Don't let the self centered bleeps deter you from documenting and publishing the poor initial build quality, the poor response times for warranty work, poor warranty work and all the rest. I can't imagine being in your situation. As a civil engineer who spent a lot of time on quality control, I'm appalled at all y'all have been thru and all you still have to go thru. Keep your heads up and keep fighting for a yacht you can safely begin your sailing journeys on. Happy belated Birthday wishes.
Interesting read at Loose Cannon. How anyone can watch your videos and still support Leopard is mind-boggling. I'm so happy to hear that you had a great time sailing on your birthday. One would think if you spend a million dollars on a boat, you would never end up spending 499 days (and counting) on the hard. Unfathomable 🤯 Thanks for sharing.
Yes, Loose Cannon posted the article on the sailing Australia FB page. Many Salty posts, but many of them did not check your situation out. Those are people that bag people out in general, like, oh, there is paint pealing on a deck....that's unsafe you need a survey or you need to buy a new boat. There are many that have pushed back against these people in regards to you guys, especially when they point out you are not the only ones with problems. Keep on pushing.
Thanks for the support and letting us know. If I publish the worst of what happened, none of these people will have anything to say. It is unacceptable and nobody will argue once the picture is fully painted. They should have done better. Plain and simple.
If you bought a new Rolls Royce which is considerably cheaper than this Cat, and after a short time the paint started peeling, your vehicle would be taken away discreetly in an enclosed truck and it would be remedied and returned. No one would hear or see anything about it. But on a vessel which is Cat 0. The whole thing is supposed to keep you alive in severe conditions. Any fault can point to a serious problem that can cost lives.
Unfortunately, there will probably always be nay-sayers. You are all doing an amazing job! Plus, you will most likely have one of the best built Leopards in the world once the work is done. All the best!
We were ready to start the process to buy a new Leopard Cat, until I saw your videos, I have saved for so many years to buy a new Cat and I cant imagine what I would do if I bought something like this. Thank you so much for posting these videos, I am sure these have helped a lot of people.
I'm sorry you are getting pushback from the Leopard community (at least some of them) for selfish financial self interest reasons not on the technical basis of the issues you have reported. Reminds me of some of the reactions that Colin on Sailing Parlay got when he tried to highlight the cracking bulkhead issue on his Lagoon 450. Thank you for your continued willingness to share your experiences.
Many of the Leopard community are the best of people. All pushback is coming from the selfish few A holes who wouldn't care less what we went through and only care about their asset. Thank you for the support and taking the time to write a comment. :)
Your videos are so informative, I've learned a lot. The biggest take away is to write into the build contract multiple independent marine surveys during the build and shake down. NFN, but maybe you guys could side hustle as surveyors.
We can quickly find issues on hulls but with no formal qualifications we would likely just be ignored by shipbuilders. Thanks for the support. If they paid us for lost time we wouldn't need a side hustle. :)
I watched a lot ,if not all of your videos. I am baffled about your enthusiasm to take on this super Lemmon of a boat. Is there anything which works or is not broken? Maybe just for the fun of it you can make a video about the good/working things on this boat. Even if this will be just a 5 minutes short 🙂 Jokes aside, I am truly impressed that you are still maintaining posture and take on this nightmare .
Thank you so much for the support and taking the time to write a comment. We love the design of the boat. We have done so much work on our boat and are proud of what we have done and our friends have helped with. Despite what people may think we work very hard and don't just sit on our hands. I just don't like Robertson and Caine's detached and nasty warranty department who wouldn't know the first thing about what we have suffered through because of their inability to build a boat. How we view the hull is in our mind and this hull is our home. They best fix it and support us if they don't want it published.
You have amazing patience. I watched some of your issues a while ago and had no idea it was still happening. By now I would have given the boat a Viking Funeral and booked a flight back to South Africa to set up camp at Robertson & Caine. It’s mad how they have gone in 15 years from making some of the best value solid boats to being like this. And I am sure you know you are not alone… as in not the only You Tube channel with Leopard warranty issues.
I feel really bad for you two. I am glad you're documenting this situation and the vessel’s defects. Setting aside the time, frustration and the lack of a through inspection the company has done its self and other Leopard owners a disservice. Please have your vessel independently evaluated paying close attention to possibly structural failures down the road compromising your safety. Bottom line inspect everything and don’t rely on the unvetted or parties that may have their own biases clouding an objective assessment. Identify all the deficiencies and beef up anything that looks or has a history of being weak points. This will serve you well down the road and give you a good look at what’s going on with your boat and hopefully alleviating any surprises in the future.
