I'd love to see something from Golden Earring (their guitarist of over 50 years was diagnosed with ALS recently) or Thank You Sceintist (Tom Monda is a BEAST and uses a fretless).
Its not rocket science people, King Gizzard is just paying an homage to turkish folk/anatolian rock and also experimenting with it. The guitars are fretted in the same way as the turkish string instrument saz and you can find many riffs and melodies they use in old turkish folk songs. That being said, i worship King Gizzard as a Turk because of how insanely fresh and creative their mixture of this old style with garage rock is. Cant get enough of it. It took an Australian band to make anatolian rock cool again.
Thanks for watching and helping me get introduced to even more of this type of music. I had no idea what anatolian rock was until i made this video. Are there any bands in particular from this genre you'd recommend?
@@LieLikesMusic Its always so thrilling to find out about a new genre of music. Anatolian rock started out in the 70s combining elements from rock and funk with traditional turkish tunes. I read in an interview that Stu is a particular fan of Erkin Koray. At the time many anatolian rock bands used normal fretted guitars and turkish saz but i remember Erkin Koray having a microtonally fretted electric guitar, i dont know if he was the first though. Others that come to my mind from that time are Baris Manco, Cem Karaca, Ersen ve Dadaslar, Mogollar, 3 Hürel. You can actually just check this youtube channel called Anatolian Rock Revival Project, they post remastered versions from this genre. Also there is a new band called Altin Gün, which got very popular in Europe lately, due to their new spin on old turkish folk/Anatolian rock songs, really recommend it. Hope this helps. I really appreciate your videos man, you put a lot of work into them, i myself am also very interested in history of music and really enjoy your videos, keep it up! Cheers:)
Yes and no, king Gizzard is an universal concept of music and anticategorise band just like Zappa making he’s own music. They don’t want fame they want experimental music.
@@LieLikesMusic There is a youtube channel called " Anatolian Rock Revival Project" i just can't recommed enough. Also i have a playlist called "Kukumav", you can find 200+ examples from different eras, genres and artists. I will put the link below. Link to my playlist: ru-vid.com/group/PL2bGUKMxCL0frLSQCpjiXvXTODXzeWPDI
They went Turkey to learn about microtones, and sleep drifter is actually a version of song called 'Kara Toprak' by Aşık Veysel (Tradititonal Turkish Musician) If you are up to microtonal music, you can look for some scales called 'Makam' in Turkish Music which (Hicaz, Hüseyni, Segâh etc.)
@@mrwoodchuck94 i quite liked L.W, i think its probably my favourite of the trio, and some of the early songs from the Demos 1+2 album is a jam too, but thats just me
@@emmarossignol4445 Thats just in the latest albums i believe. All the previous Catalog is in E. Fishies, Nonagon, Quarters are all in E. Infest, Murder, and K.G.L.W are in C# mostly i believe.
Sorry for the late reply but they’ve actually been using different tunings since the Mind Fuzz Era. They usually use either C# standard or E. You can hear E standard on 12Bar, ELTS, FAFYL, Quarters (some songs are in Eb standard), PMDB, Nonagon, MOTU, sketches and parts of Fishies and Gumboot. C# is on Mind Fuzz, Gumboot, Rats nest, fishies and poly. The tuning they use on microtonal albums is (C# F# C# F# b e), but sometimes they use a capo
Nice work Lie, but how is it possible not to mention the Arabic/Turkish scales (maqams). Or at least any of the microtonal instruments that have been there since forever, like Oud or Saz (Baglama) for example. And btw KGLW is so inspired by folk Middle-Eastern music! Just wanted to clear this out.
Thanks. And yes i glossed over a lot of the instruments and inspiration here. So thanks for adding this in the comments for people who are more interested.
