. Thanks!

That was a totally click bait title. You got me. I could not imagine you two disagreeing on the faith and church teaching. God bless you two for spreading the truth and inspiring fruitful dialog.

I’m 25 minutes in - and this is great so far.

I’m an atheist, and I love both of you guys. Mad respect

Dr. Brandon Holdsworth V. Dr. Travis Horn. (Already putting it as if it a courtroom alibi!). Wow. This is incredible!

Brian, I think you put up very good arguments, especially that one about the hiddenness of God. And I think Trent could improve a little bit on this particular challenge. But both of you did a very good job! I would say, that instead of tackling the hiddenness of God in a roundabout fashion, Trent should attack it straight on. The question to be answered is "Why is God's hiddenness a good thing?" Trent eventually touched on this, but I think in a "defensive" way. I would like Trent to defend that the hiddenness is indeed a good thing. Any other explanation is lacking IMO. I myself have experienced a tragic marriage breakdown, which inspires me to think about God as the lover seeking out the loved one. With such a backdrop, I can see how God cannot "overpower/violate" us. Furthermore, he cannot be "our super-rich/wealthy bachelor" seeking our attention - thus he cannot answer all prayers like we want to. For real love to exist at all, there is a certain probing of intention, at least in the spousal relationship. Hiddenness is thus not a bug, it's a feature. However, God is of course not completely hidden. I would argue is finding the *exact* balance for every human.

MY TWO FAVORITE CATHOLIC SPEAKERS IN ONE VIDEO, LETS GO

The disciples on the road to Emmaus not recognising him can be explained by the phenomena whereby the brain struggles to recognise ppl when they are outside of their usual context. I remember a psychology professer taking his student overseas to a country he was attending a conference in. He took her because her parents were also going to be in that city and he wanted to test this theory that they would not recognise her. They stood outside of the hotel, knowing the parents would be leaving to go on a trip at a certain time and despite looking right at their daughter they walked straight past her. I worked in pubs for years, ppl I knew very well would look at me blankly if I said hello when I bumped into them at the supermarket. Out of my expected place their brains struggled to identify me. Same when ppl are usually seen in uniform and then are seen in plain clothes, ppl can't remember them.

That's just dope

Brian is the kind of guy you want to have a beer with, I love his demeanor.

Whatever you pursue, pursue the truth. Keep in mind that the devil likes to remain undetected, so shining light on the people of God is something the devil opposes. If what you’re doing is easy, you’re definitely doing it wrong. If it’s hard, you’re still probably doing it wrong and still have more room to improve. God bless you both in your ministry. Would love to have you both spend some time on Catholic eschatology. ❤

I thought this would be boring, after all, it’s one Christian talking to another Christian about things in which they agree. However, this was actually very interesting to listen to. Well done Brian.

I'm interested to see where these men disagree if at all.

Me like this duo!

Brian does a great job presenting the opposing point of view and Trent as usual gives a great response Great video on debating the pertinent issues of our day😊

Oh man. I dont follow you, Brian, just becuase I don't follow that many people on youtube, but Im aware of your channel and when I saw the title of this video I thought "oh no! Did brian lose his faith??" Im glad to see this is all just hypothetical debate. :)

Can someone point me to the Abraham Lincoln quote? It's such a powerful explanation and I'm not sure where I can get a copy of it

If all debate were in good faith like this is be v much more inclined to watch them

This was such a great idea and Brian made a stronger case for atheism than many atheists Trent has interacted with lol

Man Brian makes a really good atheist. Great video guys

I am an atheist, but I LOVE listening to Trent Horn. He is a top tier debater.

I want Trent to debate Ben Shapiro.

This was a master class . Thank you for this awesome video. I agree with Trent on Craig vs Hitchens. I was a Protestant when I watched that debate. Dr. Craig is the Original Cyborg ! Although there's no doubt in my mind if Dr. Craig debated our Catholic Cyborg on Catholicism vs Protestantism Trent Horn would demolish him.

I'm wondering if the whole idea of essence, leans heavily close to gnosticism/hermeticism at 26:00 ?

Love the interaction between these two...likening it almost to " Freud and Jung" of the Catholic faith. 😊

This debate/discussion, right off the bat, brought up an interesting point. How do people who believe God to be who they say He is, "prove" that? As Christians, we profess Jesus to be God. Why skirt around the issue? There is ample evidence (more than any other religion...ever) that Christians are right. By trying to come up with theoretical or conceptual reasons of the existence of God, that only weakens the evidence there is of an actual, personable (for the lack of a better term) God.

Wonderful discussion! If God was fully revealed to us there would be no purpose for this life.

Thank God for this. Brian getting to the bottom of the atheistic perspective. Well done

Two great Catholics

Does anyone know where the Hallelujah chant in the very beginning of the video is from?

I never considered the possibility that might does, in fact, make right - in the context in which God (who, luckily for us, is ultimately just) is ultimately mighty.

Ive only seen Brian on one other video so I was like wait... Isnt this guy Catholic?.. debating....? ...... And then Reading the comments😅 nice practice! Loving it!

One danger in the divine hiddenness argument is thinking that God is only speaking, if you feel or hear an interior voice. But God has spoken to us in many ways, through the church, through the prophets, through scripture, through the believers around us, through the sacraments. When we receive communion, that is Christ giving us his body and blood and presence. We are fallen creatures, and I am not sure that we can necessarily hear God in an unmediated way without a great deal of training.

