We were certain that the Trojan War was pure legend up until approximately a century ago, and that questioning when it took place would be comparable to asking when Atlantis collapsed. Find out more: waddletimenow....
@@jackson4162 Yeah, it would. To speak in terms of metaphors, the kindling for igniting the war was already laid out. Paris just tossed in the match. If Paris didn't do it, sooner or later, someone else would break the truce and declared war.
In the Iliad Helen loved Menelaus who was described as a very handsome man but Paris took her with him because Aphrodite (the goddess of love) had promised him the most beautiful woman in the world (Helen ). In some stories (not in the Iliad) Helen is in love with Paris in many others (Iliad which is the original and other poems) instead she was kidnapped, hated and treated as a slut ... at the end of the war she returned home with Menelaus and lived happily. Many Trojans hated her because she was considered the reason for the war even though she had been forced to marry Paris because of Aphrodite ... only Hector was kind to her.
You Mode this isn’t really accurate. The Iliad doesn’t specify whether Helen truly loved Menelaus (it’s more likely that she did not). You’re right about everything else though!!
@@mariawajahat3613 no man. In the illiad she even said to Paris that she hoped that Menelaus (her husband) had killed him in their duel. She hated being there with him... only hector was kind to her. She was a princess, not a warrior. She wouldn’t have been able to fight and go back because Aphrodite herself made so that Paris could take her. Helen couldn’t do anything against Aphrodite.
@@insultlk no u can understand that she loved him because she used words like dear husband or something (in Greek) when she talked about him but on today’s society arranged marriage it’s looked as a bad thing (even though it shouldn’t be). In the end she returned to him. Btw I’m talking about the myths. Let’s not talk about that shitty movie.
You Mode no, it was unclear whether Helen wanted to be there. There were many lines in the book where she supported Paris. Also, she never directly told Paris she did not want to be there. It’s true that Helen couldn’t do much against Aphrodite but according to the Iliad she didn’t make her opinion known to Paris, and even the reader was given very vague clues.
@@mariawajahat3613 what are u saying? 😂She literally wished for his (París) death during his duel with Menelaus (her husband). She literally told him that. She didn’t want to be there. Every troyan thought that she was the reason behind the war and that it was all her fault but instead it was Aphrodite and Paris’ fault. Only hector was kind to her. The poor man died for his spoiled brother. She never wanted to be there with him. You should reread the myth Maria
Hector's style of saying 'war is sweet to those who have no experience of it' was great... truly there is no glory and heroism in any war...because he experienced it...
The elders of Troy allowed the war to happen, but none of them have to do any actual fighting. They all watched comfortably from a high tower while Hector was fighting.
@@gilliantohver3225 Some lessons we are doomed to learn again in every generation. We can memorialise the science of Archimedes for all time but each generation fails to grasp this truth you said about wars. Disturbing to see a drift to a global conflict today.
Well, to be fair , there were like 9 other cities in layers above and below Troy, so it wasnt the first time a city on that spot had been razed to the ground, or the last either. They fought there all the time because it was a prime location on the Aegean sea. Paris taking Helen was just the excuse Agamemnon needed to cancel the peace treaty and finish his conquest.
Hector carried the sins of his family and whole Troy at the back of his shoulders and never questioned it why because it was his life burden to carry. True man and a hero.
Menelaus wasn't that unhonorabke aswell actually, the man sought to make peace with troy and some troy prince gutted his wife. Id do exactly as menelaus did
@@catssassine2278 menelaus in the actual Iliad story and in this movie are vastly different. In the Iliad, Menelaus was an honorable king whom Helen returned to at the end of the war. Menelaus in this movie is portrayed as a vicious brute , who along with his brother look to not only get his wife back but destroy Troy.
Yeah and the idea that Helton kills Menalaos is laughable. Helen is more or less kidnapped in various versions of the legend (or forced by the gods to fall in love with Paris). Menalaos and Helen are both back home and doing pretty well in the Odyssey- a cruel irony at the time in the poem because Odysseus isn’t home yet
Hector is one of the most down to Earth centered heroes in this epic. Hector knows the Gods do not interfere in the affairs of men and the actions people take have consequences. Something that not even the King of Troy understands till the very end. However despite knowing what is to come he stays the course and fights the best way he can. In many ways Hector is Troy's answer to Odysseus. I have a feeling both men would get along quite well. The difference between the two is Hector is direct and Odysseus is cunning and uses the mind over pure force.