@@travelsketch I hear you and I know everything I’ve said you’ve already have thought about.. Get some legal advice on how to approach the builder to leverage your position.. Bottom line you want your boat to be safe.. You need an independent third party who’s objective, and who doesn’t have a dog in this fight.
I have seen several different new catamaran owners with warranty issues . Can’t believe people are still purchasing them. Wish you all the luck in getting Leopard to make the appropriate repairs. Or
As a prospective owner I can say that I really feel for you guys. I don't doubt a word or single issue you have outlined over the last one year plus. I too, will never buy a new Leopard. An older one a slim maybe - but there are other options to be explored first. All this that you have put up with is not only an issue of a new boat with a ridiculous amount of issues but is life altering. Don't settle for anything less than you are asking for.
Thank you so much for the support. If we helped you even a little please consider emailing Leopard and telling them to do better by us. This has cost us so much money and opportunity to disclose all this for the better of the majority.
Thank you for posting. I feel you are doing something good. All of the problems should come out. Spending your life savings on a product that just doesn’t meet the standard. They should be out of business! At this rate they will go out of business. I was before seeing your posts convinced I was going to buy a a 45. After your nightmare I am skipping this Leopard.
It seems the risk with catamarans are quite a bit higher than with monohulls. Lagoon has its own problems with delaminating bulkheads etc. My wife and I are monohull sailors currently looking for a new boat. We considered a catamaran, but spend ten days on a Lagoon in French Polynesia, and with what we read about all the problems with then, and now this, we think we’ll stick with a mono. They seem to be just so much stronger. I think it’s because of all the flex inherent in multihulls that there’s more problems with delamination, detachment of bulkheads and what not. Maybe I’m naive, but it’s my impression. I’m open to be corrected.
Oh My God, your gift just keeps on giving. If I were you guys I don't know if I would do, cry, laugh or get a lawyer and go visit the blokes that did that to you.
Nowhere near done yet and Trent is very close to not caring. Once we get to the final items your mind will be blown at the disgusting workmanship and lack of care for the guys sailing out of Cape Town. Thanks for the support :)
You guys should park your boat in one of the busiest marinas, and paint on both sides Lemon Leopard. I wouldn’t settle for anything less than a NEW BOAT.
Firstly a belated happy birthday to you. I have said it before and am forced to say it again for the dummies out there who clearly don't get it. I am consistently amazed at the balance and control you show in these videos, had this been my life dream I would probably be in jail by now. Carry on and don't let the few wankers bother you as in life the right thing is often the least popular course. Bravo and keep nailing the bastards till they do the right thing by you and all the others. PS. It carries over to their power cats as well saw one in Brisbane fresh off the ship whose delivery skipper refused to continue on. Many safety issues.
I have not followed all the videos on your warranty issues but has definitely put me off leopard. At this point surely the best course is legal action?
Nope, thanks for the advice. There are clauses that they don't want to know if the boat is built like crap. They obviously expect it and have had issues.
Robertson and Caine is now owned by the competitor of Travelopia building hulls for Travelopia who is marketing them under the Leopard brand which is apparently owned by Robertson and Caine.
I'd still buy a Leopard if only it's inspected by myself and 50% off. Let's be real, you do not deserve the complications and faulty MV. Hopefully you get all the recognition with compensation. ❤💪
been following your story and I am very disappointed with Leopard I too am looking for a vessel I understand issues do happen hence a warranty, you invest your monies in their product and you expect support, I was lead to believe Leopard were one of the leading builders of Cats it is a real shame, I think it maybe a big legal fight wish you all well and you never know.. Stay safe
I’ve honestly been looking at buying a leopard mainly because of the walkthrough front. Am I a complete idiot for still considering one. The 45 is my targeted length but that’s what you have. I wonder if the 48 has the same QA issues. Not sure what to do.
All 48s we have seen have been solid. Much thicker window frames than ours and other components. We have seen inside some pulled apart. That said they have more balsa core and we don't like that. A well kept and repaired owners versions 45 is better technology and layout in our opinion. There is extensive detail in the owners group for a high level surveyor. We have seen some very nice and well built Leopard 45s but it is very random, there is definitely a huge variation in them. Buy second hand with a survey if it suits you. Favour hulls that have crossed an ocean and actually flexed if possible.
