This is meant to be a direct add on to part one, which I've placed a card in the video for. I highly recommend watching that first as it will add important context. Thank you to all who took the time to check out the video!!!
I think "Mara", whoever she is, helped Lotus guide three Tenno souls into those frames, us being one of them. They all have a transference stream, so what if this Tenno's job for the Lotus is to place those Tau-lotus flowers as a sort of marker for Lotus to know where to direct our transference stream. If she is attempting to wake the Tenno, she wont do it without finding frames for them first. So "Mara"s" job could be to find warframes and inform the Lotus so she can put Tenno in them.
Also, I think our Zariman is the original, with the Orokin having retrieved the conceptually embodied copy. I say that because This is the ship that had Hombask sabotage the biomes, and this ship has plenty of evidence of what went down during the void jump. Whereas the one the Orokin found was in pristine condition. That shouldn't be possible if it was the original the Orokin found.
There's a point here that you may or may no have missed.... It's mentioned over and over of sacrifice. What if we're literally misinterpreting it to apply to a multitude of things when it's always meant one thing.... In the same way Kane of Command and Conquer has seemingly been plotting to use Scrin-tech to "leave" the mortal plane, What if Ballas' ultimate goal was to claim Tau for himself after the death of Margulus? It takes a sacrifice to traverse the void.... The "colonists" were never intended to live at all. Tuvul says so directly, "you were to die for us" They were to be the means for the Zaramin to traverse and lay the work for teraformation, something the Orokin had already mastered on Venus. In fact having so many different cephalons means the Zaramin could have been largely autonomous in teraformation and possibly the original project before the Sentients.... The Sentients lose all investment in a future, in generations of offspring, but what sacrifice was made to get them to Tau in the first place, or did they go the long way? And Ballas, himself, was using Narmer as a sacrifice to traverse to Tau, alone.
during part one i had an idea when you mentioned the jade light my first thought was "thats the next warframes name "then that thought changed it became "did al the tenno betray the orokin or did some side with them"
Lotus being voiced by Rebecca while being so mysterious and powerful is so meta. Both Rebecca and Lotus always been there since the beginning of the game and they will be there until the end
The other frames not being present in the new intro seems more like eternalism in action. A choice of which warframe was successfully awakened. The tenno did choose Excalibur. We did choose Mag. We did choose Volt. They all escaped, and they each did not.
Yeah a few days ago a watched another lore video and they said something that made the Ballas getting so unstable at the end of the New War finally make sense to. Ballas can control everything except us and he loses control of others just because we are around. He controlled his own citizens, but when they resisted, he made sure he was back in control again by making them into cephalons. There were others equally as powerful as him. So he had to get rid of them. He turned people into puppets for him to control, by turning them into Warframes. They understandably got angry and out of his control so he tried torturing them, making them fear him until he has control over them again. And when that didn't work, he wanted to get rid of them. He couldn't control the Tenno either so he wanted to get rid of them too. But Margulis said no, then he realized that he can control the Tenno through Margulis. And the Tenno can control the Warframes while he couldn't. But Margulis didn't want us to be used as weapons. We controlled the Warframes through empathy and compassion which he didn't understand. And Margulis loved us and protected us through that same empathy and compassion. Ballas couldn't control Margulis, so he gave her an ultimatum. But she chose death rather than let him control us. He needed a new way to stay in control of us so he created the Lotus. But after being in touch with us for so long, he also lost control of her. So he thought that returning her to her Natah form could put him back in control. But that didn't work. So he tried to control Erra instead. Which worked for a brief moment until it didn't work anymore, so he decided to get rid of her and us at the same time. But guess what? He can't get rid of us. We showed back up. And with our presence, people get freed from his control. He knew that as long as we are around, he can't remain in control. So he wants to destroy everything and go to system without us and where only machines live which he can reprogram as he pleases. But he failed because his own lack of understanding of human emotions dug his grave. And he wants to be in control of everything while he meets his demise not being able to control himself.
@@thimovijfschaft3271, "we controlled Warframes through empathy and compassion". right... into mass murder/bloodbath/carnage/extermination/genocide/massacre/slaughter... truly compassionate...and, of course, complete empathy. Are you high? Almost nothing is like you interpret the story. Is what you wish, rather than what you experienced. Tenno are the villain here. Margulis tried to play Ballas and the Tenno. She died because of that. Ballas created Warframes to win the war and manipulated Natah to hide the Tenno and not to kill them. When Sentients came he give us Paracesis to help us stop them.. He is definitely not the bad guy...but The Tenno...
@@UmbraFulguryeah there is a mission where she gives a choice to run away and not save the ship and let everyone on it get killed by the grenier that was kinda evil move by louts but I did save them and she said you save them but stopping captain vor was important more then innocent lives
It creates a paradox. Paradoxes are incompatible with our Universe, so a time loop will destroy the time-space continuum...and everything else. But from a different reality, a different Universe, it could be. Include that in Eternalism via Block Universe. Edit: once you are there already, add to the mixture the absence of time, since is only abbreviated calculation artifice used in mathematical equation only and it doesn't exist in reality.
Zor’s triade of how the Void salutes his “ascension” again reminds me how the void digs deep into whoever it encounters, fueling passions, almost liberating what has been fettered by the the individual’s superego. The Void isn’t a vast emptiness, it is an unbounded wellspring.