Pure force, indeed, but also values. Rewatching the fight between Hector and Achilles, I'm always amazed at how brilliantly they filmed it. Hector, through Eric Bana, was technically a bulky man, much stronger physically than Brad Pitt's Achilles. But the way they filmed it, the gap in power between the two is not in favour of Hector, who almost looks like a child playing swords with an adult.
@@Demowan Speed and technique play a factor. That's why they have weight classes in MMA and it's far harder to get into the Bantum or Feather Classes. A faster well versed opponent can take down the much larger fighter given they are slower. People think weight classes are designed to protect the smaller man. It's not. It's to protect the bigger bulkier ones. You'll also notice the lighter weight classes in the UFC are far bloodier and more aggressive than the Heavy Weights.
@@JRGProjects I’m sorry but this isn’t always true, especially when the difference in size is simply too big of a gap (think mcgregor versus someone like hafthor bjornson, I know the latter isn’t an MMA fighter but there was actually a pseudo fight between the two) the sheer difference in strenght, size, reach and toughness completely overwhelms the difference in agility and skills. But not only that, in many cases peoples seriously underestimate how fast and agile an heavyweight fighter can be. Peoples assume that bigger always means slower, thats until you face off someone who towers over you and match your speed if not completely outmatch your speed
“Then I’ll die fighting” Lmfao if you cared about Troy he would’ve died in the duel and not let thousands of women by raped by the Spartans, babies thrown off walls, & men decapitated. Love is love but all for one woman
@@naromngin but given Menelaus' wrath being satisfied. He kinda implied that he's satisfied with the death of Paris, unlike his brother. That'll create division. And division in an army like this can be fatal
First he starts a war that destroys his country and next he decides to kill Achilles when he was obviously trying to help his cousin from getting killed :)
He didn't kill an enemy at that point. He further solidified Troy's doom by killing a man who was already fighting for it's salvation. He made every wrong decision he could possibly make in that short time in his life and it's permanence is felt even today. Thousands of years later.
It was too late anyway. Agamemnon needed an excuse to go to war. Returning Helen to Sparta like spoiled goods? Nah it was game over when Paris took her.
@@wandilesithole3710 Achilles’s fate was written since before he was born. He was to die during the Trojan war. That’s why his mother tried desperately to distance him from it, even disguising him as a girl, but quite unsuccessfully. He knew he was going to die but went to war anyway. In the Greek pantheon of heroes, Achilles is the freaking GOAT.
Btw to anyone who says Agamemnon was coming for Troy anyway, that was still a few years in the future and Troy would’ve had much more time to prepare, Paris is just the worst
It would not have happened at all . Menelaus was precisely making peace with Troy , if Agamemnon went to battle without casus belli and without Sparta he would’ve been doomed .
IMO, Eric Bana was the true star of this epic! He was so damn good! Hes such an underrated actor!
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Hector didn't do anything wrong during the whole movie. He was an impeccable husband, father, brother, son, fighter, and leader. I always felt bad for him.
I hate Paris and Helen more than Menelaus and Agamemnon.... "Do you love me brother? Would you protect me against any enemy?"...a few minutes later "I won't ask you to fight my war."....and then a coward makes Hector fight his war
Right!! My personal favorites are Hector and Priam, the most Noble and Honorable men in the movie! I hated Agamemnon, Paris, and somewhat Achilles, Menelaus at least had some honor. And Helen, at least she felt guilty and wanted to go back, and even comforted Andromache the wife of Hector, another favorite of mine!
@@Aemilius46 Same here but I didn't hate Achilles...and Helen was as irritating as beautiful...she already knew Menelaus in details just like she analysed him to Paris so her "feeling guilty" meant nothing....I've watched this movie so many times and now again after you answered my comment lol
I always wondered why Hector didn't just have Paris tied to the mast of the ship so he couldn't interfere and have Helen sent on a row boat in the opposite direction. Harsh, I know but so is endangering your kingdom for a booty call.
