What’s going on with Suzuki? Kawasaki Making EVs & Hybrids? | HSLS S6E3 

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It's funny to listen to this right after Suzuki announced an all new engine that will be going in to multiple new platforms in 2024 (after you all recorded obviously). They must have heard you at HQ

According to Dani pedrosa the KTM motoGP budget for one team with two riders is 30 to 40 mil usd. He was asked on a carwow video recently.

Although I don't currently own a Suzuki, I hope they ramp up in their motorcycle company and get the name back out there.

One hit Suzuki took down under this year, was the discontinuation of the DR650, their best selling bike, and one of the best selling adventure bikes in Australia.

I hope Suzuki sticks around, they're my favorite brand (first bike and all). I've had a katana, a gt750, and several rm dirt bikes.

What about the new Suzuki twins being seen in Europe? It seems that Suzuki is in the midst of a pivot to new designs and technologies.

I'm not very good at the engine sound game, but it is always impressive to see Zachs savant skills

Now if only Suzuki would bring the GT+ to the US in a desirable color blue. I'd even take the black GT if i could get it as a + model

I usually listen to this via podcast in the car but had to come here and thumbs up and give you guys props for stepping up the thumbnail game. Very nice!

Zack and Ari took an old GSXR1000 (aka Dave) and kicked Ducati’s flagship to the curb. Maybe, as pointed out, Suzuki found the magic formula. If it ain’t broke, why change it. As for electric, battery technology and cross country infrastructure to support it does not exist. So until the support system exists, they will be the occasional oddity usually found around larger population centers.

Honda makes all those cars motorcycles and generators so that they can go racing, I mean that was Mr. Honda’s dream wasn’t it

It would be interesting to see a HS/LS edition that discusses the differences around the world in regard to two-wheeled vehicles. We often talk about the use of small motorcycles for transportation in Taiwan, India, etc., and bemoan the lack thereof in North America and to a large degree also Europe, but forget one of the main reasons: climate. In much of India, Taiwan, and Southeast Asia in general, their climate allows year-round riding without much inconvenience. In most of Canada and at least half of the US, you simply can’t ride a two-wheel vehicle reliably all year around. Even if you are willing to buy the gear required to ride at sub-freezing temperatures, the dangers of ice and snow on the roads are not easily mitigated.

Suzuki VVT trickled down from moto GP. My 18 gsxr 1000R is incredible. What have other manufacturers done. I test drove a R1 and CBR 1000. I absolutely loved the gsxr before buying it. So much power everywhere in the rev range. It felt like a faster more comfortable bike in 2019

Win on Sunday. That's it. It no longer translates to sales on Monday (or Tuesday, when dealers are open).

The sound was easy having ridden about 5,000 miles on K1600 rentals in Europe. That whine is very distinctive.

Suzuki does not have a factory team in Supercross and Motocross. They support HEP Suzuki, formerly a smaller team with B list riders. Their bikes are the only ones without electric start, something all other manufacturers embraced years ago. It breaks my heart because some of my favorite bikes have been Suzuki’s over the years (SV 650, DRZ 400, DR 650, and many RMs).

My first bike was made in 1987 and it did everything I wanted really. I think engines have reached the point where they can do eveyrthing they can on the road. Physics hasnt changed in the last 40 years. The real progress in the last 10 years has been safety, control and electronics. Thats pretty much it. And thats ok.

Interesting that Lance is not only the sharpest one here, but his image on the screen is also much sharper than the other two. Hmmm…..

Being a Rin’s and Suzuki fan I was really disappointed with them pulling out. 😢

I just can not see the EV being successful. Long charge times to short drive times and then throw in the cost it just isn't feasible.

I've been life long Suzuki customer. Many RM125 in my early years. Many gsxr 750,1000 machines. All my bikes have been incredible and reliable. It's such a shame there not doing well. They need to tweak the business model. I would be extremely disappointed if they went under

The crazy thing about suzuki is... They already made such good bikes it's hard to beat them. The drz400s is unchallenged in its power weight maintenance range. The v strom is too reliable also.

