Using The "Peel-Off" Technique for Trumpet 

You're making a good point. I just want to make clear for others that you actually can't physically and literally buzz your lips in terms of the physical movement. You're totally right that the air is doing the job here. However, Charlie talks about the correlation between lip buzzing and playing the trumpet. This is undeniable. It's just matter of adjusting the setting, but in fact, the concepts behind lip and mouthpiece buzzing and playing the horn (also other brasswind instruments) are the exact same ones. Thus, lip buzzing is definitely NOT a "separate technique" here. Apart from that, you're totally right. If we sound very good with our lips and on the mouthpieces, chances are that we are having good form as well. Cheers, Jens

Well, I wouldn’t say it’s an all together different technique. We have absolute scientifically proven evidence to support that the lips do in fact vibrate when we play...we cannot dispute this. However, what must be understood is that there is correlation between the pitch you buzz and how much higher it will be on the trumpet because of the smaller vibrational area of the mpc and the resistance of the horn. This means that playing a middle “g” should feel like buzzing a low “Bb” and not like buzzing a middle “g”. I explain this in the video, but many people simply persist on believing that they are just blowing air or that they have to buzz the same pitch. It is not a different technique...otherwise this exercise would be a complete waste of time. We buzz when we play, we just don’t buzz as high as we play...and the higher we play the larger the different becomes in the correlation. As someone who has studied with many famous teachers, some of whom don’t advocate buzzing, i we’ll understand where they are coming from. However, the results when done correctly, speak for themselves. Something needs to vibrate in order to make sound...thinking that simply blowing air is enough to accomplish this is akin to believing that some magical force is creating the vibration...nope, it’s your lips. Just include the correlation of resistance into your equation and do not buzz for too long and make sure you are going for good sound. The point is to play with form supporting this vibration and not just excessive mouthpiece pressure.

I actually think this method encourages far more tension than necessary to play. Air passing through the lips, the resistance in the leadpipe (or any tube, for that matter), is what causes the lips to 'buzz' rather than actively buzzing. Buzzing, in itself, is an isometric exercise and should be treated as such. It have benefits to trumpet playing, not necessarily correlations. Resource: www.physics.usyd.edu.au/teach_res/hsp/sp/mod31/m31_pipesA.htm

Brae Grimes sorry, but I believe you are mistaken. If you look up the word isometric you’ll clearly see that buzzing any two notes or more is clearly not isometric, since there is a movement of muscles and contraction taking place and the word isometric clearly denotes that no change of muscular contraction happens. Only buzzing one long tone could be considered isometric, as would be playing a single long tone on trumpet. You are also mistaken about the horn’s resistance being the only thing that causes the lips to buzz. If your stance is that it causes too much tension to use proper form then you are most likely not buzzing in a relaxed manner but instead over muscling the tension. Air that’s to rich in Oxygen can kill you but to say that Oxygen isn’t good to breathe would be a false statement. Can’t think of a better analogy, but hopefully you get the point. This is not a black and white issue. Your reasoning is why there is a debate. You see lip buzzing as is something that causes excess tension, when in reality you are most likely using too much pressure yourself when ascending and might actually benefit from learning to buzz with the proper amount of resistance. Also, believe it or not, you are most likely confusing the pressure of the mouthpiece against the lips and the resistance of the horn. If you press enough, the pressure will flatten down lips and make them come closer together. I will agree that blowing air only and pressing the lips onto the mouthpiece will yield a better sound than over muscling the lips. However they are both not the best route. Also, your PDF has a very poor explanation of how brass instruments work. If you want a better explanation from a physics/scientific point of view, I’d be happy to provide one.

Also, watch this video of the inside of the lips while playing to clearly see them vibrating (buzzing) and contracting from one note to the next: ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE-IvYmX-frcBI.html

@@jazzdorefree194 Slowly. I'm thinking I need lessons but the trick is to find someone who knows how to work on this sort of thing. Past instructors just had me playing exercises or songs with no comment about correct embouchure.