@@boloblade2 The provocation would still be used as a reason for starting the war. Agamemnon wanted to invade Troy and even if they returned Helen to Menelaus and he killed Paris, Menelaus would likely still be convinced by Agamemnon to invade. It was simply too late at this point, Troy was caught between Paris' stupidity and Agamemnon's ambition. The only thing Hector would be doing at this point by giving up Paris would be cosigning him to his death for little practical reason.
Loved so much about this film, the fight choreography, the scenery, the wardrobe. The blue of the sea and the blues in their tunics and jewellery is inspired, it feels so right, like a window into the ancient world. Bana's acting here is just sublime, all the acting is good but his is superb and the script is so strong.
If he had the choice, there would have been three things I would changed in this film. 1) Have Paris killed. 2) Have the role Aeneas be more of a supporting role (played by Ben Affleck, first name popped in my head), and have as playing an active part in the film, and help more Trojans escaped. 3) And have Paris killed.
4) Remove the Achilles/Briseis romance. It didn’t feel convincing to me at all, Briseis liking him only bc he keeps her safe made their romance feel contrived. And it would really show Achilles’ more kindhearted nature, if he defended her without being in love with her. 5) Keep the Achilles/Patroclus romance from the original poem.
@@samwisehuluberlu2210 Curious why? The reason why I thought of him was because of his role in Shakespeare in Love, who played a supporting character, (Like I said first choice that popped in my head)
I would have included Diomedes and Aneas in this film as there roles of the second best warriors of the Greeks and the Trojans both adding some tragedy and nuance to the story.With Diomedes being similar to hector in the sense of fighting for what he believes is right for the future of Greece only to realize over time he and the Greeks are fighting for nothing but Agamemnons pride power and greed .Aneas is in the beginning very similar to Achilles as he starts out only interested in fighting for his own personal glory in the Trojan army but over time becomes disillusioned with warfare and learns how to be the defender and leader of the people of Troy that Paris should of been instead of the irresponsible greedy lustful selfish coward he was. Thus ending the movie with Diomedes allowing Aneas to depart with the survivors of Troy after Agamemnons and Paris’s (should have been much more unsympathetic in the film)deaths.
Hector is the epitomy of what a man should embody. Honor, integrity, loyalty, wise, masculine, strong, and seeks peace and harmony instead of war and chaos.
Hector was the Hero of this film he gave up his family he fought fir his country to the death and he saved his wimp of a brother. GOD I hated Paris he got his brother, father, killed and countless of his countries fellowmen
@@ΧΡΗΣΤΟΣΑΜΑΝΑΤΙΔΗΣ-β7μOh, I'm with ya.....I'd have turned that boat around, gone back and been like ..look king, here's your woman, unharmed and safe... please accept the absolute shit-kicking I'm about to give my little brother, as an apology lol
@@zachschaefer3824 yes. I know that for plot reasons war must take place but I never understood why in the world, did Priam and hector, two honourable and noble people let Paris keep Helen and didn't punish him
Paris: *wants to start a war for a woman* Hector: "What have you done, brother?! Are you nuts?!!" Menelaus: *wants to start a war for a woman* Agamemnon: "Finally..."
Just imagine you are the king of Sparta and a neighborhood country's playboy stole your wife and your kingdom ' s queen and wouldn't do anything about it ! tell me genius what would you have done if you were menelaus
Except menelas is kinda right here. It was a peace celebration. Imagine signing peace with a country after 10 years of war and invite them to celebrate and they take your fucking wive. Worst, in a lot of version, she didn’t love him. Paris kidnapped her. The only way to do a bigger offense than that would have been to stab the king in the back right during the ceremony.
can't blame Agamemmon and Menelaus... Imagine a pathetic pussy whipped playboy comes and steals a king's wife... it is an attack on the honor of the kings
Hector should have exiled Paris and Helen and told Menelaus that he has no idea where they have gone. He might have not believed him but it might have taken the target off Troy's back since all he cared about was capturing those idiot lovebirds. Sure, it would have meant they would never be able to stop running but they would still have a chance and Troy would be safe.
Thos was literally talked by Paris and Helen in the movie. Paris suggested they run away so Troy would not burn. But Helen specifically said Menalaus would still burn the city just to make sure the Trojans were not lying. This prompted Paris to duel Menalaus instead.
Wouldn't work. Memelaus would never have believed a word that the Trojans would say to him and Agemmenon wanted an excuse to conquer the city. It would had only slowed down the Greek's plans to attack Troy but not stop them.