Dear Randy, even if other models are better than the 45 ( worse is nearly impossible), it is about the way they treat you when things go wrong. It is an absolute disgrace and I really wonder why you even consider buying a leopard cat?? Be wise and learn of this channel. Best wishes from a very happy Amel Super Maramu owner.
I seem to remember the same kind of negative comments from some owners of Lagoon catamarans when Colin from Parlay Revival publicised the bulkhead failure issue on his cat . The company who owns lagoon shrugged it off saying there was no issue with their cats and his problems were down to hurricane damage . Only when other owners began checking their cats did it become apparent that it was actually a Lagoon problem. The difference appeared to be a design problem with Lagoon whereas yours seems to be poor workmanship and worse still quality control that didn’t control quality. Where both companies act identically is denial there’s a problem and it’s just your boat and they’ve never had an issue with others .
Do you guys think it might be an inherent weakness of catamarans in general - compared to monohulls? There’s a lot more movement and flex between the hulls with catamarans. I’ve only owned monohulls, but after the Lagoon issue, and now this, I’m extremely leery to consider a catamaran of any kind….
This episode makes a stronger case for accepting a replacement hull regardless of all the 'upgrades' and 'modifications' you showed you've done. The change in factory workmanship over that month between vessels is horrendous.
Is there anything like the Euro ncap safety ratings for cars that the Leopard is supposed to meet? R&C talk about being double certified EC and IMCI, and say they satisfy all ISO standards. Be interesting if an ISO 9001 audit was done on the documentation they have on your Leopard as it went through its supposed multi-tier QA process. I know you said they have things in place to limit their liability for claims, but an independent going in and giving things a shakeup, with the possibility of loosing a certification or two it may ruffle the right feathers. Such shocking build quality sorry you are going through this.
Well they took most of the supplies which slowed us down. Then took ages sending more. We are fixing it ourselves now and waiting for them to send some decent guys to help mop up the mess left by the previous warranty team we evicted.
In the early 2000's I spent a year attending a shipyard trade school. I had aspirations of sailing the globe and was grilling boat owners around the marina on what might be a suitable boat. I remember one fellow from Australia cautioning me about boats from a factory in Asia that had produced hulls for various brands in the 1980's. I can't recall which factory or brands but boats under one name were considered top of the line and in another brand's boat built in the same factory they found newspaper used in the core of the hull lay up. I'm sorry for your experience. Without proper quality control this is likely to happen. Low paid workers performing health hazardous production jobs for wealthy clients don't have much care and often contempt for their clients.
HAPPY BIRTHDAY 🎉🎉🎉. NOW AAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!! HOW DO YOU HAVE ANY HAIR LEFT. YOU GUYS HAVE TO SUE THEIR CHONYS OFF. MY BLOOD PRESSURE MEDS JUST STOPPED WORKING. I KNOW A LITTLE BIT OF YOUR PAIN. I HAVE HAD BOAT ISSUES ALSO. I HOPE YOU HAVE A GOOD DAY AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE.
I’m a retired job broker and it’s time for you to file suit. You have a lemon on your hands. It can’t be fixed Robertson Kane lost control. It will never be right or look right they should buy the boat back to you at full price and then something for your trouble, while all your expenses
The company you buy your insurance from should be willing to get in on this. Yeah they’re there though they’re really should be your representatives your insurance company.
If they don't pay for the electrical warranty rectification that they committed to pay, you will get to see some very interesting things about this exact subject matter. Keep watching.
Same thing happened with the Lagoon bulkhead problems with the haters more concerned about their boat value instead of safety. BTW if the factory cant even tab your floors in correctly I would be surveying all the structural bulkheads for the same standard of workmanship.
I feel deeply sorry for you guys, what a nightmare. My conclusions about leopard are : 1) they are very bad boatbuilders...and 2) it is clear that the higher-ups only care about the money. As hard as it is you are doing a very good job and in the end you guys will have the strongest leopard cat there is. We are rooting for you!!
I’m a couch sailer that dreams 😊of the life but realistically don’t see it in my future. Watching Parlay Revival led me to your site. I’ve stayed to watch because I just can’t believe how difficult Leopard have made your pursuit of the sailing life. They made a massive error not addressing your issues immediately, your just to smart. I’m not half the woman you are. Well, I’m a man, so, completely not the woman you are. Maybe they’ll wake up, fix everything, just to get you off their backs. Parlay got some of the same grief from owners when he talked about bulkhead issues but it looks like he got much better support from Lagoon. Guess nobody at Leopard understand the internet.