My feeling re: the Zariman was that it was sent before the Sentients were created as a hubristic, bombastic attempt to colonize Tau "according to principles." That failed, as we all know, and the Operator/Drifter made their choice. The Zariman that returned early is the Operator's, in the timeline where all of the children survived and the Operator escaped the ship with them. That, eventually was either dismantled by the Orokin or reclaimed by the Void (or some manner of both). Much, much later, another Zariman returned, this one being the Drifter's; the Zariman where only they survived. This is the Zariman we explore post-New War, and it both is and isn't the Operator's ship... but it is definitely the Drifter's. Good video as always! I have more thoughts but it is late and I cannot organize them atm lol
Small post-script: The Ember Prime flavor text also mentions the Zariman as a military vessel, which it very much is not. It's safe to say that some details DE may have had to necessarily retcon due to differing visions and scope...
@@JenFalle From what I understand, the military ship thing was in-universe a cover up to hide the fact the Orokin tossed children into the void knowing it'd piss people off
What if the Tenno girl in the awakening is the "now calmed" Doppelganger from the end of time returning to the start the beginning? She even brings lotus flowers (which was crushed at the end of the Whispers quest). We end as we began.
Who is she? If you watch the Grineer, they act like she isn't there. They have all the time in the world to shoot her, and they don't. When she turns into mist, they're already walking past her and don't even flinch at her disappearance. From this, I conclude she really isn't there, at least not physically. I think it's a representation of you waking up, searching out, and connecting to your warframe.
Now if I remember correctly, DE didn't know what was in the opening cinematic until after they watched it, or at least they didn't know the details. I remember a conversation about mag specifically where she shot the bullets back at everyone and they asked "Oh can mag actually do that?" and someone from DE said "She can now." I personally am against the idea of a singular heroic tenno, I wholly embrace the eternalistic theory that every tenno has gone through all the quests canonically, while also somehow existing in the same universe. Also we know that tenno had "schools" where they learnt techniques and abilities to fight with their powers. Bear with me here, but there was another warframe trailer that showed a tenno that looked similar to mara using a nova warframe, it was destroyed and she freaked out and blasted the grineer with Unairu's last stand(which was made a thing afterwards.) before lunging forwards, having had a terrible nightmare into the arms of who I assume is margulis. The way I feel this wraps up is that the tenno where originally being trained as weapons and warriors that could kill the sentients using their own powers, but their tauma made them unpredictable and unable to adequately perform, one of the reasons the orokin wanted to have them destroyed. But margulis eventually discovered transference therapy which seemed to help a lot. Then the rhino thing happened and the orokin discovered "hey, these two weapons we are having trouble with go great together." I think, the only way to actually wake a tenno up may be through their last bonded warframe, we know tenno can get stuck inside warframes through harrows quest so I don't think that contradicts with anything, the warframe essentially acting like their own body and a huge vulnerability itself that can be exploited, possibly through ascaris, possibly through being destroyed. The Lotus does say "I won't lose another tenno" so there is a clear vulnerability in that state. Maybe if our warframe was destroyed we would be stuck in the dream forever, unable to be woken up, the medium that the lotus uses to wake tenno, the warframe, gone. We know in the past though that tenno could "earn primes" which are stronger and different than base warframes so it's likely they had multiple others they could earn, but I think they were so hard to earn that many tenno simply stuck with a favourite if they could. I assume the originals, the "umbra" (that I will call them at least.) are gone. The warframes we make are homunculi, copies of the originals made in the fancy 3d printers that we have on our ship that can even create infested weaponry. The only reason we managed to create umbra in my opinion was that he had just died, had an inconceivable amount of will and anger, and most importantly Ordis was supercharged, he wasn't running any unnecessary precepts. I expect running Soul.exe takes up a lot of RAM. The only reason I can think of that the other warframes aren't needed are that they're broken. I think that transference bolt that struck them was either a single tenno looking for one of it's working warframes, like a void relic being cracked, the other two options became unfeasible, They became and always have been non functional as the one functional warframe was selected. I do think it's impossible for tenno to safely to use transference on a human, the lotus did say that the warframes could withstand out power, I can only assume a regular human will have their heads explode if we the tenno try that on them. As for the zariman, I have thought about that. The thing I want to poise is that the first ship that returned may have been the copy, after all people think the drifter was the original and he was stuck in duviri, which you can only access through the 2nd, decrepit zariman. The man in the wall may have tried to "welch" on the deal by saving everyone else, but not the drifter(s). I think the deal between hunhow and ballas is important and I think it went like this: Ballas commissioned hunhow to create a sentient, and gave him the resources he would need to do so since he was sterile, possibly Kuva, wanting a daughter hunhow accepted and created the lotus to ballas' specifications. Creating a margulis lookalike that will influence the tenno to kill the orokin, then the lotus to kill the tenno. I think Hunhow used this opportunity to create Erra as well. I don't think either side expected her to join with the tenno permanently though, ballas despised the tenno because they took margulis away from him, and the lotus destroyed erra, which we know is a real memory. I think ballas controlled and used the lotus to kill erra to punish hunhow for creating him or take a variable out, but was unable to do so to make her kill the tenno, underestimating how much sentients love their children. There is still the mystery of who "mother" is though, and if she's really dead. (I doubt she is.)
That was my thought. Perhaps it's the first thing they do after escaping Duviri, since we never actually see that moment. We only see them after they (Somehow) collected the body of Lotus.
