@@Shepard5544 yeah true but I livr in apartments and leave at 6am everyday. Dont wanna piss off all my neighbors every morning with a super insanely loud bike. I run a 81 honda cb750 right now and its perfect sound wise
I have put 1500+ miles on my 2020 SR/S and here's what I know. 1) Highway speeds MURDER your mileage. 2) If you hop on one of these and expect to pull 200 miles, you will be disappointed. You would also be disappointed on a Harley expecting that mileage. 3) My average range in West Virginia (mountains) runs around 120 miles in sport mode. 4) Check your firmware. Mine was on v15 at first. When I updated it, I jumped up to 160 miles per charge. 5) Yes, your riding habits will change slightly. You will coast to stops more and use the regen braking to charge the battery. Overall, I have much more fun on my Zero than I have any other bike. Nothing like having a full 'tank' each morning to go on a ride. Is it perfect? Nope. Will it get better with time? According the the last firmware update. You bet.
I’m thinking the same. Must be in the name. Jokes aside, I obsess over my phone battery life and charge. If this transferred over to my motorcycle I would go insane too
you just have to plan a bit more, and you get used to it but it is a bit odd at first. Also range anx is a propaganda phrase that was designed to introduce anxiety where there was none, eg potential purchaser being reminded that the range is 100 miles on an EV and twice a year they may wish to drive a 150 to visit people they probably don't like that much.
@@JohnC-iv8jo most of what u say is true but, range anxiety is a very real thing that i have experienced between an electric motorcycle and electric long board. as you use them more and they start to wear the battery does too. and you have range anxiety at first becuase your getting used to the range that it has and that can be kinda sketchy whether you know how far your route it. and when the battery wears you loose some range and get the same feeling as when u first got it.
If electric bikes develop as fast as smartphones have over the next decade or so I think they will become way more attractive. As of right now, no thank you.
Electric vehicles have already existed for more than 130 years, how long should we wait? Haha as for smartphones. My phone 15 years ago needed charging about once every 3 weeks, my iphone needs charging everyday, Great progress!! Zero themselves have been out for more than 15 years, hmm don't see much improvement, do you?
Unfortunately, we're just waiting around for someone to have a eureka moment and develop a new kind of battery, it's just not there yet. Much like traditional computers haven't made real leaps in years, because they're close to their peak with current technologies.
@@PetrolJunkie to be fair your cellphone is still used the same way as it was used many years ago... with very minimal changes. Most carriers don’t even keep cellphones up front to purchase as the big moves are Smartphones.
@@PetrolJunkie I’m just stating Cellphones are still sold today. Lacking all types of features you’d see on a smartphone. Smartphones are phones with PDA features. Cellphones are just basic cellular devices. If Cellphones weren’t sold today I wouldn’t split hairs, but unfortunately the ancient device is still produced and made new today.
@@hz2035 Yes exactly the PERFECT all electric motorcycle would be to have a total of 300 usable miles in the city and 200 usable miles on the highway for everyone that wants one and have it more affordable as well !! Okay MANUFACTURERS get to work on this NOW easy said than done and it's NO WAY the world can go all green by the year 2040 !!!
a 200mile range wouldn't even get me from home to the nearest capital city. this bike should be reserved specifically for the country its parts come from - china.
My 2019 DSR pretty consistently gives me 90-100 miles of range although my longest ride was a little over 130 miles. Riding it makes me so happy although I've found Zero's customer support and quality to be a mixed bag. I definitely love my Zero but they're not for everybody.
Re: 80 min to charge. I've heard that charging from 0% to 80% charge takes about the same time as 80% to 100%. People "in the know" doing long trips in EVs seem to use a strategy of starting off with 100% charge and then toping up to only 80% during the trip to minimize time spent charging. That said 40 min still a long time to sit and wait to "refuel".
Yep, lack of lvl 3 charging really hurts these and its a mark in favor of the livewire. The range may be shorter but 15 mins to 80% is a huge plus (Assuming you can find chargers.)
