I was there... on that very corner! I can tell you the whole crowd were booing MS, we could tell immediately that he tried to take Villeneuve out. It was also Hakkinen's first race win, so I am doubly proud to have been at that corner in 1997.
@SimplyBest-hj1ns lol anyone could see its a clear movement from schumi to hit him, so blatant that its the only time in history someone was disqualified from an entire championship He knew jacques was seconds faster per lap and in that moment, the only way to win the championship was for them both to go out, in a way that ruthlessness is what made Schumi so good.
@@deloford its also in ur mind...but u can never proof that. u can explain why jaques didnt take the corner all the way? Instead of that his car kept straight into the outside curve even after he pushed micheal even after micheals natural response cause he surprised and wanted to defend his position it was his turn man....the fact is he made his break late with high speed pushed ms car outside...the physics laws never be mistaken bro....all the world complaining on schumacher that he tried to get jaques out because of the incedent at australia 94....but the fact is this incedent between jaques and micheal was like what happened in suzuka 89. But here the push of jaques was more powerful...there in suzuka was a little bit stronger....i think the response of micheal was like the response of prost both were unlucky
@slottygw2wvw842 the crowd started booing when Michael jumped up on the wall to see if the Williams might not be able to conutinue, when it appeared next lap the crowd cheered
@TommyBellingham Nobody forgets 1990 but it's not even the same as this at all. Prost did to Senna what Schumacher did in 1989, Senna still won and was DSQ'd, then in 1990 there was the pole position debate with it on the dirty side of the grid and Balestre reversing the stewards' decision to move it, and additionally Senna didn't crash Prost off the track, he went for the inside knowing what might happen and Prost turned into him, not the other way around. It wasn't as simple as Schumacher here
still shocks me that move. Remember watching it live and couldn't believe it. Suppose the Adrenalin gets in the way. Schuey; great driver but had his cheat side that tarnished his career. Hope he recovers soon from his awful accident.
It is very clear that Schumacher wanted to take out Villeneuve to win the championship just like what he did to Damon Hill. no need to argue, his championship points have been ripped off that year.
Jacques outbraked himself and would've gone off had Schumi not tried making the corner, he should've gone for a switchback move, Villenuve would've gone straight on, ended up in the gravel and lost the championship. Instead, roles were reversed.
As good as a diver Schumacher was, he had no sportsmanship what so ever. I'm glad that people like Villenueve, Hakkinen, Raikkonen, Montoya and Alonso where there to put him in his place.
It was the only way for Schumacher to win the championship cause he had serious problems with his car which has made him so slow - if not that he would win the race easily. Villeneuve had many times luck in that season and got better car.
matteo io Not exactly the same, in Melbourne he was on the racing line and already committed to the turn when Hill tried to dive into a shrinking space. A driver was not obligated to yield unless the passing car was either side by side or ahead, even Damon later admitted it was his own mistake. This one is unambiguous though, he simply swerved into Villeneuve, and he got the penalty he deserved.
Ask to Senna, Prost and Nannini during Japan GP 1989, you're a racer, you got to check for any small opening and force your way out! 1994 should not have crowned anybody, you can't claim being World Champion (Hill) by excluding your rival season or multiplying indisciplines! (Schumacher)
Not sure whether Schumacher did it on purpose to take both out but looks like he was expecting Villeneuve to be already turning and he wasn't he kept going straight and Schumacher bumped into him while turning. However, he could have let him through and try finishing 3rd at least. Villeneuve ended up finishing 3rd but who knows where Schumacher would have finished.
That pass was crazy, Gilles would have been proud, and Michael should have known better, all he had to do was get out of way and let Jacques over shoot the corner and end up in the gravel. Loved seeing Michael spinning in the gravel.
