Which sub to reverse in a 2-element cardioid stack?

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If you are trying to cancel sound in a specific direction, visualize a line drawn through the subwoofer drivers. To the rear you'll get cancellation. To the front you'll get summation. Remember that the rear facing sub gets the delay and polarity inversion.
For more information about the 2-element gradient array, watch this: • Why do you polarity in...
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I love to geek out about the physics of sound. This channel focuses on the growing opportunity for live sound engineers to improve their confidence and consistency through the understanding of the principles of sound system design and optimization. My goal is to make this channel upfront and honest about my success and failure, so you can learn from both.
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22 авг 2022

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Комментарии : 45

@stavroshouiris Год назад

weird timing, I also got covid yesterday and I'm binge watching all your videos lol. As well as Dave Rat, Alpha sound, and Michael Curtis. My interests in PA setup has recently peaked and I'm glad there's content creators like you who share all this insight on the different technics, configurations as well as tools and software. Really appreciate it, keep up the good work and hope you feel better soon!

@nathanlively Год назад

Oh man, I really hope the symptoms are weak. Mine were...brutal, for about 2 days.

@stavroshouiris Год назад

@@nathanlively Yea it wasn't anything severe just a few minor symptoms, anyway hope you're feeling better man

@icsux 10 месяцев назад

Great video man, I have 4 subs, DB 918 and now I'm gonna play with them knowing what I saw here :)

@nathanlively 10 месяцев назад

Great! If you want to measure them I’ll add them to SubAligner.

@seantallica2020 Год назад

At 06:20, do you think you could do a video about that set up? I have a show couple months from now that I would love to do the set up, I ran the regular Cardioid sub, works great, but I have 4 18” subs that I would like to use, thanks!

@nathanlively Год назад

Hi Sean, if you're interested in gradient array variations, I cover it in Sub School, but this video is really more complete: livesoundsummit2020.sounddesignlive.com/talks/modern-variable-directivity-techniques-in-subwoofer-arrays/

@TheBandRosie Год назад

What would you do in stacks of 3? I've always done the middle one but watching your video perhaps the top one makes more sense, especially on a higher stage?

@nathanlively Год назад

Hey Rosie, I'd stick with the middle one. Please see Merlijn's 2 part series on this topic: www.merlijnvanveen.nl/en/study-hall/135-which-sub-to-reverse

@NakeanWickliff 5 месяцев назад

Wow! So cool. Ok so question do people or should people use this in home theater (is there bough space in a small room) to reduce room modes? Got a 50hz trail that sucks and I think could be due to room mode but could also be oil heater or oil heater ducting. Wish I could find a good way to test this with my mic in REW. HAD 4 subs but went to a single in order to reduce the slow 50hz decay which worked. Would love to have the big boom boom of multi sub if possible without the long decay trail I’ve got.

@nathanlively 4 месяца назад

Hey Nakean, REW has a room simulation feature where you can experiment with subwoofer placement while observing the response.

@crud118 Год назад

Nice!

@nathanlively Год назад

Thanks!

@domenicdienstknecht2141 Год назад

Where did you find the Circle CAD Backround for Mapp 3D ?

@nathanlively Год назад

Hey Domenic, it's one of the built in templates. I think it's called Lab.

@soundasylumlive4421 Год назад

Do the cardioid setups or phantom cardioid setups help what the audience hears or FOH?

@nathanlively Год назад

Should be both if you do it right. :)

@tarun.krishna Год назад

Do the reflections from the floor behave similar to the reflections under a stage for cardioid subwoofer setup? If yes, how does it affect the tonal accuracy for subs low passed at 100hz vs 80hz?

@nathanlively Год назад

Hey Tarun, I'm not an acoustician, but I think a stage is a resonant box and a different beast. Wait, are you talking about putting the subs under the stage? In that case, no, that won't work. This sub array needs 1m or clearance from any boundaries, which is why you'll see it to the side or in front of a stage. Or above!