You guys talking about different capacities in Super Sport got me thinking. Why don't the Japanese 4 so what the Italians so and build "cheater" litre bikes? Think GSXR1100r, ZX11 and what not. Would also help meet emmisions standards too.

Suzuki gets criticized for not releasing new versions when they are reliable and you have KTM Advs having a reputation as “Its great when its not at dealer for mystical electric problems or its great when it starts” I rode to the Arctic this summer on reliable Suzuki that had NO issues. Thanks Mr Suzuki for building a Reliable bike😆

Hi, Hello from Mexico City. These are my 5 cents, you need to go back to see the whole picture, not just for bikes, you need to see Suzuki industry as a whole, cars, marine equipment and bikes, so on recent years Suzuki has not had a good reception on both sides, even though they have really good products. So a year ago due to pandemic the industry show us how fragile is economy, so Suzuki had no option other than sell a part of the company to Toyota, who also has an important share investment with Yamaha, so that answer Us one of many questions and it is why to have 2 companies running high expenses on the same category? Just keep the brand most relevant and the one who has more success. We know Toyota are experts on managing companies, just take a look and see how at Subaru are regaining on market where the company was left a few years ago.

Suzuki makes some good bikes. The market is ripe for an update to the DR600/DRZ400, as they are both solid bikes in that segment, but an update with a bit stronger small ADV, a better dual sport, and a couple of Japanese Supermotos to compete with KTM would put them back on people's minds. i have had a GS500, Vstrom 1000, and currently am working on a scrambler GS450 to play around with.

Gotta love the silky smooth sounds of Spurgeon Dunbar for Motul motorcycle products. Glad to see The Silver Fox is back for his first, of what I hope are many, appearances this season. So, basically Kawasaki does not stand with turbo Bruce. I know how Suzuki feels its often been said that if they ever write the story of my life it would have to start with chapter 11. Looks like Suzuki is making big plans for the future and they include needing the money from their GP division. Spurge talk about KTM's? Nah never happen lol! Smell is important Zack nothing like the smells of well weathered leather, hot metal and oil, amid the scented country air. I think its a Triumph triple cylinder, maybe a Speed Triple or a Daytona 675. Wrong on all counts...NUTS! See you in 2 and on 2!

They properly waiting the perfect time to steal some tech from someonelse XD. back in the day of 2 strokes, i heard a interesting story. Suzuki wasnt doing well soo they made a deal with the MZ motorcycle main rider to provide them with the 2 stroke tech made by an German engineer Walter Kaaden in east Germany

Thanks guys for another great episode. So proud of myself when I guessed GSX-1000 as the last "new" Suzuki model. I feel like I got pretty close. Should Suzuki "not being a motorcycle company" prevent people from buying a Suzuki? I don't think so. I think that there will still be good support. I think the motorcycle community will always be out there to help one another out. There is always a business in aftermarket parts so someone will make parts. A V-Strom 650 is in my top 5 of bikes that I will buy next. Although if they pull the V-Twin and put in a P-Twin it will be removed from the list. I really like the GSX-1000GT+ idea. It helps get a new, really good bike for a "slightly" lower price. I don't care the technology is 20 years old. I personally ride a 42 year old airhead on the weekends.

I knew the sound immediately…but I daily a K16GTL 😂. Great podcast.

Why does Suzuki investing in being more sustainable automatically mean eBikes? It's more likely to mean manufacturing in more sustainable ways than producing electric motorcycles.

Had a 18 gsxr1000r, super reliable and easy to work on, very competitive in racing as well, but it’s a shame it doesn’t excite you like other newer stuff. Can you imagine a gsxr with the new tft screen on their gsxs1000gt, and a cp4 with vvt?

