VICE Journalist Debates Islamic Female Genital Mutilation with David 

+thekidofva ship yea

Now if pakman could take on Athiest-is-Unstoppable then that would actually be something worthwhile. I'm still waiting.

I didn't even know that they had beef. The only video I've seen AiU do on David was the one on black crime statistics.

***** She got 3 holes. Count me in.

government mule! That just sounds wrong. LOL.

I agree. Also, I think VICE is more concerned with maintaining their Brooklyn-hipster image than in employing the cream-of-the-crop, when it comes to journalists. Ms. Anderson checks off all the right boxes for them, but unfortunately she comes across as unprepared and amateurish.

That's generous... to her.

Justin Carr More like a spork then fork lol

Colin, vice has some crazy good journalists. they are very dedicated and even have soent nights with ISIS

Justin Carr couldn't have said it better. He is always well prepared...she had nothing.

Pierre Du Plessis It was at this moment that she knew, she fucked up

Oh man I couldn’t stop think that through this whole thing

she has balls, i guess but yeh, it was brutal wasnt it

Because essentially she is an honest individual however she has an unconscious bias toward Islam.

@@MrTimnaik that's how I read her as well, but she wasn't prepared for this conversation and was making an emotional argument in a data-driven debate.

Tye Wolfe 👏👏👏👏👏👏

David is definitely my favorite out of the lefty type shows. Not a big fan of TYT or Secular talk. Way too smug and overly sure of themselves. David shows far more fairness and intellectual humility, which I like.

I thought he had a condescending, Superior attitude here. Usually I like him

Here is the hadith ( islamic scripture) that tells muslims to the genitals off of their own daughters ! :' islamqa.info/en/60314

I would prefer someone who appears smug and arrogant to someone who can't find their research or make a coherent argument.

+James Guinsn what was most frightening is that it was done in a calm and composed manner...

+MsSKim1 David "ICEMAN" Pakman

James Guinsn lmao

+MsSKim1 What we can take away from this video is that David Pakman is a fucking savage.

I think if you look at an EKG of a lion's heart while devouring a gazelle, it's BPM doesn't go over 51 bpm. :)

Savage

fuzzwobble Most satisfying beast mode annihilation ever. David Pakman deserves a fucking award for this flawless victory 😂

What I like about Pakman is he will concede when he is wrong, but he won't let anybody misrepresent him either. He'll call you on your shit if you strawman him.

fuzzwobble And since he always has his facts, he is hardly ever wrong unlike this dimwit. He needs a stage where he can just debate and shread uninformed people.

OS

Colin M Indeed

Three years later and he is still calm and collected.

Its cause he's not motivated by winning. Unlike most people, he is motivated by truth and reason.

Na, maybe she will wake up.

how can you feel bad for a woman supporting a religion that practices female genital mutilation? it's insane

RJinthematrix I said "almost" :p

feel bad for her? why?

Why? LOL

Do you live on RU-vid? I see you everywhere.

+Jenkkimie Pot calling kettle a very dark shade of blue, green or brown. The colour black, in regard to manufacturing, doesn't actually exist. It's always a very dark shade of blue, green or brown.

Hugh O'Toole Oh I never claimed otherwise. In fact I was specifically planning that if she would have responded me positively, I would have responded with: " Me too. " But I guess Poe's Law is an interesting one, eh?

Jenkkimie​ I should have put a smilie face at the end of that comment. Twas late & I forgot :0)

Hugh O'Toole Poe's law strikes again I guess! :)

No one can rattle him, he’s calm and rational.

That's because he's deceptive shill. He can't get upset because he has no emotional attachment. He has a task and he follows it through. But I'd like to see him debate Scott Adams just to see if Adams can get him riled up.

@@BarbaPamino : lame post

@@roqsteady5290 it's still true

@@BarbaPamino No it is your opinion.

except "requestSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS"

Ha! Feels over reals! That's great.

HA HA!!😀

To be fair she's the one putting herself out there. She is the one releasing her content she must deal with repercussions that come with it. people will be judge her for what she puts out and there is nothing she can do about it.

Why? Vice hasn't produced anything good or impartial in years. Everyone knows that. Just look at their coverage on hard hitting topics like tattoos in Korea......or their totally biast coverage on the Men's Right Movement, the 1st international conference for men's issues, etc. If it's not feminist, black and/or progressive, it doesn't get covered.

Congo Parrot she is a liar and was embarrassed to no end on this post. Just another prideful woman that is ignoring the demise that this God rejecting world is heading towards

Like so many Muslim apologies she morphs the underlying argument to set up a straw man that she wants to demolish, and he just consistently refuses to let her get away with it. When she is stuck with the actual facts She is totally incapable of refuting them

I googled this journalist after watching this and was shocked to find that she had not committed seppuku after this interview. Clearly there is no more honor amongst journalists.