I think the woman in the intro is supposed to be a stand-in for all tenno. Lotus wakes them, says "find your dream" and their transference projections land near wherever their last "dream" had ended. Since it is implied that we are the only warframe that arose from that specific tower, all the other tenno we play with are supposed to be assumed to have awoken elsewhere.
Yeah, the rest had to have def awoken elsewhere. It’d be great to think that after a successful defense mission (the ones where you’re guarding what could be a tenno in stasis), that tenno would wake and go search out a lost warframe nearby. One more new player! Honestly, how badass of a new player experience would that be. The trailer shows a trio of frames kicking ass around a stasis pod (either the classic ones or the Orokin transference pod). Taking place on a variety of tile sets. Once done, the camera shifts to your pov, you see them gaze at you through the view port as they load you onto the Liset drop ship, and before they depart the game reveals the gamer tags of the trio that rescued you. After that, the cinematic shows your pod being launched onto an unknown area of Earth, splicing seamlessly into the current new player footage until you find your frames. The CGI would have to be wire frame based, allowing any frame to perform the movements shown in the cinematic. Unless it’s a new mission type that limits you to three players, and three select frames to choose from, which would allow powers to be shown. The missions would have to have high reward drops to encourage current players to participate and “welcome” in new players. Maybe different tier difficulty to allow players at any level the chance at rewards appropriate for their level.
To add to the discussion referring to the "original Zariman" as read from the Ember prime codex, I believe that Zariman is also referred to as a military vessel and not a colony ship, and from memory the prime frames pre date the tenno, but where deemed failures because they couldn't be controlled and where essentially feral beasts like in the Rhino prime codex and it wasn't until the Zariman's void jump incident and subsequently the tenno's arrival that the primes could be controled like in the opening flashback to the old war in the new war quest. I believe the non-primes came after the new war but before the betrayal of the tenno, or perhaps after or the primes where only ever kept on lua, as we have seen non primes outside of orokin cities but never primes, take both Gauss and Grendel's Leverian entries, specifically Grendel's where Drusis has one of Gauss' air foils on display, in sands of Inaros we see a specter of Inaros and the statues are of a non prime Inaros, granted Inaros prime wasnt even a thought then id wager (even though Baro recognises both Inaros and Inaros prime separately as if 2 different entities, tho this could be due to all his adventures through abandoned orokin towers in the void and knowledge he found there), all the rail specters are non primes, it seems to me that the common person back then only ever saw the non primes which where lesser than primes, but possibly co-existed at the same timeframe, just never in the same place, it does fit that the orokin elite on lua would keep the prime vanguard on lua rather than send them out into the system and rather leave that for the lesser frames. And as to the foundry question, it has made biological matter before, not just frames both the lesser and prime variants, but all the infested weapons and even the pherliac pods, even bait from the plains of eidolon since those where originally crafted and they seem like they might have some sort of biological component. So from it seems reasonable that we can craft warframes, hell maybe its not entirely done by the foundry but in tandem with the helminth since it does manage all the biological needs of the warframes for the tenno as it itself states
I always thought the Tenno and Warframe relationship was a meta commentary on the relationship between the Avatars in games in their user. The avatar grants the user full control and the user has the responsibility to get the avatar to their destination.
The Lotus we know is likely a void entity, who is in opposition of the man in the wall, that is mimicing nata who was in turn mimicing margulas. They body of nata but the personality of margulas. The switch likely came between the death of the orokin lords and the hiding of lua, being the whole reason the tenno are not then killed. It is what comes to mind for her having void powers.
This is how I see the pre-Old War timeline: 1) The Orokin realize that the Origin System is getting used up fast (with Earth already being turned barren). 2) The Tau terraformation plan is formed - concerns about creating adaptive, self-replicating robot are quelled by designing them with the void-flaw. How exactly does the flaw not burn them out in the first trip to Tau, I don't know, but it is obvious that the flaw is about preventing them from returning to Origin. The robots work on Tau until in the process of adaptation and replication they evolve into sentience. 3) The Orokin eventually decide that it is time to send someone to check on the progress of the machines. They do not inform the "colonists" of the robots, because from the Orokin perspective, the humans don't need to know. If the robots obediently continued their work - good, the colonists will report it back. If the robots turned hostile, the colonists will send a memo back as a distress call of some kind. 4) The Zariman disappears into the Void. It is suggested that there was intentional sabotage. Possibly someone among the Orokin decided to comandeer the colonist ship for a void-related experiment, but that is just speculation on my part. 5) The Zariman re-emerges from the void for the first time. The children are collected, and delivered to the Orokin. The Zariman sinks back into the void for reasons unknown. 6) The Margulis events take place. In preparation to her own arrest, Margulis puts the Tenno in the sleeper pods. She is then executed. The Tenno are left in the pods, as the Orokin do not know exactly what to do with them. Perhaps attempts to kill some of the Tenno are made, but are met with failure ("You cannot kill a devil, but you can send it back to hell"). Alternatively, the Orokin saw the benefits of the transferece technology and are willing to continue studying the Tenno to see what else can be invented. 7) The Sentients send an armada through the Void to attack the Orokin Empire. The trip leaves them unable to replicate any more (only the sentients that returned to Origin - those that remained in Tau are likely still able to replicate to present day). The Old War begins.