I'm a fellow youngish Aussie, looking at cats with the goal to buy next year. I've been watching a few of your vids over time. This was the first to really get a visceral wtf reaction from me. No glasser or team leader worth their salt would sign off on that. What the hell kind of operation were they running in production. The millions dollar question... was it just a dud team / shit moment in time. Or is this systemic. Why haven't they just owned the problem yet and come onboard to fix it top to bottom. Also, did you buy it in the AU market and thus with our great consumer protections?
I am a yachting expert. I've been following this extended moan on Y/T and now agree with -American fiberglass construction expert Ken Fickett who says “Some of what I am seeing is definitely overblown bullshit by the owner. But regardless of that, the boat is seriously fucked up and the factory is in big trouble.” Definately large piles of overblown bullshit to make money out of their channel Having said that this boat is a result of labour issues. I am told that once the locals learn a trade they rush off to get a better paid job and so this manufacturer is using partly or unskilled labour. For the sake of your healt do not buy
So you are aware, last year the decision was made to donate the potential proceeds of these warranty videos in advance. $10,000 was given to support the work of Dr Sheddy and her sailing vet clinic, an amount that was decided on to ensure it would far eclipse any potential gain from publishing this information. You can learn more about her work here: www.vettails.com/powered-by
@@travelsketch PLEASE Accept my apology for my mistake. I know you must be going through hell and I thought you were monetising it as so often happens today
No problem, sometimes you must do what is right. Please also keep in mind that the worst things that were wrong with the boat are not published yet. Obviously RU-vid is not an exact representation of our actual lives and we work very hard to fix the boat and enjoy every day. We are very positive people, it is just impossible to give a perfectly balanced snapshot in a 15 minute video and when we enjoy ourselves in the remaining time the last thing we want to do is work to film it. :) Thanks for watching.
Similar to the situation at Boeing in a few ways, a yacht is a vessel that needs to be built to a high standard. There are lives at risk, this is not a car you can simply pull over if you get a light on the dash. These boats cross oceans and endure extreme storms with families on board. What Leopard is trying to get away with is astonishing. I don’t feel like this brand can ever be trusted by someone that’s in the market for a seaworthy vessel.
What actually happens is they promise you the world when you buy it and then once you sign your name and pay for it you get gaslighted into thinking your expectations are wrong and you are the problem.
Frustrating to deal with a poorly finished boat and shite customer service and then to top it off you have to deal with the A O naysayers and then cherry on the cake, being blocked on social media!!! You deserve a break and compensation.
Shocking ! All I can say after everything is "SHOCKING" You guys got a dud ! Amongst other things, I would insist on being at the production-line every day that the replacement boat is being built. My boat has been a nightmare but at the level of yours, I would definitely be insisting on a replacement. Even a replacement L50. Roberson & Caine hide behind Travelopia. Travelopia take all the flack. R&C NEVER step up to their responsibilities
I'm still waiting for the payment for the microphone from Daniel. Our viewers can't hear me properly. Come on Kevin. :) Well said by the way! Thanks for the support. Many owners like you have integrity and a spine. :)
Unfortunately it's not just Leopard that seems to have major issues. Your situation bears a strong similarity to that of the owner of a new Neel 47 trimaran a year or so ago. She posted RU-vid videos of her dealings with Neel and the broker while trying to get all of the problems addressed, but eventually took her videos down with no explanation.....
I wouldn’t let R&C build a canoe . Just an investment company employing unskilled Muntu from the top down . My heart goes out to you. That company is void of any moral worth.
If Leopard boat owners are so concerned about your public complaints devaluing of their Cats, they should be pressuring Leopard to give you a new boat!
We are moving on. They just get to hear about our previous suffering if they are doing stuff all about it. Lets see them do this to someone else and stay in business.
Looks like the builders QC department needs a sit down with the Production crew . I feel sorry for You having to spend so much time in the boatyard ( typically : a dusty , dirty , noisy place with the smell of chemicals floating around . )
Leopard is owned by one of the largest hedge funds in the world. Profit is there motive not quality. In fact quality impacts profit in a negative way; so why do it? Who is one of the other owners? The Moorings. A group always known for providing a quality experience at an absurd price. Not surprising you are having these issues but they are not restricted to Leopard. Most cats are poorly built and really aren't blue water boats, but floating condos which serve a limited purpose. Can't imagine how you will ever sell that boat but good for you making others aware of the shortcomings of leopard cats.