Just waiting for lance to snap about being spoken for and cut off at every turn 🤣🤣🤣🤣

I've always loved Zuks. Especially old big bore Zuks. Currently I have an '84 GS1150E and '91 GSXR1100M. Suzuki has always built solid, reliable, well engineered bikes that just plain work. They have occasionally been cutting edge, but not usually. I find it especially sad how they have more or less abandoned the off-road and MX scene. I'm old enough to very fondly remember the 80's and 90's RMs. It seems like they've just lost their passion. The Gen 3 Hayabusa is awesome, but at the same time could have been so much more. I hope they find their moto mojo again, although it is good to hear that they seem to be healthy overall financially.

Great content! I wish spurge would just let the explanations come out on their own…

I believe the 2005 and the 2017 GSX-R1000s were both ground up redesigns.

I actually have a hard time seeing hybrid motorcycle technology taking off... I mean what benefits does an electric motorcycle have over a gasoline motorcycle? Efficiency around town and simplicity of maintenance, that's pretty much it? And the downsides are weight, cost, range? Now you're talking about cramming a gas engine *and* a battery and electric motor in a bike? So now it's likely to be more expensive than a gas equivalent, *more* complicated maintenance, just as heavy or heavier, more expensive, and what you get out of it is... maybe a little bit more range (thinking touring range here, city range isn't an issue for just about anybody on a motorcycle, so a much longer range there doesn't really count for much)? Honestly a hybrid motorcycle sounds like the worst of both worlds to me, not the best of either.

for new Suzuki models, what about the M109R in '06 or the B-King in '07, or the C109R in '08? were any of those based on other bikes? i know the B-king is a busa engine but the chassis? the C109 is a scaled up VL1500, but i don't think it shares any architecture, just the motor from the M.

Isn't suzuki bringing out a parallel twin bike to replace the SV650?

The cool thing about hybrid systems - you could easily set up a 2wd system Werth an electric motor to the front wheel and gas/petrol to the rear.

HA, I knew that engine sound INSTANTLY, because I hear it every morning when I fire mine up!!! 🤣

SP model for me. Once You’ve had braided steel brake lines you’ll never go back and the $3k upgrade price gets you better suspension bits? It’s a no brainer

I was positive it was a Street Triple. Also, I think Suzuki is going to be big in the American market again in 10 years. Demand in the global market for EV motorcycles is going to be higher in the short term and North America will play catch up. Suzuki sounds like they're ahead.

On thing that I think gets glossed over way too often is Suzuki also bringing back the katana. It just didn't get the same level of hype because at came out right at the start of the pandemic

Strange move for Suzuki. Most of their bikes are based on race bikes. Only a couple cruisers and dirt bikes. I would like to see them do something to compete with the grom. A mini dual sport off the RM85 would be fun.

What about the hayabusa that came out in 99.

I really want the current Gen GSXr1000 but I’m not sure if they’ll update it or axe it. They said they’ll axe the Hayabusa but ended up with a Gen3 that meets emission regulations

I don't want no exposed chain drive! I much prefer shaft drive! I could go with some kind of enclosed chain - I'd like to see that! Exposed chain is so 1900's! Phooey!

Was the M109R in 2006 an all-new engine and chassis?

Thanks for another provocative episode. Suzuki engineering is no joke and can boast some candidates for best all-time motorcycles in some categories. To Surgeon's point, they'll be back with a game changer EV or hybrid like they did with the legendary two-stroke bikes. The world is ready!

I am a MotoGP fan and I can say that, it is totally understandable from a money standpoint why Suzuki would back out of MotoGP. However, I do think they should focus on WSBK, since the cost would not be as much but it is still a premier racing league. I also think Moto America is also a great league, but Moto America is extremely lacking in marketing and fan support.

I bought a Suzuki bike recently to be the unique one on the road but honestly they need to improve their bikes design to sell more. Also they need to work on new products.

What a beautiful twist Lance delivered about Suzuki business as a whole 👍 I absolutely loved it. It popped the balloon of being so US market centric. But I also agree with Spurgeon - Suzuki not being innovative has a perception of an old, not exciting brand of bikes that I am too young for ;) (and I am 46 years old myself). There isn't a single Suzuki bike that makes my heart pomp faster... And it makes me sad, really. Brilliant podcast.