@@jazzdorefree194 Excellent points. I do notice that Charlie and many others always make the point that it comes back to how one sounds when they play. That through it all, we should seek to sound beautiful. Good luck with your playing and composing!

I would start with his NTC class from awhile ago, its on youtube

Vince is one of the most influential trumpet educators alive today.

I own a Shires DiMartino trumpet. A really nice horn. 😊

Anthony Lenzo of course Anthony! Hope you are doing well, man. Been a long time!

@@CharliePorter Nice that you remembered me , you looklike your doing great .I always check out your videos.Be well and happy you and family.

Hey, can you give me a link please?

Thanks. Yes, Chris is a great player...since we are buzzing in any brass instrument, this exercise can help all brass players become more independent from their overuse of pressure.

Mickael Pili I believe it was one of the Essentially Ellington Q and As. maybe 2017. But Chris also had videos on trombone technique and warm up you could look up.

Mickael Pili ru-vid.com/video/%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BE--N7Z2Qey4xI.html here is the link to the video of Chris demonstrating this same technique. he does it around the 55 minutes mark.

Damn dude that's tough :(

Happens to the best of ‘em, just hit the practice room with a positive mindset and you’ll see improvement in no time

That is not sure at all

Same here :(

probably

Rockjawz just trying to show the correlation between buzzing and playing. I seriously wouldn’t over think it if you have a nice sound. Good sound is always the best approach. If your sound is tight or if you find pressure to be your only ally when ascending then relaxed buzzing with good form could be a great addition to your practice.

Chief Kibitzer I can imagine that trumpeters have been doing this exercise since the days of Bach and beyond...there are no limits to the geekdom of trumpeters! I just heard it first from Vince.

Great question! Very curious to hear a reply.

In general, you totally should be able to buzz up to a g above the staff. However, of course it is way more difficult than to buzz a low c. What it comes down to is the application and use of these concepts so that you’re actually using good form, especially in the upper register. so, i suggest that you work on lip buzzing in general. With regard to this exercise, doing this on a middle c would be something to strive for. Hope this helps. Cheers

I'm sure that anatomy plays a role to a certain extent. However, if your bottom lip is curling under the top lip, it's very likely that you lack form. The curling under of the bottom lip is problaby a symptom of your support muscles not being able to hold the form, i.e. not being strong enough or not being sensitive to this movement. I had the same problem and Charlie helped me solve it. Try to implement lip buzzing in a systematic manner and don't overdo it at the beginning. Start at a lower note so that you can rely on form. Even if it's way lower, doesn't matter. It's important to get the concept covered. Practice with a visualizer going from a large aperture to a small aperture using your support muscles. Use a mirror to check. We can't rely on our feeling since our habits trick us and don't want us to escape out of the comfort zone. Do it as often as you can throughout your day. You can even do it when walking around or waiting at the bus stop. Make sure that the red of the lips stays always the same and try to get the most beautiful sound possible. Consistency is key. It does not have to be for hours a day. That's not the point. But you have to do it every single day, especially when trying to overcome an old habit. You'll see that you'll make great progress within a short period of time. However, be aware that progress is hardly visible from day to day. After about 3 months you should have overcome the habit of curling the lip under. Good luck. If you need help, feel free to contact me. I can also highly recommend to book a lesson with Charlie. There's no better way to spend these bucks... Cheers, Jens

It's starting to work. I slowly reduce mouthpiece pressure, and when the buzz turns to a blow, I increase the muscle firmness/compression to bring back the buzz. Of course, I can only pull the mouthpiece so far away, not being able to buzz without the mouthpiece yet. I also test pressure on the upper vs. lower lip to find an optimum, keeping as little pressure on the upper as possible. My point is that even without being able to remove the mouthpiece completely, I'm getting a lot out of this exercise. Thanks, Charlie!