(1) Villeneuve's move wasn't aggressive? You don't understand. Why should Schumacher gives room for a move from Villeneuve who take the risk for a collision if Schumacher doesn't get him space. "Give me your money and i don't shoot you!" Perez took 2 drivers at the chicane, but they played the game of Perez. They didn't close the door and let him past. Kimi thought "not with me mate" and shot it. Who is wrong in your opinion?
@ShenkieJ If you'd be racing at such a high level, would you expect someone to completely miss a turn whule overtaking you? Schumacher went into the corner, otherwhise he would have gone of himself, and villeneuve locked up, kept going straight and barely made the corner himself. Thats why they collided.
Still wonder what would have happened if Schumacher had avoided Villeneuve. From this angle it looks like Villeneuve used Schumi's car as a braking zone. On the other hand it is still a mystery why Schumacher's set of tyres weren't as good. Did Goodyear prefer an anglo-team to win the championship?
@@bufferl He did that because it was the only way to surprise him. He braked as late as possible, he knew Schumacher would do something like this. In fact, that grand prix was more than just a battle for the championship, it was a political battle between the Ferrari team and the Williams team. Villeneuve simply couldn't relax. Every interview he had, he tried to remind people that Schumacher took out Damon 3 years earlier.
That's IN a car. The Ferrari wasn't average by any stretch of the imagination. Their bullet proof reliability appeared already in 1997 and Irvine commandingly led in Suzuka, proving the car had the pace even with him driving it. Elvis Presley was an average guitar player and an average lyrics writer, yet he is still seen as many as the "King of Rock". Something wrong there wouldn't you say?
Vileneuve did it well, the gap was 0,3 and Michael forgot to close they way inside. However, he's still one of the gratests but it was his own mastake this time.
He did the same to Hill. That's why I will never ever recognise him as rhe all time best driver ever. He had a very nasty streak about him. Unfair and very unsportsmanlike!!
All'epoca Jacques aveva una macchina superiore a Michael .Quel sorpasso avrebbe portato Michael all'esterno Probabilmente sulla Ghiaia anche senza il contatto. Un vero peccato che si concluse così A livello di spettacolo due grandi piloti
Giustissimo. Secondo me, vedendo come è andato lungo Villeneuve, Schumacher si sarebbe insabbiato comunque. Lui ci provò ma andò male. Forse la squalifica è stata un provvedimento esagerato ma tanto, perso per perso...
funny. If you watch this carefully, Villeneuve was never gonna make the apex - he locks up and goes WAY too wide and would've pushed Schumacher off the track regardless
Sad that Schuey was not able to get tips from Senna on how to do it properly. Now we are stuck with this guy as the 97 champ forever. Shit!! Michael should have just stayed on the outside and let Villeneuve fly off the track.
Schumacher deliberately tries to push Villeneuve off the track. If you can't see that then you shouldn't be commenting. Schumacher is and always will be one of the greatest, and sometimes you gotta cheat a little to be at and stay at the very top. All great champions do it. It's just a fact of life. However, Villeneuve deserved to have fortune on his side and win fairly and squarely.
I am amazed by that split second decision when Schumacher decided to crash into Villeneuve in attempt to take him out, before he even finished the passing maneuver...
UNA LEYENDA QUE BASO MUCHOS DE SUS CAMPEONATOS EN ACTITUDES ANTIDEPORTIVAS EN LA QUE TODOS LOS F1 CON MOTOR FERRARI LO DEJABAN PASAR Y OBSTRUIAN A SUS RIVALES.
Matthew Brooking Say that schumacher was an asshole on driving is correct. As Senna was. But say that it's just the car that gave him championships is completely idiot dude... He was one of the greatest with Senna and Prost.
Ils savent danser ces Gaulois. Mr. Jacques Villeneuve n'avait pas besoin d'un tel appui de Mr. Schumacher pour diligenter sa F1 vers son futur. Une F1 bien viser dans l'asphalte et très rapide. wow
no doubt that it was michaels fault, but wouldn´t they not crashed anyway even if michael didn´t do it on purpose? looks like villeneuve could not hold the inner line and MSC could not disappear in thin air...