I think it will sell just fine after they have gone through and fixed the entire boat from top to bottom. Most owners do not pay this much attention to detail.
The people thinking about buying one of these boats should start thinking about buying another brand do waste money buying one of these boats start a class action lawsuit against them
It's amazing. I DON'T UNDERSTAND how a company preferred option is to publicly endure this display of their poor manufacturing and under par customer service. They should at this time I would bite the bullet and volunteer to give them a new boat AND add all the add-ons you added. All free of charge. If this is not the solution, I would NEVER EVER consider them not even for a toothpick. Poor management is evident. Then one wonders why companies go bust.
As a South African and someone that used to love Leopard cats, I am appauled by this and their response to everything. If ever I had the money, I will never buy a Leopard after this. Same for Neel trimarans. Sorry for your extremely bad experiance......if I was you, I would report this to the South African consumer ombudsman and demand my money back and go buy a Seawind or Maxx cruise cat.
Thank you for the support, I don't think the SA government cares much. We have limited time because they have left us with a lot of problems. Once done here we will see what they do for us.
Who epoxi's over blue tape? Even an amateur wouldn't do that. And they've just thrown gobs of thickened epoxi (which has no inherent strength) over a fault like cement at a building site. Looks like they're using it to hide a structural fault rather than fixing the fault. Bloody awful
If you complain about anything they tell everyone you're difficult so you just have to let them make a mess, then pretend you didn't see it coming so they don't get upset. many times my experience over the past year.
Who the f*ck signed off on that job? They should be fired. I have all sorts of "solutions" like that on my 440. But it's hull 001. "creative" fixes are expected. Why the sh*t did the quality just suddenly drop mid way into production? And like you said, covid boat is not an excuse since that other boat looks fine. OK, so they can't claim that they didn't know your hull was bad. There were signs. Clearly it came out of the mold shit, and rather than throw out $30k of fiberglass/resin/labor costs they tryed to salvage it. This video just pisses me off. There's no excuses for that sh*t workmanship.
@@travelsketch You had mentioned before to me that you put some extra money into upgrades. How about giving this boat back and replacing it with a new one without issues and either transferring your upgrades over to the new boat or have them put those upgrades on for you at there cost. Also, they might be willing to give you the next size up to compensate you for all that you've had to deal with. Are you planning on suing them if they don't make you hole? I guess that's not something that you can talk about now but would like to know the outcome.
@@robertlaird6746 This boat is nearly fixed. I need to get out and use it. Not spend another year negotiating with them and then fitting out another boat and chasing issues. They likely don't have the skills to replicate our custom upgrades even if they wanted to to be blunt. I'd look at the new 52 they are bringing out, not the 46 or 50. the 50's internal layout is garbage IMO for us.
@@trentspencer7991 After watching your videos, I wouldn't purchase a Leopard catamaran. That really sucks. They should really compensate you for your loss of time and additional moneys that you've spent on fixing your brand new boat.
And screw that - they devalued themselves and if this shit happened to them- they would be crying their ass off- screw them- speak your truth- im glad I didnt buy from them-
Hello again : ) 1 min and 54 sec in this episode you are "outing yourself". The floor. Why did you not use professionals to go over the boat withe you? When one byes homes on "dry land" and the price is very high, people use companies that have cameraes to inspect with.
Nobody who had any sort or independent survey value was available or answering their phone during lockdown. The boys tried to find someone. The broker allowed them extra time to check the hull before handover due to this. The broker was very good about it and likely without their help not much would have been fixed at all in Cape Town.
The other Aussie RU-vid (Barefoot Doctors) are getting rid of their Leopard 45, less than 2 years old. Smart couple? Who will do the survey for the prospective buyer? Do hope that these surveyors take the time to watch your videos.
Who owns r&c? Who owns dream yacht charter and who are the share holders and how many boats they own?. What is the % of lagoon cats and r&c cats sold to charter fleets vs private owners? Answers to these questions and you will have all the answers.
I wonder if your boat is just a real lemon or if other lepers are total shit boxes to. I'd find it hard to believe this would be a one off, unless it suffered under some real ordinary workers who were there at the factory for a short time. If you're gonna buy a cat from South Africa balance cats are the go, they are built really well, are fast and comfortable and look real nice, unlike the lepers, I not trying to be mean but they really are an ugly boat and their sailing performance numbers are real ordinary