I agree with most everything you state here, except one facet. The Orokin wouldn’t have had anything to do with the Tenno after Margulis initiated the Second Dream because it was then that she void jumped the Moon into the void for hiding. Perhaps it was this jump that damaged the moon and killed all the occupants. Maybe it was even this devastating act that led to her charges and execution. Story has been vague enough on that point so far that it’s possible.
I mean, we have quite a lot of data on planets within our own galaxy and using mathematics and science we can know if a planet will most likely require colonization/terraforming/any other things. we got telescopes capable of looking (in a blurry/low detail way) at planets far, far away and using the colors of their surfaces and able to predict what type of minerals and gasses reside in them. Now imagine all that using orokin technology and the void, they would be able to identify if a planet needed anything from a whole galaxy away
@@TheDsIEGE Could it been that the sentients where there already? terraforming the land for a few years and this was going to be the first colony with the sentient rebellion happening later on?
@@TheDsIEGE I think it is habitable, but the orokin needed a rail to get there. I think the zariman was to act like or had the materials to build a rail that they could send their armies through and conquer the tau system, sentients or not.
I see the Mara girl as another Tenno, just as we play missions with other Tenno. To me there are numerous Tenno awakened - not as many as there are players, but maybe the six when we meet Erra, or maybe a dozen or so? The Lotus awoke us all and guided us in the beginning, but its only YOU, the player that the main story is happening to. All the other Tenno are just soldiers doing missions, helping out when you play with them. It's just you who are the special one, that ended the New War, that caught the attention of The Indifference. Mara is just another Tenno, but given a mission to awaken us, kill some Grineer to fully awaken our abilities and to defend the frame(s) from Grineer interference. Mara disappears back to her own ship, mission complete, leaving us to begin our journey - a journey initially like the other Tenno, but one that would become grander than the others', unbeknownst to anyone, inc Lotus.
Theory I saw about the infested litches being the 1999 proto-frames slowly losing themselves to the infestation wit hthe choice being to either put them out of their misery, or help them claw back something of themselves.
@@TheDsIEGE Thematically it fits the tennos' vibe of empathy and humanity in some of the msot inhumane experiances this side of 40k and or retail. Do you do what Arthur made clear that he would want ot be put out of his misery, or do you try helping them claw back something of who they were?
some crazy theories here About the girl at the beginning: I believe she is a Tenno, yes. From the beginning she was looking for somewhere with Warframes that still functional (Since in order for us to use one, we have to create them, she was trying to find some that still worked, that were already built) and she finds the tower and from there prepares to do a forced connection or something similar so that our or another tenno could access the Warframe. the reason the Griners don't see her? simple, same skill that we have as an operator. in her case, she already is, or even passed our state of power control being a Tenno who was outside the moon and survived there for a while, and due to her state, perhaps even without a warframe (could have lost it to the STAKER or shot down by the grinner who were clearly patrolling after something there, and may even have been after her originally) judging by the state she doesn't have a Helmit to do repairs on her warframe if she is a Tenno. Why would she be doing this? I don't know, maybe she discovered something, a way to bring one or more tennos back, maybe Lotus herself got in touch with her. Now, as for ProtoFrames. I've seen a lot of comments about ~ with Alberth in the past, was he the one who created the warframes then? and not Ballas? I think there may actually be two answers to this. First. the Paradox where it all started because he went back in time. Taking into account that the timeline he is in is the same as ours, he took knowledge and tools that didn't exist at that time, and from what we know he wasn't ashamed to use everything he had. leading the advancement of genetic technology to unconsciously create the Orikins. making Ballas someone who took advantage of something "forgotten" from the past. appearing to have created the Warframes. (again creating a semi-paradox, where he uses a forgotten technology brought by Alberth, which Alberth himself believes to be authored by Ballas, but in reality it was always his as he went back in time "creating" it). Second answer and the shortest. It's a different timeline, which he was able to access using the laws (or the lack of it) of void, which makes it clear that what Loid did by breaking the machine was simply cutting the connection he had between the two lines of time eventually trapping Alberth and making it impossible for anything to go there. What about Protoframes? Could they be the Original Warframes? I don't believe they are. I believe that Alberth started doing his field tests on infected people, injecting Arthur with the virus that created Excalibur. He injected Aoi with what created Mag, testing how much the individual engineering of each virus would be able to overwrite the host, all while testing the gray virus on samples taken from test subjects, which eventually created those giants in his laboratory. and This is where our Tenno comes in, being in a completely Awake state, able to use the giant "samples" from the laboratory as conduits to access the mind of the person they originally belonged to. probably the mission we will do when 1999 arrives will be something like improving the transference that our tenno has, and then being able to get down to where in time we want to enter the minds of the "protos". The question I want to see is: would our Tenno be the passenger allowing us to watch what they are doing (I'm speaking in a metaphorical way like, we control obviously, but for our character we are just watching) or will have a fight to see who will be in control? Arthur and the troupe trying to stay themselves and our Tenno trying to control them (giving them abilities they didn't know they had as Warframes)
The tau terraforming is an interesting part to reflect on. I believe that probs/telescopes would have been able to peer at the system and see what lies on each planets surface and those barren required terraforming. Also the orokin in their lush porcelain and gold towers would probably want construction efforts to make an even grander palace to live in once its ready to receive them so I’ve always though of the sentients as construction works/part time terraformers if that was required. I also get that the grineer were originally the builders as well which would puzzle me as to why they were never sent instead of the colonists or sentients… clones seem much more expendable.. maybe gene rot was a factor?