Really appreciate how you just treated this like a standard bike, I feel like a lot of people tend to be overly conservative while riding electric bikes. Would definitely be curious in a maximum/minimum range comparison, twisties in Sport Mode vs city commute in Eco, if your sanity can handle it. ✌✌🏍🏍
There are some roads in eastern Kentucky where you're in danger of running into the back of your bike. Austin Hill Country is nice, but nobody in Appalachia would call it twisties. We wouldn't call anything that flat "hill country", either.
@@calebm.5698 Yea here in Dallas the speed limits on the toll near me are 55-65 but theres no where for cops to sit bc it's so tight so everyone is doing 90+
It's interesting to take on a group/demo ride with other Zeros, and have a conversation with other riders at a stoplight, without screaming or hand signals.
45 yrs biking had all sorts & types but with my solar pv array my SRF is allways full and ready to go , ive done 3x my annual milage in 2023 compered to my vn1500 . Accelaration from word go is second to none , 130 mile is enough for me in 1 sitting ,its a lazy mans fun bike ,best bike ive ever owned by far , saved £££££££ in past 18 months & not 1 issue love it
SR/S with extra tank power 😎. But to be fair, most people don’t travel 80 miles to commute. This would certainly be perfect for suburbs commuters. Also, the premium charge cuts to 60 minutes.
Having owned a Zero. Brand new the range is bad. The battery range will improve as the battery’s balance themselves over use. Usually around 1000. - 1500 miles is where the real world range comes true. Still lower than the manufacturer claims. Yes, disappointing. The quick charger option cuts charge time in half at a level 2 charge station. I built and carried a custom charger that gave me a 60% recharge over a half hour coffee break. You do have to plan your longer rides to include charge locations. But range is why I have not bought another one yet.
It’s a long list, so I didn’t want to get into it. But since the question has been asked again… Yes I do have a First Gen KLR650 that I use as my get it filthy and drop it in the mud adventure bike. My wife has a DR650. But that is not my replacement for the Zero. The Zero SM was used mostly as a track bike. And it was bloody brilliant as one. We still have my CRF250 Supermoto build, a 125 track bike and my Ducati 848 and my my wife’s CBR600 as our larger track bikes. For on the street and light dirt, I am a vintage bike guy, with a collection of beautiful mint classics that all see regular action. 1980 BMW R100S 1983 Honda CB1100F (only one year produced) 1992 Harley Davidson Dyna Daytona (only 1700 made) 1977 Honda XL250 (euro spec) 1983 Yamaha XT200 1984 Honda XL350R And last but not least, 1983 BMW R80GS. The Dakar winning original adventure bike.
I test rode this bike last year and was thrilled w it’s performance and driving characteristics. However I was not able to test it like Yammie has I am grateful that he has shown us. If I were to buy an electric ⚡️ bike it definitely would be for short distance commuting and not expecting any long distance trips on it
I don’t think you can look at electric bikes (or cars for that matter) from the same lens as gas equivalents. With batteries there are SOOOO many things that can affect the state of charge. Temperature, humidity, road surface, etc etc. So to view these vehicles in a proper way, it is best not to think too much about the charge. Just assume the vehicle has 10-20% less battery capacity than advertised. Us that would discount this bike from road trips, but that’s just the nature of electric vehicles. For daily driving I charge my Tesla model 3 to 60-70%, and by the end of the day it’s at 30-40%. But that doesn’t matter because it’s going to be ready to go the next morning. Similarly with this bike for daily driving, on sport mode all the time and ripping through corners, it would be good for a couple hours. Personally I don’t think bikes need to go electric at all. They’re such a mechanically connected machine to the rider, it would be a shame to disconnect that. Plus their fuel consumption and environmental impact is negligible compared to cars and trucks anyways.