How is he wrong? Did you not see the replay. Watch Schumachers front wheels. They turn right, straighten up when he sees Villeneuve and then turn again into the side of the Williams. Maybe you are visually impaired or something??
Even I as schumi-fanatic have to admit that this was not fair by him and that schumacher really tried to kick his opponent out to win the championship...
He did the same thing to Damon Hill a few years earlier. Everyone seems to forget his suspensions for these deliberate acts. A greasy driver plain and simple.
so rein stechen ist ja auch nicht ok... :D naja darum war danach Villeneuve nur noch ein furz im winde -> 1996 2. 1997 1. 1998 5. 1999 21. ich meine.. er war da einfach fast der schlechteste fahrer.. shame on you ... 21 wtf 2000 7. 2001 7. 2002 12. 2003 16. 2004 21. 2005 14. 2006 15. wie schlecht er eig. war... das mit 1997 war einfach nur glück und mehr nicht
Se o schumi trava mais cedo e se desvia quem ficava na gravilha era o villeneuve... Ta a vista de toda a gente..... Se o hill ganhasse o titulo de 94 era o titulo mais injusto... Porque ganhava nao devido ao toque porque nenhum dos dois foi inocente.... Mas sim devido as suspensoes que impuseram ao schumi.... Coisas mais graves ja aconteceram e nao houve suspensoes.... Mas ele era o alvo a abater... Ninguem esperava um bennetton tao forte.... Quais sistemas ilegais?? Nao havia.... E foi sempre a dominar... Os sinais tavam todos la so nao ve quem nao quer.... Desde. A sua estreia que ele deu o primeiro sinal ao que vinha.... Qual a duvida.... Era um suposto controle de tracao que ganha uma corrida?!!!! Desde quando?! NAO saber dar ou reconhecer o valor de piloto que ele foi nao e correcto..... E como escrevi. Mais atras o hill se ganhasse o campeonato de 94 ganhava devido ao schumi nao correr... Nao devido ao toque!!! Sera que ninguem ve isso?!
all the schumacher haters here.... can't read all that shit. Okay, it was not the best decision, but for me it's more Villeneuves fault because he cuts Schumachers line into the corner and he was way to fast.... look how far Villeneuve was going outside. Tires blocked too....
I know this comment is old as fuck but well said! Absolute truth right here, as Eddie Irvine said 'the only driver on the grid that would have tried that move was Jacques... he had massive balls'
Michael Schumacher is the most cheating, dishonest and scoundrel driver who has ever existed in formula 1; four of his titles were won dishonestly. Congratulations to Villeneuve who took the crook off the trail.
Hast du nichts anderes zu tun, als anständige Bürger zu belästigen? Außerdem scheint dir entgangen zu sein, dass die Äußerung (Neo)Nazi (bitte um Aufklärung) oder Holocaustleugner für mich keine Beleidigung ist. Aber davon abgesehen scheinst du recht wenig Hobbys zu haben, weshalb ich dich bitten würde deine Freizeitaktivitäten etwas zu vergrößern. P.s. Motorsport und Motorsportpolitik sind 2 verschiedene paar Schuhe.
Yes, he decided to turn into Villeneuve, BUT the move of Villeneuve was the same as Perez vs Raikkönen in Monaco. You see Villeneuve went very wide and Schumacher had to give up to avoid a collision. Because of this, it was also a dirty move of Villeneuve. He take the risk for a collision. What would you have done in Michael's situation? Let him past for the Championship without doing anything wrong?