I watched this movie for the first time in 2005. I’ve probably watched it another 100 times in the last 17 years, and each time I watch it, my hatred for Paris and Helen grows stronger and stronger!
Then, an enraged Aragorn shakes hands and joins forces with Sauron! Soon, the entire Middle Earth will fall to the combined might of Gondor and Mordor!!!😁
Many people say the war and fall of Troy is Paris' fault. I think Helen ran away with him is just the triggers. Regardless she ran away with him or not, eventually the Greeks will still go and attack Troy regardless. It was just a matter of time
Not really. Menelaus was a man of his word and clearly favored peace . Paris managed to wrong the one man who took Troy’s side . And Agamemnon couldn’t launch an offensive without Menelaus support as they could barely take Troy even with his Spartans.
@@stormbringer2840 Agamemnon was the King of Greece though. It was The Oath everyone in Greece promised during Helen’s wedding that would cause this alliance. However, Agamemnon had more than enough men to take on Troy, it was just a matter of breaking through Troy’s Gate.
@@m.c.martin Agamemnon wasn't the king of greece but of Myceanea , the most powerfull king in greece but not the king OF greece ( he was an Hegemonic king if you prefer ). So yeah Menelaus being at the origin of the Oath his input was absolutely necessary to start a war , and No agamemnon didn't have enough men by himself , even with all the forces of greece he only barely got through Troy and could've died at any point .
Aye pretty much every City in Greece had its own King, Agamemnon was simply one of the most Influential, and had a Pact with the other Kings of Greece.
The real ending: Trojans: "Here you go, take her, she wasn't that good anyway." Menelaus: "$#@#^&&!". Agamemnon: "Let's unite all of Greece to fight for dishonouring our sister." Odysseus: "I've got a better idea..." **Helen boards ship to Egypt**
@@alitanicholas9579Helen was the wife of Menelaus, not her sister. The mythical tale of her chilling in Egypt for the entire war after being replaced by a copy made out of clouds is great though.
Even if Hector returned Helen and Paris, the Greeks will still seek to conquer Troy. Truth is even if Paris never met Helen, the Greeks were already plotting to get Troy. It was a ticking time bomb, its just unfortunate that it happened before Priam's rule ended. He worked so hard to keep that peace during his lifetime.
Funny that Paris was mythologically chosen to judge the beauty of three goddesses do to his “exemplary fairness”, and yet he thought it fair to ask thousands to die, and to allow his own brother to die for him, over a woman. Ironic. Nobody in Greek mythology saw the flaw in that?
To be fair, I blame the Greek kings for being so prideful... like, she wouldn't of left if he was actually a good husband, but Paris DOES know how the kings are and is just romanticizing this way too much...
@@anonymous-yq4wc Dude, he was literally flirting with other women in front of her, and it's heavily implied he's doing more behind closed doors. She wasn't open with her feelings for Paris before leaving, and it's shown how much she craves being in a loving relationship. In other versions, Paris kidnaps her and the king was the one devoted to her, so he was seeking revenge on Paris and keeping her from being assaulted more than if he let her go. It's usually either men being whores that start the war. I know modern women love being hoes, but it's obvious she either wasn't the whore.
One thing I find unique about this film, is that you don't find yourself rooting for any one side. In the end there are only 5 characters you can rally behind. You can't side with Achilles because he wanted glory and was willing to kill people who did nothing to him. He also desecrated Hector out of spite. You can't side with Paris because he kicked off a war. Menalaus was not faithful to Helen as we see at the party. Also a dick move to marry someone that is way younger. Priam was a fool for embracing this conflict instead of taking the peaceful option after all his hard work. His hubris costed him everything. Agamemnon was looking for an excuse for war the entire time and was too dangerous to be alive with that kind of army. That trojan priest was a bit of a wild card and one that went against Troy in hindsight. Helen is the reason the war starts and she knew it. It was her choice to go and she knew she fucked up when Hector went to fight Achilles. Hector however never wanted war but he follows through for his brother who hung him out to dry. He is also just trying to defend his country. He is also very perceptive and knows when not to fight. Odysseus is only here to ensure Ithaca doesn't get trampled by Agamemnon. Glaucous was just a general rising to meet a threat. Though his beliefs would prove costly. Achilles' right hand man was just a punching bag and didn't deserve to be beaten. Lastly, poor Patroclus was just fighting for his country and stepped up to the plate. He was martyred. Hector takes the cake though no question. I honestly don't know what to think when it comes to Briseis.