08:55 the reason why the bike limits you at a low state of charge is battery related and not really a range extention or a "thinking for you" the volage of a discharging cell drops continuously and somewhat linear until you get to abour 20% there the voltage plummets (each high power event like your throttle input drops the voltage also) the problem is that low voltage (depending on chemistry of the cell) damages the cell irreversibly. but if they were to shut of the bike at 20% charge you leave a lot of range on the table to get the last view percent they limit the current draw of the controller to get the full charge out of each cell in you first video you also mention that the bike "doesnt feel analog at all" witch isnt suprising it is not analog...! its really really high speed computing needed to drive this kind of motor (its a really really big drone motor)
My LiveWire S2 Mulholland I’ve rounded 5K miles and have learned in the custom rider modes both A and B have 0% power and 0% throttle mode A is 0% regen and mode B is 100% regen The idea is to not pull massive amounts of power from the high voltage pack at any given time. I’ll gradually accelerate from any stop (boring but necessary) and as I come to hills or stops I’ll flip it to mode B this here unlocked my maximum road range of 130 miles per charge from 100% down to 1% but don’t misunderstand some commenters here are absolutely right! 40MPH and above absolutely slashes mileage and drafting sure does help on highway riding.
These Range Bros are naysayers I'm EV related post. When gas engines first came out, were all the Horse Bros doing that? "There isn't enough range, where will I get gas? I can get hay anywhere and do more miles on my old horsey..."
If a person seldom left town and just used a bike for back and forth to work I think a bike like that would be fun and make sense. For anything else gas powered only.
My only motorcycle is gas powered, but an electric motorcycle would make a great second bike for most people, for most of the riding we do commuting around town.
I've rode one of the smaller zero bikes, I enjoyed it but the charging time really puts me off. 5 mins in a petrol station is is infinitely better than waiting over an hour for the electric battery to charge
Especially for the price of a secondary bike .. to only go 90 miles. I realize it's all depending on income but I'd reckon the avg person isn't even considering 2 motorcycles
Theoretically they should be less prone to issues since electric motors are MUCH simpler than gas. That said, no doubt something will find a way to go wrong. The question will be if it matters or not
I agree that harley's aren't very good but i test rode a livewire and it's WAY better than other gas harleys. It rides similar to a z900 in my opinion. Yammie should really give it a try.
@@mindwalkerpod I will disagree that electric motors are much simpler. Maybe 'mechanically" they are much simpler... but they aren't "simpler" to fix. We're talking about not only on the source of the parts that would be broken, but also on the price, and technicality of the parts. To put it in another way... Electric bikes are mechanically smipler since they require less moving parts. But if things go wrong, for example shit gets wet... on a mechanical bike, it probably just needs drying. On an electric bike on the other hand...
I did this same test last week and I got just over 100 miles on mine which I thought was pretty good. Previous to this test I did the trick of running the battery to completely empty and then slowly charging up to 100%. This seems to recalibrate the BMS and I found it gave me about 15% more range.
While I enjoy the visceral revving of an old-fashioned IC engine; the peacefulness of this bike is just awesome and would be great for a mountain cruise. That being said, I could not live with the inconvenience of an electric bike. Ripping through the twisties is definitely more fun with my CP3 howling under me.
EV bikes doesn't fit for everyones use. But I ride an Energica since 2 years and it was the best buy in my last 35 years. I also like the SR/F and the Livewire very much. Just get an EV and a combustion bike and enjoy both - its not about this or those, both are fun! :-)
The fix for this should be so easy; add an overdrive gear that comes on at highway speeds or during very soft throttling. You don't need 100% of your torque at 75mph.
change my mind everyday and want every bike lol. Seriously considering an electric probably zero for next bike. I think these would be a better transition for and reviewed by maxiscooter riders as myself. the range as much as i have anxiety about myself, isn't terrible. I would only get 150-200 mile range out of either of my scooters. I'm more of a commuter probably. Seldom time or don't know where want to go on long rides. only been on one motocamping adventure.
Then again for the city no one needs that much HP. Thanks for testing it out! It tells me to wait a couple of years longer before switching to electric ride.
range testing of these is vital.. and manufacturers need to be honest about ranges.. because they're customers expect practical ranges from these things based on practical everyday uses.. and if they buy a bike with power they probably expect some fast road use and some decent range on them... in the UK our motorway speed are between 70mph and 80mph.