That's a lie. The crash with Hill is much more different. Here, Schumi was already defeated ( look at 2:18 ). but in 94, he was IN FRONT of Hill. In Formula 1, there is an inofficial rule which means, that the corner belongs to the driver, who's ahead. In 94, Schumi did neither leave the racing line, nor must he let an opponent pass. No one must. But in 2:18 you see, that Villeneuve passed him before the crash. Altough Schumi was defeated, he tried to push Jacques out.
that rule was so far that from the 1991 was totally erased, from 5 discard to nothing in that season senna wasn't a lot faster than prost. prost was faster in mexico, france, hungary, imola, jerez, estoril, australia. (in the race, in qualify senna was a lot faster, sure) see the races by yourself, gordon murray isn't the truth revealed, and senna throw 2 wins in the w.c. (monaco e monza), and failed the start at the decisive japan gp. but prost lost some gears and the title.
That was, INDEED, a fair rule. Yes, Senna was faster than Prost. A LOT faster. And yes, Senna was an overall better driver than Prost. GORDON MURRAY (the great engineer responsible for the McLaren MP4/4), who worked with both Senna and Prost while the two shared the McLaren team, said that Senna was "better than Prost at the car setups and also in racing strategy, even bluffing to Prost in some occasions". I think he is better qualified than anyone to give an opinion...
I thought we were arguing about their qualities as drivers, not about their sexuality. Senna is said to be the best driver of all time by the great majority of former drivers and F1 specialists. Gordon Murray (engineer who worked at McLaren by the time Senna and Prost shared the team) said that Senna was a better driver than Prost. He said Senna was faster, better at car setups and a better racing strategist. Sorry. I can't cry about that... I can only laugh.
@74788577363 there is never anything fair in crashing deliberately into somebody, neither from Prost to Senna nor from Senna to Prost. But either way, it didn't matter in both cases. To become the 1990 world champion, Prost would have needed to win both Suzuka and Adelaide, but in Adelaide he only finished third. To become the 1989 world champion, Senna would have needed to win both Suzuka and Adelaide, but in Adelaide he crashed into Martin Brundle (again).
@pisomark He was a master at the "limit manouver", ok. This was just another weapon in his artillery. And what he did to Prost was exactly that: "get out of my way or we're goin' to crash". That corner had a gravel trap with the size of the Sahara... with tyres at the end of it. Not THAT dangerous. Prost was a "well-mannered, polite bully". Doin' shit behind the curtains, using the sport's politics to get what he wanted, trying to tear the team appart making up lies to the press...
@LouieGee senna was bully BEFORE that chicane at suzuka...so many times he was a master to done the to the limit manovrue, the other drivers has to choose..give up or shunt. how many shunt with other people has in this carreer senna? how many prost? don't you think that at suzuka 90 was a bit dangerous for being a revenge, did in porpouse? senna was a awesome driver , one of the best. not a fucking religion!!!
@LouieGee they have to discharge 5 result, not 4...i was wrong... it was pretty fair?? this is a ridicoulus comment sorry. do you think that prost didn't has problem during the entire season? for example at suzuka he lost a couple of gears from the very beginning of the race, otherwise he can win easyli race and championship, thanks to the wrong start of senna senna was faster than prost? right senna was an overall better driver than prost? a lot of people don't think so
@91debaser Continuing: about Senna being a "bully". Senna had his revenge... it was not the right thing to do, but I totally understand and if the same thing had happened to me I would probably do the same. But I find it amazing that you are judging Senna and forgetting Prost's utter and ridiculous lie to the press when he said he didn't hit Senna on purpose and, after that, had the chutzpah to say "do you think I would lie to the press?"
@91debaser If Senna had not been robbed they would both go to Australia with championship chances. If this happened, the race would be entirely different, since Prost would have been forced to start (he retired by his own will saying that the rain was dangerous). Senna would've raced with another "state of mind", he would've probably not made that mistake... he could've, but I don't think so. Also, Alain would've to score at least 3 points... and knowing he was a crap in the rain...
@PsilocybeBRA You are quite simply wrong, go look it up. Even if Senna had not been disqualified he still would have been behind Prost (7 points to be exact) with one race left (in which they both failed to finish). In 1989 only the 11 best scores counted, which might be where your discarding one result rubbish might be coming from. Might want to check your facts before you start slagging people off.