In defense of Menalaus that was the norm back then, once a girl hit puberty which could be between 12 and 14 she was considered marriageable and essentially property of the men in her life. Funnily enough though if you were a woman in Greece Sparta was probably the best place to live. The women could own property and work, they could attend and participate in sporting events, they could even learn to fight, and they were essentially married only in name because they really only had to see their husbands when they needed to have babies. Otherwise they lived a communal lifestyle with other women.
Yeah i wonder that too Briseis was just a priestess for Dionysos, She might got by Stockholm syndrome but other then that she is blame less in my opinion...
"Have you ever killed a man? Ever seen a man die in combat? Ever been in a cockpit before? Ever seen a grown man naked? Do you ever...hang around a gymnasium? Do you like movies about gladiators?"
Hector is a beautiful character....so brave,strong and honest and Eric Bana is a wonderful actor..I love Hector and Eric is a stunning man...I have always been team Hector and I always will be
I've just finished reading the Iliad and I'm surprised how well they kept to Homers script in this film. Not bad considering this story was written almost 3000 years ago.
Pretty much - Hector doesn't kill Menelaus in the Iliad which seems to be the biggest piece of artistic license but for the most part Wolfgang Peterson did a masterful job with the screenplay and the scenery.
They barely kept to the Iliad at all. Several very important characters aren't even in the film and the chronology of events and character deaths is completely different. Really the only thing this movie has in common with Iliad are the names.
@@1furious who was left out and what was the inconsistencies of the chronology order apart from the obvious changes Hollywood made. (Menelaus being killed by Hector is obviously not original and the siege lasted 10years not 17 days as in the film troy, Achilles and Patroclus were actually best friends in the poem rather being cousins in the film ) I'm not being funny im genuinely interested. For a bashed up Hollywood rendition one can't complain too much when they are known for absolutely changing everything in a film.
@@jimcraig9882 Well for an initial correction, Patroclus and Achilles in mythology are actually cousins. Specifically first cousins once removed. Patroclus is also older than Achilles. But beyond that, Diomedes isn't in the film, Nestor takes a very background role, Rhesus isn't in the film, the two Ajax's are combined into one character, Teucer is absent, Briseis is fused partially with Chryseis and Cassandra. And in the Trojan Cycle, Paris didn't survive the Trojan War. Agamemnon did. Andromache was enslaved. Hector's son was killed by Achilles' son Neoptolemus (also absent from the film). Agamemnon's characterisation in general is just completely wrong. The idea of him just wanting to conquer Troy is completely undermined by him completely annihilating it at the end. Nothing left to control. His motive in the Cycle is entirely for his brother's honour. He is also a front-line warrior who is second only to Achilles (and tied with Ajax the Greater and Diomedes). Achilles never makes it inside the walls of Troy. His death is actually what prompts the creation of the Trojan Horse, since the Greeks do not believe they can win without him. The concept of Achilles' heel is actually a Roman invention. In the Iliad, Achilles is actually wounded in combat by a Paeonian called Asteropaios (also absent from the film). So, yeah there are actually quite a lot of differences. Many characters either missing or fused into other characters. The entire Trojan Cycle was extremely condensed for the movie, which is understandable. They obviously removed the divine influences but decided to go a bit further and throw in some atheistic subtext. And the sequence of events, especially with character deaths, is somewhat disorganised. I can enjoy the movie for what it is but when I read the Iliad I was intrigued by how different it was from the movie.
Should've just knocked Paris out, tied him up and gagged him, and then locked him in the room at the bottom of the ship while they sailed back to Sparta.
I hated Paris so much! He was so selfish, weak and cowardly! Who remember that scene when scrambled to Hector’s feet like a pitiful dog running away from his battle? He made me so tense and furious ever scene I saw him in 😒
-I go with her -Uhmm...no.....guards, as the rightful heir to the throne of Troy, I order you to lock my little brother up in the ship, while I bring back Helene to Sparta, and apologize to our allies.