I did a bit of research and it shows that if you do more sport mode and use higher regeneration breaking setting, you’re more guaranteed the results you want in form of range. Being safe in eco won’t give you the results you want. Also, some reviewers said that after it goes down to 1 or 0 percent, they’ve gotten more than 10 miles after so it doesn’t die just as you reach 0%. I think that’s a great safety protocol that would give me ou the range of 109miles to 120 miles. Use it the fun way with regen and see if your experience and your observation remains the same
I have no experience with these, but lots of time with electric bikes, so just an idea- the battery on the Zero probably thought it was at 100% while it was charging, but after cooling down the voltage dropped and it showed 90% by the time you start riding. It's not great for the longevity of the cells, but you can let it cool off then out it back on the charger. Charging it in a cool place might help! Again- i have "Zero" experience with these
I have plenty of experience with electric skateboards, onewheels, and a Sur Ron. You simply change your lifestyle and habits to make it work. For example: a Onewheel can go 20 miles. Then you charge. So just plan stops to charge. Or charge at work. Or charge at the grocery store. Granted, battery technology and chargers are only so efficient, but it will only get better. Look at how quick batteries developed for phones, laptops and even electric cars.
A toy? The reality of the world of motorcycles today is that they are used primarily as commuting devices in large cities, where the 50cc mopeds and 125cc small bikes are king. Whenever I see Yam's videos and they're on these huuuge 1000cc+ motorcycles I kinda cringe a little, it's so unnecesary, and so far removed from the reality of many people. An electric motorcycle with a range of 141km is a hell of a machine, considering the average commuter in the united states does only 10km-25min trips. The machine itself is quite OK, the thing that kills the deal for me is it's price. You can't charge 20k for that. I wouldn't pay 5k for that. Plus, it's prolly going obsolete in a couple of years. If Zero wants to make the bike of the future, they first need to think in a bike for the people, like the big japanese manufacturers used to (and keep doing) with their little mopeds and street bikes. Give us a wider range of prices, promise us adaptability and future-proofing as new battery technologies come and go. Right now, they're just pandering to rich people with money to waste.
@@MrWulfgarr you clearly don't live in the US. My sister literally can't ride her 125 Monkey to work because it doesn't reach safe highway speeds. A 250-300 is the absolute bare minimum I could ride anywhere in America.
what are you talking about, the sad state of battery tech? the cost per kw/h has fallen dramatically and continues to do so. if you knew anything about that which you ignorantly opine, you'd see that battery tech is in an incredible place, relative to even five years ago, and improving incredibly fast.
this issue is why I would love to see tesla make an electric motorcycle. when it comes to battery tech and engine efficiency Tesla is close to if not at the top of the chain and the massive fast charging network is a massive gain for longer trips
@@gapplebees9295 I based my answer on statistics. If your sister needs to take highways to reach her destination, then she is probably not part of the majority of people that live in large metropolitan areas. The US is just a fraction of the worldwide motorcycle market. The main buyers are big asian countries with sprawling cities. You are smart enough to google "average commuting distance by country". Cheers.
Just the wrong product for what you want. Yesterday we rode a LiveWire and two Energicas from Albuquerque to Santa Fe for lunch and back. 170 miles in sports mode, high speed riding, several thousand feet in elevation changes. We blew past a bunch of gas bikes at Madrid, NM (where they filmed Wild Hogs) and had an amazing day. Never had to hold back or baby the bikes for range. You have to get the right tool for the right job.
@@mycobrahatesyou We rode to Santa Fe, recharged, had lunch, then rode back to Albuquerque the back way. Same exact thing we would have done on gas bikes.
Seems like electric power and range is good enough - but only for certain tasks. This as a comfy commuter bike would make much more sense than as a barebone sports bike.