To the "about these warframes" part of the video, I believe it to be a similar continuity similar to how the Operator and Drifter are the one and the same but yet so different. Many tenno, yet from the same singular point off shooting into many more converging timelines intersecting as the quills say it has been. It is likely the other two warframes were already gone by the time we awake, on their own mission if not failed to escape the grineer at the beginning. Maybe a sign that multiple tenno can awake in spots where warframes have remained since their disappearance?
I want to add something, in limbo theorum its said that limbo died due to an error in calculation during a time travel experiment, and its the point in the quest that its a mistery as to how he's back. My theory is that limbo manipulates more than time and space, he became more, like entrati, a multi-existance. I started this because we know limbo is a crazy mathematician, and the thing entrati was looking for was an equation for time travel throught the void. It could be possible limbo didnt die, he rather became an entity outside reality and capable of manifesting everytime, anywhere and in any diffenrent reality for any given purpose. All the limbo's we see on theorum arent just 1 limbo, but all the concurrent limbo's replaying his own history that is constantly branching from the original. He is always present and always dead. He is eternal.
Oh my god the woman in the cinematic has somatics on her face. I haven't finished the video yet but thanks DSiege these might be my favorite yet ❤ Edit: Literally seconds later you mentioned it lmao
Considering the heavy eastern philosophical themes and the character's apparent Indian heritage, Mara may be in reference to the goddess better known as Mrityu Devi.
in regards to the timeline of the zariman and the sentients, i think the orokin sent the zariman to tau after they sent the sentients but before they turned on them. they sent the zariman expecting it to arrive at an already terraformed tau, not knowing that the sentients would then turn around and start a war.
I just remember Vor being very noisy and annoying. So I parted him some bullets. I would like to if you mind, think that some other Tenno woke up first and were able to find out they were human earlier. This makes sense as the Lotus did tell new players that we can invite Tenno with more experience to join a mission. This also explains the bots. In the new Vor cinematic, although very powerful and is able to work properly even after being abandoned after centuries, was able to be destroyed after sustaining enough firepower from Vor(bastard has the relic) and his underlings. Hence making the girl operating the Warframe reappear on the battlefield. Thus the scene of her evading and escaping from Vor and his army. Knowing how the Lotus has other agents, lots of them, and contacts help gathering. They must have sent the Tenno to help find and secure an Warframe burial ground and prevent Vor getting his hands on a just awoken Tenno. Being a soldier, he probably knew that a Tenno who has just awoken is at their most vulnerable, the reason he would want to install the thingy on an awoken Warframe is cause well you cannot really communicate with a tin can without a mind. The othet suits might just as well stay there until the Tenno they share a link with wakes up again. We were able to wake up at the worst possible moment so yeah. Party time. The girl dissapearing is in my opinion her using powers to conceal herself and hope for the best. Not sure about the serious face though. Maybe she remembered she might get chewed out by her cephalon cause she failed? Anyway my reason for her choosing to conceal herself at the end might be because she was out of energy before? Gotta be using them beams to shoot Grineer when needed. Not played warframe in a long time but pretty sure concealment can't be used for long. Or she just zapped back to her ship, hurray！
20:00 Could it be that the ship that returned during the Orokin reign was just a copy containing the children the Operator saved as a part of the deal? And the real one reemerged only after the New War? I believe the latter one is original, because there is no mention of the damage that was supposed to occur, nor of the Holdfasts in the Ember codex entries.
im pretty sure i heard some dialogue in archon hunts and/or narmer missions that hint to the sentience having a bunch of kingdoms and wars, before a portion of them under hunhow left for the origin system as a preemptive strike witch cost them the ability to reproduce. so if that's true then that would mean the zariman probably happened after the sentient's were sent and before they returned.
So there is something I feel relevant to bring up. Not ALL of the Tenno children were lost to the void, specifically it's confirmed that there is 1 Tenno who escaped. That Tenno is revealed in the Leverian, Voruna's operator was removed from Lua before it disappeared. So it's entirely possible that Lotus discovered this surviving Tenno somewhere else, and enlisted her aid to free us. I have to ask a question though regarding the Zariman, could it be that Ballas intentionally sabotaged the ship? Because either they sent colonists to a system without confirming it could work, or they had already sent the 'machines' to begin preparing the system, meaning they already knew how to reach said system.
i think this theory has already been discussed before, but i cant shake the feeling that the zariman was never meant to be a colony transport ship - rather being a void experiment with the whole Tau journey being a facade to give the test subjects, aka the colonists, false hope that their suffering will eventually lead to a brand new universe of opportunities for humanity. some of tuvul's logs on the ship sort of imply that the orokin have no trouble with sabotaging the plan as a punishment for their doubt and disobedience. if the orokin could so easily destroy an entire colony because it hurt their ego, it kind of implies that the colonists were disposable from the beginning. that, paired with albrecht's history of sending things into the void to see what comes back, makes me believe that the zariman was never destined to reach tau at all. it's possible that they *wanted* the void to corrupt the ship. depending on when the zariman was launched, and when the sentients betrayed the orokin, the Seven might've believed that sending thousands of humans into the void may result in a ship full of void-attuned super-humans that could take on the sentients. that plan would technically work out, as the true result was a group of children with god like powers and the ability to crush entire armies by themselves
as for the zariman's untouched appearance upon its return to the orokin, it's most likely that the void rebirthed it, much like how it rebirthed the cavia, the holdfasts, the tenno themselves, and pretty much everything else the void has come into contact with. this might even suggest that the original forms of all of these reborn things are lost to the void, with the copy returning to the universe, leaving the original to rot in a state of limbo forever
I don't exactly know anymore where i've got this "information", if It was and idea of mine from something i read in the game or online but: The Zaryman true purpose was not to colonize Tau, but it was in fact an "offering" to the Void (like Tagfer & co.) hoping that something powerful would eventualy come back. And It makes sense in a way, sicne i ever found strange that the Orokins would use a big spaceship full of people and families for the very first and never experimented before big dangerous jump to Tau. Ok the Orokin are cold and cynic, but they are somewhat smart and calculative too.