Microtonal instruments are so impressive producing those captivating low & slow vibrating frequencies. Microtonality is wondrous as opens up space for endless explorations, experimentations & unexpected fusion of so many different styles. It’s a core of Gizzard’s creativity. Sounds so revolutionary. 🎸 🎹 🎷
@@harry_mair I have no idea what for. Fantano talked about them not being as creative for these couple of albums which I find to be a load of horseshit. The way they experiment with microtones on this album for a variety of sounds and the like is unreal. Just because they return to a style they used before doesn't mean they're lacking in creativity and I can't think of another group that standard would be applied to.
@@TheVanillaQueen I get what fantano said in that review to an extent cos automation sounds like something theyve done before (even though I still think it's great) but songs like Intrasport, Honey and Straws in the Wind show a lot more experimentation than on FMB. Personally I prefer LW to KG cos I think it has less meh songs, on KG I wasn't amazed by some of us and hungry wolf and to an extent oddlife too but on LW the only songs I feel kinda meh on are pleura and Ataraxia, and I still think they are better than some of KG
@@GoogleUser-ms6hr Pleura was my number 3 on LW. Ataraxia I think requires a couple listens but it's really good. Supreme Ascendancy and Static Electricity were my one and two respectively. K.G. had some absolute bangers but it didn't really blow me away. LW is a verifiable masterclass in microtonal rock.
@@TheVanillaQueen totally agree on what u said on kg and LW, LW is pretty amazing. I think the choruses on Ataraxia and Pleura are really nice, it's just I don't really like the rest of Ataraxia and Pleura doesn't seem as creative as most of their other microtonal stuff. Supreme ascendency and static electricity were definite standouts for me on first listen, but we can't forget the absolute beast of the KGLW outro, holy fuck
When you are talking about the history of microtones I was shocked that you did not include their use in Eastern music. Microtones are extremely prevalent in Middle Eastern, Asian, and other music and the fact that you did not mention this seems like a huge oversight. You even say that it gives KGatLW's music a middle eastern feel and still focused on western music somehow.
That's true. I glossed over a huge part of the history. Thankfully there are a lot of people here in the comments that provide tons of info on Anatolian and turkish rock as well as some insight into the history of the 24TET system. Maybe there will be another video in the future where i go more in-depth on that part.
Ronnie Le Tekro TNT 1/4 stepper, Uli Roth, Derek Frigo Enuff Znuff would often bend to a1/4 steps; Duane Allman(slide) was either way out of tune or playing 1/4steps, maybe, lifted off of BB King albums
@@LieLikesMusic have you guys ever heard of this band called AC/DC? They're kind of underground not sure anyone knows them but they're def Australian. Actually some of their early works influences Gizz they cover Let There Be Rock
man the editing is so great I almost believed you and the drummer were in the same room haha this is way beyond my knowledge or skill in guitar, but it was amazing to watch regardless!
6:30 They arent doing anything new. Dont get me wrong i like king gizzard. But their music is heavily based on 70's anatolian (turkish) rock music. The song Sleep drifter is a version of "kara toprak" which is a song by the turkish poet, Asik Veysel. I just find it wrong to say that they are doing something new and conventional, whilst not mentioning the roots and heavy influence of anatolian music on KG's music
I agree that it was wrong not to list the influences, especially the Kara Toprak song. Although I would say that it is innovative bringing these tones and influences into modern western rock. Every idea comes from something that came before after all. Cheers!
@@gamestvandmore Oh yeah for sure! I really like the way theyre approaching the music. However the way this video phrased how theyre using microtones in a new way just felt wrong :)
Can you please do a video on the band Slint? Their second album Spiderland celebrated its 30-year anniversary a few days ago and despite only having 2 albums, they've become a massively influential band for a variety of genres.
A note on tunings - as others have pointed out, Joey and Stu have used C# F# C# F# B E from FMB through KGLW. In the FMB-era days, Cook and Lucas used a standard tuned guitar/bass with a different fret system to the others. As of 2021, Cook seems to have adopted the C# F# C# F# B E tuning and fret system and Lucas has begun to use a custom built 5-string bass (still in standard) but with an entirely different fret system, including half/fifth frets !!
great video! I saw Gizz live a few months before the pandemic hit and they were phenomenal. one of my favourite things about their sound is Stu's crazy delay sound, it just adds such flavour to the music!