FINISH HER!!!!

BRUTALITY!!!

darttoyou1 I'M DYING 😂😂😂

Prepared with what? She ended up conceding to David that FGM is a Muslim problem. Which was the entire point of the contention. She lost. Nothing she would've brought would've reversed or mitigated her sound defeat.

Is a problem with Muslims, but not a Muslim specific problem. Something David explained he already agreed with.

He did the same thing Sam Harris does...and I love Sam but they do this thing where they nitpick in circles around what they said and what they "meant" instead of actually getting to any real argument.

Great Helm That's literally the entire point she refuted. How stupid can you be?

The point that it's not a Muslim specific problem remains unsubstantiated. What Christian group, or other non-Islamic group, practise FGM?

"Nice ass kicking" = David Pakman in a nutshell.

lol same. So cringe...

You expected that from a Reza Aslan supporter?

Suya Yuvika She calls herself a journalist and an author, so...

I agree. Write online and you're a writer, go somewhere and take some photos and you're a journalist. If you're attractive then, well, the world is your lobster.

Vice is a branch of Murdoch's journalistic empire and his son is on the board, I think it's exactly the kind of company you'd expect it to be.

Travel outside Africa and get to Indonesian and Malaysian stats on gfc !!

Yeah it seems like Sulome is more concerned with how the facts come off to the wider audience that obviously cannot deal with nuance and need to be protected from it. I can understand her concerns about this but I don't agree with them. It sort of raised the question of in what situation can the cold facts ever be presented?

Don't forget those little 'notification bells' on her MacBook going off every 2 minutes. Little treats

Yeah. Remove the trinkets before going live ffs...

That can only help her.

+RenderTheGalaxy probably some of the guys she had made out with the night before.

***** because as he states, even those countries who are majority christian FGM affects muslims at a much greater rate. and as he never stated that FGM originates in islam, that point is a strawman.

+hooks bell Do what? That's a strawman really.It affects MANY Muslim women as well as Christian, Jewish and animist...

Hooks bell+ just because it predates Islam doesn't prove anything and David 100% DID acknowledge it. Murder predates Osama Bin Ladin but that doesn't mean he's not a murderer lol. Get it?

He's owning her badly. It's actually hard to watch her fumble around and say things like, well I don't have proof but I'm sure I'm right. Lol.

***** he discussed everything in a contextual matter in his first video. the the context argument is usually one made by those who defend FGM.

I'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt because maybe she misspoke or something. BUT the problem was that she NEVER provided a clarification or a rebuttal about her statements. She just wasted time trying to spin criticism of Reza Aslan as Islamophobic, which again is so effing stupid

+ArchAingeal I am talking about them cutting off the clitoral hood. That is one of the common forms of female circumcision..so it would definitely be similar. Even if we are talking about the clitoris itself..it would still be the act of cutting off perfectly healthy, functional parts of the genitals of a young, defenseless, unconcienting person..just like it is done to males. Yes..if we are talking about an instance where someone were to remove the clitoris..that would be worse..but still an act that should not be done to people..especially not to the young.

They don't just cut off the clitoral hood. Since we know their reasoning, which is to destroy nerves..They shave part of the clitoris off. At least know what the hell you're talking about. It's comparable to cutting the actual penis. Not just the skin. www.mtholyoke.edu/~mcbri20s/classweb/worldpolitics/page1.html

You really need to learn more about what they're actually doing..Stop listening to the apologist version.

+Vanessa W There are different types of female circumcision. The one I was talking about involves the removal of the the clitoral hood. Also..even with the different types in mind..we can still very much compare the two. This video that compares both would be good for a clearer picture.. listenonrepeat.com/?v=98f3IavuEgQ#Difference_Between%3A_Male_%26_Female_Circumcision

+Vanessa W This is not the apologist version..this is the realistic/common sense version. The removal of healthy, functional cells of the genitals of young, defenseless, non-consenting children is more alike than you think. But because of the lack of understanding and the bias view of seeing something as completely different when it is very similar..people simply view one as okay and another as terrible and do not even take into account the different types..or even know their are different types. I happen to believe that all forms are wrong and unnecessary for both sexes and should be made illegal on children like the person in the video believes..just keep it simple for something that is so weird and actually kind of twisted when you think about it.

Ditto! i can't believe she is a journalist.

Man, my mind is going from 15 years of weed use. When she started in with the, "it predates Islam" shit I cringed so hard MY clit fell off.

but david mispronounced her name, so its a draw

kathy kelly Of course he did,....that's because Everything is sexist, Everything is racist, Everything is homophobic and you have to point IT ALL OUT! - Anita Sarkeesian And the latest addendum is: EVERYTHING IS ISLAMOPHOBIC! As David said, at least she had the spine to come on the show. These regressives usually crumble when they're away from the herd. These mad bastards are suicidal! They know not what they do. Here in Europe if the muslims continue to arrive and give birth at the current rate they will be a majority within 30 years! It's even worse....they don't need a majority as we Europeans have Parliamentary systems they don't need anywhere near 51% to take power they can get there with half of that. And they are telling us that is what they plan to do. These feminists must not be capable of critical thinking or game theory. God (or whoever) help them if they are under a government run by the religion of peace.