Trent failed in the hiddenness argument. This is a difficult argument.

All I keep observing is this: even with the most amazing minds working on this, faith is a very simple thing and requires very little explanation. But if your ego won’t let you accept it, you will always find an argument against it. This stubborn obsession is powered by evil. God please calm my disbelief , let me be drawn into your love.

Brian, Would you be interested in calling to PineCreek and having a conversation with him? He regularly speak to religious people and let's the conversation have a natural flow. It would be interesting.

circuit reasons have no logical fallacy to them. For instance, the mechanism that chemistry allow, have feedback which within the overall can break and emerge. No absolutely necessary thing needs to be, to grant many other things which may( based on the criteria selected) disclude an event or thing having being. Weather cycles, evaporation are circular which are necessary and can migrate to causation of other thing.

Why naturalistically should all humans have equal rights? The question in response to that would be "Why should they not"? Unless you believe that every human is capable of foreseeing the future how can you say another human is less beneficial to society? When a persons life is over, that is the only time you can sum up it's value to society.

Everytime Trent Horn mentions his books, take a sip of light beer. You'll be wasted in no time at all.

Great method acting by Brian as an Atheist.

Could you timestamp this please?

Great double question Brian (12:53), and your interweaving was more justified than Trent's separation (17:04) acknowledged. He accepted (though not until 31:40) that we need a "bunch" of (highly abstract) arguments. We need, he admitted, "patience" in order to uncover rationally the Judeo-Christian, One Creator. God seems then much more hidden to natural perception than that discerned by most committed theists-on-the-street, and than straightforward readings of the bible. It's hardly "walking with God in the cool of the evening". -- -- While most of the abstract properties industriously derived by Trent’s Scholasticism are true, the inference steps IMO have understandably failed to work in our scientific culture. The natural essence and existence of horse and stegosaurus (26:00) is a function of environmental causation across the space-time cosmos (the difference of era between stegosaurus & my horse has been discovered as of the 'essence'). Such holistic (‘efficient’ and ‘formal’) physical causation does not of itself jump beyond its boundaries to the metaphysical. That would deny the definition of “cause” today. Similarly, we do analogically ascribe existence to a unicorn (26:48) in as much as we use it, and its posited environment, to have fun and learn together. It’s essence and existence are immediately relative our mind. Might not the same be true of our whole cosmic environment: God’s stage for us to grow morally. After all Newman and Pope Benedict called conscience the echo of the personal voice of God and the “connecting principle between the creature and his Creator”. As your two-sided question seemed to be hoping for, this vision demands less philosophical patience and divine hiddenness. It's closer to the intuitions of most of the devout, and more likely to increase that number today.

Excellent depiction of Christopher Hitchens’ demagoguery by Trent.

This is 🥰

Can someone explain to me the Catholic Churches that are in one union with the Roman Catholic Church? How can we still receive the sacraments at a church other than the Roman Catholic Church?

What is the debate about?

alright man I conked out at 45 minutes it was a little too tiring but I hope you debate matt "the man" dillahunty even if he can be a bit of a prickly pear sometimes

If Friar Casey was here, would be my most OP mashup of all Catholic RU-vid.

👍🙏

If we, as time/space creatures, could now experience God in a non-time/non-space manner with our senses, our earthly existence would have no meaning.

Debate. I would hope that you would not want to oppose anything that Trent would hold dear to.

I look FORWARD TO WATCHING T H I S! 😂

"who think the earth is still flat", becuase as we know, the earth stopped being flat 500b years ago, in what we call the Great Rounding

A though just came to me. Which animals, other than man (or woman), kill their unborn children?

Debate about what? You guys should agree with most things.

“She wanted to make a podcast as a response to something that happened on Pints With Aquinas” *cough* Matt Fradd saying women aren’t funny *cough* (But to be fair, he said female stand up comediennes aren’t funny, but Laura Horn is hilarious.)

deleterious? How long have you waited to squeeze that word into a conversation? LOL

Brian's opening statement was one of most cogent and convincing presentations of the arguments for atheism that I have heard, and has confirmed my convictions of unbelief. Trent uses the old apologist trick of sliding between evidence and proof. Science deals with evidence: proofs are to be found in mathematics and philosophy. While I agree that William Lane Craig gave Christopher Hitchens a caning in their debate, Craig in turn in 2014 was demolished by Sean Carroll, whose concept of poetic naturalism I find one of the most comprehensive and satisfying world views. Ultimately, the existence of God, particularly the narcissistic cosmic CEO as portayed in the Old Testament, is as "unprovable" as Russell's teapot.

@1:17:00 the Imposter Theory is discussed. Good points! But this is also believed by the Muslims. They believe that Jesus did NOT die on the cross but think that an IMPOSTER stood in for Jesus and died instead of Jesus! This could've (should've?) been mentioned. Just FYI for your next chats with your Muslim friends.

Still cant find the debates between Timothy Gordon vs Trent Horn any longer. Horn lost in both debates.

Stegosauri went extinct much earlier, not all dinosaurs went extinct with the meteorite.

I can’t imagine a Catholic topic Trent wouldn’t smoke Brian on

both of you are the reason i stayed catholic after being challenged by protestant friends and fiancé