@TheDsIEGE I feel like there is still some interesting Stuff that Ballas himself almost introducing his latest Prime frames in every old and new Prime trailer the way he says about them and everything but also I noticed the newest Prime trailer for Protea Parvos was also heard with him pretty interesting stuff you ask me I want you to listen and make a video about it idk just want hear what you have to say about all the Prime trailers. Yes keep coming with the videos I love them!
Im curious as to why Captain Vor is an actual threat to the tenno in the awakening, since even though we aren't made aware yet, the tenno can simply transfer into a different frame and vor couldnt do anything about it.
I hope we get more information about whats going on in each faction after the rise and fall of narner like how is parvos reacting to how the griner queen reacts to the aftermath and the fate of alad v hes i dout hes dead he escaped death countess times i haven't played warframe in a while so we might of had answers to the question
My thoughts have always been the primes are the originals and the regular warframes are mass-produced models. Also with how unethical and messed up we find out Orokin society was I would take bets that their were not as many "volunteers" as Ballas implies.
Still in the middle of the video, so forgive me if you address this: What if Mara is us after we beat Wally? We've already got time travel and paradoxes. It wouldn't be much of a stretch to think we'd wake ourselves to make sure we're there to stop him later
Rather ingeniously, introducing the notion of "Eternalism" provided DE an out for the sundry plot inconsistencies that invariably arose out of a slowly (decade) evolving narrative, beginning with their two versions of the Awakening for it addresses the fundamental paradox of the uniqueness of a single player's game experience and the collective behavior of being an MMO game. In this way, the hooded young woman in Awakening Redux is a placeholder for each player separately and every player collectively. Likewise, the three warframes that can be activated by the player in the Awakening represents in a simple, manageable way the infinite variety of choices each player can make individually and the community makes cumulatively.
It's the greatest writing crutch ever made, and for that... I actually have to respect them. I hate time travel in stories because it's typically lazy but they went so far above that I can't get mad and have come to appreciate the void as my favorite enemy faction in any game, if it even is an enemy in the first place, lol
Mara tenno lives in a different universe-reality from our tenno. Also, If a warframe isn't an umbra variant, its not the original. Umbra excalibur is another version of the og excalibur, so there are two original versions of excalibur, the one who was created first, and the one who was created by ballas in the dax/orokin era zariman 10-0 was sent after the tau event while it was a different reality from it. even if the timeline is the same, tau was a failed project. So some orokin like Tuvul tried to experiment further.
Regarding the Zariman, I think you are overthinking it a bit too much. The Sentients were designed before the Zariman made the journey and prepared the Tau (Ceti) system. However around the time the Zariman mis-jumped the Sentients rebelled. Eternalism comes into play in so far that in one or rather many timelines the Zariman emerged some time later. With only the children having survived and having some strange powers. But in another timeline the Zariman never left and got stuck inside the void, with a little pocket dimension created by partially by the Zarimans own terraforming system as well as the awakened void powers of the Drifter.
Maybe mara is the man in the wall? Dont know why they would wake us up, boredem maybe, but the lotuses that are put at the base of the frames looks a lot like the one they have and the end of whispers
I think the zariman we can go to is the one frome the drifters reality as we can see it in duviri two. Maybe wally's deal (which the dirfter didn't take) condensed all variants of the zariman and the tenno into two. The intact zariman with the void touched children and the lost zariman where the drifter manifested duviri in the void. I think the zariman exident happened after the sentients were created during their time in the tau system. The way I understood the whole sentient thing is they were sent to tau and did their work thiere. While they terraformed the system they reached sentients and all. I think the orokin or at least Ballas were pretty sure this would happen but maybe didn't know when it exactly it will happen. So they sent the zariman anyway. What I don't get is why they weren't doing multiple jumps.. why they decided to do just one big jump. And also I think the first dream of the tenno is the one Margulis put them in and at this state they still knew who and what they are. Then the warframe were created and deemed a failure until they discovered the stuff from the Rhino codex entry. I think by this time transference was already a thing (remember the halloween story from Grandma? The blue kuva is a form of transference I think). The orokin discovered they could use the tenno to control the frames and use the frames to utilize the tennos' void powers. They fought in the old war and I think this time around the tenno still new who they were (even if they don't remember the deal with wally). I'm not sure when Margulis got killed. Anyway... The Lotus put the tenno into the second dream on Lua and from this point foward they no longer know that they control warframes and not are warframes. The girl in the awakening I'm pretty sure is a tenno just not a player tenno. Remember the tenno/warframe Vor trys to capture (and later the queens try to get their hands on too) is you (the player). We know other tenno awakened before us so for me it's not so far fetched that some tenno also awakend from the second dream.. maybe was awoken by the Lotus herself
There's also something that really twists my mind when thinking about it and would like to hear your opinion on it Siege, when we say that "we shouldn't be able to walk outside the cryopods untill the war within" didn't Teshian mention in our "training" that "The Tenno used to dash between dimensions" something like that when learning the void sling, shouldn't that mean that all Tenno used to have this kind of power (to walk outside), just still not that proficient in controling it? It would make more sense to me that we are simply remembering how to use the void powers outside a Warframe (sense we are eve dwelling with memories) than to be so gifted that we learn new ways to use the void powers on the fly (and with skill not eaten by the Maw not eve once), wha t do you think?? 🤔🤔
What if the person that appears in the awakening is actually the Drifter? At the end of Duviri Paradox the Drifter has the choice to go to the origin system to help the tenno, we might think he arrived at the time of New War but what if he came back a little further, to wake up the Tenno, as duviri is into the void time travel wouldnt seem so absurd, the Tenno helped the Drifter escape Duviri and the Drifter woke up the Tenno, completing the paradox of their existence.