@tarun.krishna Год назад

@@nathanlively Thank you so much, that answers my question.

@ladjkaoz 6 месяцев назад

why not set up at 9 and 3 Oclock.... right against the wall. 🤔 that's what I usually try to do.😁

@Jo-yachtgineer Год назад

Is there a special processing on this set up?

@nathanlively Год назад

Yes! Please see the video I linked to in the description above.

@tony8236 2 месяца назад

sorry if I have another question even if it's not the correct video. Do cardioid but in-line subwoofers give the same result? Of course if there is the possibility and you have enough space

@nathanlively Месяц назад

Hey Tony, when it comes to gradient array, the effective bandwidth in front is controlled by the spacing which is fixed in an inverted gradient stack.

@Earthcitizen4609 Год назад

My subs don't have delay option only polarity and 2 what's the best placement in cardioid ?

@nathanlively Год назад

Hmm, I don't know any directional arrays that don't use delay. Let me know what you find out.

@Earthcitizen4609 Год назад

@@nathanlivelyold prx 818 subwoofer JBL Have polarity button only have 2

@tony8236 2 месяца назад

hello and thanks for this video. I'm using a translator because I don't speak English well. I tried this configuration and noticed that when the public subwoofer is on the ground I get almost 2 dB more. my question is: is it right to always use this way or are there occasions when it is better to have the audience subwoofer on high?

@nathanlively 2 месяца назад

Hey Tony, I can't think of an example where I've used the opposite orientation, but I can imagine that if you had the same 2-element inverted gradient stack, but flown, you'd want it to be reversed in order to direct the cancellation towards the open mics on stage.

@tony8236 2 месяца назад

@@nathanlively thank you so much. however on stage the cancellation seems the same. only that if I use the subwoofer at the bottom facing forward I have greater gain (2db from smaart tested in the same situation). perhaps due to the ground effect

@paulwaites6551 Год назад

For two elements stacked what delay do i use on the bottom reversed sub?

@nathanlively Год назад

Hey Paul, this is exactly what I explain at the top of the video and most of the time I set it up as you see in the photo.

@mogwix Год назад

@@nathanlively Hi Nathan, I watched your other video on gradient arrays and if I understand correctly, if you have 1m of spacing between the drivers, you would phase-invert the rear facing element and delay it by 2.9ms to get summation at 86Hz? You need to physically move the elements around then calculate the delay in order to get a different tuning frequency right? Can you do gradient arrays with horn loaded subs?

@XGenuineCompetenceX 7 месяцев назад

How much delay is applied for a target frequency of 63Hz❓

@nathanlively 7 месяцев назад

Hi XGenuine. In the case of an inverted gradient stack, you don't have a choice about this because subs cannot change position. The delay required is a direct result of the array design. This is one reason to choose an inline gradient instead, so that you can control the bandwidth.

@ladjkaoz 6 месяцев назад

Those subs are very low I still would go vertical... cardio..

@hazemblahtimeyyy Год назад

This is indonesian

@zolwikwkurwik 11 месяцев назад

How much space do you need befind the two subs to make the cancelation work? I have a concrete wall and I'm wondering if I can use this method

@nathanlively 11 месяцев назад

Most of the guidelines I’ve seen say at least 1m

@zolwikwkurwik 11 месяцев назад

@@nathanlively thanx! I have another question. If I put my subs few meter in front of my other speakers, is it necessary to delay the subs main signal to make them fire at the same time from the stage?

@nathanlively 11 месяцев назад

@@zolwikwkurwik What are the “other speakers”? In any alignment, distance offsets must be equalized.

@zolwikwkurwik 11 месяцев назад

@@nathanlivelyby other speakers I mean mid-high frequency speakers

@zolwikwkurwik 11 месяцев назад

Is this software free?

@nathanlively 10 месяцев назад

Which one?