Saw 'the Gizz' last week on their Micro tour, and they are one of the best live acts I have ever seen. They didn't even play songs from my favourite album 'Infest the Rats Nest' and it was still phenomenal.
Awesome. I've seen some of their live performances on RU-vid. And they look and sound sick. If i was there in person i bet the experience would be 10x better.
@@LieLikesMusic I sincerely hope you get a chance to see them, and soon! We had to sit and have 1 seat between us, but still, musically it was a 5 star performance. Stu was awesome, and Ambrose's voice actually blew me away, especially for the song 'Straws in the wind'. Goosebumps. Keep up the great work. Subscribed \m/
@@TheShanlou Thanks for subscribing! It means a lot. And yes i hope to see them soon too. Straws In The Wind is one of my favorite songs from the KG album.
I have fully committed to nano-notes. And my accuracy has skyrocketed. Many can't understand the brilliance. They're just haters...trying to say the music is out of tune. Wrong. Oh so wrong. And I've started to explore quantum tones. Finding I seem to have a knack for it. 🙃
It would be great to add a part 2 mentioning the Radif and Dastgah systems of Persian music and Muqams of Arabic and Turkish music. They have names for those scales you don’t have names for!
seeing them this Thursday in Fremantle, last time i saw them they just released Flying Microtonal Banana in 2017, now they got two more under their belt
@@abaker2921 - Us Aussies are just in a different situation to other countries OS, so we deal with the Covid thingi in accordance to our particular circumstances. We Are pretty lucky though, compared to other OS countries.
@@LieLikesMusic It was sick, they played a whole set of microtonal music so very in keeping with your vid. Mostly from KG and LW, some Flying Microtonal Banana too. Stu said they were stoked to play for a crowd again (we don't have any covid cases in Western Australia, fingers crossed it'll stay that way). I hope you get to see them when they're around your neck of the woods next, their live shows are phenomenal.
Great video, really well researched and presented. I remember hearing Doolittle for the first time on a visit to my sister in London back in 1990, she had the album on cassette and it totally shook me. It gave me the feeling of coming home, that this music was made for me, it had so many ingredients from the music that been in the soundtrack of my life to that point, it was a really profound moment. It certainly cut my journey time into university on my skateboard 🛹 it was an exciting time to be alive.
I was so excited with the title and watch the video but I am afraid I am quite disappointed with the content. I have to say that you skipped microtones in all three songs: Sleep Drifter (lyrics part), Automation (2nd degree) and O.N.E. (I think it is 2nd degree again, I have to double check). You can listen to my Sleep Drifter cover to see the right microtones. For the others, you have to listen to them a little bit more carefully, though I agree that you are not accustomed to hearing those notes. One last criticism is that the title is "Understanding their Microtonal Music" and you don't say a word about Anatolian Rock bands that they've been influenced drastically for all 3 microtonal albums. So the microtonality idea comes from Erkin Koray, Cem Karaca, Selda Bağcan etc. You can read these in their interviews.
I'm pretty confident in the examples i gave of microtonal notes. Maybe i missed a few because i didn't cover the entire songs. And yes you're definitely right about the Anatolian rock inspiration. My bad for not including that.
Great video man. I don't think I've seen someone talk as effectively about what it's like to play one of these. You're going to make me buy a microtonal neck 🤣
@@tpguitars I may just go that. I built a telecaster deluxe from random parts last year. I'm using an old squire strat neck as a temporary thing. The more I think about it, the more I'd like a microtonal one. I saw when Charles got his last year (his channel is great too) so that's two positive reviews.