It’s called Self Preservation and reinvention.

Zach the 🐐

I figured out that engine sound right away, that was too easy.

Last fresh model 1986 GV1400 Cavalcade water cooled V4. Greatest tourer made.

I want to say 2007 Harley Dyna because that’s the bike that it sounds like that I start up almost every day and it has that wine and about that rev.

In Southeast Asia, Suzuki bike sales are declining while the Suzuki small cars, trucks and SUV are growing

If Spurge is wrong, in three to five years, he has to ride a V-strom 650 for a year.

I hope Suzuki addresses their MX bikes. As of now, they are the only four strokes that are still kickers, they have less power, and more weight compared to the competition. They used to at least be the cheapest in the segment, but now Honda's CRF450R-S has undercut that too.

Spurgeon messed it up by not differentiating 'wire' from 'cable'. Phooey.

I've been posting for a while that I do not understand what Suzuki's strategy is - particularly in the US. They have shipped overweight and underperforming bikes in the US, particularly for entry/smaller bikes. Their 250 bikes don't sell, and if someone does buy one, they lose a ton of $ when they inevitably resell it. Meanwhile, they sell a 250 adventure bike elsewhere but not in the US, and that bike would sell. The TU250X was a solid offering, but they overpriced it and discontinued it. Meanwhile, Duke, Honda, Yamaha all have solid offerings in that market, and Kawasaki has the KLX dualsports plus their great Z400/Ninja 400. So OK, Suzuki seems to have thrown in the towel for small bikes in the US. But how about the mid class? Hmm... Successful but mostly unchanged SV650 for past 20 years... GSXR was god but I don't see much on the road anymore. Their cruisers have same issue and VStar better. Hmm... what's going on? My first bike was a 93 Bandit 400 and it is and was a fantastic bike. The real first Naked midsize cafe bike that preceeded the Monster, etc. An inline 4 with a 15K RPM redline and just plain fun. Suzuki was known for their great engineering that created reliable and good performing bikes..... So where did they go? Too many of those engineers retire or something? Or is it the marketing dept just not getting it? At this point, I'd just as soon see Suzuki merge with someone like CFMoto and maybe they can make a reliable fun group of bikes, but I'm not sure that companies like CFMoto even need their help - they are listening to customers in the US, adjusting, getting in the dealerships and undercutting all the Japanese based brands already. I'd love to see Suzuki come out with a new product line - like Yamaha has done with MT. Then add a 400cc Scrambler and new mid and big true adventure bikes. That's 6 bikes that gets them competitive again. Keep the GSXR but advertise better. But right now, they are irrelevant.

You seem to forget that when Suzuki last left GP racing they delivered the GSXR750 which shook up the world. This from people who "wobbled" went two stroke racing stopped.

Turns out sporgeon isn't wrong wrong completely because suzuki did come out with a new bad ass adventure bike and parallel twin platform.

I had a DRZ400E but then traded it in for a new XR650L 11 years ago.

Suzuki is doing the 5th generation, the K5 engine, in a similar manner as Harley Davidson does their big engines. One powerplant and umpteen models differentiated by bars, fenders and foot placement.

I've tried to order a new Suzuki motorcycle from two dealers and neither would take a deposit, saying that they can't order Suzuki's and they just have to take what they are sent in their allotments!

I think they were wrong on what the last all new Suzuki model they claim is was a 1998 or 1999 vstrom or the tl1000s. Suzuki came out w a all new bike in 2000. Drz400s. Street legal and is still basically the same in 2023. And the mention that Suzuki still competes in SX/MX is partially correct. Only one or 2 riders in each class are on Suzukis in the USA. The rmz450 is still the only bike without electric start. Pitiful But I just bought a “new” gsxs 1000gt that uses a 2005 gsxr engine. Old engine in a new chassis w upgraded electronics. Fantastic motorcycle

Building EVs in my mind could not be a good decision. It is a tiny market and one that is being divided into tiny parts of that market through competition. I think that the manufacturing tooling cost alone will out weigh any profits gained.

