I love how Sam juices Josh up before the call. He knew exactly what Josh would do. Man I miss this show. It was the best show on politics there ever was.
nfinn42 - I totally agree. The writing & acting were legendary. I'm a conservative & I still believe it was truly one of the best TV shows of all time.
The term limit is not about not trusting the voters but about fearing people in power would rig the election to stay in power forever, but with just two terms, it’s not worth the risk.
Then elections should be more vigilant, and protected. It's wrong to deny the voice of the people because someone MIGHT start rigging elections. If the will of the people is ignored, then revolt against the rigger. You have this kind of corruption right now, but instead of the right one person, they just string along 20 people that suit them best.
As I recall, what finally galvanized the term limits initiative was FDR winning a fourth term when already seriously ill, leading him to make extremely poor decisions that benefited Stalin, and then later dying.
Term limits have brought more corruption to Michigan over the last thirty years because when you shove all the experienced legislators out of the government, bills get written by lobbyists and paid advocates who end up knowing the system better than the endless stream of newbies elected on the premise that outsiders with the money to pay for their campaigns are the best way to go.
Campaign finance reform in American Politics. It's nice to indulge in a little fantasy story every now and again. Maybe they'll have dragons in the next season.
"You asked me to buck him up" "Now I'm telling you to leave him alone" I think it was around this moment when I began to realize Josh was indeed, the Democrats WarDog. He's like an animal you gotta reign in and hype up once in a while when the game gets REALLY afoot. And the best part is that Josh knows he, he's proud of it...and loves every minute of it.
'the call?' 'on the cell' lol looking back, it's kinda funny some of the writing. but that is where tech was at the time. but the BEST show ever on television. I miss TWW
If there were term limits, then when a politician reached that limit, their name wouldn't be on a new election ballot... So, elections are not the same as term limits ..
In Ancient Athens, the terms of members of the council of 500 that prepared the meetings of the ekklesia, were limited. If I remember correctly, someone could be reelected once, but not further. While that was no problem for the highly populated inner districts of athens-city, the outer districts with a much lower population density had troubles filling those positions, considering that they were not paid much for that and had to travel long distances, leaving them with less time for their actual work. That lead to a point where the council was dominated by the inner districts on an intellectual level and thus setting agendas that did not necessarily took into account the needs of the outer districts. This problem would be similar in the US if we were to introduce term limits for members of the US House or the US Senate. The intellectual independence of members of those democratic bodies would be diminished. There would be more new members who would have to "learn" the job. With very harsh term limits like in Athens, the legislature would have to figure out how to do their job at the beginning of every session. Another problem would be that the skill of drafting legislation would be handed over to lobbyists and staffers. Noone elected those people. So if you want term limits, something like 6 terms for the House and two term for the US Senate would be good, in order to make sure that those bodies can still function. However, the issues with term limits is that they tackle a problem created by a different issue. Gerrymandering made it possible for politician to chose their voters. Instead of introducing term limits that come with a lot of baggage and only somewhat solve the problem, banning partisan gerrymandering and creating a system that creates fair and competitive districts would be the superior solution. However, if you go that far, you might as well go full circle and create a completely new system that's more fair and better controllable by the people than the current one. But to use the words of Winston Churchill: "Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the other systems we already tried."
For those against corporates and billionaires buying politicians and judges, ask your representative about HR1 act which had provisions on campaign finance reform and disclosures on dark money donated by corporates and billionaires via super pacs and 501c4 political advocacy nonprofits.
as much as i love this show, and it's an all time great, i never understood his position against term limits. all elected officials need term limits to keep them from having the power of kings and queens. we need to extend term limits to all elected officials including the supreme court, senators, etc.
The founders knew what they were doing and it is true that you get the government you deserve. If the people of the nation continue to vote for incompetence, incompetence is what they shall have.
Term limits don't change much. You just get a different face with the same policies and the same people pulling the strings. They project the illusion of change without providing anything of actual substance. If anything, term limits make it easier for corruption to fester, because they allow the deeper issues to be ignored. The only thing that can actually root out entrenched corruption in politics is an educated and engaged electorate. That's why both education and voting rights are things that are staunchly opposed by the corrupt.
We need money reform. Only way we get is with a new Supreme Court. Not the one that approved Citizens United. The worst decision since Dred Scott, but before Dobbs.
At the beginning of this scene, Jeb sounds like a Republican. I always laugh when politicians say that the voters are smart enough to make their own decisions. Of course we know that for most people that's not true.
Take a look at The Glad Summer book cover. Published 1951. Yes the young heroine is saying here comes that Ragamuffin Nicholas Harbourne to...anywho. she Joanne threw the heroes hat over that wall her wall and here comes her reward. Not straight reporting no salaciousness? I feel someone is sayin do you follow? Robert Shaw Richard Dreyfuss and Roy Schneide and JAWS JAWS JAWS not whose whose whose! Okay. Some subtext😊 the Glady summer. Indian Summers. Yeah. So far I have followed the script but who benefits? The pupils are not learning are they PUPILS not named IRIS Murdoch.
"I get nervous around laws that fundamentally assume that Americans can't be trusted." Any NRA person would then ask, "Then why are you trying to take away our guns?"
"I need to arm myself with the kind of weapon that only makes sense in a battlefield" is a manifestation of lack of trust in other Americans, in and of itself.