Choose the Watt-Hours per Mile setting in the quad display. There are essentially 12 usable KW in that battery. Also it is very temperature dependent. If its cold you go slower and not as far. It doesn't like temps below 50 degrees. If its warm, on level ground, you will get approximately a 100 wh/m consumption at 40 mph. Doing the math, that's 120 miles. Approximately 330 wh/m at 100miles per hour. That about 36 miles.
I drove 3 types of Zero. I don't like them because they are huge and heavy. I think the same battery size combined with a much slender bike with halve the bodyweight would make a more interesting vehicle.
Electric bike is just a fun toy riding around the blocks, urban type living, perfect for commute. Any weekend ride will more likely need a tow truck to get you home. A hybrid version would be better, for example, they can make a 250cc bike to have same performance as liter bike.
Funy to see Zero pulling the same tricks as ebike companies. They'll do the same thing. Publish a range number like 40 miles of range, but with a tiny asterisk pointing out that the published range is only possible if you ride 12 MPH over flat ground and with no headwind. Then you go for a ride at 20 MPH over some hills and your actual range is only 15 miles.
I know that battery technology advances progressively faster with each passing year, but I still believe that electric bikes, I mean truly useful ones, are still a decade away.
I use it for commuting in and around the city of Los Angeles. It’s a great commuter and I don’t have to buy gas which is a plus and beats traffic as well. I do agree that it’s not the bike I take when I ride out with friends...
I typically ride 50 miles a day mid-week. On Saturdays and Sundays, I can ride 300 - 400 miles a day. I can fill up my gas tank in about 5 minutes but my bike can go 200 miles on a tank. Not sure what the fun factor is if I have to stop every 90 miles to charge for basically 80 minutes. It might work for limited ranges but not for the distances I tend to ride. I hate to think what the range is if you have to have the headlights on full time while riding at night.
bravo, i enjoy your content. Also miss my old hometown highways and byways. I just finished safety course training off north lamar site...I like that sporty looking Zero, but i am a happy man with a honda nc700.
If the bike had the optional charge tank it would increase the distance something like 60%. It also has an additional option of adding capacity to the battery, for a fee. Also with the optional 3kW charger it can charge to 80% in one hour. So for more money you can get better than a Livewire as good as an Energica. I spent $3 total paying for power in January for mine.
No wonder a local dealer (Euro Cycle) in 2024 is selling a 22 for $14k, well below the price cuts Zero already did. Nobody wants this lower than claimed range bike for the price
Doesn't like hills, for sure. Up Tne Tight Side of Palomar, 7 miles used 20 %. Down the Fast Side, 11 miles, used 2 % . Overall did better on flat roads. Got 70 miles with 20 % left by the time I got home. My earlier 2014 went into " Limp Mode " at 10 %.
@@brendanpeoples7102 yeah seriously haha, I have a bunch of electric RC cars and they're great, in fact better than the nitro/gas ones, but for 1:1vehicles it's gonna take a while before the battery tech gets far enough to pass the practicality of gas vehicles. It won't happen overnight like these governments are hoping for
Would love to see something like the BMW i8 has, it has a hybrid motor, when you are in sport mode the car only uses the gas engine and loads the batteries while driving
I don't think electic bikes should be sold as cruisers, adventure bikes, Saturday canyon cruisers, etc. The technology limits them to commuting and errands around town, which is actually a huge market and most of the riding we do. Unfortunately, motorcycles aren't marketed to the mundane. They're marketed to how we aspire to ride and not how we usually ride. Electric bikes are great commuter bikes. If your daily ride to work and back, with side trips is 50 miles or less, you can ride in zen like silence and hoon like a demon to your heart's content, pass every gas station, never do any chain maintenance because it's belt driven, never change oil or air filters, and do a lot less brake pad replacements because the Zero has regenerative braking that only uses brake pads for emergency stopping. If you want to ride fast for hundreds of miles you'll be disappointed, but if you want a fast silent bike for your daily rider that's cheap and easy to keep, you'll like an electric bike.
To my knowledge, US and Canada are the countries with the fastest speed limits. On Europe you will see more often streets and big avenues with ranges from 50 to 60 km/h, which would be around 35 to 40 mph. That's why the Sport Mode starts so low.