Awesome video! My only criticism is that i wish you explained why the different tuning system sounds so middle eastern. That aspect would've been cool to learn more about
Ahh microtonal sounds so much like the Sitar music of my yoof. The fret layout gave me the clue. Mind you there are some very complicated and beautiful Ragas out there.
It‘s true that western music theory is having a hard time explaining microtones, but as oriental music has used them for a long time, it would have been logical to include arabian music theory. Especially the maqams, because thats where you find the scales they used or borrowed.
There's nothing new about the usage of microtones by KGLW except that the genre which is rock. It's clearly heavily influenced by Turkish folk music. For those folks who want to dig deeper I recommend searching the terms "bağlama" and "türkü".
It blows my mind to think of the possibilities of using microtonal melodies with harmony, check out Julian Carrillo, Mexican composer/ scientist, composer, violininst and conductor who carried out research on microtonalism since the end of the 19th century and developed the Sound 13 theory, the first attempt to formalize the systematic study of microtonalism. He was director of the National Conservatory of Music and the National Symphony Orchestra of Mexico and founded the Beethoven Symphony Orchestra and the Sound 13 Orchestra, based in New York. He designed and built microtonal pianos and harps to perform his compositions, in an effort that brought together knowledge of acoustics, strength of materials, and music theory.
A lot of Turkish Psych bands and Saharan bands seem to get the same sounds from standard guitars. Does anyone know what tunings are used to achieve this?
Love the new concept! Did not know his bass also had some extra frets. Wonder if more guitar/bassists play like this, I'll dig into it! Thanks for the information Lie.
Thanks for this awesome video, you allowed me to finally access this band. I was trying to listen to them a few times over the last few years and it never clicked, it just sounded too far out. But this video actually was the first time I learned about microtonal and I'm giving them a closer listen and it's been really cool. Thanks bud
That's awesome man! Then my work is done hehe. I experienced the same thing though. I found out about them back in 2017. But i'm way more into them nowadays after more exposure.
Cool video. :D Just some thoughts of mine: a) Droning was heavily used in european music as well; think of bagpipes and even many classic organ pieces feature a drone in some parts. b) Until the invention of the 12TET system around 1799, europed used several intonations including an approach of 19 tones to approximate the major third 5/4 frequency ratio at around 387 Cent better at the expense of perfect fifths being shrunk down to something between 697 or even 666 instead of 702. This major third is notably lower than the regular 400C third we are used to torture our kids ears with and i never liked any major scale at all... until i found a turkish guy on youtube covering King Gizzard on a microtonal guitar with small frets added for those lowered thirds and additional microtones. Also, on the 19-well tempered tuning the third gets streches up to 310C which is farther away from the perfect pythagoran 295 C of frequency ration 32/27. And it sounds... kinda awefull. Poor Mozart and all the other composers couln't write propper sad songs because their Cembali were hunted with weirdly sharpened minor thirds in favour of the less sharpened major third. So the 12TET is indeed better at approximating fifthts and minor thirds... I feel like this is the reason why music theorists are continuing to brabble about how every music listener has a "major bias" and how C-major is "the prototype for scales" when clearly, the 12TET major scale sounds childish and aweful and oh god, i can't stand this melodic torturing sharpened bullshit, please somebody get me a post punk band with distorted guitars and a minor third! Jeez! My point is: The 12TET was never "the best compromise", it was just the "least worse" in terms of practicability for western music. And since "the west" like to justify its historic roots by means of weird math, there was the idea that the 12TET was somehow "the most natural system to use" and it stuck that way for about a century until the artists tried to re-open the field of tuning systems and microtones. One weekend i sat down and tried to build up my own scale in an exel spread sheet from microsteps of 20, 21 and 30 in a simple pattern such that i would get 20+21+30=71 augmented prime and 71+21=92 small demi-tone, 92+20=112 diatonic demi-tone, 112+71=183 small whole tone, 183+21=204 big whole-tone... these are the "natural" small intervals known since ancient times. It worked wuite well and in the end i got 53 microtones where most fifths, major and minor thirds were perfect and... then i found out that there exsists a 53TET system which approximates the fifthts even better than i did at the expense of approximating the demi-tones... because of course somebody had already done that. :/ i adjusted my system slightly and i'm now going to write regular western harmony music with it, but seemingly random floating up or down a comma while doing so and it just feels soooo natural to use this system... but i get that most people don't want 53 keys per octave or play fretless all day long. But my computer doesn't care... So, yeah, there is more to microtonality than just adding quarter-tones in between the demitones of 12TET. :)
When I listen to you play , I hear a lot of cords and sound of the band Tool ! I really like this sound a lot and want to explore it more ! Thank you for sharing this !