@@jamesstewart556 it's never going to be fair. Even if money is taken out of the equation. Some people are born handsome, more charismatic, better manipulators. Life isn't fair and equitable, it never will be
Agree with this. Term limits are a guard rail against autocracy. The first thing a dictator for life in Latin America or Africa does is pass a constitutional ammendment removing term limits. Removing term limits is a big red flag. They may not be ideal, but the specter of autocracy must be fought with all the weapons we have, even blunt ones.
@@MascotWP Agreed, especially when you consider that most of our political leadership is in their 70s and 80s - an age when, if it was our mom or dad, we’d start to worry about their ability to even care for themselves.
"When the process is fair..." It's not. That's why we need term limits. I voted for a senator I hated last election because the other party couldn't be bothered to put a better candidate up, and there's representatives like that all over the country.
Even if it did all work, why not also have term limits? Would we really be lost without the few hundred leaders in power now? Surely each and every year should bring new people ready to meet the challenge.
I'd argue that a person's life is a lot more important than a light bulb, and being a judge is quite different from a guy browsing the electronics section of a Walmart.
6 лет назад
That's exactly right. The dumb cocksuckers would still be using 150watt bulbs where 7 watts would do.
Getting stuck up on American vs British spelling is just beating a dead horse...find a better joke (and I say that as a New Zealander who uses British spelling most of the time), but I was interested in why it used the British spelling here - I searched for the particular hotel and can't actually find a Sheraton Centre/Center Hotel DC - the main one that pops up is in Toronto, which would obviously use the British spelling. I wonder if the writers took the Canadian one and "moved" it to DC, or maybe there's an older one that google doesn't find as easily with some historical reason to use the British spelling. If it's just made up I would have expected the American spelling - particularly as Sheraton is an American company. Or maybe it was just a typo?
@@justinwellington6448 Sure, and the British standard says one thing while the American standard says another...the US has enough shit going on that you can look down on, taking issue with spelling just makes you look like a pompous high school student who just found out that different people speak different ways. Are you snobbish about accents as well? What about full on dialect changes?
I like this show a lot... Huge fan but they sometimes seem so rude for such articulate and educated people. In the real life, you don't talk to senators like that
You've had a lot of discussions with senators as a senior White House aide, have you? What makes you think that powerful and educated people can't be just as vulgar and smarmy as anybody else?
The senator was asking for it. All the Bartlett administration wanted to do was name 2 campaign finance reformers in the Federal Election Commission. Josh and Sam went to the Republicans to feel their temperature. The Republicans who control Congress in the show then threatened to pass legislation after legislation on controversial issues if Bartlett went ahead with the nominationa. (Flag burning, English as national language etc.etc.) How else were they proposed to respond?
not really, the shutdown arc was post Sorkin, and anyway if you don't want to be called a villain you shouldn't act like a cartoon version of one like the modern republicans are wont to do.
Wow, I am liberal but the first two statements were garbage. Judges can't be trusted to give equal sentences for two reasons: statistically it has been shown that rich white defendants get better sentences overall, and the laws that are passed give worse treatment to minorities than they do to others, such as the difference in sentencing between cocaine and crack cocaine. Term limits are needed because the supreme court has basically said that it is legal for the state legislatures to create voting districts which eliminate the opposition. So democrat majorities can dilute the republican districts and republican majorities can dilute the democrat districts in their respective states. When term limits are eliminated it brings the threat of authoritarianism. If it wasn't a problem then we would not have had so many presidents that have been elected while losing the popular vote. Another good reason for term limits is because government officials hide their acts. They classify something horrible that has happened as top secret and the voting public never gets that information. How can it be a true democracy if the leaders hide their actions from the voters? Responses to this (if there are any) will probably be that "The West Wing" was a fictional show, but the truth is that real life politicians are out there defending judges that give unequal sentences as well as defending states that are disenfranchising voters by diluting their districts. Not to mention the politicians that classify information so it cannot be released to the public to be judged.
Perhaps you do not remember, but the higher sentences for Crack were largely proposed and strongly supported by the Black Leadership because they expected that it would reduce Black cocaine use, since Crack was believed to be the way that they consumed it. Perhaps a mistake, but not designed to increase Black incarceration, nor over white levels.
"I get nervous around laws that fundamentally assume that Americans can't be trusted." And yet, Jed, you and your staff believe wholeheartedly in gun control, which at its roots is not about controlling guns--it's about controlling people.
Certains and certain people. Or do you think grenade launchers should be commerically available just because the 2nd ammendment said you can join a militia if the other 12 colonies had any funny ideas
@@ryuhitsuya21 The second amendment forbids the government from interfering with a right the people are assumed to have. As to what constitutes "arms", that's another issue, but I'm willing, for the sake of discussion, to exclude crew-served weapons. And, just for you, grenade launchers, RPGs, and the like, allowed only with training and licensing. In exchange, jr. high and high schools will make militia classes a requirement for graduation, and actual enrollment in an organized state or local militia entitles you to the current standard issue Army assault rifle. (Constitution, Article I, section 8, clause 16.) Sure, semi-auto only, I guess--I''m open to compromise. For, as I say, the sake of discussion.
Actually, Josh himself states he's actually ready to accept a lot of different positions on gun control as being "perfectly valid" in an earlier episode and we never see what Leo and Toby and the others think about gun control, actually. Also, you do realize that ALL laws are about controlling people, right? That's all a law does. It tells people what to do or not to do. That's why we have them. To control people. So try again. Actually, don't. I won't be responding.