Damn good episode👏

Very informative

I would say that the Suzuki GW250 Inazuma was the last new model from them

Well I can’t play the Highside lowside drinking game with alcohol since I’m at work, guess water will have to do.

Doesn't the 250 platform count as a new bike? The GW250 Inazuma was the original "organ donor" for the GSX250R and V-Strom 250.

The supercross and motocross Suzuki teams are NOT factory efforts. Not sure where Lance got his info there.

Considering big manufacturers like Kawasaski and BMW don't bother with MotoGP and their sales are doing just fine, I'm not sure why some of these others even bother. I bet Yamaha could scrap their team and see no effect on sales, especially if they took some of the money and sponsored some emerging circuits such as the sub 900cc nakeds.

Excelent poimt Lance @ 55:00

Dani Pedrosa said it costs about 30-40 Milion Euro per year for a factory team with 2 riders

Some interesting discussion but too long. A one hour format would be more palatable.

The Hayabusa came out in 1999. Also, the sv650 engine isn't natually a 650 engine. Granted it did come out 1999. But the sv650 engine is actually a bored out 400 cc engine. The sv400 came out in 1998. Then there's the tl1000. It's first iteration came out in 1997 in the S. The R came later. So, the r is a bit of a reworked s.

Guys, 2 MotoGP bikes, riders and crews costs in excess of $30mln annually. Heck, the bikes alone cost $3mln each. Just imagine what they could accomplish if they use that money on manufacturable R&D instead of sport/advertising and single use bikes, that's real money for engineers, product managers and designers.

I can’t believe I have never found this podcast.. awesome stuff here! Suzuki leaving MotoGP?! This is like hearing Kanye West and Kim Kardashian just got divorced! And I am a team green rider all day every day😂👍🏾👍🏾

R&D is research and development. Design is separate.

well, they're about to release new model, based on Parallel Twin.

It would be interesting to see a Kawasaki hybrid on Daily Rider.

I think mike pastada just did a ktm motogp ktm vs ktm 1290 vs Porsche where he said ktm pays around 30million annually for 2 bikes. I think he was talking pounds but he didn't say.

I may have missed it. Did they discuss Suzuki's internal combustion engine products will be illegal to sell in Europe in 12 years?

How is it possible for them to talk this long about Suzuki and not mention the test bikes spotted a couple weeks ago showing a new parallel twin engine in what is suspected to be the SV650 successor?

Given the lacking sales of 1000cc race replicas, and indeed the collapse of 600cc supersports, it MotoGP really worth it? How much MotoGP tech is going into adventure bikes (as a strong selling bike category)? I’m not against motoGP, just from a return on investment perspective, it does appear to be a compelling argument.

Well mgp savings would help enter those beginner markets

I want an electric or hybrid maxi scooter.

45:15 2015 Suzuki GSX-S 750 & GSX-S 1000 & GSX-S 1000 F more recently the GSX-S 1000 GT and Katana 2017 Suzuki GSX250R 2009 Suzuki SFV650 Gladius 2007 Suzuki B-King

And now the GSX-8S has dropped...that didn't take 5 years!

Suzuki needs to bring the VanVan 200 back to the US market and bring in the VanVan 125.

I think Honda Rebel will be one of Honda's first electric bikes...

Tried and true technology is les likely to fail. Know results, supply of parts and mechanics…whats to complain; love my V-storm 650 ‘21

i want to buy a touring motorcycle . i do like the 1000 GT ,but I don't have much confidence that if i am in a remote area and i break down were can i get parts? suzuki dealerships are getting hard to find. If Honda made a bike like the suzuki i would buy the honda.

$10K to run a Moto GP team. The funny one. Really smart guess, when the cheapest rider costs $1 million per year.