It does not contradict at all. I mean, we're doing the the four-step-setup to set up the lips with the readiness to vibrate. See it as a prerequisite to actually play. If we don't set up with enough space, we can even support in the correct manner, but eventually the lips will touch which will lead to disturbances in the sound. The peel-off exercise is an exercise to check whether you're playing with form or not. The point here is that you are able to use form without having the mouthpiece holding your lips together. When you just normally set up to play, then, of course, use the four steps to set up. Just make sure you're using good form. Lip buzzing will also help to develop good form and to sensitise yourself for actually relying on form and not on mouthpiece pressure or any other compensatory strategy, e.g. using more air when ascending etc. Hope this helps!

@@jens_trumpet Thanks I understand what you say. It doesn't respond what I say but nevertheless, I understood after I comment that, that when you peel off the lips get a little bit relaxed and the note change like Charlie explain in the video. I just didn't understood it right away because I wasn't blowing enough to keep the lips vibrating and it ended helping a lot to understand better what he was talking about. Thanks for your explanation, it was helpful too!

I'm glad it has helped! I read your comment again and I now see what you're after, I think. I'd say, depending on your lip size etc., yes, you'd have to stretch or let's say rather flatten the lips when you set up like that. Make sure that the corners stay neutral. However, when lip buzzing this should be the exact same feeling. In fact, you shouldn't relax more as you peel-off the mouthpiece. By doing so, just make sure to keep the same setting and airflow. You should then get this correlation of a major sixth down. The interval gets wider about the staff as the tongue comes more into play. At least in my experience. So, don't obsess with this exact correlation, but in the mid range it should be about a sixth. To accomplish the same pitch after the peel-off you'd have to work more, of course. The point still is that you use the exact form with the lips alone. If you're too relaxed after the peel-off, chances are that you're not using enough good form. But it's hard to say what you're doing anyway. I can highly recommend that you just book a lesson with Charlie. It's worth it.

@@jens_trumpet I'm really interested in what Charlie have to say about that, that's why I'm gonna book a lesson as son as I feel that worked enough with this concepts. Thanks again

You're welcome! Good luck with all that. It'll be a good investment in your trumpet playing.

To start off with, it's not about range in the first place. If you sound good and have a nice, relaxed and open feeling, you're problaby doing the right thing. Also check out his video on lip buzzing. This might help you out. Cheers!

Remember, you don’t need to be buzzing the same pitch you are playing...this takes more work than simply playing the pitch. The correlation will be something like a major sixth. If your sound is good but when you pull off the mouthpiece there is no buzz at all, then you are mostly using the mouthpiece to hold the lips together, which can work fine in the middle and low registers, but it can lead to bad habits when ascending. So, even if you have the feeling of buzzing a middle C when you are playing in general, then you won’t have more or less the feeling of supporting with good form. The exercise simply makes more use of that form by making the player match the pitches between buzzing and playing. Don’t be in a rush to develop range with the buzz and don’t lip buzz for too long at a time.

One more thing...to get that good sounding buzz on the low C, make sure you are pulling the lips away enough to create the space they need to vibrate well. To understand this better, I recommend watching the four step approach to embouchure set-up video that I made.

Florin Precup I can attest to that. Overuse of those muscles will lead to injury and you’ll have to start from scratch. That happened to me and the recovery process was very draining.

Tyler J. Holt well, a little buzzing never hurt me or Clark Terry ;) Being scared of lip buzzing is irrational. You are going to vibrate the lips to varying degrees while you play, whether you like it or not. The idea is not to over-muscle things with the face, but rather to take some of the energy being applied through arm pressure in the higher ranges and redirect it to supporting the face muscles properly and as a result grow stronger as a trumpeter. Muscles are going to activate one way or another up there, whether they are in your face or arms (as well as your abs). The point is having balance...I never recommend playing out of balance and over muscling, which CAN hurt you!

Charlie Porter that is very true! Thank you! When I was taking pedagogy lessons in grad school, I was so fixated on the physical aspect of it, that I inadvertently was forcing those concepts and ended up injuring myself. I’ve been focusing on playing in a balanced manner since then. Your videos on finding natural jaw position as well embouchure have been helping me a lot! Side note: Gabriel DiMartino was my professor in grad school 😊