@74788577363 WRONG. The title was not taken from Senna in 89, the race win was. If Senna had kept the win he would have been 7 points behind Prost needIing to win in Adelaide with a Prost DNF. Both drivers DNF so Prost would still have been champion. Senna (2010) was unfair to Prost about this. Senna was a great driver, but a bully on track, Prost had enough of his antics (Estoril 88, Imola 89) and did not yield. What Senna did in 1990 was despicable, he could have killed them both very easily.
@TommyBellingham There is a difference. Prost did it to Senna the year before. Senna went on to win the race & keep his title chances alive only to disqualified by Balestre. 1990 Senna got pole & once again Balestre screwed him by putting pole on the dirty side of the track. To top it all off EVERY other driver thought the reason for Senna's disqualification was garbage. Watch the clip of the drivers meeting before Japan 1990.
for every flamer here flaming about the two greatest driver in history of f1 senna and schumacher, you can flame and troll as long as you want, call them cheater or whatever crazy shit you talking about, it will not change the fact that they were the most successful driver ever and they always will be the best driver cry as long as you want these two guys made f1 dont forget that, they will always be the best drivers in history, they are untochable what ever you say it doesnt matter
@shazmeister2005 Its blattand, everyone can see that MS Saw JV coming, there ale two distingt turn in points the first were he see the pass and thinks of giving some room, then the aggresive second turn in wich is deliberate too take out JV as he knew his pace wanst good enought to keep both Williams behind him, and lets not foget about the MacLarens wich wernt the far back either.
Im not a Schumacher fan, i think it was hard that he got all his points removed. Whether the turn in was done in cold blood or not we will never know, but we CAN say the following. JV came from a long way back and was on the grass. That probably caught MS off guard, I doubt he will have been expecting a move from JV, he reacted by turning to shut the door but was too late and JV was going to fast. IMO JV was going so fast there would have been a collision anyway even if MS held his line.
please be serious c'mon, i am italian but but when one thing is evident i cannot lie to myself .. they showed you in the replay, he steered the first time for the turn, it is so evident he stopped steering because he saw him, but as soon as he realized, he steered the second time to hit him like he did with Hill in Australia... That's why even if he is probably the best driver ever he is not the most loved and admired.. We all need to be honest and admit that..
not quite as bad though. Plus Checo was coming from so far behind to make that move stick today, would of done well to avoid kimi had kimi even given him space to take the inside line. Perez was just a little too agressive in that chicane today, although he probably deserved the place vs alonso, who realised he couldnt defend and cut the corner
@LouieGee yeah right, can you tell me please what "politics" prost, aside that suzuka incident, has ever done. NO YOU CAN'T...only commoin sense...prost has proven to be bloody faster than watson, arnoux, cheever, lauda, rosberg, johannson, mansell, alesi, hill. (teammates). and the only problem for senna with same car. polite bully??? you're a ridicolous senna taleban fanboy.
@74788577363 No, that's not even true. Senna got fucked over in the race by the race directors putting pole position on the slippery side of the track (off of the race line). Senna wasn't going to take that sitting down, so he was going to take the line into the corner whether or not Prost let him. Prost didn't let him, and the rest is history. Prost's fault entirely.
@zaurtrien Yeah, he is cheater the same level with Senna and Prost. Alonso and Hamilton are becoming something like them nowadays... They are race drivers, racing to win as Senna would say. But they're among the greatest (not the greatest cheaters) racers. Not like Hill or Villeneuve. They were just the shadows of their fathers' talent.
i still think this was not schumachers fault. I can see clearly that villeneuve just shoots straight . And thats not because michael hit him. Jaques breaked too late while michael was turning into the corner. Villeneuve went straight on while schumacher went right into the turn. Thats why they collided. he did not do it on purpose. Clearly visable