Electric motorcycles / vehicles just aren’t there yet . It’s a cool concept , but until battery technology advances, it’s difficult to justify them for any kind of real travel
My older 2016 Zero DS with 13kwh battery has now 22.000km /13670miles with enduro tires and a total average range of 150km / 93miles. I always prefer to ride my Zero when the range is enough istead of my 2021 Honda Africa Twin. And thats more than 95% of the time! Quick answer to the ride modes: You dont ganin range to put it in street ore eco mode. Only our right hand will have an effect on fhe range 😁 I always ride my DS custom mode (App configuration) with full power / torque and maxed regen braking while braking.
Any Zero would be perfect for me, my commute is max 20mph average in central London traffic and the twisties in the hills are about 10 miles away. But at their current price point and with the current range, there is a need for fast DC charging. Big charging stations are opening rapidly in the UK and could charge this battery in the time it takes for a coffee break. Alternatively they need to drop to the price range of budget commuter bikes that people will charge at home and do the occasional ride out but no more.
Problem with E-bikes compared to E-cars, is that you can`t just put a bigger battery in it, the day they make one that can go +200 miles on the highway we can talk about it.
It's got about the same highway range as my KLX250, with its 1.5 gallon gas tank. But I can refill that in 3 minutes at a pump with tap payment. Maybe less. My 1200RT obviously has a much longer range, but I don't expect everything to be a touring bike.
not disappointed honestly, you must try an energica evo or another energica and see the range on it, that's a top end of the line electric motorcycle for sure
Practically no EV users(motorcycle or car) comes to a charging station after it's close to zero and sits there till its 100% charged. That's gonna take 80 minutes in case of this particular motorcycle. In reality people charge it whenever they can with enough buffer and only up to 80%. That way, maximum time can be saved. And this is why this 100 to 0 range tests for EVs don't make a lot of sense. The more realistic test is to find out how far one can go in a certain time(say one day or 12 hours). I am sick and tired of this kind of unrealistic riding/diving or charging habits(or no charging habits) from non-EV users to an EV, that ultimately misleads potential buyers.
Zero stopped selling bikes in Australia in 2017 when you consider they had a CLAIMED range of 146miles or 234km (city) and thanks to import, taxes and the like were around the $50k (AUD) like the HD Livewire you can see why they didn’t sell. The world seems to forget Australia is a big country and whether they like it or not 80% of Aussies live along the coast with cities being a long distance apart so these bikes land up only being useful as commuters. I say this because I know there will be those who see E Bikes as more than just a commuter bike. I honestly don’t see the point of these bikes specially when I’ve spent at least 5 or 6 hours out and about enjoying a good ride or even longer on a even better road trip.
Okay I'm not a fan of electric bikes but to be fair if an R6 have fuel gauge you would see the field depleting when you write a twisty road . I get about 100 miles to 4gal when doing some triple digit spirited riding.
anyone else notice all the rubber filings building up on the rear footpeg at 12.28? Running costs for a Zero . . . .$0.50 per 10000 miles for charging, $10000 for a replacement battery every 5 years and presumably plenty of replacement belt drives for good measure. :-) Just kidding of course but duration of battery life and cost of replacement is the biggie for me - I don't swallow the 150000 mile battery life
They need to get back to the drawing board. Less than 200 miles is unsatisfactory for likely most riders. Plus combining that with 80 minute charge time, this bike is not ready for the consumer
9:45 "If you own one get familiar with modes"....see that's the difference with ICE bike, you own one you don't need to be familiar with it's modes....
i have a zero s, and ya range kinda sucks but i love my bike its a fun ride it excels in almost everything. almost no maintenance, ( i live in the mountains of TN), im hoping that in a couple of years when i get a new battery, i can get a more efficient battery and increase my range
I need a Cruiser/touring electric that gets 250 highway miles for 10-15k before I'd jump into electric motorcycling. Sadly battery tech just isn't there yet. Maybe if we ever get those graphene batteries.