You can play some chords too based on the 11th harmonic, which is a quartertone, like C - F‡ (F# - 50 cents), maybe with an extra octave thrown in. If you have "6th tone" frets, you can do 7th harmonic chords like C - A‡‡ (A# - 30 cents). It's easy to do this in an open chord tuning. Even a regular major 3rd is 15 cents too sharp compared to the 5th harmonic (9th fret). Eddie Van Halen used to detune the B string to play just major triads on some songs.
look up “Disoriented Ghost - Metamorphic” for some more modern microtonal psych, definitely gizz inspired although they use a different scale/fret placement and incorporate more world instruments, couple records on youtube that come up first when u search
One thing so would like to add, is that these microtones are not ones based off of “true” tuning per intervals, only equal, unlike a lot of eastern music. On Sitar for example, they can adjust intonation extremely accurately.
Some drummers do but most don't. Even if not tuned to specific notes, drums are still tuned in pretty standard intervals. By tuning say the rack toms to be very close intervals and the floor tom to be a big interval they could be considered to be microtonal.
Microtonal western music is older than Parch. It goes all the way back to Ancient Rome and Greece, which likely goes back even further, back to Mesopotamia. But it has existed in Western Europe for thousands of years.
I've been trying to make melodies with microtones, and it's very interesting, but how do u built a microtonal scale like in "major/minor terms"?? I know that eastern music use other systems to built scales and melodies, and i would like to know if there's a way to make an scale adding these microtones, thank u :D
Apparently there's a whole genre of Anatolian rock (turkish rock) that i didn't know about until i published this video. They might be using such scales. It's worth googling and checking out. I'm very new to this as well, so i'm not familiar with any of those scales yet.
What I'm missing in this kind of "microtonal music" aren't the microtones. They're there, obviously. What I do miss in this expression is the _music_ part. Almost everyone fiddling with microtones uses them as an addon to 12edo music, like putting some exotic spice into an otherwise rather ordinary dish. I'd count King Gizzard into this group. In contrast, only few people compose pieces that actually "live" in a non-12edo tonal system, making use of the non-12edo intervals in such a way that the music doesn't sound like spiced up 12edo music, but like true non-12edo. Such music can sound like it's from another galaxy. What's exceptionally rare in non-12edo music though is what every good composer actually ought to be able to do: Modulate through the whole tonal system, going from any key to any other, random key in a pleasant way. Key changes are what brings music really to life and makes it exciting. Of course this demands a quite thorough understanding of the tonal system a piece is written in. Currently, there are only very few composers out there who fit into this group. I'm hoping that some day, it will be more.
Excuse me but in maqam music there are 42 different names (if I’m not mistaken) for notes in 2 octaves. What do you mean you can’t name them? For example rast (G), nim zirgule, zirgule, dik zirgule, dugah (A). 3 notes between G and A.
i don't understand what you mean by "even if they choose not to strum any of the microtones and they just use the normal tones on the guitar, the build of the guitar makes the overall sound different", as a person who understands how to build guitars this doesn't make sense to me, do you mean the tone of the guitar is different, or the guitar influences the play style?
(12:45) King Gizzard have a video out that discloses the tunings they use for their microtonal stuff which is defo worth checking out! ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-bC-cJvIZiRo.html