No prep, not even passable on-the-spot rhetoric and stalling. Hard to think of other people who were so overmatched in a debate. Pakman probably had stuff in reserve but didn't get to use given she toppled so easily.

NO MA'AM love the name and pic; Al Bundy lives in all of our hearts!

Epic commet bro. Or brodette.

"I don't have the data in front of me". Did she know she was coming on the show?

Of course she did... do you think seriously think shows like this are done on the fly without preperation? Or were you being sarcastic?

Yeah. Sarcasm was lost in the message.

Not your fault, I didn't have any weed yesterday... I can be a salty oblivious little bitch when that happens.

"The right thing to do but it was a mistake" ahahaha

The worst part of her 'rebuttal' to David was, "I would agree FGM is a problem in Islam, but it's not an Islamic problem", she used the distinction without a difference fallacy and is oblivious to it. I wish David had pointed this out to her, but I supposed he didn't want to come off as mean. She was already crumbling due to her coming unprepared. But at least that's the comments are for, further discussion after the debate.

Goodness me you're so right. There's standing up for yourself and there's this. David was very gracious, he could see she was young, practically her first assignment and she can consider herself lucky she didn't have to go to Court. I'm sure in the years that have passed she has learnt from this, here's hoping.

@@misterree09 "I would agree FGM is a problem in Islam, but it's not an Islamic problem" But she's right in that. FGM is a cultural problem from Central Africa, that has taken hold of both muslim and christian communities. Her argument is that FGM is a problem in many Islamic communities among others due to cultural influence from Central Africa, but it's not a problem tied to Islamic doctrine any more than one tied to Christian doctrine.

You have a point but an impartial observer would have thought David was the better debater simply because of his poise and preparedness. She just could not back her assertions with credible evidence even though she may have been accurate on that point.

@Ashley Marie Exactly.

@Donald Smith ROFL!

He already has

no they arnt a joke,take a look at their documentaries and certain articles stop trying to dismiss everything they do because of reporters like her.

A LOT of the stuff they do is trash.

They have some good stuff, but most of it is crap now.

Yeah.

since they got bought out a few years back they've become much more like a tabloid. Much more biased in a lot of their reporting too.

You should see the article she wrote afterwards where she still doesn't address any of David's points and basically blames him for her own lack of preparedness. Unbelievable.

I can't even watch the rest of it... my toes hurt.

@@ConsciousExpression U must be shitting me , did she actually do that ?

@@SOak145 I shit you never. Here's the relevant passage: "The day of the interview, I had just arrived home from a refugee camp where I had been interviewing a suicidal twelve-year-old Syrian girl living in circumstances I imagine being quite alien to people like Pakman and his fans. I barely had time to prep and make myself look presentable, and so was somewhat unprepared for the scenario that ensued. " She goes on to say: "In several ways, Pakman set the whole thing up to make me look like an idiot and misrepresented his original portrayal of the issue (FGM and Islam), which I was meant to be critiquing" No personal responsibility whatsoever

@@SOak145 Oh and PS - having read the article again her lack of accountability is breathtaking. The entire article is about the trolls who supposedly attacked her after her appearance. She grossly mischaracterizes David's response, pretends that she got no legitimate criticism whatsoever, and focuses solely on the response from trolls, whom she blames entirely on David himself, as though he has some sort of control over what other people do. she claims he egged on the mob, but provides absolutely no evidence of this at all. In my opinion, she's the troll.

Under prepared, badly researched and not too bright. Definitely. Liar is a little harsh. Being wrong is not necessarily deliberately lying.

+mrfriendlyguy FGM and MGM was a cultural practice before Islam. It is argued that Islam copied many practices from judaism such as no pork and MGM.

+TheRahsoft No one disputes the practice predated Islam. But lots of practices predate a particular organisation or religion, but is still adopted by said religion. The example I gave is praying. Older religions such as Christianity did it as well.

Islam is a plagetised jumble of crazy

VICE is just an extension of the establishments MSM indoctrinating propaganda campaign so what ever they "say" the ultimate goal is to peddle the plutocratic agenda.

Primo : Excellent point. The brevity of their inquiry is sad, additionally I find have a "Click-Bait" quality, kids smoking, Riots, and a guy doing silly things in china because he's white. The title & initial come-on: VICE! Pro or Con?