I think there is someting between the first dream and the second dream the lotus put the tennno, where mayby some tenno didnt go into the second dream and lived in the world. one of those tenno mayby the drifter that did the first awakening that started all others. the lotus says i hid them away in the second dream but margulis put the tenno in the first dream. that leads me to believe the tenno were awake during the old war so we had our powers sort of under control at that point in time. the warframes in the awakening are a bit wierd in my opinion because how did no one find and or take them before the awakening. it is not just the other 2. the theorie of Eternalism does make up for some of it but no all the time line of the sentience en the zariman i agree with @akhannar9368 comment.
19:57 it possible that this one is the original zarmon, and the one the orokin found is the copy. Also for the possibility of both being the same one, there is a possibility of an unreliable narrator, and on the condition of zarmon when found by the orokin is possibly not true. Also I'm curious about what happened to the zarmon found by the orokin, and where it is? What did the orokin do to it? Did they dismantle it or just thrown it back into the void?
This seems like a good time to point something out i noticed: I made my account in 2017 and finished Vor's prize but never played much more than that till recently. When i got around to doing the prelude to war, more specifically the Erra part, I noticed that i seemingly got the old cut scene rather than the updated one that you mentioned in a prior video. I'm wondering if the intro you experience dictates something about what version of the Erra cut scene you get? I also had the indiferance sat with the lotus's helm on till i started the first part of the prelude, in case that too is not experienced by new accounts. The big question is how intentional is this, if true? Did DE mean to create two separate, slightly differing, timelines or have the fully reconned the older ones.
3 Nariman ships, one that never left, carrying the tenno. One that subsists in duviri, carrying the we, the us, that never got saved. And one that made it back from it's travel to the void. Could there be but two? And the one half emerged from the void, be the same that's sitting in duviri. Is it possible Tau and duviri are one and the same?
Hmm.. U don't think this "Mara" chick owned a special little prisma weapon at some point? One that Baro got ahold of to sell to us? One thats technically 1 of a kind and doesn't share a name with any other group of weapons (Vandal, Wraith, Prisma etc.) except DOES have that uncanny void dipped prisma energy skin? U don't think it could be---- Mara's Detron?!!! 😆
There's a little bit of dialogue Tyl Regor speaks about that, confirmed in the war within. Apparently, Teshin was a mentor to the tenno during the old orokin days and was sympathetic with their cause, hence regor calling him a pseudo-tenno.
@@TheDsIEGEthank you is actually my first time getting a comment from a youtuberbut there's another question who is our space grandma we have hunhow has a granpa
TLDR - the old intro mission was better , the new changes were designed for an experienced audience not a new one , and ofc to show-off new gfx and portray meta-narrative , its not canon as such
Still can’t get over Vor, dude is wack lol. Imagine being dirt poor, looking up at the ultra wealthy and seeing them as god-like, and they give you a simple key to their mansion allowing you to come and go as you please. Now you prance around speaking high and mighty more so than they even would lmfao. The Janis key (at least so far) is nothing more than an Orokin void gate key, something common to them (or at least the high ranking-social standing) allowing access to their sanctuary towers in the void. He died, his alternate self made a deal, and it’s over exposure to the void has warped his egotistical mind and has given him new powers. He ain’t as special as he thinks though lol Or is he?
His appearance in the undercroft does warrant some questions regarding his larger place in the game. That being said, my god is he a pushover. Like why show up with your grand speech if typically you can't even get it all out before you're splattered on the ground?
it might be a bit unrelated but sometime ago i noticed how similar void contamination in the zariman and the infestatiion growths on infected ships are is the infestation somehow associated with the void or is it perhaps its oposite? idk just something that crossed my mind
This video, talking about The Lotus... This might not be relevant enough... but -- Has anyone noticed the Man In the Wall - his eldritch, colossus statue form with the odd head -- That he kinda mimics the Lotus? It's the head, Lotus is often seen with her eyes and top head obscured, but her nose and the rest of the face down is exposed. TMITW has something of the like going on, but his head is like something is missing and presents masculine traits (I think). And it got me thinking -- Albrecht has his doppleganger, we have our doppleganger -- Where is the Lotus' Doppleganger?