Gavin left

i almost died when she brought up the google search as support for her argument. like seriously did she even spend more than an hour preparing for this?

mmzen well anyone who tries to rationalize radical and/or awful behavior is essentially radical and/or awful themselves. doesn't matter what religion or group you're discussing.

I really felt bad for her :S

***** i agree. i have noticed that muslims tend to push conversations into areas they feel strongest and away from areas they know they are weak or wrong. its was interesting to watch this slow motion car crash of an example.

Exactly

If you hate islam you are automatically a nazi! /s

+RaniK sorry but that's bullshit. explain to me how a didlike for a pretty violent and silly idea is equivalent to violence against actual people.

+The EX-AhmadiyyaMuslim that wasn't there at first I am sure.

That's not a bad argument in of itself. It's only bad because in this particular instance it's not valid. Considering the entire point of David's video was countering Aslan's argument

Exactly, he doesn't need to present the other side of the argument because Aslan provides it and he was responding.

In the end her only argument was: "You called me a liar, because I OBVIOUSLY lied when I said you hadn't responded. Then you made a video calling me a liar, and THEN AFTER you made your video I changed that you hadn't responded to be that you stopped responding. Now I'm branded a liar because I LIED. That's unfair and I'm offended!" I usually say that men like to talk about how things are in general, whereas women prefer to talk about the exceptions. In saying that, as a man, I acknowledge that I'm generalizing. An easy counterexample is my brother, who prefers to talk about the exceptions - 'cause there are exceptions to all generalisations. If you watch the video "Sam Harris - on political correctness", which is an interview with university professor Jonathan Haidt, you'll hear Haidt say that there were originally three groups of people you were not allowed to criticize (women, blacks and LGBT). That number has now increased to seven groups, and the latest one is Muslims, which is arguably the one that you will currently get the most flak for criticizing. So, here you have a person, who belongs to two of those groups (women and Muslims), so she gets very offended, although she cannot argue her case except for "my feelings were hurt", which, I'm sorry to say, was her own fault. Cause and effect: If you don't like the effect, don't produce the cause. She didn't even apologize for the bullshit she did, but tried to make David apologize for her faults. If you watch the video "Sam Harris: Islam vs. all Muslims", he points out how religious people simply don't want to have their faith criticized, and they simply don't to be told that there's a link between their religion and the horrible acts commited in the name of said religion. Then you have Reza Aslan saying: "Anyone's a muslim who says he's a muslim". So yeah, Isis are not Muslim!? Last thing: I think David should have brought up the numbers of FGM in Asia, but he still did brilliant without.

Rahul Dsouza no offense, but that can make sense and if you are unable to see that you lack very simple insight into life. Take another example: all nazis are dicks but not all dicks are nazis. Its the same. fgm is practiced by muslims but not all who practice it are muslims.

Nobody said all Muslims or that majority of Muslim practice it. What people are saying that of those that do the vast majority are Muslim. See the difference? This lady does not and Pakman who was nothing but respectful to her just destroyed her in the debate.

The overwhelming majority of those who practice it ARE muslims though.

What does that have to do with anything? We are talking about FGM. Nobody is saying the majority of Muslims do this? Certainly not Pakman. Read my comment below. Your comment is irrelevant as nobody is saying the majority of Muslims practice FGM. However the vast majority who FGM are Muslim. See the difference?

Yes I agree, but it's certainly not just a "central African problem" as Reza Aslan has stated.

Sulome circumcised her own intellect.

or castrated it

+Dee Kay haha

+Dee Kay He would have got a better argument from hodor.

+ultrademigod :_(

Damn dude, I just got done crying... WHAH!

Stap! ;_;

VICE has some occasionally good reports. Their reporting on Israel/Palestine in 2014 was really good as was SHane Smith's romp through North Korea. But yeah then you have people like this bimbo

all balls no brains.. who doesn't print off some sources for a bloody debate lol she flounders helplessly it's painful

STONE COLD STUNNER, STONE COLD STUNNER, STONE COLD STUNNER!!!!- JR

jim doesn't say stone cold - he just yells STUNNER! STUNNER! STUNNER! jesse and mcmahon were the best commentator tandem.

BAHHH GAAAWD KING, STONE COLD, STONE COLD, STONE COLD!!!!!

Don't know who that is, but I'd like to see an Ozzy Man review of this.

Nearly 21 minutes in. "People were calling me a liar" Well maybe that's because you lied about him not responding?

I mean its Vice they have no standards.

She became a journalist for Vice because Vice doesn't give a shit about accuracy so long as they can push a far left SJW agenda

Vice is no longer a news establishment. Much more regressive

The only reason Vice got the chance to be a News establishment was its Syria journalists

I glad she had balls to come on the show though... Good for her!

+ICY-HURR even though she is a liar and was proven wrong? good for her. lol

I don't ;)

She has Stockholm syndrome or something similar. You should read her article