@@TheDsIEGE Oooo~! Actually... I wonder if... ... Nah, it can't be. But, what if... Our MITW isn't complete? What if his Finger wasn't the only thing taken? What if... the Lotus is instrumental to allowing TMITW to becoming whole again?
The Zariman as a whole is certainly an enigma, from its departure to its return. If one is to read events, the Zariman returned during the New World given us venturing to it to meet up with our other half. Plus it seemed like Lotus discussing the return of the ship and its song shortly after we return her to her chamber at the end of the New War and leading into the Angels quest, suggesting almost as soon as the war was over, it was back to business for us, the Queen's Kuva guard and Parvos. But how did it get lost/pulled back into the void in the first place IF it is the same Zariman our Tenno was on? And if it IS a different Zariman, what does that mean for the one that could still be in the Origin System? What stories and secrets could that one provide to the story?
Couldn't it be the drifter's zariman? Operator's zariman returns after they make a deal with wally, maybe more protected or restored thanks to the deal, and then later on, the drifter's zariman comes back, having been warped and transformed by the long time it's spent in the void. Since Duviri is created in the drifter timeline, and it's physically connected to the zariman we can access, doesn't it then make sense that it is the drifter's?
In my opinion, the Zariman that returns in the New War is the Drifter's Zariman, ours re-emerged and was fully intact because the Tenno took the deal and stopped the adults after which they repaired the biomes. The Drifter did not take the deal and so most of the children were killed by the adults, the Drifter survived because he created Duviri. In the New War, when the Tenno is thrown in the Void, they relive the moment the Drifter denied the deal and changes it, that's why the Drifter gets powers. The Zariman full of conceptual embodiments in a broken down state is the one where only the Drifter lived and he pulls it out of the void during the war after he sees it in the ending of the Duviri Paradox.
Only thing is Duviri has a lore entry that looks like a conversation between The Man in the Wall and the Drifter. "You wouldn't squelch on a deal, would you?" "I said I'd save them, never said I'd save you." I think you are right about the Zariman, but Drifter did take the deal. He's just in the timeline where he gets screwed over. Given that Wally seems to be relatively timeless, I wouldn't be surprised if this was all part of the plan. Wally needed someone without powers trapped in Limbo to be played when Operator gets taken out.
I believe that girl in the new trailer is the drifter before having their void power like they answered ordis they don't have it yet. Then they got it.
According to the platform merger event. All the individual tenno stories happen in a different universe. The quest probably happens for everyone in the universe where they are the choosen operator, but not in the universes that they aren't
I mean... Warframes are essentially human. I think the problem comes in what happens after the transference. I'm not sure what happened in 1999 but so far when a tenno transfers into something it appears to lose it's self after the process. Even the Vessel we use in Whispers, while having eyes and a heartbeat beforehand, have lost their eyes and their heartbeat in the sanctum, and the warframes appear no different... It's tough to say in the end. Humans and transference appears to be permanent, like with the silver grove, unum and continuity if you will. I don't recall a human transference outside of what happened during naberus and that ended quite horribly...
@@TheDsIEGEKuva erases, Transference unifies. Kuva erases the person and breaks them down, dissolves their consciousness until they are lost, refer to: The Leverian Voruna Story where he explains the process and The War Within we experience. Transference is Unison, as we experience in The Sacrifice and from how it explained by Ballas, that the Tenno calm them, not erase them, since Umbra is still conscious, but calm, bit removed from what he is, but the pain is eased "Take their pain away" be those emotional or physical, which makes sense considering that the Void has backlash to those who are exceedingly emotional. So the calming nature of the Tenno may be a result of the Void's indifference or nature as something that is a sea, some places calm, others a storm. The Tenno are the Calm. Slight addendum: Transference typically requires a Transference Bolt, that is put in every warframe or machine of the Orokin, presumably so they could be controlled by the Orokin, since they were strangely biomechanical creatures, be those Golden Maws or the Void Wyrms, that all serve some function. It would make sense they all had a Transference Bolt, where Umbra's was unique so he could be controlled by Ballas, as a particularly spiteful move. Though, something that is unclear is if the researcher who Transferred into The Silver Grove used a Transference Bolt to possess the forest, but bear in mind, she was a normal human researcher and physically died through transference. I can't remember what happened to her afterwards, whether she was just lost or is still there.
I beleive the 2 zaramin ships are an eternalism thing. The unscythed ship that came back is the ship that the tenno children were on and came back after they made the deal. Wally probably has something to do with it returning and being in such good condition. The ship that just returned recently is the one the drifter was on. It stayed in the void since the deal was declined in that timeline.
Perhaps an oversimplified route (sort of), the one delivering the Lotus flower could simply be the Drifter. Who looks like the Operator, has void powers on a non-distinct timeline, and in of themselves has a very vague and open ended explanation of how and when they interact with the origin system. The only specific limit thats mentioned is both Drifter and Operator can't exist in the "real" world at once, but in that opening cinematic, the Operator is in the Void (along with all of Lua) still, so the Drifter has free reign to be the physical.
I’m very noticed a lot since I’ve replayed the intro quest multiple times but ty for expanding upon nearly everything. Lastly I think it’s also quite possible the developers go and build some things blindly and then later build up them so it’s a “build as you go” concept… who who knows if this or these females will ever be important or not….
